Re: Here is why nothing will be done about climate change
On Thu, Nov 21, 2013 at 08:57:59PM +1300, LizR wrote: I'm not completely sure why this is why nothing will be done about climate change. For one thing, some things are already being done about it - the rise in emissions dropped in 2012 (not wonderful, I know, but some improvement). Interesting article, though. An even stronger case for thorium reactors, if one is needed. Not having RTFA, I may be getting the wrong end of the stick here, but I would say, of course something will be done about climate change. The real question is when, and what. That's what differentiates conservatives from progressives. Long ago, I thought the when would actually be when the last drop of oil was squeezed out of the ground, or maybe later when the last seam of coal was unearthed. Consequently, the what will be whatever changes are required to survive in the changed world. More recently, I've become more optimistic that renewable energy technology will economically displace fossil fuel technologies within a few decades. This will limit the amount of what we have to do to adapt to the new world. It despairs me to see politicians deny that there is a problem at all (such as our new PM, although his rhetoric is now changing :). That is approaching the problem with the eyes shut. ISTM, we have long since passed the stage when we could have prevented climate from changing at all... -- Prof Russell Standish Phone 0425 253119 (mobile) Principal, High Performance Coders Visiting Professor of Mathematics hpco...@hpcoders.com.au University of New South Wales http://www.hpcoders.com.au -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
RE: Here is why nothing will be done about climate change
-Original Message- From: everything-list@googlegroups.com [mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Russell Standish Sent: Thursday, November 21, 2013 1:19 PM To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: Here is why nothing will be done about climate change On Thu, Nov 21, 2013 at 08:57:59PM +1300, LizR wrote: I'm not completely sure why this is why nothing will be done about climate change. For one thing, some things are already being done about it - the rise in emissions dropped in 2012 (not wonderful, I know, but some improvement). Interesting article, though. An even stronger case for thorium reactors, if one is needed. Not having RTFA, I may be getting the wrong end of the stick here, but I would say, of course something will be done about climate change. The real question is when, and what. That's what differentiates conservatives from progressives. Long ago, I thought the when would actually be when the last drop of oil was squeezed out of the ground, or maybe later when the last seam of coal was unearthed. Consequently, the what will be whatever changes are required to survive in the changed world. More recently, I've become more optimistic that renewable energy technology will economically displace fossil fuel technologies within a few decades. This will limit the amount of what we have to do to adapt to the new world. It despairs me to see politicians deny that there is a problem at all (such as our new PM, although his rhetoric is now changing :). That is approaching the problem with the eyes shut. ISTM, we have long since passed the stage when we could have prevented climate from changing at all... Unfortunately I think you are correct. It is also highly likely that the political will to do anything at all will only materialize once the situation is desperate. There is far too much wealth tied up in the future evaluations of carbon reserves -- literally trillions of dollars of evaluations that if they became marked down from the future hypothetical values they are currently pegged at would have immediate real time effects on the balance sheets of very powerful fossil carbon interests. This is more of a political problem than a technical one. Technically we could do a lot, even right now from our current point of time, but nothing will get done as long as the vested carbon interests succeed in log jamming everything. Chris -- Prof Russell Standish Phone 0425 253119 (mobile) Principal, High Performance Coders Visiting Professor of Mathematics hpco...@hpcoders.com.au University of New South Wales http://www.hpcoders.com.au -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: Here is why nothing will be done about climate change
Yes, we've long since passed the point where we could have prevented it because it manifestly *is *changing, as almost everyone except Tony Abbott now realises. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: Here is why nothing will be done about climate change
Hmm. Let's hope the methane doesn't come out of suspension in the oceans, then, because it may go into a runaway feedback loop and lead to a firestorm - literally like fuel-air explosives being set off, perhaps over major cities. Methane being such a potent greenhouse gas, the whole thing could happen in a far shorter time than the human race's sluggish reactions could cope with. On 22 November 2013 14:46, Chris de Morsella cdemorse...@yahoo.com wrote: -Original Message- From: everything-list@googlegroups.com [mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Russell Standish Sent: Thursday, November 21, 2013 1:19 PM To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: Here is why nothing will be done about climate change On Thu, Nov 21, 2013 at 08:57:59PM +1300, LizR wrote: I'm not completely sure why this is why nothing will be done about climate change. For one thing, some things are already being done about it - the rise in emissions dropped in 2012 (not wonderful, I know, but some improvement). Interesting article, though. An even stronger case for thorium reactors, if one is needed. Not having RTFA, I may be getting the wrong end of the stick here, but I would say, of course something will be done about climate change. The real question is when, and what. That's what differentiates conservatives from progressives. Long ago, I thought the when would actually be when the last drop of oil was squeezed out of the ground, or maybe later when the last seam of coal was unearthed. Consequently, the what will be whatever changes are required to survive in the changed world. More recently, I've become more optimistic that renewable energy technology will economically displace fossil fuel technologies within a few decades. This will limit the amount of what we have to do to adapt to the