Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Statistics

2014-02-11 Thread Share Long
Judy, here is what I understand: you used the phrases enlightened days and 
genuine enlightenment with regards to Robin. Then you said that Robin said that 
enlightenment reached via Eastern systems is a delusion because ontological 
union between God and human is not possible.

Are these statements accurate?





On Monday, February 10, 2014 11:25 PM, authfri...@yahoo.com 
authfri...@yahoo.com wrote:
 
  
You're repeating his (or my or Ann's) words out of context and without 
understanding, Share. You're not really trying to understand; you just want to 
find a way to bash him.

 Judy, later Robin said that his state of enlightenment was actually, to use 
Ann's words, a state of delusion. I'm merely repeating what he himself has 
said. Or what you and Ann have said that he said. 



On Monday, February 10, 2014 5:45 PM, authfriend@... authfriend@... wrote:

 
Of course you denigrated Robin. Robin claimed he had been enlightened, and 
you're insisting he wasn't.

I've explained why your logic is, to say the least, faulty several times, as 
has Ann. It really doesn't help your case that you keep repeating your 
misunderstanding without ever addressing what we've been telling you.

 Judy, I did not denigrate Robin. I called your phrases enlightened days and 
genuine enlightenment inaccurate because you said that Robin said that 
enlightenment, including his, via Eastern systems is a delusion because 
ontological union between God and human is not possible. 


Xeno doesn't read the posts he counts here. If he did, he'd realize that most 
of Barry's posts were thoroughly dishonest attacks on me or Robin; and that in 
addition to refuting Barry's dishonesty, a substantial number of my posts were 
dealing with a discussion our Stevie can't seem to let go of in which he is 
quite idiotically trying to insist Robin and I were deliberately trying to 
fool people with our irony exchange; plus a bunch from Share attempting to 
denigrate Robin via her misunderstanding of his views on enlightenment.

(Although the two posts he claims had the same title, did not.)

 Posts from 1 February 2014 to 10 February 2014 4:00pm EST 

authfriend
143 replies, 4 original posts (although 2 had the same title)

turquoiseb
53 replies, 16 original posts 








Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Statistics

2014-02-11 Thread authfriend
As I've already told you, Share, it really doesn't help just to repeat your 
misunderstanding over and over. You have never bothered to engage with what Ann 
and I have told you.
 

 I'll try it one more time: Enlightenment reached by Eastern systems is, 
according to Robin, the real, genuine state of enlightenment.
 

 Got that?
 

 But genuine enlightenment itself is not what it's cracked up to be: It imposes 
a delusionary experience of oneself, of the world, and of one's relationship to 
God.
 

 Now, read those two sentences over and over until it dawns on you where your 
misunderstanding lies.
 

 I'm not interested in hearing from you again on this until you can show you 
understand Robin's position correctly (whether you agree with it or not).
 
  Judy, here is what I understand: you used the phrases enlightened days and 
genuine enlightenment with regards to Robin. Then you said that Robin said that 
enlightenment reached via Eastern systems is a delusion because ontological 
union between God and human is not possible.

Are these statements accurate? 
 

 
 
 On Monday, February 10, 2014 11:25 PM, authfriend@... authfriend@... wrote:
 
   You're repeating his (or my or Ann's) words out of context and without 
understanding, Share. You're not really trying to understand; you just want to 
find a way to bash him.
 

  Judy, later Robin said that his state of enlightenment was actually, to use 
Ann's words, a state of delusion. I'm merely repeating what he himself has 
said. Or what you and Ann have said that he said. 
 
 
 On Monday, February 10, 2014 5:45 PM, authfriend@... authfriend@... wrote:
 
   Of course you denigrated Robin. Robin claimed he had been enlightened, and 
you're insisting he wasn't.
 

 I've explained why your logic is, to say the least, faulty several times, as 
has Ann. It really doesn't help your case that you keep repeating your 
misunderstanding without ever addressing what we've been telling you.
 

  Judy, I did not denigrate Robin. I called your phrases enlightened days and 
genuine enlightenment inaccurate because you said that Robin said that 
enlightenment, including his, via Eastern systems is a delusion because 
ontological union between God and human is not possible. 

 Xeno doesn't read the posts he counts here. If he did, he'd realize that most 
of Barry's posts were thoroughly dishonest attacks on me or Robin; and that in 
addition to refuting Barry's dishonesty, a substantial number of my posts were 
dealing with a discussion our Stevie can't seem to let go of in which he is 
quite idiotically trying to insist Robin and I were deliberately trying to 
fool people with our irony exchange; plus a bunch from Share attempting to 
denigrate Robin via her misunderstanding of his views on enlightenment.
 

