Re: thank you

2005-06-13 Thread Cherie A Gabbert
Kristi, We are all here for you, and I am sending positve healing vibes you way, please keep us informed. Cherie[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I just want to thank you all for your responses we are having many problems (with leuk) right now and she is just topping off my plate right now. Just hearing

Re: any one checked out petfinder lately

2005-06-13 Thread Cherie A Gabbert
My goodness gracious, I want them.too bad my son does not right now, but I am womrking on him, 10 or 11 kitties would be a good thing around here. Cherie[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: A bright, yet weird, moment in my dayThey are identical to my Val that has cancer- how weird!!It replaced a pic in

RE: Admin: Gentle reminder

2005-06-13 Thread James G. Wilson
Thanks Kerry (and everyone who wrote privately). Your kind words are much appreciated. I hope y'all will please join me in taking this opportunity to also salute others who've made this list and project what it is today. Belinda Sauro, Joan Doljan and Brenda Smith (among others) have dedicated

Bramble

2005-06-13 Thread Lomaxturtle
So sorry to hear of the problems that a couple of you have been having but thankgoodness the kittens temperature is normal. Bramble is still getting along although he his stools are loose (he has never covered it up properly since the day I got him - he just scratches at the tray instead of

RE: Bramble

2005-06-13 Thread MacKenzie, Kerry N.
Title: Message Wonderful to hear that Bramble is doing well, Michelle. And very glad to hear you had the benefit of another vet's input---and it was positive input. Continuing to send lots of healing vibes Bramble's way. take care, Kerry -Original Message-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

RE: Admin: Gentle reminder

2005-06-13 Thread Cherie A Gabbert
Wonderfully said, thank you James ;-)) Cherie"James G. Wilson" [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Thanks Kerry (and everyone who wrote privately). Your kind words are much appreciated. I hope y'all will please join me in taking this opportunity to also salute others who've made this list and project what it

Re: Vitamin C questions - Gloria

2005-06-13 Thread Del Daniels
Did you begin with 250 mg Vitamin C without kitty having diarrhea? Del - Original Message - From: Gloria Lane To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Sunday, June 12, 2005 6:40 PM Subject: Re: Vitamin C questions Hey there Del! Good point - absolutely, it can

Re:she's better, he's worse- aargh!

2005-06-13 Thread ferozar01
her dose oif flagyl was so small I actually compounded the med into a flavored liquid for her- she stikll hates it, but its only for 5 days, so we're already almost done. and her fever is still down today- so its official we won!!! on the other hand Val is worse, started the dex injection

bramble

2005-06-13 Thread ferozar01
I'm glad bramble is doing better, when my guys have residual diarrhea I mix in a little Hills WD to bind things up a little bit, it usually does the trick. Wishing you the best Kristi

Re: Angel Wings FELV+ cats

2005-06-13 Thread felv
Sorry, guys, I worked a long 10 hour day yesterday, and didn't get online, I'm back on it today! :) That's great Tad, and this has always been my concern, the rescue of the FELV+ cats from this "rescue". I will pass your letter on to Kara and Holly (those are the two local rescue ladies who

Re: FIP

2005-06-13 Thread Gloria Lane
Isn't FIP a mutation of one of the corona viruses based on the cats own genetic makeup, or something like that? Gloria On Jun 12, 2005, at 9:55 PM, catatonya wrote: I think they are saying now that it's really not that 'catchy' because it's caused by a corona virus that most cats are or

New Member

2005-06-13 Thread EWagner7701
Hello, I am new to this service, so I hope I am doing this right... We just found out that our 3rd and newest kitty is FeLV and FIV positive. I am really overwhelmed, and not sure what to do next. You all seem so wise with this subject, and seeing your responses makes things seem more hopeful. Any

Re: Vitamin C questions - Gloria

2005-06-13 Thread Gloria Lane
Yes, that's usually what I do - no problems that I can recall... Gloria On Jun 13, 2005, at 9:51 AM, Del Daniels wrote: Did you begin with 250 mg Vitamin C without kitty having diarrhea? Del - Original Message - From: Gloria Lane To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Sunday, June 12,

