[FairfieldLife] RE: To Rick Archer/ On Reciting God's Name
Rick wrote: Gurus are just people who are farther up the mountain, or perhaps sitting on its summit. Bronte writes: If this is all they were, darlin', they wouldn't be intent on wearing crowns, having us prostrate ourselves at their feet, call on them to marry us, give our children their first taste of food, and carry dolls around that represent them. They wouldn't sell their clothing to their disciples and creating a focus from the aspirant on themselves, the guru, as God. Their focus would be on the God within the student. But that is not what we see. I have never observed a guru bow at the feet of a student or worship an article of a disciple's clothing. Of course gurus give lip service to the student's being God, but their actions speak profoundly otherwise. No wonder students get lost in their masters. Rick wrote: To my understanding, you dont unite with gods by using a bija mantra. You transcend the mantra and realize the ground state of all existence, including the gods existence. Bronte writes: Come on now, let's get real. When I have a mantra that consists of the name of a Hindu god followed by namah -- Sanskrit for I bow down -- my meditation is worship of a god. I feed them with my energy. The gods eat the soma of the sacrifice, says Rig Veda. This is what it's talking about. In mantra meditation, you are fodder for a god. Sure you feel good afterwards. If they didn't give you endorphins in exchange for your giving them your freedom and individuality, you wouldn't sit there and meditate, would you? Your description of realizing the ground state of existence, including the gods' existence as what happens in meditation is the lie they tell you to veil the truth. So you will keep on worshipping, of course. What do you expect, that the gods will come right and say they're turning you into dinner? At the start of this thread, you quoted Ramana Maharishi on the value of letting His name, the name of a god, not only permeate your meditation but every moment of your life, every impulse of your thought, the very fabric of consciousness. This is outright possession. This is a taking over of your individual consciousness by another entity, by the god whose name you repeated. This is not experience of Brahman, however they may dress it to be so. True Brahman does not require the sacrifice of your individuality, your free will, your desires and original thinking. Possession DOES require such things. The gods have craftily lured you into mantra meditation, and wonderful guy though you are (and pretty darn cosmic to boot, IMO), I believe you are in danger of being devoured as an individual on account of the path you insist on following. Somehow it seems you don't think you can go it by yourself. You need a god and guru to lead the way. You probably think that because of the level of possession they already have imposed on you, the feeling that you NEED them to make it to your goal. If you say you don't need it, you simply find it useful, I challenge you to give up mantra meditation, chanting sessions and all other devotional activities for two weeks. I'll bet you can't do it without tremendous effort. Your ability to take it or leave it would prove or disprove my theory that you are already part-possessed. You say your realized friends are dynamic and independent thinkers who still respect their former teachers. Maybe some are, but I'll bet not those who namahed their way to where they're at. My dear friends who follow devotional paths have trouble making decisions, trouble taking control of situations. They take the attitude that life will happen to them according to God's will, and have difficulty taking action toward a desire or goal. They tell me they feel stuck in the routine of their lives much of the time. Their tendency is to wait for God to do things for them, so life happens to them rather than life being something they dynamically create. They tend to accept what they're told as true, rather than examine the root issues at the base of their assumptions. This is very different from the enlightened people I know who don't follow devotional paths or gurus in general. Rick wrote: The realized people I know dont see themselves as having united with a god. They see all life from ants to gods as being particles or facets of their infinite nature. Bronte writes: I find that scary. They merged their very mind, their entire consciousness with His name, and they don't see they have merged with the god? They spout opinions that they as individuals do not exist, that they are will-empty body/mind vessels, meat-robots, predetermined reflectors of some nonlocalized will, and they don't see that they are possessed? The walking dead! But I guess it is to be expected. The possessed never see themselves that way. - Need a
[FairfieldLife] To Rick Archer/ on The fallacy is that a *Me* can Gain Realiza
This was beautiful, Rick. I disagree with the devotional path and so many of your beliefs, but there must be something you are doing right to have such beautiful experiences. I feel the same about Flanegin. I learn from you guys at the same time as I debate you. My understanding is an evolving thing, and I still have lots to make sense of in my world view. Thanks for reflecting on these topics with me. . As I mentioned in another post, Ive been out of town for a week, visiting in-laws in Seattle. Being on vacation and out of the usual routines was enough to ramp up the unboundedness considerably. My infinite nature and my individual nature were kind of on equal footing, see-sawing back and forth gently all week. To use a metaphor (not a literal description) , the unboundedness was like a constant tone. If theres a constant tone playing, you dont hear it after a while, even though its still there, but you can hear it again any time you choose to put your attention on it. Of course, in this case, the tone was bliss so my attention would effortlessly be drawn back to it again and again. It didnt matter how busy my surroundings were Pikes market was as conducive as a ferry ride or a beach. This experience gave rise to the thought that if unboundedness were to dawn suddenly, as it seems to have done for many spiritual teachers, one could easily feel that an individual me no longer existed. I think that if it dawns more gradually, over decades of meditation practice, as in my case, this is less likely to happen. For me, there does not appear to be any incompatibility between my individual nature with its thoughts, desires and activities, and my unbounded nature, which is like a soft cushion of bliss. The two are indeed paradoxical they seem to exist in different dimensions but they coexist in perfect harmony. It is clear that there is no me which gets enlightened, but that does not mean that there is no me. - Be a better Heartthrob. Get better relationship answers from someone who knows. Yahoo! Answers - Check it out.
RE: [FairfieldLife] Ricks enlightened friends
I agree with you about “premature claims to enlightenment.” I think they are common. If the people I’m referring to were saying “I have reached the pinnacle of human evolution” or if they displayed egotism or even if they were setting themselves up as gurus, I’d doubt them. All of them have achieved significant degrees of awakening, all acknowledge that there’s plenty more growth to undergo, not only for themselves but for MMY, Amma, your guru, and any living being, no matter how enlightened, and all are living private lives and are not inclined to become gurus. If they were, that wouldn’t rule out their enlightenment in my estimation, but it would make them suspect of ambition-based motives for claiming enlightenment. All of the folks I’m referring to have TM backgrounds. A few have branched out into other things. If the guru’s stamp of approval were an absolute necessity for realization, no one in the TM movement could become realized, because MMY doesn’t do that. You can think you are realized yet not be. But if you are realized, you’ll know it. Your experience will be sufficient confirmation. And you’ll be the only one at your graduation. No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.13.33/1034 - Release Date: 9/27/2007 5:00 PM
[FairfieldLife] Ricks enlightened friends
OK Rick, Now asking in public so all can participate. I suspect that all of those that you know that you say are realized have proclaimed this on their own without their Guru declaring this, or they did not or currently do not have a guru, or they have their own inner Guru- either in some form or otherwise. It does seem that enlightenment is also possible without the guru but I think it is very rare. Even Ramana, from which this idea that it is possible, had a Guru ( acording to my guru- I think the name was Archula). You pointed out that among other functions with the Guru is telling one to continue even though they think they have arrived. This is the key missing element for those self proclaiming as above because a Sat Guru in living form can quiclky see if there is further to go once they are with the people for some time. That is how it works in my path My experience with it is I have been with and read about both those self proclaiming as above and also those proclaimed enlightened by their Guru who also were proclaimed enlightened by their Guru in a chain continueing upwards. The Self procalimed fell apart every time under scrutiny. I have seen a lot in the last two years like this- maybe 20. It is a subtle difference by quite clear to me, with the aide of my guru pointing out the diffferences. There is a value to it- keeping holy company is wise, so good to make sure the company one keeps is 100% holy sometimes. Some of these people screw others up in various ways. Most amazing I saw was one with all the perfect words describing themselves as enlightened. What came out once there was an association with Sat Guru was this person was depressed, angry. and with violent thoughts. I just recently saw in person a guru proclaiming his disciples enlightened, however the guru himself is a self proclaimed enlightened one, and this also looks flawed. The topic is a tricky one. Hridaya Puri
[FairfieldLife] Re: Ricks enlightened friends
