Re: Probability in MWI as self-locating uncertainty

2018-09-26 Thread Brent Meeker
arroll (arXiv:1405.7577) that probability in MWI can be understood in terms of self-locating uncertainty -- when all outcomes of a measurement are realized in unitary quantum mechanics, probabilities might arise because one is does not know in which branch of the universal wave functi

Re: Probability in MWI as self-locating uncertainty

2018-09-22 Thread Bruce Kellett
From: *Philip Thrift* mailto:cloudver...@gmail.com>> This is strange. This appears here on Everything List when it appears to come from Free Thinkers Physics Discussion Group

Re: Probability in MWI as self-locating uncertainty

2018-09-22 Thread Philip Thrift
argument by Sebens and Carroll (arXiv:1405.7577) that probability in >> MWI can be understood in terms of self-locating uncertainty -- when all >> outcomes of a measurement are realized in unitary quantum mechanics, >> probabilities might arise because one is does not know

Re: Probability in MWI as self-locating uncertainty

2018-09-21 Thread Bruce Kellett
From: *Brent Meeker* mailto:meeke...@verizon.net>> On Friday, September 21, 2018 at 12:11:01 AM UTC-5, Bruce Kellett wrote: Adrian Kent (arXiv:1408.1944) makes some interesting comments about the recent argument by Sebens and Carroll (arXiv:1405.7577) that probability in M

Re: The Ilusion of Branching and the MWI

2018-08-13 Thread Bruno Marchal
> On 6 Aug 2018, at 21:11, Brent Meeker wrote: > > > > On 8/6/2018 11:22 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >>> On 6 Aug 2018, at 09:23, agrayson2...@gmail.com >>> wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> On Sunday, August 5, 2018 at 5:50:56 PM UTC, agrays...@gmail.com >>>

Re: The Ilusion of Branching and the MWI

2018-08-08 Thread Bruno Marchal
> On 7 Aug 2018, at 22:25, Brent Meeker wrote: > > > > On 8/7/2018 4:32 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >>> On 7 Aug 2018, at 01:33, Brent Meeker >> > wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> On 8/5/2018 9:43 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: > On 4 Aug 2018, at 23:32,

Re: The Ilusion of Branching and the MWI

2018-08-07 Thread Brent Meeker
On 8/7/2018 4:32 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 7 Aug 2018, at 01:33, Brent Meeker > wrote: On 8/5/2018 9:43 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 4 Aug 2018, at 23:32, agrayson2...@gmail.com wrote: AFAIK, no one has ever observed a

Re: The Ilusion of Branching and the MWI

2018-08-07 Thread Bruno Marchal
his >> ignorance interfere independently of you. >> >> >> >> >> >>> So I have embraced the "shut up and calculate" interpretation of the wave >>> function. >> >> >> That can be wise. Nobody can enforce the search of the tr

Re: The Ilusion of Branching and the MWI

2018-08-07 Thread Bruno Marchal
parts, but that is testable. > > Bruno > > > > >> >> It is OK to say that probability comes from ignorance, and that the wave >> describe that ignorance, the extraordinary thing is then that this >> ignorance interfere independently of you. >>&

Re: The Ilusion of Branching and the MWI

2018-08-07 Thread Bruno Marchal
OK to say that probability comes from ignorance, and that the wave >> describe that ignorance, the extraordinary thing is then that this >> ignorance interfere independently of you. >>> So I have embraced the "shut up and calculate" interpretation of the wave

Re: The Ilusion of Branching and the MWI

2018-08-07 Thread Bruno Marchal
er been found where the wave interfere destructively, and >> the pattern on the screen will reflect the number of holes, and their >> disposition. >> >> It is OK to say that probability comes from ignorance, and that the wave >> describe that ignorance, the extraordinary thin

Re: The Ilusion of Branching and the MWI

2018-08-07 Thread Bruno Marchal
> On 6 Aug 2018, at 21:11, Brent Meeker wrote: > > > > On 8/6/2018 11:22 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >>> On 6 Aug 2018, at 09:23, agrayson2...@gmail.com >>> wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> On Sunday, August 5, 2018 at 5:50:56 PM UTC, agrays...@gmail.com >>>

