Re: A truce: if atheism/materialism is an as if universe

2012-12-19 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 17 Dec 2012, at 12:51, Telmo Menezes wrote: I believe in the one god of CTM and its (X Z) logically derived string theory that is omnipotent (contains and carries out the laws of physics), When people claim that an entity is omnipotent, they are generally implying intentionality on

Re: A truce: if atheism/materialism is an as if universe

2012-12-19 Thread Bruno Marchal
-12-16, 09:59:56 Subject: Re: A truce: if atheism/materialism is an as if universe On 16 Dec 2012, at 14:48, Roger Clough wrote: Hi Bruno Marchal I probably agree, but what is the primitive physical universe ? Any conception of the physical universe in case you assume its existence

Re: Re: A truce: if atheism/materialism is an as if universe

2012-12-19 Thread Roger Clough
Receiver: everything-list Time: 2012-12-19, 09:49:53 Subject: Re: A truce: if atheism/materialism is an as if universe Hi Roger, On 17 Dec 2012, at 14:05, Roger Clough wrote: Hi Bruno Marchal There seems to be some sort of prejudice given to proof or theory . As a scientist, all I have to do

Re: Re: A truce: if atheism/materialism is an as if universe

2012-12-17 Thread Roger Clough
is a long time, especially near the end. -Woody Allen - Receiving the following content - From: Bruno Marchal Receiver: everything-list Time: 2012-12-16, 09:59:56 Subject: Re: A truce: if atheism/materialism is an as if universe On 16 Dec 2012, at 14:48, Roger Clough wrote: Hi Bruno

Re: A truce: if atheism/materialism is an as if universe

2012-12-17 Thread Richard Ruquist
On Mon, Dec 17, 2012 at 1:09 AM, meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net wrote: On 12/16/2012 9:59 PM, Richard Ruquist wrote: On Mon, Dec 17, 2012 at 12:44 AM, meekerdbmeeke...@verizon.net wrote: On 12/16/2012 8:57 PM, Telmo Menezes wrote: Hi Richard, I believe in the one god of CTM and its (X Z)

Re: A truce: if atheism/materialism is an as if universe

2012-12-17 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 16 Dec 2012, at 20:16, meekerdb wrote: On 12/16/2012 1:40 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 06 Dec 2012, at 15:00, Roger Clough wrote: Hi Stephen P. King OK, after thinking it over, it seems there's two ways of thinking about L's metaphysics. 1) (My way) The Idealist way, that being L's

Re: A truce: if atheism/materialism is an as if universe

2012-12-16 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 06 Dec 2012, at 15:00, Roger Clough wrote: Hi Stephen P. King OK, after thinking it over, it seems there's two ways of thinking about L's metaphysics. 1) (My way) The Idealist way, that being L's metaphysics as is. 2) (Your way) The atheist/materialist way, that being the usual

Re: Re: A truce: if atheism/materialism is an as if universe

2012-12-16 Thread Roger Clough
: 2012-12-16, 04:40:19 Subject: Re: A truce: if atheism/materialism is an as if universe On 06 Dec 2012, at 15:00, Roger Clough wrote: Hi Stephen P. King OK, after thinking it over, it seems there's two ways of thinking about L's metaphysics. 1) (My way) The Idealist way, that being L's

Re: A truce: if atheism/materialism is an as if universe

2012-12-16 Thread Bruno Marchal
[Roger Clough], [rclo...@verizon.net] 12/16/2012 Forever is a long time, especially near the end. -Woody Allen - Receiving the following content - From: Bruno Marchal Receiver: everything-list Time: 2012-12-16, 04:40:19 Subject: Re: A truce: if atheism/materialism is an as if universe On 06

Re: A truce: if atheism/materialism is an as if universe

2012-12-16 Thread meekerdb
On 12/16/2012 1:40 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 06 Dec 2012, at 15:00, Roger Clough wrote: Hi Stephen P. King OK, after thinking it over, it seems there's two ways of thinking about L's metaphysics. 1) (My way) The Idealist way, that being L's metaphysics as is. 2) (Your way) The

Re: A truce: if atheism/materialism is an as if universe

2012-12-16 Thread Telmo Menezes
On Sun, Dec 16, 2012 at 8:16 PM, meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net wrote: On 12/16/2012 1:40 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 06 Dec 2012, at 15:00, Roger Clough wrote: Hi Stephen P. King OK, after thinking it over, it seems there's two ways of thinking about L's metaphysics. 1) (My way) The

Re: A truce: if atheism/materialism is an as if universe

2012-12-16 Thread Richard Ruquist
On Sun, Dec 16, 2012 at 2:51 PM, Telmo Menezes te...@telmomenezes.com wrote: On Sun, Dec 16, 2012 at 8:16 PM, meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net wrote: On 12/16/2012 1:40 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 06 Dec 2012, at 15:00, Roger Clough wrote: Hi Stephen P. King OK, after thinking it over,

