[FairfieldLife] Re: Hope Without Magical Thinking

[merudanda]

how revealing..WOW you got me serving you...u...  You do know now
what was in the drinks ??Do you?
Does it not, would it not endanger U.S. and FFL security, should not an
injunction to stop publication of the documents and pic sought?
Isn't that not too early to reveal?FBI and CIA beware

http://inthearena.blogs.cnn.com/2011/06/10/secret-nixon-tapes-expert-ken\
-hughes-at-the-release-of-the-pentagon-papers-forty-years-ago-richard-ni\
xon-was-gleeful-and-fearful/
http://tinyurl.com/5t46p6m


--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Yifu yifuxero@... wrote:

 thx, I was there at that time.

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_NC4d7MFA2Mk/SkTMbp3i99I/BlQ/JoxhxVDrbM\
k/s400/Louis+Wain+Cat+Postcard+Playing+Cards.jpg

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, merudanda no_reply@ wrote:
 
  Buck,thanks for sharing this...
  magical
  Roll up (AND) THAT'S AN INVITATION,
roll up for the mystery tour.
  Roll up TO MAKE A RESERVATION,
roll up for the mystery tour.
  The magical mystery tour is waiting to take you away,
  Waiting to take you away.
  Hoping to take you away.
  Dying to take you away, take you today

[FairfieldLife] Re: Hope Without Magical Thinking

[sparaig]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb no_reply@... wrote:
[...]
 That, after all, was the message of the first talk I
 ever heard Maharishi give. It's just too bad that he
 either was lying about what he said, or didn't believe 
 it thoroughly enough to follow through on it in his
 own teachings, and with his own students. If he had, 
 the world might have been a much better place, and
 they would certainly have been much stronger human 
 beings. Instead, just as he said in that first talk, 
 he wound up making them weaker.


The elders ofd the various AMerican Indian tribes who are encouraging their 
people to learn TM might object to your characterization of MMY's message.


Lawson

[FairfieldLife] Re: Hope Without Magical Thinking

[wayback71]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Buck dhamiltony2k5@... wrote:

 
 
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb no_reply@ wrote:
 
  Today for some reason I found myself thinking back to
  the first time I saw Maharishi, in 1967. At that talk,
  at the Greek Theater in Los Angeles, he said a few 
  things that got me interested enough in the spiritual 
  path that I set about walking it. 
 
 
 I went to the memorial service on MUM campus last nite.
 For Lilian Wallace, the Wallace family matriarch.  
 Very much an old TM/MUM trustees event, and some 
 of us other old-timers who have been around all alongside of this who are not 
 TM-Rajas.
 
 Very nice evening of primarily the Wallace family reminiscing about Lilian 
 Wallace.
 She was a very large personality that was along the whole way behind the 
 scenes
 of the TM-movement by virtue of Keith Wallace and Peter.  In character it 
 seems she was a glamorous strong willed person of the mid-20th century.  I 
 know her first in California at one of the Humbolt courses with Maharishi.  
 Was a big course with well over a thousand people.  Most of us sat in a field 
 house on folding chairs for the lectures.  Up front was an area of stuffed 
 chairs set out for the rich ladies from southern California.   They were 
 the supporters of the 1960's.  They were of that generation.  'Made-up' and 
 dolled up they were taken care of up there.  Initially Lillian it seems was 
 brought in and introduced to TM and maharishi by her kids, Peter and Keith, 
 she was of that time.
 
 The speakers at the memorial spoke stories of those times and her life.  It 
 was fun.  Especially was Peter going on about he and his mom being with old 
 Yogananda followers, learning kriya meditation and practices early on, 
 Buddhism, and going to india and being with saints there.  Anandamayi Ma.  
 Peter was warm and animated.  On the other side of the stage while Peter 
 waxes on about visiting saints in India are Bevan and Keith stoically 
 listening.  It was a moment.
 
 Patronage.  Was interesting to see the room, staging, and relationship of the 
 Wallace clan to it.  Keith is first scientist of the TM-order.  He is not 
 MUM, not a Raja neither.  Bevan is evidently powerful.   In the greeting of 
 folks there was some ring-kissing demonstrations of fealty with Bevan going 
 on as well as chit-chat.

What do you mean ring-kissing?  Can you be specific?  

The position of the Wallaces is a special place, emeritus in a way by virtue of 
Bevan evidently.
 
 Bevan batted clean up as speaker and gave a nice statement drawing on a 
 principle.  It was nice and enlarging.
 
 I've gone to a lot of memorials of the meditating community the last few of 
 years.  Mostly the folks who would attend are the closer friends or 
 co-workers of the deceased.  Something I was noticing about some of the 
 memorials is that even with some of the most true-blue rank and file people 
 who have been around making things happen by deed of their work or money, 
 often the level of this upper movement is not present with the families and 
 friends of the deceased at memorials within the meditating community.  This 
 particular memorial was of the Taliban-class of the TM-movement.  Evidently 
 as a class they were present for this.  It wasn't necessarily large.  
 
 In looking, the two people who were particularly lit of the whole group were 
 Craig Pearson and Susan Humphreys.  Hopefully they can outlive the larger 
 force of being there and usher a new feeling to the group.  It's a pretty 
 cold group.  Lord help 'em. 
 
 - Buck in FF 
  
  
  He laid out the benefits of meditation as he saw it,
  that it offered a way to draw upon one's own inner
  resources for one's sense of self worth and happiness, 
  and not be dependent on others and how they see us or
  what they tell us to do for those things. I remember 
  him speaking about how meditation (as he saw it) 
  required no belief for it to work, and no leaders or 
  gurus for it to work. All that it did require was 
  actually doing the work -- practicing meditation. And 
  I remember him speaking about how meditation could 
  help to develop one's own creativity, and how that
  could help to resolve the problems of life by being
  able to create more effective solutions to them.
  
  At one point a person stood up and asked a question.
  He talked about a particular problem he was having,
  and how it had left him in a quandary, not knowing
  what to do. He then asked Maharishi what to do. 
  
  Maharishi's answer was the most impressive thing he'd
  said in the entire talk. He said, If I tell you what
  to do, all that will happen is that it will make you
  weaker. The next time you have a problem, you'll want
  me to tell you what to do about it again. You will 
  become dependent on me. What you should do instead is 
  meditate, draw upon your own creativity, and solve 
  the problem yourself. That will make you stronger.
  
  Compare 

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Hope Without Magical Thinking

[Denise Evans]

Oh my goodness - that's it exactly.  

--- On Wed, 6/22/11, whynotnow7 whynotn...@yahoo.com wrote:

From: whynotnow7 whynotn...@yahoo.com
Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Hope Without Magical Thinking
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Date: Wednesday, June 22, 2011, 11:07 AM















 
 



  



  
  
  Yeah, not to lose ourselves, good advice. Ironically it is when things 
are not working for us that we decide to find the answers somewhere else and 
have more of a willingness to accept anything, no matter how irrational it may 
seem in a more self-confident moment.



--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Denise Evans dmevans365@... wrote:



 Re: the original message - this would be my concern about Amma and her org as 
 well - she appears to be devolving from the original message and executing 
 controlling directives that result in dependencies in many.  Let alone the 
 $$ coming in - a 21st century tithe strategy.  Magical thinking and magical 
 stories abound..lessons... don't lose yourself in someone or something 
 else and each of us is responsible for our own spiritual growth.

 

 

 --- On Wed, 6/22/11, whynotnow7 whynotnow7@... wrote:

 

 From: whynotnow7 whynotnow7@...

 Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Hope Without Magical Thinking

 To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com

 Date: Wednesday, June 22, 2011, 9:12 AM

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  

  

 

 

 

   

 

 

 

   

   

   Enjoyed your blast from the past Curtis - I can totally see the 
 judgment on the dark spirit who was banished from the scene by Maharishi's 
 effulgence, now in retrospect realizing the poor guy probably just had to pee 
 - too many mango smoothies that morningand the chosen Governors 
 remained... 

 

 

 

 I was not part of the reinforced indoctrination that the Governors received, 
 but definitely bought into the absolute perfection of our dear leader. Though 
 I recall at the time I also took seriously the Jai Guru Dev thing, respect 
 the teacher, so I really didn't feel Maharishi was my personal guru, rather a 
 perfect teacher (for awhile). 

 

 

 

 The difference being I never had nor wanted a personal relationship with him, 
 beyond the big Maharishi posters on my dorm walls (I did work for the MMY 
 Press, but it was still a pretty groupie thing to  do...). I never had a 
 chance to meet him. So I hung on his every word and worked for the Movement 
 for two and a half years. Then when it became time to take a closer look and 
 consider becoming a teacher myself, I decided to leave instead. Just wasn't 
 going to work out.

 

 

 

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues curtisdeltablues@ 
 wrote:

 

 

 

  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Buck dhamiltony2k5@ wrote:

 

  

 

   Whoa, very nice waking state critique Turq.

 

   Nice writing.  -Buck

 

  

 

  I wonder why you would refer to the obvious fact that he had to be awake 
  when her wrote it?  I mean do you post in your sleep Doug?  Oh wait a 
  second, you are comparing Barry's post to a higher state of consciousness 
  one that you are somehow capable of discerning by the content.  Let me give 
  a shot at the higher state one:

 

  

 

  Maharishi was preceded into the hall by a golden glow, egglike in its 
  hyranyagarba glory.  As he sat down this glow enveloped the audience and I 
  could see that patches of dark clouds over people were going away.  One 
  very dark shrouded person left the room as if the purity itself had 
  expelled him.

 

  

 

  As he started to speak it was like the impulses of the Veda were unfolding 
  within me, the Prachetina value of life, the first impulses of creative 
  intelligence were enlivened.  On either side of the stage two huge Devatas 
  stood regally enraptured by the master but knowing that they would need a 
  nervous system like ours to achieve their goal.  My eyes fall on the 
  nervous system of a co-ed a few rows ahead, wearing a loose fitting, 
  sleeveless, white, cotton shirt. At this angle I can make out the curve of 
  her breast and think if I lean farther ahead I may be in nip-slip range...

 

  

 

  But spontaneously my attention is drawn away from the rajasic and back to 
  Maharishi who is laying out the steps of progress for any government to 
  turn the world into Narnia if they would only pay enough for his programs 
  to be taught everywhere, cuz as everyone knows, the divine is always a bit 
  short on cash. (Not much of a saver.)  As he speaks he leans forward and at 
  this angle I can see into his hairy chest and if I lean 
  forward...damn...pull back pull back abort abort...Nice to be enlightened 
  though so I can see my pervieness in terms of the Self, as if the universe 
  itself want's a little nip-slip now and then and I am a faithful divine 
  servant...

 

  

 

  

 

  Nice piece BTW Barry, you know for WAKING STATE!  (For any new readers, 
  waking state

[FairfieldLife] Re: Hope Without Magical Thinking

[seventhray1]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=II1BkpX03-M

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Yifu yifuxero@... wrote:

 thx, I was there at that time.
 http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_NC4d7MFA2Mk/SkTMbp3i99I/BlQ/JoxhxVDrbMk/s400/Louis+Wain+Cat+Postcard+Playing+Cards.jpg
 
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, merudanda no_reply@ wrote:
 
  Buck,thanks for sharing this...
  magical
  Roll up (AND) THAT'S AN INVITATION,
roll up for the mystery tour.
  Roll up TO MAKE A RESERVATION,
roll up for the mystery tour.
  The magical mystery tour is waiting to take you away,
  Waiting to take you away.
  Hoping to take you away.
  Dying to take you away, take you today
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Buck dhamiltony2k5@ wrote:
  
  
  
   --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb no_reply@ wrote:
   
Today for some reason I found myself thinking back to
the first time I saw Maharishi, in 1967. At that talk,
at the Greek Theater in Los Angeles, he said a few
things that got me interested enough in the spiritual
path that I set about walking it.
   
  
   I went to the memorial service on MUM campus last nite.
   For Lilian Wallace, the Wallace family matriarch.
   Very much an old TM/MUM trustees event, and some
   of us other old-timers who have been around all alongside of this who
  are not TM-Rajas.
  
   Very nice evening of primarily the Wallace family reminiscing about
  Lilian Wallace.
   She was a very large personality that was along the whole way behind
  the scenes
   of the TM-movement by virtue of Keith Wallace and Peter.  In character
  it seems she was a glamorous strong willed person of the mid-20th
  century.  I know her first in California at one of the Humbolt courses
  with Maharishi.  Was a big course with well over a thousand people. 
  Most of us sat in a field house on folding chairs for the lectures.  Up
  front was an area of stuffed chairs set out for the rich ladies from
  southern California.   They were the supporters of the 1960's.  They
  were of that generation.  'Made-up' and dolled up they were taken care
  of up there.  Initially Lillian it seems was brought in and introduced
  to TM and maharishi by her kids, Peter and Keith, she was of that time.
  
