Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-12 Thread 'Richard J. Williams' pundits...@gmail.com [FairfieldLife]



the TMO money laundering and smuggling, etc.


On 10/12/2014 2:49 AM, blue_bungalo...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote:


Young pundits and anybody from TMO, returning to india, each
person would be given particular quantity (legal) of gold.
As soon as the plane lands in india, TMO henchmen would be
waiting there to collect the gold, load the pundits on to
the waiting van, and off they go.


/So, how much money did you get //from the TMO? We already know that one 
FFL informant lived at a TM Center for five years and another FFL 
reporter got a free pod for two years at MIU./




So much gold was brought in, that they decided to make
jewellery and sell the gold. The TMO's finances are so murky
the you would never have the clear idea what happened to all
the money.


/Non sequitur. It has already been established that nobody knows the 
extent of TMO finances. What we want to know is what happened to all the 
money you got from the TMO./





Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-11 Thread salyavin808

 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote :

 Perhaps it might help if you know how things are done in the US.  Here's a 
movie out today about the Gary Webb, a newspaper reporter who exposed Iran 
Contra and later committed suicide (more likely suicided):
 

 Why more likely?
 

 I've said it before, governments do shady deals like this. They do it because 
they think it will ultimately do us (and them) a favour by tilting world 
influence away from unfriendly powers. Trouble is it might be technically 
illegal under international law so a bit of subterfuge is necessary. The CIA 
helped dispose of many governments that adopted left wing governments and 
deprived US companies of their money in favour of keeping it in the country. 
Iran, Guatemala, Chile etc..
 

 All this is known and the orders came from the top and none of it remained 
secret for very long. What you don't have with the 9/11 conspiracy is any sort 
of reason for it, or any sort of organisation that could do the job and keep it 
secret. But it's the point of the whole thing that baffles me. What did it 
achieve? They got rid of a few embarrassing documents, great but couldn't they 
have gone in at night or even ordered a member of staff to remove them as it 
was their building? And remote control planes just adds another huge layer of 
people that would have to keep quite.
 

  I'm English, I don't need telling that our government plays a double game on 
the world stage. But you have to see everything in a context of cost/benefit or 
you have to start inventing things to justify your beliefs and I think the 
truthers are far into that behaviour. Just think, if the buildings hadn't 
gone and collapsed this conversation wouldn't be happening. 
 
 http://youtu.be/VW4XO-52ubE http://youtu.be/VW4XO-52ubE
 
 Seems that the CIA has started to come forward and say that some of Webb's 
assertions were true:
 
 
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/10/10/gary-webb-dark-alliance_n_5961748.html 
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/10/10/gary-webb-dark-alliance_n_5961748.html
 
 On 10/10/2014 01:26 PM, salyavin808 wrote:
 
   

 
 
 ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, 
noozguru@... mailto:noozguru@... wrote :
 
 Salyavin, you're reviewing the movie without having seen it just  like Judy. 
 You say:
 

 BTW, I remember the movie well, I was near a TV on the day. Saw the whole 
thing, but not live. 
 
 
 I was working at the TM academy at the time and they didn't tell us it 
happened as there was a course on and didn't want to upset anybody! If we 
hadn't had someone staying for BB to mention it over the evening meal I might 
never have heard about it at all. Maybe.. So I might have missed the first 
defining moment of the 21st century! 



 




Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-11 Thread TurquoiseBee turquoi...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
From: Bhairitu noozg...@sbcglobal.net [FairfieldLife] 
FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com




 
On 10/10/2014 06:59 PM, TurquoiseBee turquoi...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote:
 
  
From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com
 


---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote :
 

On 10/10/2014 01:04 PM, salyavin808 wrote:
 
 
  
Believe if you want that some
  billionaire in a
  cave in Afghanistan ran the whole
  operation but that
  really sounds
  wacky! :-D 
 

Ran the whole operation? You mean got some guys to hijack a few planes? It's 
too simple isn't it. That's the problem people have, they can't believe that 
much destruction was caused by a few maniacs in hijacked planes.
 
But it was not that simple.  And the alleged fliers couldn't even fly a 
Cessna properly let alone a jet.  Those planes were remote controlled and 
such systems were available in advance of 9-11.I disagree, I think they were 
telepathically controlled by the Space Brothers from their secret base on 
Pluto.

 Weak minds glom onto conspiracy theories the same way that weak minds follow 
 cult leaders. That's all anyone ever needs to know about discussions like 
 this. 

Are you inferring that I'm a weak mind, Barry?  What's happened to you?  
Getting old and cranky and the contracts not showing up like they used too?


I am saying that a *tendency* to believe in conspiracy theories is a mental 
disorder strongly linked to the mental disorder that attracts people to cults. 
IMO, conspiracy theories offer those who tend to gravitate to them the same 
thing that cults do -- 1) easy answers to complex questions, and 2) the 
feeling of being special, because you know the truth while lesser people 
don't. 

There have been many studies of conspiracy theories and why they've become so 
popular. Here are a few articles on the subject. I really like one line from 
this first one: The best predictor of belief in a conspiracy theory is belief 
in other conspiracy theories... That, for me, indicates a *strong* link 
between conspiracy nuts and cultists. Just think about Fairfield, and why 
*every* huckster selling New Age potions and seminars and techniques comes 
through town -- they do this because TMers, having been taught to believe *one* 
set of improbable things (dare I mention levitation and butt bounce for 
peace), are now primed to believe *more* improbable things. Fairfielders are 
well known in the U.S. as being the Biggest Suckers In The Country -- if you 
want to sell *anything* bizarre and New Agey, you take your snake oil routine 
to Fairfield. Well, I'm suggesting that the same is true of conspiracy nuts -- 
once you've bought into one of them, and felt
 all special because you know the truth and lesser people around you 
don't, you become an easy mark for the next conspiracy theory. And the next. 
And the next. And...


Why Rational People Buy Into Conspiracy Theories


  
 
Why Rational People Buy Into Conspiracy Theories
Psychologists are beginning to unravel the mystery behind this brand of 
American political paranoia.  
View on www.nytimes.com Preview by Yahoo  
  

This next article also agrees with my personal theories about conspiracy 
theories in another way: Conspiracy theories offer easy answers by casting the 
world as simpler and more predictable than it is. Neither conspiracy nuts nor 
cultists like mysteries, things they can't explain. So they tend to glom onto 
the first easy explanation to ease their cognitive dissonance. 


Why People Believe in Conspiracy Theories


  
 
Why People Believe in Conspiracy Theories
Conspiracy theories offer easy answers by casting the world as simpler and more 
predictable than it is. Their popularity may pose a threat to societal 
well-being  
View on www.scientificameri... Preview by Yahoo  
  
 And back to the particular conspiracy theory that started all this:


9/11 Conspiracy Theories: Why Do People Believe In September 11 Conspiracies?


  
 
9/11 Conspiracy Theories: Why Do People Believe In Septe...
A deeper look into why people believe in 9/11 conspiracy theories.  
View on www.ibtimes.com Preview by Yahoo  

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-11 Thread awoelfleba...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]

 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote :

 From: Bhairitu noozguru@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
 


   
 On 10/10/2014 06:59 PM, TurquoiseBee turquoiseb@... mailto:turquoiseb@... 
[FairfieldLife] wrote:

   From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com mailto:no_re...@yahoogroups.com
 
 ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, 
noozguru@... mailto:noozguru@... wrote :
 
 On 10/10/2014 01:04 PM, salyavin808 wrote:

   
 Believe if you want that some billionaire in a cave in Afghanistan ran the 
whole operation but that really sounds wacky! :-D 
 
 Ran the whole operation? You mean got some guys to hijack a few planes? It's 
too simple isn't it. That's the problem people have, they can't believe that 
much destruction was caused by a few maniacs in hijacked planes.






 
 But it was not that simple.  And the alleged fliers couldn't even fly a Cessna 
properly let alone a jet.  Those planes were remote controlled and such systems 
were available in advance of 9-11.I disagree, I think they were telepathically 
controlled by the Space Brothers from their secret base on Pluto.








 Weak minds glom onto conspiracy theories the same way that weak minds follow 
cult leaders. That's all anyone ever needs to know about discussions like this. 
 





 
 Are you inferring that I'm a weak mind, Barry?  What's happened to you?  
Getting old and cranky and the contracts not showing up like they used too?

I think our bawee has taken profound ownership of his own conspiracy theory and 
he seems to be sticking to it - like glue. 'Weak mindedness' seems to be the 
catch-all reason for most things that human beings do, in bawee's mind 
anyway. Thank God this man didn't enter the field of psychiatry. Can you 
imagine? His one diagnosis for everything, You are weak minded, now get out of 
my office. Next. 
 






I am saying that a *tendency* to believe in conspiracy theories is a mental 
disorder strongly linked to the mental disorder that attracts people to cults. 
IMO, conspiracy theories offer those who tend to gravitate to them the same 
thing that cults do -- 1) easy answers to complex questions, and 2) the 
feeling of being special, because you know the truth while lesser people 
don't. 

There have been many studies of conspiracy theories and why they've become so 
popular. Here are a few articles on the subject. I really like one line from 
this first one: The best predictor of belief in a conspiracy theory is belief 
in other conspiracy theories... That, for me, indicates a *strong* link 
between conspiracy nuts and cultists. Just think about Fairfield, and why 
*every* huckster selling New Age potions and seminars and techniques comes 
through town -- they do this because TMers, having been taught to believe *one* 
set of improbable things (dare I mention levitation and butt bounce for 
peace), are now primed to believe *more* improbable things. Fairfielders are 
well known in the U.S. as being the Biggest Suckers In The Country -- if you 
want to sell *anything* bizarre and New Agey, you take your snake oil routine 
to Fairfield. Well, I'm suggesting that the same is true of conspiracy nuts -- 
once you've bought into one of them, and felt all special because you know 
the truth and lesser people around you don't, you become an easy mark for 
the next conspiracy theory. And the next. And the next. And...

 Why Rational People Buy Into Conspiracy Theories 
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/26/magazine/why-rational-people-buy-into-conspiracy-theories.html?pagewanted=all


  
  
 
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/26/magazine/why-rational-people-buy-into-conspiracy-theories.html?pagewanted=all
  
  
  
  
  
 Why Rational People Buy Into Conspiracy Theories 
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/26/magazine/why-rational-people-buy-into-conspiracy-theories.html?pagewanted=all
 Psychologists are beginning to unravel the mystery behind this brand of 
American political paranoia.


 
 View on www.nytimes.com 
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/26/magazine/why-rational-people-buy-into-conspiracy-theories.html?pagewanted=all
 Preview by Yahoo
 
  




This next article also agrees with my personal theories about conspiracy 
theories in another way: Conspiracy theories offer easy answers by casting the 
world as simpler and more predictable than it is. Neither conspiracy nuts nor 
cultists like mysteries, things they can't explain. So they tend to glom onto 
the first easy explanation to ease their cognitive dissonance. 

 Why People Believe in Conspiracy Theories 
http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/why-people-believe-conspiracy-theories/


  
  
 
http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/why-people-believe-conspiracy-theories/
  
  
  
  
  
 Why People Believe in Conspiracy Theories 
http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/why-people-believe-conspiracy-theories/
 Conspiracy theories offer easy answers by casting the world as simpler and 
more 

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-11 Thread fleetwood_macnche...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
It is hardly mental disorder that leads people to spiritual organizations - If 
so, Barry would be among our sickest members. His perspective is always one of 
failure, of settling for less, if it beats a sharp stick in the eye, it'll do.  

 Barry, after having had some flashy stuff in his life, cannot rekindle that 
flame again (except with his self-created deadly enemy, TM), and so he goes on 
tiredly, poking a sad sort of fun, at any need for anyone to believe in, or 
seek, something greater than themselves, whatever its attributes.  

 He is desperately trying to settle for less, and have us all do the same. He 
walks forward, ever deeper, into his compressed past, as I walk backwards, into 
the future. 
 ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote :

 
 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote :

 From: Bhairitu noozguru@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
 


   
 On 10/10/2014 06:59 PM, TurquoiseBee turquoiseb@... mailto:turquoiseb@... 
[FairfieldLife] wrote:

   From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com mailto:no_re...@yahoogroups.com
 
 ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, 
noozguru@... mailto:noozguru@... wrote :
 
 On 10/10/2014 01:04 PM, salyavin808 wrote:

   
 Believe if you want that some billionaire in a cave in Afghanistan ran the 
whole operation but that really sounds wacky! :-D 
 
 Ran the whole operation? You mean got some guys to hijack a few planes? It's 
too simple isn't it. That's the problem people have, they can't believe that 
much destruction was caused by a few maniacs in hijacked planes.






 
 But it was not that simple.  And the alleged fliers couldn't even fly a Cessna 
properly let alone a jet.  Those planes were remote controlled and such systems 
were available in advance of 9-11.I disagree, I think they were telepathically 
controlled by the Space Brothers from their secret base on Pluto.








 Weak minds glom onto conspiracy theories the same way that weak minds follow 
cult leaders. That's all anyone ever needs to know about discussions like this. 
 





 
 Are you inferring that I'm a weak mind, Barry?  What's happened to you?  
Getting old and cranky and the contracts not showing up like they used too?

I think our bawee has taken profound ownership of his own conspiracy theory and 
he seems to be sticking to it - like glue. 'Weak mindedness' seems to be the 
catch-all reason for most things that human beings do, in bawee's mind 
anyway. Thank God this man didn't enter the field of psychiatry. Can you 
imagine? His one diagnosis for everything, You are weak minded, now get out of 
my office. Next. 
 






I am saying that a *tendency* to believe in conspiracy theories is a mental 
disorder strongly linked to the mental disorder that attracts people to cults. 
IMO, conspiracy theories offer those who tend to gravitate to them the same 
thing that cults do -- 1) easy answers to complex questions, and 2) the 
feeling of being special, because you know the truth while lesser people 
don't. 

There have been many studies of conspiracy theories and why they've become so 
popular. Here are a few articles on the subject. I really like one line from 
this first one: The best predictor of belief in a conspiracy theory is belief 
in other conspiracy theories... That, for me, indicates a *strong* link 
between conspiracy nuts and cultists. Just think about Fairfield, and why 
*every* huckster selling New Age potions and seminars and techniques comes 
through town -- they do this because TMers, having been taught to believe *one* 
set of improbable things (dare I mention levitation and butt bounce for 
peace), are now primed to believe *more* improbable things. Fairfielders are 
well known in the U.S. as being the Biggest Suckers In The Country -- if you 
want to sell *anything* bizarre and New Agey, you take your snake oil routine 
to Fairfield. Well, I'm suggesting that the same is true of conspiracy nuts -- 
once you've bought into one of them, and felt all special because you know 
the truth and lesser people around you don't, you become an easy mark for 
the next conspiracy theory. And the next. And the next. And...

 Why Rational People Buy Into Conspiracy Theories 
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/26/magazine/why-rational-people-buy-into-conspiracy-theories.html?pagewanted=all


  
  
 
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/26/magazine/why-rational-people-buy-into-conspiracy-theories.html?pagewanted=all
  
  
  
  
  
 Why Rational People Buy Into Conspiracy Theories 
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/26/magazine/why-rational-people-buy-into-conspiracy-theories.html?pagewanted=all
 Psychologists are beginning to unravel the mystery behind this brand of 
American political paranoia.


 
 View on www.nytimes.com 
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/26/magazine/why-rational-people-buy-into-conspiracy-theories.html?pagewanted=all
 Preview by Yahoo
 
  




This next article also agrees with my 

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-11 Thread 'Richard J. Williams' pundits...@gmail.com [FairfieldLife]
On 10/10/2014 8:59 PM, TurquoiseBee turquoi...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] 
wrote:
Weak minds glom onto conspiracy theories the same way that weak minds 
follow cult leaders. That's all anyone ever needs to know about 
discussions like this. 


/It sounds like Barry did a 180 and changed his mind about conspiracy 
theories. Go figure./


Subject: OT: Israel
From: John Manning
Group: alt.meditation.transcendental
Date: 8/8/2003
http://tinyurl.com/qf5x6t9



Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-11 Thread 'Richard J. Williams' pundits...@gmail.com [FairfieldLife]
On 10/10/2014 9:28 PM, Bhairitu noozg...@sbcglobal.net [FairfieldLife] 
wrote:
If 9-11 were an inside job then there would be plenty of funding to 
poison the well with sites like Rational Wiki.  I don't have time to 
look at all of it now and I'm sure someone else has gone through a 
debunked most of the holes here.  I see a couple already.


If you don't agree with every single word of this guy's rant, YOU'RE 
FUCKED UP IN THE HEAD.


Duveyoung Wed, 08 Oct 2014 10:02:10 -0700
http://www.mail-archive.com/fairfieldlife%40yahoogroups.com/msg332298.html

/O'Keefe denied the plausibility that the September 11 attacks were 
committed by Osama bin Laden and the 19 hijackers. He claimed it was an 
inside job and that the US government and intelligence agencies, 
including Mossad were responsible./


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kenneth_O%27Keefe


Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-11 Thread Bhairitu noozg...@sbcglobal.net [FairfieldLife]
On 10/11/2014 02:10 AM, TurquoiseBee turquoi...@yahoo.com 
[FairfieldLife] wrote:
*From:* Bhairitu noozg...@sbcglobal.net [FairfieldLife] 
FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com



On 10/10/2014 06:59 PM, TurquoiseBee turquoi...@yahoo.com 
mailto:turquoi...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote:
*From:* salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com 
mailto:no_re...@yahoogroups.com


---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... 
mailto:noozguru@... wrote :


On 10/10/2014 01:04 PM, salyavin808 wrote:



Believe if you want that some billionaire in a cave in
Afghanistan ran the whole operation but that really sounds
wacky! :-D

Ran the whole operation? You mean got some guys to hijack a few
planes? It's too simple isn't it. That's the problem people
have, they can't believe that much destruction was caused by a
few maniacs in hijacked planes.


