Re: Men don't get no respect these days

2012-12-19 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 17 Dec 2012, at 17:38, Roger Clough wrote: Hi Craig Fear of God is the beginning of wisdom. Roger, I am not sure. If you are kind with ùe, I will love you, but if later I hear that you are kind with me because you fear God, I will not sure I will attribute any genuine kindness to

Re: What is truth ? Take your pick.

2012-12-19 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 17 Dec 2012, at 17:31, Roger Clough wrote: Hi Stephen P. King An interesting insight. Hmmm. I may have to disagree with you, possibly because no one arithmetic statement is the whole truth. And comp needs a whole set of equations, no one of which is the whole truth. No, with comp, for

The pro-life paradox

2012-12-19 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 17 Dec 2012, at 17:49, Roger Clough wrote: Hi Stephen P. King I define good as that which enhances life and evil as that which diminishes it. Is pro-life activism enhancing life or diminishing life? Some pro-life doctor are against euthanasia, even passive euthanasia, with the result

Re: What is truth ? Take your pick.

2012-12-19 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 17 Dec 2012, at 17:50, Stephen P. King wrote: On 12/17/2012 11:31 AM, Roger Clough wrote: I may have to disagree with you, possibly because no one arithmetic statement is the whole truth. And comp needs a whole set of equations, no one of which is the whole truth. But I think that

Re: What is truth ? Take your pick.

2012-12-19 Thread Stephen P. King
On 12/19/2012 5:44 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 17 Dec 2012, at 17:50, Stephen P. King wrote: On 12/17/2012 11:31 AM, Roger Clough wrote: I may have to disagree with you, possibly because no one arithmetic statement is the whole truth. And comp needs a whole set of equations, no one of which

Re: A truce: if atheism/materialism is an as if universe

2012-12-19 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 17 Dec 2012, at 12:51, Telmo Menezes wrote: I believe in the one god of CTM and its (X Z) logically derived string theory that is omnipotent (contains and carries out the laws of physics), When people claim that an entity is omnipotent, they are generally implying intentionality on

How visual images are produced in the brain. Was Dennett right after all ?

2012-12-19 Thread Roger Clough
Hi Telmo, I accidentally sent the previous email before I was done, sorry. Please consider this more complete version of the intended whole: Hi Telmo, Those images in the videoclips, while still remarkable, probably were constructed simply by monitoring sensory MRI signals just as one might

Re: A truce: if atheism/materialism is an as if universe

2012-12-19 Thread Bruno Marchal
Hi Roger, On 17 Dec 2012, at 14:05, Roger Clough wrote: Hi Bruno Marchal There seems to be some sort of prejudice given to proof or theory . As a scientist, all I have to do is to weigh myself and report that to you. Data, in my book at least, always rules over theory and assumptions.

Re: Re: Re: promoting REASON

2012-12-19 Thread Roger Clough
Hi Craig Weinberg The difference between corporations and the govt is that corps have to make a profit or they fail. Govt never fails. [Roger Clough], [rclo...@verizon.net] 12/19/2012 Forever is a long time, especially near the end. -Woody Allen - Receiving the following content -

Re: Re: promoting REASON

2012-12-19 Thread Roger Clough
Hi Craig Weinberg Conservatives don't want NO govt. They want minimal govt. It's the far left (the occupy movement, who are anarchists) that want no govt. [Roger Clough], [rclo...@verizon.net] 12/19/2012 Forever is a long time, especially near the end. -Woody Allen - Receiving the

Re: Re: clearing up the confusion on the fairness index

2012-12-19 Thread Roger Clough
Hi Craig Weinberg What is wrong with making profits ? [Roger Clough], [rclo...@verizon.net] 12/19/2012 Forever is a long time, especially near the end. -Woody Allen - Receiving the following content - From: Craig Weinberg Receiver: everything-list Time: 2012-12-18, 16:40:35

Re: What is truth ? Take your pick.

2012-12-19 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 17 Dec 2012, at 19:18, Platonist Guitar Cowboy wrote: Dear Roger and Stephen, Cowboy epistemology on truth are underestimated. Much simpler than all this heavy stuff. From a fellow guitar cowboy that many will know: When the sun came up this morning I took the time to watch it rise.