   The speakers at the memorial spoke stories of those times and her
  life.  It was fun.  Especially was Peter going on about he and his mom
  being with old Yogananda followers, learning kriya meditation and
  practices early on, Buddhism, and going to india and being with saints
  there.  Anandamayi Ma.  Peter was warm and animated.  On the other side
  of the stage while Peter waxes on about visiting saints in India are
  Bevan and Keith stoically listening.  It was a moment.
  
   Patronage.  Was interesting to see the room, staging, and relationship
  of the Wallace clan to it.  Keith is first scientist of the TM-order. 
  He is not MUM, not a Raja neither.  Bevan is evidently powerful.   In
  the greeting of folks there was some ring-kissing demonstrations of
  fealty with Bevan going on as well as chit-chat.  The position of the
  Wallaces is a special place, emeritus in a way by virtue of Bevan
  evidently.
  
   Bevan batted clean up as speaker and gave a nice statement drawing on
  a principle.  It was nice and enlarging.
  
   I've gone to a lot of memorials of the meditating community the last
  few of years.  Mostly the folks who would attend are the closer friends
  or co-workers of the deceased.  Something I was noticing about some of
  the memorials is that even with some of the most true-blue rank and file
  people who have been around making things happen by deed of their work
  or money, often the level of this upper movement is not present with the
  families and friends of the deceased at memorials within the meditating
  community.  This particular memorial was of the Taliban-class of the
  TM-movement.  Evidently as a class they were present for this.  It
  wasn't necessarily large.
  
   In looking, the two people who were particularly lit of the whole
  group were Craig Pearson and Susan Humphreys.  Hopefully they can
  outlive the larger force of being there and usher a new feeling to the
  group.  It's a pretty cold group.  Lord help 'em.
  
   - Buck in FF
  
  
He laid out the benefits of meditation as he saw it,
that it offered a way to draw upon one's own inner
resources for one's sense of self worth and happiness,
and not be dependent on others and how they see us or
what they tell us to do for those things. I remember
him speaking about how meditation (as he saw it)
required no belief for it to work, and no leaders or
gurus for it to work. All that it did require was
actually doing the work -- practicing meditation. And
I remember him speaking about how meditation could
help to develop one's own creativity, and how that
could help to resolve the problems of life by being
able to create more effective solutions to 

[FairfieldLife] Re: Hope Without Magical Thinking

[Buck]

Whoa, very nice waking state critique Turq.
Nice writing.  -Buck

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb no_reply@... wrote:

 Today for some reason I found myself thinking back to
 the first time I saw Maharishi, in 1967. At that talk,
 at the Greek Theater in Los Angeles, he said a few 
 things that got me interested enough in the spiritual 
 path that I set about walking it. 
 
 He laid out the benefits of meditation as he saw it,
 that it offered a way to draw upon one's own inner
 resources for one's sense of self worth and happiness, 
 and not be dependent on others and how they see us or
 what they tell us to do for those things. I remember 
 him speaking about how meditation (as he saw it) 
 required no belief for it to work, and no leaders or 
 gurus for it to work. All that it did require was 
 actually doing the work -- practicing meditation. And 
 I remember him speaking about how meditation could 
 help to develop one's own creativity, and how that
 could help to resolve the problems of life by being
 able to create more effective solutions to them.
 
 At one point a person stood up and asked a question.
 He talked about a particular problem he was having,
 and how it had left him in a quandary, not knowing
 what to do. He then asked Maharishi what to do. 
 
 Maharishi's answer was the most impressive thing he'd
 said in the entire talk. He said, If I tell you what
 to do, all that will happen is that it will make you
 weaker. The next time you have a problem, you'll want
 me to tell you what to do about it again. You will 
 become dependent on me. What you should do instead is 
 meditate, draw upon your own creativity, and solve 
 the problem yourself. That will make you stronger.
 
 Compare and contrast to what Maharishi allowed his
 teaching and his spiritual movement to devolve into.
 What I find myself thinking today, remembering this
 first talk, is how SAD it is how little of what he 
 said that day turned out to be true. Or at least how 
 little of it turned out to be what he actually taught 
 and how he conducted himself as the years went on.
 
 Instead of the independence and self-sufficiency he
 touted in that first talk, what happened -- and 
 within a couple of years -- was an environment in
 which the students were taught to rely on him and
 what he told them to do. Being on the whole young
 and impressionable people in the 60's they may in
 fact have brought a lot of this tendency to rely 
 on guru figures with them, but he allowed them to 
 do so, and in fact encouraged it. 
 
 He also encouraged magical thinking, the view that
 all you had to do was meditate and that if you did,
 and listened to what he told you to do, magical 
 forces that were larger than you would take care of
 you and make everything turn out right. Do less and
 accomplish more, which in those early talks clearly
 meant Meditate and recharge your energy and your
 creativity and then go out and USE it by working more
 efficiently for the things you want turned into Just 
 meditate and everything will be taken care of. Prag-
 matic thinking gave way to magical thinking. 
 
 And look what the outcome of this reliance on magical
 thinking has produced. People who can no longer imagine
 solutions to the problems of hunger and war and violence
 that come from humans using their own intelligence and
 working towards pragmatic solutions. Instead, the only
 source that they can imagine a solution to these prob-
 lems coming from is magic, in the form of some Woo Woo
 Rays emanating from the thuds of their butts on foam,
 or from other, even more magical Woo Woo Rays emanating
 from some teacher or guru or avatar. 
 
 Call me crazy but I miss the message of that first
 Maharishi talk. I am hopeful that the problems of this
 planet, both individual and worldwide, can in fact be
 resolved. But I don't believe that they can only be
 resolved by some magical force outside ourselves, or
 by Woo Woo Rays. I think that these problems can only
 be resolved by the pragmatic, creative ideas of indi-
 vidual human beings, creative ideas that are possibly
 enhanced by meditation and other practices, but *our*
 ideas, not those of some avatar or guru or spiritual
 teacher or other source of magical Woo Woo.
 
 That, after all, was the message of the first talk I
 ever heard Maharishi give. It's just too bad that he
 either was lying about what he said, or didn't believe 
 it thoroughly enough to follow through on it in his
 own teachings, and with his own students. If he had, 
 the world might have been a much better place, and
 they would certainly have been much stronger human 
 beings. Instead, just as he said in that first talk, 
 he wound up making them weaker.

[FairfieldLife] Re: Hope Without Magical Thinking

[curtisdeltablues]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Buck dhamiltony2k5@... wrote:

 Whoa, very nice waking state critique Turq.
 Nice writing.  -Buck

I wonder why you would refer to the obvious fact that he had to be awake when 
her wrote it?  I mean do you post in your sleep Doug?  Oh wait a second, 
you are comparing Barry's post to a higher state of consciousness one that you 
are somehow capable of discerning by the content.  Let me give a shot at the 
higher state one:

Maharishi was preceded into the hall by a golden glow, egglike in its 
hyranyagarba glory.  As he sat down this glow enveloped the audience and I 
could see that patches of dark clouds over people were going away.  One very 
dark shrouded person left the room as if the purity itself had expelled him.

As he started to speak it was like the impulses of the Veda were unfolding 
within me, the Prachetina value of life, the first impulses of creative 
intelligence were enlivened.  On either side of the stage two huge Devatas 
stood regally enraptured by the master but knowing that they would need a 
nervous system like ours to achieve their goal.  My eyes fall on the nervous 
system of a co-ed a few rows ahead, wearing a loose fitting, sleeveless, white, 
cotton shirt. At this angle I can make out the curve of her breast and think if 
I lean farther ahead I may be in nip-slip range...

But spontaneously my attention is drawn away from the rajasic and back to 
Maharishi who is laying out the steps of progress for any government to turn 
the world into Narnia if they would only pay enough for his programs to be 
taught everywhere, cuz as everyone knows, the divine is always a bit short on 
cash. (Not much of a saver.)  As he speaks he leans forward and at this angle I 
can see into his hairy chest and if I lean forward...damn...pull back pull back 
abort abort...Nice to be enlightened though so I can see my pervieness in terms 
of the Self, as if the universe itself want's a little nip-slip now and then 
and I am a faithful divine servant...


Nice piece BTW Barry, you know for WAKING STATE!  (For any new readers, waking 
state is a substitute for S--t for brains on FFL.  It is used as a reminder 
of the poster's intrinsic superiority.)






 
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb no_reply@ wrote:
 
  Today for some reason I found myself thinking back to
  the first time I saw Maharishi, in 1967. At that talk,
  at the Greek Theater in Los Angeles, he said a few 
  things that got me interested enough in the spiritual 
  path that I set about walking it. 
  
  He laid out the benefits of meditation as he saw it,
  that it offered a way to draw upon one's own inner
  resources for one's sense of self worth and happiness, 
  and not be dependent on others and how they see us or
  what they tell us to do for those things. I remember 
  him speaking about how meditation (as he saw it) 
  required no belief for it to work, and no leaders or 
  gurus for it to work. All that it did require was 
  actually doing the work -- practicing meditation. And 
  I remember him speaking about how meditation could 
  help to develop one's own creativity, and how that
  could help to resolve the problems of life by being
  able to create more effective solutions to them.
  
  At one point a person stood up and asked a question.
  He talked about a particular problem he was having,
  and how it had left him in a quandary, not knowing
  what to do. He then asked Maharishi what to do. 
  
  Maharishi's answer was the most impressive thing he'd
  said in the entire talk. He said, If I tell you what
  to do, all that will happen is that it will make you
  weaker. The next time you have a problem, you'll want
  me to tell you what to do about it again. You will 
  become dependent on me. What you should do instead is 
  meditate, draw upon your own creativity, and solve 
  the problem yourself. That will make you stronger.
  
  Compare and contrast to what Maharishi allowed his
  teaching and his spiritual movement to devolve into.
  What I find myself thinking today, remembering this
  first talk, is how SAD it is how little of what he 
  said that day turned out to be true. Or at least how 
  little of it turned out to be what he actually taught 
  and how he conducted himself as the years went on.
  
  Instead of the independence and self-sufficiency he
  touted in that first talk, what happened -- and 
  within a couple of years -- was an environment in
  which the students were taught to rely on him and
  what he told them to do. Being on the whole young
  and impressionable people in the 60's they may in
  fact have brought a lot of this tendency to rely 
  on guru figures with them, but he allowed them to 
  do so, and in fact encouraged it. 
  
  He also encouraged magical thinking, the view that
  all you had to do was meditate and that if you did,
  and listened to what he told you to do, magical 
  forces that were larger than you would take care of
 

[FairfieldLife] Re: Hope Without Magical Thinking

[richardjwilliamstexas]

curtisdeltablues: 
 Maharishi was preceded into the hall by a golden glow, 
 egglike in its hyranyagarba glory...

So, you're not prejudiced against Hindus? You were at the
MMY Greek Theater talk in 1967? Go figure.

A prejudice is a prejudgment, an assumption made about 
someone or something before having adequate knowledge to 
be able to do so with guaranteed accuracy...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prejudice

[FairfieldLife] Re: Hope Without Magical Thinking

[curtisdeltablues]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, richardjwilliamstexas willytex@... 
wrote:

 
 
 curtisdeltablues: 
  Maharishi was preceded into the hall by a golden glow, 
  egglike in its hyranyagarba glory...
 
 So, you're not prejudiced against Hindus?

No, I am not.

 You were at the
 MMY Greek Theater talk in 1967? Go figure.

No, I was not

 
 A prejudice is a prejudgment, an assumption made about 
 someone or something before having adequate knowledge to 
 be able to do so with guaranteed accuracy...

My judgements about Maharishi are all after experience with him. 
 Plenty.  I read his first book Mediations of Maharishi when I was 10 
years old so it has been quite a while since I could be PREjudging 
him.  But in the loose way the word is defined here it would apply
to all of us talking about everyone.  It is just a judgement call.

I would rather see something in the definition about generalizing
by type the experiences you have with one member of a group.
That seem like the key point in how we use the term.

I get along better with Hindus than most Americans due to my willingness to 
sing the puja for them.  Blows their mind everytime!




 
 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prejudice

[FairfieldLife] Re: Hope Without Magical Thinking

[whynotnow7]

I agree that Maharishi's message was one of self sufficiency, and the irony you 
point out in the TMO is evident. I am curious though how you think one person 
can make another person weaker (or anything else), without the person being 
made weaker (or stronger for that matter) allowing it to happen? Even if 
someone is not willing to acknowledge their power of choice, it is always 
available. 

What seems to get us into trouble is the propensity built into us to find 
solutions. Its not digging a burrow or building a nest anymore, but same 
concept, to solve the problem. So the answer becomes MAHARISHI or AMMA or THE 
DEMOCRATS or TECH or LEMON MERINGUE PIE. Since we live so much in a world of 
ideas now, we can find absolute happiness for awhile in a belief system or a 
person or a series of stories, without dislodging such false anchors, without 
untying the knots that adhere us to these ideas, for an entire lifetime. 

