[FairfieldLife] More Shankara-dig-vijaya: ...as lightly as a bundle of cotton.

2005-10-07 Thread cardemaister

(72-77) Having thus humbled the pride of the Buddhists,
the Brahmana sage [Skanda as Kumarila Bhatta] now began
to expound the meanings of the Vedic Mantras in order
to enlighten [Indra as] king Sudhanvan. The king thereupon
said, In wordy controversies, success and failure depend
only on the learning of the respective parties. It does
not really prove the truth of the thesis. I can accept
the religion of that party as true, who can jump down
unhurt from the top of yonder mountain.
At these words of the king, all the scholars merely stood
aghast looking at each other, unable to take up the 
challenge of the ordeal. But the Brahmana sage, with his
mind concentrated on the Veda, ascended the mountain top,
and declared: If the Veda is the true scripture, my body
shall not be hurt by this ordeal. With this mighty declaration,
the sage jumped down from the mountain top, as the spectators
shouted in wonder of the sight: Oh! Is it king Yayati
coming down from heaven on the expiry of the merits his
grandson had transferred to him! That best of Brahmanas
now touched the earth as lightly as a bundle of cotton.
Is it any wonder that the Veda protects one with whole-
hearted faith in it?





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[FairfieldLife] Re: More Shankara-dig-vijaya: ...as lightly as a bundle of cotton.

2005-10-07 Thread TurquoiseB
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, cardemaister [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
 
 (72-77) Having thus humbled the pride of the Buddhists,
 the Brahmana sage [Skanda as Kumarila Bhatta] now began
 to expound the meanings of the Vedic Mantras in order
 to enlighten [Indra as] king Sudhanvan. The king thereupon
 said, In wordy controversies, success and failure depend
 only on the learning of the respective parties. It does
 not really prove the truth of the thesis. I can accept
 the religion of that party as true, who can jump down
 unhurt from the top of yonder mountain.
 At these words of the king, all the scholars merely stood
 aghast looking at each other, unable to take up the 
 challenge of the ordeal. But the Brahmana sage, with his
 mind concentrated on the Veda, ascended the mountain top,
 and declared: If the Veda is the true scripture, my body
 shall not be hurt by this ordeal. With this mighty declaration,
 the sage jumped down from the mountain top, as the spectators
 shouted in wonder of the sight: Oh! Is it king Yayati
 coming down from heaven on the expiry of the merits his
 grandson had transferred to him! That best of Brahmanas
 now touched the earth as lightly as a bundle of cotton.
 Is it any wonder that the Veda protects one with whole-
 hearted faith in it?

A wonderful teaching.  I feel that the world
would definitely be a better place if religious 
fanatics, those who are caught up in the My way 
is the best game, undertook a similar test and 
proved their best claim by leaping from the 
top of the nearest mountain.







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[FairfieldLife] Re: More Shankara-dig-vijaya: ...as lightly as a bundle of cotton.

2005-10-07 Thread cardemaister
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, cardemaister [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 wrote:
  
  (72-77) Having thus humbled the pride of the Buddhists,
  the Brahmana sage [Skanda as Kumarila Bhatta] now began
  to expound the meanings of the Vedic Mantras in order
  to enlighten [Indra as] king Sudhanvan. The king thereupon
  said, In wordy controversies, success and failure depend
  only on the learning of the respective parties. It does
  not really prove the truth of the thesis. I can accept
  the religion of that party as true, who can jump down
  unhurt from the top of yonder mountain.
  At these words of the king, all the scholars merely stood
  aghast looking at each other, unable to take up the 
  challenge of the ordeal. But the Brahmana sage, with his
  mind concentrated on the Veda, ascended the mountain top,
  and declared: If the Veda is the true scripture, my body
  shall not be hurt by this ordeal. With this mighty declaration,
  the sage jumped down from the mountain top, as the spectators
  shouted in wonder of the sight: Oh! Is it king Yayati
  coming down from heaven on the expiry of the merits his
  grandson had transferred to him! That best of Brahmanas
  now touched the earth as lightly as a bundle of cotton.
  Is it any wonder that the Veda protects one with whole-
  hearted faith in it?
 
 A wonderful teaching.  I feel that the world
 would definitely be a better place if religious 
 fanatics, those who are caught up in the My way 
 is the best game, undertook a similar test and 
 proved their best claim by leaping from the 
 top of the nearest mountain.


It was kinda surprise to me how anti-buddhist
Vidyaranya is. I myself have nothing against Buddhists.
FCS, I'm doing anapanasati in addition to TM nowadays. :)
And a combination ,sort of, of TM and anapana is very
powerful.  :0





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[FairfieldLife] Re: More Shankara-dig-vijaya: ...as lightly as a bundle of cotton.

2005-10-07 Thread TurquoiseB
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, cardemaister [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 wrote:
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, cardemaister 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
   
   (72-77) Having thus humbled the pride of the Buddhists,
   the Brahmana sage [Skanda as Kumarila Bhatta] now began
   to expound the meanings of the Vedic Mantras in order
   to enlighten [Indra as] king Sudhanvan. The king thereupon
   said, In wordy controversies, success and failure depend
   only on the learning of the respective parties. It does
   not really prove the truth of the thesis. I can accept
   the religion of that party as true, who can jump down
   unhurt from the top of yonder mountain.
   At these words of the king, all the scholars merely stood
   aghast looking at each other, unable to take up the 
   challenge of the ordeal. But the Brahmana sage, with his
   mind concentrated on the Veda, ascended the mountain top,
   and declared: If the Veda is the true scripture, my body
   shall not be hurt by this ordeal. With this mighty 
   declaration,
   the sage jumped down from the mountain top, as the spectators
   shouted in wonder of the sight: Oh! Is it king Yayati
   coming down from heaven on the expiry of the merits his
   grandson had transferred to him! That best of Brahmanas
   now touched the earth as lightly as a bundle of cotton.
   Is it any wonder that the Veda protects one with whole-
   hearted faith in it?
  
  A wonderful teaching.  I feel that the world
  would definitely be a better place if religious 
  fanatics, those who are caught up in the My way 
  is the best game, undertook a similar test and 
  proved their best claim by leaping from the 
  top of the nearest mountain.
 
