[FairfieldLife] Re: Check out these videos!

2005-11-13 Thread sparaig
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, shempmcgurk [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 There are four categories of videos here; each category has dozens of 
 incredible videos (anywhere from 10 seconds to 3 or 4 minutes).
 
 But be forewarned: it is addictive!  You'll want to see them all!
 
 
 
 http://www.ebaumsworld.com/movies.shtml


I prefer these videos. Many are literally cutting edge, by the world's 
greatest digital video artists (seriously). Cgsociety stands 
for computer graphics society, in case you were wondering:


http://forums.cgsociety.org/forumdisplay.php?f=154






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[FairfieldLife] Earth turns around the sun not the other way: (How MMY sold a diamond (TM) for a handful of spinach...)

2005-11-13 Thread Hagen J. Holtz






  The way I heard the story, it was the 
Shankaracharya, or the guy  MMY was  propping up as 
the Shankaracharya (I can't begin to keep the  details of 
that  whole mess straight) who suggested to MMY, during a quick 
trip to  India  during the Fiuggi course, that he 
offer something more to the  Westerners. So  
Maharishi pulled out a copy of the Yoga Sutras and began  
experimenting on  half a dozen of the M-group types around him 
(I got this account  from one of  them). 

This seems to be mere 
speculation without argumentative basis. It is the same way typically mystifying circumstances as you are 
claimingthem instead of as"to have been the cause of Maharishi's 
decision".

The Siddhis are the logic 
consequence out of TM. Look into the Samyama-principle: Dharana ("fixing"), 
dhyana ("gliding") and samadhi ("landing"). These three parameters 
(always)form the naturalmovement of the mind. The result is 
"concentrating" (ekagrata parinama). In TM you start with fixing the mantra in a 
repetitive manner. The emphasis is on dharana. Due to the three-guna principle 
the result is samadhi. In the siddhis the fixing aspect is being put into the 
back-ground. Emphasis is on dhyana ("coming back to the simplest form of 
awareness" -= siddhi-instruction). By this you pass through samadhi and end up 
in dharana (fixation = manifestation). This is pure applicable science of 
mind.
The sidhis didn't come out until 1977. The 1% 
effect came  out when  Domash was reigning physicist 
in 1974. There was a campaign in  the  UK in 
 which one of the slogans was "you can be one of the 99 if you can 
 get one of  your friends to be the one." Square 
root of 1% came out soon  after  the  
sidhis, and Domash or Hagelin was physicist at that point. It was  
still  Domash until about 1980. Anyway, I think the theory 
preceded the  research.
Yes you think but you don't know it. And anyhow it would not have 
made any difference: In Science either theory precedes experience or vice versa. 
This is nothing unusual. Important is that later on theory and practice or the 
other way round have tomatch this or that 
way.  In other words, the theory 
of 1% or square root of 1% was bandied  about  
before any societal testing was done. And Maharishi spent  countless 
 hours  discussing this and lecturing about it. It's 
not like it was  foisted on him  by cunning 
physicists. As always, he was calling the shots.
Was there anyharm in 
it ?
He  was  
tickled  pink to get a theory that would absolve him from having 
to get  10%  of the  world's population 
meditating, or even 1%. Anyway, I don't think  this  
particular point has much to do with the failure of the movement. 
For 
sure he was looking for some more efficient formula. But this was justfor 
principle reasons and has nothing to do withhow many people were meant to 
be practicing TM.

The failure of the movement is by the way its 
present success. 99% of the TM-Teachers all over the world have been 
leaving the movement. Many of them are still teaching. That is, what Maharishi 
wanted. Because it secured that the secret agents in the movement have no access 
anymore to destroy the movement. Their assumed success of having been destroying 
nowhad become a success for Maharishi to have made so many minds become 
independent, not anymore bound to the master. This is the lesson of freedom 
Maharishi taught to us. He is always one step 
ahead.

The 
ideal of 10,000 or so at one place can grow now from the very grassroot 
level. Once it has been established from there it will never be destroyable 
anymore. Maharishi 1979 in Seelisberg: "I have to play a global game, which you 
may not understand, but which will prevent the movement from 
ultimatedestruction. I have to keep the appearance of the movement 
ridiculous.Those who are able to think from the heart will yet join and be 
withus."

It 
is now up to us to organize and realizethis ideal step by 
step.
 Although  the advent of the sidhis 
sure scared off a lot of respectable  folks  who 
were  beginning to take it seriously.

What should these 
folks havebeen taking more serious than the siddhis andscientific 
research on TM?All this sounds a bit talkative from your 
end.

In order to reach 
Kaivalya even the Karma Mimamsa Sutras and the Vedanta Sutras have to be 
practiced according to the Samyama-Principle. Only under these circumstances the 
Siddhis could unfold to full extent anyhow.
  Thanks Rick, for the History lesson, I 
needed it. At any rate, it  really  supports my 
contention that MMY has rested the entire welfare of  the  
TMorg's success on these bogus studies!!
Therewere no bogus 
studies, there were only bogus interpretations (see those watery wisdoms in the 
recent mail"Where is the truth ?", where pseudo-yogies are typically 
misguiding people's minds, ending up in confusion like "everything is 
truth").
It's psuedo-science, it  hasn't been proven 
satisfactorily. Remember.."thru the window of  science". 

[FairfieldLife] Re: Earth turns around the sun not the other way: (How MMY sold a diamond (TM) for a handful of spinach...)

2005-11-13 Thread sparaig
I completely disagree with your analys simply because TM isn't 
necessary repetition at all.


-- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Hagen J. Holtz 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 
   The way I heard the story, it was the Shankaracharya, or the 
guy
  MMY was
   propping up as the Shankaracharya (I can't begin to keep the
  details of that
   whole mess straight) who suggested to MMY, during a quick trip 
to
  India
   during the Fiuggi course, that he offer something more to the
  Westerners. So
   Maharishi pulled out a copy of the Yoga Sutras and began
  experimenting on
   half a dozen of the M-group types around him (I got this 
account
  from one of
   them).
 This seems to be mere speculation without argumentative basis. It 
is the 
 same way typically mystifying circumstances as you are claiming 
them instead 
 of as to have been the cause of Maharishi's decision.
 
 The Siddhis are the logic consequence out of TM. Look into the 
 Samyama-principle: Dharana (fixing), dhyana (gliding) and 
samadhi 
 (landing). These three parameters (always) form the natural 
movement of 
 the mind. The result is concentrating (ekagrata parinama). In TM 
you start 
 with fixing the mantra in a repetitive manner. The emphasis is on 
dharana. 
 Due to the three-guna principle the result is samadhi. In the 
siddhis the 
 fixing aspect is being put into the back-ground. Emphasis is on 
dhyana 
 (coming back to the simplest form of awareness -= siddhi-
instruction). By 
 this you pass through samadhi and end up in dharana (fixation = 
 manifestation). This is pure applicable science of mind.
 The sidhis didn't come out until 1977. The 1% effect came
  out when
   Domash was reigning physicist in 1974. There was a campaign in
  the
  UK in
   which one of the slogans was you can be one of the 99 if you 
can
  get one of
   your friends to be the one. Square root of 1% came out soon
  after
  the
   sidhis, and Domash or Hagelin was physicist at that point. It 
was
  still
   Domash until about 1980. Anyway, I think the theory preceded 
the
  research.
 Yes you think but you don't know it. And anyhow it would not have 
made any 
 difference: In Science either theory precedes experience or vice 
versa. This 
 is nothing unusual. Important is that later on theory and practice 
or the 
 other way round have to match this or that way.
   In other words, the theory of 1% or square root of 1% was 
bandied
  about
   before any societal testing was done. And Maharishi spent
  countless
  hours
   discussing this and lecturing about it. It's not like it was
  foisted on him
   by cunning physicists. As always, he was calling the shots.
 Was there any harm in it ?
  He
  was
  tickled
   pink to get a theory that would absolve him from having to get
  10%
  of the
   world's population meditating, or even 1%. Anyway, I don't 
think
  this
   particular point has much to do with the failure of the 
movement.
 For sure he was looking for some more efficient formula. But this 
was just 
 for principle reasons and has nothing to do with how many people 
were meant 
 to be practicing TM.
 
 The failure of the movement is by the way its present success. 99% 
of the 
 TM-Teachers all over the world have been leaving the movement. Many 
of them 
 are still teaching. That is, what Maharishi wanted. Because it 
secured that 
 the secret agents in the movement have no access anymore to destroy 
the 
 movement. Their assumed success of having been destroying now had 
become a 
 success for Maharishi to have made so many minds become 
independent, not 
 anymore bound to the master. This is the lesson of freedom 
Maharishi taught 
 to us. He is always one step ahead.
 
 The ideal of 10,000 or so at one place can grow now from the very 
grass root 
 level. Once it has been established from there it will never be 
destroyable 
 anymore. Maharishi 1979 in Seelisberg: I have to play a global 
game, which 
 you may not understand, but which will prevent the movement from 
ultimate 
 destruction. I have to keep the appearance of the movement 
ridiculous. Those 
 who are able to think from the heart will yet join and be with us.
 
 It is now up to us to organize and realize this ideal step by step.
 
  Although
   the advent of the sidhis sure scared off a lot of respectable
  folks
  who were
   beginning to take it seriously.
 
 What should these folks have been taking more serious than the 
siddhis and 
 scientific research on TM ? All this sounds a bit talkative from 
your end.
 
 In order to reach Kaivalya even the Karma Mimamsa Sutras and the 
Vedanta 
 Sutras have to be practiced according to the Samyama-Principle. 
Only under 
 these circumstances the Siddhis could unfold to full extent anyhow.
 
 
  Thanks Rick, for the History lesson, I needed it. At any rate, it
  really
  supports my contention that MMY has rested the entire welfare of
  the
  TMorg's success on these bogus studies!!
 There were no bogus studies, there were only bogus 

[FairfieldLife] Re: How MMY sold a diamond (TM) for a handful of spinach...

2005-11-13 Thread Ingegerd
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 on 11/12/05 10:56 PM, wmurphy77 at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  
  on 11/12/05 9:33 PM, wmurphy77 at [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
  
  To think that the primary technique of TM would EVER take a 
back
  seat
  to Haglin's pseudo-scientific Siddhi's program is amazing to 
me.
  
  Why are you attributing ownership or authorship of the Sidhi
  program to
  Hagelin? Hagelin wasn't a major player in the movement when
  Maharishi came
  out with the sidhi program. Sounds to me like you're trying to
  shift blame
  away from Maharishi. Common mistake. He calls the shots and 
always
  has. Deal
  with it.
  
  I'm implying that MMY has swallowed Hagelin's research 
as 'proof'!  I
  think the jury is still out as to the relative numbers required 
to
  create such an effect. I realize that it was at the suggestion
  of 'another' yogi (apparently) that MMY came out with this 
totally
  premature yogic flying, etc. MMY really thinks you only need the
  square root of 1% of the population (yada, yada) to shift trends 
in
  the world...BASED ON HAGELIN'S RESEARCH! Who's the Yogi and 
who's the
  chela now???  Hummm, think about it, it explains everything!
 
 The way I heard the story, it was the Shankaracharya, or the guy 
MMY was
 propping up as the Shankaracharya (I can't begin to keep the 
details of that
 whole mess straight) who suggested to MMY, during a quick trip to 
India
 during the Fiuggi course, that he offer something more to the 
Westerners. So
 Maharishi pulled out a copy of the Yoga Sutras and began 
experimenting on
 half a dozen of the M-group types around him (I got this account 
from one of
 them). The sidhis didn't come out until 1977. The 1% effect came 
out when
 Domash was reigning physicist in 1974. There was a campaign in the 
UK in
 which one of the slogans was you can be one of the 99 if you can 
get one of
 your friends to be the one. Square root of 1% came out soon after 
the
 sidhis, and Domash or Hagelin was physicist at that point. It was 
still
 Domash until about 1980. Anyway, I think the theory preceded the 
research.
 In other words, the theory of 1% or square root of 1% was bandied 
about
 before any societal testing was done. And Maharishi spent 
countless hours
 discussing this and lecturing about it. It's not like it was 
foisted on him
 by cunning physicists. As always, he was calling the shots. He was 
tickled
 pink to get a theory that would absolve him from having to get 10% 
of the
 world's population meditating, or even 1%. Anyway, I don't think 
this
 particular point has much to do with the failure of the movement. 
Although
 the advent of the sidhis sure scared off a lot of respectable 
folks who were
 beginning to take it seriously.

A group of Norwegian TM-Teachers, including me, did learn the TM-
Sidhi-Techniques in 1978 directly from MMY, for free. MMY gave us 
the techniques and explained how they worked. Nandkishore was 
sometimes with him. Once we asked a question to Nandkishore: If we 
do not have time to do the whole program, what should we give 
priority. His answer was: The Asanas and the Pranayama. I did not 
understand why he did not say The TM-Sidhi-Techniques. Every month 
we did send our experiences with the TM-Sidhi-Program to MMY, not 
always telling the truth. It was some kind of Mass-Hypnosis - always 
waiting to fly in the air. But we did not pay for the courses - so 
maybe we were among the students that MMY tried out the program 
with. 
Ingegerd








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[FairfieldLife] Re: instead of Vedaland ... Nature is Supporting this ...

2005-11-13 Thread Ingegerd
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Brahman 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 The newly opened AksharDham Temple in New Delhi, is truly a wonder 
and 
 expects to be India's number one religious tourist destination. It 
 only cost 40 million US dollars to build! 
 
 Maharishi had a similar, good idea called Vedaland, but as usual, 
that 
 was just all talk and no manifesting. Of course, nature abhors a 
 vacuum, and so this other Hindu sect (BAPS) got the job done. So, 
no 
 need to be disappointed any longer, Nature has taken care of 
things, 
 even without the TMO!
 
 see overview news article at:
http://www.hinduismtoday.com/hpi/2005/11/12.shtml#1
 
 see amazing pics inside the new temple, at their website:
http://akshardham.com
 lots of pics all over, be sure to click the links!

Beautiful pictures!!
Ingegerd







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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Earth turns around the sun not the other way: (How MMY sold a diamond (TM) for a handful of spinach...)

2005-11-13 Thread Hagen J. Holtz





Yes you are one of those "progressive" ones, who 
have understood all andset off for free flight in mere wide and 
infinitespace:-). I wish and prayfor you that you are not ending up 
in mere emptiness !


- Original Message - 
From: "sparaig" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sunday, November 13, 2005 9:31 
AM
Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Earth turns around the 
sun not the other way: (How MMY sold a diamond (TM) for a handful of 
spinach...)
I completely disagree with your analys simply because TM isn't 
 necessary repetition at all.   -- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Hagen 
J. Holtz"  [EMAIL PROTECTED]... 
wrote:The way I heard the 
story, it was the Shankaracharya, or the  guy  MMY 
was   propping up as the Shankaracharya (I can't begin 
to keep the  details of that   whole 
mess straight) who suggested to MMY, during a quick trip  to 
 India   during the Fiuggi course, that he offer 
something more to the  Westerners. So  
 Maharishi pulled out a copy of the Yoga Sutras and began 
 experimenting on   half a dozen of the M-group 
types around him (I got this  account  from one 
of   them). This seems to be mere 
speculation without argumentative basis. It  is the  same 
way typically mystifying circumstances as you are claiming  them instead 
 of as "to have been the cause of Maharishi's decision". 
 The Siddhis are the logic consequence out of TM. Look into the 
 Samyama-principle: Dharana ("fixing"), dhyana ("gliding") and 
 samadhi  ("landing"). These three parameters (always) form 
the natural  movement of  the mind. The result is 
"concentrating" (ekagrata parinama). In TM  you start  with 
fixing the mantra in a repetitive manner. The emphasis is on  dharana. 
 Due to the three-guna principle the result is samadhi. In the 
 siddhis the  fixing aspect is being put into the 
back-ground. Emphasis is on  dhyana  ("coming back to the 
simplest form of awareness" -= siddhi- instruction). By  
this you pass through samadhi and end up in dharana (fixation =  
manifestation). This is pure applicable science of mind. The sidhis 
didn't come out until 1977. The 1% effect came  out 
when   Domash was reigning physicist in 1974. There was 
a campaign in  the  UK in 
  which one of the slogans was "you can be one of the 99 if you 
 can  get one of   your 
friends to be the one." Square root of 1% came out soon  
after  the   sidhis, and Domash or 
Hagelin was physicist at that point. It  was  
still   Domash until about 1980. Anyway, I think the 
theory preceded  the  research. Yes you 
think but you don't know it. And anyhow it would not have  made any 
 difference: In Science either theory precedes experience or vice 
 versa. This  is nothing unusual. Important is that later on 
theory and practice  or the  other way round have to match 
this or that way.   In other words, the theory of 1% or 
square root of 1% was  bandied  about 
  before any societal testing was done. And Maharishi 
spent  countless  hours  
 discussing this and lecturing about it. It's not like it was 
 foisted on him   by cunning physicists. As 
always, he was calling the shots. Was there any harm in it 
? He  was  
tickled   pink to get a theory that would absolve him 
from having to get  10%  of the 
  world's population meditating, or even 1%. Anyway, I don't 
 think  this   particular 
point has much to do with the failure of the  movement. For 
sure he was looking for some more efficient formula. But this  was just 
 for principle reasons and has nothing to do with how many people 
 were meant  to be practicing TM.  
The failure of the movement is by the way its present success. 99%  of 
the  TM-Teachers all over the world have been leaving the movement. 
Many  of them  are still teaching. That is, what Maharishi 
wanted. Because it  secured that  the secret agents in the 
movement have no access anymore to destroy  the  movement. 
Their assumed success of having been destroying now had  become a 
 success for Maharishi to have made so many minds become  
independent, not  anymore bound to the master. This is the lesson of 
freedom  Maharishi taught  to us. He is always one step 
ahead.  The ideal of 10,000 or so at one place can grow 
now from the very  grass root  level. Once it has been 
established from there it will never be  destroyable  
anymore. Maharishi 1979 in Seelisberg: "I have to play a global  game, 
which  you may not understand, but which will prevent the movement 
from  ultimate  destruction. I have to keep the appearance 
of the movement  ridiculous. Those  who are able to think 
from the heart will yet join and be with us."  It is now 
up to us to organize and realize this ideal step by step. 
  Although   the advent of the 
sidhis sure scared off a lot of respectable  folks 
 who were   beginning to take it 
seriously.  What should these folks have been taking 
more serious than the  siddhis and  scientific research on 
TM ? All this sounds a bit talkative from  

[FairfieldLife] Re: How MMY sold a diamond (TM) for a handful of spinach...

2005-11-13 Thread Ingegerd
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Ingegerd 
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  
   on 11/12/05 10:56 PM, wmurphy77 at [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
   
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

on 11/12/05 9:33 PM, wmurphy77 at [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  wrote:

To think that the primary technique of TM would EVER take 
a 
  back
seat
to Haglin's pseudo-scientific Siddhi's program is amazing 
to 
  me.

Why are you attributing ownership or authorship of the Sidhi
program to
Hagelin? Hagelin wasn't a major player in the movement when
Maharishi came
out with the sidhi program. Sounds to me like you're trying 
to
shift blame
away from Maharishi. Common mistake. He calls the shots and 
  always
has. Deal
with it.

I'm implying that MMY has swallowed Hagelin's research 
  as 'proof'!  I
think the jury is still out as to the relative numbers 
required 
  to
create such an effect. I realize that it was at the 
suggestion
of 'another' yogi (apparently) that MMY came out with this 
  totally
premature yogic flying, etc. MMY really thinks you only need 
the
square root of 1% of the population (yada, yada) to shift 
 trends 
  in
the world...BASED ON HAGELIN'S RESEARCH! Who's the Yogi and 
  who's the
chela now???  Hummm, think about it, it explains everything!
   
