Think of the brain as one airport among many, the mind(s) as national air traffic.

2013-03-19 Thread Roger Clough
Think of the brain as one airport among many, the mind(s) as national air traffic. Dr. Roger Clough NIST (ret.) 3/19/2013 Coincidences are God's way of remaining anonymous. - Albert Einstein -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List

Re: Dartmouth neuroscientist finds free will has neural basis

2013-03-19 Thread Evgenii Rudnyi
On 18.03.2013 21:02 John Mikes said the following: friends: don't put so much brain-grease into Free Will, please! It is the religious mambo-jumbo put into the mind of the poor-believers in ancient times to make them responsible for deeds the powerful disliked - and consequently: make them

Re: Losing Control

2013-03-19 Thread Evgenii Rudnyi
On 19.03.2013 02:05 Stathis Papaioannou said the following: On Tue, Mar 19, 2013 at 11:39 AM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com wrote: If you say that free will is compatible with determinism then you are an compatibilist, otherwise you are an incompatibilist. Why do you try to make the

Re: Mind is a quantum computer

2013-03-19 Thread Evgenii Rudnyi
On 18.03.2013 19:39 Bruno Marchal said the following: Hi Roger, On 18 Mar 2013, at 12:48, Roger Clough wrote: Since mind is an MQS or Multiple Quantum Superposition, it can process information at the rate of a quantum computer. Since you seem to talk philosophy, let me translate what you

Re: Dartmouth neuroscientist finds free will has neural basis

2013-03-19 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 18 Mar 2013, at 21:02, John Mikes wrote: friends: don't put so much brain-grease into Free Will, please! It is the religious mambo-jumbo put into the mind of the poor- believers in ancient times to make them responsible for deeds the powerful disliked - and consequently: make them

Re: G.K. Chesterton on Materialism

2013-03-19 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 18 Mar 2013, at 21:15, Craig Weinberg wrote: On Monday, March 18, 2013 11:33:17 AM UTC-4, John Clark wrote: G K Chesterton wrote: For we must remember that the materialist philosophy (whether true or not) is certainly much more limiting than any religion. That is absolutely true,

Re: Mind is a quantum computer

2013-03-19 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 19 Mar 2013, at 02:06, Russell Standish wrote: On Mon, Mar 18, 2013 at 07:39:44PM +0100, Bruno Marchal wrote: Hi Roger, On 18 Mar 2013, at 12:48, Roger Clough wrote: Since mind is an MQS or Multiple Quantum Superposition, it can process information at the rate of a quantum computer.

Re: Mind is a quantum computer

2013-03-19 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 19 Mar 2013, at 10:48, Evgenii Rudnyi wrote: On 18.03.2013 19:39 Bruno Marchal said the following: Hi Roger, On 18 Mar 2013, at 12:48, Roger Clough wrote: Since mind is an MQS or Multiple Quantum Superposition, it can process information at the rate of a quantum computer. Since you

Re: G.K. Chesterton on Materialism

2013-03-19 Thread Tom Bayley
On Monday, March 18, 2013 8:15:39 PM UTC, Craig Weinberg wrote: On Monday, March 18, 2013 11:33:17 AM UTC-4, John Clark wrote: G K Chesterton wrote: For we must remember that the materialist philosophy (whether true or not) is certainly much more limiting than any religion. That is

Re: Mind is a quantum computer

2013-03-19 Thread Evgenii Rudnyi
On 19.03.2013 12:39 Bruno Marchal said the following: On 19 Mar 2013, at 10:48, Evgenii Rudnyi wrote: On 18.03.2013 19:39 Bruno Marchal said the following: ... 1) show me a human as good as a quantum computer for finding a needle in a haystack. Could you show me a quantum computer that

Re: Mind is a quantum computer

2013-03-19 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 19 Mar 2013, at 15:27, Evgenii Rudnyi wrote: On 19.03.2013 12:39 Bruno Marchal said the following: On 19 Mar 2013, at 10:48, Evgenii Rudnyi wrote: On 18.03.2013 19:39 Bruno Marchal said the following: ... 1) show me a human as good as a quantum computer for finding a needle in a

Re: G.K. Chesterton on Materialism

2013-03-19 Thread Craig Weinberg
On Tuesday, March 19, 2013 6:55:30 AM UTC-4, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 18 Mar 2013, at 21:15, Craig Weinberg wrote: On Monday, March 18, 2013 11:33:17 AM UTC-4, John Clark wrote: G K Chesterton wrote: For we must remember that the materialist philosophy (whether true or not) is