Re: New Member

2005-06-13 Thread Cherie A Gabbert
Weclome, I do not know about FIV but I do mix my positve FeLV kitty with my negatives. Indoors is great, hopefully we all can helpyouIs Tom sympomatic right now? Cherie[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello,I am new to this service, so I hope I am doing this right... We just found out that our 3rd and

Re: Re: FIP

2005-06-13 Thread ferozar01
from what i understand FIP is the body's response to the mutated corona virus. i think its the virus itself not the bodies genetics but the viruses. there are many corona viruses (kind of like breeds of cats) and every once in a while there is mutation (kind of like double paws). michelle

Re: Re: FIP - Good Explanation

2005-06-13 Thread Joan Doljan
http://www.winnfelinehealth.org/health/FIP.html[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: from what i understand FIP is the body's response to the mutated corona virus. i think its the virus itself not the bodies genetics but the viruses. there are many corona viruses (kind of like breeds of cats) and every once in

Re: Angel Wings FELV+ cats (FIV+ needs home)

2005-06-13 Thread felv
Thanks for the group link Tad, the photo album will come in very handy for this! This is Hoss: http://photos.groups.yahoo.com/group/aforeverhome/vwp?.dir=/Angel+Wings+Cats.src=""> Hoss is an FIV+ male cat the needs a new home or foster home. He was rescued from Angel Wings a few days ago.

Re: Admin: Gentle reminder

2005-06-13 Thread Lewis Faye
For those of you interested in subjects related to pets covered and not covered on this board, please feel free to visit a board that I host for Beliefnet. You can go to Beliefnet.com and click on discussions at the top of the page and then pets or, hopefully, you can click here:

RE: Re: FIP

2005-06-13 Thread Hideyo Yamamoto
Kristi, there is a really active support group for FIP - they are many many supportive educated people on the list - you might want to visit tem (it's [EMAIL PROTECTED] I think - Also, you might want to visit the below website - this is the excellent website for FIP - there is a doctor called,

RE: Re: FIP

2005-06-13 Thread ferozar01
thank you that info was great, her fever is gone, but i'm stll taking her in for some routine bloodwork because she is still always sleeping and very quiet- she doesn't play at all. I'm pretty sure she just needs to put some weight in and get her strength back- but better safe than sorry.

Re: FIP - Good Explanation

2005-06-13 Thread Gloria Lane
Thanks - interesting article - note re developing FIP: genetic susceptibility, the presence of cats that are shedders, and cat-dense environments. What are the factors that predispose a small percentage of cats with FECV to the development of FIP? Research is currently trying to

Re: fever down!

2005-06-13 Thread Lernermichelle
Kristi, that is such great news. Please keep us updated. You must be breathing a huge tentative sigh of relief. The antibiotics themselves can keep her feeling a bit under the weather and tired, if she is already weak and thin. The grooming isa very good sign. Michelle In a message dated

RE: fever down!

2005-06-13 Thread MacKenzie, Kerry N.
That is so good to hear, Kristi! Kerry -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, June 12, 2005 8:57 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: fever down! or maybe the thermometer is broken!!!??? I can't believe

RE: Admin: Gentle reminder

2005-06-13 Thread MacKenzie, Kerry N.
Agreed---a huge and heartfelt thank you to ALL of you. Kerry -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of James G. Wilson Sent: Monday, June 13, 2005 4:45 AM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: RE: Admin: Gentle reminder Thanks Kerry (and

RE: thank you

2005-06-13 Thread MacKenzie, Kerry N.
I'm so sorry to hear about your male kitty, Kristi. I'm glad he's in such wonderful hands for the rest of his life, however long that might be. big hugs to you and kitty, Kerry -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent:

RE: for Niki: Information

2005-06-13 Thread MacKenzie, Kerry N.
Title: Message Hi Niki, I think they were probably 6 months old when I got them started (they were about 3-4 months old when they found me). I don't know if there's a minimum age for starting them on interferon-- (maybe someone else can clue us in please?!) Re your moderator message,