Why all this debate about who is and who isn't enlightened? I suggest that you do what I do: assume EVERYONE you meet in life -- whether meditators or not -- are enlightened. Even the born agains. Make it your default. And if people, through their words or actions, demonstrate that they aren't enlightened, then okay, that's their problem. But why WOULDN'T you assume everyone you come in contact with is enlightened? I mean, why shouldn't you? Don't you want to see the best in everybody? --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Ron [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: OK Rick, Now asking in public so all can participate. I suspect that all of those that you know that you say are realized have proclaimed this on their own without their Guru declaring this, or they did not or currently do not have a guru, or they have their own inner Guru- either in some form or otherwise. It does seem that enlightenment is also possible without the guru but I think it is very rare. Even Ramana, from which this idea that it is possible, had a Guru ( acording to my guru- I think the name was Archula). You pointed out that among other functions with the Guru is telling one to continue even though they think they have arrived. This is the key missing element for those self proclaiming as above because a Sat Guru in living form can quiclky see if there is further to go once they are with the people for some time. That is how it works in my path My experience with it is I have been with and read about both those self proclaiming as above and also those proclaimed enlightened by their Guru who also were proclaimed enlightened by their Guru in a chain continueing upwards. The Self procalimed fell apart every time under scrutiny. I have seen a lot in the last two years like this- maybe 20. It is a subtle difference by quite clear to me, with the aide of my guru pointing out the diffferences. There is a value to it- keeping holy company is wise, so good to make sure the company one keeps is 100% holy sometimes. Some of these people screw others up in various ways. Most amazing I saw was one with all the perfect words describing themselves as enlightened. What came out once there was an association with Sat Guru was this person was depressed, angry. and with violent thoughts. I just recently saw in person a guru proclaiming his disciples enlightened, however the guru himself is a self proclaimed enlightened one, and this also looks flawed. The topic is a tricky one. Hridaya Puri
[FairfieldLife] Re: What's the difference between FFL and Columbia University
Amigo how are you.? Ahmedinejad shoots himself in his foot by denying the holocaust. But his views on Israel are accurate. Israel is an illegal and artificial state based on a mythical judaism. Creation of Israel is an illegal and unethical act by the UN. He again shoots himself in the foot by denying Gays. But then Iran is such a fucked up society that a survey taken in Iran on which is the most attractive part of a woman,, Almost all the men voted that the ankle is the most attractive part of a women.!! ShempMcGurk [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2007 18:14:02 - Subject: [FairfieldLife] What's the difference between FFL and Columbia University Not much. They have very similar views of free speech. - TASE HIM, BRO! September 26, 2007 Ann Coulter anncoulter.com Democrats should run Mahmoud Ahmadinejad for president. He's more coherent than Dennis Kucinich, he dresses like their base, he's more macho than John Edwards, and he's willing to show up at a forum where he might get one hostile question -- unlike the current Democratic candidates for president who won't debate on Fox News Channel. He's not married to an impeached president, and the name Mahmoud Ahmadinejad is surely no more frightening than B. Hussein Obama. And liberals agree with Ahmadinejad on the issues! We know that because he was invited by an American university to speak on campus. Contrary to all the blather about free speech surrounding Ahmadinejad' s appearance at Columbia, universities in America do not invite speakers who do not perfectly mirror the political views of their America-hating faculties. Rather, they aggressively censor differing viewpoints and permit only a narrow category of speech on their campuses. Ask Larry Summers. If a university invites someone to speak, you know the faculty agrees with the speaker. Maybe not the entire faculty. Some Columbia professors probably consider Ahmadinejad too moderate on Israel. Columbia president Lee Bollinger claimed the Ahmadinejad invitation is in keeping with Columbia's long-standing tradition of serving as a major forum for robust debate. Except Columbia doesn't have that tradition. This is worse than saying the dog ate my homework. It's like saying the dog ate my homework when you're Michael Vick and everyone knows you've killed your dog. Columbia's tradition is to shut down any speakers who fall outside the teeny, tiny seditious perspective of its professors. When Minutemen leader Jim Gilchrist and his black colleague Marvin Stewart were invited by the College Republicans to speak at Columbia last year, the tolerant, free-speech- loving Columbia students violently attacked them, shutting down the speech. Imbued with Bollinger's commitment to free speech, Columbia junior Ryan Fukumori said of the Minutemen: They have no right to be able to speak here. Needless to say -- unlike Ahmadinejad -- the university had not invited the Minutemen. Most colleges and universities wouldn't buy a cup of coffee for a conservative speaker. Fees for speakers who do not hate America are raised from College Republican fundraisers and contributions from patriotic alumni and locals who think students ought to hear at least one alternative viewpoint in four years of college. And then college administrators turn a blind eye when liberal apple- polishers and suck-ups shut down the speech or physically attack the speaker. Bollinger refused to punish the students who stormed the stage and violently ended the Minutemen's speech. So the one thing we know absolutely is that Bollinger did not allow Ahmadinejad to speak out of respect for free speech because Bollinger does not respect free speech. Only because normal, patriotic Americans were appalled by Columbia's invitation of Ahmadinejad to speak was Bollinger forced into the ridiculous position of denouncing Ahmadinejad when introducing him. Then why did you invite him? And by the way, I'll take a denunciation if college presidents would show up at my speeches and drone on for 10 minutes about free speech before I begin. At Syracuse University last year, when liberal hecklers tried to shut down a speech by a popular conservative author of (almost!) six books, College Republicans began to remove the hecklers. But Dean of Students Roy Baker blocked them from removing students disrupting the speech on the grounds that removing students screaming during a speech would violate the hecklers' free speech. They had a free speech right to prevent anyone from hearing a conservative' s free speech. That's what colleges mean by free speech. (And by the way, my fingers are getting exhausted from making air quotes every time I use the expression free speech in relation to a college campus.) Tolerance of opposing views means we have to listen to their anti- American views, but they don't
[FairfieldLife] News from Burma: Monks Bludgeoned to death
Subject: News from Burma Date: Fri, 28 Sep 2007 09:02:17 +0700 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Dear Friends, I hope you are well. My wife Miemie, who is Burmese, asked me to forward the following message to the largest audience possible. Thanks for you attention. Warm regards, Claude Brina *Silken East Co., Ltd* 1249 Charoen Krung Road - Soi 47/3 Gems Tower / 31st Floor / Room 204 A Bangrak Bangkok 10500 (Thailand) Phone: +66 (0)2 267 4606 Fax: +66 (0)2 267 4608 *From:* Miemie *Sent:* Fri 9/28/2007 12:18 AM *To:* [EMAIL PROTECTED] *Subject:* bludgeoning monks by the 'lone-tein' We just got phone call with our sister living in Yangon about a few hours ago. We saw on BBC world, saying that 200 monks were arrested. The true picture is far worse! For one instance, the monastery at an obscure neighborhood of Yangon, called Ngwe Kyar Yan (on Wei-za-yan-tar Road, Yangon) had been raided early this morning. A troop of lone-tein (riot police comprised of paid thugs) protected by the military trucks, raided the monastery with 200 studying monks. They systematically ordered all the monks to line up and banged and crushed each one's head against the brick wall of the monastery. One by one, the peaceful, non resisting monks, fell to the ground, screaming in pain. Then, they tore off the red robes and threw them all in the military trucks (like rice bags) and took the bodies away. The head monk of the monastery, was tied up in the middle of the monastery, tortured , bludgeoned, and later died the same day, today. Tens of thousands of people gathered outside the monastery, warded off by troops with bayoneted rifles, unable to help their helpless monks being slaughtered inside the monastery. Their every try to forge ahead was met with the bayonets. When all is done, only 10 out of 200 remained alive, hiding in the monastery. Blood stained everywhere on the walls and floors of the monastery. Please tell your audience of the full extent of the fate of the monks please please 'Arrested' is not enough expression. They have been bludgeoned to death !! Aye Aye
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Ricks enlightened friends
Like I've said many times here you begin making progress towards enlightenment once you stop worrying about whether you are enlightened or anyone else is enlightened. Aggravating over it which seems to be a favorite hobby here just slows the process. shempmcgurk wrote: Why all this debate about who is and who isn't enlightened? I suggest that you do what I do: assume EVERYONE you meet in life -- whether meditators or not -- are enlightened. Even the born agains. Make it your default. And if people, through their words or actions, demonstrate that they aren't enlightened, then okay, that's their problem. But why WOULDN'T you assume everyone you come in contact with is enlightened? I mean, why shouldn't you? Don't you want to see the best in everybody?