But it was not that simple.  And the alleged fliers couldn't even
fly a Cessna properly let alone a jet. Those planes were remote
controlled and such systems were available in advance of 9-11.

I disagree, I think they were telepathically controlled by the Space 
Brothers from their secret base on Pluto.


Weak minds glom onto conspiracy theories the same way that weak minds 
follow cult leaders. That's all anyone ever needs to know about 
discussions like this.


Are you inferring that I'm a weak mind, Barry? What's happened to you? 
Getting old and cranky and the contracts not showing up like they used 
too?



I am saying that a *tendency* to believe in conspiracy theories is a 
mental disorder strongly linked to the mental disorder that attracts 
people to cults. IMO, conspiracy theories offer those who tend to 
gravitate to them the same thing that cults do -- 1) easy answers to 
complex questions,


The easy answer would be the Official 9-11 Story or:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yuC_4mGTs98https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yuC_4mGTs98

Those whose investigate 9-11 further have more complex answers so you 
have it a little backward.


and 2) the feeling of being special, because you know the truth 
while lesser people don't.


No, we're just pointing out some interesting clues to a massive crime 
scene.  It is an educational effort.





There have been many studies of conspiracy theories and why they've 
become so popular. Here are a few articles on the subject. I really 
like one line from this first one: The best predictor of belief in a 
/conspiracy theory/ is belief in other conspiracy theories... That, 
for me, indicates a *strong* link between conspiracy nuts and 
cultists. Just think about Fairfield, and why *every* huckster selling 
New Age potions and seminars and techniques comes through town -- they 
do this because TMers, having been taught to believe *one* set of 
improbable things (dare I mention levitation and butt bounce for 
peace), are now primed to believe *more* improbable things. 
Fairfielders are well known in the U.S. as being the Biggest Suckers 
In The Country -- if you want to sell *anything* bizarre and New Agey, 
you take your snake oil routine to Fairfield. Well, I'm suggesting 
that the same is true of conspiracy nuts -- once you've bought into 
one of them, and felt all special because you know the truth and 
lesser people around you don't, you become an easy mark for the next 
conspiracy theory. And the next. And the next. And...


Why Rational People Buy Into Conspiracy Theories 
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/26/magazine/why-rational-people-buy-into-conspiracy-theories.html?pagewanted=all



image 
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/26/magazine/why-rational-people-buy-into-conspiracy-theories.html?pagewanted=all






Why Rational People Buy Into Conspiracy Theories 
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/26/magazine/why-rational-people-buy-into-conspiracy-theories.html?pagewanted=all 

Psychologists are beginning to unravel the mystery behind this brand 
of American political paranoia.


View on www.nytimes.com 
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/26/magazine/why-rational-people-buy-into-conspiracy-theories.html?pagewanted=all


Preview by Yahoo



This next article also agrees with my personal theories about 
conspiracy theories in another way: Conspiracy theories offer easy 
answers by casting the world as simpler and more predictable than it 
is. Neither conspiracy nuts nor cultists like mysteries, things they 
can't explain. So they tend to glom onto the first easy 
explanation to ease their cognitive dissonance.


Why People Believe in Conspiracy Theories 
http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/why-people-believe-conspiracy-theories/



image 
http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/why-people-believe-conspiracy-theories/






Why People Believe in Conspiracy Theories 
http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/why-people-believe-conspiracy-theories/ 

Conspiracy 

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-11 Thread seerd...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
The term “conspiracy theory”, though I use it myself, is a two-edged sword that 
may have outlived its usefulness.  Those challenging mainstream knowledge and 
conventions are routinely cast as conspiracy nuts – and implying that such nut 
jobs glob onto many such “oddball” explanations of the universe as a crutch to 
cope with reality, It has acquired a derogatory meaning and can become a 
perverse tool applied to dismiss or ridicule unconventional beliefs, a tool of 
suppressing sincere inquiry and challenging of prevailing norms and wisdom, 
defying gut instincts (aka cognitive biases) and seeking truth no matter where 
it takes you and at what costa.  
 Many breakthroughs and new understanding of how the world works, including 
counter-culture ideas, and challenges to the establishment, have been initially 
derided as crack-pot ideas, conspiracy theories, promoted by nut jobs. Derision 
of challenging and troubling ideas is a core defense mechanism.  
 A vast list of crack-pot ideas, inflammatory, and/or conspiracy-driven dibble 
has unfolded and become in our lifetimes mainstream wisdom – a few, both large 
and small (may) include (not in any order of impact or importance:  the Snowden 
leaks, Pentagon Papers, Lewinsky’s blue dress, lack of weapons of mass 
destruction, Judith Bourque’s book, Iran-Contra, the Madoff scandal, genocides 
and mass murder of German concentration camps, Stalin, Mao, Khmer Rouge, Sudan, 
Native Americans, “California real-estate prices never go down”, the USDA’s 
food triangle, equal pay for equal work, segregation, JFK’s affairs, Watergate, 
MY Lai, black site prisons, priest pedophilia, the tech bubble (“you just don’t 
GET it”), the housing bubble, Goldman Sachs, the extent of regulatory capture, 
animals having emotions, Sandusky, celebrities coming out of the closet, the 
Higgs Boson, Masters and Johnson, a black president, LBJ’s decline seek 
re-election, the value of “health foods”, vegetarianism, yoga and meditation, 
game-changing technology, global climate change, etc. More so over the march of 
time – much of mainstream science came from those initially labeled heretics, 
crackpots, etc.
 Though many weird, strange, mind-blowing, unbelievable things have turned out 
to be true, that hardly means that all weird, strange, mind-blowing, 
unbelievable things are true.  
 Some core distinctions are willingness to systematically, without bias or 
agenda, challenge one’s own and society’s views, models of how the world works, 
prevailing understandings and conventional wisdom. These are high virtues, not 
something that is worthy of derision and labels such as conspiracy theories.. 
 However, it is hardly a virtue to be driven by conformational bias in 
assembling facts to form an apparent, though illusory random pattern in order 
to fulfill some inner need to cast blows against the empire, exude elitism, 
deride others, irrationally attempt to bring order and make sense of a seemly, 
at times, irrational challenging life and universe.
 A key distinction is whether one first shoots the arrow or paints the target, 
is open to considering all evidence, a willingness to change views as new 
evidence presents itself, always seeking to find alternative answers to explain 
and overturn one’s current pet POV, having a healthy sense of both skepticism 
and optimism, and  having an identity independent of a particular “truth”.   


Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-11 Thread Michael Jackson mjackso...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
Some conspiracy theories are more fun and more chilling than others - read this 
obit of Billie Sol Estes and see what you think:

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/may/17/billie-sol-estes
  
 
Billie Sol Estes obituary
Spectacularly successful Texas fraudster who figured in conspiracy theories 
about the death of John F Kennedy  
View on www.theguardian.com Preview by Yahoo  
  



 From: seerd...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
Sent: Saturday, October 11, 2014 1:46 PM
Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
 


  
The term “conspiracy theory”,
though I use it myself, is a two-edged sword that may have outlived its
usefulness.  Those challenging mainstream
knowledge and conventions are routinely cast as conspiracy nuts – and implying
that such nut jobs glob onto many such “oddball” explanations of the universe
as a crutch to cope with reality, It has acquired a derogatory meaning and can
become a perverse tool applied to dismiss or ridicule unconventional beliefs, a
tool of suppressing sincere inquiry and challenging of prevailing norms and 
wisdom,
defying gut instincts (aka cognitive biases) and seeking truth no matter where
it takes you and at what costa.  
Many breakthroughs and new
understanding of how the world works, including counter-culture ideas, and 
challenges
to the establishment, have been initially derided as crack-pot ideas,
conspiracy theories, promoted by nut jobs. Derision of challenging and
troubling ideas is a core defense mechanism.  
A vast list of crack-pot ideas,
inflammatory, and/or conspiracy-driven dibble has unfolded and become in our
lifetimes mainstream wisdom – a few, both large and small (may) include (not in
any order of impact or importance:  the
Snowden leaks, Pentagon Papers, Lewinsky’s blue dress, lack of weapons of mass
destruction, Judith Bourque’s book, Iran-Contra, the Madoff scandal, genocides
and mass murder of German concentration camps, Stalin, Mao, Khmer Rouge, Sudan, 
Native Americans, “California
real-estate prices never go down”, the USDA’s food triangle, equal pay for
equal work, segregation, JFK’s affairs, Watergate, MY Lai, black site prisons,
priest pedophilia, the tech bubble (“you just don’t GET it”), the housing
bubble, Goldman Sachs, the extent of regulatory capture, animals having
emotions, Sandusky, celebrities coming out of the closet, the Higgs Boson, 
Masters
and Johnson, a black president, LBJ’s decline seek re-election, the value of
“health foods”, vegetarianism, yoga and meditation, game-changing technology,
global climate change, etc. More so over the march of time – much of mainstream
science came from those initially labeled heretics, crackpots, etc.
Though many weird, strange,
mind-blowing, unbelievable things have turned out to be true, that hardly means
that all weird, strange, mind-blowing, unbelievable things are true.  
Some core distinctions are willingness
to systematically, without bias or agenda, challenge one’s own and society’s 
views,
models of how the world works, prevailing understandings and conventional
wisdom. These are high virtues, not something that is worthy of derision and
labels such as conspiracy theories.. 
However, it is hardly a virtue
to be driven by conformational bias in assembling facts to form an apparent,
though illusory random pattern in order to fulfill some inner need to cast
blows against the empire, exude elitism, deride others, irrationally attempt to
bring order and make sense of a seemly, at times, irrational challenging life
and universe.
A key distinction is whether one first shoots the arrow or
paints the target, is open to considering all evidence, a willingness to change
views as new evidence presents itself, always seeking to find alternative
answers to explain and overturn one’s current pet POV, having a healthy sense
of both skepticism and optimism, and  having
an identity independent of a particular “truth”.   


Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-11 Thread Bhairitu noozg...@sbcglobal.net [FairfieldLife]
Image if your local police department reported a murder as someone shot 
the person.  Case closed That's almost what the 9-11 official story is 
like.


You would have been well advised not to use RationalWiki which 
skeptics don't even like.  Those of us who think there is something more 
to a case than reported don't call ourselves conspiracy theorists.  
That term has come about and used by PSYOPS to discredit us since the 
JFK assassination which I don't think Oswald had anything to do with 
because he had a cheap gun and was seen in the lunch room at the book 
depository when the assassination took place.  He was a convenience 
patsy due to his activities.  If Ruby had not shot him it might have 
come out that he got framed.


Anyone on the right track to solving these crimes who has any visibility 
such as a news reporter often gets offed or suicided. Some of the nutty 
stuff you will find in conspiracy theorist are PSYOPS trying to 
poison the well lest the truth be known. Just think if we could prove 
beyond a doubt that 9-11 was indeed an inside job and who the perps were 
how confidence in our government would fall, not that it isn't anyway.  
And we have long had little confidence in our corporations and banks 
which these days run like gang operations.


The USA is a very dirty place.  It was that way from it's inception 
because some of the wealthy landowners didn't want their workers to have 
rights and some wanted the US to still be beholding to Britain.  Our 
democracy is an illusion and the king makers hate anyone who points that 
out.  A lot more people would have probably taken to the streets during 
the Occupy Movement but they feared losing their jobs.  We live in a 
country of increasing have nots, people who have lost even their 
simple pleasures of life because a plan to put all but a few in austerity.


So many detractors here seem to have little knowledge of history and 
just react emotionally.  I guess some folks want to live in a simple 
world of Santy Claus and Easter Bunnies.



On 10/11/2014 10:46 AM, seerd...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote:


The term “conspiracy theory”, though I use it myself, is a two-edged 
sword that may have outlived its usefulness.  Those challenging 
mainstream knowledge and conventions are routinely cast as conspiracy 
nuts – and implying that such nut jobs glob onto many such “oddball” 
explanations of the universe as a crutch to cope with reality, It has 
acquired a derogatory meaning and can become a perverse tool applied 
to dismiss or ridicule unconventional beliefs, a tool of suppressing 
sincere inquiry and challenging of prevailing norms and wisdom, 
defying gut instincts (aka cognitive biases) and seeking truth no 
matter where it takes you and at what costa.


Many breakthroughs and new understanding of how the world works, 
including counter-culture ideas, and challenges to the establishment, 
have been initially derided as crack-pot ideas, conspiracy theories, 
promoted by nut jobs. Derision of challenging and troubling ideas is a 
core defense mechanism.


A vast list of crack-pot ideas, inflammatory, and/or conspiracy-driven 
dibble has unfolded and become in our lifetimes mainstream wisdom – a 
few, both large and small (may) include (not in any order of impact or 
importance:  the Snowden leaks, Pentagon Papers, Lewinsky’s blue 
dress, lack of weapons of mass destruction, Judith Bourque’s book, 
Iran-Contra, the Madoff scandal, genocides and mass murder of German 
concentration camps, Stalin, Mao, Khmer Rouge, Sudan, Native 
Americans, “California real-estate prices never go down”, the USDA’s 
food triangle, equal pay for equal work, segregation, JFK’s affairs, 
Watergate, MY Lai, black site prisons, priest pedophilia, the tech 
bubble (“you just don’t GET it”), the housing bubble, Goldman Sachs, 
the extent of regulatory capture, animals having emotions, Sandusky, 
celebrities coming out of the closet, the Higgs Boson, Masters and 
Johnson, a black president, LBJ’s decline seek re-election, the value 
of “health foods”, vegetarianism, yoga and meditation, game-changing 
technology, global climate change, etc. More so over the march of time 
– much of mainstream science came from those initially labeled 
heretics, crackpots, etc.


Though many weird, strange, mind-blowing, unbelievable things have 
turned out to be true, that hardly means that all weird, strange, 
mind-blowing, unbelievable things are true.


Some core distinctions are willingness to systematically, without bias 
or agenda, challenge one’s own and society’s views, models of how the 
world works, prevailing understandings and conventional wisdom. These 
are high virtues, not something that is worthy of derision and labels 
such as conspiracy theories..


However, it is hardly a virtue to be driven by conformational bias in 
assembling facts to form an apparent, though illusory random pattern 
in order to fulfill some inner need to cast blows against the empire, 

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-11 Thread fleetwood_macnche...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
Very well said. This sentence, Derision of challenging and troubling ideas is 
a core defense mechanism., stood out for me. In the face of a modern age, with 
an endless cascade of information, to assimilate, or challenge, it becomes an 
easy out, to draw broad conclusions, either casting too critical an eye at 
unconventional life, or, becoming naively accepting of it. I try to keep an 
open mind, especially for events where I was not present, and must rely on a 
media source for information.  

 Fwiw, in terms of public events, the one that still has me thinking, is the 
JFK killing - Mostly because Oswald was then killed, in a highly secure 
environment (the basement of Dallas Police HQ), by Jack Ruby, who then died on 
the eve of his second trial, four years later, at 55. Perhaps it was exactly 
how the govt. said it was, but too many questions, for my liking.
 
 ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, seerdope@... wrote :

 The term “conspiracy theory”, though I use it myself, is a two-edged sword 
that may have outlived its usefulness.  Those challenging mainstream knowledge 
and conventions are routinely cast as conspiracy nuts – and implying that such 
nut jobs glob onto many such “oddball” explanations of the universe as a crutch 
to cope with reality, It has acquired a derogatory meaning and can become a 
perverse tool applied to dismiss or ridicule unconventional beliefs, a tool of 
suppressing sincere inquiry and challenging of prevailing norms and wisdom, 
defying gut instincts (aka cognitive biases) and seeking truth no matter where 
it takes you and at what costa.  
 Many breakthroughs and new understanding of how the world works, including 
counter-culture ideas, and challenges to the establishment, have been initially 
derided as crack-pot ideas, conspiracy theories, promoted by nut jobs. Derision 
of challenging and troubling ideas is a core defense mechanism.  
 A vast list of crack-pot ideas, inflammatory, and/or conspiracy-driven dibble 
has unfolded and become in our lifetimes mainstream wisdom – a few, both large 
and small (may) include (not in any order of impact or importance:  the Snowden 
leaks, Pentagon Papers, Lewinsky’s blue dress, lack of weapons of mass 
destruction, Judith Bourque’s book, Iran-Contra, the Madoff scandal, genocides 
and mass murder of German concentration camps, Stalin, Mao, Khmer Rouge, Sudan, 
Native Americans, “California real-estate prices never go down”, the USDA’s 
food triangle, equal pay for equal work, segregation, JFK’s affairs, Watergate, 
MY Lai, black site prisons, priest pedophilia, the tech bubble (“you just don’t 
GET it”), the housing bubble, Goldman Sachs, the extent of regulatory capture, 
animals having emotions, Sandusky, celebrities coming out of the closet, the 
Higgs Boson, Masters and Johnson, a black president, LBJ’s decline seek 
re-election, the value of “health foods”, vegetarianism, yoga and meditation, 
game-changing technology, global climate change, etc. More so over the march of 
time – much of mainstream science came from those initially labeled heretics, 
crackpots, etc.
 Though many weird, strange, mind-blowing, unbelievable things have turned out 
to be true, that hardly means that all weird, strange, mind-blowing, 
unbelievable things are true.  
 Some core distinctions are willingness to systematically, without bias or 
agenda, challenge one’s own and society’s views, models of how the world works, 
prevailing understandings and conventional wisdom. These are high virtues, not 
something that is worthy of derision and labels such as conspiracy theories.. 
 However, it is hardly a virtue to be driven by conformational bias in 
assembling facts to form an apparent, though illusory random pattern in order 
to fulfill some inner need to cast blows against the empire, exude elitism, 
deride others, irrationally attempt to bring order and make sense of a seemly, 
at times, irrational challenging life and universe.
 A key distinction is whether one first shoots the arrow or paints the target, 
is open to considering all evidence, a willingness to change views as new 
evidence presents itself, always seeking to find alternative answers to explain 
and overturn one’s current pet POV, having a healthy sense of both skepticism 
and optimism, and  having an identity independent of a particular “truth”.   





Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-11 Thread salyavin808

 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote :

 Image if your local police department reported a murder as someone shot the 
person.  Case closed  That's almost what the 9-11 official story is like.
 
 You would have been well advised not to use RationalWiki which skeptics 
don't even like.  Those of us who think there is something more to a case than 
reported don't call ourselves conspiracy theorists.  That term has come about 
and used by PSYOPS to discredit us since the JFK assassination which I don't 
think Oswald had anything to do with because he had a cheap gun and was seen in 
the lunch room at the book depository when the assassination took place.  He 
was a convenience patsy due to his activities.  If Ruby had not shot him it 
might have come out that he got framed.
 

 Jeez, everyone knows Elvis shot JFK. It's hardly news.
 
 Anyone on the right track to solving these crimes who has any visibility such 
as a news reporter often gets offed or suicided.  Some of the nutty stuff you 
will find in conspiracy theorist are PSYOPS trying to poison the well lest 
the truth be known.  Just think if we could prove beyond a doubt that 9-11 was 
indeed an inside job and who the perps were how confidence in our government 
would fall, not that it isn't anyway.  And we have long had little confidence 
in our corporations and banks which these days run like gang operations.
 

 After reading the articles Barry posted I was going to write something about 
how conspiracy theories are probably created by the government to distract 
everyone from what a crap job they actually do at running the country. Be nice 
to think there was someone in power who could organise a job that big, we can't 
even make a computer system to link up health districts without the ministry 
going bankrupt and abandoning it. 
 
 The USA is a very dirty place.  It was that way from it's inception because 
some of the wealthy landowners didn't want their workers to have rights and 
some wanted the US to still be beholding to Britain.  Our democracy is an 
illusion and the king makers hate anyone who points that out.  A lot more 
people would have probably taken to the streets during the Occupy Movement but 
they feared losing their jobs.  We live in a country of increasing have nots, 
people who have lost even their simple pleasures of life because a plan to put 
all but a few in austerity.
 
 So many detractors here seem to have little knowledge of history and just 
react emotionally.  I guess some folks want to live in a simple world of Santy 
Claus and Easter Bunnies.
 
Both of which are inventions, just like the conspiracies.
 

 What worries is me that you have such a disconnect from the people that run 
the US that you actually think they would murder thousands of their own people 
for reasons best known to themselves. There's a kind of movement like that in 
the UK about the Islamic terrorist that blew up some tube trains a decade ago. 
The story goes that the government knew about it but let it happen because it 
would be an excuse to rachet up the anti-terror laws, which completely 
coincidentally can also be used to harass innocent people whenever the state 
feels like it.
 

 I don't believe it for the simple fact that however cynical politicians get 
it's their own friends and family that might get blown up. You don't seem to 
have that sort of human link, sure the govt in the US has blood on its hands 
but the 9/11 conspiracies are qualitatively different from interfering in the 
politics of left wing countries or suppressing anti-capitalist demonstrations. 
It isn't a quantitative thing at all.
 

 I think it's the conspiracists that react emotionally, something unbelievable 
happens and the dots get joined up irrationally, anything to make it make sense 
that doesn't just mean the world is so dangerous a bunch of religious 
fruitcakes can walk onto planes in America and fly them into public buildings. 
I'd hate to live in a country where I thought the government would actually 
blow me up as an excuse for starting a war in a third world country, some of 
the residents of which had already made some bold attacks on the US - unless 
they were conspiracies too.
 

 Because of the crap you can find on youtube, I know people who actually think 
ISIS and Al Queda don't exist at all and were created so the west can clamp 
down on personal freedom. We realists know they just used the 9/11 and 7/7 
bombings as an excuse for that.
 
 On 10/11/2014 10:46 AM, seerdope@... mailto:seerdope@... [FairfieldLife] wrote:
 
   The term “conspiracy theory”, though I use it myself, is a two-edged sword 
that may have outlived its usefulness.  Those challenging mainstream knowledge 
and conventions are routinely cast as conspiracy nuts – and implying that such 
nut jobs glob onto many such “oddball” explanations of the universe as a crutch 
to cope with reality, It has acquired a derogatory meaning and can become a 
perverse 

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-11 Thread Michael Jackson mjackso...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
Elvis didn't shoot JFK - Mac Wallace did. Billie Sol said so:

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/may/17/billie-sol-estes
  
 
Billie Sol Estes obituary
Spectacularly successful Texas fraudster who figured in conspiracy theories 
about the death of John F Kennedy  
View on www.theguardian.com Preview by Yahoo  
  



 From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
Sent: Saturday, October 11, 2014 3:20 PM
Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
 


  




---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote :


Image if your local police department
reported a murder as someone shot the person.  Case closed 
That's almost what the 9-11 official story is like.

You would have been well advised not to use RationalWiki which
skeptics don't even like.  Those of us who think there is
something more to a case than reported don't call ourselves
conspiracy theorists.  That term has come about and used by
PSYOPS to discredit us since the JFK assassination which I don't
think Oswald had anything to do with because he had a cheap gun
and was seen in the lunch room at the book depository when the
assassination took place.  He was a convenience patsy due to his
activities.  If Ruby had not shot him it might have come out that
he got framed.

Jeez, everyone knows Elvis shot JFK. It's hardly news.

Anyone on the right track to solving these crimes who has any
visibility such as a news reporter often gets offed or suicided. 
Some of the nutty stuff you will find in conspiracy theorist
are PSYOPS trying to poison the well lest the truth be known. 
Just think if we could prove beyond a doubt that 9-11 was indeed
an inside job and who the perps were how confidence in our
government would fall, not that it isn't anyway.  And we have long
had little confidence in our corporations and banks which these
days run like gang operations.

After reading the articles Barry posted I was going to write something about 
how conspiracy theories are probably created by the government to distract 
everyone from what a crap job they actually do at running the country. Be nice 
to think there was someone in power who could organise a job that big, we can't 
even make a computer system to link up health districts without the ministry 
going bankrupt and abandoning it. 

The USA is a very dirty place.  It was that way from it's
inception because some of the wealthy landowners didn't want their
workers to have rights and some wanted the US to still be
beholding to Britain.  Our democracy is an illusion and the king
makers hate anyone who points that out.  A lot more people would
have probably taken to the streets during the Occupy Movement but
they feared losing their jobs.  We live in a country of increasing
have nots, people who have lost even their simple pleasures of
life because a plan to put all but a few in austerity.

So many detractors here seem to have little knowledge of history
and just react emotionally.  I guess some folks want to live in a
simple world of Santy Claus and Easter Bunnies.

Both of which are inventions, just like the conspiracies.

What worries is me that you have such a disconnect from the people that run the 
US that you actually think they would murder thousands of their own people for 
reasons best known to themselves. There's a kind of movement like that in the 
UK about the Islamic terrorist that blew up some tube trains a decade ago. The 
story goes that the government knew about it but let it happen because it would 
be an excuse to rachet up the anti-terror laws, which completely coincidentally 
can also be used to harass innocent people whenever the state feels like it.

I don't believe it for the simple fact that however cynical politicians get 
it's their own friends and family that might get blown up. You don't seem to 
have that sort of human link, sure the govt in the US has blood on its hands 
but the 9/11 conspiracies are qualitatively different from interfering in the 
politics of left wing countries or suppressing anti-capitalist demonstrations. 
It isn't a quantitative thing at all.

I think it's the conspiracists that react emotionally, something unbelievable 
happens and the dots get joined up irrationally, anything to make it make sense 
that doesn't just mean the world is so dangerous a bunch of religious 
fruitcakes can walk onto planes in America and fly them into public buildings. 
I'd hate to live in a country where I thought the government would actually 
blow me up as an excuse for starting a war in a third world country, some of 
the residents of which had already made some bold attacks on the US - unless 
they were conspiracies too.

Because of the crap you can find on youtube, I know people who actually think 
ISIS and Al Queda don't exist at all and were created so the west can clamp 
down on personal freedom. We realists know they just used the 9/11 and 7/7 
bombings as an excuse

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-11 Thread Bhairitu noozg...@sbcglobal.net [FairfieldLife]
In the 1980s I knew some ex-cops from Texas who were probably in 
witness protection because of what they knew about Billy Sol Estes.


On 10/11/2014 11:01 AM, Michael Jackson mjackso...@yahoo.com 
[FairfieldLife] wrote:
Some conspiracy theories are more fun and more chilling than others - 
read this obit of Billie Sol Estes and see what you think:


http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/may/17/billie-sol-estes

image http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/may/17/billie-sol-estes





Billie Sol Estes obituary 
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/may/17/billie-sol-estes
Spectacularly successful Texas fraudster who figured in conspiracy 
theories about the death of John F Kennedy


View on www.theguardian.com 
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/may/17/billie-sol-estes


Preview by Yahoo



*From:* seerd...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] 
FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com

*To:* FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
*Sent:* Saturday, October 11, 2014 1:46 PM
*Subject:* Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

The term “conspiracy theory”, though I use it myself, is a two-edged 
sword that may have outlived its usefulness.  Those challenging 
mainstream knowledge and conventions are routinely cast as conspiracy 
nuts – and implying that such nut jobs glob onto many such “oddball” 
explanations of the universe as a crutch to cope with reality, It has 
acquired a derogatory meaning and can become a perverse tool applied 
to dismiss or ridicule unconventional beliefs, a tool of suppressing 
sincere inquiry and challenging of prevailing norms and wisdom, 
defying gut instincts (aka cognitive biases) and seeking truth no 
matter where it takes you and at what costa.
Many breakthroughs and new understanding of how the world works, 
including counter-culture ideas, and challenges to the establishment, 
have been initially derided as crack-pot ideas, conspiracy theories, 
promoted by nut jobs. Derision of challenging and troubling ideas is a 
core defense mechanism.
A vast list of crack-pot ideas, inflammatory, and/or conspiracy-driven 
dibble has unfolded and become in our lifetimes mainstream wisdom – a 
few, both large and small (may) include (not in any order of impact or 
importance:  the Snowden leaks, Pentagon Papers, Lewinsky’s blue 
dress, lack of weapons of mass destruction, Judith Bourque’s book, 
Iran-Contra, the Madoff scandal, genocides and mass murder of German 
concentration camps, Stalin, Mao, Khmer Rouge, Sudan, Native 
Americans, “California real-estate prices never go down”, the USDA’s 
food triangle, equal pay for equal work, segregation, JFK’s affairs, 
Watergate, MY Lai, black site prisons, priest pedophilia, the tech 
bubble (“you just don’t GET it”), the housing bubble, Goldman Sachs, 
the extent of regulatory capture, animals having emotions, Sandusky, 
celebrities coming out of the closet, the Higgs Boson, Masters and 
Johnson, a black president, LBJ’s decline seek re-election, the value 
of “health foods”, vegetarianism, yoga and meditation, game-changing 
technology, global climate change, etc. More so over the march of time 
– much of mainstream science came from those initially labeled 
heretics, crackpots, etc.
Though many weird, strange, mind-blowing, unbelievable things have 
turned out to be true, that hardly means that all weird, strange, 
mind-blowing, unbelievable things are true.
Some core distinctions are willingness to systematically, without bias 
or agenda, challenge one’s own and society’s views, models of how the 
world works, prevailing understandings and conventional wisdom. These 
are high virtues, not something that is worthy of derision and labels 
such as conspiracy theories..
However, it is hardly a virtue to be driven by conformational bias in 
assembling facts to form an apparent, though illusory random pattern 
in order to fulfill some inner need to cast blows against the empire, 
exude elitism, deride others, irrationally attempt to bring order and 
make sense of a seemly, at times, irrational challenging life and 
universe.
/A key distinction is whether one first shoots the arrow or paints the 
target, is open to considering all evidence, a willingness to change 
views as new evidence presents itself, always seeking to find 
alternative answers to explain and overturn one’s current pet POV, 
having a healthy sense of both skepticism and optimism, and  having an 
identity independent of a particular “truth”. /








Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-11 Thread Bhairitu noozg...@sbcglobal.net [FairfieldLife]

On 10/11/2014 12:20 PM, salyavin808 wrote:





---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote :

Image if your local police department reported a murder as someone 
shot the person.  Case closed That's almost what the 9-11 official 
story is like.


You would have been well advised not to use RationalWiki which 
skeptics don't even like.  Those of us who think there is something 
more to a case than reported don't call ourselves conspiracy 
theorists.  That term has come about and used by PSYOPS to discredit 
us since the JFK assassination which I don't think Oswald had anything 
to do with because he had a cheap gun and was seen in the lunch room 
at the book depository when the assassination took place.  He was a 
convenience patsy due to his activities.  If Ruby had not shot him it 
might have come out that he got framed.


Jeez, everyone knows Elvis shot JFK. It's hardly news.

Anyone on the right track to solving these crimes who has any 
visibility such as a news reporter often gets offed or suicided. Some 
of the nutty stuff you will find in conspiracy theorist are PSYOPS 
trying to poison the well lest the truth be known. Just think if we 
could prove beyond a doubt that 9-11 was indeed an inside job and who 
the perps were how confidence in our government would fall, not that 
it isn't anyway.  And we have long had little confidence in our 
corporations and banks which these days run like gang operations.


After reading the articles Barry posted I was going to write something 
about how conspiracy theories are probably created by the government 
to distract everyone from what a crap job they actually do at running 
the country. Be nice to think there was someone in power who could 
organise a job that big, we can't even make a computer system to link 
up health districts without the ministry going bankrupt and abandoning 
it.


The USA is a very dirty place.  It was that way from it's inception 
because some of the wealthy landowners didn't want their workers to 
have rights and some wanted the US to still be beholding to Britain.  
Our democracy is an illusion and the king makers hate anyone who 
points that out.  A lot more people would have probably taken to the 
streets during the Occupy Movement but they feared losing their jobs.  
We live in a country of increasing have nots, people who have lost 
even their simple pleasures of life because a plan to put all but a 
few in austerity.


So many detractors here seem to have little knowledge of history and 
just react emotionally.  I guess some folks want to live in a simple 
world of Santy Claus and Easter Bunnies.


Both of which are inventions, just like the conspiracies.

What worries is me that you have such a disconnect from the people 
that run the US that you actually think they would murder thousands of 
their own people for reasons best known to themselves.


Whoa, Jack! You're half reading me.  I'm not alleging that our 
politicians conspired to pull off 9-11.  It's a shadow government that 
many people in the US believe exists (and probably many folks in the UK 
believe about your own government).  Killing thousands would rile up 
Americans (and believe me the days following they were insanely riled) 
to support anything the  government asked if it involved retaliation.  
So Arab terrorists did 9-11 and we go off and bomb Afghanistan and 
Iraq.  Shouldn't we have bombed Saudi Arabia instead?  Something wrong 
with that picture?


BTW, for some reason a lot of people who worked at the WTC were told to 
stay home that day.


There's a kind of movement like that in the UK about the Islamic 
terrorist that blew up some tube trains a decade ago. The story goes 
that the government knew about it but let it happen because it would 
be an excuse to rachet up the anti-terror laws, which completely 
coincidentally can also be used to harass innocent people whenever the 
state feels like it.


The UK subway bombings indeed smell of a false flag.  These types of 
operations have been around for centuries but I guess that history 
wasn't your favorite subject?




I don't believe it for the simple fact that however cynical 
politicians get it's their own friends and family that might get blown 
up. You don't seem to have that sort of human link, sure the govt in 
the US has blood on its hands but the 9/11 conspiracies are 
qualitatively different from interfering in the politics of left wing 
countries or suppressing anti-capitalist demonstrations. It isn't a 
quantitative thing at all.


See my above comment.