Re: Mind is a quantum computer

2013-03-19 Thread Telmo Menezes
On Tue, Mar 19, 2013 at 2:06 AM, Russell Standish li...@hpcoders.com.au wrote: On Mon, Mar 18, 2013 at 07:39:44PM +0100, Bruno Marchal wrote: Hi Roger, On 18 Mar 2013, at 12:48, Roger Clough wrote: Since mind is an MQS or Multiple Quantum Superposition, it can process information at the

Re: Mind is a quantum computer

2013-03-19 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 19 Mar 2013, at 16:52, Telmo Menezes wrote: On Tue, Mar 19, 2013 at 2:06 AM, Russell Standish li...@hpcoders.com.au wrote: On Mon, Mar 18, 2013 at 07:39:44PM +0100, Bruno Marchal wrote: Hi Roger, On 18 Mar 2013, at 12:48, Roger Clough wrote: Since mind is an MQS or Multiple Quantum

Re: Losing Control

2013-03-19 Thread Craig Weinberg
On Monday, March 18, 2013 9:05:13 PM UTC-4, stathisp wrote: On Tue, Mar 19, 2013 at 11:39 AM, Craig Weinberg whats...@gmail.comjavascript: wrote: If you say that free will is compatible with determinism then you are an compatibilist, otherwise you are an incompatibilist. Why do you

Re: True?

2013-03-19 Thread Craig Weinberg
On Friday, March 8, 2013 11:11:38 PM UTC-5, Stephen Paul King wrote: On 3/8/2013 11:08 PM, Stephen P. King wrote: Hi, Is the following a sound claim? ...scientifically meaningful propositions are questions about the past, the present, the future, or the eternal laws that:

Re: G.K. Chesterton on Materialism

2013-03-19 Thread John Clark
On Mon, Mar 18, 2013 at 4:15 PM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.comwrote: The man who thinks he is logical is often just stubborn. If being ruled by your head rather than your gut or your crotch is stubborn then being stubborn is a virtue. There are many things related to consciousness

Re: Mind is a quantum computer

2013-03-19 Thread Evgenii Rudnyi
On 19.03.2013 16:38 Bruno Marchal said the following: On 19 Mar 2013, at 15:27, Evgenii Rudnyi wrote: On 19.03.2013 12:39 Bruno Marchal said the following: On 19 Mar 2013, at 10:48, Evgenii Rudnyi wrote: On 18.03.2013 19:39 Bruno Marchal said the following: ... 1) show me a human as

Re: Mind is a quantum computer

2013-03-19 Thread Telmo Menezes
On Tue, Mar 19, 2013 at 5:05 PM, Bruno Marchal marc...@ulb.ac.be wrote: On 19 Mar 2013, at 16:52, Telmo Menezes wrote: On Tue, Mar 19, 2013 at 2:06 AM, Russell Standish li...@hpcoders.com.au wrote: On Mon, Mar 18, 2013 at 07:39:44PM +0100, Bruno Marchal wrote: Hi Roger, On 18 Mar 2013,

Re: Mind is a quantum computer

2013-03-19 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 19 Mar 2013, at 17:34, Telmo Menezes wrote: On Tue, Mar 19, 2013 at 5:05 PM, Bruno Marchal marc...@ulb.ac.be wrote: On 19 Mar 2013, at 16:52, Telmo Menezes wrote: On Tue, Mar 19, 2013 at 2:06 AM, Russell Standish li...@hpcoders.com.au wrote: On Mon, Mar 18, 2013 at 07:39:44PM

Re: Mind is a quantum computer

2013-03-19 Thread John Clark
Factorize 13195212121 Rain Man? Even Rain Man couldn't figure out that 2^57885161 -1 is a prime number as a conventional computer did about a month ago, the number has 17,425,170 digits. This is the sort of problem that quantum computers would be

Re: G.K. Chesterton on Materialism

2013-03-19 Thread Craig Weinberg
On Tuesday, March 19, 2013 12:34:20 PM UTC-4, John Clark wrote: On Mon, Mar 18, 2013 at 4:15 PM, Craig Weinberg whats...@gmail.comjavascript: wrote: The man who thinks he is logical is often just stubborn. If being ruled by your head rather than your gut or your crotch is

Re: Mind is a quantum computer

2013-03-19 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 19 Mar 2013, at 17:34, Evgenii Rudnyi wrote: On 19.03.2013 16:38 Bruno Marchal said the following: On 19 Mar 2013, at 15:27, Evgenii Rudnyi wrote: On 19.03.2013 12:39 Bruno Marchal said the following: On 19 Mar 2013, at 10:48, Evgenii Rudnyi wrote: On 18.03.2013 19:39 Bruno Marchal

Re: True?