   The way I heard the story, it was the Shankaracharya, or the 
guy 
  MMY was
   propping up as the Shankaracharya (I can't begin to keep the 
  details of that
   whole mess straight) who suggested to MMY, during a quick trip 
to 
  India
   during the Fiuggi course, that he offer something more to the 
  Westerners. So
   Maharishi pulled out a copy of the Yoga Sutras and began 
  experimenting on
   half a dozen of the M-group types around him (I got this 
account 
  from one of
   them). The sidhis didn't come out until 1977. The 1% effect 
came 
  out when
   Domash was reigning physicist in 1974. There was a campaign in 
 the 
  UK in
   which one of the slogans was you can be one of the 99 if you 
can 
  get one of
   your friends to be the one. Square root of 1% came out soon 
 after 
  the
   sidhis, and Domash or Hagelin was physicist at that point. It 
was 
  still
   Domash until about 1980. Anyway, I think the theory preceded 
the 
  research.
   In other words, the theory of 1% or square root of 1% was 
bandied 
  about
   before any societal testing was done. And Maharishi spent 
  countless hours
   discussing this and lecturing about it. It's not like it was 
  foisted on him
   by cunning physicists. As always, he was calling the shots. He 
 was 
  tickled
   pink to get a theory that would absolve him from having to get 
 10% 
  of the
   world's population meditating, or even 1%. Anyway, I don't 
think 
  this
   particular point has much to do with the failure of the 
movement. 
  Although
   the advent of the sidhis sure scared off a lot of respectable 
  folks who were
   beginning to take it seriously.
  
  A group of Norwegian TM-Teachers, including me, did learn the TM-
  Sidhi-Techniques in 1978 directly from MMY, for free. MMY gave 
us 
  the techniques and explained how they worked. Nandkishore was 
  sometimes with him. Once we asked a question to Nandkishore: If 
we 
  do not have time to do the whole program, what should we give 
  priority. His answer was: The Asanas and the Pranayama. I did 
 not 
  understand why he did not say The TM-Sidhi-Techniques. Every 
 month 
  we did send our experiences with the TM-Sidhi-Program to MMY, 
not 
  always telling the truth. It was some kind of Mass-Hypnosis - 
 always 
  waiting to fly in the air. But we did not pay for the courses - 
so 
  maybe we were among the students that MMY tried out the program 
  with. 
  Ingegerd
  
 
 
 Huh, I would think it would be TM first, not asanas, since that is 
 what people were taught prior to the sidhis..

What you think is one thing - what Nandkishore said is another 
thing. I was wondering myself why he did not mention TM and TM-Sidhi-
technique.
Ingegerd






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[FairfieldLife] Re: How MMY sold a diamond (TM) for a handful of spinach...

2005-11-13 Thread sparaig
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Ingegerd 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Ingegerd 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  
   --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer 
   [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
   
on 11/12/05 10:56 PM, wmurphy77 at [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
 on 11/12/05 9:33 PM, wmurphy77 at [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
   wrote:
 
 To think that the primary technique of TM would EVER take 
 a 
   back
 seat
 to Haglin's pseudo-scientific Siddhi's program is amazing 
 to 
   me.
 
 Why are you attributing ownership or authorship of the 
Sidhi
 program to
 Hagelin? Hagelin wasn't a major player in the movement when
 Maharishi came
 out with the sidhi program. Sounds to me like you're 
trying 
 to
 shift blame
 away from Maharishi. Common mistake. He calls the shots 
and 
   always
 has. Deal
 with it.
 
 I'm implying that MMY has swallowed Hagelin's research 
   as 'proof'!  I
 think the jury is still out as to the relative numbers 
 required 
   to
 create such an effect. I realize that it was at the 
 suggestion
 of 'another' yogi (apparently) that MMY came out with this 
   totally
 premature yogic flying, etc. MMY really thinks you only 
need 
 the
 square root of 1% of the population (yada, yada) to shift 
  trends 
   in
 the world...BASED ON HAGELIN'S RESEARCH! Who's the Yogi and 
   who's the
 chela now???  Hummm, think about it, it explains everything!

The way I heard the story, it was the Shankaracharya, or the 
 guy 
   MMY was
propping up as the Shankaracharya (I can't begin to keep the 
   details of that
whole mess straight) who suggested to MMY, during a quick 
trip 
 to 
   India
during the Fiuggi course, that he offer something more to the 
   Westerners. So
Maharishi pulled out a copy of the Yoga Sutras and began 
   experimenting on
half a dozen of the M-group types around him (I got this 
 account 
   from one of
them). The sidhis didn't come out until 1977. The 1% effect 
 came 
   out when
Domash was reigning physicist in 1974. There was a campaign 
in 
  the 
   UK in
which one of the slogans was you can be one of the 99 if you 
 can 
   get one of
your friends to be the one. Square root of 1% came out soon 
  after 
   the
sidhis, and Domash or Hagelin was physicist at that point. It 
 was 
   still
Domash until about 1980. Anyway, I think the theory preceded 
 the 
   research.
In other words, the theory of 1% or square root of 1% was 
 bandied 
   about
before any societal testing was done. And Maharishi spent 
   countless hours
discussing this and lecturing about it. It's not like it was 
   foisted on him
by cunning physicists. As always, he was calling the shots. 
He 
  was 
   tickled
pink to get a theory that would absolve him from having to 
get 
  10% 
   of the
world's population meditating, or even 1%. Anyway, I don't 
 think 
   this
particular point has much to do with the failure of the 
 movement. 
   Although
the advent of the sidhis sure scared off a lot of respectable 
   folks who were
beginning to take it seriously.
   
   A group of Norwegian TM-Teachers, including me, did learn the 
TM-
   Sidhi-Techniques in 1978 directly from MMY, for free. MMY gave 
 us 
   the techniques and explained how they worked. Nandkishore was 
   sometimes with him. Once we asked a question to Nandkishore: If 
 we 
   do not have time to do the whole program, what should we give 
   priority. His answer was: The Asanas and the Pranayama. I 
did 
  not 
   understand why he did not say The TM-Sidhi-Techniques. Every 
  month 
   we did send our experiences with the TM-Sidhi-Program to MMY, 
 not 
   always telling the truth. It was some kind of Mass-Hypnosis - 
  always 
   waiting to fly in the air. But we did not pay for the courses - 
 so 
   maybe we were among the students that MMY tried out the program 
   with. 
   Ingegerd
   
  
  
  Huh, I would think it would be TM first, not asanas, since that 
is 
  what people were taught prior to the sidhis..
 
 What you think is one thing - what Nandkishore said is another 
 thing. I was wondering myself why he did not mention TM and TM-
Sidhi-
 technique.
 Ingegerd


Perhaps because he thought you meant what priorty to give to the 
program other than TM? At that point, perhaps he and MMY weren't sure 
how effective the TM-Sidhis would be while asanas and pranayama were 
definitely worth doing as a priority. Of course priority can mean 
what you do first, not what is most important...









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[FairfieldLife] Re: How MMY sold a diamond (TM) for a handful of spinach...

2005-11-13 Thread cardemaister
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wmurphy77 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 TMorg's success on these bogus studies!! It's psuedo-science, it 
 hasn't been proven satisfactorily. Remember..thru the window of 
 science.  We might as well replace Guru Dev's picture with that of 
 the greatest scientest of our age, the great John Hagelin!!  MMY's 
 biggest mistake was, is, and always will be, the Siddhi's program!


Sour grapes?  :)





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[FairfieldLife] Re: How MMY sold a diamond (TM) for a handful of spinach...

2005-11-13 Thread Ingegerd
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Ingegerd 
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 wrote:
  
   --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Ingegerd 
   [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
   
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 on 11/12/05 10:56 PM, wmurphy77 at 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  
  on 11/12/05 9:33 PM, wmurphy77 at 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
  
  To think that the primary technique of TM would EVER 
take 
  a 
back
  seat
  to Haglin's pseudo-scientific Siddhi's program is 
amazing 
  to 
me.
  
  Why are you attributing ownership or authorship of the 
 Sidhi
  program to
  Hagelin? Hagelin wasn't a major player in the movement 
when
  Maharishi came
  out with the sidhi program. Sounds to me like you're 
 trying 
  to
  shift blame
  away from Maharishi. Common mistake. He calls the shots 
 and 
always
  has. Deal
  with it.
  
  I'm implying that MMY has swallowed Hagelin's research 
as 'proof'!  I
  think the jury is still out as to the relative numbers 
  required 
to
  create such an effect. I realize that it was at the 
  suggestion
  of 'another' yogi (apparently) that MMY came out with 
this 
totally
  premature yogic flying, etc. MMY really thinks you only 
 need 
  the
  square root of 1% of the population (yada, yada) to 
shift 
   trends 
in
  the world...BASED ON HAGELIN'S RESEARCH! Who's the Yogi 
and 
who's the
  chela now???  Hummm, think about it, it explains 
everything!
 
 The way I heard the story, it was the Shankaracharya, or 
the 
  guy 
MMY was
 propping up as the Shankaracharya (I can't begin to keep 
the 
details of that
 whole mess straight) who suggested to MMY, during a quick 
 trip 
  to 
India
 during the Fiuggi course, that he offer something more to 
the 
Westerners. So
 Maharishi pulled out a copy of the Yoga Sutras and began 
experimenting on
 half a dozen of the M-group types around him (I got this 
  account 
from one of
 them). The sidhis didn't come out until 1977. The 1% 
effect 
  came 
out when
 Domash was reigning physicist in 1974. There was a 
campaign 
 in 
   the 
UK in
 which one of the slogans was you can be one of the 99 if 
you 
  can 
get one of
 your friends to be the one. Square root of 1% came out 
soon 
   after 
the
 sidhis, and Domash or Hagelin was physicist at that point. 
It 
  was 
still
 Domash until about 1980. Anyway, I think the theory 
preceded 
  the 
research.
 In other words, the theory of 1% or square root of 1% was 
  bandied 
about
 before any societal testing was done. And Maharishi spent 
countless hours
 discussing this and lecturing about it. It's not like it 
was 
foisted on him
 by cunning physicists. As always, he was calling the 
shots. 
 He 
   was 
tickled
 pink to get a theory that would absolve him from having to 
 get 
   10% 
of the
 world's population meditating, or even 1%. Anyway, I don't 
  think 
this
 particular point has much to do with the failure of the 
  movement. 
Although
 the advent of the sidhis sure scared off a lot of 
respectable 
folks who were
 beginning to take it seriously.

A group of Norwegian TM-Teachers, including me, did learn 
the 
 TM-
Sidhi-Techniques in 1978 directly from MMY, for free. MMY 
gave 
  us 
the techniques and explained how they worked. Nandkishore 
was 
sometimes with him. Once we asked a question to Nandkishore: 
If 
  we 
do not have time to do the whole program, what should we 
give 
priority. His answer was: The Asanas and the Pranayama. I 
 did 
   not 
understand why he did not say The TM-Sidhi-Techniques. 
Every 
   month 
we did send our experiences with the TM-Sidhi-Program to 
MMY, 
  not 
always telling the truth. It was some kind of Mass-Hypnosis -
 
   always 
waiting to fly in the air. But we did not pay for the 
courses - 
  so 
maybe we were among the students that MMY tried out the 
program 
with. 
Ingegerd

   
   
   Huh, I would think it would be TM first, not asanas, since 
that 
 is 
   what people were taught prior to the sidhis..
  
  What you think is one thing - what Nandkishore said is another 
  thing. I was wondering myself why he did not mention TM and TM-
 Sidhi-
  technique.
  Ingegerd
 
 
 Perhaps because he thought you meant what priorty to give to the 
 program other than TM? At that point, perhaps he and MMY weren't 
sure 
 how effective the TM-Sidhis would be while asanas and pranayama 
were 
 definitely 

[FairfieldLife] Re: How MMY sold a diamond (TM) for a handful of spinach...

2005-11-13 Thread dhamiltony2k5

MMY's
 biggest mistake was, is, and always will be, the Siddhi's program!


--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig wrote:


Unless you happen to find the Siddhis program of personal use, of
course...

Yeah, on my siddhi course w/MMY at the end there was this clamouring 
for people to receive advanced TM techniques from MMY before they 
went home.  He laughed derisively at this and said, i have just 
given you the key to the universe and you want advanced techniques?

On that course he gave these great lectures about the patanjali Yoga 
Sutras and the siddhis.  Really great understanding about how you do 
the siddhis in form.  In the sequence of things i am glad he came 
along with this back then.  
You can use the form of Patanjali to all kinds of good end with any 
of the maha vedic mantras or just simple spiritual practice.   The 
same kind of patanjalaic description for how you can meditate is 
taught with Karunamayi also.  It is not like Patanjali is tradmarked 
or MMY taught anything new.  He definitely packaged it.  

As for the long decline, it was very much in his hands as he 
dismantled the teaching organization back in 1977 that had become so 
effective to that point.  He (MMY) made the decision to supplant the 
whole thing with the chaos of the returning vedic atoms from those 
early TM-siddhi 'governor training' courses (mid  late 70's).  It 
was a monumental decision which was very human and all his.  I was 
there and watched him do it.  It was pretty clearly a whim that was 
a bad administrative choice of his.  Yes, he traded the old TMorg as 
a teaching org. for a series of cash cows of what then became the 
intervening years of the TMorg.  From then it really became about 
real estate and profit-centers for him.  The great teacher?

Jai Guru Dev,  -Doug



 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wmurphy77 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  snip
  
   The way I heard the story, it was the Shankaracharya, or the 
guy 
  MMY was
   propping up as the Shankaracharya (I can't begin to keep the 
  details of that
   whole mess straight) who suggested to MMY, during a quick trip 
to 
  India
   during the Fiuggi course, that he offer something more to the 
  Westerners. So
   Maharishi pulled out a copy of the Yoga Sutras and began 
  experimenting on
   half a dozen of the M-group types around him (I got this 
account 
  from one of
   them). The sidhis didn't come out until 1977. The 1% effect 
came 
  out when
   Domash was reigning physicist in 1974. There was a campaign in 
 the 
  UK in
   which one of the slogans was you can be one of the 99 if you 
can 
  get one of
   your friends to be the one. Square root of 1% came out soon 
 after 
  the
   sidhis, and Domash or Hagelin was physicist at that point. It 
was 
  still
   Domash until about 1980. Anyway, I think the theory preceded 
the 
  research.
   In other words, the theory of 1% or square root of 1% was 
bandied 
  about
   before any societal testing was done. And Maharishi spent 
 countless 
  hours
   discussing this and lecturing about it. It's not like it was 
  foisted on him
   by cunning physicists. As always, he was calling the shots. He 
 was 
  tickled
   pink to get a theory that would absolve him from having to get 
 10% 
  of the
   world's population meditating, or even 1%. Anyway, I don't 
think 
  this
   particular point has much to do with the failure of the 
movement. 
  Although
   the advent of the sidhis sure scared off a lot of respectable 
 folks 
  who were
   beginning to take it seriously.
  
  Thanks Rick, for the History lesson, I needed it. At any rate, 
it 
  really 
  supports my contention that MMY has rested the entire welfare of 
 the 
  TMorg's success on these bogus studies!! It's psuedo-science, it 
  hasn't been proven satisfactorily. Remember..thru the window of 
  science.  We might as well replace Guru Dev's picture with that 
of 
  the greatest scientest of our age, the great John Hagelin!!  
MMY's 
  biggest mistake was, is, and always will be, the Siddhi's 
program!
 
 
 
 Unless you happen to find the Siddhis program of personal use, of 
 course...








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[FairfieldLife] Re: How MMY sold a diamond (TM) for a handful of spinach...

2005-11-13 Thread sparaig
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Ingegerd 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Ingegerd 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  
   --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  wrote:
   
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Ingegerd 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer 
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
  on 11/12/05 10:56 PM, wmurphy77 at 
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
   wrote:
  
   --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer
   [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
   
   on 11/12/05 9:33 PM, wmurphy77 at 
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 wrote:
   
   To think that the primary technique of TM would EVER 
 take 
   a 
 back
   seat
   to Haglin's pseudo-scientific Siddhi's program is 
 amazing 
   to 
 me.
   
   Why are you attributing ownership or authorship of the 
  Sidhi
   program to
   Hagelin? Hagelin wasn't a major player in the movement 
 when
   Maharishi came
   out with the sidhi program. Sounds to me like you're 
  trying 
   to
   shift blame
   away from Maharishi. Common mistake. He calls the 
shots 
  and 
 always
   has. Deal
   with it.
   
   I'm implying that MMY has swallowed Hagelin's research 
 as 'proof'!  I
   think the jury is still out as to the relative numbers 
   required 
 to
   create such an effect. I realize that it was at the 
   suggestion
   of 'another' yogi (apparently) that MMY came out with 
 this 
 totally
   premature yogic flying, etc. MMY really thinks you only 
  need 
   the
   square root of 1% of the population (yada, yada) to 
 shift 
trends 
 in
   the world...BASED ON HAGELIN'S RESEARCH! Who's the Yogi 
 and 
 who's the
   chela now???  Hummm, think about it, it explains 
 everything!
  
  The way I heard the story, it was the Shankaracharya, or 
 the 
   guy 
 MMY was
  propping up as the Shankaracharya (I can't begin to keep 
 the 
 details of that
  whole mess straight) who suggested to MMY, during a quick 
  trip 
   to 
 India
  during the Fiuggi course, that he offer something more to 
 the 
 Westerners. So
  Maharishi pulled out a copy of the Yoga Sutras and began 
 experimenting on
  half a dozen of the M-group types around him (I got this 
   account 
 from one of
  them). The sidhis didn't come out until 1977. The 1% 
 effect 
   came 
 out when
  Domash was reigning physicist in 1974. There was a 
 campaign 
  in 
the 
 UK in
  which one of the slogans was you can be one of the 99 if 
 you 
   can 
 get one of
  your friends to be the one. Square root of 1% came out 
 soon 
after 
 the
  sidhis, and Domash or Hagelin was physicist at that 
point. 
 It 
   was 
 still
  Domash until about 1980. Anyway, I think the theory 
 preceded 
   the 
 research.
  In other words, the theory of 1% or square root of 1% was 
   bandied 
 about
  before any societal testing was done. And Maharishi spent 
 countless hours
  discussing this and lecturing about it. It's not like it 
 was 
 foisted on him
  by cunning physicists. As always, he was calling the 
 shots. 
  He 
was 
 tickled
  pink to get a theory that would absolve him from having 
to 
  get 
10% 
 of the
  world's population meditating, or even 1%. Anyway, I 
don't 
   think 
 this
  particular point has much to do with the failure of the 
   movement. 
 Although
  the advent of the sidhis sure scared off a lot of 
 respectable 
 folks who were
  beginning to take it seriously.
 
 A group of Norwegian TM-Teachers, including me, did learn 
 the 
  TM-
 Sidhi-Techniques in 1978 directly from MMY, for free. MMY 
 gave 
   us 
 the techniques and explained how they worked. Nandkishore 
 was 
 sometimes with him. Once we asked a question to 
Nandkishore: 
 If 
   we 
 do not have time to do the whole program, what should we 
 give 
 priority. His answer was: The Asanas and the Pranayama. 
I 
  did 
not 
 understand why he did not say The TM-Sidhi-Techniques. 
 Every 
month 
 we did send our experiences with the TM-Sidhi-Program to 
 MMY, 
   not 
 always telling the truth. It was some kind of Mass-
Hypnosis -
  
always 
 waiting to fly in the air. But we did not pay for the 
 courses - 
   so 
 maybe we were among the students that MMY tried out the 
 program 
 with. 
 Ingegerd
 


Huh, I would think it would be TM first, not asanas, since 
 that 
  is 
what people were taught prior to the sidhis..
   
   What you think is one thing - what Nandkishore said is another 
   thing. I was wondering myself why he did not mention TM 

[FairfieldLife] Re: How MMY sold a diamond (TM) for a handful of spinach...

2005-11-13 Thread sparaig
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 
 MMY's
  biggest mistake was, is, and always will be, the Siddhi's program!
 
 
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig wrote:
 
 
 Unless you happen to find the Siddhis program of personal use, of
 course...
 
 Yeah, on my siddhi course w/MMY at the end there was this 
clamouring 
 for people to receive advanced TM techniques from MMY before they 
 went home.  He laughed derisively at this and said, i have just 
 given you the key to the universe and you want advanced techniques?
 