 It was kinda surprise to me how anti-buddhist
 Vidyaranya is. I myself have nothing against Buddhists.
 FCS, I'm doing anapanasati in addition to TM nowadays. :)
 And a combination ,sort of, of TM and anapana is very
 powerful.  :0

I understood that.  I was just commenting on the
attitude expressed in the teaching, and in similar
quotes you've posted lately.  I, too, am somewhat
shocked by the vehemence with which early leaders
of the Shankaracharya tradition tried to put down
their Buddhist competition.  

Because that's really the issue.  Buddhism was to
the Hindu establishment very much what Catharism
was to the established Roman Catholic Church -- a
competitor that ate into profits.  Buddhism rejected
most of the rites and rituals (yagyas, etc.) for 
which the priests received money.  The very *idea*
of an approach to liberation that could be done on
one's own, without the intervention of clergy (*paid*
clergy) was probably viewed as a real danger, because
it challenged the status quo and economic solvency
of the Hindu tradition.  The religious fanatic We
know the truth and no one else does stuff is almost
secondary; the primary motivation in all of this
seems to have been financial.

What's striking me in these quotes is how far *back*
the attitude that many of us find challenging in
the TM movement goes.  The tendency to boast about
one's tradition and one's teachings being the best
is *clearly* expressed here.  The tendency to put
down other traditions is also clearly present.  The 
reliance on tests to prove the superiority of
their tradition to all others.  The reliance on 
flashy siddhis to impress those who are easily 
impressed by flashy siddhis and lure them into 
making a false connection between flashy powers
and enlightenment or self knowledge.

The more I read of this stuff, the more I'm inter-
ested in Lama Ole's theory of jealous gods being
one of the main problems in spirituality.  If there
*are* gods, goddesses, devas, etc., why would anyone
sane want to follow or revere a set of them who are
so lost in their egos that they spend much of their
teaching time putting down competitor gods, 
goddesses, and devas?









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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Men's and women's peaces palaces on MUM campus

2005-10-07 Thread Peter


--- jyouells2000 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com,
 brahmachari108
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
These Maharishi Peace Palaces are a profound
 gift from
  Maharishi
The Maharishi Peace Palaces will be financed
 through donations
  and
the sale of interest-bearing World Peace
 Bonds.
  
  How is it a gift when financed by those who are
 supposedly the
 recipients?
  
  Is this the profundity of it?
  
  Kali Yuga shining brightly, huh?
  
  Stupid ignorant people.
 
 It's the 'spiritual' equivalent to PC (politically
 correct) speech.
 Neither mean what they say. Helps to widen the gap
 between name and form. 
 
 JohnY 

Widen the gap between name and form... Now that's
hilarious!




 
 
 
 
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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: More Shankara-dig-vijaya: ...as lightly as a bundle of cotton.

2005-10-07 Thread Vaj



On 10/7/05 3:27 AM, cardemaister [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 It was kinda surprise to me how anti-buddhist
 Vidyaranya is. I myself have nothing against Buddhists.
 FCS, I'm doing anapanasati in addition to TM nowadays. :)
 And a combination ,sort of, of TM and anapana is very
 powerful.  :0

As the leading representative of that tradition, presumably since Shankara,
I don't find it surprising at all that Vidyaranya keeps the same tradition
and view as Shankara himself. Shankara's comment on the Badarayana sutras
does the same thing.




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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: More Shankara-dig-vijaya: ...as lightly as a bundle of cotton.

2005-10-07 Thread Vaj



On 10/7/05 2:50 AM, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 A wonderful teaching.  I feel that the world
 would definitely be a better place if religious
 fanatics, those who are caught up in the My way
 is the best game, undertook a similar test and
 proved their best claim by leaping from the
 top of the nearest mountain.


That's a great idea. We could call it the Cliff jump for World Peace.




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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Satsang Reports: Byron Katie Session

2005-10-07 Thread Peter


--- anonymousff [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, eptfnj
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, martyboi
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  wrote:
   Well, as my Aunt used to tell me when I was
 bored:
   
   Boredom is the sign of an undeveloped mind.
  
  i enjoyed the take on boredom by Trugpa Rinpoche.
  the Zen tradition also has some interesting views.
  
  boredom can be considered as the reaction of the
  (so-called) mind to unfulfilled expectations.
  
  wearing away of boredom by long periods of sitting
  is certainly not effortless TM.
  
  IMO,i notice that people who have completed a few
 sesshin
  have a calmness and degree of patience missing in
 long-term
  TMers.
 
 That being said, there are some things that are just
 plain boring.

Boredom is the direct experience of the minds
attachment and incessant need to feed itself. Sitting
quietly and not allowing the mind to feed itself
dissolves the attachment. The unsettled feeling of
boredom is the attachment burning-off. This is why
vipassana meditation can feel boring, but once you
come out into activity the mind is extremely, quiet,
calm and clear. Just a different path than TM.





 
 
 
 
 
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[FairfieldLife] Re: More Shankara-dig-vijaya: ...as lightly as a bundle of cotton.

2005-10-07 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, cardemaister [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 wrote:
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  wrote:
   --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, cardemaister 
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

(72-77) Having thus humbled the pride of the Buddhists,
the Brahmana sage [Skanda as Kumarila Bhatta] now began
to expound the meanings of the Vedic Mantras in order
to enlighten [Indra as] king Sudhanvan. The king thereupon
said, In wordy controversies, success and failure depend
only on the learning of the respective parties. It does
not really prove the truth of the thesis. I can accept
the religion of that party as true, who can jump down
unhurt from the top of yonder mountain.
At these words of the king, all the scholars merely stood
aghast looking at each other, unable to take up the 
challenge of the ordeal. But the Brahmana sage, with his
mind concentrated on the Veda, ascended the mountain top,
and declared: If the Veda is the true scripture, my body
shall not be hurt by this ordeal. With this mighty 
declaration,
the sage jumped down from the mountain top, as the spectators
shouted in wonder of the sight: Oh! Is it king Yayati
coming down from heaven on the expiry of the merits his
grandson had transferred to him! That best of Brahmanas
now touched the earth as lightly as a bundle of cotton.
Is it any wonder that the Veda protects one with whole-
hearted faith in it?
   