 (Although the two posts he claims had the same title, did not.)
 

  Posts from 1 February 2014 to 10 February 2014 4:00pm EST  

 authfriend
143 replies, 4 original posts (although 2 had the same title)
 

 turquoiseb
 53 replies, 16 original posts 
 

 




 














 














 


 












Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Statistics

2014-02-11 Thread Share Long
Judy, this sounds contradictory to me. How can something be genuine and 
delusionary at the same time?

Judy wrote: Enlightenment reached by Eastern systems is, according to Robin, 
the real, genuine state of enlightenment.
...

It 
imposes a delusionary experience of oneself, of the world, and of one's 
relationship to God.



On Tuesday, February 11, 2014 9:03 AM, authfri...@yahoo.com 
authfri...@yahoo.com wrote:
 
  
As I've already told you, Share, it really doesn't help just to repeat your 
misunderstanding over and over. You have never bothered to engage with what Ann 
and I have told you.

I'll try it one more time: Enlightenment reached by Eastern systems is, 
according to Robin, the real, genuine state of enlightenment.

Got that?

But genuine enlightenment itself is not what it's cracked up to be: It imposes 
a delusionary experience of oneself, of the world, and of one's relationship to 
God.

Now, read those two sentences over and over until it dawns on you where your 
misunderstanding lies.

I'm not interested in hearing from you again on this until you can show you 
understand Robin's position correctly (whether you agree with it or not).


 Judy, here is what I understand: you used the phrases enlightened days and 
genuine enlightenment with regards to Robin. Then you said that Robin said that 
enlightenment reached via Eastern systems is a delusion because ontological 
union between God and human is not possible.

Are these statements accurate? 





On Monday, February 10, 2014 11:25 PM, authfriend@... authfriend@... wrote:

 
You're repeating his (or my or Ann's) words out of context and without 
understanding, Share. You're not really trying to understand; you just want to 
find a way to bash him.

 Judy, later Robin said that his state of enlightenment was actually, to use 
Ann's words, a state of delusion. I'm merely repeating what he himself has 
said. Or what you and Ann have said that he
said. 



On Monday, February 10, 2014 5:45 PM, authfriend@... authfriend@... wrote:

 
Of course you denigrated Robin. Robin claimed he had been enlightened, and 
you're insisting he wasn't.

I've explained why your logic is, to say the least, faulty several times, as 
has Ann. It really doesn't help your case that you keep repeating your 
misunderstanding without ever addressing what we've been telling you.

 Judy, I did not denigrate Robin. I called your phrases enlightened days and 
genuine enlightenment inaccurate because you said that Robin said that 
enlightenment, including his, via Eastern systems is a delusion because 
ontological union between God and human is not possible. 


Xeno doesn't read the posts he counts here. If he did, he'd realize that most 
of Barry's posts were thoroughly dishonest attacks on me or Robin; and that in 
addition to refuting Barry's dishonesty, a substantial number of my posts were 
dealing with a discussion our Stevie can't seem to let go of
in which he is quite idiotically trying to insist Robin and I were deliberately 
trying to fool people with our irony exchange; plus a bunch from Share 
attempting to denigrate Robin via her misunderstanding of his views on 
enlightenment.

(Although the two posts he claims had the same title, did not.)

 Posts from 1 February 2014 to 10 February 2014 4:00pm EST 

authfriend
143
replies, 4 original posts (although 2 had the same title)

turquoiseb
53 replies, 16 original posts 










Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Statistics

2014-02-11 Thread authfriend
As I said: Once you figure it out, get back to me. It shouldn't be that 
difficult, even for you.
 

  Judy, this sounds contradictory to me. How can something be genuine and 
delusionary at the same time? 

 

 Judy wrote: Enlightenment reached by Eastern systems is, according to Robin, 
the real, genuine state of enlightenment.
 ...

 It imposes a delusionary experience of oneself, of the world, and of one's 
relationship to God.
 
 
 On Tuesday, February 11, 2014 9:03 AM, authfriend@... authfriend@... wrote:
 
   As I've already told you, Share, it really doesn't help just to repeat your 
misunderstanding over and over. You have never bothered to engage with what Ann 
and I have told you.
 

 I'll try it one more time: Enlightenment reached by Eastern systems is, 
according to Robin, the real, genuine state of enlightenment.
 

 Got that?
 

 But genuine enlightenment itself is not what it's cracked up to be: It imposes 
a delusionary experience of oneself, of the world, and of one's relationship to 
God.
 