 On that course he gave these great lectures about the patanjali 
Yoga 
 Sutras and the siddhis.  Really great understanding about how you 
do 
 the siddhis in form.  In the sequence of things i am glad he came 
 along with this back then.  
 You can use the form of Patanjali to all kinds of good end with any 
 of the maha vedic mantras or just simple spiritual practice.   The 
 same kind of patanjalaic description for how you can meditate is 
 taught with Karunamayi also.  It is not like Patanjali is 
tradmarked 
 or MMY taught anything new.  He definitely packaged it.  
 
 As for the long decline, it was very much in his hands as he 
 dismantled the teaching organization back in 1977 that had become 
so 
 effective to that point.  He (MMY) made the decision to supplant 
the 
 whole thing with the chaos of the returning vedic atoms from those 
 early TM-siddhi 'governor training' courses (mid  late 70's).  It 
 was a monumental decision which was very human and all his.  I was 
 there and watched him do it.  It was pretty clearly a whim that was 
 a bad administrative choice of his.  Yes, he traded the old TMorg 
as 
 a teaching org. for a series of cash cows of what then became the 
 intervening years of the TMorg.  From then it really became about 
 real estate and profit-centers for him.  The great teacher?
 
 Jai Guru Dev,  -Doug
 
 

But look at the numbers. In its heyday, the TMO was teaching perhaps 
a million people a year. That figure wasn't going to last, given the 
competition from the relaxation response and other meditation 
techniques. Even if it had, if you believe the original 1% ME figure, 
you would need to teach 60 million people TM who would be STILL 
PRACTICING for the TMO to have a permanent, long-term effect. That 
would have taken many decades of work to attain --at least 60 to 10o 
years if everyone was a TBer, and more like a 2or 3 centuries or so 
otherwise.

Now, with the sqrt of 1% effect, this time-period would be shortened 
to a period of a year or two as soon as the money was collected and 
the facilities built.

While you can argue that the decision to go for the sqrt ME effect 
with the inherent greed factor of trying to collect 100's of millions 
or even billionsof dollars, has destroyed the TMO (I'm not convinced 
of that yet), you can't aruge that it would take many decades to 
centuries to attain the same theoretical effect by going the way 
things were going in the mid-70's.

To believe that the TMO would survive past MMY's life long enough to 
teach 60-300 million people is at least as optimistic as believing 
that the TMO may yet attain its current goals, which are more 
workable, on their face.

And that 60-300 million required is the BEST-CASE scenario. With a 
90% attrition rate, it might really be impossible to teach enough 
people so that 1% of the world's population would be practicing TM on 
a regular basis.





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[FairfieldLife] Re: Self referal term

2005-11-13 Thread anonymousff
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anonymousff [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
 
  
  Can someone elaborate on the Self Referral attribute of the Self.
  Also do we know it to be true or is it part of the Ved belief 
system?
  ( I understand it but when I was trying to explain to someone 
I got stuck :) )
 
 
 The only attribute the Self really has is Self Referral 
(awareness).


  you either have them all (i.e. intelligence, mercy.., all 
dualities ) or have none of them depends on your POV.







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[FairfieldLife] Re: Self referal term

2005-11-13 Thread anonymousff
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anonymousff [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
 
  
  Can someone elaborate on the Self Referral attribute of the Self.
  Also do we know it to be true or is it part of the Ved belief 
system?
  ( I understand it but when I was trying to explain to someone 
I got stuck :) )
 
 
 The only attribute the Self really has is Self Referral 
(awareness).


  you either have them all (i.e. intelligence, mercy.., all 
dualities ) or have none of them, depends on your POV.







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[FairfieldLife] Re: How MMY sold a diamond (TM) for a handful of spinach...

2005-11-13 Thread wmurphy77
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 
 MMY's
  biggest mistake was, is, and always will be, the Siddhi's program!
 
 
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig wrote:
 
 
 Unless you happen to find the Siddhis program of personal use, of
 course...
 
 Yeah, on my siddhi course w/MMY at the end there was this 
clamouring 
 for people to receive advanced TM techniques from MMY before they 
 went home.  He laughed derisively at this and said, i have just 
 given you the key to the universe and you want advanced techniques?
 
 On that course he gave these great lectures about the patanjali 
Yoga 
 Sutras and the siddhis.  Really great understanding about how you 
do 
 the siddhis in form.  In the sequence of things i am glad he came 
 along with this back then.  
 You can use the form of Patanjali to all kinds of good end with any 
 of the maha vedic mantras or just simple spiritual practice.   The 
 same kind of patanjalaic description for how you can meditate is 
 taught with Karunamayi also.  It is not like Patanjali is 
tradmarked 
 or MMY taught anything new.  He definitely packaged it.  
 
 As for the long decline, it was very much in his hands as he 
 dismantled the teaching organization back in 1977 that had become 
so 
 effective to that point.  He (MMY) made the decision to supplant 
the 
 whole thing with the chaos of the returning vedic atoms from those 
 early TM-siddhi 'governor training' courses (mid  late 70's).  It 
 was a monumental decision which was very human and all his.  I was 
 there and watched him do it.  It was pretty clearly a whim that was 
 a bad administrative choice of his.  Yes, he traded the old TMorg 
as 
 a teaching org. for a series of cash cows of what then became the 
 intervening years of the TMorg.  From then it really became about 
 real estate and profit-centers for him.  The great teacher?
 
 Jai Guru Dev,  -Doug

 
 Seems right to me, I don't question his intentions, just his 
administrative ability. BTW, I doubt most Siddhas do samyama from the 
level of the transcendent, far from it! IMHO. Billyg.







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[FairfieldLife] Re: How MMY sold a diamond (TM) for a handful of spinach...

2005-11-13 Thread wmurphy77
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5 
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
  
  MMY's
   biggest mistake was, is, and always will be, the Siddhi's 
program!
  
  
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig wrote:
  
  
  Unless you happen to find the Siddhis program of personal use, of
  course...
  
  Yeah, on my siddhi course w/MMY at the end there was this 
 clamouring 
  for people to receive advanced TM techniques from MMY before they 
  went home.  He laughed derisively at this and said, i have just 
  given you the key to the universe and you want advanced 
techniques?
  
  On that course he gave these great lectures about the patanjali 
 Yoga 
  Sutras and the siddhis.  Really great understanding about how you 
 do 
  the siddhis in form.  In the sequence of things i am glad he came 
  along with this back then.  
  You can use the form of Patanjali to all kinds of good end with 
any 
  of the maha vedic mantras or just simple spiritual practice.   
The 
  same kind of patanjalaic description for how you can meditate is 
  taught with Karunamayi also.  It is not like Patanjali is 
 tradmarked 
  or MMY taught anything new.  He definitely packaged it.  
  
  As for the long decline, it was very much in his hands as he 
  dismantled the teaching organization back in 1977 that had become 
 so 
  effective to that point.  He (MMY) made the decision to supplant 
 the 
  whole thing with the chaos of the returning vedic atoms from 
those 
  early TM-siddhi 'governor training' courses (mid  late 70's).  
It 
  was a monumental decision which was very human and all his.  I 
was 
  there and watched him do it.  It was pretty clearly a whim that 
was 
  a bad administrative choice of his.  Yes, he traded the old TMorg 
 as 
  a teaching org. for a series of cash cows of what then became the 
  intervening years of the TMorg.  From then it really became about 
  real estate and profit-centers for him.  The great teacher?
  
  Jai Guru Dev,  -Doug
  
  
 
 But look at the numbers. In its heyday, the TMO was teaching 
perhaps 
 a million people a year. That figure wasn't going to last, given 
the 
 competition from the relaxation response and other meditation 
 techniques. Even if it had, if you believe the original 1% ME 
figure, 
 you would need to teach 60 million people TM who would be STILL 
 PRACTICING for the TMO to have a permanent, long-term effect. That 
 would have taken many decades of work to attain --at least 60 to 
10o 
 years if everyone was a TBer, and more like a 2or 3 centuries or so 
 otherwise.
 
 Now, with the sqrt of 1% effect, this time-period would be 
shortened 
 to a period of a year or two as soon as the money was collected and 
 the facilities built.
 
 While you can argue that the decision to go for the sqrt ME effect 
 with the inherent greed factor of trying to collect 100's of 
millions 
 or even billionsof dollars, has destroyed the TMO (I'm not 
convinced 
 of that yet), you can't aruge that it would take many decades to 
 centuries to attain the same theoretical effect by going the way 
 things were going in the mid-70's.
 
 To believe that the TMO would survive past MMY's life long enough 
to 
 teach 60-300 million people is at least as optimistic as believing 
 that the TMO may yet attain its current goals, which are more 
 workable, on their face.
 
 And that 60-300 million required is the BEST-CASE scenario. With a 
 90% attrition rate, it might really be impossible to teach enough 
 people so that 1% of the world's population would be practicing TM 
on 
 a regular basis.

That is nothing but *short-sighted*, if it's worth having it's worth 
waiting for and doing right. MMY always wanted a shortcut since he 
was in a *hurry*, did the Catholic Church become what it is today (in 
numbers) overnight.NO way!  Where's the long term 
strategy, can't we walk and chew gum at the same time?  No, MMY, went 
for broke, it's all or nothing!  Looks like nothing at this point, at 
least in a macro sense!  Billyg.








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[FairfieldLife] Re: How MMY sold a diamond (TM) for a handful of spinach...

2005-11-13 Thread wmurphy77
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Ingegerd 
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:


snips 
  The question was quite clear, including the whole program with TM 
  and everything. It will only be speculations about what he meant. 
  But the answer was that if we did not have time for the whole 
  program, at least do Asanas and Pranayama. Maybe Nandkishore 
 belongs 
  to another Indian Tradition where Asanas and Pranayama is the 
most 
  important?? Maybe other things. The first thing - I skipped when 
I 
  was short of time was Asanas and Pranayama - and gave the 
priority 
  to TM and TM-Sidhi. My experience is that the effect of TM is 
  stronger when I do Asanas and Pranayama.
  Ingegerd

As is mine, interesting story. Who knows if MMY is even enlightened, 
do you? Doesn't really matter to me! Billyg.









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[FairfieldLife] Re: Check out these videos!

2005-11-13 Thread wmurphy77
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, shempmcgurk [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 There are four categories of videos here; each category has dozens of 
 incredible videos (anywhere from 10 seconds to 3 or 4 minutes).
 
 But be forewarned: it is addictive!  You'll want to see them all!
 
 
 
 http://www.ebaumsworld.com/movies.shtml

The flying mouse one is great!






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Self referal term

2005-11-13 Thread sparaig
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anonymousff [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anonymousff [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 wrote:
  
   
   Can someone elaborate on the Self Referral attribute of the 
Self.
   Also do we know it to be true or is it part of the Ved belief 
 system?
   ( I understand it but when I was trying to explain to someone 
 I got stuck :) )
  
  
  The only attribute the Self really has is Self Referral 
 (awareness).
 
 
   you either have them all (i.e. intelligence, mercy.., all 
 dualities ) or have none of them depends on your POV.


Self has no POV...






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[FairfieldLife] Re: How MMY sold a diamond (TM) for a handful of spinach...

2005-11-13 Thread sparaig
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wmurphy77 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5 
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
  
  MMY's
   biggest mistake was, is, and always will be, the Siddhi's 
program!
  
  
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig wrote:
  
  
  Unless you happen to find the Siddhis program of personal use, of
  course...
  
  Yeah, on my siddhi course w/MMY at the end there was this 
 clamouring 
  for people to receive advanced TM techniques from MMY before they 
  went home.  He laughed derisively at this and said, i have just 
  given you the key to the universe and you want advanced 
techniques?
  
  On that course he gave these great lectures about the patanjali 
 Yoga 
  Sutras and the siddhis.  Really great understanding about how you 
 do 
  the siddhis in form.  In the sequence of things i am glad he came 
  along with this back then.  
  You can use the form of Patanjali to all kinds of good end with 
any 
  of the maha vedic mantras or just simple spiritual practice.   
The 
  same kind of patanjalaic description for how you can meditate is 
  taught with Karunamayi also.  It is not like Patanjali is 
 tradmarked 
  or MMY taught anything new.  He definitely packaged it.  
  
  As for the long decline, it was very much in his hands as he 
  dismantled the teaching organization back in 1977 that had become 
 so 
  effective to that point.  He (MMY) made the decision to supplant 
 the 
  whole thing with the chaos of the returning vedic atoms from 
those 
  early TM-siddhi 'governor training' courses (mid  late 70's).  
It 
  was a monumental decision which was very human and all his.  I 
was 
  there and watched him do it.  It was pretty clearly a whim that 
was 
  a bad administrative choice of his.  Yes, he traded the old TMorg 
 as 
  a teaching org. for a series of cash cows of what then became the 
  intervening years of the TMorg.  From then it really became about 
  real estate and profit-centers for him.  The great teacher?
  
  Jai Guru Dev,  -Doug
 
  
  Seems right to me, I don't question his intentions, just his 
 administrative ability. BTW, I doubt most Siddhas do samyama from 
the 
 level of the transcendent, far from it! IMHO. Billyg.


ANd this is an issue because...?






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[FairfieldLife] Re: How MMY sold a diamond (TM) for a handful of spinach...

2005-11-13 Thread sparaig
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wmurphy77 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:


[...]
  
  While you can argue that the decision to go for the sqrt ME 
effect 
  with the inherent greed factor of trying to collect 100's of 
 millions 
  or even billionsof dollars, has destroyed the TMO (I'm not 
 convinced 
  of that yet), you can't aruge that it would take many decades to 
  centuries to attain the same theoretical effect by going the way 
  things were going in the mid-70's.
  
  To believe that the TMO would survive past MMY's life long enough 
 to 
  teach 60-300 million people is at least as optimistic as 
believing 
  that the TMO may yet attain its current goals, which are more 
  workable, on their face.
  
  And that 60-300 million required is the BEST-CASE scenario. With 
a 
  90% attrition rate, it might really be impossible to teach enough 
  people so that 1% of the world's population would be practicing 
TM 
 on 
  a regular basis.
 
 That is nothing but *short-sighted*, if it's worth having it's 
worth 
 waiting for and doing right. MMY always wanted a shortcut since he 
 was in a *hurry*, did the Catholic Church become what it is today 
(in 
 numbers) overnight.NO way!  Where's the long term 
 strategy, can't we walk and chew gum at the same time?  No, MMY, 
went 
 for broke, it's all or nothing!  Looks like nothing at this point, 
at 
 least in a macro sense!  Billyg.


Patience, says the guy who sells meditation CDs online...





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[FairfieldLife] Re: How MMY sold a diamond (TM) for a handful of spinach...

2005-11-13 Thread wmurphy77
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wmurphy77 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  
   
   MMY's
biggest mistake was, is, and always will be, the Siddhi's 
 program!
   
   
   --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig wrote:
   
   
   Unless you happen to find the Siddhis program of personal use, 
of
   course...
   
   Yeah, on my siddhi course w/MMY at the end there was this 
  clamouring 
   for people to receive advanced TM techniques from MMY before 
they 
   went home.  He laughed derisively at this and said, i have 
just 
   given you the key to the universe and you want advanced 
 techniques?
   
   On that course he gave these great lectures about the patanjali 
  Yoga 
   Sutras and the siddhis.  Really great understanding about how 
you 
  do 
   the siddhis in form.  In the sequence of things i am glad he 
came 
   along with this back then.  
   You can use the form of Patanjali to all kinds of good end with 
 any 
   of the maha vedic mantras or just simple spiritual practice.   
 The 
   same kind of patanjalaic description for how you can meditate 
is 
   taught with Karunamayi also.  It is not like Patanjali is 
  tradmarked 
   or MMY taught anything new.  He definitely packaged it.  
   
   As for the long decline, it was very much in his hands as he 
   dismantled the teaching organization back in 1977 that had 
become 
  so 
   effective to that point.  He (MMY) made the decision to 
supplant 
  the 
   whole thing with the chaos of the returning vedic atoms from 
 those 
   early TM-siddhi 'governor training' courses (mid  late 70's).  
 It 
   was a monumental decision which was very human and all his.  I 
 was 
   there and watched him do it.  It was pretty clearly a whim that 
 was 
   a bad administrative choice of his.  Yes, he traded the old 
TMorg 
  as 
   a teaching org. for a series of cash cows of what then became 
the 
   intervening years of the TMorg.  From then it really became 
about 
   real estate and profit-centers for him.  The great teacher?
   
   Jai Guru Dev,  -Doug
  
   
   Seems right to me, I don't question his intentions, just his 
  administrative ability. BTW, I doubt most Siddhas do samyama from 
 the 
  level of the transcendent, far from it! IMHO. Billyg.
 
 
 ANd this is an issue because...?

It goes directly to the effectiveness of the technique!







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Re: [FairfieldLife] Earth turns around the sun not the other way: (How MMY sold a diamond (TM) for a handful of spinach...)

2005-11-13 Thread Vaj

On Nov 13, 2005, at 10:46 AM, Jason Spock wrote:

 Why does the TM-org rabidly criticise Deepak Chopra and Sri  
 Sri. Ravishankar.??  TM-governors claim MMY called him Sugar-Caned  
 poison.??

Duh. One word: competition. Falling mantra sales doesn't make M.  
happy. Isn't that obvious?

Of course, it's also easy to rationalize it as some sort of cosmic  
scenario.



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[FairfieldLife] Re: Self referal term

2005-11-13 Thread anonymousff
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anonymousff [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 wrote:
  
   --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anonymousff 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  wrote:
   

Can someone elaborate on the Self Referral attribute of the 
 Self.
Also do we know it to be true or is it part of the Ved 
belief 
  system?
( I understand it but when I was trying to explain to 
someone 
  I got stuck :) )
   
   
   The only attribute the Self really has is Self Referral 
  (awareness).
  
  
you either have them all (i.e. intelligence, mercy.., all 
  dualities ) or have none of them depends on your POV.
 
 
 Self has no POV...


Or the Self has them all.






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[FairfieldLife] US energy info from the source

2005-11-13 Thread jim_flanegin
I happened to find this website this morning. Did you know Canada 
imports the most crude oil and natural gas into the US? With Mexico a 
close second for crude oil. Anyway, this website is a goldmine of 
energy info.

http://www.eia.doe.gov/






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Self referal term

2005-11-13 Thread Jason Spock










 Self-referral is the tendency to revert back to it's Original state. All systems in nature function in a cyclical way.

 I remember Dr. Micheal Dilbeck making a beautiful speech on Self-referral, about 5 years back.

 Someone might be having therecording of it.???

---OriginalMessage--
From: "anonymousff" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Sat, 12 Nov 2005 20:29:55 - Subject: [FairfieldLife] Self referal term 
 
 Can someone elaborate on the Self Referral attribute of the Self. Also do we know it to be true or is it part of the Ved belief system? ( I understand it but when I was trying to explain to someone I got stuck :) )
  

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[FairfieldLife] Meditation Linked to Structural Changes in Brain

2005-11-13 Thread Tom Pall
http://www.healthcentral.com/newsdetail/408/1507251.html

Meditation Linked to Structural Changes in Brain

The regular practice of meditation seems to produce structural changes
in areas of the brain associated with attention and sensory
processing, a new study suggests.

The imaging study, led by Massachusetts General Hospital researchers,
found that particular areas of the cerebral cortex, the outer layer of
the brain, were thicker in participants who were experienced
practitioners of a type of meditation commonly practiced in the United
States and other western
countries.

The findings appear in the Nov. 15 issue of NeuroReport, and are also
to be presented Monday at the Society for Neuroscience meeting in
Washington, D.C.

Our results suggest that meditation can produce experience-based
structural alterations in the brain, said study author Sara Lazar, of
the hospital's Psychiatric Neuroimaging Research Program. We also
found evidence that meditation may slow down the aging-related atrophy
of certain areas of the brain.





