Re: [Felvtalk] Off topic, of interest to many: Webcast: Fixing the Feline Housing Crisis (how sheltertsd canb make cats sick!!!)

2012-10-16 Thread Kathryn Hargreaves
They make these available afterwards as videos:
http://www.maddiesfund.org/Resource_Library/Maddies_Video_Library/Shelter_Medicine_Videos.html


On Mon, Oct 15, 2012 at 3:57 PM, dlg...@windstream.net wrote:

 Will they ahve something in print for those of us who cannot go to this?
  Would like to take to local no kill shelter.  they ahve a problem with
 housing.  I know they ar short on funds, but constructive critismnever
 hurts.


  Natalie  wrote:  If anyone is interested, let me know, and I will
 send the entire page, how to register, with info privately; it’s too large
 to send to this group! My new email address is: atia@gmail.com  
   Fixing the Feline Housing Crisis: How Shelter Housing Can
 Make Cats Sick – And What You Can Do About It   It's a feline housing
 revolution – and it’s helping stop shelter cat upper respiratory infections
 in their tracks!Image removed by sender. large_box_bottom.gif   
 Image removed by sender. spacer.gifCats are extremely sensitive to
 noise, crowding, and stress – three things that are in abundant supply in
 many animal shelters. These adverse conditions often lead to illness in
 sheltered cats, particularly the most common of all feline shelter
 diseases, upper respiratory infection (URI).  The good news is that with a
 “feline wellness renovation project” – decreasing crowding and reducing
 stress – you can drastically cut the incidence of feline URI in your
 shelter's cat population.  Maddie's InstituteSM is pleased to announce the
 second in a two-part series on feline URI in shelters: Fixing the Feline
 Housing Crisis: How Shelter Housing Can Make Cats Sick - And What You Can
 Do About It. Join us for this free webcast on Thursday, October 25, at 9 PM
 Eastern, presented by Dr. Sandra Newbury of the Koret Shelter Medicine
 Program at the UC Davis School of Veterinary Medicine.   Attendees will
 learn:   * How to understand the natural behavior of cats  * How to set
 up shelter housing to reduce stress  * The importance of giving cats a
 place to hide when stressed or fearful  * The impact of housing cats near
 dogs  * How improvements in noise levels, light cycles, and enrichment can
 benefit cats  * Temperature, air quality and ventilation requirements for
 URI prevention  * How to understand exposure risks  * How to set up
 separation and isolation for sick cats   Individuals attending the live
 webcast will be entered in a door prize drawing for one of ten copies of
 Maddie's® Animal Shelter Infection Control Manual!  Fixing the Feline
 Housing Crisis: How Shelter Housing Can Make Cats Sick - And What You Can
 Do About It, is part of an ongoing series of educational programs from
 Maddie's Institute, a program of Maddie's Fund®, the nation's leading
 funder of shelter medicine education. Maddie's Institute brings cutting
 edge shelter medicine information from universities and animal welfare
 leaders to shelter veterinarians, managers and staff as well as private
 practice veterinarians, rescue groups and community members to increase the
 lifesaving of homeless dogs and cats community-wide.   _  
 Presenter: Sandra Newbury, DVM   

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-- 

Go Get a Life---Go Get a Shelter Animal!

If you can't adopt, then foster bottle baby shelter animal, to save their
life.  Contact your local pound for information.
http://www.laanimalservices.com/volunteer_fostercare.htm

If you can't bottle feed, foster an older animal, to save their life, and
to free up cage space.


Ask your local animal pound to start saving over 90% of their intake by
implementing the No Kill Equation:
http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/no-kill-equation/http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/

Here's the current growing list of true No Kill communities:
http://www.nokillhouston.org/no-kill-shelters-in-north-america/

Legislate better animal pound conditions: http://www.rescue50.org

More fun reading: http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/guides/

More fun watching: http://vimeo.com/nokill/videos especially
http://vimeo.com/48445902



Local feral cat crisis?   See Alley Cat Allies' for how to respond:
http://www.alleycat.org/page.aspx?pid=537
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Re: [Felvtalk] Nitnoy and felv

2012-10-16 Thread Terri Brown
So sorry.

Sleep sweetly, dear Nitnoy...

=^..^= Terri, Guinevere, Travis, Dori, Kimiko and 8 furangels: Ruthie, 
Samantha, 
Arielle, Gareth, Alec, Salome, Sammi and Siggie the Tomato Vampire 
=^..^=
  - Original Message - 
  From: dlg...@windstream.netmailto:dlg...@windstream.net 
  To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.orgmailto:felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
  Sent: Monday, October 15, 2012 6:07 PM
  Subject: [Felvtalk] Nitnoy and felv


  My Nitnoy crossed over today at 12:45.She had been with me since 2008, 
survived a raccoon biting of her tail and being FELV +.  There was nothing to 
idicate whaat was going on.  During the holidays, she was not doing well so 
took her to ER.  They did x-rays and complete bloodwork.  I had told them she 
was FELV+ but they did not seem upset that she was just 1 point low on red and 
white cells.  After the holiday, I took her to my vet as she was not improving, 
had not passed urine or stool.  First thing he did was look at her anal glands. 
 They were impacted and infected.  He cleaned them out and gave her Covina and 
we brought home Orbax to be given once daily.  Everything was much better, she 
was back to her self.  Then Friday, she began hiding, not eating or drinking so 
took her to vet on Saturday.  ONE THING SHE DID THAT STRUCK ME ODD - SHE TRIED 
TO EAT THE FIRBARK THAT MY ORCHIDS ARE PLANTED IN.  Sat when we got to vet, my 
dr was not there, but his wife (also a vet) was.  She said her lymph glands 
were slightly enlarged and gums very pale.  We did another blood panel.  Her 
white cells were .98 and her red blood cells were 3.2.  Kidney and liver 
functions were normal as were creatine and bun.  We thought about going to ER 
for transfusion, but she would have to stay over the weekend in a cage and we 
decided the stress would outweigh any good it might do plus her body might just 
kill the new blood and we would be right back where we started plus stress.  
Again, gave Covina shot and started again on Orbax.  I wanted to try a tonic 
that has worked wonders on cancers, etc.  Vet said ok but keep a record of what 
I did in case it worked.  She actually seemed to improve.  I was feeding with 
an eye dropper aruond 50 ml every hour (i can ad mixed with 3 cans hot water so 
she could swallow and also to egt fluids into her.  She got around 50ml of 
tonic also.  She took a turn for the worse this am at 3:30, but then seemed to 
get better.  She was breathing easier, heart was strong and she responded to my 
voice and touch.  By 12:45, she had gone completely the opposite direction.  I 
was holding her aganst me as she seemed to like the body warmth when she gasped 
3 or 4 times and the light in her eyes went out.  I knew she was going and I 
told her it was all right.  She held on with her claws, gave a sigh and that 
was all.

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[Felvtalk] Breathing issues

2012-10-16 Thread Maryam Ulomi
Hello,
Kitty, the kitten I rescued from a feral mother 6 weeks ago, is making some 
chirping like sounds now. She also does some meowing and those chirping sounds 
when she jumps around or plays. Is that anything to be concerned about?
Yesterday she did this not panting thing once and then again this am; I have an 
appointment to see the vet . But does anyone about such behavior?

Sent from my iPhone.
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Re: [Felvtalk] Breathing issues

2012-10-16 Thread Terri Brown
I don't think so.  I'm not an expert, but in my experience, these chirping 
sounds mean that kitty is inquisitive and happy.

My 2 cents.

=^..^= Terri, Guinevere, Travis, Dori, Kimiko and 8 furangels: Ruthie, 
Samantha, 
Arielle, Gareth, Alec, Salome, Sammi and Siggie the Tomato Vampire 
=^..^=
  - Original Message - 
  From: Maryam Ulomimailto:ava...@gmail.com 
  To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.orgmailto:felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
  Sent: Tuesday, October 16, 2012 7:54 AM
  Subject: [Felvtalk] Breathing issues


  Hello,
  Kitty, the kitten I rescued from a feral mother 6 weeks ago, is making some 
chirping like sounds now. She also does some meowing and those chirping sounds 
when she jumps around or plays. Is that anything to be concerned about?
  Yesterday she did this not panting thing once and then again this am; I have 
an appointment to see the vet . But does anyone about such behavior?

  Sent from my iPhone.
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Re: [Felvtalk] Breathing issues

2012-10-16 Thread Maryam Ulomi
Thanks, I do try to keep her happy and healthy.
I really hope the breathing issues are not some upper respiratory issues 

Sent from my iPhone.

On Oct 16, 2012, at 8:19, Terri Brown siggies...@hotmail.com wrote:

 I don't think so.  I'm not an expert, but in my experience, these chirping 
 sounds mean that kitty is inquisitive and happy.
  
 My 2 cents.
  
 =^..^= Terri, Guinevere, Travis, Dori, Kimiko and 8 furangels: Ruthie, 
 Samantha, 
 Arielle, Gareth, Alec, Salome, Sammi and Siggie the Tomato 
 Vampire =^..^=
 - Original Message -
 From: Maryam Ulomi
 To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
 Sent: Tuesday, October 16, 2012 7:54 AM
 Subject: [Felvtalk] Breathing issues
 
 Hello,
 Kitty, the kitten I rescued from a feral mother 6 weeks ago, is making some 
 chirping like sounds now. She also does some meowing and those chirping 
 sounds when she jumps around or plays. Is that anything to be concerned about?
 Yesterday she did this not panting thing once and then again this am; I have 
 an appointment to see the vet . But does anyone about such behavior?
 
 Sent from my iPhone.
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Re: [Felvtalk] Breathing issues

2012-10-16 Thread MaiMaiPG

My boys chirp when they see birds close up. 
On Oct 16, 2012, at 7:25 AM, Maryam Ulomi wrote:


Thanks, I do try to keep her happy and healthy.
I really hope the breathing issues are not some upper respiratory  
issues


Sent from my iPhone.

On Oct 16, 2012, at 8:19, Terri Brown siggies...@hotmail.com  
wrote:


I don't think so.  I'm not an expert, but in my experience, these  
chirping sounds mean that kitty is inquisitive and happy.


My 2 cents.