Re: Avoiding the use of the word God

2012-12-19 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 17 Dec 2012, at 19:28, John Clark wrote: On Mon, Dec 17, 2012 at 1:08 PM, Richard Ruquist yann...@gmail.com wrote: I thought it was the product of two quaternions that is non- commutative Yes, multiplication is non-commutative for quaternions and that its primary feature is

Re: Re: On Income Fairness in the USA and the world

2012-12-19 Thread Craig Weinberg
On Wednesday, December 19, 2012 10:33:55 AM UTC-5, rclough wrote: Hi Hal Ruhl So whbat ? Those gini coefficnets are in percentages, so USA has a gini about 27 %, which is outstanding. If you don't that, see from the wikimedia map (below) that the USA gini coeff. is about about

Re: Re: Progressives and social darwinism

2012-12-19 Thread Roger Clough
Hi Craig, As to promoting life, the slogan of the Progressives could be stated thusly: Eat, drink, and be merry, for tomorrow ye die ! [Roger Clough], [rclo...@verizon.net] 12/19/2012 Forever is a long time, especially near the end. -Woody Allen - Receiving the following content -

Re: Re: Re: promoting REASON

2012-12-19 Thread Craig Weinberg
On Wednesday, December 19, 2012 9:54:32 AM UTC-5, rclough wrote: Hi Craig Weinberg The difference between corporations and the govt is that corps have to make a profit or they fail. Govt never fails. Governments fail all of the time. The idea of American democracy was to factor

Re: Men don't get no respect these days

2012-12-19 Thread Bruno Marchal
Hi Roger, On 17 Dec 2012, at 19:34, Roger Clough wrote: Hi Telmo Menezes By killing the father, I meant belittling the male, but come to think of it, I don't recall seeing anything direct except in the ads and how men were treated on the screen. But it's been achieved. And indeed, there have

Re: Re: clearing up the confusion on the fairness index

2012-12-19 Thread Roger Clough
Hi meekerdb But while the gini index increases linearly with time, the individual wealth of each american (at least before Obama) increases exponentially with time. [Roger Clough], [rclo...@verizon.net] 12/19/2012 Forever is a long time, especially near the end. -Woody Allen - Receiving

Re: Re: the only truth we can understand is a man-made object

2012-12-19 Thread Roger Clough
Hi meekerdb and Stephen, If information is stored in quantum form, I can't see why the number of particles in the universe can be a limiting fsactor. Also there are ways of storing information holographically, so size gets a bit ambiguous. [Roger Clough], [rclo...@verizon.net] 12/19/2012

Re: Men don't get no respect these days

2012-12-19 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 17 Dec 2012, at 19:36, Roger Clough wrote: Hi Craig Weinberg I had been talking about fear of God, but fear of the law (meaning fear of diobeying the law) helps keep our streets safer. Only the laws coherent with a (reasonable) constitution. Again, no reason to fear them, as they

Re: Re: Question: Robotic truth

2012-12-19 Thread Roger Clough
Hi Alberto, Don't forget that mirror neurons in our brains tends to make us copy cats. [Roger Clough], [rclo...@verizon.net] 12/19/2012 Forever is a long time, especially near the end. -Woody Allen - Receiving the following content - From: meekerdb Receiver: everything-list

Re: Re: The pro-life paradox

2012-12-19 Thread Roger Clough
Hi Alberto G. Corona And as the Bible says, the wages of sin is death. [Roger Clough], [rclo...@verizon.net] 12/19/2012 Forever is a long time, especially near the end. -Woody Allen - Receiving the following content - From: Alberto G. Corona Receiver: everything-list Time:

Re: Re: clearing up the confusion on the fairness index

2012-12-19 Thread Richard Ruquist
Hi Roger, Show me the exponential data. Richard On Wed, Dec 19, 2012 at 11:25 AM, Roger Clough rclo...@verizon.net wrote: Hi meekerdb But while the gini index increases linearly with time, the individual wealth of each american (at least before Obama) increases exponentially with time.

