Re: [Felvtalk] FW: Keep Cats Indoors
My cats have destroyed my new furniture, but I love my cats much much more than I like my furniture, and declawing has never been an option at my house. I voice my opinion as much as possible on that subject. But I have found that some people think that just goes along with having a cat. What totally pisses me off is the ones that declaw and then decide to put them outside!! Sent from my iPad On Aug 26, 2011, at 11:06 PM, katskat1 katsk...@gmail.com wrote: Just add this to the consideration. To summarize, 'declawing' is a misnomer. When a cat is 'declawed' they are having their toes amputated at the first knuckle. Period. Now, think about you having all ten toes cut off at the first knuckle. Kat On 8/26/11, Gloria Lane gbl...@aristotle.net wrote: Problem is declawing is so harmful to adult cats- painful, hard to adjust to, it can ruin them. Not right for kittens, but for adults it's just mean, torturous. Just not a good thing to do. There are places that allow cats w claws but folks may not think bout that till the last thing. But then grandma or whoever dies or goes to an Alzheimer's facility and then who wants a cat ruined by declaw. Gloria Sent from my iPhone On Aug 26, 2011, at 7:25 PM, Kelley Saveika moonv...@gmail.com wrote: It wouldn't be you going without the cat, it would be the cat going without you. I have seen cats given up by their owners grieve and mourn themselves TO DEATH. I've seen cats given away by their owners be fine. I've seen cats who have been declawed suffer. I have seen cats who have been declawed do absolutely fine. It isn't all as easy as it looks sometimes. I have not had a cat declawed but I did have one who had to have a mastectomy and who I am sure would have been in horrible pain had it not been for the oral pain meds the vet prescribed. I would hope any vet doing declaw surgery would provide pain meds. At any rate I'm 44 so hopefully it would be a while before I went into a nursing home. On Fri, Aug 26, 2011 at 7:04 PM, Natalie at...@optonline.net wrote: I would seriously consider declawing very, very seriously– it is the most devastating thing for a cat. Knowing what I do, I would be more heartbroken doing it to a beloved cat than being without the cat, trust me. I wonder how a cat would feel if he/she knew that it had a choice between missing the owner or having their paws mutilated? According to Dr. Nicholas Doddman, who wrote The Cat that Cried for Help, after declawing surgery, cats feel such extreme pain that they either climb the walls of the cage or sit completely morose and cowering in the corner, something that their owners will never see. I have a copy of an article written for NY Times Magazine a few years ago, where a woman writes about declawing her older cat because her mother’s oriental rug was being scratched up. It is one of my hand-out’s to adopters – the story is heartbreaking, and very typical. After the hurricane is over, I will scan it and post it. It is probably the best I’ve read, without going into the gory details of declawing. Natalie From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Kelley Saveika Sent: Friday, August 26, 2011 7:22 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] FW: Keep Cats Indoors Sorry! This is a 62 email thread in gmail. I don't know how your email program organizes stuff. Anyway I did not look at the date. I've seen cats (especially senior cats) mourn their owners literally to death after being given away, and honestly in that case I'd rather declaw them. Hopefully I will not need to make that choice. On Fri, Aug 26, 2011 at 5:58 PM, Natalie at...@optonline.net wrote: OMG – you are responding to a post from March……I thought that I was going crazy and somehow missed a whole thread of talking about declawing, NOW! There are also some apartments that allow cats ONLY if they are declawed…I guess they prefer taking their chances of those cats peeing everywhere instead of possibly scratching something, and it would most likely be the tenants’ own furniture! I would rather give my cat away than declaw it – especially when it’s an older cat – it’s so much harder on them (not that it isn’t on young(er) cats). There needs to be a lot of education on declawing and what the psychological/emotional and physical effects can take be. We have had a few abandoned declawed cats, and I have witnessed almost all of them…..but all the damage had already been done, and what was I to do – throw them out or kill them? I found some homes that understood the ramifications and dealt with the problems as well as they could. From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Kelley Saveika Sent: Friday, August 26, 2011 6:45 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] Time out for a giggle....
Thanks for the laugh. If I ever lose my sense of humor I'm done for! On 08-26, Lynda Wilson wrote: Natalie, I have not had a laugh like that in a long time!!! Thanks so much for sharing. You are way too funny girl! I love your sense of humor. Gotta have it to keep your sanity, right?! ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] Hurricane
Good for you. There is no way I'd ever abandon my cats, but the problem is I have 15 cats, and a small Suzuki compact car, so I'd have to rent or buy a van, which I'd definitely do. Lorrie On 08-26, dlg...@windstream.net wrote: Since Katrina, I have been accumulating carriers (have 7 cats). If I have to leave my home, they go with me. I have an Astro van and all I have to do is put the seats down and I have plenty of room for the carriers. I will leve my home and all else behind, but my cats go with me. I can sleep in the van with them. ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] FW: Keep Cats Indoors
The rental apartment I own, in my two story cat shelter, allows cats As many as they want, within reason of course, and I'd never ask anyone to declaw a cat, but they must be neutered or spayed. I do not allow dogs however, as the last time I had a tenant with a dog (a big lab) we had a horrible flea infestation. The fleas got so bad they gravitated downstairs to my cat shelter and it was just horrible. Lorrie On 08-26, Natalie wrote: There are also some apartments that allow cats ONLY if they are declawed...I guess they prefer taking their chances of those cats peeing everywhere instead of possibly scratching something, and it would most likely be the tenants' own furniture! ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] Declawing
Thanks for this Natalie People need to know how HORRIBLE this declaw surgery is. Please send us the article you mentioned. Lorrie On 08-26, Natalie wrote: I would seriously consider declawing very, very seriously- it is the most devastating thing for a cat. Knowing what I do, I would be more heartbroken doing it to a beloved cat than being without the cat, trust me. I wonder how a cat would feel if he/she knew that it had a choice between missing the owner or having their paws mutilated? According to Dr. Nicholas Doddman, who wrote The Cat that Cried for Help, after declawing surgery, cats feel such extreme pain that they either climb the walls of the cage or sit completely morose and cowering in the corner, something that their owners will never see. I have a copy of an article written for NY Times Magazine a few years ago, where a woman writes about declawing her older cat because her mother's oriental rug was being scratched up. It is one of my hand-out's to adopters - the story is heartbreaking, and very typical. After the hurricane is over, I will scan it and post it. It is probably the best I've read, without going into the gory details of declawing. Natalie ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] FW: Keep Cats Indoors