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Buck dhamiltony2k5@... wrote:

 Whoa, very nice waking state critique Turq.
 Nice writing.  -Buck
 
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb no_reply@ wrote:
 
  Today for some reason I found myself thinking back to
  the first time I saw Maharishi, in 1967. At that talk,
  at the Greek Theater in Los Angeles, he said a few 
  things that got me interested enough in the spiritual 
  path that I set about walking it. 
  
  He laid out the benefits of meditation as he saw it,
  that it offered a way to draw upon one's own inner
  resources for one's sense of self worth and happiness, 
  and not be dependent on others and how they see us or
  what they tell us to do for those things. I remember 
  him speaking about how meditation (as he saw it) 
  required no belief for it to work, and no leaders or 
  gurus for it to work. All that it did require was 
  actually doing the work -- practicing meditation. And 
  I remember him speaking about how meditation could 
  help to develop one's own creativity, and how that
  could help to resolve the problems of life by being
  able to create more effective solutions to them.
  
  At one point a person stood up and asked a question.
  He talked about a particular problem he was having,
  and how it had left him in a quandary, not knowing
  what to do. He then asked Maharishi what to do. 
  
  Maharishi's answer was the most impressive thing he'd
  said in the entire talk. He said, If I tell you what
  to do, all that will happen is that it will make you
  weaker. The next time you have a problem, you'll want
  me to tell you what to do about it again. You will 
  become dependent on me. What you should do instead is 
  meditate, draw upon your own creativity, and solve 
  the problem yourself. That will make you stronger.
  
  Compare and contrast to what Maharishi allowed his
  teaching and his spiritual movement to devolve into.
  What I find myself thinking today, remembering this
  first talk, is how SAD it is how little of what he 
  said that day turned out to be true. Or at least how 
  little of it turned out to be what he actually taught 
  and how he conducted himself as the years went on.
  
  Instead of the independence and self-sufficiency he
  touted in that first talk, what happened -- and 
  within a couple of years -- was an environment in
  which the students were taught to rely on him and
  what he told them to do. Being on the whole young
  and impressionable people in the 60's they may in
  fact have brought a lot of this tendency to rely 
  on guru figures with them, but he allowed them to 
  do so, and in fact encouraged it. 
  
  He also encouraged magical thinking, the view that
  all you had to do was meditate and that if you did,
  and listened to what he told you to do, magical 
  forces that were larger than you would take care of
  you and make everything turn out right. Do less and
  accomplish more, which in those early talks clearly
  meant Meditate and recharge your energy and your
  creativity and then go out and USE it by working more
  efficiently for the things you want turned into Just 
  meditate and everything will be taken care of. Prag-
  matic thinking gave way to magical thinking. 
  
  And look what the outcome of this reliance on magical
  thinking has produced. People who can no longer imagine
  solutions to the problems of hunger and war and violence
  that come from humans using their own intelligence and
  working towards pragmatic solutions. Instead, the only
  source that they can imagine a solution to these prob-
  lems coming from is magic, in the form of some Woo Woo
  Rays emanating from the thuds of their butts on foam,
  or from other, even more magical Woo Woo Rays emanating
  from some teacher or guru or avatar. 
  
  Call me crazy but I miss the message of that first
  Maharishi talk. I am hopeful that the problems of this
  planet, both individual and worldwide, can in fact be
  resolved. But I don't believe that they can only be
  resolved 

[FairfieldLife] Re: Hope Without Magical Thinking

[whynotnow7]

Enjoyed your blast from the past Curtis - I can totally see the judgment on the 
dark spirit who was banished from the scene by Maharishi's effulgence, now in 
retrospect realizing the poor guy probably just had to pee - too many mango 
smoothies that morningand the chosen Governors remained... 

I was not part of the reinforced indoctrination that the Governors received, 
but definitely bought into the absolute perfection of our dear leader. Though I 
recall at the time I also took seriously the Jai Guru Dev thing, respect the 
teacher, so I really didn't feel Maharishi was my personal guru, rather a 
perfect teacher (for awhile). 

The difference being I never had nor wanted a personal relationship with him, 
beyond the big Maharishi posters on my dorm walls (I did work for the MMY 
Press, but it was still a pretty groupie thing to  do...). I never had a chance 
to meet him. So I hung on his every word and worked for the Movement for two 
and a half years. Then when it became time to take a closer look and consider 
becoming a teacher myself, I decided to leave instead. Just wasn't going to 
work out.

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues curtisdeltablues@... 
wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Buck dhamiltony2k5@ wrote:
 
  Whoa, very nice waking state critique Turq.
  Nice writing.  -Buck
 
 I wonder why you would refer to the obvious fact that he had to be awake when 
 her wrote it?  I mean do you post in your sleep Doug?  Oh wait a second, 
 you are comparing Barry's post to a higher state of consciousness one that 
 you are somehow capable of discerning by the content.  Let me give a shot at 
 the higher state one:
 
 Maharishi was preceded into the hall by a golden glow, egglike in its 
 hyranyagarba glory.  As he sat down this glow enveloped the audience and I 
 could see that patches of dark clouds over people were going away.  One very 
 dark shrouded person left the room as if the purity itself had expelled him.
 
 As he started to speak it was like the impulses of the Veda were unfolding 
 within me, the Prachetina value of life, the first impulses of creative 
 intelligence were enlivened.  On either side of the stage two huge Devatas 
 stood regally enraptured by the master but knowing that they would need a 
 nervous system like ours to achieve their goal.  My eyes fall on the nervous 
 system of a co-ed a few rows ahead, wearing a loose fitting, sleeveless, 
 white, cotton shirt. At this angle I can make out the curve of her breast and 
 think if I lean farther ahead I may be in nip-slip range...
 
 But spontaneously my attention is drawn away from the rajasic and back to 
 Maharishi who is laying out the steps of progress for any government to turn 
 the world into Narnia if they would only pay enough for his programs to be 
 taught everywhere, cuz as everyone knows, the divine is always a bit short on 
 cash. (Not much of a saver.)  As he speaks he leans forward and at this angle 
 I can see into his hairy chest and if I lean forward...damn...pull back pull 
 back abort abort...Nice to be enlightened though so I can see my pervieness 
 in terms of the Self, as if the universe itself want's a little nip-slip now 
 and then and I am a faithful divine servant...
 
 
 Nice piece BTW Barry, you know for WAKING STATE!  (For any new readers, 
 waking state is a substitute for S--t for brains on FFL.  It is used as a 
 reminder of the poster's intrinsic superiority.)
 
 
 
 
 
 
  
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb no_reply@ wrote:
  
   Today for some reason I found myself thinking back to
   the first time I saw Maharishi, in 1967. At that talk,
   at the Greek Theater in Los Angeles, he said a few 
   things that got me interested enough in the spiritual 
   path that I set about walking it. 
   
   He laid out the benefits of meditation as he saw it,
   that it offered a way to draw upon one's own inner
   resources for one's sense of self worth and happiness, 
   and not be dependent on others and how they see us or
   what they tell us to do for those things. I remember 
   him speaking about how meditation (as he saw it) 
   required no belief for it to work, and no leaders or 
   gurus for it to work. All that it did require was 
   actually doing the work -- practicing meditation. And 
   I remember him speaking about how meditation could 
   help to develop one's own creativity, and how that
   could help to resolve the problems of life by being
   able to create more effective solutions to them.
   
   At one point a person stood up and asked a question.
   He talked about a particular problem he was having,
   and how it had left him in a quandary, not knowing
   what to do. He then asked Maharishi what to do. 
   
   Maharishi's answer was the most impressive thing he'd
   said in the entire talk. He said, If I tell you what
   to do, all that will happen is that it will make you
   weaker. The next time you have a problem, 

[FairfieldLife] Re: Hope Without Magical Thinking

[Xenophaneros Anartaxius]

Nice.

Self-sufficency is a curious beast. It is not me against the world. Meditation 
seems to result in a wider perspective, in which one experiences being in the 
flow of things, one experiences the connexions between things more intuitively, 
even if it is difficult or impossible to express just what that means 
conceptually. On the nearby level, a person still has to do things to get 
something done. One might get information from elsewhere, but the decision what 
to do with that information does not. One relies on others to the extent that 
one does not know something, or cannot physically accomplish certain tasks, say 
writing 1,000 articles in a couple of days; so one delegates responsibilities. 
As Harry Truman once said, 'The buck stops here.'

The tendency for magical thinking does not seem to be erased by meditation; in 
my case a childhood interest in science reduced the propensity to dream this 
way, but whether meditation has had any effect in this direction, I cannot 
tell, as many people around me have a strong disposition for magical thinking, 
and they have been meditating longer than I. What is interesting is this kind 
of thinking persists even when experience and situations completely contradict 
it. It is a peculiar habit.

Hope: the wish that a non-existent state of affairs not be that way. Maharishi 
said something like 'the millionaire must still push the pencil across the 
paper himself to write something.' Hope does not accomplish anything. One 
either does something (which involves thinking of what to do, being creative), 
or if the odds are too overwhelming, surrenders to the situation (e.g., one 
falls out of an aeroplane, having forgotten to put on a parachute, or not 
having one in the first place).

It is curious how the movement turned out. Other teachers have also demanded 
unquestioned obedience in following their directives and thought. I wonder what 
sort of behaviour Swami Brahmananda Saraswati had in this regard, what the 
relationship between him and his students was. Did Maharishi adopt this 
behaviour from observation of others, or was it an intrinsic part of his 
personality. I of course do not know the answer to this question, not having 
been there.

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb no_reply@... wrote:

 Today for some reason I found myself thinking back to
 the first time I saw Maharishi, in 1967. At that talk,
 at the Greek Theater in Los Angeles, he said a few 
 things that got me interested enough in the spiritual 
 path that I set about walking it. 
 
 He laid out the benefits of meditation as he saw it,
 that it offered a way to draw upon one's own inner
 resources for one's sense of self worth and happiness, 
 and not be dependent on others and how they see us or
 what they tell us to do for those things. I remember 
 him speaking about how meditation (as he saw it) 
 required no belief for it to work, and no leaders or 
 gurus for it to work. All that it did require was 
 actually doing the work -- practicing meditation. And 
 I remember him speaking about how meditation could 
 help to develop one's own creativity, and how that
 could help to resolve the problems of life by being
 able to create more effective solutions to them.
 
 At one point a person stood up and asked a question.
 He talked about a particular problem he was having,
 and how it had left him in a quandary, not knowing
 what to do. He then asked Maharishi what to do. 
 
 Maharishi's answer was the most impressive thing he'd
 said in the entire talk. He said, If I tell you what
 to do, all that will happen is that it will make you
 weaker. The next time you have a problem, you'll want
 me to tell you what to do about it again. You will 
 become dependent on me. What you should do instead is 
 meditate, draw upon your own creativity, and solve 
 the problem yourself. That will make you stronger.
 
 Compare and contrast to what Maharishi allowed his
 teaching and his spiritual movement to devolve into.
 What I find myself thinking today, remembering this
 first talk, is how SAD it is how little of what he 
 said that day turned out to be true. Or at least how 
 little of it turned out to be what he actually taught 
 and how he conducted himself as the years went on.
 
 Instead of the independence and self-sufficiency he
 touted in that first talk, what happened -- and 
 within a couple of years -- was an environment in
 which the students were taught to rely on him and
 what he told them to do. Being on the whole young
 and impressionable people in the 60's they may in
 fact have brought a lot of this tendency to rely 
 on guru figures with them, but he allowed them to 
 do so, and in fact encouraged it. 
 
 He also encouraged magical thinking, the view that
 all you had to do was meditate and that if you did,
 and listened to what he told you to do, magical 
 forces that were larger than you would take care of
 you and make everything turn out right. Do less and
 

[FairfieldLife] Re: Hope Without Magical Thinking

[curtisdeltablues]

The only problem I have with what you have written Jim is your inclusion of 
Lemon Meringue Pie and  it being incapable of giving someone absolute 
happiness.  Here is how I break down the problems with most pies:

First: Lemon filling over sweetened. Rookie mistake.  See the perfect bite 
includes the marsh mellowing effect of the meringue, so you need to keep the 
filling tart or you blow the genius of this combination.

Second: You know all undercrust are gunna get soggy with the wet filling poured 
on, so pre bake the bottom crust. Go a little deeper with the crushed graham 
and crush them yourself, do not under any circumstances go with a pre made one. 
 They all are over sweetened and suck.  How hard is it to throw some graham 
crackers into a processor with some unsalted butter and a little sugar (not 
honey is will soften it before you begin).  Big secret?  Add in some grated 
orange peal , not lemon and you wont have to over sweeten the crust. A little 
cinnamon wont hurt, a lot will.

Third;  This is what separates the easy bake oven bakers and the real kitchen 
badass homeboys.  Leave it in the broiler long enough at the end to get the 
peaks just a touch over the browned stage.  This is tricky just like with 
pizzas.  If you can get some peaks to go beyond caramel into blacked, you will 
offset any over sweeting mistakes.   Just a touch of bitter is the magic that 
makes this dessert the magical juxtaposition it can be.  In this form, it IS 
absolute happiness believe me.

