Re: What over 170 people think about machines that think

2015-01-31 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 28 Jan 2015, at 10:52, LizR wrote: Machines (Humanly Constructed Artifacts) Cannot Think Arnold Trehub Well, I have an answer to this one, at least. Humans are machines We don't know that. Of course it is a good default hypothesis as we don't have evidences for the contrary (except

Re: Why is there something rather than nothing? From quantum theory to dialectics?

2015-01-31 Thread David Nyman
On 29 January 2015 at 10:12, Samiya Illias samiyaill...@gmail.com wrote: Why not define God as the Creator and Sustainer of the Universe and Everything Else that is or may exist? Very good, and common, definition. It is in most of my theological dictionaries. Note that the Universe is itself

Re: Why is there something rather than nothing? From quantum theory to dialectics?

2015-01-31 Thread Platonist Guitar Cowboy
On Sat, Jan 31, 2015 at 11:37 AM, Samiya Illias samiyaill...@gmail.com wrote: That is due to selective literalism, that you can do with any piece of literature or code of law, and conveniently blame it on the author. That's the problem with literalism though. It's always selective, when

Re: Why is there something rather than nothing? From quantum theory to dialectics?

2015-01-31 Thread Jason Resch
On Sat, Jan 31, 2015 at 4:37 AM, Samiya Illias samiyaill...@gmail.com wrote: On Fri, Jan 30, 2015 at 12:53 AM, Bruno Marchal marc...@ulb.ac.be wrote: On 29 Jan 2015, at 11:12, Samiya Illias wrote: On Wed, Jan 28, 2015 at 9:13 PM, Bruno Marchal marc...@ulb.ac.be wrote: On 14 Jan 2015,

Re: Why is there something rather than nothing? From quantum theory to dialectics?

2015-01-31 Thread Samiya Illias
On Sat, Jan 31, 2015 at 11:14 PM, David Nyman da...@davidnyman.com wrote: On 29 January 2015 at 10:12, Samiya Illias samiyaill...@gmail.com wrote: Why not define God as the Creator and Sustainer of the Universe and Everything Else that is or may exist? Very good, and common, definition. It

Re: Why is there something rather than nothing? From quantum theory to dialectics?

2015-01-31 Thread Samiya Illias
On Sat, Jan 31, 2015 at 9:42 PM, Platonist Guitar Cowboy multiplecit...@gmail.com wrote: On Sat, Jan 31, 2015 at 11:37 AM, Samiya Illias samiyaill...@gmail.com wrote: That is due to selective literalism, that you can do with any piece of literature or code of law, and conveniently

Re: Why is there something rather than nothing? From quantum theory to dialectics?

2015-01-31 Thread Samiya Illias
On Sun, Feb 1, 2015 at 12:20 AM, Jason Resch jasonre...@gmail.com wrote: On Sat, Jan 31, 2015 at 4:37 AM, Samiya Illias samiyaill...@gmail.com wrote: On Fri, Jan 30, 2015 at 12:53 AM, Bruno Marchal marc...@ulb.ac.be wrote: On 29 Jan 2015, at 11:12, Samiya Illias wrote: On Wed, Jan

Re: Why is there something rather than nothing? From quantum theory to dialectics?

2015-01-31 Thread Platonist Guitar Cowboy
On Sat, Jan 31, 2015 at 9:27 PM, Samiya Illias samiyaill...@gmail.com wrote: This theologian stays true to more scientific attitude of ignorance in face of the unknown. Alhazen described his theology: I constantly sought knowledge and truth, and it became my belief that for gaining

Re: Why is there something rather than nothing? From quantum theory to dialectics?

2015-01-31 Thread Platonist Guitar Cowboy
On Sat, Jan 31, 2015 at 9:57 PM, Platonist Guitar Cowboy multiplecit...@gmail.com wrote: On Sat, Jan 31, 2015 at 9:27 PM, Samiya Illias samiyaill...@gmail.com wrote: This theologian stays true to more scientific attitude of ignorance in face of the unknown. Alhazen described his

Re: Why is there something rather than nothing? From quantum theory to dialectics?

2015-01-31 Thread John Mikes
On Jan 29 2015 Samiya wrote: * Why not define God as the Creator and Sustainer of the Universe and Everything Else that is or may exist? * Excellent proposal for a *DEFINING*. Now that carries a question: if you 'define God (Allah?) as the smartest and best Creator and Sustainer, why do you

Re: What over 170 people think about machines that think

2015-01-31 Thread John Clark
On Sat, Jan 31, 2015 at 4:23 AM, Bruno Marchal marc...@ulb.ac.be wrote: the [Turing] test is a bit ambiguous. Bruno, do you believe that Plato could think? If you have doubts about the Turing Test your doubts about Plato should be even greater. Whatever the weaknesses of the Turing Test you

Re: Why is there something rather than nothing? From quantum theory to dialectics?