Re: Re: the only truth we can understand is a man-made object

2012-12-19 Thread Richard Ruquist
The holographic information capacity of the universe is 10^120, known as the Lloyd limit. On Wed, Dec 19, 2012 at 11:34 AM, Roger Clough rclo...@verizon.net wrote: Hi meekerdb and Stephen, If information is stored in quantum form, I can't see why the number of particles in the universe can

Re: The pro-life paradox

2012-12-19 Thread Roger Clough
Hi Bruno Marchal Anything pro life saves life so is good. Euthanasia destroys life so is bad. [Roger Clough], [rclo...@verizon.net] 12/19/2012 Forever is a long time, especially near the end. -Woody Allen - Receiving the following content - From: Bruno Marchal Receiver:

Re: Re: A truce: if atheism/materialism is an as if universe

2012-12-19 Thread Roger Clough
Hi Bruno Marchal You can write a chemical equation (theoretically) that will not work in the real world.. [Roger Clough], [rclo...@verizon.net] 12/19/2012 Forever is a long time, especially near the end. -Woody Allen - Receiving the following content - From: Bruno Marchal

Re: Are monads tokens ?

2012-12-19 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 17 Dec 2012, at 19:46, Roger Clough wrote: Hi Craig Weinberg No, the monads are (inextended) tokens of corporeal (extended) bodies of one part. But in comp, tokens are simple (nonreductive), ie contain no parts, while types such as are used in Functionalism, has parts on both ends. So

Re: Re: Men don't get no respect these days

2012-12-19 Thread Roger Clough
Hi Bruno Marchal That's right. One can refrain from sinning because of love of God rather than fear of Hell. I sometimes try to do that when I don't feel that guilty personally. It's just like you would be moral because that's what your parents want you to be. It's the right thing to do.

Re: Austerity

2012-12-19 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 17 Dec 2012, at 19:53, Roger Clough wrote: Hi meekerdb If simply raising taxes could kill a national debt, why does Europe still have debt problems ? In old democracies, raised money can be used to hide the problems instead of solving it. Not just in Europe. Bruno [Roger

Re: clearing up the confusion on the fairness index

2012-12-19 Thread Craig Weinberg
On Tuesday, December 18, 2012 5:04:28 PM UTC-5, Stephen Paul King wrote: On 12/18/2012 4:40 PM, Craig Weinberg wrote: On Monday, December 17, 2012 8:02:12 PM UTC-5, Stephen Paul King wrote: On 12/17/2012 5:11 PM, Craig Weinberg wrote: Taxing the rich does not redistribute the

Re: On the need for perspective and relations in modelling the mind

2012-12-19 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 17 Dec 2012, at 20:27, Richard Ruquist wrote: On Mon, Dec 17, 2012 at 2:09 PM, Bruno Marchal marc...@ulb.ac.be wrote: Why just 8? I would have expected every possible person points pf view consistent with MWI. Richard There is 8 main types of points of view given by: Dear Bruno,

Re: Re: Re: Re: promoting REASON

2012-12-19 Thread Roger Clough
Hi Craig Weinberg OK, govts can finally fail, when the people find that they can legislate their own welfare. [Roger Clough], [rclo...@verizon.net] 12/19/2012 Forever is a long time, especially near the end. -Woody Allen - Receiving the following content - From: Craig Weinberg

Re: The quantity of information of the physical universe

2012-12-19 Thread Stephen P. King
On 12/19/2012 11:34 AM, Roger Clough wrote: If information is stored in quantum form, I can't see why the number of particles in the universe can be a limiting fsactor. Also there are ways of storing information holographically, so size gets a bit ambiguous. Dear Roger, You ask an

Re: Re: Re: clearing up the confusion on the fairness index

2012-12-19 Thread Roger Clough
Hi Richard Ruquist I already sent that out a few days ago, maybe even yesterday. curve follows log (inflation-adjusted personal income) vs time I think back perhaps a century or more. [Roger Clough], [rclo...@verizon.net] 12/19/2012 Forever is a long time, especially near the end. -Woody

Re: Re: Re: the only truth we can understand is a man-made object

2012-12-19 Thread Roger Clough
Hi Richard Ruquist That's the usual response, but why does information have to be associated with extended objects ? One could store such information mentally. [Roger Clough], [rclo...@verizon.net] 12/19/2012 Forever is a long time, especially near the end. -Woody Allen - Receiving the

Re: clearing up the confusion on the fairness index

2012-12-19 Thread Stephen P. King
On 12/19/2012 12:43 PM, Craig Weinberg wrote: On Tuesday, December 18, 2012 5:04:28 PM UTC-5, Stephen Paul King wrote: On 12/18/2012 4:40 PM, Craig Weinberg wrote: On Monday, December 17, 2012 8:02:12 PM UTC-5, Stephen Paul King wrote: On 12/17/2012 5:11 PM, Craig