Re: 6 week old kitten fever question

2005-06-13 Thread felv
I'd say, if the vet you work for can't answer that, I'd find a new vet for your cat, scary. All that aside: http://www.judithstock.com/Speaking_of_Animals/Fever_in_Cats/fever_in_cats.html http://www.the-cats-meow.ca/health8.html 106.5seems to be the point of critical injury and seizures

RE: Re: FIP

2005-06-13 Thread Hideyo Yamamoto
Please do - I will be sending a healing energy for your kitties! -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, June 13, 2005 10:09 AM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: RE: Re: FIP thank you that info was great,

Re: Angel Wings FELV+ cats

2005-06-13 Thread Tad Burnett
Hi Jenn Yes..I am in VT too..Mt.Holly..About 15 miles SE of Rutland on Rt 103... My garage is connected to the house via a screened in breeze way and I keep the 7 FeLV+ cats in the room that connects to the breeze way so its not a big problem to use the garage during warm weatherThat

Re: Bramble

2005-06-13 Thread felv
That's WONDERFUL Michelle, I'm so happy for you! I can see the injection site warning if your vet is still going against the recommended vaccine site locations, and doing them in the scruff, the topical spot on flea meds would be applied in the same spot. Scary indeed! We MUST get the

Grace Update IA for mouth problems

2005-06-13 Thread Nina
Hi guys, Thank you so much for the prayers and good wishes for Grace. She's feeling better today and I'm guardedly optimistic. I've got her on Interferon A and Transfer Factor (animal stress formula). I just ordered some feline complete TF, I'll let you know what I think. I don't know

Flagil - Metronidazole tastes bad!

2005-06-13 Thread Nina
Kristi and the users of Met, When Gypsy first had Flagil prescribed for her IBD symptoms, we got the tablet. It most certainly is horrid tasting. I know because nothing goes in my babies before I taste it myself. I'm here to tell you; yuk. So, I got it compounded and flavored. Mostly because

Newest replies about Angel Wings FELV+ cats (attn. Tad)

2005-06-13 Thread felv
I also have an offer to foster a large group of FELV+ cats from one of our members in Vermont: Super This is the concern. A positive test is a quick death sentence and even for the negatives that are running free with the positives. We won't euthanize them if you can find them

Re: Bramble

2005-06-13 Thread Nina
Michelle, Bramble and your family are in my thoughts and prayers, he's such a fighter! Can you tell if his sight is still slowly improving? Thank goodness his seizures seem to have stopped. I had read that not covering feces in the litter box can be indicative of status, (lower ranking

Re: Please send good energy Grace's way

2005-06-13 Thread Nina
Thank you Carla. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Sending healing vibes and thoughts towards Grace Carla

RE: she's better, he's worse- aargh!

2005-06-13 Thread Hideyo Yamamoto
Kristi, could you give her liver shake with a syringe I had to give it that way to Ginger when she stopped eating for two weeks I will be praying for your baby! Hideyo From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, June 13,

Re: for Niki: Information

2005-06-13 Thread felv
You can't use any stationary or send any pictures because it makes your messages too big. That's one reason why that might have happened. OR.. You might have a computer virus that is attaching itself to your emails. That's worst case scenario though.

Re:she's better, he's worse- aargh!

2005-06-13 Thread catatonya
Kristi, I hope Val goes peacefully as well. Until then I hope you can keep him comfortable. Hugs to you both. tonya[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: her dose oif flagyl was so small I actually compounded the med into a flavored liquid for her- she stikll hates it, but its only for 5 days, so we're

Re: Grace Update IA for mouth problems

2005-06-13 Thread felv
Here's a good germ killing mouth rinse for using for gum flare ups when infection is a concern: http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/prod_display.cfm?pcatid=2996N=2002+22759 It's a chlorhexidine solution. Might be good in addition to the Interferon (butdon't give themat the same time, cause