My thoughts exactly! - Original Message - From: Marcia Baronda marciabmar...@gmail.com To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2011 7:30 AM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] FW: Keep Cats Indoors My cats have destroyed my new furniture, but I love my cats much much more than I like my furniture, and declawing has never been an option at my house. I voice my opinion as much as possible on that subject. But I have found that some people think that just goes along with having a cat. What totally pisses me off is the ones that declaw and then decide to put them outside!! Sent from my iPad On Aug 26, 2011, at 11:06 PM, katskat1 katsk...@gmail.com wrote: Just add this to the consideration. To summarize, 'declawing' is a misnomer. When a cat is 'declawed' they are having their toes amputated at the first knuckle. Period. Now, think about you having all ten toes cut off at the first knuckle. Kat On 8/26/11, Gloria Lane gbl...@aristotle.net wrote: Problem is declawing is so harmful to adult cats- painful, hard to adjust to, it can ruin them. Not right for kittens, but for adults it's just mean, torturous. Just not a good thing to do. There are places that allow cats w claws but folks may not think bout that till the last thing. But then grandma or whoever dies or goes to an Alzheimer's facility and then who wants a cat ruined by declaw. Gloria Sent from my iPhone On Aug 26, 2011, at 7:25 PM, Kelley Saveika moonv...@gmail.com wrote: It wouldn't be you going without the cat, it would be the cat going without you. I have seen cats given up by their owners grieve and mourn themselves TO DEATH. I've seen cats given away by their owners be fine. I've seen cats who have been declawed suffer. I have seen cats who have been declawed do absolutely fine. It isn't all as easy as it looks sometimes. I have not had a cat declawed but I did have one who had to have a mastectomy and who I am sure would have been in horrible pain had it not been for the oral pain meds the vet prescribed. I would hope any vet doing declaw surgery would provide pain meds. At any rate I'm 44 so hopefully it would be a while before I went into a nursing home. On Fri, Aug 26, 2011 at 7:04 PM, Natalie at...@optonline.net wrote: I would seriously consider declawing very, very seriously– it is the most devastating thing for a cat. Knowing what I do, I would be more heartbroken doing it to a beloved cat than being without the cat, trust me. I wonder how a cat would feel if he/she knew that it had a choice between missing the owner or having their paws mutilated? According to Dr. Nicholas Doddman, who wrote The Cat that Cried for Help, after declawing surgery, cats feel such extreme pain that they either climb the walls of the cage or sit completely morose and cowering in the corner, something that their owners will never see. I have a copy of an article written for NY Times Magazine a few years ago, where a woman writes about declawing her older cat because her mother’s oriental rug was being scratched up. It is one of my hand-out’s to adopters – the story is heartbreaking, and very typical. After the hurricane is over, I will scan it and post it. It is probably the best I’ve read, without going into the gory details of declawing. Natalie From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Kelley Saveika Sent: Friday, August 26, 2011 7:22 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] FW: Keep Cats Indoors Sorry! This is a 62 email thread in gmail. I don't know how your email program organizes stuff. Anyway I did not look at the date. I've seen cats (especially senior cats) mourn their owners literally to death after being given away, and honestly in that case I'd rather declaw them. Hopefully I will not need to make that choice. On Fri, Aug 26, 2011 at 5:58 PM, Natalie at...@optonline.net wrote: OMG – you are responding to a post from March……I thought that I was going crazy and somehow missed a whole thread of talking about declawing, NOW! There are also some apartments that allow cats ONLY if they are declawed…I guess they prefer taking their chances of those cats peeing everywhere instead of possibly scratching something, and it would most likely be the tenants’ own furniture! I would rather give my cat away than declaw it – especially when it’s an older cat – it’s so much harder on them (not that it isn’t on young(er) cats). There needs to be a lot of education on declawing and what the psychological/emotional and physical effects can take be. We have had a few abandoned declawed cats, and I have witnessed almost all of them…..but all the damage had already been done, and what was I to do – throw them out or kill them? I found some homes that understood the ramifications and dealt with the problems as well as they could. From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] Hurricane
Glad to hear that Lorrie! I belong to another cat forum and a lady had asked our opinion as to whether she should take her cat with her because it's mandatory evacuation because of Hurricane Irene? OMG! No question to me, I would never leave my babies behind. L - Original Message - From: Lorrie felineres...@frontier.com To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2011 7:15 AM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Hurricane Good for you. There is no way I'd ever abandon my cats, but the problem is I have 15 cats, and a small Suzuki compact car, so I'd have to rent or buy a van, which I'd definitely do. Lorrie On 08-26, dlg...@windstream.net wrote: Since Katrina, I have been accumulating carriers (have 7 cats). If I have to leave my home, they go with me. I have an Astro van and all I have to do is put the seats down and I have plenty of room for the carriers. I will leve my home and all else behind, but my cats go with me. I can sleep in the van with them. ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] FW: Keep Cats Indoors
Well, you could enforce the no-flea rule by insisting that the dog is treated with proof. You could even charge the extra amount for flea products and just hand it to them. -Original Message- From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Lorrie Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2011 8:23 AM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] FW: Keep Cats Indoors The rental apartment I own, in my two story cat shelter, allows cats As many as they want, within reason of course, and I'd never ask anyone to declaw a cat, but they must be neutered or spayed. I do not allow dogs however, as the last time I had a tenant with a dog (a big lab) we had a horrible flea infestation. The fleas got so bad they gravitated downstairs to my cat shelter and it was just horrible. Lorrie On 08-26, Natalie wrote: There are also some apartments that allow cats ONLY if they are declawed...I guess they prefer taking their chances of those cats peeing everywhere instead of possibly scratching something, and it would most likely be the tenants' own furniture! ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] Hurricane
I have to worry about 70+ cats - I think we're pretty safe from flooding, although we are below a pond and waterfall, and even with the few Nor'Easters, when pond overflowed, we never had water in the garage where a few cat condo are. I am worried about trees falling on the outdoor enclosure, so we will close them off this afternoon. Never mind what could happen when windows brake. -Original Message- From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Lorrie Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2011 8:15 AM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Hurricane Good for you. There is no way I'd ever abandon my cats, but the problem is I have 15 cats, and a small Suzuki compact car, so I'd have to rent or buy a van, which I'd definitely do. Lorrie On 08-26, dlg...@windstream.net wrote: Since Katrina, I have been accumulating carriers (have 7 cats). If I have to leave my home, they go with me. I have an Astro van and all I have to do is put the seats down and I have plenty of room for the carriers. I will leve my home and all else behind, but my cats go with me. I can sleep in the van with them. ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] FW: Keep Cats Indoors