I think it's the conspiracists that react emotionally, something 
unbelievable happens and the dots get joined up irrationally, anything 
to make it make sense that doesn't just mean the world is so dangerous 
a bunch of religious fruitcakes can walk onto planes in America and 
fly them into public buildings. I'd hate to live in a country where I 
thought the government would actually blow me up as an excuse for 
starting a 

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-11 Thread seerd...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
To me the (mythical/hypothetical rational, impartial) jury is still out on the 
JFK assassination. It has so many undisclosed facts, mistruths, destroyed or 
missing data, convenient subsequent deaths, agenda's build on agendas (on 
many sides of the question), whitewashes, etc. For me, 9/11 has similar 
problems (though I am not equating frameworks or magnitude.) . To me other 
issues such as the undisclosed, hidden full backroom story and agendas of how 
and why the US and others have gotten involved in, instigated, and/or prolonged 
major wars is deeply problematic and troubling (Spanish American war, 
Philippine American war, WWI, WWII, Vietnam, Central America, Gulf War, Iraq 
and Afghanistan, Lybia, ISIS, etc.
 

 Eisenhower's  caution about the military/industrial complex is as valid if not 
more so today than in 1960 when he left office with those words. I would expand 
it to the military/industrial/financial. So much lays beneath the surface that 
should be uncovered. 

 Other issues, while fairly well documented still need much more to be 
uncovered (and the public to wake up to it) such as   
 regulatory capture (when a regulatory agency, created to act in the public 
interest, advances the commercial or special concerns of interest groups that 
dominate the industry or sector it is charged with regulating), 
 the revolving door between government and high paying private sector jobs and 
influence,
 the power and influence of of Investment banks,
 the substantial science supporting global warming and the vast and far 
reaching costs and disruption of its current and unfolding impacts over the 
next century
 agra-business's influence on public (non)nutrition AMA and FDA (at times) 
perverse influence and roadblocks to the pursuit of a healthy life the 
obstacles to deep, constructive reform to primary and secondary education 
(including and not limited to teachers unions, text book publishers, etc)
 the perverse and cozy healthcare / insurance complex Medicare solvency 
advances in brain science in the past 10 years concentration of power in 
governments, corporations and high wealth individuals/families pervasive 
influence of cognitive biases and irrational / anti-science bias growing 
divergence of income distribution  There are so many issues that need fuller 
investigation, disclosure and understanding. Given limited time and resources, 
to me its a question of choosing one's battles, identifying which areas of 
disclosure and changes will make a substantive difference. And that is at the 
cost of less focus on really perverse, messed-up, clearly corrupt, black (yet 
still fascinating and intriguing)  events and processes.  
 

 To me, the JFK assassination (as well as Kennedy's and brothers' at least in 
part questionable behind the scenes actions and  agendas) are fascinating -- 
having lived through that era and through the implications of those events -- 
and clearly somethings are still quite rotten and smelly. 
 

 However, will getting to the bottom of that provide as much fuel for positive 
change and reform as, for example, helping to provide greater insight into, and 
actions to help mitigate and adapt to, the vast tsunami of disruption that 
global climate change that is unfolding?   
 

 Or does real change really begin (and end) with individual change.  Is that 
the more effective pursuit  -- even if it means foregoing worthy public inquiry 
outlined above?

   
  




Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-11 Thread seerd...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
Mac: Very well said. This sentence, Derision of challenging and troubling 
ideas is a core defense mechanism., stood out for me. In the face of a modern 
age, with an endless cascade of information, to assimilate, or challenge, it 
becomes an easy out, to draw broad conclusions, either casting too critical an 
eye at unconventional life, or, becoming naively accepting of it. I try to keep 
an open mind, especially for events where I was not present, and must rely on a 
media source for information.  

 Mac: Fwiw, in terms of public events, the one that still has me thinking, is 
the JFK killing - Mostly because Oswald was then killed, in a highly secure 
environment (the basement of Dallas Police HQ), by Jack Ruby, who then died on 
the eve of his second trial, four years later, at 55. Perhaps it was exactly 
how the govt. said it was, but too many questions, for my liking.
 

 


 Seerdope Reply: 
 

 To me the (mythical/hypothetical rational, impartial) jury is still out on the 
JFK assassination. It has so many undisclosed facts, mistruths, destroyed or 
missing data, convenient subsequent deaths, agenda's build on agendas (on 
many sides of the question), whitewashes, etc. For me, 9/11 has similar 
problems (though I am not equating frameworks or magnitude.) . To me other 
issues such as the undisclosed, hidden full backroom story and agendas of how 
and why the US and others have gotten involved in, instigated, and/or prolonged 
major wars is deeply problematic and troubling (Spanish American war, 
Philippine American war, WWI, WWII, Vietnam, Central America, Gulf War, Iraq 
and Afghanistan, Lybia, ISIS, etc.
 

 Eisenhower's  caution about the military/industrial complex is as valid if not 
more so today than in 1960 when he left office with those words. I would expand 
it to the military/industrial/financial. So much lays beneath the surface that 
should be uncovered. 

 Other issues, while fairly well documented still need much more to be 
uncovered (and the public to wake up to it) such as   
 regulatory capture (when a regulatory agency, created to act in the public 
interest, advances the commercial or special concerns of interest groups that 
dominate the industry or sector it is charged with regulating), 
 the revolving door between government and high paying private sector jobs and 
influence,
 the power and influence of of Investment banks,
 the substantial science supporting global warming and the vast and far 
reaching costs and disruption of its current and unfolding impacts over the 
next century
 agra-business's influence on public (non)nutrition AMA and FDA (at times) 
perverse influence and roadblocks to the pursuit of a healthy life the 
obstacles to deep, constructive reform to primary and secondary education 
(including and not limited to teachers unions, text book publishers, etc)
 the perverse and cozy healthcare / insurance complex Medicare solvency 
advances in brain science in the past 10 years concentration of power in 
governments, corporations and high wealth individuals/families pervasive 
influence of cognitive biases and irrational / anti-science bias growing 
divergence of income distribution  There are so many issues that need fuller 
investigation, disclosure and understanding. Given limited time and resources, 
to me its a question of choosing one's battles, identifying which areas of 
disclosure and changes will make a substantive difference. And that is at the 
cost of less focus on really perverse, messed-up, clearly corrupt, black (yet 
still fascinating and intriguing)  events and processes.  
 

 To me, the JFK assassination (as well as Kennedy's and brothers' at least in 
part questionable behind the scenes actions and  agendas) are fascinating -- 
having lived through that era and through the implications of those events -- 
and clearly somethings are still quite rotten and smelly. 
 

 However, will getting to the bottom of that provide as much fuel for positive 
change and reform as, for example, helping to provide greater insight into, and 
actions to help mitigate and adapt to, the vast tsunami of disruption that 
global climate change that is unfolding?   
 

 Or does real change really begin (and end) with individual change.  Is that 
the more effective pursuit  -- even if it means foregoing worthy public inquiry 
outlined above?

   
  
 







Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-11 Thread seerd...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
Snoozguru (is that Bhairitu?) said:  You would have been well advised not to 
use RationalWiki which skeptics don't even like.  
 

 SD:  I am not relying on RationalWiki as an authority. However, it provides 
some credible counter arguments to some 9/11 points that you (and others, such 
as O'keefe in related video) have raised. I don't find all the points raised in 
the 9/11 section of RationalWiki particular relevant or well considered.  The 
same points that I drew upon are found from a number of alternative sources. 
RationalWiki simply compiled otherwise existing information is a convenient 
format (for me). 
 

 I hope you will address (at least some) of the  specific counter points that I 
listed. I hope you will not not blanketly  discredit or disregard the 
counterpoints because you are not a fan of the site that compiled them from 
many other sources. 
 

 I do not have a rigid stance on many 911 issues and am not trying to win any 
sort of debate. You raised some interesting points. Upon research I 
found,further information that, until refuted or discredited, appears to 
counter some of your your points.  Not the end of the story in my view. 
Successive exchanges of points and rational counterpoints is at least one means 
to get further towards the bottom of things.
 

 

 Snoozeguru: Those of us who think there is something more to a case than 
reported don't call ourselves conspiracy theorists. 
 

 SD: I don't like the term conspiracy theorist either as I outline in a prior 
post this morning. I was responding to Turq's (to me useful) articles -- but 
pointing out the pitfalls of terms stemming from conspiracy.
 

 

 






Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-11 Thread salyavin808

 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote :

 On 10/11/2014 12:20 PM, salyavin808 wrote:

   

 
 
 ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, 
noozguru@... mailto:noozguru@... wrote :
 
 

 What worries is me that you have such a disconnect from the people that run 
the US that you actually think they would murder thousands of their own people 
for reasons best known to themselves. 



 
 Whoa, Jack! You're half reading me.  I'm not alleging that our politicians 
conspired to pull off 9-11.  It's a shadow government that many people in the 
US believe exists (and probably many folks in the UK believe about your own 
government).  Killing thousands would rile up Americans (and believe me the 
days following they were insanely riled) to support anything the  government 
asked if it involved retaliation.  So Arab terrorists did 9-11 and we go off 
and bomb Afghanistan and Iraq.  Shouldn't we have bombed Saudi Arabia instead?  
Something wrong with that picture? But the hijackers weren't working for the 
Saudi government. The organisers lived in Afghanistan and we just knocked off 
Iraq for the hell of it. Been after an excuse for years. 
 
 BTW, for some reason a lot of people who worked at the WTC were told to stay 
home that day.
 
 There's a kind of movement like that in the UK about the Islamic terrorist 
that blew up some tube trains a decade ago. The story goes that the government 
knew about it but let it happen because it would be an excuse to rachet up the 
anti-terror laws, which completely coincidentally can also be used to harass 
innocent people whenever the state feels like it.





 
 The UK subway bombings indeed smell of a false flag.  These types of 
operations have been around for centuries but I guess that history wasn't your 
favorite subject?
 
I think you've lost it. Can you tell fact from fiction any more? Too much TV 
perhaps, it's hard to tell sometimes, except the news doesn't have happy 
endings.
 
 
 I don't believe it for the simple fact that however cynical politicians get 
it's their own friends and family that might get blown up. You don't seem to 
have that sort of human link, sure the govt in the US has blood on its hands 
but the 9/11 conspiracies are qualitatively different from interfering in the 
politics of left wing countries or suppressing anti-capitalist demonstrations. 
It isn't a quantitative thing at all.





 
 See my above comment.
 
 
 
 I think it's the conspiracists that react emotionally, something unbelievable 
happens and the dots get joined up irrationally, anything to make it make sense 
that doesn't just mean the world is so dangerous a bunch of religious 
fruitcakes can walk onto planes in America and fly them into public buildings. 
I'd hate to live in a country where I thought the government would actually 
blow me up as an excuse for starting a war in a third world country, some of 
the residents of which had already made some bold attacks on the US - unless 
they were conspiracies too.





 
 In the 1960s they wanted to send us young guys off to the rice paddies of 
Vietnam to get our asses shot off. Gulf of Tonkin is a confirmed false flag to 
gain public support.  The poor Vietnamese just wanted their country back after 
centuries of domination by foreign powers.  Now we do trade with them. Go 
figger.
 
 
 
 Because of the crap you can find on youtube, I know people who actually think 
ISIS and Al Queda don't exist at all and were created so the west can clamp 
down on personal freedom. We realists know they just used the 9/11 and 7/7 
bombings as an excuse for that.
 





 
 This history of Al Qaeda is well known from their existence as Mujahideen and 
supported by our CIA to fight against the Russians in Afghanistan.  They've now 
morphed into ISIS.  Erm, that's what I've said here many times. It's the 
conspiracy theorists who've taken it too far. Not me. 
  Some of us weren't born yesterday.  BTW, when is it you turn 1?  :-D  I'm 
guessing this is some derision at challenging ideas yes? 
 
 
 






 
 



Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-11 Thread Share Long sharelon...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
seerdope, I agree and ask myself 1 question: if the conspiracy theories are 
true, which I think they are, would I live my life any differently. The answer 
is no. 



On Saturday, October 11, 2014 3:24 PM, seerd...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] 
FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com wrote:
 


  
Mac: Very well said. This sentence, Derision of challenging and troubling 
ideas is a core defense mechanism., stood out for me. In the face of a modern 
age, with an endless cascade of information, to assimilate, or challenge, it 
becomes an easy out, to draw broad conclusions, either casting too critical an 
eye at unconventional life, or, becoming naively accepting of it. I try to keep 
an open mind, especially for events where I was not present, and must rely on a 
media source for information. 

Mac: Fwiw, in terms of public events, the one that still has me thinking, is 
the JFK killing - Mostly because Oswald was then killed, in a highly secure 
environment (the basement of Dallas Police HQ), by Jack Ruby, who then died on 
the eve of his second trial, four years later, at 55. Perhaps it was exactly 
how the govt. said it was, but too many questions, for my liking.


Seerdope Reply: 

To me the (mythical/hypothetical rational, impartial) jury is still out on the 
JFK assassination. It has so many undisclosed facts, mistruths, destroyed or 
missing data, convenient subsequent deaths, agenda's build on agendas (on 
many sides of the question), whitewashes, etc. For me, 9/11 has similar 
problems (though I am not equating frameworks or magnitude.)
.
To me other issues such as the undisclosed, hidden full backroom story and 
agendas of how and why the US and others have gotten involved in, instigated, 
and/or prolonged major wars is deeply problematic and troubling (Spanish 
American war, Philippine American war, WWI, WWII, Vietnam, Central America, 
Gulf War, Iraq and Afghanistan, Lybia, ISIS, etc.

Eisenhower's  caution about the military/industrial complex is as valid if not 
more so today than in 1960 when he left office with those words. I would expand 
it to the military/industrial/financial. So much lays beneath the surface that 
should be uncovered.

Other issues, while fairly well documented still need much more to be uncovered 
(and the public to wake up to it) such as   
* regulatory capture (when a regulatory agency, created to act in the 
public interest, advances the commercial or special concerns of interest groups 
that dominate the industry or sector it is charged with regulating), 

* the revolving door between government and high paying private sector 
jobs and influence,

* the power and influence of of Investment banks,

* the substantial science supporting global warming and the vast and 
far reaching costs and disruption of its current and unfolding impacts over the 
next century

* agra-business's influence on public (non)nutrition
* AMA and FDA (at times) perverse influence and roadblocks to the 
pursuit of a healthy life
* the obstacles to deep, constructive reform to primary and secondary 
education (including and not limited to teachers unions, text book publishers, 
etc)

* the perverse and cozy healthcare / insurance complex
* Medicare solvency
* advances in brain science in the past 10 years
* concentration of power in governments, corporations and high wealth 
individuals/families
* pervasive influence of cognitive biases and irrational / anti-science 
bias
* growing divergence of income distribution 
There are so many issues that need fuller investigation, disclosure and 
understanding. Given limited time and resources, to me its a question of 
choosing one's battles, identifying which areas of disclosure and changes will 
make a substantive difference. And that is at the cost of less focus on really 
perverse, messed-up, clearly corrupt, black (yet still fascinating and 
intriguing)  events and processes.  

To me, the JFK assassination (as well as Kennedy's and brothers' at least in 
part questionable behind the scenes actions and  agendas) are fascinating -- 
having lived through that era and through the implications of those events -- 
and clearly somethings are still quite rotten and smelly. 

However, will getting to the bottom of that provide as much fuel for positive 
change and reform as, for example, helping to provide greater insight into, and 
actions to help mitigate and adapt to, the vast tsunami of disruption that 
global climate change that is unfolding?   

Or does real change really begin (and end) with individual change.  Is that the 
more effective pursuit  -- even if it means foregoing worthy public inquiry 
outlined above?
  
 



Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-11 Thread 'Richard J. Williams' pundits...@gmail.com [FairfieldLife]

On 10/11/2014 4:03 PM, Duveyoung wrote:
Yeah, of course you can find MANY who would be part of arranging a 
false flag for 9-11.


If you don't agree with every single word of this guy's rant, YOU'RE 
FUCKED UP IN THE HEAD.


Duveyoung Wed, 08 Oct 2014 10:02:10 -0700
http://www.mail-archive.com/fairfieldlife%40yahoogroups.com/msg332298.html

/O'Keefe denied the plausibility that the September 11 attacks were 
committed by Osama bin Laden and the 19 hijackers. He claimed it was an 
inside job and that the US government and intelligence agencies, 
including Mossad were responsible./


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kenneth_O%27Keefe


Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-11 Thread Bhairitu noozg...@sbcglobal.net [FairfieldLife]

On 10/11/2014 01:56 PM, salyavin808 wrote:





---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote :

On 10/11/2014 12:20 PM, salyavin808 wrote:





---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@...
mailto:noozguru@... wrote :


What worries is me that you have such a disconnect from the
people that run the US that you actually think they would murder
thousands of their own people for reasons best known to themselves.


Whoa, Jack! You're half reading me.  I'm not alleging that our
politicians conspired to pull off 9-11.  It's a shadow government
that many people in the US believe exists (and probably many folks
in the UK believe about your own government). Killing thousands
would rile up Americans (and believe me the days following they
were insanely riled) to support anything the  government asked if
it involved retaliation.  So Arab terrorists did 9-11 and we go
off and bomb Afghanistan and Iraq.  Shouldn't we have bombed Saudi
Arabia instead?  Something wrong with that picture?

But the hijackers weren't working for the Saudi government. 



You know this how?  Supposedly the 28 pages redacted from the Official 
911 Report say otherwise.  Some members of Congress who have read those 
pages want them released to the public.



The organisers lived in Afghanistan and we just knocked off Iraq
for the hell of it. Been after an excuse for years.



Yup, Rumsfeld even has been quoted as asking if there was a way to tie 
Saddam to 9-11.  But then I've mentioned I heard in the late 1990s the 
military was preparing for a war in the middle east.  They just needed a 
new Pearl Harbor even if they did it themselves.