Anyh, nice posts from both you and Turq.  Happy baking.  



 

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, whynotnow7 whynotnow7@... wrote:

 I agree that Maharishi's message was one of self sufficiency, and the irony 
 you point out in the TMO is evident. I am curious though how you think one 
 person can make another person weaker (or anything else), without the person 
 being made weaker (or stronger for that matter) allowing it to happen? Even 
 if someone is not willing to acknowledge their power of choice, it is always 
 available. 
 
 What seems to get us into trouble is the propensity built into us to find 
 solutions. Its not digging a burrow or building a nest anymore, but same 
 concept, to solve the problem. So the answer becomes MAHARISHI or AMMA or THE 
 DEMOCRATS or TECH or LEMON MERINGUE PIE. Since we live so much in a world of 
 ideas now, we can find absolute happiness for awhile in a belief system or a 
 person or a series of stories, without dislodging such false anchors, without 
 untying the knots that adhere us to these ideas, for an entire lifetime. 
 
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Buck dhamiltony2k5@ wrote:
 
  Whoa, very nice waking state critique Turq.
  Nice writing.  -Buck
  
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb no_reply@ wrote:
  
   Today for some reason I found myself thinking back to
   the first time I saw Maharishi, in 1967. At that talk,
   at the Greek Theater in Los Angeles, he said a few 
   things that got me interested enough in the spiritual 
   path that I set about walking it. 
   
   He laid out the benefits of meditation as he saw it,
   that it offered a way to draw upon one's own inner
   resources for one's sense of self worth and happiness, 
   and not be dependent on others and how they see us or
   what they tell us to do for those things. I remember 
   him speaking about how meditation (as he saw it) 
   required no belief for it to work, and no leaders or 
   gurus for it to work. All that it did require was 
   actually doing the work -- practicing meditation. And 
   I remember him speaking about how meditation could 
   help to develop one's own creativity, and how that
   could help to resolve the problems of life by being
   able to create more effective solutions to them.
   
   At one point a person stood up and asked a question.
   He talked about a particular problem he was having,
   and how it had left him in a quandary, not knowing
   what to do. He then asked Maharishi what to do. 
   
   Maharishi's answer was the most impressive thing he'd
   said in the entire talk. He said, If I tell you what
   to do, all that will happen is that it will make you
   weaker. The next time you have a problem, you'll want
   me to tell you what to do about it again. You will 
   become dependent on me. What you should do instead is 
   meditate, draw upon your own creativity, and solve 
   the problem yourself. That will make you stronger.
   
   Compare and contrast to what Maharishi allowed his
   teaching and his spiritual movement to devolve into.
   What I find myself thinking today, remembering this
   first talk, is how SAD it is how little of what he 
   said that day turned out to be true. Or at least how 
   little of it turned out to be what he actually taught 
   and how he conducted himself as the years went on.
   
   Instead of the independence and self-sufficiency he
   touted in that first talk, what happened -- and 
   within a 

[FairfieldLife] Re: Hope Without Magical Thinking

[maskedzebra]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues curtisdeltablues@... 
wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Buck dhamiltony2k5@ wrote:
 
  Whoa, very nice waking state critique Turq.
  Nice writing.  -Buck
 
 I wonder why you would refer to the obvious fact that he had to be awake when 
 her wrote it?  I mean do you post in your sleep Doug?  Oh wait a second, 
 you are comparing Barry's post to a higher state of consciousness one that 
 you are somehow capable of discerning by the content.  Let me give a shot at 
 the higher state one:
 
 Maharishi was preceded into the hall by a golden glow, egglike in its 
 hyranyagarba glory.  As he sat down this glow enveloped the audience and I 
 could see that patches of dark clouds over people were going away.  One very 
 dark shrouded person left the room as if the purity itself had expelled him.
 
 As he started to speak it was like the impulses of the Veda were unfolding 
 within me, the Prachetina value of life, the first impulses of creative 
 intelligence were enlivened.  On either side of the stage two huge Devatas 
 stood regally enraptured by the master but knowing that they would need a 
 nervous system like ours to achieve their goal.  My eyes fall on the nervous 
 system of a co-ed a few rows ahead, wearing a loose fitting, sleeveless, 
 white, cotton shirt. At this angle I can make out the curve of her breast and 
 think if I lean farther ahead I may be in nip-slip range...
 
 But spontaneously my attention is drawn away from the rajasic and back to 
 Maharishi who is laying out the steps of progress for any government to turn 
 the world into Narnia if they would only pay enough for his programs to be 
 taught everywhere, cuz as everyone knows, the divine is always a bit short on 
 cash. (Not much of a saver.)  As he speaks he leans forward and at this angle 
 I can see into his hairy chest and if I lean forward...damn...pull back pull 
 back abort abort...Nice to be enlightened though so I can see my pervieness 
 in terms of the Self, as if the universe itself want's a little nip-slip now 
 and then and I am a faithful divine servant...
 
 
 Nice piece BTW Barry, you know for WAKING STATE!  (For any new readers, 
 waking state is a substitute for S--t for brains on FFL.  It is used as a 
 reminder of the poster's intrinsic superiority.)

RESPONSE: Goddamn, I loved this. More of reality gets contained in the mockery 
than in the beatific. The muse that inspires you to write like this, Curtis, 
it's a healthier and more discriminating muse than those muses which keep up 
the Vedic sentimentality. Hah! Nature support coming right at you from 
CurtisDeltaBlues. Dig it, folks. Because there ain't no defending what CDB rips 
open. Too fing innocent. Yeah, you heard me right: that's the word. For me 
the antidote is irony—and here, baby, you get the kind that clears mental space 
in the universe. Oh, yeah: I speak for myself here—but if you let yourself 
'transcend' effortlessly (no concentration) you'll become a convert. I promise 
you. 
 
 
 
 
 
 
  
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb no_reply@ wrote:
  
   Today for some reason I found myself thinking back to
   the first time I saw Maharishi, in 1967. At that talk,
   at the Greek Theater in Los Angeles, he said a few 
   things that got me interested enough in the spiritual 
   path that I set about walking it. 
   
   He laid out the benefits of meditation as he saw it,
   that it offered a way to draw upon one's own inner
   resources for one's sense of self worth and happiness, 
   and not be dependent on others and how they see us or
   what they tell us to do for those things. I remember 
   him speaking about how meditation (as he saw it) 
   required no belief for it to work, and no leaders or 
   gurus for it to work. All that it did require was 
   actually doing the work -- practicing meditation. And 
   I remember him speaking about how meditation could 
   help to develop one's own creativity, and how that
   could help to resolve the problems of life by being
   able to create more effective solutions to them.
   
   At one point a person stood up and asked a question.
   He talked about a particular problem he was having,
   and how it had left him in a quandary, not knowing
   what to do. He then asked Maharishi what to do. 
   
   Maharishi's answer was the most impressive thing he'd
   said in the entire talk. He said, If I tell you what
   to do, all that will happen is that it will make you
   weaker. The next time you have a problem, you'll want
   me to tell you what to do about it again. You will 
   become dependent on me. What you should do instead is 
   meditate, draw upon your own creativity, and solve 
   the problem yourself. That will make you stronger.
   
   Compare and contrast to what Maharishi allowed his
   teaching and his spiritual movement to devolve into.
   What I find myself thinking today, remembering this
   first 

[FairfieldLife] Re: Hope Without Magical Thinking

[curtisdeltablues]

Thanks MZ, always a tough balance between satire and being a dick.If I got it 
right on this one for you, I am happy. 

One thing I know from reading un British censored Vedic texts, those old guys 
were much more comfortable with their bodies than the prudish movement. When 
they are rocking the level of analogy (remember this one) of a frog desiring 
water, a physician desiring disease (bastards!)  and trouser trout desiring 
untrimmed bush, they are not on the same page as gender-free world of the 
Capitals of the Age of Enlightenment! (Angels don't have naughty parts.) 





--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, maskedzebra no_reply@... wrote:

 
 
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues curtisdeltablues@ 
 wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Buck dhamiltony2k5@ wrote:
  
   Whoa, very nice waking state critique Turq.
   Nice writing.  -Buck
  
  I wonder why you would refer to the obvious fact that he had to be awake 
  when her wrote it?  I mean do you post in your sleep Doug?  Oh wait a 
  second, you are comparing Barry's post to a higher state of consciousness 
  one that you are somehow capable of discerning by the content.  Let me give 
  a shot at the higher state one:
  
  Maharishi was preceded into the hall by a golden glow, egglike in its 
  hyranyagarba glory.  As he sat down this glow enveloped the audience and I 
  could see that patches of dark clouds over people were going away.  One 
  very dark shrouded person left the room as if the purity itself had 
  expelled him.
  
  As he started to speak it was like the impulses of the Veda were unfolding 
  within me, the Prachetina value of life, the first impulses of creative 
  intelligence were enlivened.  On either side of the stage two huge Devatas 
  stood regally enraptured by the master but knowing that they would need a 
  nervous system like ours to achieve their goal.  My eyes fall on the 
  nervous system of a co-ed a few rows ahead, wearing a loose fitting, 
  sleeveless, white, cotton shirt. At this angle I can make out the curve of 
  her breast and think if I lean farther ahead I may be in nip-slip range...
  
  But spontaneously my attention is drawn away from the rajasic and back to 
  Maharishi who is laying out the steps of progress for any government to 
  turn the world into Narnia if they would only pay enough for his programs 
  to be taught everywhere, cuz as everyone knows, the divine is always a bit 
  short on cash. (Not much of a saver.)  As he speaks he leans forward and at 
  this angle I can see into his hairy chest and if I lean 
  forward...damn...pull back pull back abort abort...Nice to be enlightened 
  though so I can see my pervieness in terms of the Self, as if the universe 
  itself want's a little nip-slip now and then and I am a faithful divine 
  servant...
  
  
  Nice piece BTW Barry, you know for WAKING STATE!  (For any new readers, 
  waking state is a substitute for S--t for brains on FFL.  It is used as 
  a reminder of the poster's intrinsic superiority.)
 
 RESPONSE: Goddamn, I loved this. More of reality gets contained in the 
 mockery than in the beatific. The muse that inspires you to write like this, 
 Curtis, it's a healthier and more discriminating muse than those muses which 
 keep up the Vedic sentimentality. Hah! Nature support coming right at you 
 from CurtisDeltaBlues. Dig it, folks. Because there ain't no defending what 
 CDB rips open. Too fing innocent. Yeah, you heard me right: that's the 
 word. For me the antidote is irony—and here, baby, you get the kind that 
 clears mental space in the universe. Oh, yeah: I speak for myself here—but if 
 you let yourself 'transcend' effortlessly (no concentration) you'll become a 
 convert. I promise you. 
  
  
  
  
  
  
   
   --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb no_reply@ wrote:
   
Today for some reason I found myself thinking back to
the first time I saw Maharishi, in 1967. At that talk,
at the Greek Theater in Los Angeles, he said a few 
things that got me interested enough in the spiritual 
path that I set about walking it. 

He laid out the benefits of meditation as he saw it,
that it offered a way to draw upon one's own inner
resources for one's sense of self worth and happiness, 
and not be dependent on others and how they see us or
what they tell us to do for those things. I remember 
him speaking about how meditation (as he saw it) 
required no belief for it to work, and no leaders or 
gurus for it to work. All that it did require was 
actually doing the work -- practicing meditation. And 
I remember him speaking about how meditation could 
help to develop one's own creativity, and how that
could help to resolve the problems of life by being
able to create more effective solutions to them.

At one point a person stood up and asked a question.
He talked about a particular problem he was 

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Hope Without Magical Thinking

[Sal Sunshine]

On Jun 22, 2011, at 11:25 AM, curtisdeltablues wrote:

 he only problem I have with what you have written Jim is your inclusion of 
 Lemon Meringue Pie and  it being incapable of giving someone absolute 
 happiness.  Here is how I break down the problems with most pies:
 
 First: Lemon filling over sweetened. Rookie mistake.  See the perfect bite 
 includes the marsh mellowing effect of the meringue, so you need to keep the 
 filling tart or you blow the genius of this combination.
 
 Second: You know all undercrust are gunna get soggy with the wet filling 
 poured on, so pre bake the bottom crust. Go a little deeper with the crushed 
 graham and crush them yourself, do not under any circumstances go with a pre 
 made one.  They all are over sweetened and suck.  How hard is it to throw 
 some graham crackers into a processor with some unsalted butter and a little 
 sugar (not honey is will soften it before you begin).  Big secret?  Add in 
 some grated orange peal , not lemon and you wont have to over sweeten the 
 crust. A little cinnamon wont hurt, a lot will.
 
 Third;  This is what separates the easy bake oven bakers and the real kitchen 
 badass homeboys.  Leave it in the broiler long enough at the end to get the 
 peaks just a touch over the browned stage.  This is tricky just like with 
 pizzas.  If you can get some peaks to go beyond caramel into blacked, you 
 will offset any over sweeting mistakes.   Just a touch of bitter is the magic 
 that makes this dessert the magical juxtaposition it can be.  In this form, 
 it IS absolute happiness believe me.
 