Re: The Ilusion of Branching and the MWI

2018-08-06 Thread Brent Meeker
or the contrary, and it is shocking because truth always beat fictions. I also see a connection between the True Believers of the MWI, and Trump sycophants; they seem immune to simple facts, such as the foolishness of thinking copies of observers can occur, or be created, willy-nilly. AG That rema

Re: The Ilusion of Branching and the MWI

2018-08-06 Thread agrayson2000
perhaps all, is a sum on > infinitely many virtual path. With mechanism, there might still be too much > parts, but that is testable. > > Bruno > > > > > >>> It is OK to say that probability comes from ignorance, and that the wave >>> describe

Re: The Ilusion of Branching and the MWI

2018-08-06 Thread agrayson2000
> > >>> It is OK to say that probability comes from ignorance, and that the wave >>> describe that ignorance, the extraordinary thing is then that this >>> ignorance interfere independently of you. >>> >>> So I have embraced the "shut up

Re: The Ilusion of Branching and the MWI

2018-08-06 Thread Brent Meeker
On 8/6/2018 11:22 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 6 Aug 2018, at 09:23, agrayson2...@gmail.com wrote: On Sunday, August 5, 2018 at 5:50:56 PM UTC, agrays...@gmail.com wrote: On Sunday, August 5, 2018 at 4:43:21 PM UTC, Bruno Marchal

Re: The Ilusion of Branching and the MWI

2018-08-06 Thread agrayson2000
ignorance, the extraordinary thing is then that this >> ignorance interfere independently of you. >> >> >> >> >> >> So I have embraced the "shut up and calculate" interpretation of the wave >> function. >> >> >> >> That ca

Re: The Ilusion of Branching and the MWI

2018-08-06 Thread Bruno Marchal
t ignorance, the extraordinary thing is then that this ignorance > interfere independently of you. >> So I have embraced the "shut up and calculate" interpretation of the wave >> function. > That can be wise. Nobody can enforce the search of the truth. It is > frust

Re: The Ilusion of Branching and the MWI

2018-08-06 Thread Bruno Marchal
y epistemic content. So I have embraced the "shut >> up and calculate" interpretation of the wave function. I also see a >> connection between the True Believers of the MWI, and Trump sycophants; they >> seem immune to simple facts, such as the foolishness of thinkin

Re: The Ilusion of Branching and the MWI

2018-08-06 Thread Bruno Marchal
ependently of you. > > > > > >> So I have embraced the "shut up and calculate" interpretation of the wave >> function. > > > That can be wise. Nobody can enforce the search of the truth. It is > frustrating because we can’t be sure i

Re: The Ilusion of Branching and the MWI

2018-08-06 Thread agrayson2000
ed the "shut > up and calculate" interpretation of the wave function. I also see a > connection between the True Believers of the MWI, and Trump sycophants; > they seem immune to simple facts, such as the foolishness of thinking > copies of observers can occur, or be create

Re: The Ilusion of Branching and the MWI

2018-08-06 Thread agrayson2000
, the extraordinary thing is then that this >> ignorance interfere independently of you. >> >> So I have embraced the "shut up and calculate" interpretation of the wave >> function. >> >> That can be wise. Nobody can enforce the search of the truth. It i

Re: The Ilusion of Branching and the MWI

2018-08-05 Thread 'scerir' via Everything List
wave function. I also see a connection > between the True Believers of the MWI, and Trump sycophants; they seem immune > to simple facts, such as the foolishness of thinking copies of observers can > occur, or be created, willy-nilly. AG > Frankly I cannot understand, from the followi

Re: The Ilusion of Branching and the MWI

2018-08-05 Thread agrayson2000
gt; frustrating because we can’t be sure if we progress toward it or the > contrary, and it is shocking because truth always beat fictions. > > > > I also see a connection between the True Believers of the MWI, and Trump > sycophants; they seem immune to simple facts, such as the