   A wonderful teaching.  I feel that the world
   would definitely be a better place if religious 
   fanatics, those who are caught up in the My way 
   is the best game, undertook a similar test and 
   proved their best claim by leaping from the 
   top of the nearest mountain.
  
  It was kinda surprise to me how anti-buddhist
  Vidyaranya is. I myself have nothing against Buddhists.
  FCS, I'm doing anapanasati in addition to TM nowadays. :)
  And a combination ,sort of, of TM and anapana is very
  powerful.  :0
 
 I understood that.  I was just commenting on the
 attitude expressed in the teaching, and in similar
 quotes you've posted lately.  I, too, am somewhat
 shocked by the vehemence with which early leaders
 of the Shankaracharya tradition tried to put down
 their Buddhist competition.  
 
 Because that's really the issue.  Buddhism was to
 the Hindu establishment very much what Catharism
 was to the established Roman Catholic Church -- a
 competitor that ate into profits.  Buddhism rejected
 most of the rites and rituals (yagyas, etc.) for 
 which the priests received money.  The very *idea*
 of an approach to liberation that could be done on
 one's own, without the intervention of clergy (*paid*
 clergy) was probably viewed as a real danger, because
 it challenged the status quo and economic solvency
 of the Hindu tradition.  The religious fanatic We
 know the truth and no one else does stuff is almost
 secondary; the primary motivation in all of this
 seems to have been financial.
 
 What's striking me in these quotes is how far *back*
 the attitude that many of us find challenging in
 the TM movement goes.  The tendency to boast about
 one's tradition and one's teachings being the best
 is *clearly* expressed here.  The tendency to put
 down other traditions is also clearly present.  The 
 reliance on tests to prove the superiority of
 their tradition to all others.  The reliance on 
 flashy siddhis to impress those who are easily 
 impressed by flashy siddhis and lure them into 
 making a false connection between flashy powers
 and enlightenment or self knowledge.
 
 The more I read of this stuff, the more I'm inter-
 ested in Lama Ole's theory of jealous gods being
 one of the main problems in spirituality.  If there
 *are* gods, goddesses, devas, etc., why would anyone
 sane want to follow or revere a set of them who are
 so lost in their egos that they spend much of their
 teaching time putting down competitor gods, 
 goddesses, and devas?

But as you pointed out earlier:

  NO ONE could have been clearer
  in life about rejecting the Hindu system than the
  original Buddha. He also rejected to some extent
  the notion of avatars. 

So it's not exactly surprising that the Hindu system
would retaliate.

In any case, competition between jealous gods doesn't
seem to apply here, given that Buddhism doesn't have
any gods in the first place, and that what the Brahmana
sage was defending wasn't gods per se but rather the
Veda, so the competing elements are a bit more abstract.

Interestingly, Jesus is said to have been challenged
to perform a miraculous feat--to enlist his God to
save him from the cross--and he declined.  This is
perceived in Christianity as a victory, not a defeat.

The real problem is the need to compete.  It can take
many forms, depending on the nature of the competing
religions.







[FairfieldLife] Re: More Shankara-dig-vijaya: ...as lightly as a bundle of cotton.

2005-10-07 Thread benjaminccollins
In the world there are invisible ladders, leading step by step to the
summit of heaven.
There is a different ladder for every group, a different heaven for
every path.
Each one is ignorant of the other's condition in this wide kingdom
which has no end or beginning.
This one is amazed at that one and wonders why he is happy, while that
one is astonished at this one and asks why he is amazed.
God's earth is spacious*: every tree springs up from a certain soil.
The leaves and boughs sing thanks to God:
What a fine, broad kingdom.
The nightingales hover around the fruiting blossom, calling, Give us
some of what you drink.
This discourse has no end.

~ ~ ~ ~ ~

Nardobân-hâyist penhân dar jahân
pâyeh pâyeh tâ `enân-e âsmân
Har goroh-râ nardobâni digarast
har ravesh-râ âsmâni digarast
Har yeki azhâl-e digar bi khabar
molk bâ pahnâ o bi pâyân o sar
In dar ân hayrân keh u chist khvosh
va ân darin khireh keh hayrat chistesh
Sahn-e Ard Allâh wâsi`* âmadeh
har derakhti az zamini sar zadeh
Bar derakhtân shokr guyân barg o shâkh
keh Zehi molk o zehi `arseh-ye farâkh
Bolbolân gerd-e shekufeh par gereh
keh Az âncheh mi khvori mâ-râ be-deh
In sokhan pâyân na-dârad kon roju`
su-ye ân rubâh o shir o soqm o ju`


   -- Mathnawi V: 2556-2563
  Version by Camille and Kabir Helminski
  Rumi: Jewels of Remembrance
  Threshold Books, 1996
  (Persian transliteration courtesy of Yahyá Monastra)

   ^   ^   ^   ^   ^


--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, cardemaister [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  wrote:
   --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
   wrote:
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, cardemaister 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
 (72-77) Having thus humbled the pride of the Buddhists,
 the Brahmana sage [Skanda as Kumarila Bhatta] now began
 to expound the meanings of the Vedic Mantras in order
 to enlighten [Indra as] king Sudhanvan. The king thereupon
 said, In wordy controversies, success and failure depend
 only on the learning of the respective parties. It does
 not really prove the truth of the thesis. I can accept
 the religion of that party as true, who can jump down
 unhurt from the top of yonder mountain.
 At these words of the king, all the scholars merely stood
 aghast looking at each other, unable to take up the 
 challenge of the ordeal. But the Brahmana sage, with his
 mind concentrated on the Veda, ascended the mountain top,
 and declared: If the Veda is the true scripture, my body
 shall not be hurt by this ordeal. With this mighty 
 declaration,
 the sage jumped down from the mountain top, as the spectators
 shouted in wonder of the sight: Oh! Is it king Yayati
 coming down from heaven on the expiry of the merits his
 grandson had transferred to him! That best of Brahmanas
 now touched the earth as lightly as a bundle of cotton.
 Is it any wonder that the Veda protects one with whole-
 hearted faith in it?

A wonderful teaching.  I feel that the world
would definitely be a better place if religious 
fanatics, those who are caught up in the My way 
is the best game, undertook a similar test and 
proved their best claim by leaping from the 
top of the nearest mountain.
   