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[FairfieldLife] Re: The Mahesh Kozlowski Effect

2005-11-13 Thread akasha_108
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, akasha_108 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
  authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
   why you refuse to do such a simple
   thing as supply some URLs that you claim
   already to have found.
  
  And this is important, or even interesting, because ?
 
 Oh, if blatant dishonesty and hypocrisy are of
 no concern to you, I guess it wouldn't be.

Thats a pretty big disconnect. If blatant dishonesty and hypocrisy
were manfiestly core issues here, it might be of interest. Though
labeling people, just for the sake of labeling, can get to be quite
boring and IMO non-productive. 

In my view I don't see blatant dishonesty and hypocrisy -- but
oddly, I do see some petty obsessions. I remember when Vaj first 
made the statement. It was not exactly earth shattering. A quick
observation of some momentary interest. Not the kind of thing that
would affect ones world view.

Then I remember your correction: it wasn't a bunch of quick rich
schemes after all, it was Fred G.s book. Curious, I did a search
myself. The first page was filled with what looked like get rich quick
schemes based on do less accomplish more (or do nothing accomplish
everything). Upon closer examination, I saw they all related to Fred's
book. So my take away was, you were both correct in reporting your
perceptions. You, Judy, were technically correct. Vaj, it was clear to
me, made a perceptual or cognitive error, as I initially did, and
reported what he thought he saw. Not a big deal. 

I don't see blatant dishonesty and hypocrisy. And its not a matter
of much important to begin with. I mean its not like Vaj was
testifying before the nation about intelligence on WMD. 

So to go on and on and on about this, over a three month period,
appears a bit curious to me. IMO, to me, it reveals quite a bit more
about you than about Vaj.
 








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Re: [FairfieldLife] Earth turns around the sun not the other way: (How MMY sold a diamond (TM) for a handful of spinach...)

2005-11-13 Thread Vaj


On Nov 13, 2005, at 10:46 AM, Jason Spock wrote:The Siddhis are the logic consequence out of TM. Look into the Samyama-principle: Dharana ("fixing"), dhyana ("gliding") and samadhi ("landing"). These three parameters (always) form the natural movement of the mind. The result is "concentrating" (ekagrata parinama). In TM you start with fixing the mantra in a repetitive manner. The emphasis is on dharana. Due to the three-guna principle the result is samadhi. In the siddhis the fixing aspect is being put into the back-ground. Emphasis is on dhyana ("coming back to the simplest form of awareness" -= siddhi-instruction). By this you pass through samadhi and end up in dharana (fixation = manifestation). This is pure applicable science of mind.Siddhis, attainment of powers of all kinds, is a greattemptation in the life of an initiate. The danger in the pursuit ofsiddhis is twofold:1. At the slightest appearance of some hunch or some prediction coming through, and so forth, one begins to imagine himself as a siddha, an adept.2. One becomes tied down to the desires for such powers and dreams of subtle ego. One might say, "Oh, if only 1 had the power to read others' minds I could help many more students." But deep inside the sub-conscious, there lurks the impurity which would not help the students but simply invade the privacy of their minds and derive from these invasions certain vicarious pleasures. Or one thinks, "If only 1 could predict which horse would win the lottery I could help my guru financially." One day I asked Swamiji,"Why do you have to ask for funds! Why do you not simply buy a lottery ticket on a horse you know would win?" He told me quite sternly, "Don't you even think of that. Work honestly with your body. Work honestly to pay your karma and do not look or such easy ways out."If one finds that special experiences or powers are coming one's way, the injunction is to conceal them carefully and not make your meditation group into a gossip club, every one vying with each other, everyone saying, "wait till you hear my experience!" The siddhis are not in fact any kind of attainments in the sense that they are additions to one's personality. According to the Yoga Sutras of Patanjali, they are simply the unblocking of power. As one advances on the path of meditation one begins to sense the presence of these faculties within. There is a great temptation to sit by the wayside watching this beautiful scenery of siddhis and if one does not resist, the path and the goal are forgotten. The recent trend in certain meditation circles to popularize siddhis and to sell them for a certain fee, is highly frowned upon by the masters of the Himalayas.-Pundit Usharbudh Arya, lineal holder of Patanjali YS tradition and expert on the practice and commentaries.





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[FairfieldLife] Re: Earth turns around the sun not the other way: (How MMY sold a diamond (TM) for a handful of spinach...)

2005-11-13 Thread Jason Spock











 Someone else wrote it, Vajranatha. Some Charlie who rarely posts

---OriginalMessage--
From: "Vaj" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sun, 13 Nov 2005 11:47:37 -0500 Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Earth turns around the sun not the other way: (How MMY sold a diamond (TM) for a handful of spinach...) 

 


On Nov 13, 2005, at 10:46 AM, Jason Spock wrote:
The Siddhis are the logic consequence out of TM. Look into the Samyama-principle: Dharana ("fixing"), dhyana ("gliding") and samadhi ("landing"). These three parameters (always)form the naturalmovement of the mind. The result is "concentrating" (ekagrata parinama). In TM you start with fixing the mantra in a repetitive manner. The emphasis is on dharana. Due to the three-guna principle the result is samadhi. In the siddhis the fixing aspect is being put into the back-ground. Emphasis is on dhyana ("coming back to the simplest form of awareness" -= siddhi-instruction). By this you pass through samadhi and end up in dharana (fixation = manifestation). This is pure applicable science of mind.
Siddhis, attainment of powers of all kinds, is a great
temptation in the life of an initiate. The danger in the pursuit of
siddhis is twofold:

1. At the slightest appearance of some hunch or some prediction coming through, and so forth, one begins to imagine himself as a siddha, an adept.

2. One becomes tied down to the desires for such powers and dreams of subtle ego. One might say, "Oh, if only 1 had the power to read others' minds I could help many more students." But deep inside the sub-conscious, there lurks the impurity which would not help the students but simply invade the privacy of their minds and derive from these invasions certain vicarious pleasures. Or one thinks, "If only 1 could predict which horse would win the lottery I could help my guru financially." One day I asked Swamiji,

"Why do you have to ask for funds! Why do you not simply buy a lottery ticket on a horse you know would win?" He told me quite sternly, "Don't you even think of that. Work honestly with your body. Work honestly to pay your karma and do not look or such easy ways out."

If one finds that special experiences or powers are coming one's way, the injunction is to conceal them carefully and not make your meditation group into a gossip club, every one vying with each other, everyone saying, "wait till you hear my experience!" The siddhis are not in fact any kind of attainments in the sense that they are additions to one's personality. According to the Yoga Sutras of Patanjali, they are simply the unblocking of power. As one advances on the path of meditation one begins to sense the presence of these faculties within. There is a great temptation to sit by the wayside watching this beautiful scenery of siddhis and if one does not resist, the path and the goal are forgotten. The recent trend in certain meditation circles to popularize siddhis and to sell them for a certain fee, is highly frowned upon by the masters of the Himalayas.

 -Pundit Usharbudh Arya, lineal holder of Patanjali YS tradition and expert on the practice and commentaries.

 

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[FairfieldLife] Re: Earth turns around the sun not the other way: (How MMY sold a diamond (TM) for a handful of spinach...)

2005-11-13 Thread Ingegerd
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 
 On Nov 13, 2005, at 10:46 AM, Jason Spock wrote:
 
  The Siddhis are the logic consequence out of TM. Look into the  
  Samyama-principle: Dharana (fixing), dhyana (gliding) and  
  samadhi (landing). These three parameters (always) form the  
  natural movement of the mind. The result is  
  concentrating (ekagrata parinama). In TM you start with 
fixing  
  the mantra in a repetitive manner. The emphasis is on dharana. 
Due  
  to the three-guna principle the result is samadhi. In the 
siddhis  
  the fixing aspect is being put into the back-ground. Emphasis is 
on  
  dhyana (coming back to the simplest form of awareness -= 
siddhi- 
  instruction). By this you pass through samadhi and end up in  
  dharana (fixation = manifestation). This is pure applicable 
science  
  of mind.
 
 Siddhis, attainment of powers of all kinds, is a great
 temptation in the life of an initiate. The danger in the pursuit of
 siddhis is twofold:
 
 1. At the slightest appearance of some hunch or some prediction  
 coming through, and so forth, one begins to imagine himself as a  
 siddha, an adept.
 
 2. One becomes tied down to the desires for such powers and dreams 
of  
 subtle ego. One might say, Oh, if only 1 had the power to read  
 others' minds I could help many more students. But deep inside 
the  
 sub-conscious, there lurks the impurity which would not help the  
 students but simply invade the privacy of their minds and derive 
from  
 these invasions certain vicarious pleasures. Or one thinks, If 
only  
 1 could predict which horse would win the lottery I could help my  
 guru financially. One day I asked Swamiji,
 
 Why do you have to ask for funds! Why do you not simply buy a  
 lottery ticket on a horse you know would win? He told me quite  
 sternly, Don't you even think of that. Work honestly with your 
body.  
 Work honestly to pay your karma and do not look or such easy ways 
out.
 
 If one finds that special experiences or powers are coming one's 
way,  
 the injunction is to conceal them carefully and not make your  
 meditation group into a gossip club, every one vying with each 
other,  
 everyone saying, wait till you hear my experience! The siddhis 
are  
 not in fact any kind of attainments in the sense that they are  
 additions to one's personality. According to the Yoga Sutras of  
 Patanjali, they are simply the unblocking of power. As one 
advances  
 on the path of meditation one begins to sense the presence of 
these  
 faculties within. There is a great temptation to sit by the 
wayside  
 watching this beautiful scenery of siddhis and if one does not  
 resist, the path and the goal are forgotten. The recent trend in  
 certain meditation circles to popularize siddhis and to sell them 
for  
 a certain fee, is highly frowned upon by the masters of the 
Himalayas.
 
 -Pundit Usharbudh Arya, lineal holder of Patanjali YS tradition 
and  
 expert on the practice and commentaries.

And the Masters of the Himalayas, is so right.
I had a lot of Sidhi experiences as a child and grown-up, living 
in silence in the forest - Years before I learned TM. And after I 
stopped with the TM-Sidhi-techniques, they are coming back in a 
natural way. All the expectations following the TM-Sidhi-teqniques - 
encouraged by MMY, was not good at all, from my point of view. 
Ingegerd








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[FairfieldLife] Re: Earth turns around the sun not the other way: (How MMY sold a diamond (TM) for a handful of spinach...)

2005-11-13 Thread Jason Spock










 The Himalayan masters have outdated ideas.

 Just a single guy manages to float in the air,.. John Hagelin will be the next president of United States of America.

---OriginalMessage--
From: "Ingegerd" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Sun, 13 Nov 2005 17:09:38 - Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Earth turns around the sun not the other way: (How MMY sold a diamond (TM) for a handful of spinach...) 
 And the Masters of the Himalayas, is so right. I had a lot of "Sidhi experiences" as a child and grown-up, living in silence in the forest - Years before I learned TM. And after I stopped with the TM-Sidhi-techniques, they are coming back in a natural way. All the expectations following the TM-Sidhi-teqniques - encouraged by MMY, was not good at all, from my point of view. 
 Ingegerd

 

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[FairfieldLife] Re: Earth turns around the sun not the other way: (How MMY sold a diamond (TM) f

2005-11-13 Thread akasha_108
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Jason Spock [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

  
 The Himalayan masters have outdated ideas.
  
 Just a single guy manages to float in the air,..  John Hagelin
will be the next president of United States of America.

And if just one monkey flies out my ass, I'll be on Letterman. 

John and I both are s close.






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[FairfieldLife] Re: The Mahesh Kozlowski Effect

2005-11-13 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, akasha_108 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 wrote:
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, akasha_108 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  wrote:
   authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
why you refuse to do such a simple
thing as supply some URLs that you claim
already to have found.
   
   And this is important, or even interesting, because ?
  
  Oh, if blatant dishonesty and hypocrisy are of
  no concern to you, I guess it wouldn't be.
 
 Thats a pretty big disconnect. If blatant dishonesty and hypocrisy
 were manfiestly core issues here, it might be of interest. Though
 labeling people, just for the sake of labeling, can get to be quite
 boring and IMO non-productive. 
 
 In my view I don't see blatant dishonesty and hypocrisy -- but
 oddly, I do see some petty obsessions. I remember when Vaj first 
 made the statement. It was not exactly earth shattering. A quick
 observation of some momentary interest. Not the kind of thing that
 would affect ones world view.
 
 Then I remember your correction: it wasn't a bunch of quick rich
 schemes after all, it was Fred G.s book. Curious, I did a search
 myself. The first page was filled with what looked like get rich 
 quick schemes based on do less accomplish more (or do nothing 
 accomplish everything). Upon closer examination, I saw they all 
 related to Fred's book. So my take away was, you were both correct 
 in reporting your perceptions. You, Judy, were technically correct. 
 Vaj, it was clear to me, made a perceptual or cognitive error, as I 
 initially did, and reported what he thought he saw. Not a big deal.

Mm-hm.  And yet, had it been just a mistake, after
I made my post reporting on Gratzon's book, you'd
think Vaj would have double-checked and then retracted
his claim.  *Then* it would not have been a big deal;
anybody can make a careless mistake like that.

But he didn't.  Instead he came up with all kinds of
crap, such as citing get-rich-quick schemes in the
Fairfield community, as if that supported his original
claim; announcing that he wasn't going to do *my*
homework for me, as if he had not been the one to make
the claim in the first place; claiming that even if
he did provide the URLs of the Web sites he had in mind,
I wouldn't believe them; and finally telling *me* to
do a search for the sites in question, as though they
actually existed.

So I'm afraid the most likely conclusion is that he
intended to deceive from the start, hoping that most
folks wouldn't bother to check up on him, and that 
anybody who did do a search wouldn't click through
the hits and discover that the sites all had to do
with Gratzon's book.  (The point of the exercise,
of course, having been to suggest that TMers are
greedily preoccupied with making money and thus
vulnerable to get-rich-quick schemes, especially if
they're advertised using TM slogans.)

What we know *for sure* is that having been informed
of his error, Vaj first threw down a red herring of
Fairfield get-rich-quick schemes, then when that
didn't work, attempted to stonewall and pretend that
there indeed were such sites but that somehow I was
too incompetent to find them.

Now, I don't know what your standards are for blatant
dishonesty, but the above more than meets mine, even
if Vaj's original claim was just a dumb mistake.

The *hypocrisy* part is, of course, that Vaj
frequently scornfully accuses MMY and the TMO of
being dishonest in various ways (as with his most
recent comment about the TM studies that inspired
me to bring up the purported Web sites claim again).

 I don't see blatant dishonesty and hypocrisy. And its not a matter
 of much important to begin with. I mean its not like Vaj was
 testifying before the nation about intelligence on WMD.

It's not like anybody here is testifying on such
important matters.  But Vaj *does* testify about
matters that are important to many here, quite a 
few of whom seem to consider him to be a font of
authoritative information.

So it appears to me to be important to know that he
is willing to lie in the service of his agenda, and
accordingly take other pronouncements that he makes
about MMY and TM and the TMO--and quite possibly
other things as well--with a good-sized salt shaker
handy.

 So to go on and on and on about this, over a three month period,
 appears a bit curious to me. IMO, to me, it reveals quite a bit more
 about you than about Vaj.

I'm happy to have it revealed that I am intolerant
of deliberate falsehood.  I suspect most people here
have long since figured that out, however.

As for Vaj, perhaps you don't consider it much of a
revelation that, at the very least, he will lie to
cover up his errors.  I disagree; I think that's a
pretty important character trait to know about.

Oh, and by the way, I have not been going on and
on about this over a three-month period.  I posted
about it right after Vaj made his claim, but I don't
believe I brought 

[FairfieldLife] Re: The Mahesh Kozlowski Effect

2005-11-13 Thread akasha_108
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, akasha_108 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 wrote:
authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 why you refuse to do such a simple
 thing as supply some URLs that you claim
 already to have found.

And this is important, or even interesting, because ?
   
   Oh, if blatant dishonesty and hypocrisy are of
   no concern to you, I guess it wouldn't be.
  
  Thats a pretty big disconnect. If blatant dishonesty and hypocrisy
  were manfiestly core issues here, it might be of interest. Though
  labeling people, just for the sake of labeling, can get to be quite
  boring and IMO non-productive. 
  
  In my view I don't see blatant dishonesty and hypocrisy -- but
  oddly, I do see some petty obsessions. I remember when Vaj first 
  made the statement. It was not exactly earth shattering. A quick
  observation of some momentary interest. Not the kind of thing that
  would affect ones world view.
  
  Then I remember your correction: it wasn't a bunch of quick rich
  schemes after all, it was Fred G.s book. Curious, I did a search
  myself. The first page was filled with what looked like get rich 
  quick schemes based on do less accomplish more (or do nothing 
  accomplish everything). Upon closer examination, I saw they all 
  related to Fred's book. So my take away was, you were both correct 
  in reporting your perceptions. You, Judy, were technically correct. 
  Vaj, it was clear to me, made a perceptual or cognitive error, as
I initially did, and reported what he thought he saw. Not a big deal.

 
 Mm-hm.  And yet, had it been just a mistake, after
 I made my post reporting on Gratzon's book, you'd
 think Vaj would have double-checked and then retracted
 his claim.  *Then* it would not have been a big deal;
 anybody can make a careless mistake like that.
 
 But he didn't.  Instead he came up with all kinds of
 crap, 

I took it as Vaj playing with you. Knowing that if he obsuficated a
bit, you would tend towards imploding in obsession. Barry enjoys such
toying also. Perhaps not the noblest of traits, but maybe they are
students of the behavioral sciences and love to see small pieces of
bait repeatedly taken and watch the predictable drama unfold.

...

 (The point of the exercise,
 of course, having been to suggest that TMers are
 greedily preoccupied with making money and thus
 vulnerable to get-rich-quick schemes, especially if
 they're advertised using TM slogans.)

From I have seen in 35+ years,in and around the movement:

1) TM teachers and govs are often preoccupied with making money quickly.

2) TM teachers and govs are often open to magical thinking, often 
lack much critical evaluation, logic and analytical skills,  and
therefore are vulnerable to get-rich-quick schemes.  

3) TM teachers and govs are often have talked the talk of incredible
undemonstrated stuff for so long, using TM slogans and lingo, that BS
 can often make great sense to them hey its just like . They do
draw parallels and analogies as if this were a proof. And worse yet,
often the analogies are to nebulous, abstract unproven stuff to begin
with from TMO-world.

 What we know *for sure* is that having been informed
 of his error, Vaj first threw down a red herring of
 Fairfield get-rich-quick schemes, then when that   
 didn't work, attempted to stonewall and pretend that
 there indeed were such sites but that somehow I was
 too incompetent to find them.

Or he was playing with you. Lots of possible interpretations here. You
may know it for sure -- just as we all claim to believe our
interpreation of things, becasue they so clearly makes sense, it
obviously (to us) is correct.
 
 Now, I don't know what your standards are for blatant
 dishonesty, but the above more than meets mine, even
 if Vaj's original claim was just a dumb mistake.

Yes, your threshold is way way lower than mine.

 
 It's not like anybody here is testifying on such
 important matters.  But Vaj *does* testify about
 matters that are important to many here, quite a 
 few of whom seem to consider him to be a font of
 authoritative information.

And we all take what he says, as with what anyone else says, with some
grains of salt, based on OUR own appraisal of their tendency towards
veracity. How you evealuate Vaj's tendency towards veracity is really
of little consequence and interest to me. And I would guess most. We 
can and do make our own appraisals. 

 So it appears to me to be important to know that he
 is willing to lie in the service of his agenda, 

Or he sometimes plays with people, throws out some bait to see if the
age old patterns emerge.


 and
 accordingly take other pronouncements that he makes
 about MMY and TM and the TMO --and quite possibly
 other things as well--with a good-sized salt shaker
 handy.

We all have our salt shakers. But if anything, your focus on this
incident gives Vaj more credibiliy not less, in my view of 

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: FF 'deeksha', Kalki cult, Chalanda Ma

2005-11-13 Thread gullible fool
 
Has anyone here received deeksha from the Chalanda Sai
Ma people? 