Re: New Member

2005-06-13 Thread catatonya
Hi Erika, Welcome the the list, although I'm sorry you had to find us. Right now it sounds like you're doing about all you can. How old is Tom? What ages are the others? If possible, I would keep them all inside for now. tonya[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello,I am new to this service, so I hope I

Re: Vitamin C questions (taste)

2005-06-13 Thread felv
I tried to use powdered Vit C, it's the Extra-C brand: http://store.yahoo.com/healthforyourpet/xtinviccopob.html But it tastes HORRIBLE, and I can barely make myself eat it without gagging... and was never able to get much inside a cat either. Do they all taste this bad?

Re: New Member

2005-06-13 Thread felv
Welcome to the group. I'm one of the ones here that does not feel it is necessary to separate FELV+ and negative healthy adult cats. I can give you my personal mixed house-hold story if it will help you come to a decision about it, let me know if you want to hear it. Are the other two cats

Re: Flagil - Metronidazole tastes bad!

2005-06-13 Thread Nina
That had occurred to me too! [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: MANY things made in Mexico really aren't what they claim to be. That may be why it didn't taste like Flagil... because it WASN'T! It's a huge problem down there, they have no authority over these things, so anyone can make anything and

RE: Vitamin C questions (taste)

2005-06-13 Thread Hideyo Yamamoto
Try sodium ascorbate form of V-C this is the only format that my cats will eat with the food it doesnt taste bad at all I sprinkle on their dry food and they eat with no problem, which is excellent is impossible to do with other type of V-C they all taste awful! You used to see this

RE: New Member

2005-06-13 Thread MacKenzie, Kerry N.
Title: Message Hello Erika Welcome from me too, and thank you for caring for little Tom and and wanting to do the best for him. Don't worry---you will find a ton of support and info from the wonderful folks here just like I did/do. I agree withTonya---best to keep them all indoors just now

Re: she's better, he's worse- aargh!

2005-06-13 Thread Nina
Kristi, I'm sorry to hear Val is not improving. Have you tried salmon oil sprinkled on top of babyfood, or milk replacer, to entice him to eat? Sometimes warming food will bring out the aroma enough to get them interested. Gypsy likes it when I lightly stroke her when she's thinking about

Re: Please Help!! 2 17y old healthy cats...NY/TONYA

2005-06-13 Thread Susan Loesch
I did, but I haven't had a reply. catatonya [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Susan, Did you email the man directly? I have lost his email addy. tSusan Loesch [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I haven't sent any of the other ideas but I emailed with an offer to take them - into FuRR (Feline Rescue and Rehome),

Drugs given to TeeCee

2005-06-13 Thread Stephanie E Caldwell
I was wondering if anyone here can look at some picturse of the meds they gave TeeCee when he was so sick and see how much is in the syringes? I had some problems and this looks like way more drugs than he ws supposed to have. Steph

Re: New member

2005-06-13 Thread EWagner7701
Tonya, We think Tom is about 3. He has been hanging around our house for about a year and a half, and has never looked like he was sick. We found out about the FeLV and FIV when we took him to see about having him come in permanantly. Tinkerbelle, our female, is 6 and Bernie, the other boy is 4. I

Nice Vet

2005-06-13 Thread Lomaxturtle
Nina I didn't ask where that vet practised although I wish I had and took him there. Bramble's sight has restored anymore - he seems to seemore when there is very little light but but not really see much at all when the light is on - I've kept the light down as much as possible for him - he

RE: 6 week old kitten fever question

2005-06-13 Thread Hideyo Yamamoto
Hi, I have to share my experience that its pretty common with fevers with unknown cause I had about a dozen of my cats going through the same experience all the blood work came back pretty normal, but some had a high fever over 106 my vets couldnt figure out whats wrong with them and

Re: dex/elspar- learned alot today...