   It was kinda surprise to me how anti-buddhist
   Vidyaranya is. I myself have nothing against Buddhists.
   FCS, I'm doing anapanasati in addition to TM nowadays. :)
   And a combination ,sort of, of TM and anapana is very
   powerful.  :0
  
  I understood that.  I was just commenting on the
  attitude expressed in the teaching, and in similar
  quotes you've posted lately.  I, too, am somewhat
  shocked by the vehemence with which early leaders
  of the Shankaracharya tradition tried to put down
  their Buddhist competition.  
  
  Because that's really the issue.  Buddhism was to
  the Hindu establishment very much what Catharism
  was to the established Roman Catholic Church -- a
  competitor that ate into profits.  Buddhism rejected
  most of the rites and rituals (yagyas, etc.) for 
  which the priests received money.  The very *idea*
  of an approach to liberation that could be done on
  one's own, without the intervention of clergy (*paid*
  clergy) was probably viewed as a real danger, because
  it challenged the status quo and economic solvency
  of the Hindu tradition.  The religious fanatic We
  know the truth and no one else does stuff is almost
  secondary; the primary motivation in all of this
  seems to have been financial.
  
  What's striking me in these quotes is how far *back*
  the attitude that many of us find challenging in
  the TM movement goes.  The tendency to boast about
  one's tradition and one's 

[FairfieldLife] Re: More Shankara-dig-vijaya: ...as lightly as a bundle of cotton.

2005-10-07 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, benjaminccollins 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 In the world there are invisible ladders, leading step by step to
 the summit of heaven.
 There is a different ladder for every group, a different heaven for
 every path.
 Each one is ignorant of the other's condition in this wide kingdom
 which has no end or beginning.
 This one is amazed at that one and wonders why he is happy, while 
 that one is astonished at this one and asks why he is amazed.
 God's earth is spacious*: every tree springs up from a certain soil.
 The leaves and boughs sing thanks to God:
 What a fine, broad kingdom.
 The nightingales hover around the fruiting blossom, calling, Give 
 us some of what you drink.
 This discourse has no end.

Lovely!!

This one is amazed at that one and wonders why he is happy, while 
that one is astonished at this one and asks why he is amazed.

Perfect.  Good ol' Rumi.






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[FairfieldLife] Maharishi's designated successor.. (was Re: A scolding for Maharishi...)

2005-10-07 Thread jim_flanegin
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
  on 10/6/05 5:18 PM, peterklutz at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  
   
   1st para, It's now official..?
   
   Well, that's what MMY said.
  
  MMY - forever stretching one's concept of what enlightenment is.
 
 Indeed.  The definition gains more weight every day.
 
Exactly. Until the mind can no longer handle the irrefutable paradox, 
and collapses.






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[FairfieldLife] Re: More Shankara-dig-vijaya: ...as lightly as a bundle of cotton.

2005-10-07 Thread jim_flanegin
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 The real problem is the need to compete.  It can take
 many forms, depending on the nature of the competing
 religions.

Well said. The need to compete keeps us attached to the birth and 
death of ideas, the birth and death of desires, and the birth and 
death of the body. Which is why transcending the discrimination of the 
intellect is a vital component of Realization.





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[FairfieldLife] Re: More Shankara-dig-vijaya: ...as lightly as a bundle of cotton.

2005-10-07 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jim_flanegin [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 wrote:
 
  The real problem is the need to compete.  It can take
  many forms, depending on the nature of the competing
  religions.
 
 Well said. The need to compete keeps us attached to the birth and 
 death of ideas, the birth and death of desires, and the birth and 
 death of the body.

Or the other way around, the need to compete is a
function of attachment.

 Which is why transcending the discrimination of the 
 intellect is a vital component of Realization.

Either way...







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[FairfieldLife] Re: Dangers of Pseudo-Advaita

2005-10-07 Thread jim_flanegin
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 
 
 --- jim_flanegin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
 snip
  
  And also when Maharishi speaks about being instantly
  enlightened 
  once we transcend for the first time. ...
 
 I've never heard MMY say anything remotely close to
 this. MMY always presented enlightenment from the
 gradual school perspective: dying the cloth, etc.
 
I was referring to his comments about being enlightened as to the 
goal of enlightenment, the first time we transcend during TM and 
contact the Absolute.

So it is a statement of relative enlightenment he was making. 

The point I was making was that this statement of his led some of us 
to think that we were in fact enlightened; end of pathless path. 
This was in the context of a discussion about knowledge being 
structured in consciousness.

The 'gradual school' perspective was always there as well, proving I 
guess that the ego hears what it wants to. 

  





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[FairfieldLife] Re: More Shankara-dig-vijaya: ...as lightly as a bundle of cotton.

2005-10-07 Thread jim_flanegin
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jim_flanegin 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 wrote:
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  wrote:
  
   The real problem is the need to compete.  It can take
   many forms, depending on the nature of the competing
   religions.
  
  Well said. The need to compete keeps us attached to the birth 
and 
  death of ideas, the birth and death of desires, and the birth 
and 
  death of the body.
 
 Or the other way around, the need to compete is a
 function of attachment.

Right. Kind of a snake chasing its tail type of thing. Either way it 
is a circle.
 
  Which is why transcending the discrimination of the 
  intellect is a vital component of Realization.
 
 Either way...







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Re: [FairfieldLife] Maharishi's designated successor.. (was Re: A scolding for Maharishi...)

2005-10-07 Thread Vaj



On 10/7/05 10:45 AM, jim_flanegin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
 on 10/6/05 5:18 PM, peterklutz at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
 
 1st para, It's now official..?
 
 Well, that's what MMY said.
 
 MMY - forever stretching one's concept of what enlightenment is.
 
 Indeed.  The definition gains more weight every day.
 
 Exactly. Until the mind can no longer handle the irrefutable paradox,
 and collapses.

Jai Guru Bev' !




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[FairfieldLife] Re: More Shankara-dig-vijaya: ...as lightly as a bundle of cotton.

2005-10-07 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jim_flanegin [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jim_flanegin 
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  wrote:
   --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
   wrote:
   
The real problem is the need to compete.  It can take
many forms, depending on the nature of the competing
religions.
   