Benfield Health at Petsmart has a big promotion for kitten health which includes declawing. Many people think it's just a manicure, where nails are pulled out, which to me sounds like torture used by third world countries and barbarians. And many vets suggest it as an option when they learn that the cats will be inside only. I know several people who allowed, and still do, declawed cats outside. No good comes of it more often than not, and the ones that are OK are a fluke. -Original Message- From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Marcia Baronda Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2011 8:31 AM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] FW: Keep Cats Indoors My cats have destroyed my new furniture, but I love my cats much much more than I like my furniture, and declawing has never been an option at my house. I voice my opinion as much as possible on that subject. But I have found that some people think that just goes along with having a cat. What totally pisses me off is the ones that declaw and then decide to put them outside!! Sent from my iPad On Aug 26, 2011, at 11:06 PM, katskat1 katsk...@gmail.com wrote: Just add this to the consideration. To summarize, 'declawing' is a misnomer. When a cat is 'declawed' they are having their toes amputated at the first knuckle. Period. Now, think about you having all ten toes cut off at the first knuckle. Kat On 8/26/11, Gloria Lane gbl...@aristotle.net wrote: Problem is declawing is so harmful to adult cats- painful, hard to adjust to, it can ruin them. Not right for kittens, but for adults it's just mean, torturous. Just not a good thing to do. There are places that allow cats w claws but folks may not think bout that till the last thing. But then grandma or whoever dies or goes to an Alzheimer's facility and then who wants a cat ruined by declaw. Gloria Sent from my iPhone On Aug 26, 2011, at 7:25 PM, Kelley Saveika moonv...@gmail.com wrote: It wouldn't be you going without the cat, it would be the cat going without you. I have seen cats given up by their owners grieve and mourn themselves TO DEATH. I've seen cats given away by their owners be fine. I've seen cats who have been declawed suffer. I have seen cats who have been declawed do absolutely fine. It isn't all as easy as it looks sometimes. I have not had a cat declawed but I did have one who had to have a mastectomy and who I am sure would have been in horrible pain had it not been for the oral pain meds the vet prescribed. I would hope any vet doing declaw surgery would provide pain meds. At any rate I'm 44 so hopefully it would be a while before I went into a nursing home. On Fri, Aug 26, 2011 at 7:04 PM, Natalie at...@optonline.net wrote: I would seriously consider declawing very, very seriously– it is the most devastating thing for a cat. Knowing what I do, I would be more heartbroken doing it to a beloved cat than being without the cat, trust me. I wonder how a cat would feel if he/she knew that it had a choice between missing the owner or having their paws mutilated? According to Dr. Nicholas Doddman, who wrote The Cat that Cried for Help, after declawing surgery, cats feel such extreme pain that they either climb the walls of the cage or sit completely morose and cowering in the corner, something that their owners will never see. I have a copy of an article written for NY Times Magazine a few years ago, where a woman writes about declawing her older cat because her mother’s oriental rug was being scratched up. It is one of my hand-out’s to adopters – the story is heartbreaking, and very typical. After the hurricane is over, I will scan it and post it. It is probably the best I’ve read, without going into the gory details of declawing. Natalie From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Kelley Saveika Sent: Friday, August 26, 2011 7:22 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] FW: Keep Cats Indoors Sorry! This is a 62 email thread in gmail. I don't know how your email program organizes stuff. Anyway I did not look at the date. I've seen cats (especially senior cats) mourn their owners literally to death after being given away, and honestly in that case I'd rather declaw them. Hopefully I will not need to make that choice. On Fri, Aug 26, 2011 at 5:58 PM, Natalie at...@optonline.net wrote: OMG – you are responding to a post from March……I thought that I was going crazy and somehow missed a whole thread of talking about declawing, NOW! There are also some apartments that allow cats ONLY if they are declawed…I guess they prefer taking their chances of those cats peeing everywhere instead of possibly scratching something, and it would most likely be the tenants’ own furniture! I would rather give my cat away
Re: [Felvtalk] FW: Keep Cats Indoors
The best furniture is wooden futons..and bentwood chairs, that's what we have in the kitchen and the TV room, where most cats are. -Original Message- From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Lynda Wilson Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2011 8:45 AM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] FW: Keep Cats Indoors My thoughts exactly! - Original Message - From: Marcia Baronda marciabmar...@gmail.com To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2011 7:30 AM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] FW: Keep Cats Indoors My cats have destroyed my new furniture, but I love my cats much much more than I like my furniture, and declawing has never been an option at my house. I voice my opinion as much as possible on that subject. But I have found that some people think that just goes along with having a cat. What totally pisses me off is the ones that declaw and then decide to put them outside!! Sent from my iPad On Aug 26, 2011, at 11:06 PM, katskat1 katsk...@gmail.com wrote: Just add this to the consideration. To summarize, 'declawing' is a misnomer. When a cat is 'declawed' they are having their toes amputated at the first knuckle. Period. Now, think about you having all ten toes cut off at the first knuckle. Kat On 8/26/11, Gloria Lane gbl...@aristotle.net wrote: Problem is declawing is so harmful to adult cats- painful, hard to adjust to, it can ruin them. Not right for kittens, but for adults it's just mean, torturous. Just not a good thing to do. There are places that allow cats w claws but folks may not think bout that till the last thing. But then grandma or whoever dies or goes to an Alzheimer's facility and then who wants a cat ruined by declaw. Gloria Sent from my iPhone On Aug 26, 2011, at 7:25 PM, Kelley Saveika moonv...@gmail.com wrote: It wouldn't be you going without the cat, it would be the cat going without you. I have seen cats given up by their owners grieve and mourn themselves TO DEATH. I've seen cats given away by their owners be fine. I've seen cats who have been declawed suffer. I have seen cats who have been declawed do absolutely fine. It isn't all as easy as it looks sometimes. I have not had a cat declawed but I did have one who had to have a mastectomy and who I am sure would have been in horrible pain had it not been for the oral pain meds the vet prescribed. I would hope any vet doing declaw surgery would provide pain meds. At any rate I'm 44 so hopefully it would be a while before I went into a nursing home. On Fri, Aug 26, 2011 at 7:04 PM, Natalie at...@optonline.net wrote: I would seriously consider declawing very, very seriously– it is the most devastating thing for a cat. Knowing what I do, I would be more heartbroken doing it to a beloved cat than being without the cat, trust me. I wonder how a cat would feel if he/she knew that it had a choice between missing the owner or having their paws mutilated? According to Dr. Nicholas Doddman, who wrote The Cat that Cried for Help, after declawing surgery, cats feel such extreme pain that they either climb the walls of the cage or sit completely morose and cowering in the corner, something that their owners will never see. I have a copy of an article written for NY Times Magazine a few years ago, where a woman writes about declawing her older cat because her mother’s oriental rug was being scratched up. It is one of my hand-out’s to adopters – the story is heartbreaking, and very typical. After the hurricane is over, I will scan it and post it. It is probably the best I’ve read, without going into the gory details of declawing. Natalie From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Kelley Saveika Sent: Friday, August 26, 2011 7:22 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] FW: Keep Cats Indoors Sorry! This is a 62 email thread in gmail. I don't know how your email program organizes stuff. Anyway I did not look at the date. I've seen cats (especially senior cats) mourn their owners literally to death after being given away, and honestly in that case I'd rather declaw them. Hopefully I will not need to make that choice. On Fri, Aug 26, 2011 at 5:58 PM, Natalie at...@optonline.net wrote: OMG – you are responding to a post from March……I thought that I was going crazy and somehow missed a whole thread of talking about declawing, NOW! There are also some apartments that allow cats ONLY if they are declawed…I guess they prefer taking their chances of those cats peeing everywhere instead of possibly scratching something, and it would most likely be the tenants’ own furniture! I would rather give my cat away than declaw it – especially when it’s an older cat – it’s so much harder on them (not that it isn’t on