For the record I opposed wars of empire as any sane thinking American 
should.





BTW, for some reason a lot of people who worked at the WTC were
told to stay home that day.


There's a kind of movement like that in the UK about the Islamic
terrorist that blew up some tube trains a decade ago. The story
goes that the government knew about it but let it happen because
it would be an excuse to rachet up the anti-terror laws, which
completely coincidentally can also be used to harass innocent
people whenever the state feels like it.


The UK subway bombings indeed smell of a false flag.  These types
of operations have been around for centuries but I guess that
history wasn't your favorite subject?

I think you've lost it. Can you tell fact from fiction any more?
Too much TV perhaps, it's hard to tell sometimes, except the news
doesn't have happy endings.



Why couldn't it have been a false flag?  I bet you swallowed the 
propaganda hook line and sinker.




I don't believe it for the simple fact that however cynical
politicians get it's their own friends and family that might get
blown up. You don't seem to have that sort of human link, sure
the govt in the US has blood on its hands but the 9/11
conspiracies are qualitatively different from interfering in the
politics of left wing countries or suppressing anti-capitalist
demonstrations. It isn't a quantitative thing at all.


See my above comment.



I think it's the conspiracists that react emotionally, something
unbelievable happens and the dots get joined up irrationally,
anything to make it make sense that doesn't just mean the world
is so dangerous a bunch of religious fruitcakes can walk onto
planes in America and fly them into public buildings. I'd hate to
live in a country where I thought the government would actually
blow me up as an excuse for starting a war in a third world
country, some of the residents of which had already made some
bold attacks on the US - unless they were conspiracies too.


In the 1960s they wanted to send us young guys off to the rice
paddies of Vietnam to get our asses shot off. Gulf of Tonkin is a
confirmed false flag to gain public support.  The poor Vietnamese
just wanted their country back after centuries of domination by
foreign powers.  Now we do trade with them. Go figger.



Because of the crap you can find on youtube, I know people who
actually think ISIS and Al Queda don't exist at all and were
created so the west can clamp down on personal freedom. We
realists know they just used the 9/11 and 7/7 bombings as an
excuse for that.


This history of Al Qaeda is well known from their existence as
Mujahideen and supported by our CIA to fight against the Russians
in Afghanistan.  They've now morphed into ISIS. 


Erm, that's what I've said here many times. It's the conspiracy
theorists who've taken it too far. Not me.



That's history pal.  Look it up!  Or are you afraid to?



 Some of us weren't born yesterday.  BTW, when is it you turn 1? :-D 


I'm guessing this is some derision at challenging ideas 

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-11 Thread Bhairitu noozg...@sbcglobal.net [FairfieldLife]
Spot  on, Edg.  It's amazing how many people who haven't been abroad or 
worked in government just buy the propaganda.  I guess history wasn't 
their favorite subject. Ask some of the young kids who got shot up in 
Afghanistan or Iraq why they joined the military?  They'll tell you it 
was the only job they could get.


On 10/11/2014 02:03 PM, Duveyoung wrote:


Yeah, of course you can find MANY who would be part of arranging a 
false flag for 9-11.


What a bunch of blinkered fools we are.  Let's open our scrunched-up 
eyes a crack and admit one thing:  the authorities of the world will 
do cruelty in any form upon anyone no matter the legal framework.


Your local cop IS A MOTHERFUCKING KILLER wishing for his moment to 
totally ruin someone's life.


And if he isn't, then he's an enabler of a fellow cop who is a 
sociopathand that is just AS BAD.


Case in point:  I know of an 2007 incident in sleepy little-town 
FAIRFIELD in which a cop TORTURED A ROO for over 12 hours in the 
presence of the other officers.  Not a headline.  (Don't ask for 
details -- can't out a Roo who doesn't want more of the same if he's 
seen bitching about it in public.  No charges, let the guy go the next 
day.)


But see?  This is the heart of darkness within ALL OF US in Kali Yuga. 
 Even our heroes will be found to be  tilted in this age.


Even the good guys...consider how the TMO did all it could to 
subvert the legal requirements during the murder at MUM.   Those were 
saints, right?  Even inside them was the I get to do whatever shit 
I want to dynamic.  Consider Ed Beckeley, Dr. Bloomfield, the 
commodities groups, the TMO money laundering and smuggling, etc.


I have been to 17 countries and saw the same shit everywhere.  Give 
someone a gun and they're looking for game cuz they're on safari, 
donchaknow.


To sum:  how many good Americans would be willing to put a tactical 
nuke inside a 9-11 tower?  Almost any cop, any soldier.   Deal with 
this fact.  It's the truth.  Krishna took sattva with Him 5,000 years 
ago. There's no Arjuna out there wearing a badge of honor and integrity.









Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-11 Thread Bhairitu noozg...@sbcglobal.net [FairfieldLife]
The first thing I saw in your points from RationalWiki were Bill Maher 
and Michael Shermer taken as credible.  Maher is a comedian and actually 
thinks truthers is blaming the government for 9-11 which shows how 
little he knows about truthers.  I say the same about Rachel Maddow 
who mocks Alex Jones when it is obviously she has never listened to him 
(one of her interns probably found a few clips that would piss her off 
to show her).  She might be shocked to find she agrees on some stuff 
that is on Infowars.


Michael Shermer has long been known to be a PSYOP and well poisoner.  
You might as well quote Hearst owned Popular Mechanics, a bastion of 
yellow journalism.  Maybe you can find some articles in Reader's Digest 
as well.


Before I wasted any time with those points I made the effort to look up 
RationalWiki and it's reputation.  There are a number of blog articles 
and opinion pieces by skeptics who think it is a joke.  They'll dig up 
anything negative to say about anything.  Do they have some anti-TM 
articles as well?  Probably anti-Mindfulness pieces as well.


Note please that I post my own opinions and if I make references don't 
demand that people go read them.  I do have other things to do.  You can 
look up my past references to 9-11 and debates here going back years.  
Even Rick questioned WTC 7.


I just think that some folks feel really uncomfortable waking up to the 
idea that they might be living in the Fourth Reich or something like it.


The Earth is round BTW.  Well not really, it bulges some places. :-D

On 10/11/2014 01:45 PM, seerd...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote:
Snoozguru (is that Bhairitu?) said:  You would have been well advised 
not to use RationalWiki which skeptics don't even like.


SD:  I am not relying on RationalWiki as an authority. However, it 
provides some credible counter arguments to some 9/11 points that you 
(and others, such as O'keefe in related video) have raised. I don't 
find all the points raised in the 9/11 section of RationalWiki 
particular relevant or well considered.  The same points that I drew 
upon are found from a number of alternative sources. RationalWiki 
simply compiled otherwise existing information is a convenient format 
(for me).


I hope you will address (at least some) of the  specific counter 
points that I listed. I hope you will not not blanketly  discredit or 
disregard the counterpoints because you are not a fan of the site 
that compiled them from many other sources.


I do not have a rigid stance on many 911 issues and am not trying to 
win any sort of debate. You raised some interesting points. Upon 
research I found,further information that, until refuted or 
discredited, appears to counter some of your your points.  Not the 
end of the story in my view. Successive exchanges of points and 
rational counterpoints is at least one means to get further towards 
the bottom of things.



Snoozeguru: Those of us who think there is something more to a case 
than reported don't call ourselves conspiracy theorists.


SD: I don't like the term conspiracy theorist either as I outline in 
a prior post this morning. I was responding to Turq's (to me useful) 
articles -- but pointing out the pitfalls of terms stemming from 
conspiracy.










Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-11 Thread Michael Jackson mjackso...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
That's a powerful statement - wonder how long it'll take Share, Steve and Feste 
to say no such cop/TMer incident happened?




 From: Duveyoung no_re...@yahoogroups.com
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
Sent: Saturday, October 11, 2014 5:03 PM
Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
 


  
Yeah, of course you can find MANY who would be part of arranging a false flag 
for 9-11.

What a bunch of blinkered fools we are.  Let's open our scrunched-up eyes a 
crack and admit one thing:  the authorities of the world will do cruelty in any 
form upon anyone no matter the legal framework.

Your local cop IS A MOTHERFUCKING KILLER wishing for his moment to totally ruin 
someone's life.

And if he isn't, then he's an enabler of a fellow cop who is a sociopathand 
that is just AS BAD.  

Case in point:  I know of an 2007 incident in sleepy little-town FAIRFIELD in 
which a cop TORTURED A ROO for over 12 hours in the presence of the other 
officers.  Not a headline.  (Don't ask for details -- can't out a Roo who 
doesn't want more of the same if he's seen bitching about it in public.  No 
charges, let the guy go the next day.)

But see?  This is the heart of darkness within ALL OF US in Kali Yuga.  Even 
our heroes will be found to be  tilted in this age.  

Even the good guys...consider how the TMO did all it could to subvert the 
legal requirements during the murder at MUM.   Those were saints, right?  
Even inside them was the I get to do whatever shit I want to dynamic.  
Consider Ed Beckeley, Dr. Bloomfield, the commodities groups, the TMO money 
laundering and smuggling, etc.  

I have been to 17 countries and saw the same shit everywhere.  Give someone a 
gun and they're looking for game cuz they're on safari, donchaknow.  

To sum:  how many good Americans would be willing to put a tactical nuke inside 
a 9-11 tower?  Almost any cop, any soldier.   Deal with this fact.  It's the 
truth.  Krishna took sattva with Him 5,000 years ago. There's no Arjuna out 
there wearing a badge of honor and integrity.  



 


Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-11 Thread feste37
The cop was trying to get the TMer to tell him his mantra. 
 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote :

 That's a powerful statement - wonder how long it'll take Share, Steve and 
Feste to say no such cop/TMer incident happened?

 

 From: Duveyoung no_re...@yahoogroups.com
 To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
 Sent: Saturday, October 11, 2014 5:03 PM
 Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
 
 
   Yeah, of course you can find MANY who would be part of arranging a false 
flag for 9-11.

What a bunch of blinkered fools we are.  Let's open our scrunched-up eyes a 
crack and admit one thing:  the authorities of the world will do cruelty in any 
form upon anyone no matter the legal framework.

Your local cop IS A MOTHERFUCKING KILLER wishing for his moment to totally ruin 
someone's life.

And if he isn't, then he's an enabler of a fellow cop who is a sociopathand 
that is just AS BAD.  

Case in point:  I know of an 2007 incident in sleepy little-town FAIRFIELD in 
which a cop TORTURED A ROO for over 12 hours in the presence of the other 
officers.  Not a headline.  (Don't ask for details -- can't out a Roo who 
doesn't want more of the same if he's seen bitching about it in public.  No 
charges, let the guy go the next day.)

But see?  This is the heart of darkness within ALL OF US in Kali Yuga.  Even 
our heroes will be found to be  tilted in this age.  

Even the good guys...consider how the TMO did all it could to subvert the 
legal requirements during the murder at MUM.   Those were saints, right?  
Even inside them was the I get to do whatever shit I want to dynamic.  
Consider Ed Beckeley, Dr. Bloomfield, the commodities groups, the TMO money 
laundering and smuggling, etc.  

I have been to 17 countries and saw the same shit everywhere.  Give someone a 
gun and they're looking for game cuz they're on safari, donchaknow.  

To sum:  how many good Americans would be willing to put a tactical nuke inside 
a 9-11 tower?  Almost any cop, any soldier.   Deal with this fact.  It's the 
truth.  Krishna took sattva with Him 5,000 years ago. There's no Arjuna out 
there wearing a badge of honor and integrity.  



 

 


 











Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-11 Thread awoelfleba...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]

 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote :

 The cop was trying to get the TMer to tell him his mantra. 
 

 Wow, good for the TMer. I mean, one's mantra is hardly worthy of 12 hours of 
torture but if it was me I would have resisted just because someone was 
pressing me so hard, not necessarily because I felt saying my mantra out loud 
was so terribly verboten. But any asshole willing to torture an MIU student 
over such a thing needs his head examined. I mean, why would the cop want to 
know someone else's mantra? He didn't; he was just a masochistic bastard if Edg 
and Feste are to be believed.
 

 
 


 













Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-11 Thread steve.sun...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
Michael, you are cuckoo. 

 Give you brain a rest.
 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote :

 That's a powerful statement - wonder how long it'll take Share, Steve and 
Feste to say no such cop/TMer incident happened?

 

 From: Duveyoung no_re...@yahoogroups.com
 To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
 Sent: Saturday, October 11, 2014 5:03 PM
 Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
 
 
   Yeah, of course you can find MANY who would be part of arranging a false 
flag for 9-11.

What a bunch of blinkered fools we are.  Let's open our scrunched-up eyes a 
crack and admit one thing:  the authorities of the world will do cruelty in any 
form upon anyone no matter the legal framework.

Your local cop IS A MOTHERFUCKING KILLER wishing for his moment to totally ruin 
someone's life.

And if he isn't, then he's an enabler of a fellow cop who is a sociopathand 
that is just AS BAD.  

Case in point:  I know of an 2007 incident in sleepy little-town FAIRFIELD in 
which a cop TORTURED A ROO for over 12 hours in the presence of the other 
officers.  Not a headline.  (Don't ask for details -- can't out a Roo who 
doesn't want more of the same if he's seen bitching about it in public.  No 
charges, let the guy go the next day.)

But see?  This is the heart of darkness within ALL OF US in Kali Yuga.  Even 
our heroes will be found to be  tilted in this age.  

Even the good guys...consider how the TMO did all it could to subvert the 
legal requirements during the murder at MUM.   Those were saints, right?  
Even inside them was the I get to do whatever shit I want to dynamic.  
Consider Ed Beckeley, Dr. Bloomfield, the commodities groups, the TMO money 
laundering and smuggling, etc.  

I have been to 17 countries and saw the same shit everywhere.  Give someone a 
gun and they're looking for game cuz they're on safari, donchaknow.  

To sum:  how many good Americans would be willing to put a tactical nuke inside 
a 9-11 tower?  Almost any cop, any soldier.   Deal with this fact.  It's the 
truth.  Krishna took sattva with Him 5,000 years ago. There's no Arjuna out 
there wearing a badge of honor and integrity.  



 

 


 












Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-11 Thread feste37
It was a joke, Ann. 
 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote :

 
 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote :

 The cop was trying to get the TMer to tell him his mantra. 
 

 Wow, good for the TMer. I mean, one's mantra is hardly worthy of 12 hours of 
torture but if it was me I would have resisted just because someone was 
pressing me so hard, not necessarily because I felt saying my mantra out loud 
was so terribly verboten. But any asshole willing to torture an MIU student 
over such a thing needs his head examined. I mean, why would the cop want to 
know someone else's mantra? He didn't; he was just a masochistic bastard if Edg 
and Feste are to be believed.
 

 
 


 















Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-11 Thread awoelfleba...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]

 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote :

 It was a joke, Ann. 
 

 Good joke. I can see it now. Meditator under bright lights. Cop in his face, 
pointing, gesturing demanding to know the holy word. The meditator pursing his 
lips closed and shaking his head vigorously. The cop threatens to feed him 
Iowa-raised pork. Meditator near hysterical, calling for mercy. You know the 
drill. Good story.
 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote :

 
 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote :

 The cop was trying to get the TMer to tell him his mantra. 
 

 Wow, good for the TMer. I mean, one's mantra is hardly worthy of 12 hours of 
torture but if it was me I would have resisted just because someone was 
pressing me so hard, not necessarily because I felt saying my mantra out loud 
was so terribly verboten. But any asshole willing to torture an MIU student 
over such a thing needs his head examined. I mean, why would the cop want to 
know someone else's mantra? He didn't; he was just a masochistic bastard if Edg 
and Feste are to be believed.
 

 
 


 

















Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-10 Thread Michael Jackson mjackso...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
Here's hoping he will combine his 9-11 questions with his TM pitches If we had 
more politicians doing TM, they wouldn't lie about things like 9-11! We need 
answers! I get mine from hallucinations I have of midgets talking to me in my 
dreams! Do TM! It'll save the world!




 From: jr_...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
Sent: Friday, October 10, 2014 1:31 PM
Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
 


  


Lynch is asking very important questions.  There appears to be a conspiracy or 
government coverup.   He should try to prove the doubts he has about the 911 
scenario.

Or, he could have been trying to sell his new movie to the public.  He's doing 
the shock and awe tactics for publicity sake.

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote :


Should cause some commotion here:
http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/


Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-10 Thread jr_...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
MJ, 

 For this particular radio program, he might have been promoting the local TM 
rajah in the Netherlands.
 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote :

 Here's hoping he will combine his 9-11 questions with his TM pitches If we 
had more politicians doing TM, they wouldn't lie about things like 9-11! We 
need answers! I get mine from hallucinations I have of midgets talking to me in 
my dreams! Do TM! It'll save the world!

 

 From: jr_esq@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
 To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
 Sent: Friday, October 10, 2014 1:31 PM
 Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
 
 
   

 Lynch is asking very important questions.  There appears to be a conspiracy or 
government coverup.   He should try to prove the doubts he has about the 911 
scenario.
 

 Or, he could have been trying to sell his new movie to the public.  He's doing 
the shock and awe tactics for publicity sake.