   Well said. The need to compete keeps us attached to the birth 
   and death of ideas, the birth and death of desires, and the 
   birth and death of the body.
  
  Or the other way around, the need to compete is a
  function of attachment.
 
 Right. Kind of a snake chasing its tail type of thing. Either way
 it is a circle.

Plus the irony that if religion can be said to
have a goal, it's to break that vicious circle.






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[FairfieldLife] Re: More Shankara-dig-vijaya: ...as lightly as a bundle of cotton.

2005-10-07 Thread jim_flanegin
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jim_flanegin 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  wrote:
  
   --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jim_flanegin 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
   wrote:
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend 
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 The real problem is the need to compete.  It can take
 many forms, depending on the nature of the competing
 religions.

Well said. The need to compete keeps us attached to the 
birth 
and death of ideas, the birth and death of desires, and the 
birth and death of the body.
   
   Or the other way around, the need to compete is a
   function of attachment.
  
  Right. Kind of a snake chasing its tail type of thing. Either way
  it is a circle.
 
 Plus the irony that if religion can be said to
 have a goal, it's to break that vicious circle.

Yes. *Very* ironic! A close friend of mine remarked that they 
thought the main goal of any religion is to prepare us for death. 







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[FairfieldLife] Maharishi's designated successor.. (was Re: A scolding for Maharishi...)

2005-10-07 Thread jim_flanegin
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 
 
 
 On 10/7/05 10:45 AM, jim_flanegin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
  
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
  
  on 10/6/05 5:18 PM, peterklutz at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  
  
  1st para, It's now official..?
  
  Well, that's what MMY said.
  
  MMY - forever stretching one's concept of what enlightenment 
is.
  
  Indeed.  The definition gains more weight every day.
  
  Exactly. Until the mind can no longer handle the irrefutable 
paradox,
  and collapses.
 
 Jai Guru Bev' !

All right, all right, it worked, already!!! Ha-ha-ha good one!







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Re: [FairfieldLife] For Vaj

2005-10-07 Thread Vaj
Sorry, I just noticed this--not sure why I missed it.

Yeah I had heard about it just a couple of months ago so was waiting and
when I checked iTunes the other day, there it was. I was wondering if he had
replayed them since I have most of these (except the ones you mention)? I
was hoping it would have studio version of Deer Dancing Around a Broken
Mirror--a personal fave.

There are note-for-note transcriptions out for several of these if you
play--and his stuff is very fun to play, very spontaneously clever, not to
mention beautiful.

-V.


On 10/5/05 1:59 PM, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Vaj, you like Bruce Cockburn, right?  He has a new
 album out called 'Speechless.'  And that's exactly
 what it is.  It's a complete album of his instru-
 mentals.  Most are old, with one ('Rise And Fall')
 that was previously only available on a Japanese
 pressing and three new ones.  Worth the whole price
 just for one of them, 'The End Of All Rivers.'




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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Dangers of Pseudo-Advaita

2005-10-07 Thread Peter


--- jim_flanegin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 wrote:
 
  
  
  --- jim_flanegin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  
  snip
   
   And also when Maharishi speaks about being
 instantly
   enlightened 
   once we transcend for the first time. ...
  
  I've never heard MMY say anything remotely close
 to
  this. MMY always presented enlightenment from the
  gradual school perspective: dying the cloth,
 etc.
  
 I was referring to his comments about being
 enlightened as to the 
 goal of enlightenment, the first time we transcend
 during TM and 
 contact the Absolute.
 
 So it is a statement of relative enlightenment he
 was making. 
 
 The point I was making was that this statement of
 his led some of us 
 to think that we were in fact enlightened; end of
 pathless path. 
 This was in the context of a discussion about
 knowledge being 
 structured in consciousness.
 
 The 'gradual school' perspective was always there as
 well, proving I 
 guess that the ego hears what it wants to.

You don't have to respond, but I still don't get your
point!


 
 
   
 
 
 
 
 
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__ 
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[FairfieldLife] Maharishi's designated successor.. (was Re: A scolding for Maharishi...)

2005-10-07 Thread uns_tressor
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 on 10/6/05 5:18 PM, peterklutz at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 
  1st para, It's now official..?
  
  Well, that's what MMY said.
 
 MMY - forever stretching one's concept of what enlightenment is.
  
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
  on 10/6/05 2:37 PM, peterklutz at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  Any one seen the Oct 5, 2005 press conference?
  
  It's now official: the Prime Minister of the Global Country of 
World
  Peace, His Excellency Dr Bevan Morris, is Enlightened and is 
capable
  of answering any question as well as handling any task.

Impressive. His first task might be to cognize from the 
absolute a cure for clinical obesity before he dies of 
heart failure.
Uns.






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Dangers of Pseudo-Advaita

2005-10-07 Thread jim_flanegin
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 
 
 --- jim_flanegin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  wrote:
  
   
   
   --- jim_flanegin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
   
   snip

And also when Maharishi speaks about being
  instantly
enlightened 
once we transcend for the first time. ...
   
   I've never heard MMY say anything remotely close
  to
   this. MMY always presented enlightenment from the
   gradual school perspective: dying the cloth,
  etc.
   
  I was referring to his comments about being
  enlightened as to the 
  goal of enlightenment, the first time we transcend
  during TM and 
  contact the Absolute.
  
  So it is a statement of relative enlightenment he
  was making. 
  
  The point I was making was that this statement of
  his led some of us 
  to think that we were in fact enlightened; end of
  pathless path. 
  This was in the context of a discussion about
  knowledge being 
  structured in consciousness.
  
  The 'gradual school' perspective was always there as
  well, proving I 
  guess that the ego hears what it wants to.
 
 You don't have to respond, but I still don't get your
 point!
 
Thanks- I don't think it is worth pursuing. I am probably trying to 
clean glass with a dirty rag as it were. I *do* get your point, and 
agree...





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[FairfieldLife] Re: More Shankara-dig-vijaya: ...as lightly as a bundle of cotton.

2005-10-07 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jim_flanegin [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jim_flanegin 
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  wrote:
  
   --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
   wrote:
   
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jim_flanegin 
   [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 wrote:
 
  The real problem is the need to compete.  It can take
  many forms, depending on the nature of the competing
  religions.
 