Re: [Felvtalk] FW: Keep Cats Indoors
They actually have to learn to walk again. When people lose some of their toes, they lose their balance. Some declaw ALL four paws - and others proudly announce MY cat is declawed on the front paws only!, as if it were something very admirable. When I ask them why they think it's so great, the assumption is that because they spent extra money on the cat, they did it a great favorIt's just plain ignorance when people don't know what declawing really does to a cat's psyche! Everyone should read The Cat that Cried for Help! - just the chapter on the declawing procedure. -Original Message- From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of katskat1 Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2011 12:07 AM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] FW: Keep Cats Indoors Just add this to the consideration. To summarize, 'declawing' is a misnomer. When a cat is 'declawed' they are having their toes amputated at the first knuckle. Period. Now, think about you having all ten toes cut off at the first knuckle. Kat On 8/26/11, Gloria Lane gbl...@aristotle.net wrote: Problem is declawing is so harmful to adult cats- painful, hard to adjust to, it can ruin them. Not right for kittens, but for adults it's just mean, torturous. Just not a good thing to do. There are places that allow cats w claws but folks may not think bout that till the last thing. But then grandma or whoever dies or goes to an Alzheimer's facility and then who wants a cat ruined by declaw. Gloria Sent from my iPhone On Aug 26, 2011, at 7:25 PM, Kelley Saveika moonv...@gmail.com wrote: It wouldn't be you going without the cat, it would be the cat going without you. I have seen cats given up by their owners grieve and mourn themselves TO DEATH. I've seen cats given away by their owners be fine. I've seen cats who have been declawed suffer. I have seen cats who have been declawed do absolutely fine. It isn't all as easy as it looks sometimes. I have not had a cat declawed but I did have one who had to have a mastectomy and who I am sure would have been in horrible pain had it not been for the oral pain meds the vet prescribed. I would hope any vet doing declaw surgery would provide pain meds. At any rate I'm 44 so hopefully it would be a while before I went into a nursing home. On Fri, Aug 26, 2011 at 7:04 PM, Natalie at...@optonline.net wrote: I would seriously consider declawing very, very seriously- it is the most devastating thing for a cat. Knowing what I do, I would be more heartbroken doing it to a beloved cat than being without the cat, trust me. I wonder how a cat would feel if he/she knew that it had a choice between missing the owner or having their paws mutilated? According to Dr. Nicholas Doddman, who wrote The Cat that Cried for Help, after declawing surgery, cats feel such extreme pain that they either climb the walls of the cage or sit completely morose and cowering in the corner, something that their owners will never see. I have a copy of an article written for NY Times Magazine a few years ago, where a woman writes about declawing her older cat because her mother's oriental rug was being scratched up. It is one of my hand-out's to adopters - the story is heartbreaking, and very typical. After the hurricane is over, I will scan it and post it. It is probably the best I've read, without going into the gory details of declawing. Natalie From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Kelley Saveika Sent: Friday, August 26, 2011 7:22 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] FW: Keep Cats Indoors Sorry! This is a 62 email thread in gmail. I don't know how your email program organizes stuff. Anyway I did not look at the date. I've seen cats (especially senior cats) mourn their owners literally to death after being given away, and honestly in that case I'd rather declaw them. Hopefully I will not need to make that choice. On Fri, Aug 26, 2011 at 5:58 PM, Natalie at...@optonline.net wrote: OMG - you are responding to a post from March..I thought that I was going crazy and somehow missed a whole thread of talking about declawing, NOW! There are also some apartments that allow cats ONLY if they are declawed.I guess they prefer taking their chances of those cats peeing everywhere instead of possibly scratching something, and it would most likely be the tenants' own furniture! I would rather give my cat away than declaw it - especially when it's an older cat - it's so much harder on them (not that it isn't on young(er) cats). There needs to be a lot of education on declawing and what the psychological/emotional and physical effects can take be. We have had a few abandoned declawed cats, and I have witnessed almost all of them...but all the damage had already been done, and what was I to do - throw them
[Felvtalk] Declawing - list of countries where it is illegal!
A question about which states do NOT allow declawing: http://cats.about.com/od/declawing/f/uslaws.htm A list of countries where declawing is illegal: http://www.declawing.com/list.html From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Terri Brown Sent: Friday, August 26, 2011 9:52 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] FW: Keep Cats Indoors Paws come with claws. Period. I once lost a job opportunity (which came with a free apartment) because the owner wanted me to declaw. I told him: Unfortunately for you, it will NEVER happen, because I believe it's cruelty to animals. Needless to say, I never got called for a second interview. And I'd do it again. I think I was about 37 at the time. I've always had a big mouth. =^..^= Terri, Siggie the Tomato Vampire, Guinevere, Travis, Dori and 6 furangels: Ruthie, Samantha, Arielle, Gareth, Alec, Salome and Sammi =^..^= - Original Message - From: Natalie mailto:at...@optonline.net To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Friday, August 26, 2011 8:04 PM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] FW: Keep Cats Indoors I would seriously consider declawing very, very seriously- it is the most devastating thing for a cat. Knowing what I do, I would be more heartbroken doing it to a beloved cat than being without the cat, trust me. I wonder how a cat would feel if he/she knew that it had a choice between missing the owner or having their paws mutilated? According to Dr. Nicholas Doddman, who wrote The Cat that Cried for Help, after declawing surgery, cats feel such extreme pain that they either climb the walls of the cage or sit completely morose and cowering in the corner, something that their owners will never see. I have a copy of an article written for NY Times Magazine a few years ago, where a woman writes about declawing her older cat because her mother's oriental rug was being scratched up. It is one of my hand-out's to adopters - the story is heartbreaking, and very typical. After the hurricane is over, I will scan it and post it. It is probably the best I've read, without going into the gory details of declawing. Natalie From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Kelley Saveika Sent: Friday, August 26, 2011 7:22 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] FW: Keep Cats Indoors Sorry! This is a 62 email thread in gmail. I don't know how your email program organizes stuff. Anyway I did not look at the date. I've seen cats (especially senior cats) mourn their owners literally to death after being given away, and honestly in that case I'd rather declaw them. Hopefully I will not need to make that choice. On Fri, Aug 26, 2011 at 5:58 PM, Natalie at...@optonline.net wrote: OMG - you are responding to a post from March..I thought that I was going crazy and somehow missed a whole thread of talking about declawing, NOW! There are also some apartments that allow cats ONLY if they are declawed.I guess they prefer taking their chances of those cats peeing everywhere instead of possibly scratching something, and it would most likely be the tenants' own furniture! I would rather give my cat away than declaw it - especially when it's an older cat - it's so much harder on them (not that it isn't on young(er) cats). There needs to be a lot of education on declawing and what the psychological/emotional and physical effects can take be. We have had a few abandoned declawed cats, and I have witnessed almost all of them...but all the damage had already been done, and what was I to do - throw them out or kill them? I found some homes that understood the ramifications and dealt with the problems as well as they could. From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Kelley Saveika Keep Cats Indoors Because if the owner has to go into the nursing home and is fortunate enough to find one where they can take their cat, the nursing home is likely to require declawing. On Wed, Mar 23, 2011 at 9:34 PM, Natalie at...@optonline.net wrote: That is true, but I don't understand why an old person can't have a cat with claws. Dealing mostly with feral cats, I have never been bitten or scratched - what's the danger, I am 70 yrs old. And as I said, bites are a natural defense for declawed cats! ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] FW: Keep Cats Indoors