Re: the only truth we can understand is a man-made object

2012-12-19 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 17 Dec 2012, at 22:31, meekerdb wrote: On 12/17/2012 1:15 PM, Quentin Anciaux wrote: ISTM that consistency is the fact that you can't have contradiction. In some logics you're allowed to have contradictions, but the rules of inference don't permit you to prove everything from a

Re: promoting REASON

2012-12-19 Thread meekerdb
On 12/19/2012 6:54 AM, Roger Clough wrote: Hi Craig Weinberg The difference between corporations and the govt is that corps have to make a profit or they fail. Or they get the government to give them breaks because they're too big to fail. Brent -- You received this message because you are

Re: clearing up the confusion on the fairness index

2012-12-19 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 17 Dec 2012, at 22:41, Roger Clough wrote: To try to clear up my mistaken interpretation of the gini coefficient, namely that USA inequality is not decreasing, it is actually increasing, I find that the per capita wealth is also increasing, so let's see what effect that will have.

Re: promoting REASON

2012-12-19 Thread meekerdb
On 12/19/2012 6:58 AM, Roger Clough wrote: Hi Craig Weinberg Conservatives don't want NO govt. They want minimal govt. I think you're confused; that's Libertarians. Conservatives always vote for more government control over individual behavior and more money for the military (that protects

Re: Avoiding the use of the word God

2012-12-19 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 17 Dec 2012, at 22:55, Stephen P. King wrote: On 12/17/2012 2:15 PM, Bruno Marchal wrote: Is it possible to define a relative probability in the case where it is not possible to count or otherwise partition the members of the ensemble? Yes. relative probability is not necessarily a

Re: WHOOPS! e: Re: On Income Fairness (income equality) in the USA and the world

2012-12-19 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 18 Dec 2012, at 00:01, Stathis Papaioannou wrote: On Tue, Dec 18, 2012 at 5:59 AM, Roger Clough rclo...@verizon.net wrote: Whoops ! Big mistake. I had the gini index backwards. 1 means total inequality, not equality of income. So things are getting worse in america instead of better. And

Re: WHOOPS! e: Re: On Income Fairness (income equality) in the USA and the world

2012-12-19 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 18 Dec 2012, at 00:02, Stathis Papaioannou wrote: On Tue, Dec 18, 2012 at 10:01 AM, Stathis Papaioannou stath...@gmail.com wrote: On Tue, Dec 18, 2012 at 5:59 AM, Roger Clough rclo...@verizon.net wrote: Whoops ! Big mistake. I had the gini index backwards. 1 means total inequality, not

Re: promoting REASON

2012-12-19 Thread Stephen P. King
On 12/19/2012 1:42 PM, meekerdb wrote: On 12/19/2012 6:54 AM, Roger Clough wrote: Hi Craig Weinberg The difference between corporations and the govt is that corps have to make a profit or they fail. Or they get the government to give them breaks because they're too big to fail. Brent Hi

Re: Re: Re: clearing up the confusion on the fairness index

2012-12-19 Thread Richard Ruquist
Then you can easily provide a link to that data On Wed, Dec 19, 2012 at 1:02 PM, Roger Clough rclo...@verizon.net wrote: Hi Richard Ruquist I already sent that out a few days ago, maybe even yesterday. curve follows log (inflation-adjusted personal income) vs time I think back perhaps a

Re: promoting REASON

2012-12-19 Thread Stephen P. King
On 12/19/2012 1:46 PM, meekerdb wrote: On 12/19/2012 6:58 AM, Roger Clough wrote: Hi Craig Weinberg Conservatives don't want NO govt. They want minimal govt. I think you're confused; that's Libertarians. Conservatives always vote for more government control over individual behavior and more

Re: the only truth we can understand is a man-made object

2012-12-19 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 18 Dec 2012, at 01:50, Stephen P. King wrote: On 12/17/2012 4:31 PM, meekerdb wrote: On 12/17/2012 1:15 PM, Quentin Anciaux wrote: ISTM that consistency is the fact that you can't have contradiction. In some logics you're allowed to have contradictions, but the rules of inference

Re: promoting REASON

2012-12-19 Thread Quentin Anciaux
2012/12/19 Stephen P. King stephe...@charter.net On 12/19/2012 1:46 PM, meekerdb wrote: On 12/19/2012 6:58 AM, Roger Clough wrote: Hi Craig Weinberg Conservatives don't want NO govt. They want minimal govt. I think you're confused; that's Libertarians. Conservatives always vote for