 Anyh, nice posts from both you and Turq.  Happy baking.  

Nice, Curtis.  Do you have any idea for making croissants
without going to all the trouble of making them from scratch?
Would puff pasty sheets work?

Sal

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Hope Without Magical Thinking

[Denise Evans]

Re: the original message - this would be my concern about Amma and her org as 
well - she appears to be devolving from the original message and executing 
controlling directives that result in dependencies in many.  Let alone the $$ 
coming in - a 21st century tithe strategy.  Magical thinking and magical 
stories abound..lessons... don't lose yourself in someone or something else 
and each of us is responsible for our own spiritual growth.


--- On Wed, 6/22/11, whynotnow7 whynotn...@yahoo.com wrote:

From: whynotnow7 whynotn...@yahoo.com
Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Hope Without Magical Thinking
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Date: Wednesday, June 22, 2011, 9:12 AM















 
 



  



  
  
  Enjoyed your blast from the past Curtis - I can totally see the judgment 
on the dark spirit who was banished from the scene by Maharishi's effulgence, 
now in retrospect realizing the poor guy probably just had to pee - too many 
mango smoothies that morningand the chosen Governors remained... 



I was not part of the reinforced indoctrination that the Governors received, 
but definitely bought into the absolute perfection of our dear leader. Though I 
recall at the time I also took seriously the Jai Guru Dev thing, respect the 
teacher, so I really didn't feel Maharishi was my personal guru, rather a 
perfect teacher (for awhile). 



The difference being I never had nor wanted a personal relationship with him, 
beyond the big Maharishi posters on my dorm walls (I did work for the MMY 
Press, but it was still a pretty groupie thing to  do...). I never had a chance 
to meet him. So I hung on his every word and worked for the Movement for two 
and a half years. Then when it became time to take a closer look and consider 
becoming a teacher myself, I decided to leave instead. Just wasn't going to 
work out.



--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues curtisdeltablues@... 
wrote:



 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Buck dhamiltony2k5@ wrote:

 

  Whoa, very nice waking state critique Turq.

  Nice writing.  -Buck

 

 I wonder why you would refer to the obvious fact that he had to be awake when 
 her wrote it?  I mean do you post in your sleep Doug?  Oh wait a second, 
 you are comparing Barry's post to a higher state of consciousness one that 
 you are somehow capable of discerning by the content.  Let me give a shot at 
 the higher state one:

 

 Maharishi was preceded into the hall by a golden glow, egglike in its 
 hyranyagarba glory.  As he sat down this glow enveloped the audience and I 
 could see that patches of dark clouds over people were going away.  One very 
 dark shrouded person left the room as if the purity itself had expelled him.

 

 As he started to speak it was like the impulses of the Veda were unfolding 
 within me, the Prachetina value of life, the first impulses of creative 
 intelligence were enlivened.  On either side of the stage two huge Devatas 
 stood regally enraptured by the master but knowing that they would need a 
 nervous system like ours to achieve their goal.  My eyes fall on the nervous 
 system of a co-ed a few rows ahead, wearing a loose fitting, sleeveless, 
 white, cotton shirt. At this angle I can make out the curve of her breast and 
 think if I lean farther ahead I may be in nip-slip range...

 

 But spontaneously my attention is drawn away from the rajasic and back to 
 Maharishi who is laying out the steps of progress for any government to turn 
 the world into Narnia if they would only pay enough for his programs to be 
 taught everywhere, cuz as everyone knows, the divine is always a bit short on 
 cash. (Not much of a saver.)  As he speaks he leans forward and at this angle 
 I can see into his hairy chest and if I lean forward...damn...pull back pull 
 back abort abort...Nice to be enlightened though so I can see my pervieness 
 in terms of the Self, as if the universe itself want's a little nip-slip now 
 and then and I am a faithful divine servant...

 

 

 Nice piece BTW Barry, you know for WAKING STATE!  (For any new readers, 
 waking state is a substitute for S--t for brains on FFL.  It is used as a 
 reminder of the poster's intrinsic superiority.)

 

 

 

 

 

 

  

  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb no_reply@ wrote:

  

   Today for some reason I found myself thinking back to

   the first time I saw Maharishi, in 1967. At that talk,

   at the Greek Theater in Los Angeles, he said a few 

   things that got me interested enough in the spiritual 

   path that I set about walking it. 

   

   He laid out the benefits of meditation as he saw it,

   that it offered a way to draw upon one's own inner

   resources for one's sense of self worth and happiness, 

   and not be dependent on others and how they see us or

   what they tell us to do for those things. I remember 

   him speaking about how meditation (as he saw it) 

   required no belief for it to work

[FairfieldLife] Re: Hope Without Magical Thinking

[curtisdeltablues]

I never went further in to pastry than figuring out the variables in pie 
crusts. (Sorry its half butter (flavor) and half Crisco or lard (flakiness) I'm 
a big bread and pizza guy.

I don't believe you can get there using philo though.  It will stay crunchy 
between levels which is what it good for. It wont blend between the levels like 
you get when you roll out a sheet of dough really really thin, brush it with 
butter and roll it into a croissant.   That is one of the few foods that is 
best left to the professionals for me.

But if I had a bigass kitchen table, and a fridge big enough to take the sheets 
as I roll them out. (they gotta stay chilled or you would get a goopy mess 
between layers)

If you try it you have to report!




--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine salsunshine@... wrote:

 On Jun 22, 2011, at 11:25 AM, curtisdeltablues wrote:
 
  he only problem I have with what you have written Jim is your inclusion of 
  Lemon Meringue Pie and  it being incapable of giving someone absolute 
  happiness.  Here is how I break down the problems with most pies:
  
  First: Lemon filling over sweetened. Rookie mistake.  See the perfect bite 
  includes the marsh mellowing effect of the meringue, so you need to keep 
  the filling tart or you blow the genius of this combination.
  
  Second: You know all undercrust are gunna get soggy with the wet filling 
  poured on, so pre bake the bottom crust. Go a little deeper with the 
  crushed graham and crush them yourself, do not under any circumstances go 
  with a pre made one.  They all are over sweetened and suck.  How hard is it 
  to throw some graham crackers into a processor with some unsalted butter 
  and a little sugar (not honey is will soften it before you begin).  Big 
  secret?  Add in some grated orange peal , not lemon and you wont have to 
  over sweeten the crust. A little cinnamon wont hurt, a lot will.
  
  Third;  This is what separates the easy bake oven bakers and the real 
  kitchen badass homeboys.  Leave it in the broiler long enough at the end to 
  get the peaks just a touch over the browned stage.  This is tricky just 
  like with pizzas.  If you can get some peaks to go beyond caramel into 
  blacked, you will offset any over sweeting mistakes.   Just a touch of 
  bitter is the magic that makes this dessert the magical juxtaposition it 
  can be.  In this form, it IS absolute happiness believe me.
  
  Anyh, nice posts from both you and Turq.  Happy baking.  
 
 Nice, Curtis.  Do you have any idea for making croissants
 without going to all the trouble of making them from scratch?
 Would puff pasty sheets work?
 
 Sal

[FairfieldLife] Re: Hope Without Magical Thinking

[whynotnow7]

responses below:

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues curtisdeltablues@... 
wrote:

 The only problem I have with what you have written Jim is your inclusion of 
 Lemon Meringue Pie and  it being incapable of giving someone absolute 
 happiness.  Here is how I break down the problems with most pies:
 
 First: Lemon filling over sweetened. Rookie mistake.  See the perfect bite 
 includes the marsh mellowing effect of the meringue, so you need to keep the 
 filling tart or you blow the genius of this combination.

**Total agreement. And the marsh mellowy part of the meringue can't have that 
too uniform wtf is that chemical puffiness consistency.
 
 Second: You know all undercrust are gunna get soggy with the wet filling 
 poured on, so pre bake the bottom crust. Go a little deeper with the crushed 
 graham and crush them yourself, do not under any circumstances go with a pre 
 made one.  They all are over sweetened and suck.  How hard is it to throw 
 some graham crackers into a processor with some unsalted butter and a little 
 sugar (not honey is will soften it before you begin).  Big secret?  Add in 
 some grated orange peal , not lemon and you wont have to over sweeten the 
 crust. A little cinnamon wont hurt, a lot will.

**You make a good point, though Marie Callender's frozen pie crust is really 
close to homemade in taste and consistency.
 
 Third;  This is what separates the easy bake oven bakers and the real kitchen 
 badass homeboys.  

**I am definitely the ez bake oven baker, making a minor art form of tweaking 
frozen nukable food into something tasty - lol, I can see your grimace. 

Leave it in the broiler long enough at the end to get the peaks just a touch 
over the browned stage.  This is tricky just like with pizzas.  If you can get 
some peaks to go beyond caramel into blacked, you will offset any over sweeting 
mistakes.   Just a touch of bitter is the magic that makes this dessert the 
magical juxtaposition it can be.  In this form, it IS absolute happiness 
believe me.

**That is a very tricky bit. Yep, overcook at that point and the whole thing 
tastes like carbon. 

Last, I am lucky to have a lemon tree in the backyard and it makes great pies 
and juice.
 
 Anyh, nice posts from both you and Turq.  Happy baking.  
 
** Yes, and happy baking to you! 
 
  
 
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, whynotnow7 whynotnow7@ wrote:
 
  I agree that Maharishi's message was one of self sufficiency, and the irony 
  you point out in the TMO is evident. I am curious though how you think one 
  person can make another person weaker (or anything else), without the 
  person being made weaker (or stronger for that matter) allowing it to 
  happen? Even if someone is not willing to acknowledge their power of 
  choice, it is always available. 
  
  What seems to get us into trouble is the propensity built into us to find 
  solutions. Its not digging a burrow or building a nest anymore, but same 
  concept, to solve the problem. So the answer becomes MAHARISHI or AMMA or 
  THE DEMOCRATS or TECH or LEMON MERINGUE PIE. Since we live so much in a 
  world of ideas now, we can find absolute happiness for awhile in a belief 
  system or a person or a series of stories, without dislodging such false 
  anchors, without untying the knots that adhere us to these ideas, for an 
  entire lifetime. 
  
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Buck dhamiltony2k5@ wrote:
  
   Whoa, very nice waking state critique Turq.
   Nice writing.  -Buck
   
   --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb no_reply@ wrote:
   
Today for some reason I found myself thinking back to
the first time I saw Maharishi, in 1967. At that talk,
at the Greek Theater in Los Angeles, he said a few 
things that got me interested enough in the spiritual 
path that I set about walking it. 

He laid out the benefits of meditation as he saw it,
that it offered a way to draw upon one's own inner
resources for one's sense of self worth and happiness, 
and not be dependent on others and how they see us or
what they tell us to do for those things. I remember 
him speaking about how meditation (as he saw it) 
required no belief for it to work, and no leaders or 
gurus for it to work. All that it did require was 
actually doing the work -- practicing meditation. And 
I remember him speaking about how meditation could 
help to develop one's own creativity, and how that
could help to resolve the problems of life by being
able to create more effective solutions to them.

At one point a person stood up and asked a question.
He talked about a particular problem he was having,
and how it had left him in a quandary, not knowing
what to do. He then asked Maharishi what to do. 

Maharishi's answer was the most impressive thing he'd
said in the entire talk. He said, If I tell you what
to do, all that will happen is that 

[FairfieldLife] Re: Hope Without Magical Thinking

[whynotnow7]

nuthin' says lovin' like something in the oven - Pillsbury makes some pretty 
good instant croissants, though all their stuff has a pronounced baking powder 
flavor that has to be drowned out with a lot of butter.

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine salsunshine@... wrote:

 On Jun 22, 2011, at 11:25 AM, curtisdeltablues wrote:
 
  he only problem I have with what you have written Jim is your inclusion of 
  Lemon Meringue Pie and  it being incapable of giving someone absolute 
  happiness.  Here is how I break down the problems with most pies:
  
  First: Lemon filling over sweetened. Rookie mistake.  See the perfect bite 
  includes the marsh mellowing effect of the meringue, so you need to keep 
  the filling tart or you blow the genius of this combination.
  
  Second: You know all undercrust are gunna get soggy with the wet filling 
  poured on, so pre bake the bottom crust. Go a little deeper with the 
  crushed graham and crush them yourself, do not under any circumstances go 
  with a pre made one.  They all are over sweetened and suck.  How hard is it 
  to throw some graham crackers into a processor with some unsalted butter 
  and a little sugar (not honey is will soften it before you begin).  Big 
  secret?  Add in some grated orange peal , not lemon and you wont have to 
  over sweeten the crust. A little cinnamon wont hurt, a lot will.
  