 Now, read those two sentences over and over until it dawns on you where your 
misunderstanding lies.
 

 I'm not interested in hearing from you again on this until you can show you 
understand Robin's position correctly (whether you agree with it or not).
 
  Judy, here is what I understand: you used the phrases enlightened days and 
genuine enlightenment with regards to Robin. Then you said that Robin said that 
enlightenment reached via Eastern systems is a delusion because ontological 
union between God and human is not possible.

Are these statements accurate? 
 

 
 
 On Monday, February 10, 2014 11:25 PM, authfriend@... authfriend@... wrote:
 
   You're repeating his (or my or Ann's) words out of context and without 
understanding, Share. You're not really trying to understand; you just want to 
find a way to bash him.
 

  Judy, later Robin said that his state of enlightenment was actually, to use 
Ann's words, a state of delusion. I'm merely repeating what he himself has 
said. Or what you and Ann have said that he said. 
 
 
 On Monday, February 10, 2014 5:45 PM, authfriend@... authfriend@... wrote:
 
   Of course you denigrated Robin. Robin claimed he had been enlightened, and 
you're insisting he wasn't.
 

 I've explained why your logic is, to say the least, faulty several times, as 
has Ann. It really doesn't help your case that you keep repeating your 
misunderstanding without ever addressing what we've been telling you.
 

  Judy, I did not denigrate Robin. I called your phrases enlightened days and 
genuine enlightenment inaccurate because you said that Robin said that 
enlightenment, including his, via Eastern systems is a delusion because 
ontological union between God and human is not possible. 

 Xeno doesn't read the posts he counts here. If he did, he'd realize that most 
of Barry's posts were thoroughly dishonest attacks on me or Robin; and that in 
addition to refuting Barry's dishonesty, a substantial number of my posts were 
dealing with a discussion our Stevie can't seem to let go of in which he is 
quite idiotically trying to insist Robin and I were deliberately trying to 
fool people with our irony exchange; plus a bunch from Share attempting to 
denigrate Robin via her misunderstanding of his views on enlightenment.
 

 (Although the two posts he claims had the same title, did not.)
 

  Posts from 1 February 2014 to 10 February 2014 4:00pm EST  

 authfriend
143 replies, 4 original posts (although 2 had the same title)
 

 turquoiseb
 53 replies, 16 original posts 
 

 




 














 














 














 


 












Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Statistics

2014-02-11 Thread Richard J. Williams
On 2/11/2014 9:19 AM, Share Long wrote:
 this sounds contradictory to me. How can something be genuine and 
 delusionary at the same time?
 
According to Robin, most people are in a dream state and mistake it for 
the real. What you have to do according to Robin is wake up from the 
dream. The Adi Shankaracharya explained this very well using analogies 
like the rope-sanke. The dream state is like a delusion or an illusion. 
Dreams and illusions are real, while they last, but not real in the 
absolute sense. An illusion or a dream is real in the sense that it is 
presented to us.

At first that seems to be contradictory, but when you think about it, 
dreams are as real as any other state - dreams are not real, yet they 
are not unreal either. In the waking state you can run and jump and 
consult with your friends. You can also run and jump in your dreams and 
consult with your friends. In fact, there's nothing that can be done in 
the waking state that you cannot also do in a dream state. It's like a 
zen koan:

At night, you see a thief.
In the light of day, you realize it was just a fence pole.


Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Statistics

2014-02-11 Thread Share Long
Thanks Richard, I understand this. Using dreams is a good way to explain it. 
Dreams are real in their own context. But they are delusions in a larger 
context.

Do you think that's what Robin meant about his enlightenment?





On Tuesday, February 11, 2014 10:34 AM, Richard J. Williams 
pundits...@gmail.com wrote:
 
  
On 2/11/2014 9:19 AM, Share Long wrote:
 this sounds contradictory to me. How can something be genuine and 
 delusionary at the same time?

According to Robin, most people are in a dream state and mistake it for 
the real. What you have to do according to Robin is wake up from the 
dream. The Adi Shankaracharya explained this very well using analogies 
like the rope-sanke. The dream state is like a delusion or an illusion. 
Dreams and illusions are real, while they last, but not real in the 
absolute sense. An illusion or a dream is real in the sense that it is 
presented to us.

At first that seems to be contradictory, but when you think about it, 
dreams are as real as any other state - dreams are not real, yet they 
are not unreal either. In the waking state you can run and jump and 
consult with your friends. You can also run and jump in your dreams and 
consult with your friends. In fact, there's nothing that can be done in 
the waking state that you cannot also do in a dream state. It's like a 
zen koan:

At night, you see a thief.
In the light of day, you realize it was just a fence pole.



Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Statistics

2014-02-11 Thread Richard J. Williams
On 2/11/2014 7:08 AM, Share Long wrote:
 ontological union between God and human is not possible.
 
When Robin experienced enlightenment he said that he floated in a kind 
of absolute bliss - he was able to witness his body move, as his 
individuality carried out its natural actions, but the individual 
Robin was gone - he had reached CC. According to MMY, if pure 
consciousness stays awake while everything else sleeps, then one knows 
one is in cosmic consciousness.


Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Statistics

2014-02-11 Thread Richard J. Williams
On 2/11/2014 10:39 AM, Share Long wrote:
 Dreams are real in their own context. But they are delusions in a 
 larger context.
 
Dreams are real while we are dreaming, but unreal in the absolute sense. 
Dreams are not illusions in the sense of not being real because we do 
have dreams. The magic tricks of the magician seem unreal but they are 
tricks, not unreal tricks - there is a real sleight of hand. Something 
that is unreal is something that cannot be.

 Do you think that's what Robin meant about his enlightenment?
 
According to Robin's biography, The First Three Years of Enlightenment 
at the time Robin got enlightened he believed in MMY's seven states 
typology and followed the Shankara Advaita. We don't know exactly what 
he believes now - Robin is a deep couple of guys.



Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Statistics

2014-02-10 Thread Share Long
Judy, I did not denigrate Robin. I called your phrases enlightened days and 
genuine enlightenment inaccurate because you said that Robin said that 
enlightenment, including his, via Eastern systems is a delusion because 
ontological union between God and human is not possible. 







On Monday, February 10, 2014 3:18 PM, authfri...@yahoo.com 
authfri...@yahoo.com wrote:
 
  
Xeno doesn't read the posts he counts here. If he did, he'd realize that most 
of Barry's posts were thoroughly dishonest attacks on me or Robin; and that in 
addition to refuting Barry's dishonesty, a substantial number of my posts were 
dealing with a discussion our Stevie can't seem to let go of in which he is 
quite idiotically trying to insist Robin and I were deliberately trying to 
fool people with our irony exchange; plus a bunch from Share attempting to 
denigrate Robin via her misunderstanding of his views on enlightenment.

(Although the two posts he claims had the same title, did not.)

 Posts from 1 February 2014 to 10 February 2014 4:00pm EST 

authfriend
143 replies, 4 original posts (although 2 had the same title)

turquoiseb
53 replies, 16 original posts 




Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Statistics

2014-02-10 Thread authfriend
Of course you denigrated Robin. Robin claimed he had been enlightened, and 
you're insisting he wasn't.
 

 I've explained why your logic is, to say the least, faulty several times, as 
has Ann. It really doesn't help your case that you keep repeating your 
misunderstanding without ever addressing what we've been telling you.
 

  Judy, I did not denigrate Robin. I called your phrases enlightened days and 
genuine enlightenment inaccurate because you said that Robin said that 
enlightenment, including his, via Eastern systems is a delusion because 
ontological union between God and human is not possible. 

 Xeno doesn't read the posts he counts here. If he did, he'd realize that most 
of Barry's posts were thoroughly dishonest attacks on me or Robin; and that in 
addition to refuting Barry's dishonesty, a substantial number of my posts were 
dealing with a discussion our Stevie can't seem to let go of in which he is 
quite idiotically trying to insist Robin and I were deliberately trying to 
fool people with our irony exchange; plus a bunch from Share attempting to 
denigrate Robin via her misunderstanding of his views on enlightenment.
 

 (Although the two posts he claims had the same title, did not.)
 

  Posts from 1 February 2014 to 10 February 2014 4:00pm EST  

 authfriend
143 replies, 4 original posts (although 2 had the same title)
 

 turquoiseb
 53 replies, 16 original posts 
 

 




 


 












Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Statistics

2014-02-10 Thread Share Long
Judy, later Robin said that his state of enlightenment was actually, to use 
Ann's words, a state of delusion. I'm merely repeating what he himself has 
said. Or what you and Ann have said that he said.




On Monday, February 10, 2014 5:45 PM, authfri...@yahoo.com 
authfri...@yahoo.com wrote:
 
  
Of course you denigrated Robin. Robin claimed he had been enlightened, and 
you're insisting he wasn't.

I've explained why your logic is, to say the least, faulty several times, as 
has Ann. It really doesn't help your case that you keep repeating your 
misunderstanding without ever addressing what we've been telling you.