2013-03-19 Thread Alberto G. Corona
No. What means truth value of something? in which range of phenomena? in all phenomena applicable? how you can test all phenomena applicable to a theory? you can't. The only thing that you can do is to test a particular prediction that the theory predict that may never happen (Popperian

Re: G.K. Chesterton on Materialism

2013-03-19 Thread John Clark
On Tue, Mar 19, 2013 at 1:13 PM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.comwrote: Intimate relation is not causality. The stock market has been famously been related to skirt lengths If when skirt lengths changed there was ALWAYS a change in the stock market in the same direction, and when the

Re: True?

2013-03-19 Thread Evgenii Rudnyi
On 19.03.2013 18:37 Alberto G. Corona said the following: No. ... Then, to escape the Feyerabend trap, there is necessary additional criteria, such is the economy of axioms or the Occam Razor as criteria for theory acceptance. Fortunately it works, because it seems that we live in a simple,

Re: Mind is a quantum computer

2013-03-19 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 19 Mar 2013, at 18:13, John Clark wrote: Factorize 13195212121 Rain Man? Even Rain Man couldn't figure out that 2^57885161 -1 is a prime number as a conventional computer did about a month ago, the number has 17,425,170 digits. This is the sort

Re: Mind is a quantum computer

2013-03-19 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 19 Mar 2013, at 18:35, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 19 Mar 2013, at 17:34, Evgenii Rudnyi wrote: snip (see the preview post) As an example, I could point you to the Genome Wager between Lewis Wolpert and Rupert Sheldrake http://www.sheldrake.org/DC/controversies/genomewager.html

Re: True?

2013-03-19 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 19 Mar 2013, at 18:37, Alberto G. Corona wrote: No. What means truth value of something? in which range of phenomena? in all phenomena applicable? how you can test all phenomena applicable to a theory? That's what the theory is all about, if done honestly. you can't. of course

Re: G.K. Chesterton on Materialism

2013-03-19 Thread Craig Weinberg
On Tuesday, March 19, 2013 1:38:21 PM UTC-4, John Clark wrote: On Tue, Mar 19, 2013 at 1:13 PM, Craig Weinberg whats...@gmail.comjavascript: wrote: Intimate relation is not causality. The stock market has been famously been related to skirt lengths If when skirt lengths changed

Re: G.K. Chesterton on Materialism

2013-03-19 Thread Evgenii Rudnyi
On 19.03.2013 19:17 Craig Weinberg said the following: On Tuesday, March 19, 2013 1:38:21 PM UTC-4, John Clark wrote: On Tue, Mar 19, 2013 at 1:13 PM, Craig Weinberg whats...@gmail.comjavascript: wrote: Intimate relation is not causality. The stock market has been famously been related

Re: G.K. Chesterton on Materialism

2013-03-19 Thread Craig Weinberg
On Tuesday, March 19, 2013 2:24:40 PM UTC-4, Evgenii Rudnyi wrote: On 19.03.2013 19:17 Craig Weinberg said the following: On Tuesday, March 19, 2013 1:38:21 PM UTC-4, John Clark wrote: On Tue, Mar 19, 2013 at 1:13 PM, Craig Weinberg whats...@gmail.comjavascript: wrote:

Re: Losing Control

2013-03-19 Thread Stathis Papaioannou
On Wed, Mar 20, 2013 at 3:11 AM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com wrote: We need to agree on terminology if we're going to have a discussion at all. Have aliens visited the Earth? We need to agree that an alien is a being born on another planet. It doesn't mean we agree on the facts, but

Re: Mind is a quantum computer

2013-03-19 Thread Russell Standish
On Tue, Mar 19, 2013 at 05:05:25PM +0100, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 19 Mar 2013, at 16:52, Telmo Menezes wrote: On Tue, Mar 19, 2013 at 2:06 AM, Russell Standish as a quantum computer, since random oracles are another way of bridging computational complexity classes. My point to Russell