Re: The Ilusion of Branching and the MWI

2018-08-05 Thread Bruno Marchal
s beat fictions. > I also see a connection between the True Believers of the MWI, and Trump > sycophants; they seem immune to simple facts, such as the foolishness of > thinking copies of observers can occur, or be created, willy-nilly. AG That remark deserves your point and dimini

Re: The Ilusion of Branching and the MWI

2018-08-04 Thread agrayson2000
>> the wave function has only epistemic content. So I have embraced the "shut >> up and calculate" interpretation of the wave function. I also see a >> connection between the True Believers of the MWI, and Trump sycophants; >> they seem immune to simple fac

Re: The Ilusion of Branching and the MWI

2018-08-04 Thread Quentin Anciaux
I have embraced the "shut > up and calculate" interpretation of the wave function. I also see a > connection between the True Believers of the MWI, and Trump sycophants; > they seem immune to simple facts, such as the foolishness of thinking > copies of observers can occur, or

The Ilusion of Branching and the MWI

2018-08-04 Thread agrayson2000
AFAIK, no one has ever observed a probability wave, from which I conclude the wave function has only epistemic content. So I have embraced the "shut up and calculate" interpretation of the wave function. I also see a connection between the True Believers of the MWI, and Trump

Re: My final word on the MWI --

2018-07-30 Thread Bruno Marchal
> On 30 Jul 2018, at 08:51, Alberto G. Corona wrote: > > We need a safe space-time What could be safer than something originating in 2+2=4? > > > No universe was burned in the making of this email Good. All Universe are created equal with respect to the Law and Rights. > >

Re: My final word on the MWI --

2018-07-30 Thread Alberto G. Corona
We need a safe space-time No universe was burned in the making of this email 2018-07-26 19:18 GMT+02:00 Bruno Marchal : > > On 26 Jul 2018, at 13:06, agrayson2...@gmail.com wrote: > > -- a mental illness, verging on, but not quite a form of insanity. AG > > > > That was like the final word of

Re: My final word on the MWI --

2018-07-29 Thread Lawrence Crowell
On Sunday, July 29, 2018 at 3:08:50 AM UTC-5, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > > On 28 Jul 2018, at 20:36, Lawrence Crowell > wrote: > > In the deBroglie-Bohm interpretation the counterfactual does not exist. > > > Here I disagree. They continue to exist in the potential so that it guides > the

Re: My final word on the MWI --

2018-07-29 Thread Telmo Menezes
t; >>> and their ideas instead of discussing or just stay with their own >> >>> thoughts and just say they disagree... What do you gain by saying >> >>> they are insane, stupid or whatever? >> >>> >> >>> It just looks to me childis

Re: My final word on the MWI --

2018-07-29 Thread agrayson2000
r own > >>> thoughts and just say they disagree... What do you gain by saying > >>> they are insane, stupid or whatever? > >>> > >>> It just looks to me childish. So stop doing this, stop writing in > >>> 70pt size red fonts... It's a disfavo

Re: My final word on the MWI --

2018-07-29 Thread Telmo Menezes
;>> In fact, I DO think it's a mental illness. AG >> >> >> It's not just wrong, but a gross dysfunction of judgment. Joe the >> Plumber goes into a lab or his closet, shoots a single electron at a >> slit, and by so doing creates uncountable universes, all with

Re: My final word on the MWI --

2018-07-29 Thread smitra
large. I don't see how that follows. Unfortunately, one cannot PROVE that the many worlds allegedly implied by the MWI interpretation don't exist, which is why I insist the True Believers are judgment impaired. Do you really believe that trivial actions by mere humans, accidents of evolution, can cre

Re: My final word on the MWI --

2018-07-29 Thread Bruno Marchal
xisting counterfactuals > in a ψ-ontic interpretation, such as MWI. We agree. > In MWI the counterfactual continues to exist after the process as well. That was my point. OK. > In the deBroglie-Bohm interpretation the counterfactual does not exist. Here I disagree. They cont