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote :

 Should cause some commotion here:
 http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/ 
http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/


 


 












Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-10 Thread Michael Jackson mjackso...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
Good! The more stuff he blabbers about that mainstream people don't like will 
give less credibility to his TM sales pitches.




 From: jr_...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
Sent: Friday, October 10, 2014 2:02 PM
Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
 


  
MJ,

For this particular radio program, he might have been promoting the local TM 
rajah in the Netherlands.



---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote :


Here's hoping he will combine his 9-11 questions with his TM pitches If we had 
more politicians doing TM, they wouldn't lie about things like 9-11! We need 
answers! I get mine from hallucinations I have of midgets talking to me in my 
dreams! Do TM! It'll save the world!




 From: jr_esq@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
Sent: Friday, October 10, 2014 1:31 PM
Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11



 


Lynch is asking very important questions.  There appears to be a conspiracy or 
government coverup.   He should try to prove the doubts he has about the 911 
scenario.

Or, he could have been trying to sell his new movie to the public.  He's doing 
the shock and awe tactics for publicity sake.

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote :


Should cause some commotion here:
http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/




Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-10 Thread Bhairitu noozg...@sbcglobal.net [FairfieldLife]
Alex Jones broadcasts out of Austin, Texas.  I don't know when he did 
the interview with Lynch.  David Duchovny in drag?  That was before The 
X-Files.  Jones knows a lot of Hollywood people and they sometimes 
appear on his show: Ed Asner, Richard Belzer, Mike Judge (does a Hank 
Hill promo for Infowars), Charlie Sheen, etc.  Alex appears in two 
Richard Linklater films: Waking Life and A Scanner Darkly.


The radio show (which can be streamed free) is far more entertaining 
than the crap on mainstream media.


On 10/10/2014 11:02 AM, jr_...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote:


MJ,


For this particular radio program, he might have been promoting the 
local TM rajah in the Netherlands.



---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote :

Here's hoping he will combine his 9-11 questions with his TM pitches 
If we had more politicians doing TM, they wouldn't lie about things 
like 9-11! We need answers! I get mine from hallucinations I have of 
midgets talking to me in my dreams! Do TM! It'll save the world!



*From:* jr_esq@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
*To:* FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
*Sent:* Friday, October 10, 2014 1:31 PM
*Subject:* [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11


Lynch is asking very important questions.  There appears to be a 
conspiracy or government coverup.   He should try to prove the doubts 
he has about the 911 scenario.


Or, he could have been trying to sell his new movie to the public. 
 He's doing the shock and awe tactics for publicity sake.


---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote :

Should cause some commotion here:
http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/







Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-10 Thread Bhairitu noozg...@sbcglobal.net [FairfieldLife]
There are lots of celebrities who question the 9-11 story.  I liked the 
time that Mos Def was on Bill Maher and mentioned he didn't believe the 
official story. That sort of put Maher between a rock and a hard place 
because he like Mos but goes unglued over the  9-11 allegations.  Maher 
even had some audience folks thrown out because they yelled it was an 
inside job.


Oh and BTW, I bought both of the remote viewing episodes from Courtney 
Brown.  It's more about the process the two remote viewers went through 
and very interesting.  One point I wonder about though was if one of 
them remote viewed the war room for the war game that day which would 
have had nothing to do with the false flag.


But keep eating the peanuts and believing your guvmint and the big 
corporations who represent the truth.


On 10/10/2014 11:14 AM, salyavin808 wrote:



Ah, celebrity endorsement. It must be true!

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote :

Should cause some commotion here:
http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/





RE: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-10 Thread 'Rick Archer' r...@searchsummit.com [FairfieldLife]
 

From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com] 
Sent: Friday, October 10, 2014 1:37 PM
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

 

  

There are lots of celebrities who question the 9-11 story.  I liked the time 
that Mos Def was on Bill Maher and mentioned he didn't believe the official 
story.  That sort of put Maher between a rock and a hard place because he like 
Mos but goes unglued over the  9-11 allegations.  Maher even had some audience 
folks thrown out because they yelled it was an inside job.

 

Maher got slammed and had to grovel to keep his job after 9/11 when he 
commented that it took courage to fly those planes into the buildings.



Oh and BTW, I bought both of the remote viewing episodes from Courtney Brown.  
It's more about the process the two remote viewers went through and very 
interesting.  One point I wonder about though was if one of them remote viewed 
the war room for the war game that day which would have had nothing to do with 
the false flag.
   
But keep eating the peanuts and believing your guvmint and the big corporations 
who represent the truth.

On 10/10/2014 11:14 AM, salyavin808 wrote:

  

 

Ah, celebrity endorsement. It must be true!

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com ,  
mailto:noozguru@... noozguru@... wrote :

Should cause some commotion here:
http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/

 





Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-10 Thread salyavin808

 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote :

 There are lots of celebrities who question the 9-11 story.  I liked the time 
that Mos Def was on Bill Maher and mentioned he didn't believe the official 
story.  That sort of put Maher between a rock and a hard place because he like 
Mos but goes unglued over the  9-11 allegations.  Maher even had some audience 
folks thrown out because they yelled it was an inside job.
 
 Oh and BTW, I bought both of the remote viewing episodes from Courtney Brown.  
It's more about the process the two remote viewers went through and very 
interesting.  One point I wonder about though was if one of them remote viewed 
the war room for the war game that day which would have had nothing to do with 
the false flag.

 But keep eating the peanuts and believing your guvmint and the big 
corporations who represent the truth.
 

 The only thing I believe about the government is that they are incapable of 
planning and executing such a sophisticated and cynical plot. Rigging buildings 
to collapse like a traditional demolition but only after planes had flown into 
them? And without ever practising! What would have happened if the buildings 
fell over when the planes hit? The nuclear weapons would have been seen 
exploding! Bit risky for the plotters.
 

 You got to be on more than peanuts to take any of it even remotely seriously. 
 

 Basically something shit happened and it's hard to take on board so someone 
has to be to blamed. Just as with Lady Di, that had to be an inside job - even 
though none of it made any sense - otherwise it's all just so pointless and 
destructive. Much better if the government are behind it. Something to get 
excited about.
 
 On 10/10/2014 11:14 AM, salyavin808 wrote:
 
   

 Ah, celebrity endorsement. It must be true!
 
 ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, 
noozguru@... mailto:noozguru@... wrote :
 
 Should cause some commotion here:
 http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/ 
http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/


 




Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-10 Thread Bhairitu noozg...@sbcglobal.net [FairfieldLife]
Salyavin, you're reviewing the movie without having seen it just  like 
Judy.  You say:


The only thing I believe about the government is that they are incapable 
of planning and executing such a sophisticated and cynical plot. Rigging 
buildings to collapse like a traditional demolition but only after 
planes had flown into them? And without ever practising! What would have 
happened if the buildings fell over when the planes hit? The nuclear 
weapons would have been seen exploding! Bit risky for the plotters.


This is because you don't actually know what 9-11 investigators allege.  
We allege it was a conspiracy by a faction in the government and some 
corporations.  The planes were a cover and they alone would not have 
collapsed the building.  See, Mr. Science, you don't even know that the 
buildings were designed to take a hit by those size planes. This because 
a large plane hit the Empire State by accident back in the 1940s but it 
also didn't sustain much damage from that.  So they made sure future 
buildings were also built to take such hits.


Also planes hitting the building would not have made them fall over.  To 
do that is a bit tricky and they hit too high to do that.  Thus it 
required demolition to complete the job.  It is alleged that Flight 93 
was supposed to hit WTC 7 where the operation was run from and it was 
also the principal target because it contained documents that the 
perpetrators didn't want investigated.  When the Flight 93 got shot down 
(no it didn't crash) then they had to pull the building (as soon as 
the operations team got out).  Silverstein goofed and said they had to 
pull building.  It wouldn't be possible to set the building up for 
demolition under those conditions and that fast.  It was set up in advance.


Most of us know that a large jet liner could not have maneuvered to hit 
the Pentagon.  There would have been crash debris and a much larger 
hole.  It was most likely a missile. Some folks claim they saw a plane 
but that too may have been the operations plane flying over at the time 
(and one was seen in the vicinity).


Your knowledge of modern tactical nuclear weapons is a bit lacking.  
They would necessarily exposed the perps to any danger setting them up.


I've spent  over 10 years on this subject and  have many reference 
materials if you want to argue more and get an education.


Believe if you want that some billionaire in a cave in Afghanistan ran 
the whole operation but that really sounds wacky! :-D



On 10/10/2014 12:09 PM, salyavin808 wrote:





---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote :

There are lots of celebrities who question the 9-11 story.  I liked 
the time that Mos Def was on Bill Maher and mentioned he didn't 
believe the official story. That sort of put Maher between a rock and 
a hard place because he like Mos but goes unglued over the  9-11 
allegations. Maher even had some audience folks thrown out because 
they yelled it was an inside job.


Oh and BTW, I bought both of the remote viewing episodes from Courtney 
Brown.  It's more about the process the two remote viewers went 
through and very interesting.  One point I wonder about though was if 
one of them remote viewed the war room for the war game that day which 
would have had nothing to do with the false flag.


But keep eating the peanuts and believing your guvmint and the big 
corporations who represent the truth.


The only thing I believe about the government is that they are 
incapable of planning and executing such a sophisticated and cynical 
plot. Rigging buildings to collapse like a traditional demolition but 
only after planes had flown into them? And without ever practising! 
What would have happened if the buildings fell over when the planes 
hit? The nuclear weapons would have been seen exploding! Bit risky for 
the plotters.


You got to be on more than peanuts to take any of it even remotely 
seriously.


Basically something shit happened and it's hard to take on board so 
someone has to be to blamed. Just as with Lady Di, that had to be an 
inside job - even though none of it made any sense - otherwise it's 
all just so pointless and destructive. Much better if the government 
are behind it. Something to get excited about.


On 10/10/2014 11:14 AM, salyavin808 wrote:



Ah, celebrity endorsement. It must be true!

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... 
mailto:noozguru@... wrote :


Should cause some commotion here:
http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/







Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-10 Thread salyavin808

 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote :

 Salyavin, you're reviewing the movie without having seen it just  like Judy. 
 You say:
 
 The only thing I believe about the government is that they are incapable of 
planning and executing such a sophisticated and cynical plot. Rigging buildings 
to collapse like a traditional demolition but only after planes had flown into 
them? And without ever practising! What would have happened if the buildings 
fell over when the planes hit? The nuclear weapons would have been seen 
exploding! Bit risky for the plotters.
 
 This is because you don't actually know what 9-11 investigators allege.  We 
allege it was a conspiracy by a faction in the government and some 
corporations.  The planes were a cover and they alone would not have collapsed 
the building.  See, Mr. Science, you don't even know that the buildings were 
designed to take a hit by those size planes.  This because a large plane hit 
the Empire State by accident back in the 1940s but it also didn't sustain much 
damage from that.  So they made sure future buildings were also built to take 
such hits.
 
 Also planes hitting the building would not have made them fall over.  To do 
that is a bit tricky and they hit too high to do that.  Thus it required 
demolition to complete the job.  It is alleged that Flight 93 was supposed to 
hit WTC 7 where the operation was run from and it was also the principal target 
because it contained documents that the perpetrators didn't want investigated.  
When the Flight 93 got shot down (no it didn't crash) then they had to pull 
the building (as soon as the operations team got out).  Silverstein goofed and 
said they had to pull building.  It wouldn't be possible to set the building 
up for demolition under those conditions and that fast.  It was set up in 
advance.
 
 Most of us know that a large jet liner could not have maneuvered to hit the 
Pentagon.  There would have been crash debris and a much larger hole.  It was 
most likely a missile.  Some folks claim they saw a plane but that too may have 
been the operations plane flying over at the time (and one was seen in the 
vicinity).
 

 Do you have any idea how desperate this sounds? Maybe that's part of it, it's 
all so ridiculous no one would ever believe it!
 
 Your knowledge of modern tactical nuclear weapons is a bit lacking.  They 
would necessarily exposed the perps to any danger setting them up.
 

 But you wouldn't know how the buildings would react if they set them off, It's 
all preposterous. I can't imagine what your government has done to make you so 
convinced they harbour such evil geniuses.
 
 I've spent  over 10 years on this subject and  have many reference materials 
if you want to argue more and get an education.
 
 Believe if you want that some billionaire in a cave in Afghanistan ran the 
whole operation but that really sounds wacky! :-D 
 
Ran the whole operation? You mean got some guys to hijack a few planes? It's 
too simple isn't it. That's the problem people have, they can't believe that 
much destruction was caused by a few maniacs in hijacked planes.
 
 On 10/10/2014 12:09 PM, salyavin808 wrote:
 
   

 
 
 ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, 
noozguru@... mailto:noozguru@... wrote :
 
 There are lots of celebrities who question the 9-11 story.  I liked the time 
that Mos Def was on Bill Maher and mentioned he didn't believe the official 
story.  That sort of put Maher between a rock and a hard place because he like 
Mos but goes unglued over the  9-11 allegations.  Maher even had some audience 
folks thrown out because they yelled it was an inside job.
 
 Oh and BTW, I bought both of the remote viewing episodes from Courtney Brown.  
It's more about the process the two remote viewers went through and very 
interesting.  One point I wonder about though was if one of them remote viewed 
the war room for the war game that day which would have had nothing to do with 
the false flag.

 But keep eating the peanuts and believing your guvmint and the big 
corporations who represent the truth.
 

 The only thing I believe about the government is that they are incapable of 
planning and executing such a sophisticated and cynical plot. Rigging buildings 
to collapse like a traditional demolition but only after planes had flown into 
them? And without ever practising! What would have happened if the buildings 
fell over when the planes hit? The nuclear weapons would have been seen 
exploding! Bit risky for the plotters.
 
 
 You got to be on more than peanuts to take any of it even remotely seriously. 
 
 
 Basically something shit happened and it's hard to take on board so someone 
has to be to blamed. Just as with Lady Di, that had to be an inside job - even 
though none of it made any sense - otherwise it's all just so pointless and 
destructive. Much better if the government are behind it. Something to get 
excited about.
 
 On 

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-10 Thread salyavin808

 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote :

 Salyavin, you're reviewing the movie without having seen it just  like Judy. 
 You say:
 

 BTW, I remember the movie well, I was near a TV on the day. Saw the whole 
thing, but not live. 
 

 I was working at the TM academy at the time and they didn't tell us it 
happened as there was a course on and didn't want to upset anybody! If we 
hadn't had someone staying for BB to mention it over the evening meal I might 
never have heard about it at all. Maybe.. So I might have missed the first 
defining moment of the 21st century! 




Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-10 Thread Michael Jackson mjackso...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
Everyone knows Lady Di's death was orchestrated by MI6 on the orders of the 
Duke of Edinburgh, the Prince of Wales and Lady Sarah McCorquodale cuz they 
couldn't stand the thought of a Muzzlim gittn' in the britches of the Princess. 
That's what Mohamed al Fayed said anyways!




 From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
Sent: Friday, October 10, 2014 3:09 PM
Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
 


  




---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote :


There are lots of celebrities who
question the 9-11 story.  I liked the time that Mos Def was on
Bill Maher and mentioned he didn't believe the official story. 
That sort of put Maher between a rock and a hard place because he
like Mos but goes unglued over the  9-11 allegations.  Maher even
had some audience folks thrown out because they yelled it was an
inside job.

Oh and BTW, I bought both of the remote viewing episodes from
Courtney Brown.  It's more about the process the two remote
viewers went through and very interesting.  One point I wonder
about though was if one of them remote viewed the war room for the
war game that day which would have had nothing to do with the
false flag.
   
But keep eating the peanuts and believing your guvmint and the big
corporations who represent the truth.

The only thing I believe about the government is that they are incapable of 
planning and executing such a sophisticated and cynical plot. Rigging buildings 
to collapse like a traditional demolition but only after planes had flown into 
them? And without ever practising! What would have happened if the buildings 
fell over when the planes hit? The nuclear weapons would have been seen 
exploding! Bit risky for the plotters.

You got to be on more than peanuts to take any of it even remotely seriously. 

Basically something shit happened and it's hard to take on board so someone has 
to be to blamed. Just as with Lady Di, that had to be an inside job - even 
though none of it made any sense - otherwise it's all just so pointless and 
destructive. Much better if the government are behind it. Something to get 
excited about.


On 10/10/2014 11:14 AM, salyavin808 wrote:

 


Ah, celebrity endorsement. It must
be true!

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote :


Should cause some commotion
here:
http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/



Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-10 Thread Michael Jackson mjackso...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]

I can't imagine what your government has done to make you so convinced they 
harbour such evil geniuses.

I think its mainly the fact that Dick Cheny orchestrated the Patriot Act and 
used his behind the curtain powers to see to it that we invaded Afghanistan and 
especially Iraq, not so much for the oil as to be able to award all the 
rebuilding contracts to his old company Haliburton and its subsidiaries - he 
and they made billions off that deal.




 From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
Sent: Friday, October 10, 2014 4:04 PM
Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
 


  




---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote :


Salyavin, you're reviewing the movie
without having seen it just  like Judy.  You say:

The only thing I believe
about the government is that they are incapable of planning and
executing such a sophisticated and cynical plot. Rigging
buildings to collapse like a traditional demolition but only
after planes had flown into them? And without ever practising!
What would have happened if the buildings fell over when the
planes hit? The nuclear weapons would have been seen exploding!
Bit risky for the plotters.