RE: [FairfieldLife] To Rick Archer/ On Reciting God's Name
I congratulate the writer. This is meaningful. Rick Archer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: My own experience, and my observation of those whom I consider to have most successfully achieved the goal of meditation practice, does not corroborate your theory. The realized people I know, on this forum and in my personal life, tend to be dynamic, clear-thinking, decisive, even forceful individuals who are above average in their ability to fulfill their desires. They are not meek, submissive, subservient, or drained. They tend to respect the guru or gurus from whom they have learned, but are quite independent of them now, thinking their own thoughts and putting things in their own terms based on their own experience. It is the goal of true gurus to produce such individuals. Gurus are just people who are farther up the mountain, or perhaps sitting on its summit. They can be useful in pointing out the best route up, or in reminding you that you havent reached the summit if youre sitting on your butt thinking you have. To my understanding, you dont unite with gods by using a bija mantra. You transcend the mantra and realize the ground state of all existence, including the gods existence. The realized people I know dont see themselves as having united with a god. They see all life from ants to gods as being particles or facets of their infinite nature. No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.13.33/1034 - Release Date: 9/27/2007 5:00 PM - Luggage? GPS? Comic books? Check out fitting gifts for grads at Yahoo! Search.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Ricks enlightened friends
On Sep 28, 2007, at 10:15 AM, Ron wrote: My experience with it is I have been with and read about both those self proclaiming as above and also those proclaimed enlightened by their Guru who also were proclaimed enlightened by their Guru in a chain continueing upwards. The Self procalimed fell apart every time under scrutiny. I have seen a lot in the last two years like this- maybe 20. I've had the exact same experience. And you're right it's becoming almost a common claim in some circles. The common denominator is almost always some sort of involvement in Neo- / Pseudo- advaita movements / gurus or their writings. From my POV, this is largely a Green Meme pathology (aka the Mean Green Meme or MGM). Some believe it may be a stalling mechanism in the jump to a more collective increase in world consciousness. It would be very interesting in the future to see some psychological and sociological research on this phenomenon.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Ricks enlightened friends
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I agree with you about premature claims to enlightenment. I think they are common. I read this and I had to chuckle-- my history with flashy I'm there! experiences, pointing towards enlightenment, has been that just when I thought I had awakened, the overwhelming and unbalanced (key words here) bliss would wear off, and there was nothing I could do to get it back, for awhile. And the longest the flashy stuff lasted was about a week, so as embarassing as any premature claims to myself were, they were mercifully short lived (and very disappointing at the time). Contrast that with the permanent experience, which is more of a concrete shift in perspective, in being, which cannot be diminished or eliminated, no matter how hard I try- lol!:-)
[FairfieldLife] Either pregnant or not- same with enlightenment
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I agree with you about premature claims to enlightenment. I think they are common. If the people I'm referring to were saying I have reached the pinnacle of human evolution or if they displayed egotism or even if they were setting themselves up as gurus, I'd doubt them. All of them have achieved significant degrees of awakening, all acknowledge that there's plenty more growth to undergo, not only for themselves but for MMY, Amma, your guru, CAPS ONLY TO FIND MY RESPONSE- MY GURU SAYS THERE IS A DEEPENING ONCE ONE IS ENLIGHTENED and any living being, no matter how enlightened, and all are living private lives and are not inclined to become gurus. MY GURU EXPLAINS ONE IS COMMISSIONED TO BE A GURU, IT IS NOT A DESIRE, AMBITION. OR CHOICE If they were, that wouldn't rule out their enlightenment in my estimation, but it would make them suspect of ambition-based motives for claiming enlightenment. All of the folks I'm referring to have TM backgrounds. A few have branched out into other things. If the guru's stamp of approval were an absolute necessity for realization, no one in the TM movement could become realized, because MMY doesn't do that. MMY WAS CAGED UP ALL THESE YEARS BECAUSE OF A WRONG VASTU. IF YOU BUY INTO A GURU NOT BEING ABLE TO TAKE THE DISCIPLES FURTHER THAN HE IS, THEN IT IS UNDERSTANDABLE WHY MMY DOESN'T GIVE THE STAMP OF APRAOVAL. EVEN IF HE DID, WHERE IS HIS STAMP? IF YOU BUY INTO THE CONCEPT THAT EVEN A SICK MAN CAN OWN A HEALTH FOOD STORE-GO AHEAD AND GET YOUR GUIDANCE FROM HIM - YOUR CHOICE You can think you are realized yet not be. THAT IS WHAT I HAVE RUN INTO But if you are realized, you'll know it. SEEMS TRUE BUT ALSO THIS SAME SPEACH IS COMING FROM THOSE NOT REALIZED Your experience will be sufficient confirmation. I ALSO HAVE HEARD UNENLIGHTENED SAY THIS ABOUT THEIR OWN EXPERIENCE. THERE WAS ONE WHO WROTE TO MY GURU WITH HER DECLARATION OF ENLIGHTENMENT, AND THEN EXPLAINING HOW THEY WERE LAUGHING AT MY GURU BECAUSE THEY KNEW FOR CERTAIN SHE WAS NOT ENLIGHTENED. THIS SAME ONE DID A 180 DEGREE TURNAROUND AND THEN ADMITTED IT WAS SHE HERSELF THAT WAS NOT ENLIGHTENED , THEN WHAT UNFOLDED IN THE MONTHS AHEAD WAS THIS PERSON WAS THE ONE DEPRESSED, ANGRY AND MAYBE EVEN SUICIDAL And you'll be the only one at your graduation. LETS SEE WHAT HAPPENS REGARDING THE OTHER POSTS, THERE IS A GREAT VALUE IN THE CLARITY OF KNOWING WHO IS AND IS NOT ENLIGHTENED. IF YOU DONT AGREE WITH THIS, FINE- YOU HAVE YOUR OPINION, I JUST GAVE MIINE. I HAVE GIVEN REASONS WHY IT IS OF VALUE- SORRY FOR THE CAPS- TOO LATE NOW
[FairfieldLife] Why is search not working?
Has anyone else noticed this?
[FairfieldLife] What's the Most....
What's the greatest and most satisfying thing a person can accomplish in the material, relative world?
[FairfieldLife] Re: To Rick Archer/ On Reciting God's Name
Comment below: ** --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bronte Baxter [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: **snip** If you say you don't need it, you simply find it useful, I challenge you to give up mantra meditation, chanting sessions and all other devotional activities for two weeks. I'll bet you can't do it without tremendous effort. Your ability to take it or leave it would prove or disprove my theory that you are already part-possessed. You say your realized friends are dynamic and independent thinkers who still respect their former teachers. Maybe some are, but I'll bet not those who namahed their way to where they're at. My dear friends who follow devotional paths have trouble making decisions, trouble taking control of situations. They take the attitude that life will happen to them according to God's will, and have difficulty taking action toward a desire or goal. They tell me they feel stuck in the routine of their lives much of the time. Their tendency is to wait for God to do things for them, so life happens to them rather than life being something they dynamically create. They tend to accept what they're told as true, rather than examine the root issues at the base of their assumptions. This is very different from the enlightened people I know who don't follow devotional paths or gurus in general. **snip to end** Bronte, this position (above) doesn't comport with my experience at all and I suspect others would find it equally contradictory to their own. Sometime in the early or mid-90s, after some 20+ years of TM meditation and assorted TMO techniques I discontinued the practice entirely, gave up being a vegetarian and pretty much just gave up the whole spiritual lifestyle, at least as I had been living it up to that time. Never noticed a difference; no tremendous effort, no DTs while I purged the energy-sucking gods from my system, no headaches or anything. However, sometime at the beginning of 2001 I got the impulse to start meditation again and was pleased with how excellent and enjoyable it was. After some period of time I got all Hindu again and have for some time engaged in devotional behavior within that framework and even constant repetition of mantra as I believe I mentioned in an earlier post. It's all fine; I'm active, both physically and mentally, maintain relationships, both familial and otherwise, work well with others in a demanding environment (criminal trial lawyer), exhibit appropriate behavior in most situations and enjoy life tremendously. And yet, it does seem difficult to actually entertain a 'me'. Life feels much like it did when I was a very young child; it does feel very automatic and goes along all on its own. Don't claim to be enlightened but can't honestly claim that that's not the case, either. Bharitu's suggestion that not paying attention to enlightenment as either one's own goal or as some metric in the evaluation of others, might actually facilitate its dawn more easily would be my position on the subject as well. The dynamic you propose (above and in earlier posts) just isn't my experience whatsoever. Just throwing that into the hopper for your consideration. Marek
[FairfieldLife] Re: What's the Most....
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, suziezuzie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What's the greatest and most satisfying thing a person can accomplish in the material, relative world? If you want a straight answer, I would say: be who you are. All of us have different talents, so there is no one single thing that one can focus on. (or it could be the TM agenda if you're into that.) If this is a rhetorical question, then let us have the answer. Regards, John R.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Challenge -- say something true
off_world_beings wrote: Bliss is entirely comfortable, as those who have experienced it know. Total comfort is entirely blissful, as those who can appreciate it to the fullest know. Tautology is mere rhetoric, the use of redundant language that adds no information whatsoever. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tautology
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Breaking News - Iran Invites U.N. Inspectors to Search for Homosexuals
2007-09-28
Thread
Samadhi Is Much Closer Than You Think -- Really! -- It's A No-Brainer. Who'd've Thunk It?