--- dhamiltony2k5 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Brahman
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 wrote:
 
   feste37 wrote:
  
   Actually, the people in Fairfield who give
 deeksha
   don't charge for it. It's free for anyone who
 wants it,
   although you can leave a donation if you want.
 There is
   no pressure on anyone to give or to recruit. 
 
 Well, they do have the lingo down actually... 
 You'll be enlightened 
 and never need to do sadana anymore with enough
 deeksha.  Real sweet 
 and earnest people, are pretty
 vested and are going back for the next hit of
 darshan.
 
 
  
  i am curious how big of a following there is in
 fairfield
  now, taking this deeksha ... just a handful, or
 is it
  a growing trend now that TMO is faltering? Do they
 have
  their own Center in fairfield, for this Kalki
 deeksha thing?
  Or a website?
 
 Seems sort of like everyone is giving `deeksha'
 here.   Chalanda Sai 
 Ma saw Kalki giving deeksh some while ago so she
 thought `heck I can 
 do that as a modality' and started giving it and
 also then teaching 
 how to give `deeksha'.  There is a lot of 'energy
 work' here otherwise 
 of the similar modality.
 
 The irony is that one of the first weekends that the
 couple who were 
 back from India having learned it for thousands of
 dollars from Kalki, 
 the local Chalanda Ma devotees gave a weekend course
 in how to give 
 deeksha for 45 bucks to cover the cost..   In both
 cases it is sort of 
 a laying of hands on the head energy work in form.  
 From either the 
 Kalki people here or the Chalanda Ma people here it
 is nice.  Partly 
 it is nice because of the powerful room of spiritual
 practitioners who 
 will git together and be at these meetings.  It is a
 powerful 
 meditating group here.
 
 As far as money, the Chalanda Sai Ma and Kalki folks
 here skate a fine 
 line just to cover costs.  People here generally are
 weary (sensitive) 
 of the cult thing of raising money.  Also, a lot of
 the money that 
 used to be here just is not anymore. … Just us
 spiritual church mice 
 remain mostly.
 
 -Doug
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Earth turns around the sun not the other way: (How MMY sold a diamond (TM) for a handful of spinach...)

2005-11-13 Thread Rick Archer
Title: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Earth turns around the sun not the other way: (How MMY sold a diamond (TM) for a handful of spinach...)





on 11/13/05 11:19 AM, Jason Spock at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 
 The Himalayan masters have outdated ideas.
 
Just a single guy manages to float in the air,.. John Hagelin will be the next president of United States of America.

No, the fundamentalist Christians, who are a powerful voting block in this country, would go bananas and oppose him violently if necessary.






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Earth turns around the sun not the other way:

2005-11-13 Thread akasha_108
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:

 on 11/13/05 11:23 AM, akasha_108 at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Jason Spock
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  
   
  The Himalayan masters have outdated ideas.
   
  Just a single guy manages to float in the air,..  John Hagelin
  will be the next president of United States of America.
  
  And if just one monkey flies out my ass, I'll be on Letterman.
 
 I don't know. Do you think they'd let you demonstrate that on
network TV?


With Dave? Sure. He'd probably stage on the roof of the Ed Sullivan
Theatre (as he does a number of things) and have me aim at windows in
buildings across the street to see if I could hit them.

And just think of the ratings if I am also the one guy who levitates.
A twofer. John Haiglin would be there for running commentary. The
levitation is predicted by my 13d virtual loop, tunneling of quantum
worlds string theory. The monkey thing, we are still running some
ARIMA models to try to correctly predict that sort of thing. The fact
that the monkey is also flying, similtaneously with the emittor, 
shows the self referral, infinite looping parallelism of the universe.
But we need more research dollars. Here is my 800 number. 





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[FairfieldLife] Purusha and Prakriti

2005-11-13 Thread Rick Archer
Title: Purusha and Prakriti





From a friend:

 The crazy part of the whole story is that, He posted it into the group. My message was 'private' only to him.!!
 
First, let me begin with the concept of Ramana. He says that, Superiority  inferiority, there is duality. Duality is not real, so it belongs to illusion.

Here is this important excerpt from, The Cosmic Matrix by Rishi Kumar Mishra.

Quote,Purusha and Prakriti, two crucial tattwas in the cosmic matrix, have been grossly misunderstood and misinterpreted both in the philosophical and scientific domains. Likened to the male and female principles, their meaning has been imprisoned by gender stereotypes of western civilisation. Not only this caused havoc in the sciences discussed in the vedas and indexed in the geeta; but grave distortions have been injected into the understanding of ethics, law, customs, social arrangements and above all, male-female relationships based on the vedic principles as enunciated by the seer-scientists. The usage of the term `Purusha' to communicate the masculint gender is a narrow view of the word. By superimposing this meaning on other, more profound contexts, commentators and translators have obscured the real significance of this factor in the cosmic arrangement.
 
The relationship between Prakriti and Purusha is not hierarchical. The two are interwined, something perhaps difficult to comprehend in a cultural context, wherein all relations are based on Superiority and inferiority: between 'Humans and animals', 'men and women', 'followers of one profession and another', 'ruler and the ruled', and so forth. 

In contrast, the social arrangement flowing from, and based on the perceptions of the seer-scientists is in harmony with the cosmic balance. This indicates that all sentient and inanimate beings, all species and all sexes -- in fact, all entities and individuals -- are bound to each other and among themselves in a comprehensive and complex matrix of interdependence.

The Sun, moon and earth have different functions and varying locations on the cosmic-canvas, but are not related to each other in a hierarchical fashion. Various dimensions of their relationship need to be examined in depth and applied creatively in order to establish an order of harmony and happiness in the Universe. Such an order would not be based on concepts of superiority and inferiority', but on relationships of interdependence. UnQuote
 
 In other words, 'Without a servant, there is no master', 'Without a disciple, there is no guru', 'without a student, there is no teacher', 'without some subjects, there is no king'. etc etc






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Earth turns around the sun not the other way: (How MMY sold a diamond (TM) f

2005-11-13 Thread Kenny H
I think you are sorely mistaken. I don't think many would even take
notice of someone floating in the air. I mean who cares, really? What
does it have to do with the bulk of people's lives who are primarily
concerned with such mundane things like: 

*earning a living
*paying for food
*health insurance
*gasoline approaching $3/gallon
*an administration trying to screw with Social Security
*also trying to rewrite the tax code and screw people out of their
mortgage deduction
to name a few.

Add paying $2500 to learn TM so they can spend the next 35 years
trying to float? I don't think so. 

kh



 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 on 11/13/05 11:19 AM, Jason Spock at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
   
  The Himalayan masters have outdated ideas.
   
  Just a single guy manages to float in the air,..  John Hagelin
will be the
  next president of United States of America.
   
 No, the fundamentalist Christians, who are a powerful voting block
in this
 country, would go bananas and oppose him violently if necessary.







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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Earth turns around the sun not the other way: (How MMY sold a diamond (TM) f

2005-11-13 Thread Rick Archer
Probably most people wouldn't believe it. There are some amazing magic
tricks out there, like guys walking through plate glass windows. People know
it's a trick even though they can't imagine how it's done. People would
assume the same with levitation, even if were done in their living room.
David Blaine (http://www.davidblaine.com) levitates on NYC sidewalks, which
freaks people out, but they don't elect him president.


on 11/13/05 1:14 PM, Kenny H at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 I think you are sorely mistaken. I don't think many would even take
 notice of someone floating in the air. I mean who cares, really? What
 does it have to do with the bulk of people's lives who are primarily
 concerned with such mundane things like:
 
 *earning a living
 *paying for food
 *health insurance
 *gasoline approaching $3/gallon
 *an administration trying to screw with Social Security
 *also trying to rewrite the tax code and screw people out of their
 mortgage deduction
 to name a few.
 
 Add paying $2500 to learn TM so they can spend the next 35 years
 trying to float? I don't think so.
 
 kh




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[FairfieldLife] Science will *never* prove the existence of God!

2005-11-13 Thread wmurphy77
That proof can only be had thru *direct* experience in the temple of 
meditation! I think you all know that here; the instruments of science 
are too crude. And no one can prove God to another, they can only prove 
it to themselves by direct experience, and yes, MMY has blessed us with 
that experience thru TM.  Billyg.






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[FairfieldLife] Samadhi meditation rare...in any discipline!

2005-11-13 Thread wmurphy77
Most meditators (TM) don't transcend to samadhi, they transcend, yes, 
but not to *pure* consciousness or savikalpa samadhi (temporary 
enlightenment).  That's why MMY always talks about, a simple ray of the 
sun, etc. brings the light, surely if you transcended to pure 
consciousness, Sat Chit Ananda, don't you think you would remember? 
It's something you would *NEVER* forget! No thoughts, No mantra and No 
bliss=NO SAMADHI! (ok, maybe just a taste, certainly not the full noon 
day sun). Deal with it:-)






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Earth turns around the sun not the other way: (How MMY sold a diamond (TM) f

2005-11-13 Thread akasha_108
Kenny H [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 *also trying to rewrite the tax code and screw people out of their
 mortgage deduction

And who is getting screwed out of thier mortgage deduction? Under the
proposal, the average home owner will maintian their full
deductiblity. And those who are unable to deduct it now, because they
 dont save enough by itemizing will be able to deduct it. 

Who will lose part of their deduction? The upper third or so on the
wealth scale. You seem overly concerned for these poor souls. First,
they will retain dudutability up to about the average price home
regionally. Thus in California, those with a million dollar home,
would, under the proposal, be only be able deduct the mortgage
interest equivalent to about a $400-500,000 home. And yet, in balance,
a lot of these taax payers are not currently able to deduct for such,
because at their incomes the Alternative Minimum Tax (AMT) kicks in.
But under  the proposal, AMT will be killed, thus the upper third or
tax payers trade part of their mortgage deduction for elimination of
the onerous AMT. 

So don't cry too hard for these upper 1/3 of taxpayers who will be
affected. (Which seems odd for you -- to cry for such (mostly
Republicans), but I guess its just compassion bubbling out for all of
God's creatures.) Their taxes  will be pretty much uneffected as the
AMT gains will balance out the partial mortgage deducability loss. 

And the lower 2/3s of tax payers will be generally uneffected -- or
will actually gain -- by being able to deduct mortgage interest when
they can't now. 

And the overall effect will be to make housing more affordable. A good
thing, yes?

What is interesting is your implication that mortgage interest
deductions is an entitlement. It is a poor policy economically, having
been a huge bonanza of a tax shelter for the rich and has contributed
to current housing being out of reach for 85% of potential buyers.

An effect will be that less money will be sunk into fancy show-off
houses and more into capital investments which will raise productivity
and wage rates for all. A good thing, yes?









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[FairfieldLife] Re: The Mahesh Kozlowski Effect

2005-11-13 Thread feste37
From my 35+ years in and around the movement, I've not observed this. I think 
you could argue that the reverse is true, at least as far as your first point 
is 
concerned. A lot of TM teachers and governors are not preoccupied with 
making money at all, whether quickly or slowly. They have a more spiritual 
orientation to life and are not so concerned with the accumulation of material 
things. The gullibility and stupidity you ascribe to them seems unfair, to say 
the least. 

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, akasha_108 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:



 From I have seen in 35+ years,in and around the movement:
 
 1) TM teachers and govs are often preoccupied with making money quickly.
 
 2) TM teachers and govs are often open to magical thinking, often 
 lack much critical evaluation, logic and analytical skills,  and
 therefore are vulnerable to get-rich-quick schemes.  
 
 3) TM teachers and govs are often have talked the talk of incredible
 undemonstrated stuff for so long, using TM slogans and lingo, that BS
  can often make great sense to them hey its just like . They do
 draw parallels and analogies as if this were a proof. And worse yet,
 often the analogies are to nebulous, abstract unproven stuff to begin
 with from TMO-world.
 






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Re: [FairfieldLife] Samadhi meditation rare...in any discipline!

2005-11-13 Thread Vaj

On Nov 13, 2005, at 2:47 PM, wmurphy77 wrote:

 Most meditators (TM) don't transcend to samadhi, they transcend, yes,
 but not to *pure* consciousness or savikalpa samadhi (temporary
 enlightenment).  That's why MMY always talks about, a simple ray of  
 the
 sun, etc. brings the light, surely if you transcended to pure
 consciousness, Sat Chit Ananda, don't you think you would remember?
 It's something you would *NEVER* forget! No thoughts, No mantra and No
 bliss=NO SAMADHI! (ok, maybe just a taste, certainly not the full noon
 day sun). Deal with it:-)


Thank you, nicely said!


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[FairfieldLife] Article on Indian's Liberalized Youth

2005-11-13 Thread Bhairitu
Interesting article on zippies as they are called:
http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/chronicle/archive/2005/11/13/ING2HFMG9J1.DTL

- Bhairitu



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[FairfieldLife] Re: The Mahesh Kozlowski Effect

2005-11-13 Thread akasha_108
You are correct in that in rereading what I wrote, I should have said
something like a visible minority of TM teachers and govs are often
preoccupied 

I didn't mean to say all TM teachers are like that -- I wrote it too
hastily. I agree with you A lot of TM teachers and governors are not
preoccupied with making money at all, whether quickly or slowly. The
majority. 

My point is that I have seen a lot of others who reflect the
characteristics of my points. And it appears to me a higher proportion
than found in society as a whole, though maybe I tend to hang with
maintstream career types and my vision is skewed. There certainly is a
lot of mojo in the lottery. Though I don't personally know many people
who buy such lousy odds gambles.

And my personal experience with easy money teachers  was in the 70's
and then looking a bit at a distance in the 80's and 90's -- with
periodic personal encounters that appeared to confirm what I was
seeing and hearing from afar. 

And FF appears to have had its share, actually a higher share than
mainstream society from what I can tell, of scam artists, easy money
schemes etc. Along with a lot of hard working people in intelligently
concieved businesses. 

So sorry if my observations were overgeneralized, but for a segment of
teachers, I still believe its a fair characterization.

 
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, feste37 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 From my 35+ years in and around the movement, I've not observed
this. I think you could argue that the reverse is true, at least as
far as your first point is  concerned. A lot of TM teachers and
governors are not preoccupied with  making money at all, whether
quickly or slowly. They have a more spiritual  orientation to life and
are not so concerned with the accumulation of material 
 things. The gullibility and stupidity you ascribe to them seems
unfair, to say  the least. 
 
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, akasha_108 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
 
 
  From I have seen in 35+ years,in and around the movement:
  
  1) TM teachers and govs are often preoccupied with making money
quickly.
  
  2) TM teachers and govs are often open to magical thinking,
often lack much critical evaluation, logic and analytical skills,  and
therefore are vulnerable to get-rich-quick schemes.  
  
  3) TM teachers and govs are often have talked the talk of
incredible undemonstrated stuff for so long, using TM slogans and
lingo, that BS can often make great sense to them hey its just like
. They do draw parallels and analogies as if this were a proof.
And worse yet, often the analogies are to nebulous, abstract unproven
stuff to begin with from TMO-world.






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Re: [FairfieldLife] Samadhi meditation rare...in any discipline!

2005-11-13 Thread Peter


--- wmurphy77 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Most meditators (TM) don't transcend to samadhi,
 they transcend, yes, 
 but not to *pure* consciousness or savikalpa samadhi
 (temporary 
 enlightenment).

Completely disagree with you. 

 That's why MMY always talks about,
 a simple ray of the 
 sun, etc. brings the light, surely if you
 transcended to pure 
 consciousness, Sat Chit Ananda, don't you think you
 would remember?

No, you would not remember pure transcendence unless
the mind was functioning along with that transcendence
and that would be CC. Transcendence is no mantra, no
thought. It is that gap between thoughts in meditation
when the mind completely stops and the continuity of
the thought process is broken as it transcends and
then comes out into a completely different thought
stream. It is then that the mind notices the
difference between the thought streams and recognizes
the transcendent as a gap. People are transcending
all the time in TM, it's just that the mind thinks
that it is supposed to have some sort of
experience.` 

 
snip
 
 
 
 
 
 
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[FairfieldLife] Re: Earth turns around the sun not the other way: (How MMY sold a diamond (TM) f

2005-11-13 Thread Kenny H
Maybe to most of what you have written
However, I don't consider $350,000+ for an 800-1000 sq. foot 2 br/1
bath bungalow  (here in Sacramento) in a lousy neighborhood
affordable. Go a few blocks over and the same houses are already at
half a million. Go a bit further south towards the Bay Area or east
towards Tahoe and you start getting to the $500,000+ range for a
small-normal size home, not the estate one would have imagined for
this kind of money.  




 Do you know that the cost of --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com,
akasha_108 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Kenny H [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
  *also trying to rewrite the tax code and screw people out of their
  mortgage deduction
 
 And who is getting screwed out of thier mortgage deduction? Under the
 proposal, the average home owner will maintian their full
 deductiblity. And those who are unable to deduct it now, because they
  dont save enough by itemizing will be able to deduct it. 
 
 Who will lose part of their deduction? The upper third or so on the
 wealth scale. You seem overly concerned for these poor souls. First,
 they will retain dudutability up to about the average price home
 regionally. Thus in California, those with a million dollar home,
 would, under the proposal, be only be able deduct the mortgage
 interest equivalent to about a $400-500,000 home. And yet, in balance,
 a lot of these taax payers are not currently able to deduct for such,
 because at their incomes the Alternative Minimum Tax (AMT) kicks in.
 But under  the proposal, AMT will be killed, thus the upper third or
 tax payers trade part of their mortgage deduction for elimination of
 the onerous AMT. 
 
 So don't cry too hard for these upper 1/3 of taxpayers who will be
 affected. (Which seems odd for you -- to cry for such (mostly
 Republicans), but I guess its just compassion bubbling out for all of
 God's creatures.) Their taxes  will be pretty much uneffected as the
 AMT gains will balance out the partial mortgage deducability loss. 
 
 And the lower 2/3s of tax payers will be generally uneffected -- or
 will actually gain -- by being able to deduct mortgage interest when
 they can't now. 
 
 And the overall effect will be to make housing more affordable. A good
 thing, yes?
 
 What is interesting is your implication that mortgage interest
 deductions is an entitlement. It is a poor policy economically, having
 been a huge bonanza of a tax shelter for the rich and has contributed
 to current housing being out of reach for 85% of potential buyers.
 
 An effect will be that less money will be sunk into fancy show-off
 houses and more into capital investments which will raise productivity
 and wage rates for all. A good thing, yes?








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[FairfieldLife] Re: Earth turns around the sun not the other way: (How MMY sold a diamond (TM) f

2005-11-13 Thread akasha_108
I know, California real estate is unreal (literally IMO and is not
stable at current levels.) Thats one reason I left the state, having
been born, raised, educated and careered there. Housing prices are
just in fairyland compared to many other nice areas. And with
broadband internet being most everywhere (and soon to be wireless, and
literally EVERYWHERE, location is less and less important IMO,
particularly if you can make a living not tied physically to a large
hub business center.)

Compare a $500,000 or million dollar home in SF, San Diego or Sac to
one in FF. Its a joke.

But the mortgage deduction still applies to the 350k bungalow. The
proposals are for it to be partially taken away for the kind of basic
$million middle class home close to it.

And long run, thats a good thing, it will help bring housing and
affordability back into synch. 15% affordibility rates are crazy and
unsustainable.



--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Kenny H [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Maybe to most of what you have written
 However, I don't consider $350,000+ for an 800-1000 sq. foot 2 br/1
 bath bungalow  (here in Sacramento) in a lousy neighborhood
 affordable. Go a few blocks over and the same houses are already at
 half a million. Go a bit further south towards the Bay Area or east
 towards Tahoe and you start getting to the $500,000+ range for a
 small-normal size home, not the estate one would have imagined for
 this kind of money.  
 
 
 
 
  Do you know that the cost of --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com,
 akasha_108 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
  Kenny H [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  
   *also trying to rewrite the tax code and screw people out of their
   mortgage deduction
  
  And who is getting screwed out of thier mortgage deduction? Under the
  proposal, the average home owner will maintian their full
  deductiblity. And those who are unable to deduct it now, because they
   dont save enough by itemizing will be able to deduct it. 
  