=^..^= Terri, Guinevere, Travis, Dori, Kimiko and 8 furangels:  
Ruthie, Samantha,
Arielle, Gareth, Alec, Salome, Sammi and Siggie the  
Tomato Vampire =^..^=

- Original Message -
From: Maryam Ulomi
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Sent: Tuesday, October 16, 2012 7:54 AM
Subject: [Felvtalk] Breathing issues

Hello,
Kitty, the kitten I rescued from a feral mother 6 weeks ago, is  
making some chirping like sounds now. She also does some meowing  
and those chirping sounds when she jumps around or plays. Is that  
anything to be concerned about?
Yesterday she did this not panting thing once and then again this  
am; I have an appointment to see the vet . But does anyone about  
such behavior?


Sent from my iPhone.
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felvtalk_felineleukemia.org

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[Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat

2012-10-16 Thread Alev Durmus
Dear all,

I feel for all of you who lost your cat(s). I have lost one too many and I 
can't bring myself to think losing another one. I would like to share something 
with you all and ask your opinions and advice since I am not originally from 
the US and I don't know how things go over here plus I might not be thinking 
straight because I am very upset. This happened on Saturday and I have been 
crying since...

I came across to this cat-we named her River-less than 2 weeks ago cross the 
road from my home in an unused shed. I usually don't look around but for some 
reason, I looked towards the shed and there she was looking at me...She was not 
moving a lot, sickly and skinny. I started feeding her, she ate a lot and 
became more energetic in 2 days. She had started wandering around since she 
wasn't starving anymore and I became afraid of coyotes killing her or cold 
weather coming soon. I called the local no-kill shelter to ask what to do. They 
told me to take pictures and uploaded on their facebook page in order to locate 
her owners. She definitely had owners once and probably was dumped...She was a 
very loving sweet cat. I suspected, being a house cat she didn't know what to 
do to feed herself and that's why she was in that shape. After a while she was 
so great, even if she was not in the shed, she would come running when I called 
her. A few days later
 shelter called and said they had an opening for her. This was a good timing 
because of freeze warning coming to our way. I already have another cat and I 
didn't want to bring her home without knowing that she is healthy...We-me and 
the kids-were so happy to bring her to safety. They asked me to sign a form 
saying that I gave all her rights to the shelter. I was puzzled but knowing 
that it was a no-kill shelter I was not that concerned. I put a note saying 
that I was not the owner and she probably had an owner...I asked a lot of 
questions, when would we know about her health, how can we adopt her, can I 
visit her etc.? I told them we were planning to adopt her but my husband needed 
to be convinced...They told me the vet would be coming on Thursday and the 
blood test would be back and she would be in pet finder after a while. They 
said no to visitation and no to adopting her right from the shelter...I said 
what if someone adopts her before we see the
 ad, please call me etc...And then we left. I didn't know that I brought her to 
her death by my hands thinking I was doing the right thing...

I called them Saturday and they informed me that they put her to sleep on 
Friday because she had FeLV+...I said why didn't you call? no answer...Between 
killing an animal and making a phone call they picked killing her. After I read 
online that there are many false positive on this test ( I don;t think anyone 
bothered to do the second test) and even if she was positive she could be 
living a long life in a one-cat household...I can't believe any animal lover 
would be that quick to kill one without exploring other options or calling 
someone-me- who showed extreme interest on saving this cat...Please anyone let 
me know if this is what they do in the shelters? Is there anything we can do to 
change their policy? She even gave me a line of  oh, you did such a good job 
taking care of her, she would have died if not for you

No one ever mentioned me killing the cat-never...If they did I wouldn't leave 
River there.

Please drop me a few lines, I am still crying and I think I owe this to River 
to at least question their actions...I can't even look over the shed which is 
cross the road from my home-impossible to avoid and couldn't even tell the kids 
what happened...

Thank you for all your help,
 


Alev 



 From: ter...@tazzys.org ter...@tazzys.org
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Sent: Tuesday, October 16, 2012 1:22 AM
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Nitnoy and felv
 

BTW...would like to add this nasty tumor grew so fast within one 
month before Taz passed. So we were pressed for time and had to do whatever it 
would take.

TAZZY'S ANIMAL TRANSPORTS/SIAMESE  COLLIE RESCUE
Sultan, WA. 98294
Terrie Mohr-Forker
http://tazzys.org/
Non-Profit national rescue
Dedicated to the welfare of animals.
 
 
Copyright © 1999-2012 tazzys.org. All rights reserved.
 
 
 Original Message 
Subject: [Felvtalk] Nitnoy and felv
From: dlg...@windstream.net
Date: Mon, October 15, 2012 3:07 pm
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org

My Nitnoy crossed over today at 12:45. She had been with me since 2008, 
survived a raccoon biting of her tail and being FELV +. There was nothing to 
idicate whaat was going on. During the holidays, she was not doing well so 
took her to ER. They did x-rays and complete bloodwork. I had told them she 
was FELV+ but they did not seem upset that she was just 1 point low on red and 
white cells. After the holiday, I took her to my vet as she was not improving, 
had not passed urine or stool. First thing he 

Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat

2012-10-16 Thread Beth


Alev -

I'm so sorry you had this experience. Unfortunately many no-kill shelters are 
really not totally no-kill - they do euthanize for FeLV  FIV, usually because 
they have no place to house/foster the positive cats. 

It is routine for shelters to make you sign all rights over to them. It usually 
will say in that ppw that they euthanize for FeLV  FIV.
It is also normal for you to have to go through the same adoption process as 
anyone else even if you were the one surrendering the animal.
It is crazy, though, that they would not call you  give you the chance to take 
the cat back or permanently foster her. However, their reasoning might have 
been that the cat had been outside  they were afraid you may re-release her 
with a contagious virus.

I had this happen with an FIV+ cat when I 1st moved into my neighborhood. I 
found the cat  he was injured. I already had 5 cats  could not take another, 
so I took him to a local emergency vet that had an injured stray program. 
They took in donations for injured strays  then adopted them out. When I 
called back to find out how he was they said he tested positive for FIV  they 
were going to euthanize him. I begged them to give me time to find someone to 
take him - I had a friend with an FIV+ cat. Unfortunately she could not take 
him. So I called the vet  said I would take him back. They then said NO - They 
could not trust that I would not let him outside again  he was contagious. I 
pleaded with them to wait for my vet's office to open the next day  have her 
vouch for me (they knew my vet well). She did  I was able to pick him up. He 
lived 10 healthy years with me.

BTW our shelter does NOT euthanize for FeLV or FIV. I foster FeLV cats for them 
 we actually rent a house for the FIV cats to live in.
You can see the FIV cat's FB page here:  
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Furkids-FIV-House/217196318335990?ref=tsfref=ts

Beth

 
Don't Litter, Fix Your Critter! www.Furkids.org
 



 From: Alev Durmus alev_dur...@yahoo.com
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Sent: Tuesday, October 16, 2012 11:15 AM
Subject: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat
 

Dear all,

I feel for all of you who lost your cat(s). I have lost one too many and I 
can't bring myself to think losing another one. I would like to share something 
with you all and ask your opinions and advice since I am not originally from 
the US and I don't know how things go over here plus I might not be thinking 
straight because I am very upset. This happened on Saturday and I have been 
crying since...

I came across to this cat-we named her River-less than 2 weeks ago cross the 
road from my home in an unused shed. I usually don't look around but for some 
reason, I looked towards the shed and there she was looking at me...She was not 
moving a lot, sickly and skinny. I started feeding her, she ate a lot and 
became more energetic in 2 days. She had started wandering around since she 
wasn't starving anymore and I became afraid of coyotes killing her or cold 
weather coming soon. I called the local no-kill shelter to ask what to do. They 
told me to take pictures and uploaded on their facebook page in order to locate 
her owners. She definitely had owners once and probably was dumped...She was a 
very loving sweet cat. I suspected, being a house cat she didn't know what to 
do to feed herself and that's why she was in that shape. After a while she was 
so great, even if she was not in the shed, she would come running when I called 
her. A few days later
 shelter called and said they had an opening for her. This was a good timing 
because of freeze warning coming to our way. I already have another cat and I 
didn't want to bring her home without knowing that she is healthy...We-me and 
the kids-were so happy to bring her to safety. They asked me to sign a form 
saying that I gave all her rights to the shelter. I was puzzled but knowing 
that it was a no-kill shelter I was not that concerned. I put a note saying 
that I was not the owner and she probably had an owner...I asked a lot of 
questions, when would we know about her health, how can we adopt her, can I 
visit her etc.? I told them we were planning to adopt her but my husband needed 
to be convinced...They told me the vet would be coming on Thursday and the 
blood test would be back and she would be in pet finder after a while. They 
said no to visitation and no to adopting her right from the shelter...I said 
what if someone adopts her before we see the
 ad, please call me etc...And then we left. I didn't know that I brought her to 
her death by my hands thinking I was doing the right thing...

I called them Saturday and they informed me that they put her to sleep on 
Friday because she had FeLV+...I said why didn't you call? no answer...Between 
killing an animal and making a phone call they picked killing her. After I read 
online that there are many false positive on 

Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat

2012-10-16 Thread Kathryn Hargreaves
What pound was this?

That's one of the only good things about the pounds around here is that
they don't test for FIV/Felv, so then they don't kill for it.   Of course,
I think they should test, and still not kill for it.

These are the open-admission No Kill (saving 90%+) shelters in the U.S.:
http://www.nokillhouston.org/no-kill-shelters-in-north-america/   Since
they made you wait for an opening, they are not open-admission by that list
compiler's standards.   There are many so-called no-kill (note the
lowercase letters) ``shelters'' that are not open-admission, and many say
they are no-kill even if they do kill, presumably to get donations.

The only way you can absolutely tell if a pound is a No Kill shelter is to
somehow get their intake/transfer/kill stats---sometimes via FOIA (Freedom
of Information Act).  If you're lucky, they post them on their website.

Most pounds in this country are just killing machines, unfortunately.   See
the bottom of my messages for how to change this.  Fortunately, now that
people know it can be done, they are demanding their pounds become No Kill
shelters.   All it will take is time.  Hopefully, in my lifetime.


