Re: QTI --- Expanding brains

2008-04-23 Thread Tom Caylor
On Apr 22, 6:26 am, Stathis Papaioannou [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 2008/4/22 Tom Caylor [EMAIL PROTECTED]:  Your external event is part of what I was referring to as out  there. I would argue for the consistency and the merits of the view  that our identity is tied not only to our brains

Re: QTI --- Expanding brains

2008-04-23 Thread Tom Caylor
John, I maintain that we all, whether we admit it or not, are doing more than simply building our life history in a constructive way (in the mathematical sense, sorry), bit by bit, from one observer moment to the next based only one a logical progression from remembered observer moments. This

Re: QTI --- Expanding brains

2008-04-22 Thread Stathis Papaioannou
2008/4/22 Tom Caylor [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Your external event is part of what I was referring to as out there. I would argue for the consistency and the merits of the view that our identity is tied not only to our brains but also to events recorded outside of our brains. Someone with

Re: QTI --- Expanding brains

2008-04-22 Thread John Mikes
Tom (and Russell and others in the discussion): (Remark: I did not read Russell's book, it is above my head to follow his (math-related?) logic. So I rely on remarks I read on the list. Sorry, if it is unfounded or erroneous). our there The ominous MIR assumption (Mind Independent Rreality) I've

Re: QTI --- Expanding brains

2008-04-22 Thread nichomachus
On Apr 20, 6:10 pm, Russell Standish [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Sun, Apr 20, 2008 at 01:20:21PM -0700, Tom Caylor wrote: Except that the evidence seems to support that our past is also recorded in a reality out there that seems independent of our brains.  For example when we are

Re: QTI --- Expanding brains

2008-04-21 Thread Tom Caylor
Russell Standish wrote: On Sun, Apr 20, 2008 at 08:25:56PM -0700, Brent Meeker wrote: Does that mean that if I don't remember it, it didn't happen? No it means it did/didn't happen until such a time as a measurement indicates which. When it does, there will be two of you in different

Re: QTI --- Expanding brains

2008-04-21 Thread Tom Caylor
Tom Caylor wrote: Russell Standish wrote: On Sun, Apr 20, 2008 at 08:25:56PM -0700, Brent Meeker wrote: Does that mean that if I don't remember it, it didn't happen? No it means it did/didn't happen until such a time as a measurement indicates which. When it does, there will be

Re: QTI --- Expanding brains

2008-04-21 Thread Günther Greindl
The concept at fault here is the I - there is no essence to you, so it is rather meaningless to speak of what you where if there is neither exterior physical evidence (records) or interior physical evidence (memory) which ascertains a history pertaining to the current Tom Caylor pattern.

Re: QTI --- Expanding brains

2008-04-21 Thread Brent Meeker
Tom Caylor wrote: Tom Caylor wrote: Russell Standish wrote: On Sun, Apr 20, 2008 at 08:25:56PM -0700, Brent Meeker wrote: Does that mean that if I don't remember it, it didn't happen? No it means it did/didn't happen until such a time as a measurement indicates which. When it does, there

Re: QTI --- Expanding brains

2008-04-21 Thread Brian Tenneson
Reminds me of a quote by Aliester Crowley: Psychiatrist: Look--how do you know you're God? O'Toole: Well, every time I pray, I find that I'm talking to myself. --- Peter O'Toole in The Ruling Class Brent Meeker From Magick by Aliester Crowley: I am a God, I very God of very God;

Re: QTI --- Expanding brains

2008-04-21 Thread Russell Standish
On Mon, Apr 21, 2008 at 12:56:22PM -0700, Tom Caylor wrote: Russell Standish wrote: On Sun, Apr 20, 2008 at 08:25:56PM -0700, Brent Meeker wrote: Does that mean that if I don't remember it, it didn't happen? No it means it did/didn't happen until such a time as a measurement

Re: QTI --- Expanding brains

2008-04-21 Thread Brent Meeker
Russell Standish wrote: On Mon, Apr 21, 2008 at 12:56:22PM -0700, Tom Caylor wrote: Russell Standish wrote: On Sun, Apr 20, 2008 at 08:25:56PM -0700, Brent Meeker wrote: Does that mean that if I don't remember it, it didn't happen? No it means it did/didn't happen until such a time as a

Re: QTI --- Expanding brains

2008-04-21 Thread Russell Standish
On Mon, Apr 21, 2008 at 06:10:52PM -0700, Brent Meeker wrote: What if my parents are named Riley and Mae and my birthdate is 1939, but I remember being Jesus? Brent Meeker Sounds to me like you would be suffering delusions then, but I'm no psychoanalyst. --