  Who will lose part of their deduction? The upper third or so on the
  wealth scale. You seem overly concerned for these poor souls. First,
  they will retain dudutability up to about the average price home
  regionally. Thus in California, those with a million dollar home,
  would, under the proposal, be only be able deduct the mortgage
  interest equivalent to about a $400-500,000 home. And yet, in balance,
  a lot of these taax payers are not currently able to deduct for such,
  because at their incomes the Alternative Minimum Tax (AMT) kicks in.
  But under  the proposal, AMT will be killed, thus the upper third or
  tax payers trade part of their mortgage deduction for elimination of
  the onerous AMT. 
  
  So don't cry too hard for these upper 1/3 of taxpayers who will be
  affected. (Which seems odd for you -- to cry for such (mostly
  Republicans), but I guess its just compassion bubbling out for all of
  God's creatures.) Their taxes  will be pretty much uneffected as the
  AMT gains will balance out the partial mortgage deducability loss. 
  
  And the lower 2/3s of tax payers will be generally uneffected -- or
  will actually gain -- by being able to deduct mortgage interest when
  they can't now. 
  
  And the overall effect will be to make housing more affordable. A good
  thing, yes?
  
  What is interesting is your implication that mortgage interest
  deductions is an entitlement. It is a poor policy economically, having
  been a huge bonanza of a tax shelter for the rich and has contributed
  to current housing being out of reach for 85% of potential buyers.
  
  An effect will be that less money will be sunk into fancy show-off
  houses and more into capital investments which will raise productivity
  and wage rates for all. A good thing, yes?
 








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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: The Mahesh Kozlowski Effect

2005-11-13 Thread Vaj

On Nov 13, 2005, at 1:42 PM, akasha_108 wrote:


 ...

 (The point of the exercise,
 of course, having been to suggest that TMers are
 greedily preoccupied with making money and thus
 vulnerable to get-rich-quick schemes, especially if
 they're advertised using TM slogans.)

 From I have seen in 35+ years,in and around the movement:

 1) TM teachers and govs are often preoccupied with making money  
 quickly.

 2) TM teachers and govs are often open to magical thinking, often
 lack much critical evaluation, logic and analytical skills,  and
 therefore are vulnerable to get-rich-quick schemes.

 3) TM teachers and govs are often have talked the talk of incredible
 undemonstrated stuff for so long, using TM slogans and lingo, that BS
  can often make great sense to them hey its just like . They do
 draw parallels and analogies as if this were a proof. And worse yet,
 often the analogies are to nebulous, abstract unproven stuff to begin
 with from TMO-world.

Precisely. This was one of the points I've made to Judy--this is a  
well-known dynamic IF you were in those circles. It would appear she  
is not familiar with this (or is pretending not to be), so what is  
there to discuss? You either've seen this or you haven't. And much of  
this may be past now that the TMO is essentially dying and little or  
no new blood coming in.



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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: The Mahesh Kozlowski Effect

2005-11-13 Thread Vaj

On Nov 13, 2005, at 11:43 AM, akasha_108 wrote:

 Then I remember your correction: it wasn't a bunch of quick rich
 schemes after all, it was Fred G.s book. Curious, I did a search
 myself. The first page was filled with what looked like get rich quick
 schemes based on do less accomplish more (or do nothing accomplish
 everything). Upon closer examination, I saw they all related to Fred's
 book.

Yes. However it seems this work has spawned numerous other splinter  
groups--thus the large number of hits on google, etc. Nonetheless  
Judy doesn't believe (or simply doesn't want to believe) that this is  
a 'get rich quick scheme, thus there is no need to discuss further if  
she has solidified her belief. I hesitate to even mention this  
because it will simply will start a new chain of endless responses  
sigh.

In addition there were numerous get-rick-quick schemes in the past,  
when the boomer generation was much younger, but primarily among  
business types.

You think this stuff is obsessional if it goes on a couple of months?  
Try watching over years. At least a rat in a maze gets shocked a  
couple of times and stops.



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[FairfieldLife] Re: The Mahesh Kozlowski Effect

2005-11-13 Thread akasha_108
authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

akasha_108 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 

 but maybe they 
  are students of the behavioral sciences and love to see small 
  pieces of bait repeatedly taken and watch the predictable drama 
  unfold.
 

...
 But it's clearly not what Vaj was doing, if you
 go back and actually read his posts.

And yet you have taken the bait (non-existant as you seem to think it is).

 
 Yeah, but we know this for sure.  I'm reporting
 what he actually *said*, you see.

No, you are reporting your interpretation of what he said. 

 
   Now, I don't know what your standards are for blatant
   dishonesty, but the above more than meets mine, even
   if Vaj's original claim was just a dumb mistake.
  
  Yes, your threshold is way way lower than mine.
 
 I'm sorry to hear that.  Now we know you can't
 be trusted either.

Wow, I am now thrown in to pit with all the other liars and total
scoundrels, just because I have a different standard than you for
trivial vs substantial things to worry about. Oh, please don't report
me to the Thought Police oh kind and worthy Commissaress.


 
 As it happens, though, as I just pointed out, 
 many people here seem to take everything Vaj
 says as gospel.

HAHAHA. I don't think even Vaj takes everthing hes says as Gospel.
 
Any hands? Who among us takes everything Vaj says as Gospel? (And if
you do, I have a wonderful little seminar on making millions in 3
weeks, that I invite you to attend.)

 
   So it appears to me to be important to know that he
   is willing to lie in the service of his agenda, 

And  what is his agenda?



 
   I'm happy to have it revealed that I am intolerant
   of deliberate falsehood.  
  
  Or your perception of deliberate falsehood. Belief doesn't
  neessarily make it (deliberate falsehood) so.
 
 Yeah, this isn't belief; we have the evidence of
 his own words, you see.


Thats what is so fascinating. You actually beleive you can absolutely
impute his motive from words words. We have words that he uttered
(trivial, IMO) falsehoods. We do not have words that PROVE his
motives. His motives are  your interpretation of what he said. 

 
 *Even if* he were just trying to get a rise out of me--
 which there are excellent reasons to think was not the
 case--he was still perpetrating a deliberate falsehood.
 
 The first time around, it *could* have been a mistake--
 not likely, but possible.  His *defense* was obviously
 intentionally false, on its face.

No, you are reporting your interpretation of what he said. 
  


 Of course, he could easily come forward now, claim
 he was just baiting me in his defense, and explain
 that he had initially made an error--that is, if he
 wanted to set the record straight.
 
 I'm guessing he doesn't, but we'll see.


Come on down Vaj! 









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[FairfieldLife] Re: Samadhi meditation rare...in any discipline!

2005-11-13 Thread wmurphy77
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
 No, you would not remember pure transcendence unless
 the mind was functioning along with that transcendence
 and that would be CC.

What do you think the *infusion* of *Being* is, if not bliss?




 Transcendence is no mantra, no
 thought. It is that gap between thoughts in meditation
 when the mind completely stops and the continuity of
 the thought process is broken as it transcends and
 then comes out into a completely different thought
 stream. It is then that the mind notices the
 difference between the thought streams and recognizes
 the transcendent as a gap. People are transcending
 all the time in TM, it's just that the mind thinks
 that it is supposed to have some sort of
 experience.`

The nature of the Being is pure bliss (happiness). 






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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: The Mahesh Kozlowski Effect

2005-11-13 Thread Vaj

On Nov 13, 2005, at 4:23 PM, akasha_108 wrote:

 HAHAHA. I don't think even Vaj takes everthing hes says as Gospel.


Only the stuff the Burning Bush tells me to. But that book won't be  
released until 2012.


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[FairfieldLife] MUM IT grads get temp jobs at 521 companies

2005-11-13 Thread bbrigante
http://tinyurl.com/bnf44





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[FairfieldLife] Re: The Mahesh Kozlowski Effect

2005-11-13 Thread akasha_108
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 
 On Nov 13, 2005, at 4:23 PM, akasha_108 wrote:
 
  HAHAHA. I don't think even Vaj takes everthing hes says as Gospel.
 
 
 Only the stuff the Burning Bush tells me to. But that book won't be  
 released until 2012.


Only George I presume. Or are you burning the whole family at the stake?







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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: The Mahesh Kozlowski Effect

2005-11-13 Thread Vaj

On Nov 13, 2005, at 4:28 PM, akasha_108 wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:


 On Nov 13, 2005, at 4:23 PM, akasha_108 wrote:

 HAHAHA. I don't think even Vaj takes everthing hes says as Gospel.


 Only the stuff the Burning Bush tells me to. But that book won't be
 released until 2012.


 Only George I presume. Or are you burning the whole family at the  
 stake?

We threw in Ann Coulter for good measure.



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[FairfieldLife] Re: The Mahesh Kozlowski Effect

2005-11-13 Thread akasha_108
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 
 On Nov 13, 2005, at 4:23 PM, akasha_108 wrote:
 
  HAHAHA. I don't think even Vaj takes everthing hes says as Gospel.
 
 
 Only the stuff the Burning Bush tells me to. But that book won't be  
 released until 2012.


I saw the movie, wide screen version of the 10 commandments at a
tender impressionable age. The scene I most remember was the burning
bush. It was like, yeah, thats worth finding

What is your take on the burning bush? Most interpretations I have
heard are kundalini rising and illuminating the web of channels and
energy pathways, particularly the crown chakra, which is said to
resemble a burning bush. And it is from this illumined state, the word
of god is heard. 








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[FairfieldLife] Re: The Mahesh Kozlowski Effect

2005-11-13 Thread akasha_108
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 
 On Nov 13, 2005, at 4:28 PM, akasha_108 wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
 
  On Nov 13, 2005, at 4:23 PM, akasha_108 wrote:
 
  HAHAHA. I don't think even Vaj takes everthing hes says as Gospel.
 
 
  Only the stuff the Burning Bush tells me to. But that book won't be
  released until 2012.
 
 
  Only George I presume. Or are you burning the whole family at the  
  stake?
 
 We threw in Ann Coulter for good measure.


Ah, I thought I heard something cackling in the fire.

(its funny though. She hangs with Bill Maher sometimes. On his show,
she laughs at his pot jokes -- and smiles at strong indendos about the
two of them getting it on. Does she take a somewhat different view
from her conservative brethen on personal freedom issues?
Fornication? Drugs? 







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[FairfieldLife] Re: The Mahesh Kozlowski Effect

2005-11-13 Thread akasha_108
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, akasha_108 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
  
  On Nov 13, 2005, at 4:23 PM, akasha_108 wrote:
  
   HAHAHA. I don't think even Vaj takes everthing hes says as Gospel.
  
  
  Only the stuff the Burning Bush tells me to. But that book won't be  
  released until 2012.
 
 
 I saw the movie, wide screen version of the 10 commandments at a
 tender impressionable age. The scene I most remember was the burning
 bush. It was like, yeah, thats worth finding
 
 What is your take on the burning bush? Most interpretations I have
 heard are kundalini rising and illuminating the web of channels and
 energy pathways, particularly the crown chakra, which is said to
 resemble a burning bush. And it is from this illumined state, the word
 of god is heard.

Charlston Heston saw the burning bush, heard the word of god, and
became president of the NRA. Go figure.









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[FairfieldLife] A day in the life of a True Believer

2005-11-13 Thread jim_flanegin
7:45AM Awake. Darn! Overslept again, due to lack of alarm clock. All 
is bliss, all is bliss...take cold shower to eliminate thoughts of 
sex. Scrape tongue.
 
8:00AM settle down to do program. 
9:00AM still doing program.

9:16AM phone rings. Don't answer it. Supervisor from MAPI store 
calls, sounding both polite and tense, wondering where I am, since 
this is the fourth time this month I am late. I think, Doing 
program is our most important work. 

All is bliss, all is bliss, start to get headache in middle of 
siddhis program. Foot goes to sleep. Pins and needles. All is bliss, 
all is bliss- Ow! Bumped butt really hard! Make note to buy new foam 
mattress for flying...
9:50AM Start to get thoughts of sex during lie down after flying. 
Quick, read sutras!!!

10:10AM Drinking MV tea, eating wheat-free toast and soy milk and 
kashi cereal. Finished. Guiltily wolf down two snickers bars. Scrape 
tongue again. All is bliss, all is bliss. Leave house through south 
entrance. Ooops!!! Pray to Guru Dev, walk back inside and leave 
through east entrance.

10:20AM Still trying to start 1981 Pontiac Sunbird. Problem 
compounded by salvation army polyester pants not warm enough for 
winter time. This world is so ignorant!!!... Finally car starts, 
start to back out of driveway. Suddenly Mercedes with tinted glass 
whips around corner. I slam on brakes, Jai Guru Dev! [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Fcker!!! I half-shout at the ignorant rakshasa bastard... all is 
bliss all is bliss all is bliss...

10:45AM Pull into parking lot of MAPI store, hurry inside, eyes 
downcast. Jai Guru Dev, Fred! says my boss. Jai Guru Dev, Roger 
I reply, and hurry to the back of the store, where I am hoping to 
brew some vata tea, to counteract my massive sugar rush from the 
snickers bars. All is bliss all is bliss all is bliss...

Noon. Finish selling coral beads, 2 big jars of honey, a Bhagavad 
Gita hardcover book, and 5 MAPI soy protein candy bars to a cute 
white girl in a dhoti. Really cute...all is bliss all is bliss all 
is bliss...

12:15AM The store staff and I do a noon meditation in the back room. 
Bhakti (birth name David...) locks his hands into some kind of mudra 
as he meditates. After we all come out, Roger begins to argue with 
Bhakti about whether he is following Maharishi by holding his hands 
that way while meditating. Bhakti just smiles at him, though I 
notice he slams the door of the meditation room when he leaves, with 
a harsh little laugh. Roger writes something down but I can't see it.

While eating my burnt fried tofu and mung beans for lunch, I start 
to have the most blissful experience. I.Am.Centered.In.Being. Wow! 
Waves of bliss wash over me! I feel more enlightened than anyone in 
the store! This is great! Jai Guru Dev! I can feel my face flushing, 
and a deep blissful silence pervades my...Oh SH*T!! Some asshole kid 
knocked over the incense display...again!

Jaigurudev all is bliss all is bliss...I'm hoping that the packs of 
incense that broke can be returned. Last time we sent them back to 
Devi Products, they weren't too happy about it. 

After about ten minutes, all is back to normal, except for yet 
another ding on Ganesh's trunk at the top of the display. All is 
bliss all is bliss all is bliss. I settle down, and pour myself my 
eighth cup of vata tea, and dip into my secret stash of mm's...just 
picking out the yellow ones.  

2:00PM It is quiet at the store. Roger is reading Maharishi's 
translation of the Gita, again. It is such 
wonderful...Knowledge...Oh, the...Knowledge. Yeah...Chapter 2, verse 
45: Be.Without.The.Three.Gunas. Krishna, Man…that is so cool. Roger 
starts to explain it, and that makes everyone in the store feel 
really good. Jai Guru Dev! I wonder if the Purusha men will be at 
group program tonight. They are here after being with Maharishi. I 
could really feel the bliss radiating from them last night. They are 
s enlightened! 

2:30PM Roger calls me into his office (the veggie storage room) and 
says that I can't go on the Almost Savoring Enlightenment course 
that starts next week. I know it is a test from the Absolute. I am 
very peaceful and take the decision with equanimity. It is what the 
Master wants. Jai Guru Dev...all is bliss all is bliss all is 
bliss...I think I was in CC earlier today. I'm pretty sure I was 
witnessing! 

God, if only the ignorant world would recognize this precious, 
blessed knowledge we are so 
fortunatetoreceivefromMaharishiMaheshYogi...He IS divine. Too bad I 
couldn't convince my dad about that, living his corporate darkness 
f*cking ignorant all is bliss all is bliss all is bliss. At 
least I have radiated enough enlightenment so that he keeps sending 
me checks ... Cleansing the family dharma. All is bliss all is bliss 
all is bliss...







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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: The Mahesh Kozlowski Effect

2005-11-13 Thread Vaj

On Nov 13, 2005, at 4:32 PM, akasha_108 wrote:

 What is your take on the burning bush? Most interpretations I have
 heard are kundalini rising and illuminating the web of channels and
 energy pathways, particularly the crown chakra, which is said to
 resemble a burning bush. And it is from this illumined state, the word
 of god is heard.

According to the Kabbalah, the whole exodus trip is about the journey  
of the soul from bondage or Mizraim (Egypt) to the higher planes.  
For example the parting of the Red Sea is transition from one plane  
to another. Eventually Moseh ascends Mount Sinai and this is the  
closest you can come to God/HaShem and still live. You cannot look at  
God and live--this is the Kabbalistic idea of isplakaria or  
reflection, you must look at God in a mirror rather than face-to- 
face. The burning bush is the mirror. In Sri Vidya this would be the  
vimarsha-shakti--the energy of the mirror at the centermost triangle  
of the Sri Chakra. It's the power behind phenomenal appearances.



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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: The Mahesh Kozlowski Effect

2005-11-13 Thread Vaj

On Nov 13, 2005, at 4:37 PM, akasha_108 wrote:

 Ah, I thought I heard something cackling in the fire.

 (its funny though. She hangs with Bill Maher sometimes. On his show,
 she laughs at his pot jokes -- and smiles at strong indendos about the
 two of them getting it on. Does she take a somewhat different view
 from her conservative brethen on personal freedom issues?
 Fornication? Drugs?

Not sure but I always found her very refreshing on that show.



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[FairfieldLife] Re: The Mahesh Kozlowski Effect

2005-11-13 Thread akasha_108
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 
 On Nov 13, 2005, at 4:37 PM, akasha_108 wrote:
 
  Ah, I thought I heard something cackling in the fire.
 
  (its funny though. She hangs with Bill Maher sometimes. On his show,
  she laughs at his pot jokes -- and smiles at strong indendos about the
  two of them getting it on. Does she take a somewhat different view
  from her conservative brethen on personal freedom issues?
  Fornication? Drugs?
 
 Not sure but I always found her very refreshing on that show.


Yea, its almost like she is human. Shes funny, bright, witty. Laughs a
lot. 

Then you see her on a cable news show appearance and she is spitting
venom and fire. 








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[FairfieldLife] Re: The Mahesh Kozlowski Effect

2005-11-13 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 
 On Nov 13, 2005, at 1:42 PM, akasha_108 wrote:
 
 
  ...
 
  (The point of the exercise,
  of course, having been to suggest that TMers are
  greedily preoccupied with making money and thus
  vulnerable to get-rich-quick schemes, especially if
  they're advertised using TM slogans.)
 
  From I have seen in 35+ years,in and around the movement:
 
  1) TM teachers and govs are often preoccupied with making money  
  quickly.
 
  2) TM teachers and govs are often open to magical thinking, 
often
  lack much critical evaluation, logic and analytical skills,  and
  therefore are vulnerable to get-rich-quick schemes.
 
  3) TM teachers and govs are often have talked the talk of 
incredible
  undemonstrated stuff for so long, using TM slogans and lingo, 
that BS
   can often make great sense to them hey its just like . 
They do
  draw parallels and analogies as if this were a proof. And worse 
yet,
  often the analogies are to nebulous, abstract unproven stuff to 
begin
  with from TMO-world.
 
 Precisely. This was one of the points I've made to Judy--this is a  
 well-known dynamic IF you were in those circles. It would appear
 she is not familiar with this (or is pretending not to be), so what 
 is there to discuss?

Bullshit.  As Vaj well knows, I never expressed an
opinion about it one way or the other, because it had
nothing to do with his false claim about the Web
sites.  It was a red herring he introduced to distract
attention from the fact that he couldn't produce URLs
of the nonexistent sites he had made up out of whole
cloth.

Just one more example of dishonesty from Vaj.