Yes, but it shouldn't be taken as the ONLY option! And what if the declawed cat starts pissing all over or starts biting people? From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of MaiMaiPG Sent: Friday, August 26, 2011 8:42 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] FW: Keep Cats Indoors And who is going to take care of the cat if the owner isn't available? In many rural areas the cat will be taken to the pound or thrown out to take care of himself/herself. This is particularly hard for older cats. It is a judgment call that must be made with all factors considered and with the welfare of the cat in the front. On Aug 26, 2011, at 7:04 PM, Natalie wrote: I would seriously consider declawing very, very seriously- it is the most devastating thing for a cat. Knowing what I do, I would be more heartbroken doing it to a beloved cat than being without the cat, trust me. I wonder how a cat would feel if he/she knew that it had a choice between missing the owner or having their paws mutilated? According to Dr. Nicholas Doddman, who wrote The Cat that Cried for Help, after declawing surgery, cats feel such extreme pain that they either climb the walls of the cage or sit completely morose and cowering in the corner, something that their owners will never see. I have a copy of an article written for NY Times Magazine a few years ago, where a woman writes about declawing her older cat because her mother's oriental rug was being scratched up. It is one of my hand-out's to adopters - the story is heartbreaking, and very typical. After the hurricane is over, I will scan it and post it. It is probably the best I've read, without going into the gory details of declawing. Natalie From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Kelley Saveika Sent: Friday, August 26, 2011 7:22 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] FW: Keep Cats Indoors Sorry! This is a 62 email thread in gmail. I don't know how your email program organizes stuff. Anyway I did not look at the date. I've seen cats (especially senior cats) mourn their owners literally to death after being given away, and honestly in that case I'd rather declaw them. Hopefully I will not need to make that choice. On Fri, Aug 26, 2011 at 5:58 PM, Natalie at...@optonline.net wrote: OMG - you are responding to a post from March..I thought that I was going crazy and somehow missed a whole thread of talking about declawing, NOW! There are also some apartments that allow cats ONLY if they are declawed.I guess they prefer taking their chances of those cats peeing everywhere instead of possibly scratching something, and it would most likely be the tenants' own furniture! I would rather give my cat away than declaw it - especially when it's an older cat - it's so much harder on them (not that it isn't on young(er) cats). There needs to be a lot of education on declawing and what the psychological/emotional and physical effects can take be. We have had a few abandoned declawed cats, and I have witnessed almost all of them...but all the damage had already been done, and what was I to do - throw them out or kill them? I found some homes that understood the ramifications and dealt with the problems as well as they could. From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Kelley Saveika Sent: Friday, August 26, 2011 6:45 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] FW: Keep Cats Indoors Because if the owner has to go into the nursing home and is fortunate enough to find one where they can take their cat, the nursing home is likely to require declawing. On Wed, Mar 23, 2011 at 9:34 PM, Natalie at...@optonline.net wrote: That is true, but I don't understand why an old person can't have a cat with claws. Dealing mostly with feral cats, I have never been bitten or scratched - what's the danger, I am 70 yrs old. And as I said, bites are a natural defense for declawed cats! ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org -- Rescuties - Saving the world, one cat at a time. http://www.rescuties.org http://www.rescuties.org/ Vist the Rescuties stores and save a kitty life! http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/redirect-home?tag=rescuties-20 http://www.zazzle.com/rescuties* Buy or renew magazines and help our kitties! http://www.magfundraising.com/rescuties Please help Trooper! http://rescuties.chipin.com/trooper And it is the most divisive incivility to tell true animal lovers they can't complain about it, that they can't fight for the animals, that they should sit down and shut up and allow the killing to continue. - Nathan Winograd ___
Re: [Felvtalk] Vaccinations
My vet hates that vaccine - and the company that produces it is not very good or reliable, either! -Original Message- From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Lynda Wilson Sent: Friday, August 26, 2011 7:52 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Vaccinations They should no better than to give an FIV shot. Once administered they will then always test positive for it whether they have it or not!! Idiots! - Original Message - From: Lorrie felineres...@frontier.com To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Friday, August 26, 2011 4:50 PM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Vaccinations It's very bad practice to vaccinate cats while they are having surgery, but vets do it, so now I write out instructions not to vaccinate, and put it on the cat's carrier when I bring them for surgery. I give my cats their PCRC, way before they have surgery, but Rabies vaccinations are the law here, and only vets can give the injections. Once they are vaccinated I do not repeat vaccinations annually, and I just ignore the postcards I get saying it's time to vaccinate again. Lorrie On 08-26, Natalie wrote: Anyone who uses Petsmart's veterinary plan should be aware that they pump every possible vaccine into cats...it is most important to specify in the beginning which vaccines you want and especially which ones you do NOT want. My friend uses that plan because it does save a lot of moneyshe brought her two cats in, and she assumed incorrectly that they would get the same vaccines as the ones she specified at the last time, NOT! They got FeLV/FIV, God-know what elseshe was furious! She always tells them ahead of time that they are strictly indoor cats! ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] FW: Keep Cats Indoors
That's one of the questions that are listed in declawing info: Q: Is it painful? A: No, it is done under anesthesia. I say - DUH! You can't keep a cat on painkillers all their lives - and some cats do suffer pain ALL their lives. That's all I can tell you. If some people believe that their cats are just fine, they are deluding themselves and don't know how much more fine' that cat would have been without being mutilated! From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Kelley Saveika Sent: Friday, August 26, 2011 8:26 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] FW: Keep Cats Indoors It wouldn't be you going without the cat, it would be the cat going without you. I have seen cats given up by their owners grieve and mourn themselves TO DEATH. I've seen cats given away by their owners be fine. I've seen cats who have been declawed suffer. I have seen cats who have been declawed do absolutely fine. It isn't all as easy as it looks sometimes. I have not had a cat declawed but I did have one who had to have a mastectomy and who I am sure would have been in horrible pain had it not been for the oral pain meds the vet prescribed. I would hope any vet doing declaw surgery would provide pain meds. At any rate I'm 44 so hopefully it would be a while before I went into a nursing home. On Fri, Aug 26, 2011 at 7:04 PM, Natalie at...