This story, reposted as we saw it here, is bringing forth vast peels of laughter everywhere I post it. It's been fun, indeed. ;-) On 9/27/07, off_world_beings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Rick lives ! ! ! It was all just a vast and convoluted widespread internet rumour ! Alright ! .. .glad it wasn't true ! OffWorld --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Breaking News Ahmadinejad Invites U.N. Inspectors to Search for Homosexuals Permits Use of Advanced Gaydar Just days after asserting that there are no homosexuals in Iran, Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad today invited United Nations inspectors into his country to search for homosexuals. We have nothing to hide, Mr. Ahmadinejad said in a speech to the United Nations General Assembly. You can search the entire country – even the airport bathrooms. While some senior U.S. diplomats expressed scepticism about the Iranian president's offer to allow U.N. inspectors to search his country for homosexuals, Mr. Ahmadinejad attempted to silence the sceptics by permitting the use of advanced gaydar technology as part of the proposed inspections. In Iran we have the most advanced gaydar in the world and we are prepared to share it with you, he said. In the immediate aftermath of Mr. Ahmadinejad's speech, it was unclear as to who would lead the U.N.'s inspection efforts, but most diplomats assumed that the task would fall to Mohamed ElBaradei, head of the International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA). At a press conference at the United Nations, Mr. ElBaradei acknowledged that he had no previous experience searching for homosexuals, but said that if chosen to lead the inspection effort he would make sure that the inspections were rigorous and thorough. The possibility that Iran may possess homosexuals is a serious matter to the world community, Mr. ElBaradei said. There has been evidence for some time that Iran may be attempting to build a Broadway musical. Elsewhere, President Bush made his first official comment on the situation in Myanmar, telling reporters, I will support whichever side is easier to pronounce.
[FairfieldLife] Thoughts on Ken's Burns The War
The 14 hour Ken Burn's documentary on World War II debuted this week on PBS. Since 14 hours is quite a bit to invest I have been archiving it to watch when I have time. I just completed episode one and was struck with something that isn't really covered: World War II was about going after three tyrants: Hitler, Mussolini and General Tojo who were out to establish empires. What's left out: how did they get there in the first place? They didn't get their on their own. Who backed them? Who were the industrialists and bankers who backed them and why? The answer so far wasn't in the first episode so it will be interesting to see if it is at all in the remaining ones. In fact the impression I got was that the war was more a failed exercise in trying to reduce the world's population dramatically. And there is a section on how they got people in the US to buy bonds to finance the war but no answer as to who made all the money off the weapons sales. That should be part of the story too. And isn't it interesting at a time when there is much saber rattling over Iran such a documentary should come out?
[FairfieldLife] DS responds to response to Rick Archer RE: Enlightenment
Please note. To save time, I am placing my responses in CAPS minus the shouting. They easily distinguish my responses from the rest of the text. Thank you for your understanding. David Spero OK Rick, Now asking in public so all can participate. THANK YOU FOR THE INVITATION TO ENTER THIS DISCUSSION. I suspect that all of those that you know that you say are realized have proclaimed this on their own without their Guru declaring this, or they did not or currently do not have a guru, or they have their own inner Guru- either in some form or otherwise. It does seem that enlightenment is also possible without the guru but I think it is very rare. Even Ramana, from which this idea that it is possible, had a Guru (acording to my guru- I think the name was Archula). HERE IS WHAT RAMANA SAID: THE SELF, OR THE ATMAN, IS THE GURU. HE ALSO SAYS THAT THE SELF - OR GRACE - MAY GUIDE THE SEEKER TO FIND AN OUTER (LIVING) GURU. I'VE NOT HEARD ABOUT RAMANA HAVING AN EXTERNAL GURU. PLEASE HAVE YOUR GURU SEND YOU THE SOURCE OF HIS KNOWLEDGE ABOUT THIS GURU SO WE CAN LEARN ABOUT HIM OR HER. You pointed out that among other functions with the Guru is telling one to continue even though they think they have arrived. This is the key missing element for those self proclaiming as above because a Sat Guru in living form can quiclky see if there is further to go once they are with the people for some time. That is how it works in my path. AN APPOINTED GURU IS NO GUARANTEE OF AUTHENTICITY. ON THE CONTRARY, SPIRITUAL LINEAGES AND MOVEMENTS OFTEN CARRY A LOT OF POLITICAL BAGGAGE. AN APPOINTED, BONA-FIDE GURU - REALIZED OR NOT - IS JUST A BODY WITH A REPUTATION ATTACHED TO IT. My experience with it is I have been with and read about both those self proclaiming as above and also those proclaimed enlightened by their Guru who also were proclaimed enlightened by their Guru in a chain continueing upwards. The Self procalimed fell apart every time under scrutiny. I have seen a lot in the last two years like this- maybe 20. AND MANY APPOINTED GURUS HAVE ALSO BITTEN THE DUST IN PUBLIC HUMILIATION AND DISGRACE. THE PLAYING FIELD IS EVEN: NEITHER THE APPOINTED NOR THE SELF- PROCLAIMED HOLD ANY ADVANTAGE OVER THE OTHER. It is a subtle difference by quite clear to me, with the aide of my guru pointing out the diffferences. There is a value to it- keeping holy company is wise, so good to make sure the company one keeps is 100% holy sometimes. HOLINESS IS MERELY APPEARANCE AND THERE ARE NO OUTER BEHAVIORIAL CRITERIA TO JUDGE WHETHER SOMEONE IS ENLIGHTENED OR NOT. Some of these people screw others up in various ways. Most amazing I saw was one with all the perfect words describing themselves as enlightened. What came out once there was an association with Sat Guru was this person was depressed, angry. and with violent thoughts. I'VE MET MANY PROFOUNDLY WOUNDED PEOPLE AFTER STUDYING UNDER HIGHLY ACCLAIMED, APPOINTED GURUS. I just recently saw in person a guru proclaiming his disciples enlightened, however the guru himself is a self proclaimed enlightened one, and this also looks flawed. The topic is a tricky one. YES, IT IS. SO PLEASE TRY NOT TO SOUND SO CERTAIN ABOUT THIS SUBJECT. NAMASTE, DS Hridaya Puri
[FairfieldLife] Re: To Rick Archer/ On Reciting God's Name
You mentioned earlier your own experience of both the infinite Self background bliss and of the relative self, not seeing any contradictions. Why isn't it the relative self in the background going about it's usual business and the infinite Self that is the centre of gravity identity, as one would expect this to override/ overwhelm everything else - like sunshine blotting out moon and star light in daytime..? Also how is it that the Self, once established in a permanent way, remains associated with a parrticular elative self? How come, in other words, you don't get experiences coming from other relative selves apart from your own? I'm thinikng of the analogy of an actor playing different roles - he can be this or other character AND himself as transcendental from such roles... --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: My own experience, and my observation of those whom I consider to have most successfully achieved the goal of meditation practice, does not corroborate your theory. The realized people I know, on this forum and in my personal life, tend to be dynamic, clear-thinking, decisive, even forceful individuals who are above average in their ability to fulfill their desires. They are not meek, submissive, subservient, or drained. They tend to respect the guru or gurus from whom they have learned, but are quite independent of them now, thinking their own thoughts and putting things in their own terms based on their own experience. It is the goal of true gurus to produce such individuals. Gurus are just people who are farther up the mountain, or perhaps sitting on its summit. They can be useful in pointing out the best route up, or in reminding you that you haven't reached the summit if you're sitting on your butt thinking you have. To my understanding, you don't unite with gods by using a bija mantra. You transcend the mantra and realize the ground state of all existence, including the gods' existence. The realized people I know don't see themselves as having united with a god. They see all life from ants to gods as being particles or facets of their infinite nature. No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.13.33/1034 - Release Date: 9/27/2007 5:00 PM
[FairfieldLife] Will we become mindless in enlightenment?
Amy: Will we become mindless and not be able to write, speak, and thus work, take care of ourselves, etc. in the midst of this process? Sarojini: Oh no, dear, dear one. This will not be the case what-so- ever. The body/mind will continue on, for the most part, as it always has. The conditionings and personality will not be affected, unless of course one comes to find a previous conditioning useless and not worth expending energy upon, but nothing changes. This ones friends, family and aquaintances do not notice much difference at all. All the responsibilities of this one are still taken care of, Perfectly. Not by a me, but by Pure Intelligence, Grace and Great Peace al-0ne. There may be a few funny quirks, but they are nothing to be taken *seriously* and are rather endearing. Amy: Swami G. seems to be able to do these things quite well and she has already gone through the process. Sarojini: Yes. Our dear SatGuru is Living Proof that there is nothing to fear. Life goes on, the body/mind goes on and everything is taken care of Perfectly by Life itself. There's nothing else to it and not a thing to worry about at all.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Challenge -- say something true
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, qntmpkt [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --Thanks, Offworld, btw one of my hobbies is getting a rise out of people...it's a fun game; Oh I'm sorry, I didn't realize you were a retard, since that is the games of the mentally deficient. I am sorry. (Great hobby you go there) (people should have some signal on the internet to let people know they are mentally retarded . It would make for clearer interactions - compassion for the retard an' all that) nevertheless this doesn't detract from my claim of illogic in your chain of statements. I'll just mention one item:, to quote: Being at home, therefore you are happy in this universe, which is your cherished home where you grew up as a species. I simply can't fathom how you arrived at therefore you are happy in this universe, from being at home. Doesn't compute. No, I realise now, why it won't compute under any efforts by your brain. Makes sense now. Enjoy your day. Look three ways when crossing the road. Don't kick any dogs today, and keep your hands out of the toilet bowl. Ok bud...enjoy. OffWorld
[FairfieldLife] Re: To Rick Archer/ On Reciting God's Name
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, claudiouk [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You mentioned earlier your own experience of both the infinite Self background bliss and of the relative self, not seeing any contradictions. Why isn't it the relative self in the background going about it's usual business and the infinite Self that is the centre of gravity identity, as one would expect this to override/ overwhelm everything else - like sunshine blotting out moon and star light in daytime..? Activity is just more noticeable.:-) Also how is it that the Self, once established in a permanent way, remains associated with a parrticular elative self? How come, in other words, you don't get experiences coming from other relative selves apart from your own? I'm thinikng of the analogy of an actor playing different roles - he can be this or other character AND himself as transcendental from such roles... Habit. That's all.:-)
[FairfieldLife] Re: WHOOPS! A FLAME HAS IGNITED!