Re: Losing Control

2013-03-19 Thread Craig Weinberg
On Tuesday, March 19, 2013 5:37:34 PM UTC-4, stathisp wrote: On Wed, Mar 20, 2013 at 3:11 AM, Craig Weinberg whats...@gmail.comjavascript: wrote: We need to agree on terminology if we're going to have a discussion at all. Have aliens visited the Earth? We need to agree that an alien

Re: Losing Control

2013-03-19 Thread Stathis Papaioannou
On Wed, Mar 20, 2013 at 9:01 AM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com wrote: I'll agree on your terms, but you have to make it explicit. My terms are: Super-Personal Intentional (Intuition) |

A philosopher making the Duplication argument

2013-03-19 Thread Stephen P. King
http://www.closertotruth.com/video-profile/What-is-the-Nature-of-Personal-Identity-Peter-van-Inwagen-/176 -- Onward! Stephen -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it,

Re: True?

2013-03-19 Thread meekerdb
On 3/19/2013 10:37 AM, Alberto G. Corona wrote: No. What means truth value of something? in which range of phenomena? in all phenomena applicable? how you can test all phenomena applicable to a theory? you can't. The only thing that you can do is to test a particular prediction that the theory

Re: Mind is a quantum computer

2013-03-19 Thread meekerdb
On 3/19/2013 11:00 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 19 Mar 2013, at 18:35, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 19 Mar 2013, at 17:34, Evgenii Rudnyi wrote: snip (see the preview post) As an example, I could point you to the Genome Wager between Lewis Wolpert and Rupert Sheldrake

Re: Losing Control

2013-03-19 Thread Craig Weinberg
On Tuesday, March 19, 2013 6:19:22 PM UTC-4, stathisp wrote: On Wed, Mar 20, 2013 at 9:01 AM, Craig Weinberg whats...@gmail.comjavascript: wrote: I'll agree on your terms, but you have to make it explicit. My terms are: Super-Personal

Re: True?

2013-03-19 Thread Stephen P. King
On 3/19/2013 6:29 PM, meekerdb wrote: Of course it works in the sense that the selected theory will save the facts, because you only consider theories that are not contradicted by the facts - and if you are fortunate enough to have more than one, then you consider Occams razor and esthetic

Re: Losing Control

2013-03-19 Thread meekerdb
On 3/19/2013 3:19 PM, Stathis Papaioannou wrote: On Wed, Mar 20, 2013 at 9:01 AM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com wrote: I'll agree on your terms, but you have to make it explicit. My terms are: Super-Personal Intentional (Intuition)

Re: Losing Control

2013-03-19 Thread Craig Weinberg
On Tuesday, March 19, 2013 7:14:14 PM UTC-4, Brent wrote: On 3/19/2013 3:19 PM, Stathis Papaioannou wrote: On Wed, Mar 20, 2013 at 9:01 AM, Craig Weinberg whats...@gmail.comjavascript: wrote: I'll agree on your terms, but you have to make it explicit. My terms are:

Re: Losing Control

2013-03-19 Thread Stathis Papaioannou
On Wed, Mar 20, 2013 at 10:01 AM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com wrote: On Tuesday, March 19, 2013 6:19:22 PM UTC-4, stathisp wrote: On Wed, Mar 20, 2013 at 9:01 AM, Craig Weinberg whats...@gmail.com wrote: I'll agree on your terms, but you have to make it explicit. My terms

Re: Losing Control

2013-03-19 Thread Craig Weinberg
On Tuesday, March 19, 2013 8:09:47 PM UTC-4, stathisp wrote: On Wed, Mar 20, 2013 at 10:01 AM, Craig Weinberg whats...@gmail.comjavascript: wrote: On Tuesday, March 19, 2013 6:19:22 PM UTC-4, stathisp wrote: On Wed, Mar 20, 2013 at 9:01 AM, Craig Weinberg whats...@gmail.com

Re: G.K. Chesterton on Materialism

2013-03-19 Thread John Clark
On Tue, Mar 19, 2013 at 2:17 PM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.comwrote: Correlation, even 100% correlation, does not equal causation. BULLSHIT! If when X is changed there is ALWAYS a change in Y in the same direction, and when Y changes you can ALWAYS find a change in X that preceded