@optonline.net wrote: I would seriously consider declawing very, very seriously- it is the most devastating thing for a cat. Knowing what I do, I would be more heartbroken doing it to a beloved cat than being without the cat, trust me. I wonder how a cat would feel if he/she knew that it had a choice between missing the owner or having their paws mutilated? According to Dr. Nicholas Doddman, who wrote The Cat that Cried for Help, after declawing surgery, cats feel such extreme pain that they either climb the walls of the cage or sit completely morose and cowering in the corner, something that their owners will never see. I have a copy of an article written for NY Times Magazine a few years ago, where a woman writes about declawing her older cat because her mother's oriental rug was being scratched up. It is one of my hand-out's to adopters - the story is heartbreaking, and very typical. After the hurricane is over, I will scan it and post it. It is probably the best I've read, without going into the gory details of declawing. Natalie From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Kelley Saveika Sent: Friday, August 26, 2011 7:22 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] FW: Keep Cats Indoors Sorry! This is a 62 email thread in gmail. I don't know how your email program organizes stuff. Anyway I did not look at the date. I've seen cats (especially senior cats) mourn their owners literally to death after being given away, and honestly in that case I'd rather declaw them. Hopefully I will not need to make that choice. On Fri, Aug 26, 2011 at 5:58 PM, Natalie at...@optonline.net wrote: OMG - you are responding to a post from March..I thought that I was going crazy and somehow missed a whole thread of talking about declawing, NOW! There are also some apartments that allow cats ONLY if they are declawed.I guess they prefer taking their chances of those cats peeing everywhere instead of possibly scratching something, and it would most likely be the tenants' own furniture! I would rather give my cat away than declaw it - especially when it's an older cat - it's so much harder on them (not that it isn't on young(er) cats). There needs to be a lot of education on declawing and what the psychological/emotional and physical effects can take be. We have had a few abandoned declawed cats, and I have witnessed almost all of them...but all the damage had already been done, and what was I to do - throw them out or kill them? I found some homes that understood the ramifications and dealt with the problems as well as they could. From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Kelley Saveika Sent: Friday, August 26, 2011 6:45 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] FW: Keep Cats Indoors Because if the owner has to go into the nursing home and is fortunate enough to find one where they can take their cat, the nursing home is likely to require declawing. On Wed, Mar 23, 2011 at 9:34 PM, Natalie at...@optonline.net wrote: That is true, but I don't understand why an old person can't have a cat with claws. Dealing mostly with feral cats, I have never been bitten or scratched - what's the danger, I am 70 yrs old. And as I said, bites are a natural defense for declawed cats! ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] FW: Keep Cats Indoors
I will never use Banfield in Petsmart...oh the horror stories!! - Original Message - From: Natalie at...@optonline.net To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2011 8:10 AM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] FW: Keep Cats Indoors Benfield Health at Petsmart has a big promotion for kitten health which includes declawing. Many people think it's just a manicure, where nails are pulled out, which to me sounds like torture used by third world countries and barbarians. And many vets suggest it as an option when they learn that the cats will be inside only. I know several people who allowed, and still do, declawed cats outside. No good comes of it more often than not, and the ones that are OK are a fluke. -Original Message- From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Marcia Baronda Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2011 8:31 AM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] FW: Keep Cats Indoors My cats have destroyed my new furniture, but I love my cats much much more than I like my furniture, and declawing has never been an option at my house. I voice my opinion as much as possible on that subject. But I have found that some people think that just goes along with having a cat. What totally pisses me off is the ones that declaw and then decide to put them outside!! Sent from my iPad On Aug 26, 2011, at 11:06 PM, katskat1 katsk...@gmail.com wrote: Just add this to the consideration. To summarize, 'declawing' is a misnomer. When a cat is 'declawed' they are having their toes amputated at the first knuckle. Period. Now, think about you having all ten toes cut off at the first knuckle. Kat On 8/26/11, Gloria Lane gbl...@aristotle.net wrote: Problem is declawing is so harmful to adult cats- painful, hard to adjust to, it can ruin them. Not right for kittens, but for adults it's just mean, torturous. Just not a good thing to do. There are places that allow cats w claws but folks may not think bout that till the last thing. But then grandma or whoever dies or goes to an Alzheimer's facility and then who wants a cat ruined by declaw. Gloria Sent from my iPhone On Aug 26, 2011, at 7:25 PM, Kelley Saveika moonv...@gmail.com wrote: It wouldn't be you going without the cat, it would be the cat going without you. I have seen cats given up by their owners grieve and mourn themselves TO DEATH. I've seen cats given away by their owners be fine. I've seen cats who have been declawed suffer. I have seen cats who have been declawed do absolutely fine. It isn't all as easy as it looks sometimes. I have not had a cat declawed but I did have one who had to have a mastectomy and who I am sure would have been in horrible pain had it not been for the oral pain meds the vet prescribed. I would hope any vet doing declaw surgery would provide pain meds. At any rate I'm 44 so hopefully it would be a while before I went into a nursing home. On Fri, Aug 26, 2011 at 7:04 PM, Natalie at...@optonline.net wrote: I would seriously consider declawing very, very seriously– it is the most devastating thing for a cat. Knowing what I do, I would be more heartbroken doing it to a beloved cat than being without the cat, trust me. I wonder how a cat would feel if he/she knew that it had a choice between missing the owner or having their paws mutilated? According to Dr. Nicholas Doddman, who wrote The Cat that Cried for Help, after declawing surgery, cats feel such extreme pain that they either climb the walls of the cage or sit completely morose and cowering in the corner, something that their owners will never see. I have a copy of an article written for NY Times Magazine a few years ago, where a woman writes about declawing her older cat because her mother’s oriental rug was being scratched up. It is one of my hand-out’s to adopters – the story is heartbreaking, and very typical. After the hurricane is over, I will scan it and post it. It is probably the best I’ve read, without going into the gory details of declawing. Natalie From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Kelley Saveika Sent: Friday, August 26, 2011 7:22 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] FW: Keep Cats Indoors Sorry! This is a 62 email thread in gmail. I don't know how your email program organizes stuff. Anyway I did not look at the date. I've seen cats (especially senior cats) mourn their owners literally to death after being given away, and honestly in that case I'd rather declaw them. Hopefully I will not need to make that choice. On Fri, Aug 26, 2011 at 5:58 PM, Natalie at...@optonline.net wrote: OMG – you are responding to a post from March……I thought that I was going crazy and somehow missed a whole thread of talking about declawing, NOW! There are also some apartments that allow cats ONLY if they are declawed…I guess
Re: [Felvtalk] Vaccinations