Re: the only truth we can understand is a man-made object

2012-12-19 Thread Stephen P. King
On 12/19/2012 2:14 PM, Bruno Marchal wrote: I am trying to see if we can use the way that towers of theories are allowed by the incompleteness theorems... This is studied in recursion theory. Turing shows that incompleteness continue to all effective transfinite tower, on the constructive

Re: promoting REASON

2012-12-19 Thread Stephen P. King
On 12/19/2012 2:16 PM, Quentin Anciaux wrote: 2012/12/19 Stephen P. King stephe...@charter.net mailto:stephe...@charter.net On 12/19/2012 1:46 PM, meekerdb wrote: On 12/19/2012 6:58 AM, Roger Clough wrote: Hi Craig Weinberg Conservatives don't want NO govt. They want

Re: Theory of Nothing

2012-12-19 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 18 Dec 2012, at 07:28, Jason Resch wrote: On Tue, May 22, 2007 at 5:54 AM, Russell Standish li...@hpcoders.com.au wrote: - Forwarded message from Russell Standish hpco...@hpcoders.com.au - Date: Tue, 22 May 2007 18:18:59 +1000 From: Russell Standish hpco...@hpcoders.com.au

Re: the only truth we can understand is a man-made object

2012-12-19 Thread meekerdb
On 12/19/2012 8:34 AM, Roger Clough wrote: Hi meekerdb and Stephen, If information is stored in quantum form, I can't see why the number of particles in the universe can be a limiting fsactor. Information has to be instantiated in matter (unless you're a Platonist like Bruno). No

Re: promoting REASON

2012-12-19 Thread Craig Weinberg
On Wednesday, December 19, 2012 2:08:20 PM UTC-5, Stephen Paul King wrote: On 12/19/2012 1:42 PM, meekerdb wrote: On 12/19/2012 6:54 AM, Roger Clough wrote: Hi Craig Weinberg The difference between corporations and the govt is that corps have to make a profit or they fail. Or

Re: the only truth we can understand is a man-made object

2012-12-19 Thread John Mikes
I tried to identify the meaning of axiom and found a funny solution: as it looks, AXIOM is an unprovable idea underlining a theory otherwise non-provable. In most cases: an unjustified statement, that, however, DOES work in the contest of the particular theory it is serving. Better

Re: the only truth we can understand is a man-made object

2012-12-19 Thread Richard Ruquist
On Wed, Dec 19, 2012 at 2:30 PM, meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net wrote: On 12/19/2012 8:34 AM, Roger Clough wrote: Hi meekerdb and Stephen, If information is stored in quantum form, I can't see why the number of particles in the universe can be a limiting fsactor. Information has to be

Re: clearing up the confusion on the fairness index

2012-12-19 Thread John Mikes
I do not intend to 'clear up' on a nonexisting fairness Index. Democracy is an oxymoron: NO CHANCE the entire populace (demos) could exercise governance-power (cratos). There is a COMPROMISE in voting: what do I prefer to vote for from other goals I put temporarily to sleep - and who is the

Re: promoting REASON

2012-12-19 Thread meekerdb
On 12/19/2012 9:53 AM, Roger Clough wrote: Hi Craig Weinberg OK, govts can finally fail, when the people find that they can legislate their own welfare. Or when the people realize that their government has just become a tool of the rich and powerful to increase their wealth and power; in

Re: promoting REASON

2012-12-19 Thread meekerdb
On 12/19/2012 11:08 AM, Stephen P. King wrote: On 12/19/2012 1:42 PM, meekerdb wrote: On 12/19/2012 6:54 AM, Roger Clough wrote: Hi Craig Weinberg The difference between corporations and the govt is that corps have to make a profit or they fail. Or they get the government to give them breaks

Re: promoting REASON

2012-12-19 Thread meekerdb
On 12/19/2012 11:12 AM, Stephen P. King wrote: On 12/19/2012 1:46 PM, meekerdb wrote: On 12/19/2012 6:58 AM, Roger Clough wrote: Hi Craig Weinberg Conservatives don't want NO govt. They want minimal govt. I think you're confused; that's Libertarians. Conservatives always vote for more