Re: My final word on the MWI --

2018-07-28 Thread Lawrence Crowell
al objects. Prior to a measurement or decoherent process that shifts a superposition or entanglement phase from a system to a reservoir of states we might say the superposition of a quantum wave is a case of prior existing counterfactuals in a ψ-ontic interpretation, such as MWI. In MWI the counter

Re: My final word on the MWI --

2018-07-28 Thread agrayson2000
>>>>>>>> people and their ideas instead of discussing or just stay with >>>>>>>>>>>> their own >>>>>>>>>>>> thoughts and just say they disagree... What do you gain by saying >>>>>>>>&

Re: My final word on the MWI --

2018-07-28 Thread Bruno Marchal
es into a lab or his closet, shoots a single electron at a slit, and by so > doing creates uncountable universes, all with copies of himself, replete with > his memories. Sure. AG > > You may as well protest on the same basis that the universe can’t be so > wastefully large. >

Re: My final word on the MWI --

2018-07-28 Thread Bruno Marchal
gt;>>> >>>> It's not just wrong, but a gross dysfunction of judgment. Joe the Plumber >>>> goes into a lab or his closet, shoots a single electron at a slit, and by >>>> so doing creates uncountable >>>

Re: My final word on the MWI --

2018-07-28 Thread Bruno Marchal
dysfunction of judgment. Joe the Plumber >>> goes into a lab or his closet, shoots a single electron at a slit, and by >>> so doing creates uncountable universes, all with copies of himself, replete >>> with his memories. Sure. AG >>> >>> You m

Re: My final word on the MWI --

2018-07-27 Thread Brent Meeker
l protest on the same basis that the universe can’t be so wastefully large. I don't see how that follows. Unfortunately, one cannot PROVE that the many worlds allegedly implied by the MWI interpretation don't exist, which is w

Re: My final word on the MWI --

2018-07-27 Thread Quentin Anciaux
ting in >>>>>>>> 70pt size red fonts... It's a disfavor to your arguments. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Quentin >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> In fact, I DO think it's a menta

Re: My final word on the MWI --

2018-07-27 Thread agrayson2000
>>>>>>>> insane, stupid or whatever? >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> It just looks to me childish. So stop doing this, stop writing >>>>>>>>>>> in 70pt size red fonts... It

Re: My final word on the MWI --

2018-07-27 Thread Brent Meeker
I don't see how that follows. Unfortunately, one cannot PROVE that the many worlds allegedly implied by the MWI interpretation don't exist, which is why I insist the True Believers are judgment impaired. Do you really believe that trivial a

Re: My final word on the MWI --

2018-07-27 Thread Brent Meeker
lds allegedly implied by the MWI interpretation don't exist, which is why I insist the True Believers are judgment impaired. Do you really believe that trivial actions by mere humans, accidents of evolution, can create entire universes? AG. No, because tha

Re: My final word on the MWI --

2018-07-27 Thread Quentin Anciaux
size red fonts... It's a disfavor to your arguments. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Quentin >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> In fact, I DO think it's a mental illness. AG >>>>>> >>>>> &

Re: My final word on the MWI --

2018-07-27 Thread Brent Meeker
ow that follows. Unfortunately, one cannot PROVE that the many worlds allegedly implied by the MWI interpretation don't exist, which is why I insist the True Believers are judgment impaired. Do you really believe that trivial actions by mere humans, accidents of evolution, can

Re: My final word on the MWI --

2018-07-27 Thread agrayson2000
;>>> >>>> It's not just wrong, but a gross dysfunction of judgment. Joe the >>>> Plumber goes into a lab or his closet, shoots a single electron at a slit, >>>> and by so doing creates uncountable universes, all with copies of himself, >>>

Re: My final word on the MWI --

2018-07-27 Thread agrayson2000
t;>>>>>>> they are >>>>>>>>>> insane, stupid or whatever? >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> It just looks to me childish. So stop doing this, stop writing in >>>>>>>>>> 70pt s

Re: My final word on the MWI --

2018-07-27 Thread Quentin Anciaux
ong, but a gross dysfunction of judgment. Joe the >>>> Plumber goes into a lab or his closet, shoots a single electron at a slit, >>>> and by so doing creates uncountable universes, all with copies of himself, >>>> replete with his memories. Sure. AG >>>> >