 Well said. The need to compete keeps us attached to the
 birth and death of ideas, the birth and death of desires, 
 and the birth and death of the body.

Or the other way around, the need to compete is a
function of attachment.
   
   Right. Kind of a snake chasing its tail type of thing. Either 
   way it is a circle.
  
  Plus the irony that if religion can be said to
  have a goal, it's to break that vicious circle.
 
 Yes. *Very* ironic! A close friend of mine remarked that they 
 thought the main goal of any religion is to prepare us for death. 

Oy gevalt.  Well, death is transcendence of a sort.

Or transcendence is a sort of death.  So he wasn't
far wrong, conceptually at least.






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[FairfieldLife] Maharishi's designated successor.. (was Re: A scolding for Maharishi...)

2005-10-07 Thread Robert Gimbel
Sex, sex and more sex/


- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, uns_tressor [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
 
  on 10/6/05 5:18 PM, peterklutz at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 
   1st para, It's now official..?
   
   Well, that's what MMY said.
  
  MMY - forever stretching one's concept of what enlightenment is.
   
   --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 wrote:
   on 10/6/05 2:37 PM, peterklutz at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
   Any one seen the Oct 5, 2005 press conference?
   
   It's now official: the Prime Minister of the Global Country 
of 
 World
   Peace, His Excellency Dr Bevan Morris, is Enlightened and is 
 capable
   of answering any question as well as handling any task.
 
 Impressive. His first task might be to cognize from the 
 absolute a cure for clinical obesity before he dies of 
 heart failure.
 Uns.







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[FairfieldLife] Maharishi's designated successor.. (was Re: A scolding for Maharishi...)

2005-10-07 Thread anonymousff
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, uns_tressor [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:

 
 Impressive. His first task might be to cognize from the 
 absolute a cure for clinical obesity before he dies of 
 heart failure.
 Uns.



Skinny people die of heart failure also.





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[FairfieldLife] Re: Dangers of Pseudo-Advaita

2005-10-07 Thread eptfnj
 I was referring to his comments about being enlightened as to the 
 goal of enlightenment, the first time we transcend during TM and 
 contact the Absolute.
 
 So it is a statement of relative enlightenment he was making. 
 The point I was making was that this statement of his led some of 
 us 
 to think that we were in fact enlightened; end of pathless path. 
 This was in the context of a discussion about knowledge being 
 structured in consciousness.
 The 'gradual school' perspective was always there as well, proving 
 I guess that the ego hears what it wants to.


if a person cannot tell when they have ceased being totally at the 
mercy of their past actions, memories, tendencies or whatever then 
screw them.

there are a good number of people that experience lights, sounds and 
all other Yogic stuff and are basically quite fu*ked up.

the term liberation' might be better a description
of the outcome of completely letting go rather than enlightenment.

i thought the object is to become free and not get caught up in 
endless courses, programs, techniques and other nonsence.

Someone mentioned Taoist texts awhile ago.
Wasn't it Chuang Tzu that pointed out the absurdity
of the various later developments in Taoist breathing, 
meditational and alchemy pursuits? 

This is what TM has become. A lot of horsecrap.
What happened to capture the fort?



























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[FairfieldLife] Re: Dangers of Pseudo-Advaita

2005-10-07 Thread TurquoiseB
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, eptfnj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

  I was referring to his comments about being enlightened as to the 
  goal of enlightenment, the first time we transcend during TM and 
  contact the Absolute.
  
  So it is a statement of relative enlightenment he was making. 
  The point I was making was that this statement of his led some of 
  us 
  to think that we were in fact enlightened; end of pathless path. 
  This was in the context of a discussion about knowledge being 
  structured in consciousness.
  The 'gradual school' perspective was always there as well, 
  proving I guess that the ego hears what it wants to.
 
 if a person cannot tell when they have ceased being totally at the 
 mercy of their past actions, memories, tendencies or whatever then 
 screw them.
 
 there are a good number of people that experience lights, sounds 
 and all other Yogic stuff and are basically quite fu*ked up.
 
 the term liberation' might be better a description
 of the outcome of completely letting go rather than enlightenment.
 
 i thought the object is to become free and not get caught up in 
 endless courses, programs, techniques and other nonsence.
 
 Someone mentioned Taoist texts awhile ago.
 Wasn't it Chuang Tzu that pointed out the absurdity
 of the various later developments in Taoist breathing, 
 meditational and alchemy pursuits? 
 
 This is what TM has become. A lot of horsecrap.
 What happened to capture the fort?

That was Zen; this is Tao.  The movement decided
that it was more in tune with Natural Law to buy
the fort than to capture it.







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[FairfieldLife] Re: Dangers of Pseudo-Advaita

2005-10-07 Thread eptfnj
 That was Zen; this is Tao.  The movement decided
 that it was more in tune with Natural Law to buy
 the fort than to capture it.

now, the Fort is only spoken about,
loyal followers imply it has been captured,
detractors say it will only be purchased,
a few people see only an empty useless lot 
with real estate people from Florida selling it as
The Ideal Community to Live in at prices no-one
can afford.










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[FairfieldLife] Re: Dangers of Pseudo-Advaita

2005-10-07 Thread jim_flanegin
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, eptfnj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

  That was Zen; this is Tao.  The movement decided
  that it was more in tune with Natural Law to buy
  the fort than to capture it.
 
 now, the Fort is only spoken about,
 loyal followers imply it has been captured,
 detractors say it will only be purchased,
 a few people see only an empty useless lot 
 with real estate people from Florida selling it as
 The Ideal Community to Live in at prices no-one
 can afford.

A favorite expression of mine by 'The Man' is: The world is as you 
are; live unbounded awareness. Can't ever quite get past that one...

Re your writing above, how could 'loyal followers imply [the fort] has 
been captured'? If they have really captured the fort, in that 
context, they may be loyal but they could no longer, by definition, be 
followers.







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[FairfieldLife] Maharishi's designated successor.. (was Re: A scolding for Maharishi...)

2005-10-07 Thread scienceofabundance
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Robert Gimbel 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Sex, sex and more sex/
 
 
He might also do some cognizing of his own sexuality. 