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[FairfieldLife] Re: The Mahesh Kozlowski Effect

2005-11-13 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 
 On Nov 13, 2005, at 11:43 AM, akasha_108 wrote:
 
  Then I remember your correction: it wasn't a bunch of quick rich
  schemes after all, it was Fred G.s book. Curious, I did a search
  myself. The first page was filled with what looked like get rich
  quick schemes based on do less accomplish more (or do nothing 
  accomplish everything). Upon closer examination, I saw they all 
  related to Fred's book.
 
 Yes. However it seems this work has spawned numerous other 
 splinter groups--thus the large number of hits on google, etc.

No, it hasn't.  Cite one.
 
 Nonetheless Judy doesn't believe (or simply doesn't want to 
 believe) that this is a 'get rich quick scheme, thus there is no 
 need to discuss further if she has solidified her belief. I 
 hesitate to even mention this because it will simply will start a 
 new chain of endless responses sigh.

Yes, I'll usually respond to lies, Vaj.

The book is *not* a get-rich-quick scheme, not
even remotely, as anybody can tell by reading
the descriptions.  It isn't a matter of belief
or even opinion.  You are misrepresenting the
facts.  It's just that simple, and just that ugly.

 In addition there were numerous get-rick-quick schemes in the 
 past, when the boomer generation was much younger, but primarily 
 among business types.
 
 You think this stuff is obsessional if it goes on a couple of 
 months? Try watching over years. At least a rat in a maze gets 
 shocked a couple of times and stops.

So why don't you stop, Vaj?  If you didn't continue
to lie, I wouldn't keep calling you on it, and you
wouldn't have to keep trying to weasel out of the
lies.







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[FairfieldLife] Re: The Mahesh Kozlowski Effect

2005-11-13 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, akasha_108 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, akasha_108 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  
   
   On Nov 13, 2005, at 4:23 PM, akasha_108 wrote:
   
HAHAHA. I don't think even Vaj takes everthing hes says as 
Gospel.
   
   
   Only the stuff the Burning Bush tells me to. But that book 
won't be  
   released until 2012.
  
  
  I saw the movie, wide screen version of the 10 commandments at a
  tender impressionable age. The scene I most remember was the 
burning
  bush. It was like, yeah, thats worth finding
  
  What is your take on the burning bush? Most interpretations I have
  heard are kundalini rising and illuminating the web of channels 
and
  energy pathways, particularly the crown chakra, which is said to
  resemble a burning bush. And it is from this illumined state, the 
word
  of god is heard.
 
 Charlston Heston saw the burning bush, heard the word of god, and
 became president of the NRA. Go figure.

And then developed Alzheimer's.






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Is Paris Burning?

2005-11-13 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Kenny H [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 Well, fwiw, I just spoke with my 27 year old niece who lives in the
 heart of Paris and she said that what is actually going on over there
 is nothing like the press here in the U.S. has made it out to be. She
 recently watched CNN and could not believe how exaggerated they made
 it out to be. And that the reporter from CNN completely ignored the
 French person he was interviewing and kept hypersensationalizing it,
 in spite of what was being said straight from someone who lives 
there.

So what *is* happening in Paris?






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Re: [FairfieldLife] Earth turns around the sun not the other way: (How MMY sold a diamond (TM) for a handful of spinach...)

2005-11-13 Thread Hagen J. Holtz







  
  
  
  
  
  
   dhyana ("gliding") 
  
   Are they really Gliding.??
  The mind is always by its 
  functioning based on the principle of three gunas: Rishi - Davata- 
  Chanddhas
  
  "I am Hagen" (subject - 
  awareness - object) or "You question me" etc.. There is nothing les than 
  three. If you take one aspect, trying to isolate it, the two 
  others
  silently come along. 
  Think about it thoroughly !
  
  If you say "I" and 
  you stop saying more, trying to hide that you wanted to say sometzhing more, 
  then silently at least the question "I" means what ? By this the three gunas 
  have been joining together automatically. Either you can make some statement 
  or you are speech- and meaningless. If you state something, the three are 
  obviously involved. If you do not state sonething, they are still involved, 
  because the avoidance as such implies the same again.
  
  Dharana - Dhyana-Samadhi 
  are synonyms of this first "triangle" of attributes, the same as 
  sat-chit-ananda are synonyms to the second triangle, Brahma-Vishnu-Shiva 
  another one orsattwa-rajas-tamasand so 
forth.
  
  Dr. Peter Plichta has 
  been findinginnumerous of such three-attributes based principles in 
  variousscience disciplines(see alsoGod's secret formula, 
  Element Books). 
  
  Even without practicing 
  the siddhis you areunder the influence of the same mind-principles. You 
  can fix a thought (or a an object), but it has to automaticallyturn into 
  something else, otherwise it would "burn" a hole in your mind, in case it 
  stayed at the same spot. This act of metamorphosis is the gliding-aspect, 
  which ends up in an "ecstasy" or new manifestation.
  
  (Some practical exercise: 
  Draw a cube ona piece of paper and let your mind contemplate on the form 
  with open eyes. Try to fix it as good as you can. After a few seconds it will 
  turn its space-direction from back-ground to fore-ground and after a few 
  seconds back again and so forth.)
  
  If you start with a 
  mantra you will easily glide (slipping on a bananapeel - see 
  Course on SCI !!)
  automatically into 
  samadhi (pure consciousness).
  
   Due to the three-guna principle the result is 
  samadhi.
  
  What does three gunas has 
  to do with Samadhi.??
  
  Samadhi is the sattwa 
  guna of the mind (pure ground of consciousness). Dhyana is the rajas-aspect 
  (dynamic movement) and
  dharana is the 
  tamas-aspect of the mind (fruit or result or manifestation out of the dynamics 
  of the dhyana-force). The rsult has to to dissolve again, and that is being 
  done by the influence of transcendence (Samadhi). All three gunas can never be 
  seen as isolated.
  That means, if Samadhi 
  starts to render its influence, it needs its rajas-nature inherent in it in 
  order to give place for a new result (manifestation), which is also part of 
  the sattwic force. This is an infinitely endless and minuteprocess, 
  taking place at every moment and everywhere, because there is no "space" left 
  in between any of these processes (advaita-aspect = non-divisibility). And in 
  thoses moments itself it takes place innumerable times.
  
   99% of the TM-Teachers all over the world have been leaving the 
  movement. Many of them are still teaching. That is, what Maharishi 
  wanted.
  made so many minds become 
  independent, not anymore bound to the master. This is the lesson of freedom 
  Maharishi taught to us
  
  Why does the TM-org rabidly 
  criticise Deepak Chopra and Sri Sri. Ravishankar.?? TM-governors claim 
  MMY called him "Sugar-Caned poison".??
  I do not know, whether 
  Ravishankar od Deppak had been called so. But I guess it would preferredly fit 
  to Ravishankar. When I was living at Gandhinagar/India between October 18, 
  1997 and September 11, 2001 (!!!) I got in touch with Ravishankars "Art of 
  Living", and I watched a group of Government-employees practicing "Sudarshan 
  Kriya" (I hope I remember the name of this practice correctly). I was 
  shockked, ´because I heard them breathing "like horses" close to be collapsing 
  into a hyperventilative cramp. It sounded so unnatural and disharmonious to me 
  that I had the instant impulse to undertake something.
  
  I wrote a letter to him 
  and got an answer from his secretary: In short the answer was (out of which 
  you can make out my own inquiry), that Ravishankar would be ready to let me 
  initiate "hundreds and thousands of his followers" provided a) I got an 
  authorisation from the TM-Movement to do so and b) that the TM-Movement 
  stopped to behave like a "fanatic muslim organization"- I was positively 
  shocked and tried to get in touch with the TM-movement. No reply. Ravishankar 
  also invited me to come to his place at Andhra Pradesh, but unfortunately I 
  became sick at that time (getting Malaria) and could not attend the planned 
  meeting. Later on I did not succeed in getting further in touch with him, only 
  seeing him on the 

Re: [FairfieldLife] Is Paris Burning?

2005-11-13 Thread MDixon6569






In a message dated 11/13/05 5:00:35 P.M. Central Standard Time, 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Well, 
  fwiw, I just spoke with my 27 year old niece who lives in theheart of 
  Paris and she said that what is actually going on over thereis nothing 
  like the press here in the U.S. has made it out to be. Sherecently watched 
  CNN and could not believe how exaggerated they madeit out to be. And that 
  the "reporter" from CNN completely ignored theFrench person he was 
  interviewing and kept hypersensationalizing it,in spite of what was being 
  said straight from someone who lives there.

I never put much faith in anything CNN has ever had to say. I 
definitely wouldn't trust their European Bureau. But maybe it's common to see 
lines of police marching with clubs,shields andother riot equipment 
through the streets with cars burning everywhere. Gay Paris 
!





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[FairfieldLife] Re: Is Paris Burning?

2005-11-13 Thread anonymousff
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Kenny H [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 wrote:
 
  Well, fwiw, I just spoke with my 27 year old niece who lives in 
the
  heart of Paris and she said that what is actually going on over 
there
  is nothing like the press here in the U.S. has made it out to 
be. She
  recently watched CNN and could not believe how exaggerated they 
made
  it out to be. And that the reporter from CNN completely 
ignored the
  French person he was interviewing and kept hypersensationalizing 
it,
  in spite of what was being said straight from someone who lives 
 there.
 

how do you say self denial in French?

BTW, anyone know why TurquoiseB stopped posting? is it related?





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Re: [FairfieldLife] Is Paris Burning?

2005-11-13 Thread MDixon6569






In a message dated 11/13/05 5:00:35 P.M. Central Standard Time, 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Well, 
  fwiw, I just spoke with my 27 year old niece who lives in theheart of 
  Paris and she said that what is actually going on over thereis nothing 
  like the press here in the U.S. has made it out to be. Sherecently watched 
  CNN and could not believe how exaggerated they madeit out to be. And that 
  the "reporter" from CNN completely ignored theFrench person he was 
  interviewing and kept hypersensationalizing it,in spite of what was being 
  said straight from someone who lives there.

All this chaos in France will end as soon as Jac Chirac can 
find out who to surrender to.





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[FairfieldLife] Re: Earth turns around the sun not the other way: (How MMY sold a diamond (TM) f

2005-11-13 Thread jim_flanegin
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, akasha_108 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 I know, California real estate is unreal (literally IMO and is not
 stable at current levels.) Thats one reason I left the state, 
having
 been born, raised, educated and careered there. Housing prices are
 just in fairyland compared to many other nice areas. And with
 broadband internet being most everywhere (and soon to be wireless, 
and
 literally EVERYWHERE, location is less and less important IMO,
 particularly if you can make a living not tied physically to a 
large
 hub business center.)
 
 Compare a $500,000 or million dollar home in SF, San Diego or Sac 
to
 one in FF. Its a joke.
 
 But the mortgage deduction still applies to the 350k bungalow. The
 proposals are for it to be partially taken away for the kind of 
basic
 $million middle class home close to it.
 
 And long run, thats a good thing, it will help bring housing and
 affordability back into synch. 15% affordibility rates are crazy 
and
 unsustainable.
 
I was just looking at housing prices in my neighborhood in Santa 
Clara, Cal. which is a middle-class neighborhood, but nothing ritzy- 
Many retired folks, some families and couples. Houses are typically 
single story, about 50 years old, 1200 to 1500 square feet. Selling 
prices are 750 to 900K. You won't find a house for less, although I 
did see a 2/1, 900 square feet, for 720K...

The proposed mortgage deduction would hurt a lot of people here, 
even if prices softened somewhat. The trend here, just to buy a 
house, is to take out an interest-only loan. So many homeowners are 
counting on that large mortgage interest deduction to be able to 
afford the house.

For the last twenty years at least, through good times and bad, 
people have been predicting housing prices to go down here. There is 
about a 15% affordability rate in this area, with lots and lots of 
overseas investor money mostly from Asia keeping prices high, even 
through recessions. 

So the SF Bay Area is not purely a domestic real estate market.
If the mortgage deduction is adjusted to the 350K range, all that 
will happen here is that local people will be forced to sell, the 
properties will be snatched up by investors and we'll have more 
renters. 





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[FairfieldLife] Re: Is Paris Burning?

2005-11-13 Thread Kenny H
Judy,
That is a good question and would have been my next question but there
wasn't enough time to ask. I just fired off an e-mail asking her if
she could send me a description of what her direct experience is like.
KH


--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Kenny H [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 wrote:
 
  Well, fwiw, I just spoke with my 27 year old niece who lives in the
  heart of Paris and she said that what is actually going on over there
  is nothing like the press here in the U.S. has made it out to be. She
  recently watched CNN and could not believe how exaggerated they made
  it out to be. And that the reporter from CNN completely ignored the
  French person he was interviewing and kept hypersensationalizing it,
  in spite of what was being said straight from someone who lives 
 there.
 
 So what *is* happening in Paris?







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[FairfieldLife] Day of awakening

2005-11-13 Thread bbrigante
MAHARISHI after Deva Prabodhini Ekadashi puja, Day of
Awakening, 12NOV05

`Now we have all the Devatas wake up and from their
side they are coming together asking what we want. So
we are telling them, please from your level you decide
and we want all that is possible for you to give.

'So they seem to be coming to us through the window of
treasury of Raja Ram. The treasury of the Global
Country of World Peace. And through the finance
minister all the doors of the treasury from all
directions are now open and all the devatas asking us
what you want.

'And our request to them is, how much you are
satisfied with us, please give us your blessings, your
parental role for us, at least on our globe, in our
world we want to see all our people peaceful, happy,
fulfilled, integrated, fully enlightened and in
possession of all possibilities. Creativity which will
be unlimited, unbounded, eternal and ever lasting.
This is what our reply to the fully awakened all the
devatas today.

'And that is the gift that has been coming on from
Guru Purnima...






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Is Paris Burning?

2005-11-13 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Kenny H [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 Judy,
 That is a good question and would have been my next question but 
there
 wasn't enough time to ask. I just fired off an e-mail asking her if
 she could send me a description of what her direct experience is 
like.

Please keep us posted...  There's an awful lot of
pontificating going on, along with a fair amount of
Schadenfreude, in this country.  Be nice to have a
clearer picture of events.






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Is Paris Burning? Part II

2005-11-13 Thread Kenny H
Here is the reply I just received from my niece, direct from Paris.

Basically what I've observed is nothing. I came into Charles DeGaulle
Airport, and all modes of transport were open to me, unlike the
reported closure of trains on CNN. I go out almost every night and
have never seen a fire. I eavesdrop mercilessly, and the only people
talking about it are doing it in english- with british or american
accents. The riots are happening, but they're the expression of one
community far on the outskirts of Paris AND from what the local news
reports they're on a serious decline. It's unfortunate that the people
behind the rioting are so incredibly justified for their anger, but
Paris is not on fire.




--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Kenny H [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Judy,
 That is a good question and would have been my next question but there
 wasn't enough time to ask. I just fired off an e-mail asking her if
 she could send me a description of what her direct experience is like.
 KH
 
 
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Kenny H [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  wrote:
  
   Well, fwiw, I just spoke with my 27 year old niece who lives in the
   heart of Paris and she said that what is actually going on over
there
   is nothing like the press here in the U.S. has made it out to
be. She
   recently watched CNN and could not believe how exaggerated they made
   it out to be. And that the reporter from CNN completely
ignored the
   French person he was interviewing and kept hypersensationalizing it,
   in spite of what was being said straight from someone who lives 
  there.
  
  So what *is* happening in Paris?
 








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[FairfieldLife] Re: Is Paris Burning?

2005-11-13 Thread bbrigante
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Kenny H [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 Judy,
 That is a good question and would have been my next question but 
there
 wasn't enough time to ask. I just fired off an e-mail asking her if
 she could send me a description of what her direct experience is 
like.
 KH
 
**

(One surprising stat: Even before the riots, an average of 3,500 cars 
a month were burned across the nation.)

 
http://www.slate.com/id/2130272/





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[FairfieldLife] Re: Earth turns around the sun not the other way: (How MMY sold a diamond (TM) f

2005-11-13 Thread akasha_108
jim_flanegin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:


 I was just looking at housing prices in my neighborhood in Santa 
 Clara, Cal. which is a middle-class neighborhood, but nothing ritzy- 
 Many retired folks, some families and couples. Houses are typically 
 single story, about 50 years old, 1200 to 1500 square feet. Selling 
 prices are 750 to 900K. You won't find a house for less, although I 
 did see a 2/1, 900 square feet, for 720K...
 
 The proposed mortgage deduction would hurt a lot of people here, 
 even if prices softened somewhat. 

Well the rent to mortgage cost (after tax) in many parts of the bay
area, and other high price areas are quite low, like 50% and less.
They are hurt only if they feel the need to buy. Pay 2000 in rent or
4000 in a mortgage. Rentals in sme areas a great deals -- and a great
way to ride out the bubble.

Some will say, but I don't want to throw my money away in rent. At
least with a house I amd building equity. False on so many levels.
First, everyone is a renter. They either rent property, or the rent
money to to buy housing. A million dollar home costs a lot of rent on
money. Just as wasted as property rent. 

Second, the only thing that makes owning more attractive, financially,
than renting when the rent to mortgage ratios are so low, is the
expectation of appreciation. But that train has left. Prices
everywhere are leveling off or beginning to fall. And when the
expectations for apprecation are no longer there, it becomes a double
whammy: no appreciation, and demand for housing falls thus bringing
pressure for lower prices -- starting a depreciation expectation
cycle. Thats when everyone tries to unload and prices plummet. 

Third, if you are paying 2000 in rent instead of 4000 in mortgage for
the same property, you are saving 2000 a month which can be saved,
invested etc. Thats your rent equity building up and if there is no or
little price appreciation, it will far outstrip any equity build up in
property. 

Fourth, if one is paying interest only, they are not building up any 
equity -- nothing is going to repay principal. And they may actually
be building up negative equity, which gets tacked onto the loan in
later years. The only equity build up is if prices keep appreciating
-- it becomes a game of the greater fool. Hold risky properties now
with the hope someone will be foolish enough to buy at an appreciated
price in a flat or declining market in years hence.

Fifth, international investors may be holding up the market now, and
maybe suffering from information lags -- being sold on price trends of
past years and not understanding the dynamics of the local market. But
after a year or two of flat and declining prices, the bloom will be
off the rose, and hot international money could flood out of the area.
By definition, international investors are renting their properties.
50% rent to mortgage ratios may be bearable when prices are
appreciating 20-40% a year. But when that stops, for a couple of
years, bam, many investors will try to unload. Thus putting more
pressure on downward prices. 

 The trend here, just to buy a 
 house, is to take out an interest-only loan. So many homeowners are 
 counting on that large mortgage interest deduction to be able to 
 afford the house.

And in 2-5 years they may count their blessings the loss of mortgage
deductions prevented them from buying at the peak of the market.
 
 For the last twenty years at least, through good times and bad, 
 people have been predicting housing prices to go down here. There is 
 about a 15% affordability rate in this area, with lots and lots of 
 overseas investor money mostly from Asia keeping prices high, even 
 through recessions. 

But there has never been sustained 15% affordability and 50% rent to
mortgage ratios. So the past is not a good predictor.

And many parts of california had definite flattening and declines
1985-95 or so. Certainly in San Diego and parts of LA/OC. 
I thought the bay area had such too -- maybe not.

 
 So the SF Bay Area is not purely a domestic real estate market.
 If the mortgage deduction is adjusted to the 350K range, all that 
 will happen here is that local people will be forced to sell, 

Well, many owners have morgages in the 500 or less range, having
obtained them 5-20 years ago. Who will be initially hurt are new
buyers. But they can rent for half the price. I can't feel too sorry
for them.

 the 
 properties will be snatched up by investors and we'll have more 
 renters.

Not for too much longer, IMO.






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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Is Paris Burning? Part II

2005-11-13 Thread MDixon6569






In a message dated 11/13/05 7:27:42 P.M. Central Standard Time, 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
I 
  eavesdrop mercilessly, and the only peopletalking about it are doing it in 
  english- with british or americanaccents. The riots are happening, but 
  they're the _expression_ of onecommunity far on the outskirts of Paris AND 
  from what the local newsreports they're on a serious decline. It's 
  unfortunate that the peoplebehind the rioting are so incredibly justified 
  for their anger, butParis is not on fire."