On Tue, Oct 16, 2012 at 7:15 AM, Alev Durmus alev_dur...@yahoo.com wrote:

 Dear all,

 I feel for all of you who lost your cat(s). I have lost one too many and I
 can't bring myself to think losing another one. I would like to share
 something with you all and ask your opinions and advice since I am not
 originally from the US and I don't know how things go over here plus I
 might not be thinking straight because I am very upset. This happened on
 Saturday and I have been crying since...

 I came across to this cat-we named her River-less than 2 weeks ago cross
 the road from my home in an unused shed. I usually don't look around but
 for some reason, I looked towards the shed and there she was looking at
 me...She was not moving a lot, sickly and skinny. I started feeding her,
 she ate a lot and became more energetic in 2 days. She had started
 wandering around since she wasn't starving anymore and I became afraid of
 coyotes killing her or cold weather coming soon. I called the local no-kill
 shelter to ask what to do. They told me to take pictures and uploaded on
 their facebook page in order to locate her owners. She definitely had
 owners once and probably was dumped...She was a very loving sweet cat. I
 suspected, being a house cat she didn't know what to do to feed herself and
 that's why she was in that shape. After a while she was so great, even if
 she was not in the shed, she would come running when I called her. A few
 days later shelter called and said they had an opening for her. This was a
 good timing because of freeze warning coming to our way. I already have
 another cat and I didn't want to bring her home without knowing that she is
 healthy...We-me and the kids-were so happy to bring her to safety. They
 asked me to sign a form saying that I gave all her rights to the shelter. I
 was puzzled but knowing that it was a no-kill shelter I was
 not that concerned. I put a note saying that I was not the owner and she
 probably had an owner...I asked a lot of questions, when would we know
 about her health, how can we adopt her, can I visit her etc.? I told them
 we were planning to adopt her but my husband needed to be convinced...They
 told me the vet would be coming on Thursday and the blood test would be
 back and she would be in pet finder after a while. They said no to
 visitation and no to adopting her right from the shelter...I said what if
 someone adopts her before we see the ad, please call me etc...And then we
 left. I didn't know that I brought her to her death by my hands thinking I
 was doing the right thing...

 I called them Saturday and they informed me that they put her to sleep
 on Friday because she had FeLV+...I said why didn't you call? no
 answer...Between killing an animal and making a phone call they picked
 killing her. After I read online that there are many false positive on this
 test ( I don;t think anyone bothered to do the second test) and even if she
 was positive she could be living a long life in a one-cat household...I
 can't believe any animal lover would be that quick to kill one without
 exploring other options or calling someone-me- who showed extreme interest
 on saving this cat...Please anyone let me know if this is what they do in
 the shelters? Is there anything we can do to change their policy? She even
 gave me a line of  oh, you did such a good job taking care of her, she
 would have died if not for you

 No one ever mentioned me killing the cat-never...If they did I wouldn't
 leave River there.

 Please drop me a few lines, I am still crying and I think I owe this to
 River to at least question their actions...I can't even look over the shed
 which is cross the road from my home-impossible to avoid and couldn't even
 tell the kids what happened...

 Thank you for all your help,


 Alev



Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat

2012-10-16 Thread Beth
According to her email it wasn't a pound, it was a so-called no-kill shelter.
Pounds are usually owned by the local municipality.

 
 
Don't Litter, Fix Your Critter! www.Furkids.org
 



 From: Kathryn Hargreaves khargrea...@gmail.com
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Cc: Alev Durmus alev_dur...@yahoo.com 
Sent: Tuesday, October 16, 2012 12:19 PM
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat
 

What pound was this?  

That's one of the only good things about the pounds around here is that they 
don't test for FIV/Felv, so then they don't kill for it.   Of course, I think 
they should test, and still not kill for it.


These are the open-admission No Kill (saving 90%+) shelters in the 
U.S.: http://www.nokillhouston.org/no-kill-shelters-in-north-america/   Since 
they made you wait for an opening, they are not open-admission by that list 
compiler's standards.   There are many so-called no-kill (note the lowercase 
letters) ``shelters'' that are not open-admission, and many say they are 
no-kill even if they do kill, presumably to get donations.   

The only way you can absolutely tell if a pound is a No Kill shelter is to 
somehow get their intake/transfer/kill stats---sometimes via FOIA (Freedom of 
Information Act).  If you're lucky, they post them on their website.

Most pounds in this country are just killing machines, unfortunately.   See the 
bottom of my messages for how to change this.  Fortunately, now that people 
know it can be done, they are demanding their pounds become No Kill shelters.   
All it will take is time.  Hopefully, in my lifetime.___
Felvtalk mailing list
Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org


Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat

2012-10-16 Thread Kathryn Hargreaves
I (and others) use the term ``pound'' for all so-called ``shelters'' that
are not truly No Kill (saving 90%+).


On Tue, Oct 16, 2012 at 8:26 AM, Beth create_me_...@yahoo.com wrote:

 According to her email it wasn't a pound, it was a so-called no-kill
 shelter.
 Pounds are usually owned by the local municipality.


 Don't Litter, Fix Your Critter! www.Furkids.org http://www.furkids.org/


   --
 *From:* Kathryn Hargreaves khargrea...@gmail.com
 *To:* felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
 *Cc:* Alev Durmus alev_dur...@yahoo.com
 *Sent:* Tuesday, October 16, 2012 12:19 PM
 *Subject:* Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat

 What pound was this?

 That's one of the only good things about the pounds around here is that
 they don't test for FIV/Felv, so then they don't kill for it.   Of course,
 I think they should test, and still not kill for it.

 These are the open-admission No Kill (saving 90%+) shelters in the U.S.:
 http://www.nokillhouston.org/no-kill-shelters-in-north-america/   Since
 they made you wait for an opening, they are not open-admission by that list
 compiler's standards.   There are many so-called no-kill (note the
 lowercase letters) ``shelters'' that are not open-admission, and many say
 they are no-kill even if they do kill, presumably to get donations.

 The only way you can absolutely tell if a pound is a No Kill shelter is to
 somehow get their intake/transfer/kill stats---sometimes via FOIA (Freedom
 of Information Act).  If you're lucky, they post them on their website.

 Most pounds in this country are just killing machines, unfortunately.
 See the bottom of my messages for how to change this.  Fortunately, now
 that people know it can be done, they are demanding their pounds become No
 Kill shelters.   All it will take is time.  Hopefully, in my lifetime.




 ___
 Felvtalk mailing list
 Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
 http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org




-- 

Go Get a Life---Go Get a Shelter Animal!

If you can't adopt, then foster bottle baby shelter animal, to save their
life.  Contact your local pound for information.
http://www.laanimalservices.com/volunteer_fostercare.htm

If you can't bottle feed, foster an older animal, to save their life, and
to free up cage space.


Ask your local animal pound to start saving over 90% of their intake by
implementing the No Kill Equation:
http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/no-kill-equation/http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/

Here's the current growing list of true No Kill communities:
http://www.nokillhouston.org/no-kill-shelters-in-north-america/

Legislate better animal pound conditions: http://www.rescue50.org

More fun reading: http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/guides/

More fun watching: http://vimeo.com/nokill/videos especially
http://vimeo.com/48445902



Local feral cat crisis?   See Alley Cat Allies' for how to respond:
http://www.alleycat.org/page.aspx?pid=537
___
Felvtalk mailing list
Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org


Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat

2012-10-16 Thread Alev Durmus
They may call themselves a shelter but killing the animals dragged them down 
to a level of  a pound I would call them a death camp if you ask me...
This shelter/pound I brought River is a charity organization I believe and 
works with donations. 
 

Alev 



 From: Beth create_me_...@yahoo.com
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Sent: Tuesday, October 16, 2012 12:26 PM
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat
 

According to her email it wasn't a pound, it was a so-called no-kill shelter.
Pounds are usually owned by the local municipality.

 
 
Don't Litter, Fix Your Critter! www.Furkids.org
 



 From: Kathryn Hargreaves khargrea...@gmail.com
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Cc: Alev Durmus alev_dur...@yahoo.com 
Sent: Tuesday, October 16, 2012 12:19 PM
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat
 

What pound was this?  

That's one of the only good things about the pounds around here is that they 
don't test for FIV/Felv, so then they don't kill for it.   Of course, I think 
they should test, and still not kill for it.


These are the open-admission No Kill (saving 90%+) shelters in the 
U.S.: http://www.nokillhouston.org/no-kill-shelters-in-north-america/   Since 
they made you wait for an opening, they are not open-admission by that list 
compiler's standards.   There are many so-called no-kill (note the lowercase 
letters) ``shelters'' that are not open-admission, and many say they are 
no-kill even if they do kill, presumably to get donations.   

The only way you can absolutely tell if a pound is a No Kill shelter is to 
somehow get their intake/transfer/kill stats---sometimes via FOIA (Freedom of 
Information Act).  If you're lucky, they post them on their website.

Most pounds in this country are just killing machines, unfortunately.   See the 
bottom of my messages for how to change this.  Fortunately, now that people 
know it can be done, they are demanding their pounds become No Kill shelters.   
All it will take is time.  Hopefully, in my lifetime.



___
Felvtalk mailing list
Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org___
Felvtalk mailing list
Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org


Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat

2012-10-16 Thread Kathryn Hargreaves
Yes, that term is bandied about, too.

On Tue, Oct 16, 2012 at 8:38 AM, Alev Durmus alev_dur...@yahoo.com wrote:

 They may call themselves a shelter but killing the animals dragged them
 down to a level of  a pound I would call them a death camp if you ask
 me...
 This shelter/pound I brought River is a charity organization I believe and
 works with donations.


 Alev
   --
 *From:* Beth create_me_...@yahoo.com
 *To:* felvtalk@felineleukemia.org felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
 *Sent:* Tuesday, October 16, 2012 12:26 PM

 *Subject:* Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat

 According to her email it wasn't a pound, it was a so-called no-kill
 shelter.
 Pounds are usually owned by the local municipality.


 Don't Litter, Fix Your Critter! www.Furkids.org http://www.furkids.org/


   --
 *From:* Kathryn Hargreaves khargrea...@gmail.com
 *To:* felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
 *Cc:* Alev Durmus alev_dur...@yahoo.com
 *Sent:* Tuesday, October 16, 2012 12:19 PM
 *Subject:* Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat

 What pound was this?