There's some group somewhere doing research on the rabies vaccination and they have found that kittens vaccinated still had immunity in their system four years later. That's with the normal one year vaccine. They suspect there's immunity up to seven years later. I told my vet one time that if they require an animal to be vaccinated to be seen so then they vaccinate them during surgery or the day of the appointment it was stupid because it takes time for the body to develop an immunity after the vaccination so the vaccination done that day was useless. It doesn't offer protection for the animal being seen or for animals at the clinic that day. sent from my ATT Smartphone by HTC - Reply message - From: Marcia Baronda marciabmar...@gmail.com Date: Sat, Aug 27, 2011 12:31 am Subject: [Felvtalk] Vaccinations To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org felvtalk@felineleukemia.org That's just for the cash! That is so stupid and it shows what they really care about. Sent from my iPad On Aug 26, 2011, at 5:41 PM, Natalie at...@optonline.net wrote: There are some really stupid vets out there. If you bring in a sick cat that doesn't have an up-to-date rabies vaccine, many will insist that they cannot treat a cat without one, and insist on vaccinating before treating the sick cat. My vet does NOT! I know of one veterinary hospital that will NOT treat any cat that has never been vaccinated! -Original Message- From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Lorrie Sent: Friday, August 26, 2011 5:51 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Vaccinations It's very bad practice to vaccinate cats while they are having surgery, but vets do it, so now I write out instructions not to vaccinate, and put it on the cat's carrier when I bring them for surgery. I give my cats their PCRC, way before they have surgery, but Rabies vaccinations are the law here, and only vets can give the injections. Once they are vaccinated I do not repeat vaccinations annually, and I just ignore the postcards I get saying it's time to vaccinate again. Lorrie On 08-26, Natalie wrote: Anyone who uses Petsmart's veterinary plan should be aware that they pump every possible vaccine into cats...it is most important to specify in the beginning which vaccines you want and especially which ones you do NOT want. My friend uses that plan because it does save a lot of moneyshe brought her two cats in, and she assumed incorrectly that they would get the same vaccines as the ones she specified at the last time, NOT! They got FeLV/FIV, God-know what elseshe was furious! She always tells them ahead of time that they are strictly indoor cats! ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] Vaccinations
I wish that states would accept a titer, and allow vaccinations accordingly. But I sup[pose [people may not want to pay the extra money for it. From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of molvey...@hotmail.com Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2011 10:40 AM To: I wish that states would accept a titer, and allow vaccinations accordingly. But I sup[pose [people may not want to pay the extra money for it. Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Vaccinations There's some group somewhere doing research on the rabies vaccination and they have found that kittens vaccinated still had immunity in their system four years later. That's with the normal one year vaccine. They suspect there's immunity up to seven years later. I told my vet one time that if they require an animal to be vaccinated to be seen so then they vaccinate them during surgery or the day of the appointment it was stupid because it takes time for the body to develop an immunity after the vaccination so the vaccination done that day was useless. It doesn't offer protection for the animal being seen or for animals at the clinic that day. sent from my ATT Smartphone by HTC - Reply message - From: Marcia Baronda marciabmar...@gmail.com Date: Sat, Aug 27, 2011 12:31 am Subject: [Felvtalk] Vaccinations To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org felvtalk@felineleukemia.org That's just for the cash! That is so stupid and it shows what they really care about. Sent from my iPad On Aug 26, 2011, at 5:41 PM, Natalie at...@optonline.net wrote: There are some really stupid vets out there. If you bring in a sick cat that doesn't have an up-to-date rabies vaccine, many will insist that they cannot treat a cat without one, and insist on vaccinating before treating the sick cat. My vet does NOT! I know of one veterinary hospital that will NOT treat any cat that has never been vaccinated! -Original Message- From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Lorrie Sent: Friday, August 26, 2011 5:51 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Vaccinations It's very bad practice to vaccinate cats while they are having surgery, but vets do it, so now I write out instructions not to vaccinate, and put it on the cat's carrier when I bring them for surgery. I give my cats their PCRC, way before they have surgery, but Rabies vaccinations are the law here, and only vets can give the injections. Once they are vaccinated I do not repeat vaccinations annually, and I just ignore the postcards I get saying it's time to vaccinate again. Lorrie On 08-26, Natalie wrote: Anyone who uses Petsmart's veterinary plan should be aware that they pump every possible vaccine into cats...it is most important to specify in the beginning which vaccines you want and especially which ones you do NOT want. My friend uses that plan because it does save a lot of moneyshe brought her two cats in, and she assumed incorrectly that they would get the same vaccines as the ones she specified at the last time, NOT! They got FeLV/FIV, God-know what elseshe was furious! She always tells them ahead of time that they are strictly indoor cats! ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] Hurricane
so true,but this will only be for a day. keep the cats together,leave plenty of food,they should be fine.I know,believe me, I'm in NY .I didn't feel the earthquake,but a gas line broke out side my house. The fireman said I had to leave.I have alot more than 15 cats. But, I left ,locked my door,blessed myself,and said: please God don't let me lose my house or my furry family. I live for them.Everything was fine in a short time. --- On Sat, 8/27/11, Lorrie felineres...@frontier.com wrote: From: Lorrie felineres...@frontier.com Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Hurricane To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Date: Saturday, August 27, 2011, 8:15 AM Good for you. There is no way I'd ever abandon my cats, but the problem is I have 15 cats, and a small Suzuki compact car, so I'd have to rent or buy a van, which I'd definitely do. Lorrie On 08-26, dlg...@windstream.net wrote: Since Katrina, I have been accumulating carriers (have 7 cats). If I have to leave my home, they go with me. I have an Astro van and all I have to do is put the seats down and I have plenty of room for the carriers. I will leve my home and all else behind, but my cats go with me. I can sleep in the van with them. ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] Vaccinations
Some do...at least to a degree. One vet I asked charges almost $250 for a rabies titer and it has to be repeated yearly. On Aug 27, 2011, at 10:43 AM, Natalie wrote: I wish that states would accept a titer, and allow vaccinations accordingly. But I sup[pose [people may not want to pay the extra money for it. From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org ] On Behalf Of molvey...@hotmail.com Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2011 10:40 AM To: I wish that states would accept a titer, and allow vaccinations accordingly. But I sup[pose [people may not want to pay the extra money for it. Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Vaccinations There's some group somewhere doing research on the rabies vaccination and they have found that kittens vaccinated still had immunity in their system four years later. That's with the normal one year vaccine. They suspect there's immunity up to seven years later. I told my vet one time that if they require an animal to be vaccinated to be seen so then they vaccinate them during surgery or the day of the appointment it was stupid because it takes time for the body to develop an immunity after the vaccination so the vaccination done that day was useless. It doesn't offer protection for the animal being seen or for animals at the clinic that day. sent from my ATT Smartphone by HTC - Reply message - From: Marcia Baronda marciabmar...@gmail.com Date: Sat, Aug 27, 2011 12:31 am Subject: [Felvtalk] Vaccinations To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org felvtalk@felineleukemia.org That's just for the cash! That is so stupid and it shows what they really care about. Sent from my iPad On Aug 26, 2011, at 5:41 PM, Natalie at...