Re: My final word on the MWI --

2018-07-27 Thread Quentin Anciaux
gt;>> 70pt size red fonts... It's a disfavor to your arguments. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Quentin >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> In fact, I DO think it's a mental illnes

Re: My final word on the MWI --

2018-07-27 Thread Brent Meeker
. I don't see how that follows. Unfortunately, one cannot PROVE that the many worlds allegedly implied by the MWI interpretation don't exist, which is why I insist the True Believers are judgment impaired. Do you really believe that trivial actions by mere humans, accidents of

Re: My final word on the MWI --

2018-07-27 Thread agrayson2000
> It just looks to me childish. So stop doing this, stop writing in >>>>>>>> 70pt size red fonts... It's a disfavor to your arguments. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Quentin >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>&g

Re: My final word on the MWI --

2018-07-27 Thread Bruno Marchal
ing creates uncountable universes, all with copies of himself, replete with > his memories. Sure. AG > > You may as well protest on the same basis that the universe can’t be so > wastefully large. > > I don't see how that follows. Unfortunately, one cannot PROVE that the many > wo

Re: My final word on the MWI --

2018-07-27 Thread Bruno Marchal
gt; suggest there might be other planets, before burning it at the stake. > > No, not at all. I don't deny the possible existence of multiple universes. > What I DO deny is that they're implied by the MWI. AG > > You worry me a little bit. > > Anyway, closing discussion or

Re: My final word on the MWI --

2018-07-27 Thread Quentin Anciaux
t;>>>>> >>>>>> In fact, I DO think it's a mental illness. AG >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> It's not just wrong, but a gross dysfunction of judgment. Joe the >>>>> Plumber goes into a lab or his closet,

Re: My final word on the MWI --

2018-07-27 Thread Telmo Menezes
t;>> 70pt size red fonts... It's a disfavor to your arguments. >> >>>>>>> >> >>>>>>> Quentin >> >>>>>> >> >>>>>> >> >>>>>> In fact, I DO think it's a mental illness.

Re: My final word on the MWI --

2018-07-27 Thread agrayson2000
sh. So stop doing this, stop writing in > >>>>>>> 70pt size red fonts... It's a disfavor to your arguments. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Quentin > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> I

Re: My final word on the MWI --

2018-07-27 Thread Telmo Menezes
;>>>>> >>>>>> In fact, I DO think it's a mental illness. AG >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> It's not just wrong, but a gross dysfunction of judgment. Joe the >>>>> Plumber goes into a lab or his close

Re: My final word on the MWI --

2018-07-27 Thread agrayson2000
nts... It's a disfavor to your arguments. >>>>>> >>>>>> Quentin >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> In fact, I DO think it's a mental illness. AG >>>>> >>>> >>>> It's not just wro

Re: My final word on the MWI --

2018-07-27 Thread Quentin Anciaux
just wrong, but a gross dysfunction of judgment. Joe the >>> Plumber goes into a lab or his closet, shoots a single electron at a slit, >>> and by so doing creates uncountable universes, all with copies of himself, >>> replete with his memories. Sure. AG >>> >> >

Re: My final word on the MWI --

2018-07-26 Thread agrayson2000
es uncountable universes, all with copies of himself, replete >> with his memories. Sure. AG >> > > You may as well protest on the same basis that the universe can’t be so > wastefully large. > I don't see how that follows. Unfortunately, one cannot PROVE that the many w

Re: My final word on the MWI --

2018-07-26 Thread Stathis Papaioannou
On Fri, 27 Jul 2018 at 2:08 am, wrote: > > > On Thursday, July 26, 2018 at 11:30:11 AM UTC, agrays...@gmail.com wrote: >> >> >> >> On Thursday, July 26, 2018 at 11:24:42 AM UTC, Quentin Anciaux wrote: >>> >>> I still don't get it why some people prefer insulting other people and >>> their ideas