 That's one of the only good things about the pounds around here is that
 they don't test for FIV/Felv, so then they don't kill for it.   Of course,
 I think they should test, and still not kill for it.

 These are the open-admission No Kill (saving 90%+) shelters in the U.S.:
 http://www.nokillhouston.org/no-kill-shelters-in-north-america/   Since
 they made you wait for an opening, they are not open-admission by that list
 compiler's standards.   There are many so-called no-kill (note the
 lowercase letters) ``shelters'' that are not open-admission, and many say
 they are no-kill even if they do kill, presumably to get donations.

 The only way you can absolutely tell if a pound is a No Kill shelter is to
 somehow get their intake/transfer/kill stats---sometimes via FOIA (Freedom
 of Information Act).  If you're lucky, they post them on their website.

 Most pounds in this country are just killing machines, unfortunately.
 See the bottom of my messages for how to change this.  Fortunately, now
 that people know it can be done, they are demanding their pounds become No
 Kill shelters.   All it will take is time.  Hopefully, in my lifetime.




 ___
 Felvtalk mailing list
 Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
 http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org



 ___
 Felvtalk mailing list
 Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
 http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org




-- 

Go Get a Life---Go Get a Shelter Animal!

If you can't adopt, then foster bottle baby shelter animal, to save their
life.  Contact your local pound for information.
http://www.laanimalservices.com/volunteer_fostercare.htm

If you can't bottle feed, foster an older animal, to save their life, and
to free up cage space.


Ask your local animal pound to start saving over 90% of their intake by
implementing the No Kill Equation:
http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/no-kill-equation/http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/

Here's the current growing list of true No Kill communities:
http://www.nokillhouston.org/no-kill-shelters-in-north-america/

Legislate better animal pound conditions: http://www.rescue50.org

More fun reading: http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/guides/

More fun watching: http://vimeo.com/nokill/videos especially
http://vimeo.com/48445902



Local feral cat crisis?   See Alley Cat Allies' for how to respond:
http://www.alleycat.org/page.aspx?pid=537
___
Felvtalk mailing list
Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org


[Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat

2012-10-16 Thread Christiane Biagi
The caveat to the no kill (as defined in the Asilomar Accords) is that all
it means is they will not kill adoptable animals.  Unfortunately, its up to
the individual shelter/rescue to define what they consider adoptable.  All
too often, facilities that advertise themselves as no kill really mean
that they will kill all ill, senior, problem behavior, etc. animals but
never kill a healthy easily adoptable animals.  These kinds of facilities
never ever publish their euthanasia matrix which is where they define
their policy on who they will kill.  True no kills (as we think it means 
as defined by Nathan Winograd) are tough to find.  I volunteer for one such
shelter in New Orleans (ARNO)  the handful of animals they've put down have
been terminally ill animals who were either comatose or in intractable pain.
They never put down for fiv or felv!  

 

The shelter you cited clearly is a kill shelter  why they wouldn't have
alerted you to the cat's test results  given you some time demonstrates an
attitude that is unfortunately all too common.  I'm so sorry this happened
to you but please know that River had love from you-something she likely
hadn't had in a very long time.

 

From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of
Alev Durmus
Sent: Tuesday, October 16, 2012 11:15 AM
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Subject: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat

 

 

___
Felvtalk mailing list
Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
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Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat

2012-10-16 Thread Kathryn Hargreaves
Yes, and some have even gone so far as to define ``adoptable'' as those for
which they have cages!  Outta space, outta luck.


As Christine probably knows, there are over 200 cities/towns that are now
No Kill.  As for No Kill places being hard to find, at least someone is
looking for them.   In fact, I just realized that my link to the No Kill
communities list is outdated and should be replaced with this, which is the
above someone's blog:

Here's the current growing list of true No Kill communities:
http://www.no-killnews.com/http://www.nokillhouston.org/no-kill-shelters-in-north-america/
(see
the right sidebar)



On Tue, Oct 16, 2012 at 8:49 AM, Christiane Biagi ti...@mindspring.comwrote:

 The caveat to the “no kill” (as defined in the Asilomar Accords) is that
 all it means is they will not kill adoptable animals.  Unfortunately, its
 up to the individual shelter/rescue to define what they consider
 “adoptable”.  All too often, facilities that advertise themselves as “no
 kill” really mean that they will kill all ill, senior, problem behavior,
 etc. animals but never kill a healthy easily adoptable animals.  These
 kinds of facilities never ever publish their euthanasia matrix” which is
 where they define their policy on who they will kill.  True no kills (as we
 think it means  as defined by Nathan Winograd) are tough to find.  I
 volunteer for one such shelter in New Orleans (ARNO)  the handful of
 animals they’ve put down have been terminally ill animals who were either
 comatose or in intractable pain.  They never put down for fiv or felv!  **
 **

 ** **

 The shelter you cited clearly is a kill shelter  why they wouldn’t have
 alerted you to the cat’s test results  given you some time demonstrates an
 attitude that is unfortunately all too common.  I’m so sorry this happened
 to you but please know that River had love from you—something she likely
 hadn’t had in a very long time.

 ** **

 *From:* Felvtalk 
 [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.orgfelvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org]
 *On Behalf Of *Alev Durmus
 *Sent:* Tuesday, October 16, 2012 11:15 AM
 *To:* felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
 *Subject:* [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat

 ** **

 ** **

 ___
 Felvtalk mailing list
 Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
 http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org




-- 

Go Get a Life---Go Get a Shelter Animal!

If you can't adopt, then foster bottle baby shelter animal, to save their
life.  Contact your local pound for information.
http://www.laanimalservices.com/volunteer_fostercare.htm

If you can't bottle feed, foster an older animal, to save their life, and
to free up cage space.


Ask your local animal pound to start saving over 90% of their intake by
implementing the No Kill Equation:
http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/no-kill-equation/http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/

Here's the current growing list of true No Kill communities:
http://www.nokillhouston.org/no-kill-shelters-in-north-america/

Legislate better animal pound conditions: http://www.rescue50.org

More fun reading: http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/guides/

More fun watching: http://vimeo.com/nokill/videos especially
http://vimeo.com/48445902



Local feral cat crisis?   See Alley Cat Allies' for how to respond:
http://www.alleycat.org/page.aspx?pid=537
___
Felvtalk mailing list
Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org


Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat

2012-10-16 Thread CATHERINE DIDONNA
around here doesn't say where you are??

From: Kathryn Hargreaves khargrea...@gmail.com
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Sent: Tuesday, October 16, 2012 12:29 PM
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat


I (and others) use the term ``pound'' for all so-called ``shelters'' that are 
not truly No Kill (saving 90%+).   



On Tue, Oct 16, 2012 at 8:26 AM, Beth create_me_...@yahoo.com wrote:

According to her email it wasn't a pound, it was a so-called no-kill shelter.
Pounds are usually owned by the local municipality.




Don't Litter, Fix Your Critter! http://www.furkids.org/
 


From: Kathryn Hargreaves khargrea...@gmail.com
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Cc: Alev Durmus alev_dur...@yahoo.com 
Sent: Tuesday, October 16, 2012 12:19 PM
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat



What pound was this?   


That's one of the only good things about the pounds around here is that they 
don't test for FIV/Felv, so then they don't kill for it.   Of course, I think 
they should test, and still not kill for it.


These are the open-admission No Kill (saving 90%+) shelters in the 
U.S.: http://www.nokillhouston.org/no-kill-shelters-in-north-america/   Since 
they made you wait for an opening, they are not open-admission by that list 
compiler's standards.   There are many so-called no-kill (note the lowercase 
letters) ``shelters'' that are not open-admission, and many say they are 
no-kill even if they do kill, presumably to get donations.   


The only way you can absolutely tell if a pound is a No Kill shelter is to 
somehow get their intake/transfer/kill stats---sometimes via FOIA (Freedom of 
Information Act).  If you're lucky, they post them on their website.


Most pounds in this country are just killing machines, unfortunately.   See 
the bottom of my messages for how to change this.  Fortunately, now that 
people know it can be done, they are demanding their pounds become No Kill 
shelters.   All it will take is time.  Hopefully, in my lifetime.





___
Felvtalk mailing list
Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org




-- 

Go Get a Life---Go Get a Shelter Animal! 

If you can't adopt, then foster bottle baby shelter animal, to save their 
life.  Contact your local pound for information.  


If you can't bottle feed, foster an older animal, to save their life, and to 
free up cage space.

Ask your local animal pound to start saving over 90% of their intake by 
implementing the No Kill Equation: http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/

Here's the current growing list of true No Kill communities: 
http://www.nokillhouston.org/no-kill-shelters-in-north-america/

Legislate better animal pound conditions: http://www.rescue50.org

More fun reading: http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/guides/

More fun watching: 
http://vimeo.com/nokill/videos especially http://vimeo.com/48445902




Local feral cat crisis?   See Alley Cat Allies' for how to 
respond: http://www.alleycat.org/page.aspx?pid=537

___
Felvtalk mailing list
Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org___
Felvtalk mailing list
Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org


Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat

2012-10-16 Thread Alev Durmus
Hi Christiane,

Thank you so much...I am so sorry to find out about all these a little too 
late...Yes, they show kittens, young cats, but very few seniors on their 
website for adoption...They are a kill shelter and people do not know this. 
People are happily donating money thinking they are helping the animals, but 
they are helping them to be killed too. What can I do to change this? I want to 
send them an email, what should I say? I want to say the right things and not 
sound like a crazy woman...

Thank you so much for your kind words, maybe River will be the reason that this 
shelter does something about their policy. You (and the animals in that area) 
are very lucky. Take care,
 
Alev



 From: Christiane Biagi ti...@mindspring.com
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Sent: Tuesday, October 16, 2012 12:49 PM
Subject: [Felvtalk]  No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat
 

The caveat to the “no kill” (as defined in the Asilomar Accords) is that all it 
means is they will not kill adoptable animals.  Unfortunately, its up to the 
individual shelter/rescue to define what they consider “adoptable”.  All too 
often, facilities that advertise themselves as “no kill” really mean that they 
will kill all ill, senior, problem behavior, etc. animals but never kill a 
healthy easily adoptable animals.  These kinds of facilities never ever publish 
their euthanasia matrix” which is where they define their policy on who they 
will kill.  True no kills (as we think it means  as defined by Nathan 
Winograd) are tough to find.  I volunteer for one such shelter in New Orleans 
(ARNO)  the handful of animals they’ve put down have been terminally ill 
animals who were either comatose or in intractable pain.  They never put down 
for fiv or felv!  
 