 - In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, uns_tressor 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 wrote:
  
   on 10/6/05 5:18 PM, peterklutz at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 
1st para, It's now official..?

Well, that's what MMY said.
   
   MMY - forever stretching one's concept of what enlightenment 
is.

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  wrote:
on 10/6/05 2:37 PM, peterklutz at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Any one seen the Oct 5, 2005 press conference?

It's now official: the Prime Minister of the Global 
Country 
 of 
  World
Peace, His Excellency Dr Bevan Morris, is Enlightened and 
is 
  capable
of answering any question as well as handling any task.
  
  Impressive. His first task might be to cognize from the 
  absolute a cure for clinical obesity before he dies of 
  heart failure.
  Uns.
 







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[FairfieldLife] Re: Dangers of Pseudo-Advaita

2005-10-07 Thread eptfnj
 Re your writing above, how could 'loyal followers imply [the fort] 
 has been captured'? If they have really captured the fort, in that 
 context, they may be loyal but they could no longer, by definition, 
 be followers.

very good!

but those Lions even after looking into the calm clear pool,
still bray like the jackasses they associate with.
their identity is still unclear.

a profilic western interpreter of Zen once commented that
Bankei Zenji, an eccentric and insightfull meditator was
considered a successfull teacher precisely because he left 
no successors or followers.

people DO get addicted to the medicine prescribed to cure their
dis-ease.

people DO fall in love with the doctor that intended only to cure 
their dis-ease.













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[FairfieldLife] Re: Power of Silence

2005-10-07 Thread sparaig
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Jason Spock [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 wrote:
   
Hari Om,
 Here is an discourse on the Power of Silence
 
 There's a gag in there somewhere...


Ouch!





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[FairfieldLife] Re: more Lynch tour

2005-10-07 Thread sparaig
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, uns_tressor 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, bbrigante [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
  Recluse filmmaker David Lynch's East Coast college tour - which 
made 
 a 
  pit-stop at NYU Thursday to promote transcendental meditation - 
seems 
  to be yielding positive results from the other schools he's 
visited, 
  with one university in talks to establish a center for the 
meditation 
  practice.  
  http://www.washingtonsquarenews.com/news/campus/9934.html
 
 I suspect that all this effort will be wasted if
 Maharishi continues to keep in position his barking 
 mad price list. (Unless, of course, there are realistic
 concessions for students).
 Uns.


For me, and for many people, the price would be barking mad for 
somethingthat was unproven (at least in my personal life). However, 
after 30+ years of practice, I think it's worth far more than that. 
Lynch's choice is to let the price remain high but give students and 
teachers a chance to learn it for free or for a drastically reduced 
price. That way, people believe they're getting something important, 
but they don't have to pay the full price.

 






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Satsang Reports: Byron Katie Session

2005-10-07 Thread sparaig
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, eptfnj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, martyboi [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 wrote:
  Well, as my Aunt used to tell me when I was bored:
  
  Boredom is the sign of an undeveloped mind.
 
 i enjoyed the take on boredom by Trugpa Rinpoche.
 the Zen tradition also has some interesting views.
 
 boredom can be considered as the reaction of the
 (so-called) mind to unfulfilled expectations.
 
 wearing away of boredom by long periods of sitting
 is certainly not effortless TM.
 
 IMO,i notice that people who have completed a few sesshin
 have a calmness and degree of patience missing in long-term
 TMers.


Funny, I was going to say the same thing about people doing whatever 
it is that you are touting...






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Men's and women's peaces palaces on MUM campus

2005-10-07 Thread sparaig
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, brahmachari108 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

   These Maharishi Peace Palaces are a profound gift from
 Maharishi
   The Maharishi Peace Palaces will be financed through donations
 and
   the sale of interest-bearing World Peace Bonds.
 
 How is it a gift when financed by those who are supposedly the 
recipients?
 
 Is this the profundity of it?
 
 Kali Yuga shining brightly, huh?
 
 Stupid ignorant people.


It's the manifestation of his knowledge that is the gift. If you 
don't value the knowledge, then you miss what the gift is.






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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Men's and women's peaces palaces on MUM campus

2005-10-07 Thread Vaj



On 10/7/05 7:32 PM, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 It's the manifestation of his knowledge that is the gift. If you
 don't value the knowledge, then you miss what the gift is.

Diluted, commercialized knowledge is a gift?




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[FairfieldLife] Re: Men's and women's peaces palaces on MUM campus

2005-10-07 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 On 10/7/05 7:32 PM, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, brahmachari108
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
These Maharishi Peace Palaces are a profound gift from
  Maharishi
The Maharishi Peace Palaces will be financed through donations
  and
the sale of interest-bearing World Peace Bonds.
 
   How is it a gift when financed by those who are supposedly
   the recipients?
  
   Is this the profundity of it?
  
   Kali Yuga shining brightly, huh?
  
   Stupid ignorant people.
 
  It's the manifestation of his knowledge that is the gift. If you
  don't value the knowledge, then you miss what the gift is.
 
 Diluted, commercialized knowledge is a gift?

What *you* think of the knowledge is irrelevant
in this context, other than that it puts you in
the category of those who don't value the knowledge
and therefore miss what those who do value it
perceive as the gift.

(Note to careless readers: I'm not saying Vaj's
opinion of the knowledge is irrelevant generally,
but rather *in this context*, just as is Lawson's,
or mine.)






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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Men's and women's peaces palaces on MUM campus

2005-10-07 Thread Peter


--- Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 
 
 
 On 10/7/05 7:32 PM, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 wrote:
 
  It's the manifestation of his knowledge that is
 the gift. If you
  don't value the knowledge, then you miss what the
 gift is.
 
 Diluted, commercialized knowledge is a gift?

There's a diamond in there!


 
 
 
 
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 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 
  
 
 
 
 
 




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[FairfieldLife] Re: Global Country of World Peace flag - comments?

2005-10-07 Thread jyouells2000
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, eptfnj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 
 
 What do others here think of the flag design?
 
 
 
 
 Located at http://tmbulletin.net/images/GCWP-flag.jpg


and it's available for only $608 for your sv rectified dwelling!