Re: My final word on the MWI --

2018-07-26 Thread agrayson2000
it at the stake. > *No, not at all. I don't deny the possible existence of multiple universes. What I DO deny is that they're implied by the MWI. AG* > > You worry me a little bit. > > Anyway, closing discussion or using insult means you are not really > interested in sea

Re: My final word on the MWI --

2018-07-26 Thread Bruno Marchal
> On 26 Jul 2018, at 13:06, agrayson2...@gmail.com wrote: > > -- a mental illness, verging on, but not quite a form of insanity. AG That was like the final word of the Church about Giordano Bruno, who dared to suggest there might be other planets, before burning it at the stake. You worry

Re: My final word on the MWI --

2018-07-26 Thread agrayson2000
On Thursday, July 26, 2018 at 11:30:11 AM UTC, agrays...@gmail.com wrote: > > > > On Thursday, July 26, 2018 at 11:24:42 AM UTC, Quentin Anciaux wrote: >> >> I still don't get it why some people prefer insulting other people and >> their ideas instead of discussing or just stay with their own

Re: My final word on the MWI --

2018-07-26 Thread agrayson2000
On Thursday, July 26, 2018 at 11:24:42 AM UTC, Quentin Anciaux wrote: > > I still don't get it why some people prefer insulting other people and > their ideas instead of discussing or just stay with their own thoughts and > just say they disagree... What do you gain by saying they are insane,

Re: My final word on the MWI --

2018-07-26 Thread Quentin Anciaux
I still don't get it why some people prefer insulting other people and their ideas instead of discussing or just stay with their own thoughts and just say they disagree... What do you gain by saying they are insane, stupid or whatever? It just looks to me childish. So stop doing this, stop

My final word on the MWI --

2018-07-26 Thread agrayson2000
-- a mental illness, verging on, but not quite a form of insanity. AG -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to

Re: Strong AI implies MWI

2018-05-29 Thread Bruno Marchal
n. It is like betting on something we have no evidence for, just to prevent a simpler theory to work. > >> >> While this doesn't seem to have anything to do with quantum mechanics, the >> MWI etc., it actually implies the MWI. This follows from the assumption that >>

Re: Strong AI implies MWI

2018-05-29 Thread Bruno Marchal
can be done with STRONG AI instead, and that is somehow done in the “interview of the universal (Löbian) machine. > > While this doesn't seem to have anything to do with quantum mechanics, the > MWI etc., it actually implies the MWI. I agree, with “world” left to further precis

Re: Strong AI implies MWI

2018-05-27 Thread Brent Meeker
text of a world, a world which is effectively physical. While this doesn't seem to have anything to do with quantum mechanics, the MWI etc., it actually implies the MWI. This follows from the assumption that whatever subjective experience is generated by the simulation is independent of the impleme

Strong AI implies MWI

2018-05-27 Thread smitra
f certain computations are performed correctly, not on how those computations are performed. While this doesn't seem to have anything to do with quantum mechanics, the MWI etc., it actually implies the MWI. This follows from the assumption that whatever subjective experience is

Re: Interpretive cards (MWI, Bohm, Copenhagen: collect ’em all)

2018-02-18 Thread agrayson2000
uantum interpretations: > > https://www.scottaaronson.com/blog/?p=3628 > > He seems somewhat conflicted over which interpretation to believe. > "Anyway, as I said, MWI is the best interpretation if we leave ourselves > out of the picture. what would it be like to b

Re: Interpretive cards (MWI, Bohm, Copenhagen: collect ’em all)

2018-02-12 Thread Bruno Marchal
elieve..... > "Anyway, as I said, MWI is the best interpretation if we leave ourselves out > of the picture. what would it be like to be maintained in a coherent > superposition of thinking two different thoughts A and B, and then to get > measured in the |A>+|B&

Re: Interpretive cards (MWI, Bohm, Copenhagen: collect ’em all)

2018-02-12 Thread Lawrence Crowell
that are ψ-ontic, which in some way might reflect an undecidability issue with quantum mechanics. Examples of these for ψ-epistemic interpretations are Copenhagen, GRW or objective collapse, and those that are ψ-ontic are MWI or the deBroglie-Bohm interpretation. LC On Sunday, February 11, 2018 at 4