The shelter you cited clearly is a kill shelter  why they wouldn’t have 
alerted you to the cat’s test results  given you some time demonstrates an 
attitude that is unfortunately all too common.  I’m so sorry this happened to 
you but please know that River had love from you—something she likely hadn’t 
had in a very long time.
 
From:Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Alev 
Durmus
Sent: Tuesday, October 16, 2012 11:15 AM
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Subject: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat
 
 
___
Felvtalk mailing list
Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org___
Felvtalk mailing list
Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org


Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat

2012-10-16 Thread Kathryn Hargreaves
Los Angeles.  Neither the city not the county pounds test.


On Tue, Oct 16, 2012 at 9:11 AM, CATHERINE DIDONNA westnint...@yahoo.comwrote:

 around here doesn't say where you are??

   *From:* Kathryn Hargreaves khargrea...@gmail.com
 *To:* felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
 *Sent:* Tuesday, October 16, 2012 12:29 PM

 *Subject:* Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat

 I (and others) use the term ``pound'' for all so-called ``shelters'' that
 are not truly No Kill (saving 90%+).


 On Tue, Oct 16, 2012 at 8:26 AM, Beth create_me_...@yahoo.com wrote:

  According to her email it wasn't a pound, it was a so-called no-kill
 shelter.
 Pounds are usually owned by the local municipality.


 Don't Litter, Fix Your Critter! http://www.furkids.org/


*From:* Kathryn Hargreaves khargrea...@gmail.com
 *To:* felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
 *Cc:* Alev Durmus alev_dur...@yahoo.com
 *Sent:* Tuesday, October 16, 2012 12:19 PM
 *Subject:* Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat

 What pound was this?

 That's one of the only good things about the pounds around here is that
 they don't test for FIV/Felv, so then they don't kill for it.   Of course,
 I think they should test, and still not kill for it.

 These are the open-admission No Kill (saving 90%+) shelters in the U.S.:
 http://www.nokillhouston.org/no-kill-shelters-in-north-america/   Since
 they made you wait for an opening, they are not open-admission by that list
 compiler's standards.   There are many so-called no-kill (note the
 lowercase letters) ``shelters'' that are not open-admission, and many say
 they are no-kill even if they do kill, presumably to get donations.

 The only way you can absolutely tell if a pound is a No Kill shelter is to
 somehow get their intake/transfer/kill stats---sometimes via FOIA (Freedom
 of Information Act).  If you're lucky, they post them on their website.

 Most pounds in this country are just killing machines, unfortunately.
 See the bottom of my messages for how to change this.  Fortunately, now
 that people know it can be done, they are demanding their pounds become No
 Kill shelters.   All it will take is time.  Hopefully, in my lifetime.




 ___
 Felvtalk mailing list
 Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
 http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org




 --
 
 Go Get a Life---Go Get a Shelter Animal!

 If you can't adopt, then foster bottle baby shelter animal, to save
 their life.  Contact your local pound for information. 
 http://www.laanimalservices.com/volunteer_fostercare.htm

 If you can't bottle feed, foster an older animal, to save their life, and
 to free up cage space.


 Ask your local animal pound to start saving over 90% of their intake by
 implementing the No Kill Equation: http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/

 Here's the current growing list of true No Kill communities:
 http://www.nokillhouston.org/no-kill-shelters-in-north-america/

 Legislate better animal pound conditions: http://www.rescue50.org

 More fun reading:
 http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/guides/

 More fun watching: http://vimeo.com/nokill/videos especially
 http://vimeo.com/48445902



 Local feral cat crisis?   See Alley Cat Allies' for how to respond:
 http://www.alleycat.org/page.aspx?pid=537


 ___
 Felvtalk mailing list
 Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
 http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org



 ___
 Felvtalk mailing list
 Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
 http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org




-- 

Go Get a Life---Go Get a Shelter Animal!

If you can't adopt, then foster bottle baby shelter animal, to save their
life.  Contact your local pound for information.
http://www.laanimalservices.com/volunteer_fostercare.htm

If you can't bottle feed, foster an older animal, to save their life, and
to free up cage space.


Ask your local animal pound to start saving over 90% of their intake by
implementing the No Kill Equation:
http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/no-kill-equation/http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/

Here's the current growing list of true No Kill communities:
http://www.no-killnews.com/http://www.nokillhouston.org/no-kill-shelters-in-north-america/
(see
the right sidebar)

Legislate better animal pound conditions: http://www.rescue50.org

More fun reading: http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/guides/

More fun watching: http://vimeo.com/nokill/videos especially
http://vimeo.com/48445902



Local feral cat crisis?   See Alley Cat Allies' for how to respond:
http://www.alleycat.org/page.aspx?pid=537
___
Felvtalk mailing list
Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org


Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat

2012-10-16 Thread Alev Durmus
Thank you Kathryn,

I signed the Houston petition already...I hope you guys get enough people on 
time. I checked the list, it was not in it before. I will check the new one 
too. I am thinking to send them an email about what I think of them and send a 
FB messages to people around town to warn that this shelter is not no-kill I 
don't know what else I can do?

Thank you so much to you all for all you support and info, really, sharing this 
with you made me cry more but better than holding in...
 

Alev 



 From: Kathryn Hargreaves khargrea...@gmail.com
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Sent: Tuesday, October 16, 2012 1:07 PM
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat
 

Yes, and some have even gone so far as to define ``adoptable'' as those for 
which they have cages!  Outta space, outta luck.


As Christine probably knows, there are over 200 cities/towns that are now No 
Kill.  As for No Kill places being hard to find, at least someone is looking 
for them.   In fact, I just realized that my link to the No Kill communities 
list is outdated and should be replaced with this, which is the above someone's 
blog:

Here's the current growing list of true No Kill 
communities: http://www.nokillhouston.org/no-kill-shelters-in-north-america/ (see
 the right sidebar)





On Tue, Oct 16, 2012 at 8:49 AM, Christiane Biagi ti...@mindspring.com wrote:

The caveat to the “no kill” (as defined in the Asilomar Accords) is that all it 
means is they will not kill adoptable animals.  Unfortunately, its up to the 
individual shelter/rescue to define what they consider “adoptable”.  All too 
often, facilities that advertise themselves as “no kill” really mean that they 
will kill all ill, senior, problem behavior, etc. animals but never kill a 
healthy easily adoptable animals.  These kinds of facilities never ever publish 
their euthanasia matrix” which is where they define their policy on who they 
will kill.  True no kills (as we think it means  as defined by Nathan 
Winograd) are tough to find.  I volunteer for one such shelter in New Orleans 
(ARNO)  the handful of animals they’ve put down have been terminally ill 
animals who were either comatose or in intractable pain.  They never put down 
for fiv or felv!  
 
The shelter you cited clearly is a kill shelter  why they wouldn’t have 
alerted you to the cat’s test results  given you some time demonstrates an 
attitude that is unfortunately all too common.  I’m so sorry this happened to 
you but please know that River had love from you—something she likely hadn’t 
had in a very long time.
 
From:Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Alev 
Durmus
Sent: Tuesday, October 16, 2012 11:15 AM
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Subject: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat
 
 
___
Felvtalk mailing list
Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
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-- 

Go Get a Life---Go Get a Shelter Animal!

If you can't adopt, then foster bottle baby shelter animal, to save their 
life.  Contact your local pound for information. 


If you can't bottle feed, foster an older animal, to save their life, and to 
free up cage space.

Ask your local animal pound to start saving over 90% of their intake by 
implementing the No Kill Equation: http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/

Here's the current growing list of true No Kill communities: 
http://www.nokillhouston.org/no-kill-shelters-in-north-america/

Legislate better animal pound conditions: http://www.rescue50.org

More fun reading: http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/guides/

More fun watching: 
http://vimeo.com/nokill/videos especially http://vimeo.com/48445902




Local feral cat crisis?   See Alley Cat Allies' for how to 
respond: http://www.alleycat.org/page.aspx?pid=537

___
Felvtalk mailing list
Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org___
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Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org


Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat

2012-10-16 Thread Kathryn Hargreaves
Although that could be a good warning shot, they may just ignore you and
not doing anything.

The way to change things is to go to, say, the city council, or whomever
hired them, and tell them you do not like what this pound is doing.
Whatever you do, act professional.   Dress professionally and tell them
calmly you are a constituent who is concerned about what is going on.


On Tue, Oct 16, 2012 at 9:11 AM, Alev Durmus alev_dur...@yahoo.com wrote:

 Hi Christiane,

 Thank you so much...I am so sorry to find out about all these a little too
 late...Yes, they show kittens, young cats, but very few seniors on their
 website for adoption...They are a kill shelter and people do not know this.
 People are happily donating money thinking they are helping the animals,
 but they are helping them to be killed too. What can I do to change this? I
 want to send them an email, what should I say? I want to say the right
 things and not sound like a crazy woman...

 Thank you so much for your kind words, maybe River will be the reason that
 this shelter does something about their policy. You (and the animals in
 that area) are very lucky. Take care,

 Alev
   --
 *From:* Christiane Biagi ti...@mindspring.com
 *To:* felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
 *Sent:* Tuesday, October 16, 2012 12:49 PM

 *Subject:* [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat

 The caveat to the “no kill” (as defined in the Asilomar Accords) is that
 all it means is they will not kill adoptable animals.  Unfortunately, its
 up to the individual shelter/rescue to define what they consider
 “adoptable”.  All too often, facilities that advertise themselves as “no
 kill” really mean that they will kill all ill, senior, problem behavior,
 etc. animals but never kill a healthy easily adoptable animals.  These
 kinds of facilities never ever publish their euthanasia matrix” which is
 where they define their policy on who they will kill.  True no kills (as we
 think it means  as defined by Nathan Winograd) are tough to find.  I
 volunteer for one such shelter in New Orleans (ARNO)  the handful of
 animals they’ve put down have been terminally ill animals who were either
 comatose or in intractable pain.  They never put down for fiv or felv!

