RE: [FairfieldLife] Re: A point many have missed about David Lynch's success 'se
From: TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A point many have missed about David Lynch's success 'selling' TM Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2006 09:52:52 - --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_reply@ wrote: I suspect that most French would say that only a cretin would learn a meditation technique because of what some scientific study says about it. They're far more prag- matic than that, and more personal. They look at the *person* who is teaching and ask themselves if there is something interesting or cool about that *individual* that they'd like to learn. In the case of the teachers in Montpellier (I've met some of them), that is the case; IMO that's the secret of their success. Why do you assume most french would think that? I'm sure a lot of people would value the research on TM as a pointer to the fact that something is actually happening, whereas in a lot of meditation techniques I have tried all you do is sit around thinking about stuff or staring at candles. I learnt after reading one of Peter Russells books which went into the early research, and meeting a TM teacher who really did have the look and persona of someone who had seen something beyond the usual. What we need is more comparitive research so we can see if other techniques have the same effects, I'm most interested in the Maharishi effect which I think is an undeniable phenomenon, the first thing I noticed was that TM was stronger in a group, whether it is having an effect on the wider population remains to be seen and science is the only way we will be able to do that. THAT is what students are responding to, Lawson. Get over the science project mentality, already. That only appeals to people who believe in science more than they believe their own eyes and ears. Eyes and ears are only too fallible, perhaps someones charisma can sell meditation but I want to know if it actually works, I mean I know people who got involved with charismatic gurus and when I asked what happens during thier meditation they say, genuinely puzzled, what do you mean happens? I would then tell them about my expriences and they would be amazed. But I agree the movements image is crap, I think they avoid spiritiual stuff to avoid alienating their corporate target, which is strange because one day they will see a Raja and probably head for the hills. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [FairfieldLife] Re: A point many have missed about David Lynch's success 'se
From: TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A point many have missed about David Lynch's success 'selling' TM Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2006 09:52:52 - --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_reply@ wrote: I suspect that most French would say that only a cretin would learn a meditation technique because of what some scientific study says about it. They're far more prag- matic than that, and more personal. They look at the *person* who is teaching and ask themselves if there is something interesting or cool about that *individual* that they'd like to learn. In the case of the teachers in Montpellier (I've met some of them), that is the case; IMO that's the secret of their success. Why do you assume most french would think that? I'm sure a lot of people would value the research on TM as a pointer to the fact that something is actually happening, whereas in a lot of meditation techniques I have tried all you do is sit around thinking about stuff or staring at candles. I learnt after reading one of Peter Russells books which went into the early research, and meeting a TM teacher who really did have the look and persona of someone who had seen something beyond the usual. What we need is more comparitive research so we can see if other techniques have the same effects, I'm most interested in the Maharishi effect which I think is an undeniable phenomenon, the first thing I noticed was that TM was stronger in a group, whether it is having an effect on the wider population remains to be seen and science is the only way we will be able to do that. THAT is what students are responding to, Lawson. Get over the science project mentality, already. That only appeals to people who believe in science more than they believe their own eyes and ears. Eyes and ears are only too fallible, perhaps someones charisma can sell meditation but I want to know if it actually works, I mean I know people who got involved with charismatic gurus and when I asked what happens during thier meditation they say, genuinely puzzled, what do you mean happens? I would then tell them about my expriences and they would be amazed. But I agree the movements image is crap, I think they avoid spiritiual stuff to avoid alienating their corporate target, which is strange because one day they will see a Raja and probably head for the hills. Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Join modern day disciples reach the disfigured and poor with hope and healing http://us.click.yahoo.com/lMct6A/Vp3LAA/i1hLAA/UlWolB/TM ~- To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [FairfieldLife] Re: A point many have missed about David Lynch's success 'se
From: TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: A point many have missed about David Lynch's success 'se Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2006 12:43:11 - --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Richard Hughes [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: From: TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] I suspect that most French would say that only a cretin would learn a meditation technique because of what some scientific study says about it. They're far more prag- matic than that, and more personal. They look at the *person* who is teaching and ask themselves if there is something interesting or cool about that *individual* that they'd like to learn. In the case of the teachers in Montpellier (I've met some of them), that is the case; IMO that's the secret of their success. Why do you assume most french would think that? It's just a subjective experience, based on living here for a few years. In general, I find that the French seem to make more decisions based on their impressions of *people* rather than so-called facts. A scientist can stand up all day and claim that product A is better than product B, but if the spokesperson for product B seems to them to be more genuine and more represent- ative of traits they'd like to see develop in their lives, they're going to go for product B every time... fuck the science. Much of the French social system is based on person- to-person interactions. It's the most important thing in French culture. Science and scientific fact are never even going to come *close* to replacing an assess- ment of a person *as* a person when it comes to making decisions about what that person -- be it a salesman or a politician or whatever -- is selling. Gosh, no wonder the French and the English have never got on! I'm sure a lot of people would value the research on TM as a pointer to the fact that something is actually happening, whereas in a lot of meditation techniques I have tried all you do is sit around thinking about stuff or staring at candles. I learnt after reading one of Peter Russells books which went into the early research, and meeting a TM teacher who really did have the look and persona of someone who had seen something beyond the usual. I think you were fortunate in finding such a TM teacher. Many of the teachers who went out into the field to teach in the early 70s had trouble finding their mouth with a fork, much less repre- senting some kind of spiritual experience or fulfillment. :-) Yes I agree, he was a good bloke with amazingly deep eyes, as you say these first impressions are important and if been exposed to a big dose of cuurent knowledge I too would have run a mile. It was a Tibetan Buddhist who got me into TM funnily enough, he lent me Buddhist books but I didn't like the idea of commiting to a belief system and still don't, reincarnation? Karma? who cares? true or not it doesn't need me to believe it. What we need is more comparitive research so we can see if other techniques have the same effects... I completely disagree. I think that's just a carryover of the old TM my technique's dick is longer than your technique's dick mentality. I don't think the general public gives a shit about which meditation technique is best in some kind of scientific dick-size contest. They want to know whether practicing the technique might have some benefits for them personally, and what those benefits might be. They learn this by looking at the teachers who embody the results of prac- ticing the technique, *not* by looking at the research. Well in my experience TM definately has good personal effects, maybe the scientific approach backfires with some people, not with me. I'd rather look at a few graphs and see that something real is happening rather than waste money on yet another bit of new age tomfoolery. ...I'm most interested in the Maharishi effect which I think is an undeniable phenomenon... Your call. I think the ME is bullshit, so I'm completely uninterested in any research about it. I suspect that the general public would be equally uninterested. Interesting... don't you remember that feeling in group meditation? I've spent years trying to come up with a working theory that doesn't involve unified fields etc but it seems like a genuine, dare I say it, paranormal phenomenon. I really don't think I'm imagining it but I'm always happy to be proved wrong. The big question is; does it effect society as a whole? I've no idea, Movement pronouncements about us bringing down the Berlin wall and ending the cold war etc. are complete garbage IMO and will only embarass us. The washington project was interesting, we should do more things like this, though I did have the idea that the crime rate went down because the 4000 TMers took the hotel rooms that the people who come on mugging holidays would have had. Still, MMY has promised us