2015-01-31 Thread Samiya Illias
On 01-Feb-2015, at 1:57 am, Platonist Guitar Cowboy multiplecit...@gmail.com wrote: On Sat, Jan 31, 2015 at 9:27 PM, Samiya Illias samiyaill...@gmail.com wrote: This theologian stays true to more scientific attitude of ignorance in face of the unknown. Alhazen

Re: What over 170 people think about machines that think

2015-01-31 Thread Alberto G. Corona
The Turing test is one of these over- overrated things that modern people worship. A child may not pass the test. And even an adolescent. and a simple program such Eliza could pass it in some way. And it means absolutely nothing. How modern people keep attached to myths fabricated and neglect

Re: What over 170 people think about machines that think

2015-01-31 Thread John Clark
On Sat, Jan 31, 2015 at 5:24 PM, LizR lizj...@gmail.com wrote: I must admit I have never been able to see much point in the TT, So if it's not behavior how do you tell the difference between smart people and stupid people? John K Clark -- You received this message because you are

Re: Why is there something rather than nothing? From quantum theory to dialectics?

2015-01-31 Thread Samiya Illias
On Sun, Feb 1, 2015 at 2:23 AM, John Mikes jami...@gmail.com wrote: On Jan 29 2015 Samiya wrote: * Why not define God as the Creator and Sustainer of the Universe and Everything Else that is or may exist? * Excellent proposal for a *DEFINING*. Now that carries a question: if you 'define

Re: Why is there something rather than nothing? From quantum theory to dialectics?

2015-01-31 Thread Platonist Guitar Cowboy
On Sun, Feb 1, 2015 at 4:32 AM, Samiya Illias samiyaill...@gmail.com wrote: On Sun, Feb 1, 2015 at 5:16 AM, Platonist Guitar Cowboy multiplecit...@gmail.com wrote: On Sat, Jan 31, 2015 at 10:34 PM, Samiya Illias samiyaill...@gmail.com wrote: On 01-Feb-2015, at 1:57 am, Platonist

Re: What over 170 people think about machines that think

2015-01-31 Thread LizR
I must admit I have never been able to see much point in the TT, but I think it probably made sense in the context of the times, as a first cut at defining AI. But as Alberto says we shouldn't have deified it or reified it (or whatever). On 1 February 2015 at 10:43, Alberto G. Corona

Re: What over 170 people think about machines that think

2015-01-31 Thread Alberto G. Corona
Yes. It was a first cut. For a very realistic and humorous view of the social problems with machines I recommend the novels of stanislav Lem. 2015-01-31 23:24 GMT+01:00 LizR lizj...@gmail.com: I must admit I have never been able to see much point in the TT, but I think it probably made sense

Re: Why is there something rather than nothing? From quantum theory to dialectics?

2015-01-31 Thread Platonist Guitar Cowboy
On Sat, Jan 31, 2015 at 10:34 PM, Samiya Illias samiyaill...@gmail.com wrote: On 01-Feb-2015, at 1:57 am, Platonist Guitar Cowboy multiplecit...@gmail.com wrote: Kierkegaard complained about this with his own Religion, the Christians. Maybe all religions suffer from this as there is

Re: Free Speech is not Free unless it is allowed for every point of view

2015-01-31 Thread LizR
War is peace Freedom is slavery Ignorance is strength Did he have a hotline to the 21st century or what??? On 21 January 2015 at 10:00, 'Chris de Morsella' via Everything List everything-list@googlegroups.com wrote: -- *From:* spudboy100 via Everything List

Re: Why is there something rather than nothing? From quantum theory to dialectics?

2015-01-31 Thread Samiya Illias
On Sun, Feb 1, 2015 at 5:16 AM, Platonist Guitar Cowboy multiplecit...@gmail.com wrote: On Sat, Jan 31, 2015 at 10:34 PM, Samiya Illias samiyaill...@gmail.com wrote: On 01-Feb-2015, at 1:57 am, Platonist Guitar Cowboy multiplecit...@gmail.com wrote: Kierkegaard complained about

Re: Democracy

2015-01-31 Thread LizR
On 14 January 2015 at 09:12, Platonist Guitar Cowboy multiplecit...@gmail.com wrote: I'd appreciate a link to sex with sheep list. Not for personal but for scientific reasons. For example, to find out: Do Le Pen, Emerson, or Hitler frequent such list? Are there more Christian or Muslims

Re: Democracy

2015-01-31 Thread LizR
On 14 January 2015 at 12:07, Telmo Menezes te...@telmomenezes.com wrote: So in what way are you forced to conform? Do you want to have sex with sheep? No. Do you want to shoot up heroin? Not now, but I would like the option if I were terminally ill. Do you want print your own

Re: Why is there something rather than nothing? From quantum theory to dialectics?

2015-01-31 Thread Samiya Illias
On Fri, Jan 30, 2015 at 12:53 AM, Bruno Marchal marc...@ulb.ac.be wrote: On 29 Jan 2015, at 11:12, Samiya Illias wrote: On Wed, Jan 28, 2015 at 9:13 PM, Bruno Marchal marc...@ulb.ac.be wrote: On 14 Jan 2015, at 11:46, Samiya Illias wrote (to Chris): Why not define God as the Creator