 The shelter you cited clearly is a kill shelter  why they wouldn’t have
 alerted you to the cat’s test results  given you some time demonstrates an
 attitude that is unfortunately all too common.  I’m so sorry this happened
 to you but please know that River had love from you—something she likely
 hadn’t had in a very long time.

 *From:* Felvtalk 
 [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.orgfelvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org]
 *On Behalf Of *Alev Durmus
 *Sent:* Tuesday, October 16, 2012 11:15 AM
 *To:* felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
 *Subject:* [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat



 ___
 Felvtalk mailing list
 Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
 http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org



 ___
 Felvtalk mailing list
 Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
 http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org




-- 

Go Get a Life---Go Get a Shelter Animal!

If you can't adopt, then foster bottle baby shelter animal, to save their
life.  Contact your local pound for information.
http://www.laanimalservices.com/volunteer_fostercare.htm

If you can't bottle feed, foster an older animal, to save their life, and
to free up cage space.


Ask your local animal pound to start saving over 90% of their intake by
implementing the No Kill Equation:
http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/no-kill-equation/http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/

Here's the current growing list of true No Kill communities:
http://www.no-killnews.com/http://www.nokillhouston.org/no-kill-shelters-in-north-america/
(see
the right sidebar)

Legislate better animal pound conditions: http://www.rescue50.org

More fun reading: http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/guides/

More fun watching: http://vimeo.com/nokill/videos especially
http://vimeo.com/48445902



Local feral cat crisis?   See Alley Cat Allies' for how to respond:
http://www.alleycat.org/page.aspx?pid=537
___
Felvtalk mailing list
Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
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Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat

2012-10-16 Thread Edna Taylor

Alev, are you in Houston, TX.  What shelter was this?
 Date: Tue, 16 Oct 2012 10:17:14 -0700
From: alev_dur...@yahoo.com
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat

Thank you Kathryn,
I signed the Houston petition already...I hope you guys get enough people on 
time. I checked the list, it was not in it before. I will check the new one 
too. I am thinking to send them an email about what I think of them and send a 
FB messages to people around town to warn that this shelter is not no-kill I 
don't know what else I can do?
Thank you so much to you all for all you support and info, really, sharing this 
with you made me cry more but better than holding in... 
Alev 
From: Kathryn Hargreaves khargrea...@gmail.com
 To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
 Sent: Tuesday, October 16, 2012 1:07 PM
 Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+
 cat
   

Yes, and some have even gone so far as to define ``adoptable'' as those for 
which they have cages!  Outta space, outta luck.

As Christine probably knows, there are over 200 cities/towns that are now No 
Kill.  As for No Kill places being hard to find, at least someone is looking 
for them.   In fact, I just realized that my link to the No Kill communities 
list is outdated and should be replaced with this, which is the above someone's 
blog:

Here's the current growing list of true No Kill communities: 
http://www.nokillhouston.org/no-kill-shelters-in-north-america/ (see the right 
sidebar)





On Tue, Oct 16, 2012 at 8:49 AM, Christiane Biagi ti...@mindspring.com wrote:

The caveat to the “no kill” (as defined in the Asilomar Accords) is that all it 
means is they will not kill adoptable animals.  Unfortunately, its up to the 
individual shelter/rescue to define what they consider “adoptable”.  All too 
often, facilities that advertise themselves as “no kill” really mean that they 
will kill all ill, senior, problem behavior, etc. animals but never kill a 
healthy easily adoptable animals.  These kinds of facilities never ever publish 
their euthanasia matrix” which is where they define their policy on who they 
will kill.  True no kills (as we think it means  as defined by Nathan 
Winograd) are tough to find.  I volunteer for one such shelter in New Orleans 
(ARNO)  the
 handful of animals they’ve put down have been terminally ill animals who were 
either comatose or in intractable pain.  They never put down for fiv or felv!  


 The shelter you cited clearly is a kill shelter  why they wouldn’t have 
alerted you to the cat’s test results  given you some time demonstrates an 
attitude that is unfortunately all too common.  I’m so sorry this happened to 
you but please know that River had love from you—something she likely hadn’t 
had in a very long time.


 


From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Alev 
Durmus



Sent: Tuesday, October 16, 2012 11:15 AM
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Subject: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat


  
___




Felvtalk mailing list

Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org

http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org




-- 

Go Get a Life---Go Get a Shelter Animal!
If you can't adopt, then foster bottle baby shelter animal, to save their 
life.  Contact your local pound for information. 



If you can't bottle feed, foster an older animal, to save their life, and to 
free up cage space.

Ask your local animal pound to start saving over 90% of their intake by 
implementing the No Kill Equation: http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/




Here's the current growing list of true No Kill communities: 
http://www.nokillhouston.org/no-kill-shelters-in-north-america/




Legislate better animal pound conditions: http://www.rescue50.org

More fun reading: http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/guides/




More fun watching: http://vimeo.com/nokill/videos especially 
http://vimeo.com/48445902






Local feral cat crisis?   See Alley Cat Allies' for how to respond: 
http://www.alleycat.org/page.aspx?pid=537






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Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org



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Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org  
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Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat

2012-10-16 Thread Beth
I've never heard of a true shelter not testing for FIV or FeLV. That sounds 
more like an animal control facility.
The Dept of Agriculture wouldn't let us adopt out animals unless we had tested 
them.


 
Don't Litter, Fix Your Critter! www.Furkids.org
 



 From: CATHERINE DIDONNA westnint...@yahoo.com
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Sent: Tuesday, October 16, 2012 1:11 PM
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat
 

around here doesn't say where you are??

From: Kathryn Hargreaves khargrea...@gmail.com
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Sent: Tuesday, October 16, 2012 12:29 PM
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat


I (and others) use the term ``pound'' for all so-called ``shelters'' that are 
not truly No Kill (saving 90%+).   



On Tue, Oct 16, 2012 at 8:26 AM, Beth create_me_...@yahoo.com wrote:

According to her email it wasn't a pound, it was a so-called no-kill shelter.
Pounds are usually owned by the local municipality.

 
 
Don't Litter, Fix Your Critter! http://www.furkids.org/
 


From: Kathryn Hargreaves khargrea...@gmail.com
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Cc: Alev Durmus alev_dur...@yahoo.com 
Sent: Tuesday, October 16, 2012 12:19 PM
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat



What pound was this?   


That's one of the only good things about the pounds around here is that they 
don't test for FIV/Felv, so then they don't kill for it.   Of course, I think 
they should test, and still not kill for it.


These are the open-admission No Kill (saving 90%+) shelters in the 
U.S.: http://www.nokillhouston.org/no-kill-shelters-in-north-america/   Since 
they made you wait for an opening, they are not open-admission by that list 
compiler's standards.   There are many so-called no-kill (note the lowercase 
letters) ``shelters'' that are not open-admission, and many say they are 
no-kill even if they do kill, presumably to get donations.   


The only way you can absolutely tell if a pound is a No Kill shelter is to 
somehow get their intake/transfer/kill stats---sometimes via FOIA (Freedom of 
Information Act).  If you're lucky, they post them on their website.


Most pounds in this country are just killing machines, unfortunately.   See 
the bottom of my messages for how to change this.  Fortunately, now that 
people know it can be done, they are demanding their pounds become No Kill 
shelters.   All it will take is time.  Hopefully, in my lifetime.





___
Felvtalk mailing list
Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
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-- 

Go Get a Life---Go Get a Shelter Animal! 

If you can't adopt, then foster bottle baby shelter animal, to save their 
life.  Contact your local pound for information.  


If you can't bottle feed, foster an older animal, to save their life, and to 
free up cage space.

Ask your local animal pound to start saving over 90% of their intake by 
implementing the No Kill Equation: http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/

Here's the current growing list of true No Kill communities: 
http://www.nokillhouston.org/no-kill-shelters-in-north-america/

Legislate better animal pound conditions: http://www.rescue50.org

More fun reading: http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/guides/

More fun watching: 
http://vimeo.com/nokill/videos especially http://vimeo.com/48445902




Local feral cat crisis?   See Alley Cat Allies' for how to 
respond: http://www.alleycat.org/page.aspx?pid=537

___
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Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org



___
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Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
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Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat

2012-10-16 Thread Beth
These all look like Animal Control Facilities.
Our shelter is definitely no-kill  we are not on there.

 
Don't Litter, Fix Your Critter! www.Furkids.org
 



 From: Kathryn Hargreaves khargrea...@gmail.com
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Sent: Tuesday, October 16, 2012 1:07 PM
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat
 

Yes, and some have even gone so far as to define ``adoptable'' as those for 
which they have cages!  Outta space, outta luck.


As Christine probably knows, there are over 200 cities/towns that are now No 
Kill.  As for No Kill places being hard to find, at least someone is looking 
for them.   In fact, I just realized that my link to the No Kill communities 
list is outdated and should be replaced with this, which is the above someone's 
blog:

Here's the current growing list of true No Kill 
communities: http://www.nokillhouston.org/no-kill-shelters-in-north-america/ (see
 the right sidebar)





On Tue, Oct 16, 2012 at 8:49 AM, Christiane Biagi ti...@mindspring.com wrote:

The caveat to the “no kill” (as defined in the Asilomar Accords) is that all it 
means is they will not kill adoptable animals.  Unfortunately, its up to the 
individual shelter/rescue to define what they consider “adoptable”.  All too 
often, facilities that advertise themselves as “no kill” really mean that they 
will kill all ill, senior, problem behavior, etc. animals but never kill a 
healthy easily adoptable animals.  These kinds of facilities never ever publish 
their euthanasia matrix” which is where they define their policy on who they 
will kill.  True no kills (as we think it means  as defined by Nathan 
Winograd) are tough to find.  I volunteer for one such shelter in New Orleans 
(ARNO)  the handful of animals they’ve put down have been terminally ill 
animals who were either comatose or in intractable pain.  They never put down 
for fiv or felv!  
 