2005-06-13 Thread Lernermichelle
Kristi, is there any way that your vet can consult with an oncologist, or that you can see one? Though it would probably take a long time to get an appointment with one and I know Val needs treatment right away if he has a chance of responding. I ask because I can share the protocol my

Re: Angel Wings FELV+ cats

2005-06-13 Thread TenHouseCats
i've got a fair number of transport contacts, if we get to needing them. -- MaryChristine AIM / YAHOO: TenHouseCats MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ICQ: 289856892

Re: RE: 6 week old kitten fever question

2005-06-13 Thread ferozar01
Hideyo- your experience seems similar to mine in regards to fevers of unknow origin, I just got so nervous because she was already on fever reducers. One of the 2 vets i work with actually does a samll amount of hollistic medicine and she feels as you spoke of. of fever's not always being bad

Re: she's better, he's worse- aargh!

2005-06-13 Thread Lernermichelle
Kristi, I hope that you will consider trying the dex and depo shots for at least a day or two before choosing euthanasia. They really can make a huge difference. It was unclear from your emails whether he got a dex shot today or not. If he got one and there is no response by tomorrow, then

Fwd: Check out Fever in Cats

2005-06-13 Thread Lernermichelle
this is a good website on fevers. My mom sent it to me when Ginger had a high fever. Michelle ---BeginMessage--- Click here: Fever in Cats ---End Message---

Re: New member

2005-06-13 Thread EWagner7701
Chris, That makes me feel better. Thank you. Did you have to do anything other than the vaccinations for the negative kitties? The vet told me that it can be passed if they eat from the same food dish. I assume yours do, and no problems? You are right that the FIV requires a puncture bite, so I am

Re: New member - Erika

2005-06-13 Thread Nina
Erika, Have your Tinkerbell and Bernie had their shots? I've heard and read that too, about FeLV being spread by mutual grooming, sharing food dishes and litter boxes. I guess somewhere, somehow that was documented, but a lot of the folks on this list mix, myself included, and none of my

yes-got injections

2005-06-13 Thread ferozar01
thanx michelle- sorry i was unclear- yes he did get dex depo. he actually got dex 2 x today. my vet wanted me to do it every 12 hrs. he will have a third injection tomorrow morning. the fact that he has actually gotten worse even with the injections on board is why my bfriend and I haved

Re: Fwd: Check out Fever in Cats

2005-06-13 Thread ferozar01
thanx for the fever website- nice and easy to understand the nitty gritty:) From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: 2005/06/13 Mon PM 08:54:40 EDT To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Fwd: Check out Fever in Cats this is a good website on

Re: Nina, ivermectin 4 earmites

2005-06-13 Thread Wheezercat42
I'm getting ready to do the ear mite annihilation thing myself again. I use.1 ml Ivermectin and .9 ml water per adult injected, and with the few who are eithervery hard to inject or who have health problems that make me nervous about introducing more meds into their blood streams (I havetwo

Limping Kittens??

2005-06-13 Thread catatonya
Am I confused, or did someone have a positive cat showing weakness in the rear legs? I saw this on another board. I don't know how old these kittens were, but old enough for s/n. tad [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:Yes--they pick up one of their paws--It is the calici virus--need to start them on clavamox

Re: Nina, ivermectin 4 earmites

2005-06-13 Thread Wheezercat42
Ivermectin can be bought without a prescription at farm supply stores. It'ssold as a cattle and pig wormer. I've been using the 1% solution made by Merck. The package says "ivomec injection". It comes in a 50ml bottle - so at .1 ml per adult, it'll last for about 500 doses. One of the

Re: Nice Vet

2005-06-13 Thread Nicholena Rushton
It is great to hear that Bramble is doing a bit better and I do think that you are much better off taking him to your regular vet. I will keep him in my prayers as always and sending him good vibes too Niki Ziggy - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To:

Re: Nina, ivermectin 4 earmites

2005-06-13 Thread Wheezercat42
BTW - I jumped in to the discussion after only reading one or two postings. I see that the doses and where to find it were already discussed. I have used it both injected and topically many times and have never had a bad reaction to it. I have 49 I'm treating now, and I've had over 200