This is because you don't actually know
what 9-11 investigators allege.  We allege it was a conspiracy
by a faction in the government and some corporations.  The
planes were a cover and they alone would not have collapsed
the building.  See, Mr. Science, you don't even know that the
buildings were designed to take a hit by those size planes. 
This because a large plane hit the Empire State by accident
back in the 1940s but it also didn't sustain much damage from
that.  So they made sure future buildings were also built to
take such hits.

Also planes hitting the building would not have made them fall
over.  To do that is a bit tricky and they hit too high to do
that.  Thus it required demolition to complete the job.  It is
alleged that Flight 93 was supposed to hit WTC 7 where the
operation was run from and it was also the principal target
because it contained documents that the perpetrators didn't
want investigated.  When the Flight 93 got shot down (no it
didn't crash) then they had to pull the building (as soon as
the operations team got out).  Silverstein goofed and said
they had to pull building.  It wouldn't be possible to set
the building up for demolition under those conditions and that
fast.  It was set up in advance.

Most of us know that a large jet liner could not have
maneuvered to hit the Pentagon.  There would have been crash
debris and a much larger hole.  It was most likely a missile. 
Some folks claim they saw a plane but that too may have been
the operations plane flying over at the time (and one was seen
in the vicinity).

Do you have any idea how desperate this sounds? Maybe that's part of it, it's 
all so ridiculous no one would ever believe it!

Your knowledge of modern tactical nuclear weapons is a bit
lacking.  They would necessarily exposed the perps to any
danger setting them up.

But you wouldn't know how the buildings would react if they set them off, It's 
all preposterous. I can't imagine what your government has done to make you so 
convinced they harbour such evil geniuses.

I've spent  over 10 years on this subject and  have many
reference materials if you want to argue more and get an
education.

Believe if you want that some billionaire in a
cave in Afghanistan ran the whole operation but that really sounds
wacky! :-D 

Ran the whole operation? You mean got some guys to hijack a few planes? It's 
too simple isn't it. That's the problem people have, they can't believe that 
much destruction was caused by a few maniacs in hijacked planes.


On 10/10/2014 12:09 PM, salyavin808 wrote:

 




---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote :


There
are lots of celebrities who
question the 9-11 story.  I liked the time that Mos
Def was on
Bill Maher and mentioned he didn't believe the
official story. 
That sort of put Maher between a rock and a hard place
because he
like Mos but goes unglued over the  9-11 allegations. 
Maher even
had some audience folks thrown out because they yelled
it was an
inside job.

Oh and BTW, I bought both of the remote viewing
episodes from
Courtney Brown.  It's more about the process the two
remote
viewers went through and very interesting.  One point
I wonder
about though was if one of them remote viewed the war
room for the
war game that day which would have had nothing to do
with the
false flag.
   
But keep eating the peanuts and believing your guvmint
and the big
corporations who represent the truth.


The only thing I
believe about the government is that they are
incapable of planning and executing such a
sophisticated and cynical plot. Rigging buildings to
collapse like a traditional demolition but only
after planes had flown into them? And without ever
practising! What would have happened

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-10 Thread Michael Jackson mjackso...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
What is BB as relates to a residence course or WPA? And did the course leaders 
give the person any crap for telling about it?




 From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
Sent: Friday, October 10, 2014 4:26 PM
Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
 


  




---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote :


Salyavin, you're reviewing the movie
without having seen it just  like Judy.  You say:


BTW, I remember the movie well, I was near a TV on the day. Saw the whole 
thing, but not live. 

I was working at the TM academy at the time and they didn't tell us it happened 
as there was a course on and didn't want to upset anybody! If we hadn't had 
someone staying for BB to mention it over the evening meal I might never have 
heard about it at all. Maybe.. So I might have missed the first defining 
moment of the 21st century! 


Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-10 Thread Bhairitu noozg...@sbcglobal.net [FairfieldLife]

On 10/10/2014 01:04 PM, salyavin808 wrote:





---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote :

Salyavin, you're reviewing the movie without having seen it just  
like Judy.  You say:


The only thing I believe about the government is that they are 
incapable of planning and executing such a sophisticated and cynical 
plot. Rigging buildings to collapse like a traditional demolition but 
only after planes had flown into them? And without ever practising! 
What would have happened if the buildings fell over when the planes 
hit? The nuclear weapons would have been seen exploding! Bit risky for 
the plotters.


This is because you don't actually know what 9-11 investigators 
allege.  We allege it was a conspiracy by a faction in the government 
and some corporations.  The planes were a cover and they alone would 
not have collapsed the building.  See, Mr. Science, you don't even 
know that the buildings were designed to take a hit by those size 
planes. This because a large plane hit the Empire State by accident 
back in the 1940s but it also didn't sustain much damage from that.  
So they made sure future buildings were also built to take such hits.


Also planes hitting the building would not have made them fall over.  
To do that is a bit tricky and they hit too high to do that.  Thus it 
required demolition to complete the job.  It is alleged that Flight 93 
was supposed to hit WTC 7 where the operation was run from and it was 
also the principal target because it contained documents that the 
perpetrators didn't want investigated.  When the Flight 93 got shot 
down (no it didn't crash) then they had to pull the building (as 
soon as the operations team got out).  Silverstein goofed and said 
they had to pull building.  It wouldn't be possible to set the 
building up for demolition under those conditions and that fast.  It 
was set up in advance.


Most of us know that a large jet liner could not have maneuvered to 
hit the Pentagon.  There would have been crash debris and a much 
larger hole.  It was most likely a missile. Some folks claim they saw 
a plane but that too may have been the operations plane flying over at 
the time (and one was seen in the vicinity).


Do you have any idea how desperate this sounds? Maybe that's part of 
it, it's all so ridiculous no one would ever believe it!


Do you know what the word may means?  It's a theory, Sal.  Some people 
have claimed to have seen a plane but it might have been an operations 
plane (a tanker).  Nice cover up.  Also many airline pilots have said 
that it would  have been impossible for even an experienced pilot to fly 
that could have hit the Pentagon.  So why has the FBI not released the 
numerous security videos they confiscated from surrounding businesses.  
The wing that was hit was about to start their yearly accounting of 
finances and there were alleged trillions of dollars missing.  Very 
suspicious.




Your knowledge of modern tactical nuclear weapons is a bit lacking.  
They would necessarily exposed the perps to any danger setting them up.


But you wouldn't know how the buildings would react if they set them 
off, It's all preposterous. I can't imagine what your government has 
done to make you so convinced they harbour such evil geniuses.


OMG, such devices were tested and even in the news years before 9-11.



I've spent  over 10 years on this subject and have many reference 
materials if you want to argue more and get an education.


Believe if you want that some billionaire in a cave in Afghanistan ran 
the whole operation but that really sounds wacky! :-D


Ran the whole operation? You mean got some guys to hijack a few 
planes? It's too simple isn't it. That's the problem people have, they 
can't believe that much destruction was caused by a few maniacs in 
hijacked planes.


But it was not that simple.  And the alleged fliers couldn't even fly a 
Cessna properly let alone a jet.  Those planes were remote controlled 
and such systems were available in advance of 9-11.


How are things at MI5 these days? :-D


On 10/10/2014 12:09 PM, salyavin808 wrote:





---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... 
mailto:noozguru@... wrote :


There are lots of celebrities who question the 9-11 story.  I liked 
the time that Mos Def was on Bill Maher and mentioned he didn't 
believe the official story. That sort of put Maher between a rock and 
a hard place because he like Mos but goes unglued over the  9-11 
allegations. Maher even had some audience folks thrown out because 
they yelled it was an inside job.


Oh and BTW, I bought both of the remote viewing episodes from 
Courtney Brown.  It's more about the process the two remote viewers 
went through and very interesting. One point I wonder about though 
was if one of them remote viewed the war room for the war game that 
day which would have had nothing to do with the false flag.


But keep eating the peanuts and believing 

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-10 Thread salyavin808

 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote :

 Everyone knows Lady Di's death was orchestrated by MI6 on the orders of the 
Duke of Edinburgh, the Prince of Wales and Lady Sarah McCorquodale cuz they 
couldn't stand the thought of a Muzzlim gittn' in the britches of the Princess. 
That's what Mohamed al Fayed said anyways!

 

 Here's a fascinating insight into how conspiracy theories are worked out:
 

 That Mitchell and Webb Look - Diana Assassination 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b4meFC1ee7Q 
 
 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b4meFC1ee7Q 
 
 That Mitchell and Webb Look - Diana Assassination 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b4meFC1ee7Q That Mitchel and Webb Look- Season 
4- Episode 6 This isn't taking the piss out of Princess Diana but in fact the 
idiots who believe in conspiracy theories so...
 
 
 
 View on www.youtube.com https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b4meFC1ee7Q 
 Preview by Yahoo 
 
 
  


 

 From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com
 To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
 Sent: Friday, October 10, 2014 3:09 PM
 Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
 
 
   

 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote :

 There are lots of celebrities who question the 9-11 story.  I liked the time 
that Mos Def was on Bill Maher and mentioned he didn't believe the official 
story.  That sort of put Maher between a rock and a hard place because he like 
Mos but goes unglued over the  9-11 allegations.  Maher even had some audience 
folks thrown out because they yelled it was an inside job.
 
 Oh and BTW, I bought both of the remote viewing episodes from Courtney Brown.  
It's more about the process the two remote viewers went through and very 
interesting.  One point I wonder about though was if one of them remote viewed 
the war room for the war game that day which would have had nothing to do with 
the false flag.

 But keep eating the peanuts and believing your guvmint and the big 
corporations who represent the truth.
 

 The only thing I believe about the government is that they are incapable of 
planning and executing such a sophisticated and cynical plot. Rigging buildings 
to collapse like a traditional demolition but only after planes had flown into 
them? And without ever practising! What would have happened if the buildings 
fell over when the planes hit? The nuclear weapons would have been seen 
exploding! Bit risky for the plotters.
 

 You got to be on more than peanuts to take any of it even remotely seriously. 
 

 Basically something shit happened and it's hard to take on board so someone 
has to be to blamed. Just as with Lady Di, that had to be an inside job - even 
though none of it made any sense - otherwise it's all just so pointless and 
destructive. Much better if the government are behind it. Something to get 
excited about.
 
 On 10/10/2014 11:14 AM, salyavin808 wrote:
 
   

 Ah, celebrity endorsement. It must be true!
 
 ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, 
noozguru@... mailto:noozguru@... wrote :
 
 Should cause some commotion here:
 http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/ 
http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/


 



 


 











Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-10 Thread Share Long sharelon...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
Yay, MJ, we finally agree on something! I don't know if it was M16, etc. but 
pretty sure they couldn't allow it. 



On Friday, October 10, 2014 3:50 PM, salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com 
wrote:
 


  




---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote :


Everyone knows Lady Di's death was orchestrated by MI6 on the orders of the 
Duke of Edinburgh, the Prince of Wales and Lady Sarah McCorquodale cuz they 
couldn't stand the thought of a Muzzlim gittn' in the britches of the Princess. 
That's what Mohamed al Fayed said anyways!


Here's a fascinating insight into how conspiracy theories are worked out:

That Mitchell and Webb Look - Diana Assassination
 
   That Mitchell and Webb Look - Diana Assassination  
That Mitchel and Webb Look- Season 4- Episode 6 This isn't taking the piss out 
of Princess Diana but in fact the idiots who believe in conspiracy theories 
so...  
View on www.youtube.comPreview by Yahoo
 




 From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
Sent: Friday, October 10, 2014 3:09 PM
Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11



 




---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote :


There are lots of celebrities who
question the 9-11 story.  I liked the time that Mos Def was on
Bill Maher and mentioned he didn't believe the official story. 
That sort of put Maher between a rock and a hard place because he
like Mos but goes unglued over the  9-11 allegations.  Maher even
had some audience folks thrown out because they yelled it was an
inside job.

Oh and BTW, I bought both of the remote viewing episodes from
Courtney Brown.  It's more about the process the two remote
viewers went through and very interesting.  One point I wonder
about though was if one of them remote viewed the war room for the
war game that day which would have had nothing to do with the
false flag.
   
But keep eating the peanuts and believing your guvmint and the big
corporations who represent the truth.

The only thing I believe about the government is that they are incapable of 
planning and executing such a sophisticated and cynical plot. Rigging buildings 
to collapse like a traditional demolition but only after planes had flown into 
them? And without ever practising! What would have happened if the buildings 
fell over when the planes hit? The nuclear weapons would have been seen 
exploding! Bit risky for the plotters.

You got to be on more than peanuts to take any of it even remotely seriously. 

Basically something shit happened and it's hard to take on board so someone has 
to be to blamed. Just as with Lady Di, that had to be an inside job - even 
though none of it made any sense - otherwise it's all just so pointless and 
destructive. Much better if the government are behind it. Something to get 
excited about.



On 10/10/2014 11:14 AM, salyavin808 wrote:

 


Ah, celebrity endorsement. It must
be true!

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote :


Should cause some commotion
here:
http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/





Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-10 Thread salyavin808

 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote :

 On 10/10/2014 01:04 PM, salyavin808 wrote:

   

 
 


 
 Believe if you want that some billionaire in a cave in Afghanistan ran the 
whole operation but that really sounds wacky! :-D 
 
 Ran the whole operation? You mean got some guys to hijack a few planes? It's 
too simple isn't it. That's the problem people have, they can't believe that 
much destruction was caused by a few maniacs in hijacked planes.






 
 But it was not that simple.  And the alleged fliers couldn't even fly a Cessna 
properly let alone a jet.  Those planes were remote controlled and such systems 
were available in advance of 9-11. I disagree, I think they were telepathically 
controlled by the Space Brothers from their secret base on Pluto. 
 
 How are things at MI5 these days?  :-D 
 
 On 10/10/2014 12:09 PM, salyavin808 wrote:
 
   

 
 
 ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, 
noozguru@... mailto:noozguru@... wrote :
 
 There are lots of celebrities who question the 9-11 story.  I liked the time 
that Mos Def was on Bill Maher and mentioned he didn't believe the official 
story.  That sort of put Maher between a rock and a hard place because he like 
Mos but goes unglued over the  9-11 allegations.  Maher even had some audience 
folks thrown out because they yelled it was an inside job.
 
 Oh and BTW, I bought both of the remote viewing episodes from Courtney Brown.  
It's more about the process the two remote viewers went through and very 
interesting.  One point I wonder about though was if one of them remote viewed 
the war room for the war game that day which would have had nothing to do with 
the false flag.

 But keep eating the peanuts and believing your guvmint and the big 
corporations who represent the truth.
 

 The only thing I believe about the government is that they are incapable of 
planning and executing such a sophisticated and cynical plot. Rigging buildings 
to collapse like a traditional demolition but only after planes had flown into 
them? And without ever practising! What would have happened if the buildings 
fell over when the planes hit? The nuclear weapons would have been seen 
exploding! Bit risky for the plotters.
 
 
 You got to be on more than peanuts to take any of it even remotely seriously. 
 
 
 Basically something shit happened and it's hard to take on board so someone 
has to be to blamed. Just as with Lady Di, that had to be an inside job - even 
though none of it made any sense - otherwise it's all just so pointless and 
destructive. Much better if the government are behind it. Something to get 
excited about.
 
 On 10/10/2014 11:14 AM, salyavin808 wrote:
 
   

 Ah, celebrity endorsement. It must be true!
 
 ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, 
noozguru@... mailto:noozguru@... wrote :
 
 Should cause some commotion here:
 http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/ 
http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/


 



 





 
 



Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-10 Thread Michael Jackson mjackso...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
I was being facetious just to see what Sal would say. I think if MI6 was to 
have done it, they could have make it look as tho they had drownt in a bathtub 
- why make it messy and public?




 From: Share Long sharelon...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] 
FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
Sent: Friday, October 10, 2014 4:58 PM
Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11
 


  
Yay, MJ, we finally agree on something! I don't know if it was M16, etc. but 
pretty sure they couldn't allow it. 



On Friday, October 10, 2014 3:50 PM, salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com 
wrote:
 


  




---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote :


Everyone knows Lady Di's death was orchestrated by MI6 on the orders of the 
Duke of Edinburgh, the Prince of Wales and Lady Sarah McCorquodale cuz they 
couldn't stand the thought of a Muzzlim gittn' in the britches of the Princess. 
That's what Mohamed al Fayed said anyways!


Here's a fascinating insight into how conspiracy theories are worked out:

That Mitchell and Webb Look - Diana Assassination
 
   That Mitchell and Webb Look - Diana Assassination  
That Mitchel and Webb Look- Season 4- Episode 6 This isn't taking the piss out 
of Princess Diana but in fact the idiots who believe in conspiracy theories 
so...  
View on www.youtube.comPreview by Yahoo
 




 From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
Sent: Friday, October 10, 2014 3:09 PM
Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11



 




---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote :


There are lots of celebrities who
question the 9-11 story.  I liked the time that Mos Def was on
Bill Maher and mentioned he didn't believe the official story. 
That sort of put Maher between a rock and a hard place because he
like Mos but goes unglued over the  9-11 allegations.  Maher even
had some audience folks thrown out because they yelled it was an
inside job.

Oh and BTW, I bought both of the remote viewing episodes from
Courtney Brown.  It's more about the process the two remote
viewers went through and very interesting.  One point I wonder
about though was if one of them remote viewed the war room for the
war game that day which would have had nothing to do with the
false flag.
   