The shelter you cited clearly is a kill shelter  why they wouldn’t have 
alerted you to the cat’s test results  given you some time demonstrates an 
attitude that is unfortunately all too common.  I’m so sorry this happened to 
you but please know that River had love from you—something she likely hadn’t 
had in a very long time.
 
From:Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Alev 
Durmus
Sent: Tuesday, October 16, 2012 11:15 AM
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Subject: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat
 
 
___
Felvtalk mailing list
Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org




-- 

Go Get a Life---Go Get a Shelter Animal!

If you can't adopt, then foster bottle baby shelter animal, to save their 
life.  Contact your local pound for information. 


If you can't bottle feed, foster an older animal, to save their life, and to 
free up cage space.

Ask your local animal pound to start saving over 90% of their intake by 
implementing the No Kill Equation: http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/

Here's the current growing list of true No Kill communities: 
http://www.nokillhouston.org/no-kill-shelters-in-north-america/

Legislate better animal pound conditions: http://www.rescue50.org

More fun reading: http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/guides/

More fun watching: 
http://vimeo.com/nokill/videos especially http://vimeo.com/48445902




Local feral cat crisis?   See Alley Cat Allies' for how to 
respond: http://www.alleycat.org/page.aspx?pid=537

___
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Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
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Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat

2012-10-16 Thread Beth
Most of the pounds (what we refer to as animal control facilites) here do not 
test, either. But there are plenty of taxempt charitable shelters,  some of 
them are truly no-kill. We go above  beyond what most other shelters do. We 
have to test  make sure the animals are fixed  vaccinated before being 
adopted.

Don't Litter, Fix Your Critter! www.Furkids.org
 



 From: Kathryn Hargreaves khargrea...@gmail.com
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Sent: Tuesday, October 16, 2012 1:13 PM
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat
 

Los Angeles.  Neither the city not the county pounds test.



On Tue, Oct 16, 2012 at 9:11 AM, CATHERINE DIDONNA westnint...@yahoo.com 
wrote:

around here doesn't say where you are??


From: Kathryn Hargreaves khargrea...@gmail.com
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Sent: Tuesday, October 16, 2012 12:29 PM

Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat


I (and others) use the term ``pound'' for all so-called ``shelters'' that are 
not truly No Kill (saving 90%+).   



On Tue, Oct 16, 2012 at 8:26 AM, Beth create_me_...@yahoo.com wrote:

According to her email it wasn't a pound, it was a so-called no-kill shelter.
Pounds are usually owned by the local municipality.

 
 
Don't Litter, Fix Your Critter! http://www.furkids.org/
 


From: Kathryn Hargreaves khargrea...@gmail.com
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Cc: Alev Durmus alev_dur...@yahoo.com 
Sent: Tuesday, October 16, 2012 12:19 PM
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat



What pound was this?   


That's one of the only good things about the pounds around here is that they 
don't test for FIV/Felv, so then they don't kill for it.   Of course, I think 
they should test, and still not kill for it.


These are the open-admission No Kill (saving 90%+) shelters in the 
U.S.: http://www.nokillhouston.org/no-kill-shelters-in-north-america/   Since 
they made you wait for an opening, they are not open-admission by that list 
compiler's standards.   There are many so-called no-kill (note the lowercase 
letters) ``shelters'' that are not open-admission, and many say they are 
no-kill even if they do kill, presumably to get donations.   


The only way you can absolutely tell if a pound is a No Kill shelter is to 
somehow get their intake/transfer/kill stats---sometimes via FOIA (Freedom of 
Information Act).  If you're lucky, they post them on their website.


Most pounds in this country are just killing machines, unfortunately.   See 
the bottom of my messages for how to change this.  Fortunately, now that 
people know it can be done, they are demanding their pounds become No Kill 
shelters.   All it will take is time.  Hopefully, in my lifetime.






___
Felvtalk mailing list
Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org






-- 

Go Get a Life---Go Get a Shelter Animal! 


If you can't adopt, then foster bottle baby shelter animal, to save their 
life.  Contact your local pound for information.  


If you can't bottle feed, foster an older animal, to save their life, and to 
free up cage space.


Ask your local animal pound to start saving over 90% of their intake by 
implementing the No Kill Equation: http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/


Here's the current growing list of true No Kill communities: 
http://www.nokillhouston.org/no-kill-shelters-in-north-america/

Legislate better animal pound conditions: http://www.rescue50.org

More fun reading: http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/guides/

More fun watching: 
http://vimeo.com/nokill/videos especially http://vimeo.com/48445902







Local feral cat crisis?   See Alley Cat Allies' for how to 
respond: http://www.alleycat.org/page.aspx?pid=537


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-- 

Go Get a Life---Go Get a Shelter Animal!

If you can't adopt, then foster bottle baby shelter animal, to save their 
life.  Contact your local pound for information. 


If you can't bottle feed, foster an older animal, to save their life, and to 
free up cage space.

Ask your local animal pound to start saving over 90% of their intake by 
implementing the No Kill Equation: 
http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/no-kill-equation/

Here's the current growing list of true No Kill communities: 
http://www.no-killnews.com/ (see the right sidebar)

Legislate better animal pound conditions: http://www.rescue50.org

More fun reading: http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/guides/

More fun watching: 

Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat

2012-10-16 Thread Alev
Hi Edna,

No, I am in MA. 
thank you,

Sent from my iPhone

On Oct 16, 2012, at 2:39 PM, Edna Taylor taylore...@msn.com wrote:

 Alev, are you in Houston, TX.  What shelter was this?
  
 Date: Tue, 16 Oct 2012 10:17:14 -0700
 From: alev_dur...@yahoo.com
 To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
 Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat
 
 Thank you Kathryn,
 
 I signed the Houston petition already...I hope you guys get enough people on 
 time. I checked the list, it was not in it before. I will check the new one 
 too. I am thinking to send them an email about what I think of them and send 
 a FB messages to people around town to warn that this shelter is not 
 no-kill I don't know what else I can do?
 
 Thank you so much to you all for all you support and info, really, sharing 
 this with you made me cry more but better than holding in...
  
 
 Alev 
 From: Kathryn Hargreaves khargrea...@gmail.com
 To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
 Sent: Tuesday, October 16, 2012 1:07 PM
 Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat
 
 Yes, and some have even gone so far as to define ``adoptable'' as those for 
 which they have cages!  Outta space, outta luck.
 
 
 As Christine probably knows, there are over 200 cities/towns that are now No 
 Kill.  As for No Kill places being hard to find, at least someone is looking 
 for them.   In fact, I just realized that my link to the No Kill communities 
 list is outdated and should be replaced with this, which is the above 
 someone's blog:
 
 Here's the current growing list of true No Kill communities: 
 http://www.nokillhouston.org/no-kill-shelters-in-north-america/ (see the 
 right sidebar)
 
 
 
 On Tue, Oct 16, 2012 at 8:49 AM, Christiane Biagi ti...@mindspring.com 
 wrote:
 The caveat to the “no kill” (as defined in the Asilomar Accords) is that all 
 it means is they will not kill adoptable animals.  Unfortunately, its up to 
 the individual shelter/rescue to define what they consider “adoptable”.  All 
 too often, facilities that advertise themselves as “no kill” really mean that 
 they will kill all ill, senior, problem behavior, etc. animals but never kill 
 a healthy easily adoptable animals.  These kinds of facilities never ever 
 publish their euthanasia matrix” which is where they define their policy on 
 who they will kill.  True no kills (as we think it means  as defined by 
 Nathan Winograd) are tough to find.  I volunteer for one such shelter in New 
 Orleans (ARNO)  the handful of animals they’ve put down have been terminally 
 ill animals who were either comatose or in intractable pain.  They never put 
 down for fiv or felv! 
  
 The shelter you cited clearly is a kill shelter  why they wouldn’t have 
 alerted you to the cat’s test results  given you some time demonstrates an 
 attitude that is unfortunately all too common.  I’m so sorry this happened to 
 you but please know that River had love from you—something she likely hadn’t 
 had in a very long time.
  
 From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Alev 
 Durmus
 Sent: Tuesday, October 16, 2012 11:15 AM
 To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
 Subject: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat
  
  
 
 ___
 Felvtalk mailing list
 Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
 http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
 
 
 
 
 -- 
 
 Go Get a Life---Go Get a Shelter Animal!
 
 If you can't adopt, then foster bottle baby shelter animal, to save their 
 life.  Contact your local pound for information. 
 
 If you can't bottle feed, foster an older animal, to save their life, and to 
 free up cage space.
 
 
 Ask your local animal pound to start saving over 90% of their intake by 
 implementing the No Kill Equation: http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/
 
 Here's the current growing list of true No Kill communities: 
 http://www.nokillhouston.org/no-kill-shelters-in-north-america/
 
 Legislate better animal pound conditions: http://www.rescue50.org
 
 More fun reading: http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/guides/
 
 More fun watching: http://vimeo.com/nokill/videos especially 
 http://vimeo.com/48445902
 
 
 
 Local feral cat crisis?   See Alley Cat Allies' for how to respond: 
 http://www.alleycat.org/page.aspx?pid=537
 
 
 ___
 Felvtalk mailing list
 Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
 http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
 
 
 
 ___ Felvtalk mailing list 
 Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
 http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
 ___
 Felvtalk mailing list
 Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
 http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
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Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat

2012-10-16 Thread Kathryn Hargreaves
Sorry, Gmail messed up my link (says one thing and goes somewhere else)!
Here it is, all fixed up:

Here's the current growing list of true No Kill communities:
http://www.no-killnews.com/ (see the right sidebar)

If your shelter meets the criteria on http://www.no-killnews.com/?page_id=8 and
is not in this list, then alert the blog author.   She's trying to find No
Kill communities as fast as she can, and it helps her if you tell her.  You
can subscribe to the email alerts (form in the left sidebar), and then
email her your information.  (This goes for everyone, not just Beth.)   The
more shelters we know about, the more we can convince/force kill shelters
to change their ways.


On Tue, Oct 16, 2012 at 10:55 AM, Beth create_me_...@yahoo.com wrote:

 These all look like Animal Control Facilities.
 Our shelter is definitely no-kill  we are not on there.