Re: promoting REASON

2012-12-19 Thread Craig Weinberg
On Wednesday, December 19, 2012 4:30:17 PM UTC-5, Stephen Paul King wrote: On 12/19/2012 2:43 PM, Craig Weinberg wrote: All markets become first-come first-serve pyramid schemes by definition. And this means? What is the implication? That policies based on the assumption that

Re: promoting REASON

2012-12-19 Thread Stephen P. King
On 12/19/2012 3:29 PM, meekerdb wrote: On 12/19/2012 9:53 AM, Roger Clough wrote: Hi Craig Weinberg OK, govts can finally fail, when the people find that they can legislate their own welfare. Or when the people realize that their government has just become a tool of the rich and powerful to

Re: promoting REASON

2012-12-19 Thread Stephen P. King
On 12/19/2012 3:50 PM, meekerdb wrote: On 12/19/2012 11:08 AM, Stephen P. King wrote: On 12/19/2012 1:42 PM, meekerdb wrote: On 12/19/2012 6:54 AM, Roger Clough wrote: Hi Craig Weinberg The difference between corporations and the govt is that corps have to make a profit or they fail. Or

Re: promoting REASON

2012-12-19 Thread Craig Weinberg
On Wednesday, December 19, 2012 4:56:43 PM UTC-5, Stephen Paul King wrote: On 12/19/2012 3:50 PM, meekerdb wrote: On 12/19/2012 11:08 AM, Stephen P. King wrote: On 12/19/2012 1:42 PM, meekerdb wrote: On 12/19/2012 6:54 AM, Roger Clough wrote: Hi Craig Weinberg The

Re: promoting REASON

2012-12-19 Thread Stephen P. King
On 12/19/2012 3:55 PM, meekerdb wrote: That's because the federal government was the instrument of freeing the slaves, over turning Jim Crow, giving women the vote and equal rights. No corporation ever supported personal or civil rights - the only rights they ever support are the right to

Re: the only truth we can understand is a man-made object

2012-12-19 Thread meekerdb
On 12/19/2012 11:58 AM, Richard Ruquist wrote: On Wed, Dec 19, 2012 at 2:30 PM, meekerdbmeeke...@verizon.net wrote: On 12/19/2012 8:34 AM, Roger Clough wrote: Hi meekerdb and Stephen, If information is stored in quantum form, I can't see why the number of particles in the universe can be a

Re: clearing up the confusion on the fairness index

2012-12-19 Thread Stephen P. King
On 12/19/2012 4:08 PM, meekerdb wrote: Is there any indication of how much of that GDP number is actually built on sovereign and private debt? How would you define 'built-on'? If I borrow money to start a business and the money comes from a pool that Japanese and Germans invested in does

Re: promoting REASON

2012-12-19 Thread Stephen P. King
On 12/19/2012 4:34 PM, Craig Weinberg wrote: On Wednesday, December 19, 2012 4:30:17 PM UTC-5, Stephen Paul King wrote: On 12/19/2012 2:43 PM, Craig Weinberg wrote: All markets become first-come first-serve pyramid schemes by definition. And this means? What is the

Re: promoting REASON

2012-12-19 Thread meekerdb
On 12/19/2012 2:01 PM, Craig Weinberg wrote: But it isn't just money-under-the-table and campaign funding that corrupts; it is also a huge think-tank industry and media empire that supports politicians who vote to allow mergers and tax breaks and special regulations that, down

Re: promoting REASON

2012-12-19 Thread Craig Weinberg
On Wednesday, December 19, 2012 6:13:20 PM UTC-5, Brent wrote: On 12/19/2012 2:01 PM, Craig Weinberg wrote: But it isn't just money-under-the-table and campaign funding that corrupts; it is also a huge think-tank industry and media empire that supports politicians who vote to allow

Re: promoting REASON

2012-12-19 Thread meekerdb
On 12/19/2012 1:38 PM, Stephen P. King wrote: On 12/19/2012 3:29 PM, meekerdb wrote: On 12/19/2012 9:53 AM, Roger Clough wrote: Hi Craig Weinberg OK, govts can finally fail, when the people find that they can legislate their own welfare. Or when the people realize that their government has

Re: promoting REASON

2012-12-19 Thread Stephen P. King
On 12/19/2012 5:01 PM, Craig Weinberg wrote: So, basically, we are just screwed. OK! ;-) At least the super-rich will have higher numbers in their bank accounts. That will make the loss of civilization for the other 6. billion people all worthwhile ;) So, who is handing out