But keep eating the peanuts and believing your guvmint and the big
corporations who represent the truth.

The only thing I believe about the government is that they are incapable of 
planning and executing such a sophisticated and cynical plot. Rigging buildings 
to collapse like a traditional demolition but only after planes had flown into 
them? And without ever practising! What would have happened if the buildings 
fell over when the planes hit? The nuclear weapons would have been seen 
exploding! Bit risky for the plotters.

You got to be on more than peanuts to take any of it even remotely seriously. 

Basically something shit happened and it's hard to take on board so someone has 
to be to blamed. Just as with Lady Di, that had to be an inside job - even 
though none of it made any sense - otherwise it's all just so pointless and 
destructive. Much better if the government are behind it. Something to get 
excited about.



On 10/10/2014 11:14 AM, salyavin808 wrote:

 


Ah, celebrity endorsement. It must
be true!

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote :


Should cause some commotion
here:
http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/







Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-10 Thread nablusoss1008
He is certainly giving voice to 2-3 important questions many are asking
 Twin Peaks Creator Questions 9/11 
http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/

 
 
 http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/ 
 
 Twin Peaks Creator Questions 9/11 
http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/ Famed Hollywood 
director casts doubt on government narrative.
 
 
 
 View on www.infowars.com 
http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/ 
 Preview by Yahoo 
 
 
  


Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-10 Thread Bhairitu noozg...@sbcglobal.net [FairfieldLife]
Perhaps it might help if you know how things are done in the US.  Here's 
a movie out today about the Gary Webb, a newspaper reporter who exposed 
Iran Contra and later committed suicide (more likely suicided):


http://youtu.be/VW4XO-52ubE

Seems that the CIA has started to come forward and say that some of 
Webb's assertions were true:


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/10/10/gary-webb-dark-alliance_n_5961748.html

On 10/10/2014 01:26 PM, salyavin808 wrote:





---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote :

Salyavin, you're reviewing the movie without having seen it just  
like Judy.  You say:


BTW, I remember the movie well, I was near a TV on the day. Saw the 
whole thing, but not live.


I was working at the TM academy at the time and they didn't tell us it 
happened as there was a course on and didn't want to upset anybody! If 
we hadn't had someone staying for BB to mention it over the evening 
meal I might never have heard about it at all. Maybe.. So I might 
have missed the first defining moment of the 21st century!






Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-10 Thread Bhairitu noozg...@sbcglobal.net [FairfieldLife]

All Lynch has to do is ask Salyavin since he has it all figured out. :-D

On 10/10/2014 03:09 PM, nablusoss1008 wrote:



You probably don't know him very well, he's a very private fellow. The 
last thing he would do is to create a shock for the sake of publicity.
He was asked a question and gave his honest opinion; the hole in 
Pentagon wasn't big enough for a plane to have crashed, why did 3 huge 
buildings collapse when only two were hit by planes and why were there 
no wreckage or skidmarks on the ground from the plane that supposedly 
went down in Pennsylvania.

Like Lynch said; we need answers, that's all.

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jr_esq@... wrote :


Lynch is asking very important questions.  There appears to be a 
conspiracy or government coverup.   He should try to prove the doubts 
he has about the 911 scenario.


Or, he could have been trying to sell his new movie to the public. 
 He's doing the shock and awe tactics for publicity sake.


---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote :

Should cause some commotion here:
http://www.infowars.com/twin-peaks-creator-questions-911/





Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-10 Thread 'Richard J. Williams' pundits...@gmail.com [FairfieldLife]
On 10/10/2014 2:54 PM, Bhairitu noozg...@sbcglobal.net [FairfieldLife] 
wrote:
We allege it was a conspiracy by a faction in the government and some 
corporations.


/We allege that the U.S. Government can't even design a web site, much 
less conduct a secret conspiracy to demolish the WTC./


Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-10 Thread awoelfleba...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]

 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote :

 Salyavin, you're reviewing the movie without having seen it just  like Judy. 
 You say:
 
 The only thing I believe about the government is that they are incapable of 
planning and executing such a sophisticated and cynical plot. Rigging buildings 
to collapse like a traditional demolition but only after planes had flown into 
them? And without ever practising! What would have happened if the buildings 
fell over when the planes hit? The nuclear weapons would have been seen 
exploding! Bit risky for the plotters.
 
 This is because you don't actually know what 9-11 investigators allege.  We 
allege it was a conspiracy by a faction in the government and some 
corporations.  The planes were a cover and they alone would not have collapsed 
the building.  See, Mr. Science, you don't even know that the buildings were 
designed to take a hit by those size planes.  This because a large plane hit 
the Empire State by accident back in the 1940s but italso didn't sustain much 
damage from that.  So they made sure future buildings were also built to take 
such hits.
 
 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 
 
 Also planes hitting the building would not have made them fall over.  To do 
that is a bit tricky and they hit too high to do that.  Thus it required 
demolition to complete the job.  It is alleged that Flight 93 was supposed to 
hit WTC 7 where the operation was run from and it was also the principal target 
because it contained documents that the perpetrators didn't want investigated.  
When the Flight 93 got shot down (no it didn't crash) then they had to pull 
the building (as soon as the operations team got out).  Silverstein goofed and 
said they had to pull building.  It wouldn't be possible to set the building 
up for demolition under those conditions and that fast.  It was set up in 
advance.
 
 Most of us know that a large jet liner could not have maneuvered to hit the 
Pentagon.  There would have been crash debris and a much larger hole.  It was 
most likely a missile.  Some folks claim they saw a plane but that too may have 
been the operations plane flying over at the time (and one was seen in the 
vicinity).
 
 Your knowledge of modern tactical nuclear weapons is a bit lacking.  They 
would necessarily exposed the perps to any danger setting them up.
 
 I've spent  over 10 years on this subject and  have many reference materials 
if you want to argue more and get an education.
 
 Believe if you want that some billionaire in a cave in Afghanistan ran the 
whole operation but that really sounds wacky! :-D 
 
 

 



 




Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-10 Thread seerd...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]


 While I am open to and inclined to believe that there is still a lot unknown 
about the 911 attacks, many of the arguments that Bhairitu makes appear to have 
substantial counter arguments as I have outlined below. .  
  
 A general criticism, not of Bhairitu’s arguments specifically, is voiced by 
Thomas W. Eagar, an engineering professor at MIT, [9/11 conspiracy 
advocates]use the 'reverse scientific method'. They determine what happened, 
throw out all the data that doesn't fit their conclusion, and then hail their 
findings as the only possible conclusion. Eagar's criticisms also exemplify a 
common stance that the theories are best ignored. I've told people that if the 
argument gets too mainstream, I'll engage in the debate. Michael Shermer, in 
Scientific American http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientific_American, said: 
The mistaken belief that a handful of unexplained anomalies can undermine a 
well-established theory lies at the heart of all conspiratorial thinking. All 
the evidence for a 9/11 conspiracy falls under the rubric of this fallacy. Such 
notions are easily refuted by noting that scientific theories are not built on 
single facts alone but on a convergence of evidence assembled from multiple 
lines of inquiry. 
  
 If the following counter arguments don’t hold water, please explain, I am all 
ears. 
 
 
 
 1)1) Bhairitu: We allege it was a conspiracy by a faction in the 
government and some corporations.  
 
 Rational Wiki: [Regarding claims that] Powerful money/Bush 
family/military-industrial conspirers did it, all of whom needed a new war in 
the Middle East for various commercial reasons (oil 
http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Oil, arm sales, real estate, precious bodily 
fluids etc.):  While it could easily be said that they used 9/11 to create an 
unrelated Iraq War http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Iraq_War, they did not blame 
the Iraqis http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Iraq, but al-Qaeda, which isn't really 
as convenient if you want to declare war with Iraq and not lose some friends. 
To quote Bill Maher http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Bill_Maher, [That Bush had 
prior knowledge of the 9/11 attacks] is an absurd statement, because it 
contains the words Bush and knowledge.  
 …  the biggest problem is that for the Bush administration to enact such an 
abhorrent plot and keep it a secret would seem to require a level of competence 
they never displayed at anything else. While there is some evidence that 
intelligence http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Intelligence_(government) regarding 
the attack was ignored, that does not mean it was a nefarious plot. As Heinlein 
http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Heinlein said, You have attributed conditions to 
villainy that simply result from stupidity.
 The second problem is that if BushCo did stage the 9/11 attack, their failure 
to place the blame directly on Saddam Hussein 
http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Saddam_Hussein's regime is rather baffling, since 
their alleged main use of 9/11 was to force the US into war with Iraq.
   Rational Wiki: [Regarding claims that] It was carried out by Mossad to 
galvanize US support for Israel and destroy their enemies:  The story of Mossad 
allegedly telling Jews http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Jew to stay home the day of 
the attack, or that no Jews died in the attack, both of which are false, 
brought this one forward (the most common of these claims is that 4,000 Jews 
were warned to stay home).[41] 
http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/9-11_conspiracy_theories#cite_note-40 However, as 
Bush was already one of the strongest supporters Israel has ever had, it is 
questionable as to why they'd need more of his support. The idea that the Jews 
were forewarned may originate in the fact that 9/11 happened to fall at the end 
of the month of Elul, during the days leading up to Rosh Hashanah 
http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Jewish_holidays#Rosh_Hashanah, when observant Jews 
would have additional prayers at their morning prayer services and therefore 
would likely be late to work. However, given that there were several Orthodox 
http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Orthodox_Judaism minyanim (prayer groups) 
organized within the WTC, it is unclear how many, if any, Jews were away from 
the towers due to prayer services. Then again, if Mossad had wanted to destroy 
the towers when there were no Jews in them, they could simply have waited a few 
days until Rosh Hashanah or Yom Kippur http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Yom_Kippur, 
when practically no Jews would have been at work.
  
  
 9/11 conspiracy theories(Wiki): In 2006, members of the group Scholars for 
9/11 Truth http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scholars_for_9/11_Truth argued that a 
group of US neo-conservatives called the Project for a New American Century 
(PNAC), which included Paul Wolfowitz 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Wolfowitz, Dick Cheney 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dick_Cheney and Donald Rumsfeld 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Donald_Rumsfeld, set on US world dominance and 

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-10 Thread TurquoiseBee turquoi...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com



---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote :


On 10/10/2014 01:04 PM, salyavin808
wrote:

  
Believe if you want that some
billionaire in a
cave in Afghanistan ran the whole operation but that
really sounds
wacky! :-D 


Ran the whole
operation? You mean got some guys to hijack a few
planes? It's too simple isn't it. That's the problem
people have, they can't believe that much
destruction was caused by a few maniacs in hijacked
planes.

But it was not that simple.  And the alleged fliers couldn't even
fly a Cessna properly let alone a jet.  Those planes were remote
controlled and such systems were available in advance of 9-11.

I disagree, I think they were telepathically controlled by the Space Brothers 
from their secret base on Pluto.


Weak minds glom onto conspiracy theories the same way that weak minds follow 
cult leaders. That's all anyone ever needs to know about discussions like 
this. 

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-10 Thread Bhairitu noozg...@sbcglobal.net [FairfieldLife]
On 10/10/2014 06:59 PM, TurquoiseBee turquoi...@yahoo.com 
[FairfieldLife] wrote:

*From:* salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote :

On 10/10/2014 01:04 PM, salyavin808 wrote:



Believe if you want that some billionaire in a cave in
Afghanistan ran the whole operation but that really sounds wacky!
:-D

Ran the whole operation? You mean got some guys to hijack a few
planes? It's too simple isn't it. That's the problem people have,
they can't believe that much destruction was caused by a few
maniacs in hijacked planes.


But it was not that simple.  And the alleged fliers couldn't even
fly a Cessna properly let alone a jet.  Those planes were remote
controlled and such systems were available in advance of 9-11.


I disagree, I think they were telepathically controlled by the
Space Brothers from their secret base on Pluto.



Weak minds glom onto conspiracy theories the same way that weak minds 
follow cult leaders. That's all anyone ever needs to know about 
discussions like this.


Are you inferring that I'm a weak mind, Barry?  What's happened to you?  
Getting old and cranky and the contracts not showing up like they used too?










Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-10 Thread Bhairitu noozg...@sbcglobal.net [FairfieldLife]
If 9-11 were an inside job then there would be plenty of funding to 
poison the well with sites like Rational Wiki.  I don't have time to 
look at all of it now and I'm sure someone else has gone through a 
debunked most of the holes here.  I see a couple already.


On 10/10/2014 06:55 PM, seerd...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote:


While I am open to and inclined to believe that there is still a lot 
unknown about the 911 attacks, many of the arguments that Bhairitu 
makes appear to have substantial counter arguments as I have outlined 
below. .


A general criticism, not of Bhairitu’s arguments specifically, is 
voiced by Thomas W. Eagar, an engineering professor atMIT 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Massachusetts_Institute_of_Technology, 
[9/11 conspiracy advocates]use the 'reverse scientific method'. They 
determine what happened, throw out all the data that doesn't fit their 
conclusion, and then hail their findings as the only possible 
conclusion. Eagar's criticisms also exemplify a common stance that 
the theories are best ignored. I've told people that if the argument 
gets too mainstream, I'll engage in the debate. Michael Shermer, in 
/Scientific American 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientific_American/, said: The 
mistaken belief that a handful of unexplained anomalies can undermine 
a well-established theory lies at the heart of all conspiratorial 
thinking. All the evidence for a 9/11 conspiracy falls under the 
rubric of this fallacy. Such notions are easily refuted by noting that 
scientific theories are not built on single facts alone but on a 
convergence of evidence assembled from multiple lines of inquiry.


If the following counter arguments don’t hold water, please explain, I 
am all ears.




1)1) Bhairitu: We allege it was a conspiracy by a faction in the 
government and some corporations.




Rational Wiki: [Regarding claims that] Powerful money/Bush
family/military-industrial conspirers did it, all of whom
needed a new war in the Middle East for various commercial
reasons (oil http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Oil, arm sales,
real estate, precious bodily fluids etc.):  While it could
easily be said that they used 9/11 to create an
unrelatedIraq War http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Iraq_War,
they did not blame theIraqis
http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Iraq, but al-Qaeda, which isn't
really as convenient if you want to declare war with Iraq and
not lose some friends. To quoteBill Maher
http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Bill_Maher, [That Bush had
prior knowledge of the 9/11 attacks] is an absurd statement,
because it contains the wordsBush andknowledge.

… the biggest problem is that for the Bush administration to enact 
such an abhorrent plot and keep it a secret would seem to require a 
level of competence they/never displayed at anything else/. While 
there is some evidence thatintelligence 
http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Intelligence_%28government%29regarding 
the attack was ignored, that does not mean it was a nefarious plot. 
AsHeinlein http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Heinleinsaid, You have 
attributed conditions to villainy that simply result from stupidity 
http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Hanlon%27s_razor.


The second problem is that if BushCo/did/stage the 9/11 attack, their 
failure to place the blame directly onSaddam Hussein 
http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Saddam_Hussein's regime is rather 
baffling, since their alleged main use of 9/11 was to force the US 
into war with Iraq.



Rational Wiki: [Regarding claims that] It was carried out by
Mossad to galvanize US support for Israel and destroy their
enemies:  The story ofMossad
http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Mossadallegedly tellingJews
http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Jewto stay home the day of the
attack, or that no Jews died in the attack, both of which are
false, brought this one forward (the most common of these
claims is that 4,000 Jews were warned to stay home).^[41]
http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/9-11_conspiracy_theories#cite_note-40
However, as Bush was already one of the strongest
supportersIsrael http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Israelhas ever
had, it is questionable as to why they'd needmoreof his support.

The idea that the Jews were forewarned may originate in the fact that 
9/11 happened to fall at the end of the month of Elul, during the days 
leading up toRosh Hashanah 
http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Jewish_holidays#Rosh_Hashanah, when 
observant Jews would have additionalprayers 
http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Prayerat their morning prayer services 
and therefore would likely be late to work. However, given that there 
were severalOrthodox 
http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Orthodox_Judaismminyanim (prayer 
groups) organized within the WTC, it is unclear how many, if any, Jews 
were away from the towers due to prayer services. Then again, if 

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch Questions 9-11

2014-10-10 Thread Bhairitu noozg...@sbcglobal.net [FairfieldLife]
On 10/10/2014 06:59 PM, TurquoiseBee turquoi...@yahoo.com 
[FairfieldLife] wrote:

*From:* salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote :

On 10/10/2014 01:04 PM, salyavin808 wrote:



Believe if you want that some billionaire in a cave in
Afghanistan ran the whole operation but that really sounds wacky!
:-D

Ran the whole operation? You mean got some guys to hijack a few
planes? It's too simple isn't it. That's the problem people have,
they can't believe that much destruction was caused by a few
maniacs in hijacked planes.


But it was not that simple.  And the alleged fliers couldn't even
fly a Cessna properly let alone a jet.  Those planes were remote
controlled and such systems were available in advance of 9-11.


I disagree, I think they were telepathically controlled by the
Space Brothers from their secret base on Pluto.



Weak minds glom onto conspiracy theories the same way that weak minds 
follow cult leaders. That's all anyone ever needs to know about 
discussions like this.




Actually it is weak minds who tend to believe what the government and 
mainstream media tells them.