new world. It despairs me to see politicians deny that there is a problem at all (such as our new PM, although his rhetoric is now changing :). That is approaching the problem with the eyes shut. ISTM, we have long since passed the stage when we could have prevented climate from changing at all... Unfortunately I think you are correct. It is also highly likely that the political will to do anything at all will only materialize once the situation is desperate. There is far too much wealth tied up in the future evaluations of carbon reserves -- literally trillions of dollars of evaluations that if they became marked down from the future hypothetical values they are currently pegged at would have immediate real time effects on the balance sheets of very powerful fossil carbon interests. This is more of a political problem than a technical one. Technically we could do a lot, even right now from our current point of time, but nothing will get done as long as the vested carbon interests succeed in log jamming everything. Chris -- Prof Russell Standish Phone 0425 253119 (mobile) Principal, High Performance Coders Visiting Professor of Mathematics hpco...@hpcoders.com.au University of New South Wales http://www.hpcoders.com.au -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
RE: Here is why nothing will be done about climate change
Yes my main concern as well. The runaway scenario could totally overwhelm humanity and trigger global systemic collapse. Within the last five years methane emission rates in the - now melting -- Arctic permafrost have risen by a third. The permafrost is a huge methane and CO2 store - all that decomposing organic matter kept in deep freeze inert and out of circulation, but when it melts the processes kick back into gear and the trillions upon trillions of anaerobic microbes begin farting out (essentially) methane. While humanity could possibly survive that - open to debate - the resulting thermal blanket over our biosphere would begin to inexorably bring the deep water column temperatures up. The deep water column is currently quite near freezing temperatures and at those temperatures and pressure methane hydrates are stable, as you know, if deep sea temps rise (over time) at some point the vast stores of methane now locked away will become unstable and geyser out into the atmosphere. If that happens we could be looking at a redo of the great Permian extinction; and I doubt any humans would make it through the bottleneck event. nor would almost every other living thing. Chris From: everything-list@googlegroups.com [mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of LizR Sent: Thursday, November 21, 2013 7:09 PM To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: Here is why nothing will be done about climate change Hmm. Let's hope the methane doesn't come out of suspension in the oceans, then, because it may go into a runaway feedback loop and lead to a firestorm - literally like fuel-air explosives being set off, perhaps over major cities. Methane being such a potent greenhouse gas, the whole thing could happen in a far shorter time than the human race's sluggish reactions could cope with. On 22 November 2013 14:46, Chris de Morsella cdemorse...@yahoo.com wrote: -Original Message- From: everything-list@googlegroups.com [mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Russell Standish Sent: Thursday, November 21, 2013 1:19 PM To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: Here is why nothing will be done about climate change On Thu, Nov 21, 2013 at 08:57:59PM +1300, LizR wrote: I'm not completely sure why this is why nothing will be done about climate change. For one thing, some things are already being done about it - the rise in emissions dropped in 2012 (not wonderful, I know, but some improvement). Interesting article, though. An even stronger case for thorium reactors, if one is needed. Not having RTFA, I may be getting the wrong end of the stick here, but I would say, of course something will be done about climate change. The real question is when, and what. That's what differentiates conservatives from progressives. Long ago, I thought the when would actually be when the last drop of oil was squeezed out of the ground, or maybe later when the last seam of coal was unearthed. Consequently, the what will be whatever changes are required to survive in the changed world. More recently, I've become more optimistic that renewable energy technology will economically displace fossil fuel technologies within a few decades. This will limit the amount of what we have to do to adapt to the new world. It despairs me to see politicians deny that there is a problem at all (such as our new PM, although his rhetoric is now changing :). That is approaching the problem with the eyes shut. ISTM, we have long since passed the stage when we could have prevented climate from changing at all... Unfortunately I think you are correct. It is also highly likely that the political will to do anything at all will only materialize once the situation is desperate. There is far too much wealth tied up in the future evaluations of carbon reserves -- literally trillions of dollars of evaluations that if they became marked down from the future hypothetical values they are currently pegged at would have immediate real time effects on the balance sheets of very powerful fossil carbon interests. This is more of a political problem than a technical one. Technically we could do a lot, even right now from our current point of time, but nothing will get done as long as the vested carbon interests succeed in log jamming everything. Chris -- Prof Russell Standish Phone 0425 253119 (mobile) Principal, High Performance Coders Visiting Professor of Mathematics hpco...@hpcoders.com.au University of New South Wales http://www.hpcoders.com.au -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com mailto:everything-list%2bunsubscr
Re: Here is why nothing will be done about climate change
I'm not completely sure why this is why nothing will be done about climate change. For one thing, some things are already being done about it - the rise in emissions dropped in 2012 (not wonderful, I know, but some improvement). Interesting article, though. An even stronger case for thorium reactors, if one is needed. On 21 November 2013 18:59, meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net wrote: Attached is an excellent article from today’s NYT business section . Brent -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