Re: Interpretive cards (MWI, Bohm, Copenhagen: collect ’em all)

2018-02-11 Thread Stathis Papaioannou
. > "Anyway, as I said, MWI is the best interpretation if we leave ourselves > out of the picture. what would it be like to be maintained in a > coherent superposition of thinking two different thoughts A and B, and > then to get measured in the |A>+|B>, |A&

Interpretive cards (MWI, Bohm, Copenhagen: collect ’em all)

2018-02-11 Thread Bruce Kellett
Scott Aaronson has an interesting blog entry on quantum interpretations: https://www.scottaaronson.com/blog/?p=3628 He seems somewhat conflicted over which interpretation to believe. "Anyway, as I said, MWI is the best interpretation if we leave ourselves out of the picture. what

Re: A thought on MWI and its alternative(s)

2017-06-21 Thread Bruno Marchal
Hi Pierz, On 21 Jun 2017, at 15:31, Pierz wrote: Bruno, do you believe there is a different world for every possible basis in which a spin (or other observable) might be measured? That seems pretty strange. I believe in 0 worlds, but in many relative computational histories, in

Re: A thought on MWI and its alternative(s)

2017-06-21 Thread Pierz
Bruno, do you believe there is a different world for every possible basis in which a spin (or other observable) might be measured? That seems pretty strange. On Wednesday, June 21, 2017 at 10:27:14 PM UTC+10, Bruno Marchal wrote: > On 20 Jun 2017, at 19:44, Brent Meeker wrote: > > > > > > >

Re: A thought on MWI and its alternative(s)

2017-06-21 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 20 Jun 2017, at 19:44, Brent Meeker wrote: On 6/19/2017 11:47 PM, Bruno Marchal wrote: Why would you say that if I fly from Bermuda to London it demonstrates that flights from Bermuda to Algiers and Algiers to London exist? Why should I not when I can find interference pattern

Re: A thought on MWI and its alternative(s)

2017-06-20 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 19 Jun 2017, at 19:08, Brent Meeker wrote: On 6/19/2017 2:46 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: So back to quantum computation: what I think that QC demonstrates (independently of it being realised by network models or cluster states) is that the superposition of states really does mean that the

Re: A thought on MWI and its alternative(s)

2017-06-19 Thread Pierz
On Tuesday, June 20, 2017 at 3:08:42 AM UTC+10, Brent wrote: > > > > On 6/19/2017 2:46 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > So back to quantum computation: what I think that QC demonstrates > (independently of it being realised by network models or cluster > states) is that the superposition of states

Re: A thought on MWI and its alternative(s)

2017-06-19 Thread Brent Meeker
On 6/19/2017 2:46 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: So back to quantum computation: what I think that QC demonstrates (independently of it being realised by network models or cluster states) is that the superposition of states really does mean that the various states *exist*. Superposition of states

Re: A thought on MWI and its alternative(s)

2017-06-19 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 18 Jun 2017, at 21:17, Brent Meeker wrote: On 6/18/2017 3:43 AM, Telmo Menezes wrote: No, but it does mean that a quantum computer can have the computational power of a lot of Turing machines acting in parallel, and it is normal to ask "why?", and be unsatisfied with a theory that

Re: A thought on MWI and its alternative(s)

2017-06-18 Thread Brent Meeker
On 6/18/2017 3:43 AM, Telmo Menezes wrote: No, but it does mean that a quantum computer can have the computational power of a lot of Turing machines acting in parallel, and it is normal to ask "why?", and be unsatisfied with a theory that does not answer this question. I have come across an

Re: A thought on MWI and its alternative(s)

2017-06-18 Thread spudboy100 via Everything List
;te...@telmomenezes.com> To: everything-list <everything-list@googlegroups.com> Sent: Sun, Jun 18, 2017 6:43 am Subject: Re: A thought on MWI and its alternative(s) > No, but it does mean that a quantum computer can have the > computational power of a lot of Turing machines