  Third;  This is what separates the easy bake oven bakers and the real 
  kitchen badass homeboys.  Leave it in the broiler long enough at the end to 
  get the peaks just a touch over the browned stage.  This is tricky just 
  like with pizzas.  If you can get some peaks to go beyond caramel into 
  blacked, you will offset any over sweeting mistakes.   Just a touch of 
  bitter is the magic that makes this dessert the magical juxtaposition it 
  can be.  In this form, it IS absolute happiness believe me.
  
  Anyh, nice posts from both you and Turq.  Happy baking.  
 
 Nice, Curtis.  Do you have any idea for making croissants
 without going to all the trouble of making them from scratch?
 Would puff pasty sheets work?
 
 Sal

[FairfieldLife] Re: Hope Without Magical Thinking

[whynotnow7]

Yeah, not to lose ourselves, good advice. Ironically it is when things are not 
working for us that we decide to find the answers somewhere else and have more 
of a willingness to accept anything, no matter how irrational it may seem in a 
more self-confident moment.

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Denise Evans dmevans365@... wrote:

 Re: the original message - this would be my concern about Amma and her org as 
 well - she appears to be devolving from the original message and executing 
 controlling directives that result in dependencies in many.  Let alone the 
 $$ coming in - a 21st century tithe strategy.  Magical thinking and magical 
 stories abound..lessons... don't lose yourself in someone or something 
 else and each of us is responsible for our own spiritual growth.
 
 
 --- On Wed, 6/22/11, whynotnow7 whynotnow7@... wrote:
 
 From: whynotnow7 whynotnow7@...
 Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Hope Without Magical Thinking
 To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
 Date: Wednesday, June 22, 2011, 9:12 AM
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
  
  
 
 
 
   
 
 
 
   
   
   Enjoyed your blast from the past Curtis - I can totally see the 
 judgment on the dark spirit who was banished from the scene by Maharishi's 
 effulgence, now in retrospect realizing the poor guy probably just had to pee 
 - too many mango smoothies that morningand the chosen Governors 
 remained... 
 
 
 
 I was not part of the reinforced indoctrination that the Governors received, 
 but definitely bought into the absolute perfection of our dear leader. Though 
 I recall at the time I also took seriously the Jai Guru Dev thing, respect 
 the teacher, so I really didn't feel Maharishi was my personal guru, rather a 
 perfect teacher (for awhile). 
 
 
 
 The difference being I never had nor wanted a personal relationship with him, 
 beyond the big Maharishi posters on my dorm walls (I did work for the MMY 
 Press, but it was still a pretty groupie thing to  do...). I never had a 
 chance to meet him. So I hung on his every word and worked for the Movement 
 for two and a half years. Then when it became time to take a closer look and 
 consider becoming a teacher myself, I decided to leave instead. Just wasn't 
 going to work out.
 
 
 
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues curtisdeltablues@ 
 wrote:
 
 
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Buck dhamiltony2k5@ wrote:
 
  
 
   Whoa, very nice waking state critique Turq.
 
   Nice writing.  -Buck
 
  
 
  I wonder why you would refer to the obvious fact that he had to be awake 
  when her wrote it?  I mean do you post in your sleep Doug?  Oh wait a 
  second, you are comparing Barry's post to a higher state of consciousness 
  one that you are somehow capable of discerning by the content.  Let me give 
  a shot at the higher state one:
 
  
 
  Maharishi was preceded into the hall by a golden glow, egglike in its 
  hyranyagarba glory.  As he sat down this glow enveloped the audience and I 
  could see that patches of dark clouds over people were going away.  One 
  very dark shrouded person left the room as if the purity itself had 
  expelled him.
 
  
 
  As he started to speak it was like the impulses of the Veda were unfolding 
  within me, the Prachetina value of life, the first impulses of creative 
  intelligence were enlivened.  On either side of the stage two huge Devatas 
  stood regally enraptured by the master but knowing that they would need a 
  nervous system like ours to achieve their goal.  My eyes fall on the 
  nervous system of a co-ed a few rows ahead, wearing a loose fitting, 
  sleeveless, white, cotton shirt. At this angle I can make out the curve of 
  her breast and think if I lean farther ahead I may be in nip-slip range...
 
  
 
  But spontaneously my attention is drawn away from the rajasic and back to 
  Maharishi who is laying out the steps of progress for any government to 
  turn the world into Narnia if they would only pay enough for his programs 
  to be taught everywhere, cuz as everyone knows, the divine is always a bit 
  short on cash. (Not much of a saver.)  As he speaks he leans forward and at 
  this angle I can see into his hairy chest and if I lean 
  forward...damn...pull back pull back abort abort...Nice to be enlightened 
  though so I can see my pervieness in terms of the Self, as if the universe 
  itself want's a little nip-slip now and then and I am a faithful divine 
  servant...
 
  
 
  
 
  Nice piece BTW Barry, you know for WAKING STATE!  (For any new readers, 
  waking state is a substitute for S--t for brains on FFL.  It is used as 
  a reminder of the poster's intrinsic superiority.)
 
  
 
  
 
  
 
  
 
  
 
  
 
   
 
   --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb no_reply@ wrote:
 
   
 
Today for some reason I found myself thinking back to
 
the first time I saw Maharishi, in 1967. At that talk,
 
at the Greek Theater in Los Angeles, he said a few

[FairfieldLife] Re: Hope Without Magical Thinking

[curtisdeltablues]

If you can grow lemons do you have avocados in your back yard too?

That was the coolest thing about living in Florida, tropical fruits!




--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, whynotnow7 whynotnow7@... wrote:

 responses below:
 
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues curtisdeltablues@ 
 wrote:
 
  The only problem I have with what you have written Jim is your inclusion of 
  Lemon Meringue Pie and  it being incapable of giving someone absolute 
  happiness.  Here is how I break down the problems with most pies:
  
  First: Lemon filling over sweetened. Rookie mistake.  See the perfect bite 
  includes the marsh mellowing effect of the meringue, so you need to keep 
  the filling tart or you blow the genius of this combination.
 
 **Total agreement. And the marsh mellowy part of the meringue can't have that 
 too uniform wtf is that chemical puffiness consistency.
  
  Second: You know all undercrust are gunna get soggy with the wet filling 
  poured on, so pre bake the bottom crust. Go a little deeper with the 
  crushed graham and crush them yourself, do not under any circumstances go 
  with a pre made one.  They all are over sweetened and suck.  How hard is it 
  to throw some graham crackers into a processor with some unsalted butter 
  and a little sugar (not honey is will soften it before you begin).  Big 
  secret?  Add in some grated orange peal , not lemon and you wont have to 
  over sweeten the crust. A little cinnamon wont hurt, a lot will.
 
 **You make a good point, though Marie Callender's frozen pie crust is really 
 close to homemade in taste and consistency.
  
  Third;  This is what separates the easy bake oven bakers and the real 
  kitchen badass homeboys.  
 
 **I am definitely the ez bake oven baker, making a minor art form of tweaking 
 frozen nukable food into something tasty - lol, I can see your grimace. 
 
 Leave it in the broiler long enough at the end to get the peaks just a touch 
 over the browned stage.  This is tricky just like with pizzas.  If you can 
 get some peaks to go beyond caramel into blacked, you will offset any over 
 sweeting mistakes.   Just a touch of bitter is the magic that makes this 
 dessert the magical juxtaposition it can be.  In this form, it IS absolute 
 happiness believe me.
 
 **That is a very tricky bit. Yep, overcook at that point and the whole thing 
 tastes like carbon. 
 
 Last, I am lucky to have a lemon tree in the backyard and it makes great pies 
 and juice.
  
  Anyh, nice posts from both you and Turq.  Happy baking.  
  
 ** Yes, and happy baking to you! 
  
   
  
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, whynotnow7 whynotnow7@ wrote:
  
   I agree that Maharishi's message was one of self sufficiency, and the 
   irony you point out in the TMO is evident. I am curious though how you 
   think one person can make another person weaker (or anything else), 
   without the person being made weaker (or stronger for that matter) 
   allowing it to happen? Even if someone is not willing to acknowledge 
   their power of choice, it is always available. 
   
   What seems to get us into trouble is the propensity built into us to find 
   solutions. Its not digging a burrow or building a nest anymore, but same 
   concept, to solve the problem. So the answer becomes MAHARISHI or AMMA or 
   THE DEMOCRATS or TECH or LEMON MERINGUE PIE. Since we live so much in a 
   world of ideas now, we can find absolute happiness for awhile in a belief 
   system or a person or a series of stories, without dislodging such false 
   anchors, without untying the knots that adhere us to these ideas, for an 
   entire lifetime. 
   
   --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Buck dhamiltony2k5@ wrote:
   
Whoa, very nice waking state critique Turq.
Nice writing.  -Buck

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb no_reply@ wrote:

 Today for some reason I found myself thinking back to
 the first time I saw Maharishi, in 1967. At that talk,
 at the Greek Theater in Los Angeles, he said a few 
 things that got me interested enough in the spiritual 
 path that I set about walking it. 
 
 He laid out the benefits of meditation as he saw it,
 that it offered a way to draw upon one's own inner
 resources for one's sense of self worth and happiness, 
 and not be dependent on others and how they see us or
 what they tell us to do for those things. I remember 
 him speaking about how meditation (as he saw it) 
 required no belief for it to work, and no leaders or 
 gurus for it to work. All that it did require was 
 actually doing the work -- practicing meditation. And 
 I remember him speaking about how meditation could 
 help to develop one's own creativity, and how that
 could help to resolve the problems of life by being
 able to create more effective solutions to them.
 
 At one point a person stood up and asked a question.
 He talked 

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Hope Without Magical Thinking

[Sal Sunshine]

Well, philo is different from puff pastry.
I've never used philo for anything other than
spinach pies~~which are easy and which I'll
be making later this week.
I agree totally about leaving some things
to the professionals, though.  They're either
too time-consuming for what you get, or they're
not nearly as good.  Haven't quite gotten to that
point with croissants yet, although it's close.
I'll definitely let you know if I'm successful
with them, Curtis.

Best,
Sal
  
On Jun 22, 2011, at 12:26 PM, curtisdeltablues wrote:

I never went further in to pastry than figuring out the variables in pie 
crusts. (Sorry its half butter (flavor) and half Crisco or lard (flakiness) I'm 
a big bread and pizza guy.

I don't believe you can get there using philo though.  It will stay crunchy 
between levels which is what it good for. It wont blend between the levels like 
you get when you roll out a sheet of dough really really thin, brush it with 
butter and roll it into a croissant.   That is one of the few foods that is 
best left to the professionals for me.

But if I had a bigass kitchen table, and a fridge big enough to take the sheets 
as I roll them out. (they gotta stay chilled or you would get a goopy mess 
between layers)

If you try it you have to report!




--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine salsunshine@... wrote:
 
 On Jun 22, 2011, at 11:25 AM, curtisdeltablues wrote:
 
 he only problem I have with what you have written Jim is your inclusion of 
 Lemon Meringue Pie and  it being incapable of giving someone absolute 
 happiness.  Here is how I break down the problems with most pies:
 
 First: Lemon filling over sweetened. Rookie mistake.  See the perfect bite 
 includes the marsh mellowing effect of the meringue, so you need to keep the 
 filling tart or you blow the genius of this combination.
 
 Second: You know all undercrust are gunna get soggy with the wet filling 
 poured on, so pre bake the bottom crust. Go a little deeper with the crushed 
 graham and crush them yourself, do not under any circumstances go with a pre 
 made one.  They all are over sweetened and suck.  How hard is it to throw 
 some graham crackers into a processor with some unsalted butter and a little 
 sugar (not honey is will soften it before you begin).  Big secret?  Add in 
 some grated orange peal , not lemon and you wont have to over sweeten the 
 crust. A little cinnamon wont hurt, a lot will.
 
 Third;  This is what separates the easy bake oven bakers and the real 
 kitchen badass homeboys.  Leave it in the broiler long enough at the end to 
 get the peaks just a touch over the browned stage.  This is tricky just like 
 with pizzas.  If you can get some peaks to go beyond caramel into blacked, 
 you will offset any over sweeting mistakes.   Just a touch of bitter is the 
 magic that makes this dessert the magical juxtaposition it can be.  In this 
 form, it IS absolute happiness believe me.
 
 Anyh, nice posts from both you and Turq.  Happy baking.  
 
 Nice, Curtis.  Do you have any idea for making croissants
 without going to all the trouble of making them from scratch?
 Would puff pasty sheets work?

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Hope Without Magical Thinking

[Sal Sunshine]

Well, Pillsbury makes crescent rolls, right?
I haven't seen any instant croissants. And  If 
they haven't done it it's probably not 
possible.
Sal

On Jun 22, 2011, at 1:00 PM, whynotnow7 wrote:

nuthin' says lovin' like something in the oven - Pillsbury makes some pretty 
good instant croissants, though all their stuff has a pronounced baking powder 
flavor that has to be drowned out with a lot of butter.