@optonline.net wrote: There are some really stupid vets out there. If you bring in a sick cat that doesn't have an up-to-date rabies vaccine, many will insist that they cannot treat a cat without one, and insist on vaccinating before treating the sick cat. My vet does NOT! I know of one veterinary hospital that will NOT treat any cat that has never been vaccinated! -Original Message- From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Lorrie Sent: Friday, August 26, 2011 5:51 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Vaccinations It's very bad practice to vaccinate cats while they are having surgery, but vets do it, so now I write out instructions not to vaccinate, and put it on the cat's carrier when I bring them for surgery. I give my cats their PCRC, way before they have surgery, but Rabies vaccinations are the law here, and only vets can give the injections. Once they are vaccinated I do not repeat vaccinations annually, and I just ignore the postcards I get saying it's time to vaccinate again. Lorrie On 08-26, Natalie wrote: Anyone who uses Petsmart's veterinary plan should be aware that they pump every possible vaccine into cats...it is most important to specify in the beginning which vaccines you want and especially which ones you do NOT want. My friend uses that plan because it does save a lot of moneyshe brought her two cats in, and she assumed incorrectly that they would get the same vaccines as the ones she specified at the last time, NOT! They got FeLV/FIV, God- know what elseshe was furious! She always tells them ahead of time that they are strictly indoor cats! ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] FW: Keep Cats Indoors
metal is great too. Porch furniture can be used inside too. On Aug 27, 2011, at 8:20 AM, Natalie wrote: The best furniture is wooden futons..and bentwood chairs, that's what we have in the kitchen and the TV room, where most cats are. -Original Message- From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org ] On Behalf Of Lynda Wilson Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2011 8:45 AM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] FW: Keep Cats Indoors My thoughts exactly! - Original Message - From: Marcia Baronda marciabmar...@gmail.com To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2011 7:30 AM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] FW: Keep Cats Indoors My cats have destroyed my new furniture, but I love my cats much much more than I like my furniture, and declawing has never been an option at my house. I voice my opinion as much as possible on that subject. But I have found that some people think that just goes along with having a cat. What totally pisses me off is the ones that declaw and then decide to put them outside!! Sent from my iPad On Aug 26, 2011, at 11:06 PM, katskat1 katsk...@gmail.com wrote: Just add this to the consideration. To summarize, 'declawing' is a misnomer. When a cat is 'declawed' they are having their toes amputated at the first knuckle. Period. Now, think about you having all ten toes cut off at the first knuckle. Kat On 8/26/11, Gloria Lane gbl...@aristotle.net wrote: Problem is declawing is so harmful to adult cats- painful, hard to adjust to, it can ruin them. Not right for kittens, but for adults it's just mean, torturous. Just not a good thing to do. There are places that allow cats w claws but folks may not think bout that till the last thing. But then grandma or whoever dies or goes to an Alzheimer's facility and then who wants a cat ruined by declaw. Gloria Sent from my iPhone On Aug 26, 2011, at 7:25 PM, Kelley Saveika moonv...@gmail.com wrote: It wouldn't be you going without the cat, it would be the cat going without you. I have seen cats given up by their owners grieve and mourn themselves TO DEATH. I've seen cats given away by their owners be fine. I've seen cats who have been declawed suffer. I have seen cats who have been declawed do absolutely fine. It isn't all as easy as it looks sometimes. I have not had a cat declawed but I did have one who had to have a mastectomy and who I am sure would have been in horrible pain had it not been for the oral pain meds the vet prescribed. I would hope any vet doing declaw surgery would provide pain meds. At any rate I'm 44 so hopefully it would be a while before I went into a nursing home. On Fri, Aug 26, 2011 at 7:04 PM, Natalie at...@optonline.net wrote: I would seriously consider declawing very, very seriously– it is the most devastating thing for a cat. Knowing what I do, I would be more heartbroken doing it to a beloved cat than being without the cat, trust me. I wonder how a cat would feel if he/she knew that it had a choice between missing the owner or having their paws mutilated? According to Dr. Nicholas Doddman, who wrote The Cat that Cried for Help, after declawing surgery, cats feel such extreme pain that they either climb the walls of the cage or sit completely morose and cowering in the corner, something that their owners will never see. I have a copy of an article written for NY Times Magazine a few years ago, where a woman writes about declawing her older cat because her mother’s oriental rug was being scratched up. It is one of my hand-out’s to adopters – the story is heartbreaking, and very typical. After the hurricane is over, I will scan it and post it. It is probably the best I’ve read, without going into the gory details of declawing. Natalie From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Kelley Saveika Sent: Friday, August 26, 2011 7:22 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] FW: Keep Cats Indoors Sorry! This is a 62 email thread in gmail. I don't know how your email program organizes stuff. Anyway I did not look at the date. I've seen cats (especially senior cats) mourn their owners literally to death after being given away, and honestly in that case I'd rather declaw them. Hopefully I will not need to make that choice. On Fri, Aug 26, 2011 at 5:58 PM, Natalie at...@optonline.net wrote: OMG – you are responding to a post from March……I thought that I was going crazy and somehow missed a whole thread of talking about declawing, NOW! There are also some apartments that allow cats ONLY if they are declawed…I guess they prefer taking their chances of those cats peeing everywhere instead of possibly scratching something, and it would most likely be the tenants’ own furniture! I would rather give my cat away than declaw it –
Re: [Felvtalk] Vaccinations
Mine feels the same way :0) - Original Message - From: Natalie at...@optonline.net To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2011 8:55 AM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Vaccinations My vet hates that vaccine - and the company that produces it is not very good or reliable, either! -Original Message- From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Lynda Wilson Sent: Friday, August 26, 2011 7:52 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Vaccinations They should no better than to give an FIV shot. Once administered they will then always test positive for it whether they have it or not!! Idiots! ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] Hurricane
I will keep you and your furry friends in my prayers. Natalie at...@optonline.net wrote: I have to worry about 70+ cats - I think we're pretty safe from flooding, although we are below a pond and waterfall, and even with the few Nor'Easters, when pond overflowed, we never had water in the garage where a few cat condo are. I am worried about trees falling on the outdoor enclosure, so we will close them off this afternoon. Never mind what could happen when windows brake. -Original Message- From: felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Lorrie Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2011 8:15 AM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Hurricane Good for you. There is no way I'd ever abandon my cats, but the problem is I have 15 cats, and a small Suzuki compact car, so I'd have to rent or buy a van, which I'd definitely do. Lorrie On 08-26, dlg...@windstream.net wrote: Since Katrina, I have been accumulating carriers (have 7 cats). If I have to leave my home, they go with me. I have an Astro van and all I have to do is put the seats down and I have plenty of room for the carriers. I will leve my home and all else behind, but my cats go with me. I can sleep in the van with them. ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