Re: A thought on MWI and its alternative(s)

2017-06-18 Thread Telmo Menezes
> No, but it does mean that a quantum computer can have the > computational power of a lot of Turing machines acting in parallel, > and it is normal to ask "why?", and be unsatisfied with a theory that > does not answer this question. > > > I have come across an interesting paper that discusses

Re: A thought on MWI and its alternative(s)

2017-06-16 Thread Bruno Marchal
problem, and there does not seem to be any principled way from within the theory to select unambiguosly the basis in which all of these worlds form. More recent understandings of MWI take decoherence into account. Decoherence provides a principled dynamical way to solve the basis problem

Re: A thought on MWI and its alternative(s)

2017-06-16 Thread Bruce Kellett
way from within the theory to select unambiguosly the basis in which all of these worlds form. More recent understandings of MWI take decoherence into account. Decoherence provides a principled dynamical way to solve the basis problem, but it means the worlds do not actually form until

Re: A thought on MWI and its alternative(s)

2017-06-15 Thread John Clark
On Tue, Jun 13, 2017 at 7:11 AM, Telmo Menezes wrote: ​> ​ > If you take the wave function seriously, then you take > ​ ​ > seriously that qubits really do exist in a superposition of states, > ​ ​ > and this explains the exponential increase in computational power as >

Re: A thought on MWI and its alternative(s)

2017-06-15 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 15 Jun 2017, at 06:59, Bruce Kellett wrote: On Wednesday, June 14, 2017 at 10:19:56 AM UTC+10, Brent wrote 6/13/2017 4:11 AM, Telmo Menezes wrote: > The reason why it would follow is precisely the point of my rhetorical > question above. If you take the wave function seriously, then you

Re: A thought on MWI and its alternative(s)

2017-06-15 Thread Bruno Marchal
nt that you CAN place a detector next to one slit so you CAN know which slit the photon went through, but if you do that then the interference pattern disappears. How does the MWI explain that? It says that when the photon approaches the 2 slits the universe splits, but in one universe a

Re: A thought on MWI and its alternative(s)

2017-06-15 Thread Bruno Marchal
unambiguosly the basis in which all of these worlds form. More recent understandings of MWI take decoherence into account. Decoherence provides a principled dynamical way to solve the basis problem, but it means the worlds do not actually form until there is decoherence -- worlds cannot form

Re: A thought on MWI and its alternative(s)

2017-06-14 Thread Bruce Kellett
On Wednesday, June 14, 2017 at 10:19:56 AM UTC+10, Brent wrote 6/13/2017 4:11 AM, Telmo Menezes wrote: > The reason why it would follow is precisely the point of my rhetorical > question above. If you take the wave function seriously, then you take > seriously that qubits

Re: A thought on MWI and its alternative(s)

2017-06-14 Thread John Clark
experiment that you CAN place a detector next to one slit so you CAN know which slit the photon went through, but if you do that then the interference pattern disappears. How does the MWI explain that? It says that when the photon approaches the 2 slits the universe splits, but in one universe a

Re: A thought on MWI and its alternative(s)

2017-06-14 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 12 Jun 2017, at 17:09, John Clark wrote: On Fri, Jun 9, 2017 at 7:11 PM, Bruce Kellett wrote: ​> ​Deutsch is out to lunch on this. He appears to assume that a quantum computer is just using the same algorithms that a classical computer would use, only

Re: A thought on MWI and its alternative(s)

2017-06-13 Thread Brent Meeker
6/13/2017 4:11 AM, Telmo Menezes wrote: The reason why it would follow is precisely the point of my rhetorical question above. If you take the wave function seriously, then you take seriously that qubits really do exist in a superposition of states, and this explains the exponential increase in

Re: A thought on MWI and its alternative(s)

2017-06-13 Thread Bruce Kellett
. More recent understandings of MWI take decoherence into account. Decoherence provides a principled dynamical way to solve the basis problem, but it means the worlds do not actually form until there is decoherence -- worlds cannot form until they know what basis is relevant! I recommend

  1   2   3   4   5   6   7   8   9   10   >