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine salsunshine@... wrote:
 
 On Jun 22, 2011, at 11:25 AM, curtisdeltablues wrote:
 
 he only problem I have with what you have written Jim is your inclusion of 
 Lemon Meringue Pie and  it being incapable of giving someone absolute 
 happiness.  Here is how I break down the problems with most pies:
 
 First: Lemon filling over sweetened. Rookie mistake.  See the perfect bite 
 includes the marsh mellowing effect of the meringue, so you need to keep the 
 filling tart or you blow the genius of this combination.
 
 Second: You know all undercrust are gunna get soggy with the wet filling 
 poured on, so pre bake the bottom crust. Go a little deeper with the crushed 
 graham and crush them yourself, do not under any circumstances go with a pre 
 made one.  They all are over sweetened and suck.  How hard is it to throw 
 some graham crackers into a processor with some unsalted butter and a little 
 sugar (not honey is will soften it before you begin).  Big secret?  Add in 
 some grated orange peal , not lemon and you wont have to over sweeten the 
 crust. A little cinnamon wont hurt, a lot will.
 
 Third;  This is what separates the easy bake oven bakers and the real 
 kitchen badass homeboys.  Leave it in the broiler long enough at the end to 
 get the peaks just a touch over the browned stage.  This is tricky just like 
 with pizzas.  If you can get some peaks to go beyond caramel into blacked, 
 you will offset any over sweeting mistakes.   Just a touch of bitter is the 
 magic that makes this dessert the magical juxtaposition it can be.  In this 
 form, it IS absolute happiness believe me.
 
 Anyh, nice posts from both you and Turq.  Happy baking.  
 
 Nice, Curtis.  Do you have any idea for making croissants
 without going to all the trouble of making them from scratch?
 Would puff pasty sheets work?

[FairfieldLife] Re: Hope Without Magical Thinking

[curtisdeltablues]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine salsunshine@... wrote:

 Well, philo is different from puff pastry.

Yes, I understand now. So maybe your idea has more merit than I thought.  I 
have only used Philo and thought they were similar.  If puff pastry can rise 
and isn't crunchy inside  you might be on to something.  It might be a 
crunchier croissants which would not be a bad thing in my book.  I hope you do 
it!

Here is a recipe I found on puffpastry.com for croissants.

 http://www.puffpastry.com/recipedetail.aspx?recipeID=60105rc=-1

I hope you do it and report!

Curtis 




 I've never used philo for anything other than
 spinach pies~~which are easy and which I'll
 be making later this week.
 I agree totally about leaving some things
 to the professionals, though.  They're either
 too time-consuming for what you get, or they're
 not nearly as good.  Haven't quite gotten to that
 point with croissants yet, although it's close.
 I'll definitely let you know if I'm successful
 with them, Curtis.
 
 Best,
 Sal
   
 On Jun 22, 2011, at 12:26 PM, curtisdeltablues wrote:
 
 I never went further in to pastry than figuring out the variables in pie 
 crusts. (Sorry its half butter (flavor) and half Crisco or lard (flakiness) 
 I'm a big bread and pizza guy.
 
 I don't believe you can get there using philo though.  It will stay crunchy 
 between levels which is what it good for. It wont blend between the levels 
 like you get when you roll out a sheet of dough really really thin, brush it 
 with butter and roll it into a croissant.   That is one of the few foods that 
 is best left to the professionals for me.
 
 But if I had a bigass kitchen table, and a fridge big enough to take the 
 sheets as I roll them out. (they gotta stay chilled or you would get a goopy 
 mess between layers)
 
 If you try it you have to report!
 
 
 
 
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine salsunshine@ wrote:
  
  On Jun 22, 2011, at 11:25 AM, curtisdeltablues wrote:
  
  he only problem I have with what you have written Jim is your inclusion of 
  Lemon Meringue Pie and  it being incapable of giving someone absolute 
  happiness.  Here is how I break down the problems with most pies:
  
  First: Lemon filling over sweetened. Rookie mistake.  See the perfect bite 
  includes the marsh mellowing effect of the meringue, so you need to keep 
  the filling tart or you blow the genius of this combination.
  
  Second: You know all undercrust are gunna get soggy with the wet filling 
  poured on, so pre bake the bottom crust. Go a little deeper with the 
  crushed graham and crush them yourself, do not under any circumstances go 
  with a pre made one.  They all are over sweetened and suck.  How hard is 
  it to throw some graham crackers into a processor with some unsalted 
  butter and a little sugar (not honey is will soften it before you begin).  
  Big secret?  Add in some grated orange peal , not lemon and you wont have 
  to over sweeten the crust. A little cinnamon wont hurt, a lot will.
  
  Third;  This is what separates the easy bake oven bakers and the real 
  kitchen badass homeboys.  Leave it in the broiler long enough at the end 
  to get the peaks just a touch over the browned stage.  This is tricky just 
  like with pizzas.  If you can get some peaks to go beyond caramel into 
  blacked, you will offset any over sweeting mistakes.   Just a touch of 
  bitter is the magic that makes this dessert the magical juxtaposition it 
  can be.  In this form, it IS absolute happiness believe me.
  
  Anyh, nice posts from both you and Turq.  Happy baking.  
  
  Nice, Curtis.  Do you have any idea for making croissants
  without going to all the trouble of making them from scratch?
  Would puff pasty sheets work?

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Hope Without Magical Thinking

[Sal Sunshine]

On Jun 22, 2011, at 2:07 PM, curtisdeltablues wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine salsunshine@... wrote:
 
 Well, philo is different from puff pastry.
 
 Yes, I understand now. So maybe your idea has more merit than I thought.  I 
 have only used Philo and thought they were similar.  If puff pastry can rise 
 and isn't crunchy inside  you might be on to something.  It might be a 
 crunchier croissants which would not be a bad thing in my book.  I hope you 
 do it!
 
 Here is a recipe I found on puffpastry.com for croissants.
 
 http://www.puffpastry.com/recipedetail.aspx?recipeID=60105rc=-1

Yes, that's the one I saw!  

 I hope you do it and report!

I'm letting the dough thaw as I type.  

Sal

[FairfieldLife] Re: Hope Without Magical Thinking

[whynotnow7]

You are right. Oh well. Maybe if you put on a beret, some french music, pour a 
glass of bordeaux and THEN eat the Pillsbury crescent roll, the effect will be 
achieved. I suppose it depends on the size of that glass of wine...

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine salsunshine@... wrote:

 Well, Pillsbury makes crescent rolls, right?
 I haven't seen any instant croissants. And  If 
 they haven't done it it's probably not 
 possible.
 Sal
 
 On Jun 22, 2011, at 1:00 PM, whynotnow7 wrote:
 
 nuthin' says lovin' like something in the oven - Pillsbury makes some 
 pretty good instant croissants, though all their stuff has a pronounced 
 baking powder flavor that has to be drowned out with a lot of butter.
 
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine salsunshine@ wrote:
  
  On Jun 22, 2011, at 11:25 AM, curtisdeltablues wrote:
  
  he only problem I have with what you have written Jim is your inclusion of 
  Lemon Meringue Pie and  it being incapable of giving someone absolute 
  happiness.  Here is how I break down the problems with most pies:
  
  First: Lemon filling over sweetened. Rookie mistake.  See the perfect bite 
  includes the marsh mellowing effect of the meringue, so you need to keep 
  the filling tart or you blow the genius of this combination.
  
  Second: You know all undercrust are gunna get soggy with the wet filling 
  poured on, so pre bake the bottom crust. Go a little deeper with the 
  crushed graham and crush them yourself, do not under any circumstances go 
  with a pre made one.  They all are over sweetened and suck.  How hard is 
  it to throw some graham crackers into a processor with some unsalted 
  butter and a little sugar (not honey is will soften it before you begin).  
  Big secret?  Add in some grated orange peal , not lemon and you wont have 
  to over sweeten the crust. A little cinnamon wont hurt, a lot will.
  
  Third;  This is what separates the easy bake oven bakers and the real 
  kitchen badass homeboys.  Leave it in the broiler long enough at the end 
  to get the peaks just a touch over the browned stage.  This is tricky just 
  like with pizzas.  If you can get some peaks to go beyond caramel into 
  blacked, you will offset any over sweeting mistakes.   Just a touch of 
  bitter is the magic that makes this dessert the magical juxtaposition it 
  can be.  In this form, it IS absolute happiness believe me.
  
  Anyh, nice posts from both you and Turq.  Happy baking.  
  
  Nice, Curtis.  Do you have any idea for making croissants
  without going to all the trouble of making them from scratch?
  Would puff pasty sheets work?

[FairfieldLife] Re: Hope Without Magical Thinking

[whynotnow7]

damned right dude - biggest crop one year was about 400 avos(!). The tree is 
about 50 feet tall and 60 years old. All organic. Average yield is 100 to 200 
per season. This year the crop was tiny, maybe 50, and I share half with the 
squirrels. If they gnaw it before I get to it, its theirs. The wind sometimes 
kicks up around pollinating season and knocks a lot of the avocado flowers off. 
Also have two orange trees. Still have a lot of fruit on one of them. The lemon 
tree at any one time has 60 to 100 lemons. Might be a Meyer, but not really 
sure.

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues curtisdeltablues@... 
wrote:

 If you can grow lemons do you have avocados in your back yard too?
 
 That was the coolest thing about living in Florida, tropical fruits!
 
 
 
 
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, whynotnow7 whynotnow7@ wrote:
 
  responses below:
  
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues 
  curtisdeltablues@ wrote:
  
   The only problem I have with what you have written Jim is your inclusion 
   of Lemon Meringue Pie and  it being incapable of giving someone absolute 
   happiness.  Here is how I break down the problems with most pies:
   
   First: Lemon filling over sweetened. Rookie mistake.  See the perfect 
   bite includes the marsh mellowing effect of the meringue, so you need to 
   keep the filling tart or you blow the genius of this combination.
  
  **Total agreement. And the marsh mellowy part of the meringue can't have 
  that too uniform wtf is that chemical puffiness consistency.
   
   Second: You know all undercrust are gunna get soggy with the wet filling 
   poured on, so pre bake the bottom crust. Go a little deeper with the 
   crushed graham and crush them yourself, do not under any circumstances go 
   with a pre made one.  They all are over sweetened and suck.  How hard is 
   it to throw some graham crackers into a processor with some unsalted 
   butter and a little sugar (not honey is will soften it before you begin). 
Big secret?  Add in some grated orange peal , not lemon and you wont 
   have to over sweeten the crust. A little cinnamon wont hurt, a lot will.
  
  **You make a good point, though Marie Callender's frozen pie crust is 
  really close to homemade in taste and consistency.
   
   Third;  This is what separates the easy bake oven bakers and the real 
   kitchen badass homeboys.  
  
  **I am definitely the ez bake oven baker, making a minor art form of 
  tweaking frozen nukable food into something tasty - lol, I can see your 
  grimace. 
  
  Leave it in the broiler long enough at the end to get the peaks just a 
  touch over the browned stage.  This is tricky just like with pizzas.  If 
  you can get some peaks to go beyond caramel into blacked, you will offset 
  any over sweeting mistakes.   Just a touch of bitter is the magic that 
  makes this dessert the magical juxtaposition it can be.  In this form, it 
  IS absolute happiness believe me.
  
  **That is a very tricky bit. Yep, overcook at that point and the whole 
  thing tastes like carbon. 
  
  Last, I am lucky to have a lemon tree in the backyard and it makes great 
  pies and juice.
   
   Anyh, nice posts from both you and Turq.  Happy baking.  
   
  ** Yes, and happy baking to you! 
   

   
   --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, whynotnow7 whynotnow7@ wrote:
   
I agree that Maharishi's message was one of self sufficiency, and the 
irony you point out in the TMO is evident. I am curious though how you 
think one person can make another person weaker (or anything else), 
without the person being made weaker (or stronger for that matter) 
allowing it to happen? Even if someone is not willing to acknowledge 
their power of choice, it is always available. 

What seems to get us into trouble is the propensity built into us to 
find solutions. Its not digging a burrow or building a nest anymore, 
but same concept, to solve the problem. So the answer becomes MAHARISHI 
or AMMA or THE DEMOCRATS or TECH or LEMON MERINGUE PIE. Since we live 
so much in a world of ideas now, we can find absolute happiness for 
awhile in a belief system or a person or a series of stories, without 
dislodging such false anchors, without untying the knots that adhere us 
to these ideas, for an entire lifetime. 

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Buck dhamiltony2k5@ wrote:

 Whoa, very nice waking state critique Turq.
 Nice writing.  -Buck
 
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb no_reply@ wrote:
 
  Today for some reason I found myself thinking back to
  the first time I saw Maharishi, in 1967. At that talk,
  at the Greek Theater in Los Angeles, he said a few 
  things that got me interested enough in the spiritual 
  path that I set about walking it. 
  