Re: promoting REASON

2012-12-19 Thread Stephen P. King
On 12/19/2012 6:47 PM, meekerdb wrote: The people don't have to be armed to overthrow their government. It depends on the culture; but revolutions were successful in the USSR, Poland, India, and South Africa even though the people were not armed. Violent revolutions very often lead to

Re: Why economic inequality and environmental degradation are likely to improve

2012-12-19 Thread Craig Weinberg
On Wednesday, December 19, 2012 12:47:26 PM UTC-5, rclough wrote: Hi Craig Weinberg http://it.stlawu.edu/~pomo/mike/kuznet.html The Kuznet's theory goes like this: when a country begins developing economically, its income inequality worsens. But after a few decades when the

Re: Why economic inequality and environmental degradation are likely to improve

2012-12-19 Thread Stephen P. King
On 12/19/2012 10:36 PM, Craig Weinberg wrote: Did you notice this chart on that link? http://www.unc.edu/~nielsen/special/s2/hs12003a.gif There is no shade of black that is white, sir. I know you mean well, but I have lived in the US for 44 years and I can tell you that it has gotten worse

Re: Why economic inequality and environmental degradation are likely to improve

2012-12-19 Thread meekerdb
On 12/19/2012 7:36 PM, Craig Weinberg wrote: On Wednesday, December 19, 2012 12:47:26 PM UTC-5, rclough wrote: Hi Craig Weinberg http://it.stlawu.edu/~pomo/mike/kuznet.html http://it.stlawu.edu/%7Epomo/mike/kuznet.html The Kuznet's theory goes like this: when a country begins

Re: Why economic inequality and environmental degradation are likely to improve

2012-12-19 Thread Stephen P. King
On 12/19/2012 11:13 PM, meekerdb wrote: On 12/19/2012 7:36 PM, Craig Weinberg wrote: On Wednesday, December 19, 2012 12:47:26 PM UTC-5, rclough wrote: Hi Craig Weinberg http://it.stlawu.edu/~pomo/mike/kuznet.html http://it.stlawu.edu/%7Epomo/mike/kuznet.html The Kuznet's

Re: Why economic inequality and environmental degradation are likely to improve

2012-12-19 Thread Stephen P. King
Also: http://www.sjsu.edu/faculty/watkins/subprime.htm -- Onward! Stephen -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to

Re: Why economic inequality and environmental degradation are likely to improve

2012-12-19 Thread meekerdb
On 12/19/2012 8:41 PM, Stephen P. King wrote: On 12/19/2012 11:13 PM, meekerdb wrote: On 12/19/2012 7:36 PM, Craig Weinberg wrote: On Wednesday, December 19, 2012 12:47:26 PM UTC-5, rclough wrote: Hi Craig Weinberg http://it.stlawu.edu/~pomo/mike/kuznet.html

Re: Why economic inequality and environmental degradation are likely to improve

2012-12-19 Thread Stephen P. King
On 12/20/2012 12:08 AM, meekerdb wrote: In 1983 747 savings and loans failed, costing 90B$. The FBI opened 5490 criminal investigations and by 1992 839 people were convicted. What about this time around? For example http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Franklin_Financial_Corp. and see the

Re: Why economic inequality and environmental degradation are likely to improve

2012-12-19 Thread meekerdb
On 12/19/2012 8:44 PM, Stephen P. King wrote: Also: http://www.sjsu.edu/faculty/watkins/subprime.htm That's a very biases analysis that implies Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac bought subprime loans, which they did not. It was the banks and private mortgage companies that created the adjustable

Re: Why economic inequality and environmental degradation are likely to improve

2012-12-19 Thread Stephen P. King
On 12/20/2012 12:26 AM, meekerdb wrote: On 12/19/2012 8:44 PM, Stephen P. King wrote: Also: http://www.sjsu.edu/faculty/watkins/subprime.htm That's a very biases analysis that implies Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac bought subprime loans, which they did not. It was the banks and private

Re: Why economic inequality and environmental degradation are likely to improve

2012-12-19 Thread meekerdb
On 12/19/2012 9:38 PM, Stephen P. King wrote: On 12/20/2012 12:26 AM, meekerdb wrote: On 12/19/2012 8:44 PM, Stephen P. King wrote: Also: http://www.sjsu.edu/faculty/watkins/subprime.htm That's a very biases analysis that implies Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac bought subprime loans, which they