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bronte Baxter [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: And you have zero logic or rationale or ANY argument whatsoever behind anything you say, except to attack me. Pathetic little man you are. OffWorld Bronte writes: Uh-oh, Off-World, my dear kundulini wise man, the fire got a little too hot for you, bro. You broke into A FLAME! You guys always say that. But I am saying those things in a totally calm voice...can't you tell? A flame is dropping bombs on people. Roughing a guy up verbally for acting like a dumbass is the enlightened thing to do. An unenlightened person would be all nice about it at all times. Though I am not enlightened and never claimed to be, you MAY be falling in to the trap that believes and promotes the idea all enlightened people must appear to be nicey nicey all the time. That is a fallacy. The Gita says as much, and it makes sense. It's not all your fault. Your opponent was putting you down without doing outright namecalling. But you are the one who crossed clearly over the line. Come on, you guys! This is supposed to be FUN! It is funto a point. But the guy said, in another post here, that he trolls the internet purely for the purpose of annoying people and this gives him a rise. Buddy, please quit saying Off World doesn't know beans about logic just because he disagrees with you. That seems unfair. And where I come from, with a minor in philosophy, a tautology was considered an error if you were using it as reasoning to prove something. Maybe, as a former logic teacher, you could explain to us how and when tautology is a good thing. A tautology in logic is true under all circumstances. In logic if a statement is not tautological, then it becomes questionable as to its truth under all angles of inquiry. A tautololgy is the best statement in logic to achieve. Anything else is questionable. A formula is valid (a tautology)... is true in all possible worlds. A formula is said to be valid if it is valid in all models ... A valid formula is called a tautology. Predicate Logic (or Predicate Calculus or First-Order Logic) is a generalization of Propositional Logic. Generalization requires the introduction of variables...A formula that is valid is called a tautology. http://cs.wwc.edu/~aabyan/Logic/Modal.html If your argument is not tautological in its statements then it is weaker. However, I did not use tautology as the hypotheses and conclusion as qntpkt claimed. What you and the others here have been taught is a tautology in rhetoric, which is not logic, but the art of persuasion. You are both brilliant entities, and together we Fairfield Lifers are exploring life more deeply and figuring out the universe. Please don't put each other down, because you're both BEAUTIFUL and NEITHER ONE of you deserves it! It hurts all of us when you hurt each other here. I love you guys. I think qtmpkt and yagyax are Shempgurk under other guises. OffWorld .
[FairfieldLife] Re: Challenge -- say something true
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Richard J. Williams [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: off_world_beings wrote: Bliss is entirely comfortable, as those who have experienced it know. Total comfort is entirely blissful, as those who can appreciate it to the fullest know. Tautology is mere rhetoric, the use of redundant language that adds no information whatsoever. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tautology Lol, I'm afraid a quick jump into Wikipedia will not educate you on this topic willtex. Take 3 weeks, come back when you understand tautology in LOGIC, which is not the same thing as RHETORIC. OffWorld
[FairfieldLife] Ramana's Guru, comments about needing a Guru
**Note- G = Swami Ganaga Puri ( my Guru), the asteric is a disciple of Christine Breese, who has videos up on your tube: As for the real question about whether this is true, RAMANA contradicted his own teaching that the guru is necessary (and he would be tickled to see that this has come up!). After all, who was his teacher? He did not have one except sitting in meditation and bringing forth the wisdom from within. Is that not being one's own teacher? G FAR from being tickled Here is what Sri Ramana said on these subjects. My suggestion is that you buy some books on Ramana and research it for yourself. Ramana did not contradict his own teachings as you will see. G i also had some Guru's that weren't seen - and this has nothing to do with being your own guru. Here is what Ramana said about these subjects - Q; How did some great persons attain knowledge without a guru ? A: To a few *mature* persons the Lord shines as the formless light of knowledge and imparts Awareness to the Truth. (pg 93) G Ramana went on to say - i have never said that there is no need for a guru. Q: Sri Aurobindo and others refer to you as having had no guru. A: The Guru is Absolutely necessary. The Upanishads say that none but a Guru can take a man out of the jungle of intellect and sense perceptions. So there Must be a Guru. Q: I mean a human Guru - Maharishi didn't have one. A: I might have had one at one time or other. But did i not sing hymns to Arunachala ?(paraphrase as is long) When man leaves materialism aside and prays to know God then God appears to him in some forn or other, human or non human, to guide him to himself in answer to his prayers. Q. J Krishnamurti says no Guru is necessary. A. How did he know it ? One can say so *After* Realizing (Realization) and NOT before. Q is it absolutely necessary to have a Guru if one is seeking Self Realization ? A: So long as duality persists in you the Guru is necessary. Because you identify yourself with the body you think that the Guru is also a body. You are not the body and neither is the Guru. You are the Self and so is the Guru. This knowledge is gained by what you call Self Realization. G knowledge *gained* isn't talking about a conceptual understanding it is talking about a cannot be denied Reality that becomes ones Conscious Awareness in every moment of every day- * I'm Jenny and I maintain this site for University Of Metaphysical Sciences and Christine. Aaah, yes, there are quite a few people who believe a teacher is absolutely and undeniably necessary. However, Christine says a new paradigm makes it possible for people to awaken without the teacher moreso than ever before. Veils aren't so thick anymore. As for the contradiction (see Christine's talk on Paradox, Its All True), both are true. Some need the teacher, others don't. G many are starting to awaken - but starting to awaken is a far cry from not needing a Guru. What is She doing ? Being a Guru - Guru means dispeller of Darkness - (it doesn't mean one that has adoring fawning devotees) Any teacher that is attempting to bring Guidance in Spirituality is a Guru. They may not be a Sat Guru which is a Realized Actualized ONE - but they are attempting to break through the coverings to the Truth of Being. THIS IS A GURU - no matter how you want to spin it the Truth is they are acting as Guru's. A friend is someone you pal around with - hang out with- yaps endlessly with about each others troubles. And while people want to hear (as it is so ego affirming) i am Not a Guru i am your friend. Let's see how many of these Not Guru's will let their friends come on a moments notice just to hang out and shoot the breeze. i doubt that is going to happen. Try to call up Gangaji or Christine and say look i'm not interested in going to the retreat let's hang out and be friends - what do you think the response is going to be ? While a Guru on one hand may be your best *friend* as they are there to shed light on what you are not seeing clearly within your self or path , the Guru is not there to be your buddy and pal. * For those who believe they need the teacher, then yes, the teacher is necessary. For those who don't believe it, then no, the teacher is not necessary. Both are possible. In another talk Christine mentions to try not to think a single thought for 5 minutes. If you can pass that test, you are ready to start being your own teacher and bring out the transmission and wisdom from within that resides in the One Self that we all are, which is the same resource the teacher brings it from. G IF they need to HEAR that then they Need a Guide. Even IF one can have a quiet mind - and i had a quiet mind Many Many years before even halfway coming close to realization. And even with that was caught in delusion and it was only through the Compassion of my Guru (who i thought i didn't need because all of these wonderful
[FairfieldLife] Re: Thoughts on Ken's Burns The War