This is far closer to what is being reported on Fox. Rioting 
and car burning is in the suburbs outside of Paris and other towns through out 
France. But Paris is relatively quiet. The French seem to be too embarrassed to 
talk about it. Unemployment among the French is around 10% but among the 
immigrant population and their children it's closer to 40 or even 50%! 
Unfortunately many of the rioters are heard to be shouting "God is great" and 
"this is Baghdad". Also unfortunately, the French have a reputation of looking 
down their noses at foreigners which probably pisses the immigrants off 
even more.





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[FairfieldLife] Lotsa HAARP Links

2005-11-13 Thread Blue Star



From: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/circle2012dreams/

Bearden's briefing papers and slide on scalar weapons http://www.cheniere.org/books/ferdelance/s94.htm  Weapons Slides by Tom Bearden http://www.cheniere.org/images/weapons/index.html  Scalar Wars - My attempt to summarize Bearden's information http://prahlad.org/pub/bearden/scalar_wars.htm  Horrifying US Secret Weapon Unleashed In Baghdad - from Rense http://prahlad.org/pub/bearden/new_weapon_in_iraq.htm  Scalar Heaven or Hell: Psychoenergetics http://prahlad.org/pub/bearden/Psychoenergetics.htm  Are any of these Earthquakes Being caused by Scalar Weapons? http://prahlad.org/pub/bearden/scalarvocanos.htm  Examples of Probable Scalar Weapons Tests - by Tom Bearden http://prahlad.org/pub/bearden/examples.htm  Scalar War Has Already Begun http://prahlad.org/pub/bearden/Scalar_War_Already.htm Messin' With the Weather http://www.illinoisleader.com/columnists/columnistsview.asp?c=28992 
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Re: [FairfieldLife] Lotsa HAARP Links

2005-11-13 Thread Rick Archer
Title: Re: [FairfieldLife] Lotsa HAARP Links





This person is spamming a lot of lists, but I have found some of his/her posts interesting, and I presume others have, so I havent banned him/her. Others feel the same way?


on 11/13/05 8:33 PM, Blue Star at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

From: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/circle2012dreams/ http://groups.yahoo.com/group/circle2012dreams/ 

Bearden's briefing papers and slide on scalar weapons
http://www.cheniere.org/books/ferdelance/s94.htm http://www.cheniere.org/books/ferdelance/s94.htm 

Weapons Slides by Tom Bearden
http://www.cheniere.org/images/weapons/index.html http://www.cheniere.org/images/weapons/index.html 

Scalar Wars - My attempt to summarize Bearden's information
http://prahlad.org/pub/bearden/scalar_wars.htm http://prahlad.org/pub/bearden/scalar_wars.htm 

Horrifying US Secret Weapon Unleashed In Baghdad - from Rense
http://prahlad.org/pub/bearden/new_weapon_in_iraq.htm http://prahlad.org/pub/bearden/new_weapon_in_iraq.htm 

Scalar Heaven or Hell: Psychoenergetics
http://prahlad.org/pub/bearden/Psychoenergetics.htm http://prahlad.org/pub/bearden/Psychoenergetics.htm 

Are any of these Earthquakes Being caused by Scalar Weapons?
http://prahlad.org/pub/bearden/scalarvocanos.htm http://prahlad.org/pub/bearden/scalarvocanos.htm 

Examples of Probable Scalar Weapons Tests - by Tom Bearden
http://prahlad.org/pub/bearden/examples.htm http://prahlad.org/pub/bearden/examples.htm 

Scalar War Has Already Begun
http://prahlad.org/pub/bearden/Scalar_War_Already.htm http://prahlad.org/pub/bearden/Scalar_War_Already.htm 

Messin' With the Weather
 http://www.illinoisleader.com/columnists/columnistsview.asp?c=28992 http://www.illinoisleader.com/columnists/columnistsview.asp?c=28992 








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Re: [FairfieldLife] Lotsa HAARP Links

2005-11-13 Thread gullible fool

I haven't gotten around to blocking his nonsense yet,
so I find his drivel quite annoying.

--- Rick Archer [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:

 This person is spamming a lot of lists, but I have
 found some of his/her
 posts interesting, and I presume others have, so I
 haven¹t banned him/her.
 Others feel the same way?
 
 
 on 11/13/05 8:33 PM, Blue Star at
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
  From: 
 http://groups.yahoo.com/group/circle2012dreams/
  http://groups.yahoo.com/group/circle2012dreams/
  
  Bearden's briefing papers and slide on scalar
 weapons
 
 http://www.cheniere.org/books/ferdelance/s94.htm
 
 http://www.cheniere.org/books/ferdelance/s94.htm
  
  Weapons Slides by Tom Bearden
 
 http://www.cheniere.org/images/weapons/index.html
 
 http://www.cheniere.org/images/weapons/index.html
  
  Scalar Wars - My attempt to summarize
 Bearden's information
 
 http://prahlad.org/pub/bearden/scalar_wars.htm
  http://prahlad.org/pub/bearden/scalar_wars.htm
  
  Horrifying US Secret Weapon Unleashed In
 Baghdad - from Rense
 

http://prahlad.org/pub/bearden/new_weapon_in_iraq.htm
 

http://prahlad.org/pub/bearden/new_weapon_in_iraq.htm
  
  Scalar Heaven or Hell: Psychoenergetics
 
 http://prahlad.org/pub/bearden/Psychoenergetics.htm
 

http://prahlad.org/pub/bearden/Psychoenergetics.htm
  
  Are any of these Earthquakes Being caused by
 Scalar Weapons?
 
 http://prahlad.org/pub/bearden/scalarvocanos.htm
 
 http://prahlad.org/pub/bearden/scalarvocanos.htm
  
  Examples of Probable Scalar Weapons Tests -
 by Tom Bearden
  http://prahlad.org/pub/bearden/examples.htm
  http://prahlad.org/pub/bearden/examples.htm
  
  Scalar War Has Already Begun
 

http://prahlad.org/pub/bearden/Scalar_War_Already.htm
 

http://prahlad.org/pub/bearden/Scalar_War_Already.htm
  
  Messin' With the Weather


http://www.illinoisleader.com/columnists/columnistsview.asp?c=28992
 

http://www.illinoisleader.com/columnists/columnistsview.asp?c=28992
  
 
 






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Re: [FairfieldLife] Lotsa HAARP Links

2005-11-13 Thread Rick Archer
on 11/13/05 9:39 PM, gullible fool at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 
 I haven't gotten around to blocking his nonsense yet,
 so I find his drivel quite annoying.

I found the compilation of prophesies kind of interesting, as I've always
been interested in that kind of stuff. But if the majority feel these Blue
Star posts are too egregious a violation of our guidelines, and if there's
no general interest in them, we can delete his membership.




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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Samadhi meditation rare...in any discipline!

2005-11-13 Thread Peter


--- wmurphy77 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 wrote:
  No, you would not remember pure transcendence
 unless
  the mind was functioning along with that
 transcendence
  and that would be CC.
 
 What do you think the *infusion* of *Being* is, if
 not bliss?

Bliss is a relative phenomenon and has nothing to do
with pure consciousness. Bliss is, actually, quite
stupid.

  Transcendence is no mantra, no
  thought. It is that gap between thoughts in
 meditation
  when the mind completely stops and the continuity
 of
  the thought process is broken as it transcends and
  then comes out into a completely different thought
  stream. It is then that the mind notices the
  difference between the thought streams and
 recognizes
  the transcendent as a gap. People are
 transcending
  all the time in TM, it's just that the mind thinks
  that it is supposed to have some sort of
  experience.`
 
 The nature of the Being is pure bliss (happiness).

Absolutely not. Pure Bliss is not happiness. Happiness
is a relative phenomenon. To equate Being with
relative happiness is just the terrified mind taking
refuge in a concept as Being eats it alive. It keeps a
person stuck in ignorance seeking an experience of
pure consciousness.


 
 
 
 
 
 
 
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 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 
  
 
 
 





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[FairfieldLife] Re: Samadhi meditation rare...in any discipline!

2005-11-13 Thread akasha_108
Peter [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Bliss is, actually, quite stupid.

Well, I was talking to Bliss the other day and it said Peter was
stupid. :)







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[FairfieldLife] Fw: [TMTrue] questions asked by non-Muslims

2005-11-13 Thread anonymousff
 http://tinyurl.com/b6zwm






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Earth turns around the sun not the other way: (How MMY sold a diamond (TM) for a handful of spinach...)

2005-11-13 Thread sparaig
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 
 On Nov 13, 2005, at 10:46 AM, Jason Spock wrote:
 
  Why does the TM-org rabidly criticise Deepak Chopra and Sri  
  Sri. Ravishankar.??  TM-governors claim MMY called him Sugar-
Caned  
  poison.??
 
 Duh. One word: competition. Falling mantra sales doesn't make M.  
 happy. Isn't that obvious?
 
 Of course, it's also easy to rationalize it as some sort of cosmic  
 scenario.


I have NEVER heard anyone claim that MMY ever said anything ill about 
Chopra. 





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[FairfieldLife] Re: The Mahesh Kozlowski Effect

2005-11-13 Thread sparaig
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, akasha_108 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, akasha_108 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  wrote:
 authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  why you refuse to do such a simple
  thing as supply some URLs that you claim
  already to have found.
 
 And this is important, or even interesting, because ?

Oh, if blatant dishonesty and hypocrisy are of
no concern to you, I guess it wouldn't be.
   
   Thats a pretty big disconnect. If blatant dishonesty and 
hypocrisy
   were manfiestly core issues here, it might be of interest. 
Though
   labeling people, just for the sake of labeling, can get to be 
quite
   boring and IMO non-productive. 
   
   In my view I don't see blatant dishonesty and hypocrisy -- but
   oddly, I do see some petty obsessions. I remember when Vaj 
first 
   made the statement. It was not exactly earth shattering. A quick
   observation of some momentary interest. Not the kind of thing 
that
   would affect ones world view.
   
   Then I remember your correction: it wasn't a bunch of quick rich
   schemes after all, it was Fred G.s book. Curious, I did a search
   myself. The first page was filled with what looked like get 
rich 
   quick schemes based on do less accomplish more (or do nothing 
   accomplish everything). Upon closer examination, I saw they all 
   related to Fred's book. So my take away was, you were both 
correct 
   in reporting your perceptions. You, Judy, were technically 
correct. 
   Vaj, it was clear to me, made a perceptual or cognitive error, 
as
 I initially did, and reported what he thought he saw. Not a big 
deal.
 
  
  Mm-hm.  And yet, had it been just a mistake, after
  I made my post reporting on Gratzon's book, you'd
  think Vaj would have double-checked and then retracted
  his claim.  *Then* it would not have been a big deal;
  anybody can make a careless mistake like that.
  
  But he didn't.  Instead he came up with all kinds of
  crap, 
 
 I took it as Vaj playing with you. Knowing that if he obsuficated a
 bit, you would tend towards imploding in obsession. Barry enjoys 
such
 toying also. Perhaps not the noblest of traits, but maybe they are
 students of the behavioral sciences and love to see small pieces of
 bait repeatedly taken and watch the predictable drama unfold.
 

I understand that BF Skinner's daughter greatly appreciated this 
tendency in her father. She has had nothing but good to say about his 
child-rearing practices, afterall...







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[FairfieldLife] Re: Samadhi meditation rare...in any discipline!

2005-11-13 Thread shempmcgurk
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 on 11/13/05 9:57 PM, Peter at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  
  Absolutely not. Pure Bliss is not happiness. Happiness
  is a relative phenomenon. To equate Being with
  relative happiness is just the terrified mind taking
  refuge in a concept as Being eats it alive. It keeps a
  person stuck in ignorance seeking an experience of
  pure consciousness.
 
 Probably most of us remember the lecture in which Maharishi says 
that bliss
 is not blissful, the point being that bliss is a relative quality 
and the
 Absolute is quality-less.


Yeah, and while IN the field of bliss there is just being, so how 
can there be bliss until you come out of it?






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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Earth turns around the sun not the other way: (How MMY sold a diamond (TM) for a handful of spinach...)

2005-11-13 Thread Rick Archer
on 11/13/05 10:49 PM, sparaig at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
 
 On Nov 13, 2005, at 10:46 AM, Jason Spock wrote:
 
 Why does the TM-org rabidly criticise Deepak Chopra and Sri
 Sri. Ravishankar.??  TM-governors claim MMY called him Sugar-
 Caned  
 poison.??
 
 Duh. One word: competition. Falling mantra sales doesn't make M.
 happy. Isn't that obvious?
 
 Of course, it's also easy to rationalize it as some sort of cosmic
 scenario.
 
 
 I have NEVER heard anyone claim that MMY ever said anything ill about
 Chopra. 

No, but TB's have gone so far as to spit on him in airports, or so I heard.




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[FairfieldLife] Re: Samadhi meditation rare...in any discipline!

2005-11-13 Thread sparaig
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wmurphy77 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 wrote:
  No, you would not remember pure transcendence unless
  the mind was functioning along with that transcendence
  and that would be CC.
 
 What do you think the *infusion* of *Being* is, if not bliss?
 
 

Bliss isn't blissful...

 





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[FairfieldLife] Re: The Mahesh Kozlowski Effect

2005-11-13 Thread sparaig
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 
 On Nov 13, 2005, at 4:28 PM, akasha_108 wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
 
  On Nov 13, 2005, at 4:23 PM, akasha_108 wrote:
 
  HAHAHA. I don't think even Vaj takes everthing hes says as 
Gospel.
 
 
  Only the stuff the Burning Bush tells me to. But that book won't 
be
  released until 2012.
 
 
  Only George I presume. Or are you burning the whole family at 
the  
  stake?
 
 We threw in Ann Coulter for good measure.


Ann Coulter is gay?






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[FairfieldLife] Re: The Mahesh Kozlowski Effect

2005-11-13 Thread sparaig
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, akasha_108 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
  
  On Nov 13, 2005, at 4:28 PM, akasha_108 wrote:
  
   --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
  
  
   On Nov 13, 2005, at 4:23 PM, akasha_108 wrote:
  
   HAHAHA. I don't think even Vaj takes everthing hes says as 
Gospel.
  
  
   Only the stuff the Burning Bush tells me to. But that book 
won't be
   released until 2012.
  
  
   Only George I presume. Or are you burning the whole family at 
the  
   stake?
  
  We threw in Ann Coulter for good measure.
 
 
 Ah, I thought I heard something cackling in the fire.
 
 (its funny though. She hangs with Bill Maher sometimes. On his show,
 she laughs at his pot jokes -- and smiles at strong indendos about 
the
 two of them getting it on. Does she take a somewhat different view
 from her conservative brethen on personal freedom issues?
 Fornication? Drugs?


She's stated that living the meat market life in bars is no big deal.






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Earth turns around the sun not the other way: (How MMY sold a diamond (TM) for a handful of spinach...)

2005-11-13 Thread sparaig
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 on 11/13/05 10:49 PM, sparaig at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  
  
  On Nov 13, 2005, at 10:46 AM, Jason Spock wrote:
  
  Why does the TM-org rabidly criticise Deepak Chopra and Sri
  Sri. Ravishankar.??  TM-governors claim MMY called him Sugar-
  Caned  
  poison.??
  
  Duh. One word: competition. Falling mantra sales doesn't make M.
  happy. Isn't that obvious?
  
  Of course, it's also easy to rationalize it as some sort of 
cosmic
  scenario.
  
  
  I have NEVER heard anyone claim that MMY ever said anything ill 
about
  Chopra. 
 
 No, but TB's have gone so far as to spit on him in airports, or so 
I heard.


I'm not pleased with him, but I tend to bite my tongue when his name 
is mentioned. The son of his publicist was on PUrusha for years after 
he left the TMO. This implies that there wasnot an official stance 
against Chopra and associated, though the guy did sound a tad 
defensive when he said to me you know my Mom, I think.

He audibly relaxed when I put two and two together and went Oh, 
Muriel? How is she doing? Havent talk to her in ages, blah blah...






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[FairfieldLife] Re: A day in the life of a True Believer

2005-11-13 Thread jim_flanegin
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 Jim where do you get this stuff? From your chitta? ;-)

Yep, just having fun, and challenging the orthodoxy that some attach 
to the means of liberation...
 






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[FairfieldLife] Fwd: join the feedback list on a poorly written TM article- link attached

2005-11-13 Thread Ron F

 There is growing feedback response to this artice- may as well have fun and 
 join the party, they are accepting everyone's comments, it seems
 
 http://www.dailyemerald.com/vnews/display.v/ART/2005/11/10/437313e2094fc
 
 Meditation movement lacks proper credentials
 Editorial
 By Emerald editorial board
 November 10, 2005
 A sold-out crowd packed into 150 Columbia Tuesday night to hear famous 
 filmmaker David Lynch speak. Perhaps they came to learn about the meaning of 
 his 
 dark films, but Lynch primarily used his time to promote the controversial 
 practice of Transcendental Meditation.
 A practitioner of TM for 32 years, Lynch wants to raise billions of dollars 
 to teach it to any child in America who wants to learn it. Like many TM 
 proponents, Lynch, accompanied by two “experts,â€? described TM as a way to
 usher in 
 world peace and achieve greater personal effectiveness. Lynch and his 
 comrades 
 couched the practice in scientific terms.
 But they didn’t give the audience the whole story.
 Now famous as the Beatles’ one-time guru, Maharishi Mahesh Yogi founded TM 
 in 
 India in 1958 as the outgrowth of a Hindu spiritual movement. Since then, 
 more than 6 million people have learned TM, according to the organization’s 
 Web 
 site. Learning the technique costs $2,500.
 At first, TM practitioners meditate for about 20 minutes twice daily with 
 their eyes closed, repeating a syllabic phrase or “mantraâ€? to reach 
 “pure 
 awareness� and rid themselves of conscious thought.
 We don’t dispute the fact that meditation in general can be calming and 
 beneficial. Yet we raise questions consumers should seriously consider before 
 purchasing this commodity as a means to attain peace.
 First, we question the high cost. During his speech, Lynch said people who 
 really want peace will find the money to pay for TM classes. Some advocates 
 say 
 the cost ensures the TM movement will persevere and grow, and that the price 
 wouldn’t seem outrageous if we lived in a culture that values meditation. 
 Yet 
 people can learn many types of meditation for free from books and classes. 
 Proponents claim the TM mantras are more effective than repeating secular 
 sounds, 
 but some books on meditation say otherwise.
 We also question the scientific merits of TM. Advocates claim a multitude of 
 scientific studies validate the physiological benefits of TM. Many of these 
 studies, however, are conducted at the organization’s own Maharishi 
 University 
 of Management and they are not necessarily published in peer-reviewed 
 journals. 
 Any scholars thinking about trying TM should check out these scientific 
 claims, especially those that suggest TM is different from other forms of 
 meditation. We also cannot find any credible evidence to support the claim 
 that TM
 
 creates peace by “radiating an influence of harmony to your 
 surroundings.� In 
 light of the recent heated debate over the scientific merit of Intelligent 
 Design, TM should come under equally rigorous investigation.
 People with certain religious beliefs should also investigate the religious 
 roots of TM. Although advocates claim it is simply a “mental techniqueâ€? 
 and 
 not a religion or philosophy, historical facts clearly show TM is rooted in 
 Hinduism; the mantras people repeat during TM are the names of Hindu gods. 
 Moreover, the movement lost a 1979 suit after the New Jersey Supreme Court 
 ruled
 TM 
 was based on religious concepts and shouldn’t be taught in schools. TM has 
 been 
 presented in a secular package to appeal to Westerners.
 Millions of people like Lynch have found TM to be a satisfying and worthwhile 
 purchase, as demonstrated by their longtime commitments to the practice. 
 However, we hope listeners at Lynch’s recent speech take the initiative to 
 investigate the statements made by this salesman of pseudo-science and 
 evaluate 
 whether they belong in an academic setting like this University. We think they
 don’
 t.
 




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