  He laid out the benefits of meditation as he saw it,
  that it offered a way 

[FairfieldLife] Re: Hope Without Magical Thinking

[Buck]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb no_reply@... wrote:

 Today for some reason I found myself thinking back to
 the first time I saw Maharishi, in 1967. At that talk,
 at the Greek Theater in Los Angeles, he said a few 
 things that got me interested enough in the spiritual 
 path that I set about walking it. 


I went to the memorial service on MUM campus last nite.
For Lilian Wallace, the Wallace family matriarch.  
Very much an old TM/MUM trustees event, and some 
of us other old-timers who have been around all alongside of this who are not 
TM-Rajas.

Very nice evening of primarily the Wallace family reminiscing about Lilian 
Wallace.
She was a very large personality that was along the whole way behind the scenes
of the TM-movement by virtue of Keith Wallace and Peter.  In character it seems 
she was a glamorous strong willed person of the mid-20th century.  I know her 
first in California at one of the Humbolt courses with Maharishi.  Was a big 
course with well over a thousand people.  Most of us sat in a field house on 
folding chairs for the lectures.  Up front was an area of stuffed chairs set 
out for the rich ladies from southern California.   They were the supporters 
of the 1960's.  They were of that generation.  'Made-up' and dolled up they 
were taken care of up there.  Initially Lillian it seems was brought in and 
introduced to TM and maharishi by her kids, Peter and Keith, she was of that 
time.

The speakers at the memorial spoke stories of those times and her life.  It was 
fun.  Especially was Peter going on about he and his mom being with old 
Yogananda followers, learning kriya meditation and practices early on, 
Buddhism, and going to india and being with saints there.  Anandamayi Ma.  
Peter was warm and animated.  On the other side of the stage while Peter waxes 
on about visiting saints in India are Bevan and Keith stoically listening.  It 
was a moment.

Patronage.  Was interesting to see the room, staging, and relationship of the 
Wallace clan to it.  Keith is first scientist of the TM-order.  He is not MUM, 
not a Raja neither.  Bevan is evidently powerful.   In the greeting of folks 
there was some ring-kissing demonstrations of fealty with Bevan going on as 
well as chit-chat.  The position of the Wallaces is a special place, emeritus 
in a way by virtue of Bevan evidently.

Bevan batted clean up as speaker and gave a nice statement drawing on a 
principle.  It was nice and enlarging.

I've gone to a lot of memorials of the meditating community the last few of 
years.  Mostly the folks who would attend are the closer friends or co-workers 
of the deceased.  Something I was noticing about some of the memorials is that 
even with some of the most true-blue rank and file people who have been around 
making things happen by deed of their work or money, often the level of this 
upper movement is not present with the families and friends of the deceased at 
memorials within the meditating community.  This particular memorial was of the 
Taliban-class of the TM-movement.  Evidently as a class they were present for 
this.  It wasn't necessarily large.  

In looking, the two people who were particularly lit of the whole group were 
Craig Pearson and Susan Humphreys.  Hopefully they can outlive the larger force 
of being there and usher a new feeling to the group.  It's a pretty cold group. 
 Lord help 'em. 

- Buck in FF 
 
 
 He laid out the benefits of meditation as he saw it,
 that it offered a way to draw upon one's own inner
 resources for one's sense of self worth and happiness, 
 and not be dependent on others and how they see us or
 what they tell us to do for those things. I remember 
 him speaking about how meditation (as he saw it) 
 required no belief for it to work, and no leaders or 
 gurus for it to work. All that it did require was 
 actually doing the work -- practicing meditation. And 
 I remember him speaking about how meditation could 
 help to develop one's own creativity, and how that
 could help to resolve the problems of life by being
 able to create more effective solutions to them.
 
 At one point a person stood up and asked a question.
 He talked about a particular problem he was having,
 and how it had left him in a quandary, not knowing
 what to do. He then asked Maharishi what to do. 
 
 Maharishi's answer was the most impressive thing he'd
 said in the entire talk. He said, If I tell you what
 to do, all that will happen is that it will make you
 weaker. The next time you have a problem, you'll want
 me to tell you what to do about it again. You will 
 become dependent on me. What you should do instead is 
 meditate, draw upon your own creativity, and solve 
 the problem yourself. That will make you stronger.
 
 Compare and contrast to what Maharishi allowed his
 teaching and his spiritual movement to devolve into.
 What I find myself thinking today, remembering this
 first talk, is how SAD it is how little of what he 
 said that day 

[FairfieldLife] Re: Hope Without Magical Thinking

[merudanda]

Buck,thanks for sharing this...
magical
Roll up (AND) THAT'S AN INVITATION,
  roll up for the mystery tour.
Roll up TO MAKE A RESERVATION,
  roll up for the mystery tour.
The magical mystery tour is waiting to take you away,
Waiting to take you away.
Hoping to take you away.
Dying to take you away, take you today
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Buck dhamiltony2k5@... wrote:



 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb no_reply@ wrote:
 
  Today for some reason I found myself thinking back to
  the first time I saw Maharishi, in 1967. At that talk,
  at the Greek Theater in Los Angeles, he said a few
  things that got me interested enough in the spiritual
  path that I set about walking it.
 

 I went to the memorial service on MUM campus last nite.
 For Lilian Wallace, the Wallace family matriarch.
 Very much an old TM/MUM trustees event, and some
 of us other old-timers who have been around all alongside of this who
are not TM-Rajas.

 Very nice evening of primarily the Wallace family reminiscing about
Lilian Wallace.
 She was a very large personality that was along the whole way behind
the scenes
 of the TM-movement by virtue of Keith Wallace and Peter.  In character
it seems she was a glamorous strong willed person of the mid-20th
century.  I know her first in California at one of the Humbolt courses
with Maharishi.  Was a big course with well over a thousand people. 
Most of us sat in a field house on folding chairs for the lectures.  Up
front was an area of stuffed chairs set out for the rich ladies from
southern California.   They were the supporters of the 1960's.  They
were of that generation.  'Made-up' and dolled up they were taken care
of up there.  Initially Lillian it seems was brought in and introduced
to TM and maharishi by her kids, Peter and Keith, she was of that time.

 The speakers at the memorial spoke stories of those times and her
life.  It was fun.  Especially was Peter going on about he and his mom
being with old Yogananda followers, learning kriya meditation and
practices early on, Buddhism, and going to india and being with saints
there.  Anandamayi Ma.  Peter was warm and animated.  On the other side
of the stage while Peter waxes on about visiting saints in India are
Bevan and Keith stoically listening.  It was a moment.

 Patronage.  Was interesting to see the room, staging, and relationship
of the Wallace clan to it.  Keith is first scientist of the TM-order. 
He is not MUM, not a Raja neither.  Bevan is evidently powerful.   In
the greeting of folks there was some ring-kissing demonstrations of
fealty with Bevan going on as well as chit-chat.  The position of the
Wallaces is a special place, emeritus in a way by virtue of Bevan
evidently.

 Bevan batted clean up as speaker and gave a nice statement drawing on
a principle.  It was nice and enlarging.

 I've gone to a lot of memorials of the meditating community the last
few of years.  Mostly the folks who would attend are the closer friends
or co-workers of the deceased.  Something I was noticing about some of
the memorials is that even with some of the most true-blue rank and file
people who have been around making things happen by deed of their work
or money, often the level of this upper movement is not present with the
families and friends of the deceased at memorials within the meditating
community.  This particular memorial was of the Taliban-class of the
TM-movement.  Evidently as a class they were present for this.  It
wasn't necessarily large.

 In looking, the two people who were particularly lit of the whole
group were Craig Pearson and Susan Humphreys.  Hopefully they can
outlive the larger force of being there and usher a new feeling to the
group.  It's a pretty cold group.  Lord help 'em.

 - Buck in FF


  He laid out the benefits of meditation as he saw it,
  that it offered a way to draw upon one's own inner
  resources for one's sense of self worth and happiness,
  and not be dependent on others and how they see us or
  what they tell us to do for those things. I remember
  him speaking about how meditation (as he saw it)
  required no belief for it to work, and no leaders or
  gurus for it to work. All that it did require was
  actually doing the work -- practicing meditation. And
  I remember him speaking about how meditation could
  help to develop one's own creativity, and how that
  could help to resolve the problems of life by being
  able to create more effective solutions to them.
 
  At one point a person stood up and asked a question.
  He talked about a particular problem he was having,
  and how it had left him in a quandary, not knowing
  what to do. He then asked Maharishi what to do.
 
  Maharishi's answer was the most impressive thing he'd
  said in the entire talk. He said, If I tell you what
  to do, all that will happen is that it will make you
  weaker. The next time you have a problem, you'll want
  me to tell you what to do about it again. You will
  become dependent on 

[FairfieldLife] Re: Hope Without Magical Thinking

[Yifu]

thx, I was there at that time.
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_NC4d7MFA2Mk/SkTMbp3i99I/BlQ/JoxhxVDrbMk/s400/Louis+Wain+Cat+Postcard+Playing+Cards.jpg

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, merudanda no_reply@... wrote:

 Buck,thanks for sharing this...
 magical
 Roll up (AND) THAT'S AN INVITATION,
   roll up for the mystery tour.
 Roll up TO MAKE A RESERVATION,
   roll up for the mystery tour.
 The magical mystery tour is waiting to take you away,
 Waiting to take you away.
 Hoping to take you away.
 Dying to take you away, take you today
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Buck dhamiltony2k5@ wrote:
 
 
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb no_reply@ wrote:
  
   Today for some reason I found myself thinking back to
   the first time I saw Maharishi, in 1967. At that talk,
   at the Greek Theater in Los Angeles, he said a few
   things that got me interested enough in the spiritual
   path that I set about walking it.
  
 
  I went to the memorial service on MUM campus last nite.
  For Lilian Wallace, the Wallace family matriarch.
  Very much an old TM/MUM trustees event, and some
  of us other old-timers who have been around all alongside of this who
 are not TM-Rajas.
 
  Very nice evening of primarily the Wallace family reminiscing about
 Lilian Wallace.
  She was a very large personality that was along the whole way behind
 the scenes
  of the TM-movement by virtue of Keith Wallace and Peter.  In character
 it seems she was a glamorous strong willed person of the mid-20th
 century.  I know her first in California at one of the Humbolt courses
 with Maharishi.  Was a big course with well over a thousand people. 
 Most of us sat in a field house on folding chairs for the lectures.  Up
 front was an area of stuffed chairs set out for the rich ladies from
 southern California.   They were the supporters of the 1960's.  They
 were of that generation.  'Made-up' and dolled up they were taken care
 of up there.  Initially Lillian it seems was brought in and introduced
 to TM and maharishi by her kids, Peter and Keith, she was of that time.
 
  The speakers at the memorial spoke stories of those times and her
 life.  It was fun.  Especially was Peter going on about he and his mom
 being with old Yogananda followers, learning kriya meditation and
 practices early on, Buddhism, and going to india and being with saints
 there.  Anandamayi Ma.  Peter was warm and animated.  On the other side
 of the stage while Peter waxes on about visiting saints in India are
 Bevan and Keith stoically listening.  It was a moment.
 
  Patronage.  Was interesting to see the room, staging, and relationship
 of the Wallace clan to it.  Keith is first scientist of the TM-order. 
 He is not MUM, not a Raja neither.  Bevan is evidently powerful.   In
 the greeting of folks there was some ring-kissing demonstrations of
 fealty with Bevan going on as well as chit-chat.  The position of the
 Wallaces is a special place, emeritus in a way by virtue of Bevan
 evidently.
 
  Bevan batted clean up as speaker and gave a nice statement drawing on
 a principle.  It was nice and enlarging.
 
  I've gone to a lot of memorials of the meditating community the last
 few of years.  Mostly the folks who would attend are the closer friends
 or co-workers of the deceased.  Something I was noticing about some of
 the memorials is that even with some of the most true-blue rank and file
 people who have been around making things happen by deed of their work
 or money, often the level of this upper movement is not present with the
 families and friends of the deceased at memorials within the meditating
 community.  This particular memorial was of the Taliban-class of the
 TM-movement.  Evidently as a class they were present for this.  It
 wasn't necessarily large.
 
  In looking, the two people who were particularly lit of the whole
 group were Craig Pearson and Susan Humphreys.  Hopefully they can
 outlive the larger force of being there and usher a new feeling to the
 group.  It's a pretty cold group.  Lord help 'em.
 
  - Buck in FF
 
 
   He laid out the benefits of meditation as he saw it,
   that it offered a way to draw upon one's own inner
   resources for one's sense of self worth and happiness,
   and not be dependent on others and how they see us or
   what they tell us to do for those things. I remember
   him speaking about how meditation (as he saw it)
   required no belief for it to work, and no leaders or
   gurus for it to work. All that it did require was
   actually doing the work -- practicing meditation. And
   I remember him speaking about how meditation could
   help to develop one's own creativity, and how that
   could help to resolve the problems of life by being
   able to create more effective solutions to them.
  
   At one point a person stood up and asked a question.
   He talked about a particular problem he was having,
   and how it had left him in a quandary, not knowing
   what to do. He then asked