Bhairitu, I agree. IMO, there is a cabal of backroom evil rich manipulators running things, and it makes perfect sense that the follow the money concept is never supported in most documentary endeavors -- too risky to the film-maker to snoop around in Big Finance's underwear drawer, and way hard to get the legal access to do so. But, evil dictators, well, documentary makers CAN get the data on them. There was a reason for Deep Throat to keep his identity hidden, cuz he was telling Woodward and Bernstein to follow the money, and if the money folks found out, POOF! goes Deepy. As long as the masses are having their attentions misdirected towards focal-points of evil -- Hitler the person for instance -- then the money is not followed, and instead the group consciousness is put upon the failings of one person -- NOT HIS SUPPORTERS, CREATORS, BACKERS, BOSSES, whatever. The people who backed Hitler are still in business today -- sultan rich and Satan evil. Saddam was said to be the problem, ya see?, not the USA's obscene oil habit which caused the powers that be to think that they needed to control (own) Iraq's oil (the whole region actually) and so, suddenly, Saddam became the evil dictator that had to be stomped even though he was PUT INTO POWER BY THE USA. His country is invaded, 500 thousand INNOCENT civilians get killed, and Saddam's the blame -- when largely speaking, we supported and allowed his crimes that we armed him for and encouraged him to do. Poison gas sold to him by the USA killed the Kurds. And it was that very poison gas we called a weapon of mass destruction and used as a reason for the invasion. And, get this, Saddam would still be in power right now if he hadn't started messing around the value of the dollar by selling his oil and taking euros for it -- pushing the world closer to a petro-euro instead of a petro-dollar. That was Saddam's real, actual and ONLY mistake in the eyes of the lords of power. We prop up dictators all the time to deflect the world's attention to one person, one race, one ethnicity, like that. You don't have to look far for these evil types -- they're everywhere. The bankers arranged for a PRIVATE COMPANY to have ALL OF AMERICA'S seigniorage. The gold standard was tossed. Income tax for the non-rich. BigMedia's being in bed with BigMoney assures we'll always have a bad guy trotted out to piss off the masses enough to get another war going. We won't bomb Iran until after we make sure that the masses are certain that our soldiers have been bombed by Iran. We won't see headlines about all the ways we can employ to piss off Iran enough for them to bomb back at us. We won't be told -- simple as that. Pre-Pearl Harbor, we cut off Japan's oil supplies; do you think that pissed them off? 19 terrorists may have been all it took to make 911 happen, but what did it takes to get them pissed off enough to give up their lives to fight back? How about hundreds of millions of people being brutalized daily in a thousand ways? Abu Ghraib prison -- only the small fry got indicted, but generals on down knew about it. Kerry lost the election -- who is following the money that Supreme Court Justices get? Pelosi won't try to impeach Bush -- why? Cuz it will hurt her cash flow somehow -- follow the money and see what big companies are fluffing up her accounts. 20,000,000 Mexicans came across the border and no one noticed -- except BigMoney which needed temporary slaves. Okay, I'm going to stop here. Outta control again. Can't put my attention on these things without risking ruining my day. Edg --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The 14 hour Ken Burn's documentary on World War II debuted this week on PBS. Since 14 hours is quite a bit to invest I have been archiving it to watch when I have time. I just completed episode one and was struck with something that isn't really covered: World War II was about going after three tyrants: Hitler, Mussolini and General Tojo who were out to establish empires. What's left out: how did they get there in the first place? They didn't get their on their own. Who backed them? Who were the industrialists and bankers who backed them and why? The answer so far wasn't in the first episode so it will be interesting to see if it is at all in the remaining ones. In fact the impression I got was that the war was more a failed exercise in trying to reduce the world's population dramatically. And there is a section on how they got people in the US to buy bonds to finance the war but no answer as to who made all the money off the weapons sales. That should be part of the story too. And isn't it interesting at a time when there is much saber rattling over Iran such a documentary should come out?
[FairfieldLife] Re: Challenge -- say something true
Tautology is mere rhetoric, the use of redundant language that adds no information whatsoever. Lol, I'm afraid a quick jump into Wikipedia will not educate you on this topic willtex. off_world_beings wrote: Take 3 weeks, come back when you understand tautology in LOGIC, which is not the same thing as RHETORIC. Tautology in logic is a statement of propositional logic which can be inferred from any proposition whatsoever. Are we to infer that you used logic when you said that qtmpkt and yagyax are Shempgurk under other guises. LOL! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tautology
[FairfieldLife] Re: What's the difference between FFL and Columbia University
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Jason Spock [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: He again shoots himself in the foot by denying Gays. But then Iran is such a fucked up society that a survey taken in Iran on which is the most attractive part of a woman,, Almost all the men voted that the ankle is the most attractive part of a women.!! IMU, in Japan it's the neck!!
[FairfieldLife] Heather on Conan!
Just saw Heather Graham on Conan. (We are a couple of days behind here in Eastern Scandinavia.) She looked very lovely and girlish, but her constant, almost hysterical giggling was a tad bit disturbing...
[FairfieldLife] Re: DS responds to response to Rick Archer RE: Enlightenment
HERE IS WHAT RAMANA SAID: THE SELF, OR THE ATMAN, IS THE GURU. HE ALSO SAYS THAT THE SELF - OR GRACE - MAY GUIDE THE SEEKER TO FIND AN OUTER (LIVING) GURU. I'VE NOT HEARD ABOUT RAMANA HAVING AN EXTERNAL GURU. PLEASE HAVE YOUR GURU SEND YOU THE SOURCE OF HIS KNOWLEDGE ABOUT THIS GURU SO WE CAN LEARN ABOUT HIM OR HER. **Here is one excerpt from my gurus writtings: As Ramana melted within Arunachala obedient and surrendered and never did he leave his Guru's side. He came amidst all obstacles and Surrendered to it's wisdom as Shiva. He stayed once home without ever a thought of leaving. I have made a seperate post about Ramana, his Guru, and comments about needing a Guru AN APPOINTED GURU IS NO GUARANTEE OF AUTHENTICITY. ON THE CONTRARY, SPIRITUAL LINEAGES AND MOVEMENTS OFTEN CARRY A LOT OF POLITICAL BAGGAGE. AN APPOINTED, BONA-FIDE GURU - REALIZED OR NOT - IS JUST A BODY WITH A REPUTATION ATTACHED TO IT. ** First of all, I have promoted here that based in my experience, I recommed that for the unfoldment of enlightenment, one should have two things- a Sat Guru, then work one to one with this Guru. The reason why is it has been pointed out that it is a very rare one that will make it without this. I buy into this, so herewith is my beliefs expressed, as it usually is- I cant preference every line with this is my belief, but most of my posts, that is what it is. Now, I think most will not go along with this so not really to much need to figure out which guru is for real and which is not. What good is that? for one to fill up their encyclopedia brain? However, if there happens to be one here interested in a Sat Guru and working one to one, then he has to use his discrimination in picking. First thing is to see what is available, then narrow things down. when all is said and done, it is going to take faith for the part that is unknown to him and claimed to be known by the mentor. So, they can weigh all the logic presented and then choose the way they are going to choose. The complications are unlimited- Sai Baba and his boys, Muktananda and his girls, MMY and his kings and queens, If you research Muktananda, you get writtings as in TM where on the one hand he is not appointed by his Guru, on the other, things surface which claim he is- and this is only a short time into history- imagine what happens in a few hundred years, things will really be distorted AND MANY APPOINTED GURUS HAVE ALSO BITTEN THE DUST IN PUBLIC HUMILIATION AND DISGRACE. Who? each situation has to be looked at THE PLAYING FIELD IS EVEN: NEITHER THE APPOINTED NOR THE SELF- PROCLAIMED HOLD ANY ADVANTAGE OVER THE OTHER. Once you are interested in a guru, which most are not, then it is not just weather they are self proclaimed or not as the only criteria to pick a Guru. For example, my guru would recommend spending time with both the Guru and the sadakas to see how the consciousness and progress looks. In spending a short time, I have seen the real essence of the claims come to the surface and fall apart. Each seeker has to use his discretion, then procede HOLINESS IS MERELY APPEARANCE AND THERE ARE NO OUTER BEHAVIORIAL CRITERIA TO JUDGE WHETHER SOMEONE IS ENLIGHTENED OR NOT. IN my case, for example, a lasting exalted state of consciousness came about within a few days of being with my Guru and it is here now as a platform from which I am writting this. This again is a part of the discrimination used but a significant one. Each seeker has to weigh as much as he needs to weigh in order to choose. There is nothing on the outside with my guru that makes her seem any different than anyone. I'VE MET MANY PROFOUNDLY WOUNDED PEOPLE AFTER STUDYING UNDER HIGHLY ACCLAIMED, APPOINTED GURUS. As I said, if sadakas are like that, then this is a sign that this guru may not be a Sat Guru. Again, it is good to not only check out the Guru but also the sadakas YES, IT IS. SO PLEASE TRY NOT TO SOUND SO CERTAIN ABOUT THIS SUBJECT. My post is formulated by both my experience, then belief beyond my experience. I am certain about both but the belief part is revealing in that you know it is my belief- so then one can have their own beliefs and opinions- if they state if forcefully or not, either way is ok- we know it for what it is.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Thoughts on Ken's Burns The War