Re: QTI --- Expanding brains

2008-04-21 Thread Brent Meeker
Russell Standish wrote: On Mon, Apr 21, 2008 at 06:10:52PM -0700, Brent Meeker wrote: What if my parents are named Riley and Mae and my birthdate is 1939, but I remember being Jesus? Brent Meeker Sounds to me like you would be suffering delusions then, but I'm no psychoanalyst. So

Re: QTI --- Expanding brains

2008-04-21 Thread Russell Standish
On Mon, Apr 21, 2008 at 07:56:33PM -0700, Brent Meeker wrote: Russell Standish wrote: On Mon, Apr 21, 2008 at 06:10:52PM -0700, Brent Meeker wrote: What if my parents are named Riley and Mae and my birthdate is 1939, but I remember being Jesus? Brent Meeker Sounds to me like

Re: QTI --- Expanding brains

2008-04-21 Thread Tom Caylor
On Apr 21, 8:56 pm, Russell Standish [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, Apr 21, 2008 at 07:56:33PM -0700, Brent Meeker wrote: Russell Standish wrote: On Mon, Apr 21, 2008 at 06:10:52PM -0700, Brent Meeker wrote: What if my parents are named Riley and Mae and my birthdate is 1939, but

Re: QTI --- Expanding brains

2008-04-21 Thread Brent Meeker
Russell Standish wrote: On Mon, Apr 21, 2008 at 07:56:33PM -0700, Brent Meeker wrote: Russell Standish wrote: On Mon, Apr 21, 2008 at 06:10:52PM -0700, Brent Meeker wrote: What if my parents are named Riley and Mae and my birthdate is 1939, but I remember being Jesus? Brent Meeker

Re: QTI --- Expanding brains

2008-04-21 Thread Russell Standish
On Mon, Apr 21, 2008 at 09:47:39PM -0700, Brent Meeker wrote: Do the contents of memory consist of what is presently being remembered in an OM, or does it refer to what might be remembered at some other time, or to the set of all things remember in all OMs? Brent Meeker I think this is

Re: QTI --- Expanding brains

2008-04-20 Thread Günther Greindl
Your identity must be preserved as your brain continues to expand to make room for all that informaton that must be stored. Now, I find it hard to Why should all the info be stored/your id. be preserved? We constantly forget stuff - as you get older and older, you will forget past stuff, so

Re: QTI --- Expanding brains

2008-04-20 Thread Tom Caylor
On Apr 20, 3:00 am, Günther Greindl [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Your identity must be preserved as your brain continues to expand to make room for all that informaton that must be stored. Now, I find it hard to Why should all the info be stored/your id. be preserved? We constantly forget

Re: QTI --- Expanding brains

2008-04-20 Thread Russell Standish
On Sun, Apr 20, 2008 at 01:20:21PM -0700, Tom Caylor wrote: Except that the evidence seems to support that our past is also recorded in a reality out there that seems independent of our brains. For example when we are reminded of something from our past, from looking at old photos, or from

Re: QTI --- Expanding brains

2008-04-20 Thread Brent Meeker
Russell Standish wrote: On Sun, Apr 20, 2008 at 01:20:21PM -0700, Tom Caylor wrote: Except that the evidence seems to support that our past is also recorded in a reality out there that seems independent of our brains. For example when we are reminded of something from our past, from looking

Re: QTI --- Expanding brains

2008-04-20 Thread Russell Standish
On Sun, Apr 20, 2008 at 08:25:56PM -0700, Brent Meeker wrote: Does that mean that if I don't remember it, it didn't happen? No it means it did/didn't happen until such a time as a measurement indicates which. When it does, there will be two of you in different Multiverse branches, one in

Re: QTI --- Expanding brains

2008-04-19 Thread Stathis Papaioannou
On 20/04/2008, Saibal Mitra [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I don't buy QTI for quite a few reasons. A model independent objection I have is the following. If you accept QTI, then the information you have about your history will have to grow without limit (if not, then effectively you have a

Re: QTI --- Expanding brains

2008-04-19 Thread Brent Meeker
Saibal Mitra wrote: Yes, I should have mentioned ASSA and RSSA as discussed on this list in the dark ages. I don't buy QTI for quite a few reasons. A model independent objection I have is the following. If you accept QTI, then the information you have about your history will have to grow