Re: Nina, ivermectin 4 earmites

2005-06-13 Thread Nina
Kathy, Thank you for the specifics on dosing the Ivermectin! It's going right in the file. I can't believe the regiment of med dispersement at your house, God bless you! How do you ever get to leave the house? Nina [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm getting ready to do the ear mite

CLS Monday June 13, 2005

2005-06-13 Thread Belinda Sauro
Hi Al, Here is the service for this week. I hope all the sick furkids feel better soon. Take care all ... FeLV Candle Light Service http://www.bemikitties.com/cls -- Belinda Happiness is being owned by cats ... Be-Mi-Kitties ... http://www.bemikitties.com Post Adoptable

Re: New member

2005-06-13 Thread felv
Excuse my bluntness, but your vet seems like he is trying to scare you, rather than give you any sound and helpful advice. The FELV virus dies VERY quickly when exposed to air, such as in the dry kibble food dish or a well maintained litterbox. Very cautious sources claim that the virus

Re: Muffie

2005-06-13 Thread Sheila208
Muffie is great. Thanks for asking. I think she likes her new hairdo. She is getting along great with everyone, better than I expected. The dogs even seem to think she is okay! I guess she was just meant to be a part of this family. She is spoiled rotten already, and has become a picky eater very

Re: Muffie

2005-06-13 Thread catatonya
That sounds good to me! I was afraid she would be upset from the shave. Glad to know she's settled in and enjoying being spoiled. t[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Muffie is great. Thanks for asking. I think she likes her new hairdo. She is getting along great with everyone, better than I expected. The

Great News! Hartz is withdrawing their awful Flea and Tick Drops!

2005-06-13 Thread Gloria B. Lane
fyi - Hartz has signed an agreement with the EPA initiating the voluntary cancellation of the following products: Hartz Advanced Care 4 in 1 Flea and Tick Drops Plus for Cats Hartz Advanced Care 3 in 1 Flea and Tick Drops for Cats The drops will be available until spring 2006 when the company

Re: New member

2005-06-13 Thread EWagner7701
I have to thank you all for the advice. I never expected to get so much response. I want you all to know that you and your kitties are in my prayers. I would like to know how to join the FIV yahoo group. I haven't even begun to research that one! So far we are all doing well here! Tom officially

RE: New member

2005-06-13 Thread Chris
Well, after I stopped hyperventilating I did a whole lot of research and ended up with all sorts of opinions. FELV is a very old disease, probably not really noticed until fairly recently. My cat Tucson, who I got as a stray kitten, was tested very young was neg. Some five years later,

Re: Great News! Hartz is withdrawing their awful Flea and Tick Drops!

2005-06-13 Thread Mia Nicer
See all that hardwork did pay off!!! Mia Nicer Phone: (646) 226-3277 Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Discover Yahoo! Have fun online with music videos, cool games, IM & more. Check it out!

RE: New Member

2005-06-13 Thread Chris
Title: Message He came to give you joy Chris [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Nicholena Rushton Sent: Monday, June 13, 2005 10:41 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: New Member Erika:

Re: CLS-Belinda

2005-06-13 Thread Gloria B. Lane
Belinda, Would you add Smokey to the special needs list? A sweet young Siamese cat, lost. He was Susan's foster kitty, and a special cat. We I went out tonight looking for him and putting up flyers. Susan's also on this list. When his new person took a trip to Europe, her sons girlfriend

RE: New member

2005-06-13 Thread Chris
Just keep in mind my Tucson was an indoor cat since kittenhood;never exposed to pos cattested neg at about 6 weeks old turned up pos 5 years later. Tests of young kittens can be inaccurate. Chris [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL

Re: Great News! Hartz is withdrawing their awful Flea and Tick Drops!

2005-06-13 Thread EWagner7701
Wow! That is great news! I am not sure of exactly what the problem was, but I know that we used it when we found out that our Tom is + and the other 2 were exposed and it was terrible! When the defining moment comes, either you define the moment, or the moment defines you.