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[FairfieldLife] Poll: Groups Unhappy With Bush Performance

2005-10-07 Thread gullible fool

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20051008/ap_on_go_pr_wh/bush_ap_poll

WASHINGTON - Evangelicals, Republican women,
Southerners and other critical groups in President
Bush's political coalition are worried about the
direction the nation is headed and disappointed with
his performance, an AP-Ipsos poll found. 

That unease could be a troubling sign for a White
House already struggling to keep the Republican Party
base from slipping over Supreme Court nominee Harriet
Miers, Gulf Coast spending projects, immigration and
other issues.

Politically, this is very serious for the president,
said James Thurber, a political scientist at American
University. If the base of his party has lost faith,
that could spell trouble for his policy agenda and for
the party generally.

Sentiment about the nation's direction has sunk to new
depths at a time people are anxious about Iraq,
the economy, gas prices and the management of billions
of dollars being spent for recovery from the nation's
worst natural disaster.

Only 28 percent say the country is headed in the right
direction while two-thirds, 66 percent, say it is on
the wrong track, the poll found.

There is a growing, deep-seated discontentment and
pessimism about the direction of the country, said
Republican strategist Tony Fabrizio, who believes the
reasons for their pessimism differ for those in one
political party or another.

Among those most likely to have lost confidence about
the nation's direction over the past year are white
evangelicals, down 30 percentage points since
November, Republican women, down 28 points,
Southerners, down 26 points, and suburban men, down 20
points.

Bush's supporters are uneasy about issues such as
federal deficits, immigration and his latest
nomination for the Supreme Court. Social conservatives
are concerned about his choice of Miers, a relatively
unknown lawyer who has most recently served as White
House counsel.

Bush is trying to get more support generally from the
American public by seeming more moderate and showing
he's a strong leader at the same time he has a
rebellion within his own party, Thurber said. The
far right is starting to be very open about their
claim that he's not a real conservative.

The president's job approval is mired at the lowest
level of his presidency — 39 percent. While four of
five Republicans say they approve of Bush's job
performance — enthusiasm in that support has dipped
over the last year.

In December 2004, soon after his re-election, almost
two-thirds of Republicans strongly approved of the job
done by Bush. The AP-Ipsos survey found that just half
in his own party feel that way now.

The intensity of support for Bush's job performance
has also dropped sharply among white evangelicals,
Southerners, people from rural areas and suburban men.

We've lost focus on where we're supposed to be going
and not able to respond to the crises that affect the
people of this country, said David Ernest, a
Republican from San Ramon, Calif., who is angry about
the government's response to Hurricane Katrina. We're
mired in a Middle Eastern adventure and we've taken
the focus off of our own country.

Bush has tried to reassure conservatives about his
Supreme Court nominee. He's also trying to counter
critics of the war by tying U.S. efforts in Iraq to
the larger war against terrorism. And he's made
frequent trips to the areas devastated by hurricanes
Katrina and Rita to offset criticism of the
government's initial response to Katrina.

Of all the problems facing the country, the war in
Iraq is the one that troubles some Bush supporters the
most.

I approve of what the president is doing, but it's a
mixed decision, said Richard Saulinski, a Republican
from Orland Park, Ill. We should get out of Iraq. It
seems like there's no light at the end of the tunnel.
I just think we're dealing with a culture we don't
really understand.

The poll of 1,000 adults was conducted by Ipsos, an
international polling company, from Monday to
Wednesday and has a margin of sampling error of plus
or minus 3 percentage points.






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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Men's and women's peaces palaces on MUM campus

2005-10-07 Thread Vaj



On 10/7/05 10:20 PM, Peter [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 
 
 --- Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
 
 
 
 On 10/7/05 7:32 PM, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 wrote:
 
 It's the manifestation of his knowledge that is
 the gift. If you
 don't value the knowledge, then you miss what the
 gift is.
 
 Diluted, commercialized knowledge is a gift?
 
 There's a diamond in there!

Checked it out...sorry Cubic Zirconium...




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[FairfieldLife] Re: Poll: Groups Unhappy With Bush Performance

2005-10-07 Thread authfriend
What cracks me up is to see conservatives saying
things like this (quote from Kathryn Jean Lopez
on the Corner, National Review Online's group
blog):

The president just took some questions. To
sum up his message: She's my girl. She's a
good girl. Trust me.

I hate this groaning-when-the-president-speaks
reflex I've had all week on this issue.

We feel your pain, Kathryn.

If they were just griping because Bush wasn't
conservative enough for them, it wouldn't be
so satisfying.  But their disgust with the Miers
nomination (and some previous perceived failures
they were quieter about) has, it seems, finally
awakened them to what a shallow, arrogant,
petty, childish sad sack Bush is.

Or maybe they saw that all along, but now they're
so pissed they've dropped the pretense.

Don't know how many of you folks were politically
aware during Watergate, but it feels very much
like that--except that Bush is so much smaller a
figure than Nixon.  As horrid as Nixon was, he
had a certain tragic dignity.  In bringing him
down, there was a feeling of having accomplished
something significant, of having righted a major
wrong.  He was Shakespearean in stature, a real
villain.

Bush is something that never should have happened
in the first place, a stupid mistake.


--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, gullible fool [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 
 http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20051008/ap_on_go_pr_wh/bush_ap_poll
 
 WASHINGTON - Evangelicals, Republican women,
 Southerners and other critical groups in President
 Bush's political coalition are worried about the
 direction the nation is headed and disappointed with
 his performance, an AP-Ipsos poll found. 
 
 That unease could be a troubling sign for a White
 House already struggling to keep the Republican Party
 base from slipping over Supreme Court nominee Harriet
 Miers, Gulf Coast spending projects, immigration and
 other issues.






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Poll: Groups Unhappy With Bush Performance

2005-10-07 Thread bbrigante
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

SNIP

 Bush is something that never should have happened
 in the first place, a stupid mistake.
 



Every group gets the government it deserves -- Bush is a mistake only 
in the sense that he is representative of a very mistaken people. Bush 
happened because the American people are, on average, as stupid as he 
is (turn on the TV any night if you doubt that), and they continue to 
channelize his thinking. Only higher consciousness among the populace 
will create a situation where more intelligent leaders are enabled. 





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