Duveyoung wrote: Bhairitu, I agree. IMO, there is a cabal of backroom evil rich manipulators running things, and it makes perfect sense that the follow the money concept is never supported in most documentary endeavors -- too risky to the film-maker to snoop around in Big Finance's underwear drawer, and way hard to get the legal access to do so. But, evil dictators, well, documentary makers CAN get the data on them. There was a reason for Deep Throat to keep his identity hidden, cuz he was telling Woodward and Bernstein to follow the money, and if the money folks found out, POOF! goes Deepy. As long as the masses are having their attentions misdirected towards focal-points of evil -- Hitler the person for instance -- then the money is not followed, and instead the group consciousness is put upon the failings of one person -- NOT HIS SUPPORTERS, CREATORS, BACKERS, BOSSES, whatever. The people who backed Hitler are still in business today -- sultan rich and Satan evil. Saddam was said to be the problem, ya see?, not the USA's obscene oil habit which caused the powers that be to think that they needed to control (own) Iraq's oil (the whole region actually) and so, suddenly, Saddam became the evil dictator that had to be stomped even though he was PUT INTO POWER BY THE USA. His country is invaded, 500 thousand INNOCENT civilians get killed, and Saddam's the blame -- when largely speaking, we supported and allowed his crimes that we armed him for and encouraged him to do. Poison gas sold to him by the USA killed the Kurds. And it was that very poison gas we called a weapon of mass destruction and used as a reason for the invasion. And, get this, Saddam would still be in power right now if he hadn't started messing around the value of the dollar by selling his oil and taking euros for it -- pushing the world closer to a petro-euro instead of a petro-dollar. That was Saddam's real, actual and ONLY mistake in the eyes of the lords of power. We prop up dictators all the time to deflect the world's attention to one person, one race, one ethnicity, like that. You don't have to look far for these evil types -- they're everywhere. The bankers arranged for a PRIVATE COMPANY to have ALL OF AMERICA'S seigniorage. The gold standard was tossed. Income tax for the non-rich. BigMedia's being in bed with BigMoney assures we'll always have a bad guy trotted out to piss off the masses enough to get another war going. We won't bomb Iran until after we make sure that the masses are certain that our soldiers have been bombed by Iran. We won't see headlines about all the ways we can employ to piss off Iran enough for them to bomb back at us. We won't be told -- simple as that. Pre-Pearl Harbor, we cut off Japan's oil supplies; do you think that pissed them off? 19 terrorists may have been all it took to make 911 happen, but what did it takes to get them pissed off enough to give up their lives to fight back? How about hundreds of millions of people being brutalized daily in a thousand ways? Abu Ghraib prison -- only the small fry got indicted, but generals on down knew about it. Kerry lost the election -- who is following the money that Supreme Court Justices get? Pelosi won't try to impeach Bush -- why? Cuz it will hurt her cash flow somehow -- follow the money and see what big companies are fluffing up her accounts. 20,000,000 Mexicans came across the border and no one noticed -- except BigMoney which needed temporary slaves. Okay, I'm going to stop here. Outta control again. Can't put my attention on these things without risking ruining my day. Edg Ah, but you see that IS the reality and anything else just the illusion. Perhaps more people need their days ruined so things will change. The money people are like slight-of-hand magicians. :)
[FairfieldLife] Re: Challenge -- say something true
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Richard J. Williams [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Tautology is mere rhetoric, the use of redundant language that adds no information whatsoever. Lol, I'm afraid a quick jump into Wikipedia will not educate you on this topic willtex. off_world_beings wrote: Take 3 weeks, come back when you understand tautology in LOGIC, which is not the same thing as RHETORIC. Tautology in logic is a statement of propositional logic which can be inferred from any proposition whatsoever. I asked you to study it for 3 weeks full-time, then come back when you have a proper understanding of it, and explain it in your own words. Go ahead now, we'll see you in 3 weeks. Are we to infer that you used logic when you said that qtmpkt and yagyax are Shempgurk under other guises. I employed fuzzy logic. OffWorld LOL! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tautology
[FairfieldLife] Re: News from Burma: Monks Bludgeoned to death
It is a pity Bush has spent all of America's credibility and bargaining power, all of its money, and all of its military in Iraq... fighting MDIXON's Dumbass War. GW Bush - worst president of all time. OffWorld --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Subject: News from Burma Date: Fri, 28 Sep 2007 09:02:17 +0700 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Dear Friends, I hope you are well. My wife Miemie, who is Burmese, asked me to forward the following message to the largest audience possible. Thanks for you attention. Warm regards, Claude Brina *Silken East Co., Ltd* 1249 Charoen Krung Road - Soi 47/3 Gems Tower / 31st Floor / Room 204 A Bangrak Bangkok 10500 (Thailand) Phone: +66 (0)2 267 4606 Fax: +66 (0)2 267 4608 *From:* Miemie *Sent:* Fri 9/28/2007 12:18 AM *To:* [EMAIL PROTECTED] *Subject:* bludgeoning monks by the 'lone-tein' We just got phone call with our sister living in Yangon about a few hours ago. We saw on BBC world, saying that 200 monks were arrested. The true picture is far worse! For one instance, the monastery at an obscure neighborhood of Yangon, called Ngwe Kyar Yan (on Wei-za-yan-tar Road, Yangon) had been raided early this morning. A troop of lone-tein (riot police comprised of paid thugs) protected by the military trucks, raided the monastery with 200 studying monks. They systematically ordered all the monks to line up and banged and crushed each one's head against the brick wall of the monastery. One by one, the peaceful, non resisting monks, fell to the ground, screaming in pain. Then, they tore off the red robes and threw them all in the military trucks (like rice bags) and took the bodies away. The head monk of the monastery, was tied up in the middle of the monastery, tortured , bludgeoned, and later died the same day, today. Tens of thousands of people gathered outside the monastery, warded off by troops with bayoneted rifles, unable to help their helpless monks being slaughtered inside the monastery. Their every try to forge ahead was met with the bayonets. When all is done, only 10 out of 200 remained alive, hiding in the monastery. Blood stained everywhere on the walls and floors of the monastery. Please tell your audience of the full extent of the fate of the monks please please 'Arrested' is not enough expression. They have been bludgeoned to death !! Aye Aye
[FairfieldLife] Re: Why is search not working?
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, m2smart4u2000 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Has anyone else noticed this? Yes. OffWorld
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Thoughts on Ken's Burns The War
On Sep 28, 2007, at 5:07 PM, Duveyoung wrote: Bhairitu, I agree. IMO, there is a cabal of backroom evil rich manipulators running things, and it makes perfect sense that the follow the money concept is never supported in most documentary endeavors -- too risky to the film-maker to snoop around in Big Finance's underwear drawer, and way hard to get the legal access to do so. But, evil dictators, well, documentary makers CAN get the data on them. There was a reason for Deep Throat to keep his identity hidden, cuz he was telling Woodward and Bernstein to follow the money, and if the money folks found out, POOF! goes Deepy. It's unrealistic to expect a Ken Burn's genre documentary to cover such intrigue and conspiracy theory material. You'll have to wait instead for Oliver Stone's version The War That Greed Built, co- written with Alex Jones.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Why is search not working?
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, m2smart4u2000 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Has anyone else noticed this? Yes. I thought Rick was going to ban me the other day, but then I noticed he had not posted for a while, so I looked for his last post to see if he had gone on holiday, and it took me to 2002 posts. So I quickly deduced that Rick must have passed on to bigger and better things. Soon that ballooned spontaneously into an internet hot topic, with people arguing about how people could die on the internet and no-one would know. The next thing I know a guy from South Africa does a video all about it on YouTube, discussing the case of Rick, and that video got 50,000+ views, and more than 20 video responces, and 3000+ comments. Then the secret service got edgy thinking it was a case of subterfuge, but they realised the mistake quickly and passed the buck to a lonely diplomat to the Falkland islands, who hung himself over the matter which caused a scandal in Parliament, and ultimately led to economic pressure being put on China to get to the bottom of this affair. This has ballooned out of proportion and ultimately led to Earth tremors in the Pacific ocean that threaten the stability of the Earth's crust. Finally, I put out the word that it was all a mistake, and Rick was just fine, and now all the chatter has subsided. Phew ! Close one. OffWorld
[FairfieldLife] Take a ride down Edg's street
One of the houses in this video is mine. Can you guess which one? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6PPtD_v4ezE Edg
[FairfieldLife] Shemp has propogated.
sinhlnx, yagyax, qtmpkt Nice one Shemp. OffWorld
[FairfieldLife] Ron Paul Raises $500,000 online in 3.5 days...