 Judy, I did not denigrate Robin. I called your phrases enlightened days and 
genuine enlightenment inaccurate because you said that Robin said that 
enlightenment, including his, via Eastern systems is a delusion because 
ontological union between God and human is not possible. 


Xeno doesn't read the posts he counts here. If he did, he'd realize that most 
of Barry's posts were thoroughly dishonest attacks on me or Robin; and that in 
addition to refuting Barry's dishonesty, a substantial number of my posts were 
dealing with a discussion our Stevie can't seem to let go of in which he is 
quite idiotically trying to insist Robin and I were deliberately trying to 
fool people with our irony exchange; plus a bunch from Share attempting to 
denigrate Robin via her misunderstanding of his views on enlightenment.

(Although the two posts he claims had the same title, did not.)

 Posts from 1 February 2014 to 10 February 2014 4:00pm EST 

authfriend
143 replies, 4 original posts (although 2 had the same title)

turquoiseb
53 replies, 16 original posts 






Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Statistics

2014-02-10 Thread awoelflebater


 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend@... wrote:

 Of course you denigrated Robin. Robin claimed he had been enlightened, and 
you're insisting he wasn't.
 

 I've explained why your logic is, to say the least, faulty several times, as 
has Ann. It really doesn't help your case that you keep repeating your 
misunderstanding without ever addressing what we've been telling you.
 

 Judy, while I really appreciate your persistence and tireless efforts to clue 
Share in on this there are one of two things going on: 
 1) She is either incapable of grasping the concept we are attempting to help 
her understand or
 2) She is unwilling to grasp it. 
 Either way, she will never, never give it up. But I do have a tip for the 
third race - bet on the mule wearing blinkers to win. Odds are 10-1.
 

  Judy, I did not denigrate Robin. I called your phrases enlightened days and 
genuine enlightenment inaccurate because you said that Robin said that 
enlightenment, including his, via Eastern systems is a delusion because 
ontological union between God and human is not possible. 

 Xeno doesn't read the posts he counts here. If he did, he'd realize that most 
of Barry's posts were thoroughly dishonest attacks on me or Robin; and that in 
addition to refuting Barry's dishonesty, a substantial number of my posts were 
dealing with a discussion our Stevie can't seem to let go of in which he is 
quite idiotically trying to insist Robin and I were deliberately trying to 
fool people with our irony exchange; plus a bunch from Share attempting to 
denigrate Robin via her misunderstanding of his views on enlightenment.
 

 (Although the two posts he claims had the same title, did not.)
 

  Posts from 1 February 2014 to 10 February 2014 4:00pm EST  

 authfriend
143 replies, 4 original posts (although 2 had the same title)
 

 turquoiseb
 53 replies, 16 original posts 
 

 




 


 














Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: Statistics

2014-02-10 Thread authfriend
You're repeating his (or my or Ann's) words out of context and without 
understanding, Share. You're not really trying to understand; you just want to 
find a way to bash him.
 

  Judy, later Robin said that his state of enlightenment was actually, to use 
Ann's words, a state of delusion. I'm merely repeating what he himself has 
said. Or what you and Ann have said that he said. 
 
 
 On Monday, February 10, 2014 5:45 PM, authfriend@... authfriend@... wrote:
 
   Of course you denigrated Robin. Robin claimed he had been enlightened, and 
you're insisting he wasn't.
 

 I've explained why your logic is, to say the least, faulty several times, as 
has Ann. It really doesn't help your case that you keep repeating your 
misunderstanding without ever addressing what we've been telling you.
 

  Judy, I did not denigrate Robin. I called your phrases enlightened days and 
genuine enlightenment inaccurate because you said that Robin said that 
enlightenment, including his, via Eastern systems is a delusion because 
ontological union between God and human is not possible. 

 Xeno doesn't read the posts he counts here. If he did, he'd realize that most 
of Barry's posts were thoroughly dishonest attacks on me or Robin; and that in 
addition to refuting Barry's dishonesty, a substantial number of my posts were 
dealing with a discussion our Stevie can't seem to let go of in which he is 
quite idiotically trying to insist Robin and I were deliberately trying to 
fool people with our irony exchange; plus a bunch from Share attempting to 
denigrate Robin via her misunderstanding of his views on enlightenment.
 

 (Although the two posts he claims had the same title, did not.)
 

  Posts from 1 February 2014 to 10 February 2014 4:00pm EST  

 authfriend
143 replies, 4 original posts (although 2 had the same title)
 

 turquoiseb
 53 replies, 16 original posts