Re: A truce: if atheism/materialism is an as if universe

2012-12-16 Thread Telmo Menezes
Hi Richard, I believe in the one god of CTM and its (X Z) logically derived string theory that is omnipotent (contains and carries out the laws of physics), When people claim that an entity is omnipotent, they are generally implying intentionality on the part of the entity. omniscient

Re: A truce: if atheism/materialism is an as if universe

2012-12-16 Thread meekerdb
On 12/16/2012 8:57 PM, Telmo Menezes wrote: Hi Richard, I believe in the one god of CTM and its (X Z) logically derived string theory that is omnipotent (contains and carries out the laws of physics), When people claim that an entity is omnipotent, they are generally implying

Re: A truce: if atheism/materialism is an as if universe

2012-12-16 Thread Richard Ruquist
On Mon, Dec 17, 2012 at 12:44 AM, meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net wrote: On 12/16/2012 8:57 PM, Telmo Menezes wrote: Hi Richard, I believe in the one god of CTM and its (X Z) logically derived string theory that is omnipotent (contains and carries out the laws of physics), When people

Re: A truce: if atheism/materialism is an as if universe

2012-12-16 Thread meekerdb
On 12/16/2012 9:59 PM, Richard Ruquist wrote: On Mon, Dec 17, 2012 at 12:44 AM, meekerdbmeeke...@verizon.net wrote: On 12/16/2012 8:57 PM, Telmo Menezes wrote: Hi Richard, I believe in the one god of CTM and its (X Z) logically derived string theory that is omnipotent (contains and carries

Re: A truce: if atheism/materialism is an as if universe

2012-12-09 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 09 Dec 2012, at 00:30, Stephen P. King wrote: On 12/8/2012 2:28 PM, John Mikes wrote: Dear Stephen, it is amazing how we formulate our (belief) systems similarly, except for yours in a descriptive - mine in an agnostic explanation (=a joke). Dear John, ;-) I try hard to stay in a

Re: A truce: if atheism/materialism is an as if universe

2012-12-09 Thread Stephen P. King
On 12/9/2012 9:03 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: Hmm With CTM it is simple, if our knowledge augment linearly, our ignorance augments non computably. The more we know, the more we can intuit how much we don't know, making us wiser (with some luck). We can jump from big picture to big picture,

Re: Re: A truce: if atheism/materialism is an as if universe

2012-12-08 Thread Roger Clough
content - From: Stephen P. King Receiver: everything-list Time: 2012-12-06, 14:02:33 Subject: Re: A truce: if atheism/materialism is an as if universe On 12/6/2012 9:00 AM, Roger Clough wrote: Hi Stephen P. King OK, after thinking it over, it seems there's two ways of thinking about L's

Re: A truce: if atheism/materialism is an as if universe

2012-12-08 Thread Stephen P. King
-list@googlegroups.com *Time:* 2012-12-06, 14:02:33 *Subject:* Re: A truce: if atheism/materialism is an as if universe On 12/6/2012 9:00 AM, Roger Clough wrote: Hi Stephen P. King OK, after thinking it over, it seems there's two ways of thinking about L's metaphysics

Re: A truce: if atheism/materialism is an as if universe

2012-12-08 Thread John Mikes
. -Woody Allen - Receiving the following content - *From:* Stephen P. King stephe...@charter.net *Receiver:* everything-list everything-list@googlegroups.com *Time:* 2012-12-06, 14:02:33 *Subject:* Re: A truce: if atheism/materialism is an as if universe On 12/6/2012 9:00 AM, Roger

Re: A truce: if atheism/materialism is an as if universe

2012-12-08 Thread Bruno Marchal
:33 Subject: Re: A truce: if atheism/materialism is an as if universe On 12/6/2012 9:00 AM, Roger Clough wrote: Hi Stephen P. King OK, after thinking it over, it seems there's two ways of thinking about L's metaphysics. 1) (My way) The Idealist way, that being L's metaphysics as is. 2) (Your

Re: A truce: if atheism/materialism is an as if universe

2012-12-08 Thread Stephen P. King
On 12/8/2012 2:28 PM, John Mikes wrote: Dear Stephen, it is amazing how we formulate our (belief) systems similarly, except for yours in a descriptive - mine in an agnostic explanation (=a joke). Dear John, ;-) I try hard to stay in a superposed state, somewhere between serious and 'just

A truce: if atheism/materialism is an as if universe

2012-12-06 Thread Roger Clough
Hi Stephen P. King OK, after thinking it over, it seems there's two ways of thinking about L's metaphysics. 1) (My way) The Idealist way, that being L's metaphysics as is. 2) (Your way) The atheist/materialist way, that being the usual atheist/materialistc view of the universe --- as long as

Re: A truce: if atheism/materialism is an as if universe

2012-12-06 Thread Stephen P. King
On 12/6/2012 9:00 AM, Roger Clough wrote: Hi Stephen P. King OK, after thinking it over, it seems there's two ways of thinking about L's metaphysics. 1) (My way) The Idealist way, that being L's metaphysics as is. 2) (Your way) The atheist/materialist way, that being the usual