Ron Paul Raises $500,000 online in 3.5 days... http://youtube.com/watch?v=V5VPNupY0Bw OffWorld
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: News from Burma: Monks Bludgeoned to death
In a message dated 9/28/07 6:17:51 P.M. Central Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: It is a pity Bush has spent all of America's credibility and bargaining power, all of its money, and all of its military in Iraq... fighting MDIXON's Dumbass War. GW Bush - worst president of all time. OffWorld Do I read you right? Are you suggesting that Bush could have gone to war with Burma instead? ** See what's new at http://www.aol.com
[FairfieldLife] Re: News from Burma: Monks Bludgeoned to death
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 9/28/07 6:17:51 P.M. Central Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: It is a pity Bush has spent all of America's credibility and bargaining power, all of its money, and all of its military in Iraq... fighting MDIXON's Dumbass War. GW Bush - worst president of all time. OffWorld Do I read you right? Are you suggesting that Bush could have gone to war with Burma instead? No you don't read right, as usual. But your answer was predicted by me before you even thought of it yourself. How sad. OffWorld ** See what's new at http://www.aol.com
Re: [FairfieldLife] Take a ride down Edg's street
That's you best one yet. Yes, the red trailer with the tornado scar. On Sep 28, 2007, at 7:32 PM, Duveyoung wrote: One of the houses in this video is mine. Can you guess which one? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6PPtD_v4ezE Edg
Re: [FairfieldLife] News from Burma: Monks Bludgeoned to death
And the NeoCons are licking their chops to do that here. Probably starting in Fairfield. Vaj wrote: Subject: News from Burma Date: Fri, 28 Sep 2007 09:02:17 +0700 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Dear Friends, I hope you are well. My wife Miemie, who is Burmese, asked me to forward the following message to the largest audience possible. Thanks for you attention. Warm regards, Claude Brina *Silken East Co., Ltd* 1249 Charoen Krung Road - Soi 47/3 Gems Tower / 31st Floor / Room 204 A Bangrak Bangkok 10500 (Thailand) Phone: +66 (0)2 267 4606 Fax: +66 (0)2 267 4608 *From:* Miemie *Sent:* Fri 9/28/2007 12:18 AM *To:* [EMAIL PROTECTED] *Subject:* bludgeoning monks by the 'lone-tein' We just got phone call with our sister living in Yangon about a few hours ago. We saw on BBC world, saying that 200 monks were arrested. The true picture is far worse! For one instance, the monastery at an obscure neighborhood of Yangon, called Ngwe Kyar Yan (on Wei-za-yan-tar Road, Yangon) had been raided early this morning. A troop of lone-tein (riot police comprised of paid thugs) protected by the military trucks, raided the monastery with 200 studying monks. They systematically ordered all the monks to line up and banged and crushed each one's head against the brick wall of the monastery. One by one, the peaceful, non resisting monks, fell to the ground, screaming in pain. Then, they tore off the red robes and threw them all in the military trucks (like rice bags) and took the bodies away. The head monk of the monastery, was tied up in the middle of the monastery, tortured , bludgeoned, and later died the same day, today. Tens of thousands of people gathered outside the monastery, warded off by troops with bayoneted rifles, unable to help their helpless monks being slaughtered inside the monastery. Their every try to forge ahead was met with the bayonets. When all is done, only 10 out of 200 remained alive, hiding in the monastery. Blood stained everywhere on the walls and floors of the monastery. Please tell your audience of the full extent of the fate of the monks please please 'Arrested' is not enough expression. They have been bludgeoned to death !! Aye Aye
[FairfieldLife] Re: 'Seeking Sanskrit Translation'
YS III. 18: By bringing into direct perception the subliminal-impressions, there is knowledge of the earlier births. translation of the Yogasutra-s by T.S. Rukmani for the Yogavarttika of Vijnanabhiksu and the Yogasutrabhasyavivarana of Shankara --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, cardemaister [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Robert babajii_99@ wrote: Was wondering if anyone would have the Sanskrit translation for the Pantanjali Sutra for 'Knowledge of Past Lives', 'Lattent Impressions', is the english way of saying it, so. Anyway, thanks to I,me, mine, and all the interesting seekers of wisdom, who this forum of knowledge. R.G. Verona, Wisconsin. I guess you mean III 18: saMskaarasaakSaatkaraNaat puurvajaatijñaanam. (saMskaara-saakSaat-karaNaat puurva-jaati-jñaanam.) - Fussy? Opinionated? Impossible to please? Perfect. Join Yahoo!'s user panel and lay it on us.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: News from Burma: Monks Bludgeoned to death
In a message dated 9/28/07 7:09:51 P.M. Central Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: --- In [EMAIL PROTECTED] (mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com) , [EMAIL PROTECTED], MDi In a message dated 9/28/07 6:17:51 P.M. Central Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]) writes: It is a pity Bush has spent all of America's credibility and bargaining power, all of its money, and all of its military in Iraq... fighting MDIXON's Dumbass War. GW Bush - worst president of all time. OffWorld Do I read you right? Are you suggesting that Bush could have gone to war with Burma instead? No you don't read right, as usual. But your answer was predicted by me before you even thought of it yourself. How sad. OffWorld Well, sheesh! I don't know how I could have come up with that idea based on the title of the thread! ** See what's new at http://www.aol.com
[FairfieldLife] Fwd: Thank you for supporting Ron Paul I joined contributed $ as well
I was a former NLP candidate for congress an elector for NY state. Also an elector for the NY independence party. Now very comfortable with Ron Paul. ** See what's new at http://www.aol.com ---BeginMessage--- Dear WILLIAM LEED III, Thank you for signing up to receive email updates from the Ron Paul 2008 Presidential Campaign. This email is confirmation that we have received your contact information. We depend on supporters like you to help us spread the message of freedom, peace and prosperity through Ron Pauls candidacy. If you also indicated you are interested in volunteering, we will contact you soon with more information. Please add this email address to your email address or contact list to ensure that you will receive future messages. Thanks for joining the campaign! Note: If you received this message but did not sign up at www.ronpaul2008.com with this email address, please reply to this email with the word Unsubscribe in the subject and we will correct the error. ---End Message---
[FairfieldLife] Kundalini Through The Chakras
Does anyone have descriptions of experiences, perceptions resulting from raising the kundalini through the various chakras? Classic descriptions as well as personal experiences. Thank you, Satya When Shakyamuni Buddha was at Mount Grdhrakuta, he held up a flower to his listeners. Everyone was silent. Only Mahakashyapa broke into a broad smile. The Buddha said, I have the True Dharma Eye, the Marvelous Mind of Nirvana, the True Form of the Formless, and the Subtle Dharma Gate, independent of words and transmitted beyond doctrine. This I have entrusted to Mahakashyapa.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Fwd: Thank you for supporting Ron Paul I joined contributed $ as well
Right on bud. I've had differences with you in the past, but all roads lead to Rome in the end, and Ron Paul is the solution to all the diverse broken, and disparate opinions in America. Hope for America and the World ...at the current rate on his website he is raising possibly 2 million dollars a week ! ! ! Let's hope that continues. http://www.ronpaul2008.com/ OffWorld --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I was a former NLP candidate for congress an elector for NY state. Also an elector for the NY independence party. Now very comfortable with Ron Paul. ** See what's new at http://www.aol.com
[FairfieldLife] Re: News from Burma: Monks Bludgeoned to death
--Another brilliant comment from the tantric. - In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: And the NeoCons are licking their chops to do that here. Probably starting in Fairfield. Vaj wrote: Subject: News from Burma Date: Fri, 28 Sep 2007 09:02:17 +0700 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Dear Friends, I hope you are well. My wife Miemie, who is Burmese, asked me to forward the following message to the largest audience possible. Thanks for you attention. Warm regards, Claude Brina *Silken East Co., Ltd* 1249 Charoen Krung Road - Soi 47/3 Gems Tower / 31st Floor / Room 204 A Bangrak Bangkok 10500 (Thailand) Phone: +66 (0)2 267 4606 Fax: +66 (0)2 267 4608 *From:* Miemie *Sent:* Fri 9/28/2007 12:18 AM *To:* [EMAIL PROTECTED] *Subject:* bludgeoning monks by the 'lone-tein' We just got phone call with our sister living in Yangon about a few hours ago. We saw on BBC world, saying that 200 monks were arrested. The true picture is far worse! For one instance, the monastery at an obscure neighborhood of Yangon, called Ngwe Kyar Yan (on Wei-za-yan-tar Road, Yangon) had been raided early this morning. A troop of lone-tein (riot police comprised of paid thugs) protected by the military trucks, raided the monastery with 200 studying monks. They systematically ordered all the monks to line up and banged and crushed each one's head against the brick wall of the monastery. One by one, the peaceful, non resisting monks, fell to the ground, screaming in pain. Then, they tore off the red robes and threw them all in the military trucks (like rice bags) and took the bodies away. The head monk of the monastery, was tied up in the middle of the monastery, tortured , bludgeoned, and later died the same day, today. Tens of thousands of people gathered outside the monastery, warded off by troops with bayoneted rifles, unable to help their helpless monks being slaughtered inside the monastery. Their every try to forge ahead was met with the bayonets. When all is done, only 10 out of 200 remained alive, hiding in the monastery. Blood stained everywhere on the walls and floors of the monastery. Please tell your audience of the full extent of the fate of the monks please please 'Arrested' is not enough expression. They have been bludgeoned to death !! Aye Aye