 Don't Litter, Fix Your Critter! www.Furkids.org http://www.furkids.org/


   --
 *From:* Kathryn Hargreaves khargrea...@gmail.com
 *To:* felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
 *Sent:* Tuesday, October 16, 2012 1:07 PM
 *Subject:* Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat

 Yes, and some have even gone so far as to define ``adoptable'' as those
 for which they have cages!  Outta space, outta luck.


 As Christine probably knows, there are over 200 cities/towns that are now
 No Kill.  As for No Kill places being hard to find, at least someone is
 looking for them.   In fact, I just realized that my link to the No Kill
 communities list is outdated and should be replaced with this, which is the
 above someone's blog:

 Here's the current growing list of true No Kill communities:
 http://www.nokillhouston.org/no-kill-shelters-in-north-america/ (see the
 right sidebar)





-- 

Go Get a Life---Go Get a Shelter Animal!

If you can't adopt, then foster bottle baby shelter animal, to save their
life.  Contact your local pound for information.
http://www.laanimalservices.com/volunteer_fostercare.htm

If you can't bottle feed, foster an older animal, to save their life, and
to free up cage space.


Ask your local animal pound to start saving over 90% of their intake by
implementing the No Kill Equation:
http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/no-kill-equation/http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/

Here's the current growing list of true No Kill communities:
http://www.no-killnews.com/ (see the right sidebar)

Legislate better animal pound conditions: http://www.rescue50.org

More fun reading: http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/guides/

More fun watching: http://vimeo.com/nokill/videos especially
http://vimeo.com/48445902



Local feral cat crisis?   See Alley Cat Allies' for how to respond:
http://www.alleycat.org/page.aspx?pid=537
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Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
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Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat

2012-10-16 Thread Edna Taylor

Oh, I saw where you said you signed the Houston petition which is why I thought 
you were here.

 From: alev_dur...@yahoo.com
Date: Tue, 16 Oct 2012 15:40:28 -0400
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat

Hi Edna,
No, I am in MA. thank you,

Sent from my iPhone
On Oct 16, 2012, at 2:39 PM, Edna Taylor taylore...@msn.com wrote:





Alev, are you in Houston, TX.  What shelter was this?
 
Date: Tue, 16 Oct 2012 10:17:14 -0700
From: alev_dur...@yahoo.com
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat

Thank you Kathryn,
I signed the Houston petition already...I hope you guys get enough people on 
time. I checked the list, it was not in it before. I will check the new one 
too. I am thinking to send them an email about what I think of them and send a 
FB messages to people around town to warn that this shelter is not no-kill I 
don't know what else I can do?
Thank you so much to you all for all you support and info, really, sharing this 
with you made me cry more but better than holding in... 
Alev 
From: Kathryn Hargreaves khargrea...@gmail.com
 To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
 Sent: Tuesday, October 16, 2012 1:07 PM
 Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+
 cat
   

Yes, and some have even gone so far as to define ``adoptable'' as those for 
which they have cages!  Outta space, outta luck.

As Christine probably knows, there are over 200 cities/towns that are now No 
Kill.  As for No Kill places being hard to find, at least someone is looking 
for them.   In fact, I just realized that my link to the No Kill communities 
list is outdated and should be replaced with this, which is the above someone's 
blog:

Here's the current growing list of true No Kill communities: 
http://www.nokillhouston.org/no-kill-shelters-in-north-america/ (see the right 
sidebar)





On Tue, Oct 16, 2012 at 8:49 AM, Christiane Biagi ti...@mindspring.com wrote:

The caveat to the “no kill” (as defined in the Asilomar Accords) is that all it 
means is they will not kill adoptable animals.  Unfortunately, its up to the 
individual shelter/rescue to define what they consider “adoptable”.  All too 
often, facilities that advertise themselves as “no kill” really mean that they 
will kill all ill, senior, problem behavior, etc. animals but never kill a 
healthy easily adoptable animals.  These kinds of facilities never ever publish 
their euthanasia matrix” which is where they define their policy on who they 
will kill.  True no kills (as we think it means  as defined by Nathan 
Winograd) are tough to find.  I volunteer for one such shelter in New Orleans 
(ARNO)  the
 handful of animals they’ve put down have been terminally ill animals who were 
either comatose or in intractable pain.  They never put down for fiv or felv!  


 The shelter you cited clearly is a kill shelter  why they wouldn’t have 
alerted you to the cat’s test results  given you some time demonstrates an 
attitude that is unfortunately all too common.  I’m so sorry this happened to 
you but please know that River had love from you—something she likely hadn’t 
had in a very long time.



 


From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Alev 
Durmus



Sent: Tuesday, October 16, 2012 11:15 AM
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Subject: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat


  
___




Felvtalk mailing list

Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org

http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org




-- 

Go Get a Life---Go Get a Shelter Animal!
If you can't adopt, then foster bottle baby shelter animal, to save their 
life.  Contact your local pound for information. 



If you can't bottle feed, foster an older animal, to save their life, and to 
free up cage space.

Ask your local animal pound to start saving over 90% of their intake by 
implementing the No Kill Equation: http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/




Here's the current growing list of true No Kill communities: 
http://www.nokillhouston.org/no-kill-shelters-in-north-america/




Legislate better animal pound conditions: http://www.rescue50.org

More fun reading: http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/guides/




More fun watching: http://vimeo.com/nokill/videos especially 
http://vimeo.com/48445902






Local feral cat crisis?   See Alley Cat Allies' for how to respond: 
http://www.alleycat.org/page.aspx?pid=537






___
Felvtalk mailing list
Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org



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Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
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Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat

2012-10-16 Thread janine paton
Alev, 

I am so sorry this has happened to you and River.  River is a beautiful name, 
btw, and one I gave to a rescue cat we took in recently.  I don't know what 
else 
to say other than I am hoping you someday find peace with what has happened 
knowing your intentions were only the best, and you only wanted to help her.  

Some of these types of shelters have come a long way, but still have a long way 
to go.  They can be ignorant and misinformed and how could you have known this? 
 

Best to you, 

Janine




From: Alev Durmus alev_dur...@yahoo.com
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Sent: Tue, October 16, 2012 1:12:13 PM
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat


Hi Christiane,

Thank you so much...I am so sorry to find out about all these a little too 
late...Yes, they show kittens, young cats, but very few seniors on their 
website 
for adoption...They are a kill shelter and people do not know this. People are 
happily donating money thinking they are helping the animals, but they are 
helping them to be killed too. What can I do to change this? I want to send 
them 
an email, what should I say? I want to say the right things and not sound like 
a 
crazy  woman...

Thank you so much for your kind words, maybe River will be the reason that this 
shelter does something about their policy. You (and the animals in that area) 
are very lucky. Take care,
 
Alev



 From: Christiane Biagi ti...@mindspring.com
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Sent: Tuesday, October 16, 2012 12:49 PM
Subject: [Felvtalk]  No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat
 

The caveat to the “no kill” (as defined in the Asilomar Accords) is that all it 
means is they will not kill adoptable animals.  Unfortunately, its up to the 
individual shelter/rescue to define what they consider “adoptable”.  All too 
often, facilities that advertise themselves as “no kill” really mean that they 
will kill all ill, senior, problem behavior, etc. animals but never kill a 
healthy easily adoptable animals.  These kinds of facilities never ever publish 
their euthanasia matrix” which is where they define their policy on who they 
will kill.  True no kills (as we think it means  as defined by Nathan 
Winograd) 
are tough to find.  I volunteer for one such shelter in New Orleans (ARNO)  
the 
handful of animals they’ve put down have been terminally  ill animals who were 
either comatose or in intractable pain.  They never put down for fiv or felv!  

 
The shelter you cited clearly is a kill shelter  why they wouldn’t have 
alerted 
you to the cat’s test results  given you some time demonstrates an attitude 
that is unfortunately all too common.  I’m so sorry this happened to you but 
please know that River had love from you—something she likely hadn’t had in a 
very long time.
 
From:Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Alev 
Durmus
Sent: Tuesday, October 16, 2012 11:15 AM
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Subject: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat
 
 
___
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Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
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Re: [Felvtalk] Nitnoy and felv

2012-10-16 Thread Lee Evans
I'm so sorry.  I know how  much you must grieve but you need to rejoice that 
you were holding her lovingly when she passed and you spoke to her and told her 
it was all right to leave.  She is having no pain now, no discomfort, wherever 
it is that we all go when we pass.  But you are still here stuck with the pain 
and grief.  Please be nice to yourself and do something to relieve your 
unhappiness.  You did a wonderful thing for Nitnoy.  You gave her 4 years of 
quality life and love.  Some people don't get as much.  Hugs and blessings to 
you.


 
Spay and Neuter your cats and dogs and your weird relatives and nasty neighbors 
too!





 From: dlg...@windstream.net dlg...@windstream.net
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Sent: Monday, October 15, 2012 5:07 PM
Subject: [Felvtalk] Nitnoy and felv
 
My Nitnoy crossed over today at 12:45.    She had been with me since 2008, 
survived a raccoon biting of her tail and being FELV +.  There was nothing to 
idicate whaat was going on.  During the holidays, she was not doing well so 
took her to ER.  They did x-rays and complete bloodwork.  I had told them she 
was FELV+ but they did not seem upset that she was just 1 point low on red and 
white cells.  After the holiday, I took her to my vet as she was not improving, 
had not passed urine or stool.  First thing he did was look at her anal 
glands.  They were impacted and infected.  He cleaned them out and gave her 
Covina and we brought home Orbax to be given once daily.  Everything was much 
better, she was back to her self.  Then Friday, she began hiding, not eating or 
drinking so took her to vet on Saturday.  ONE THING SHE DID THAT STRUCK ME ODD 
- SHE TRIED TO EAT THE FIRBARK THAT MY ORCHIDS ARE PLANTED IN.  Sat when we got 
to vet, my dr was not
 there, but his wife (also a vet) was.  She said her lymph glands were slightly 
enlarged and gums very pale.  We did another blood panel.  Her white cells were 
.98 and her red blood cells were 3.2.  Kidney and liver functions were normal 
as were creatine and bun.  We thought about going to ER for transfusion, but 
she would have to stay over the weekend in a cage and we decided the stress 
would outweigh any good it might do plus her body might just kill the new blood 
and we would be right back where we started plus stress.  Again, gave Covina 
shot and started again on Orbax.  I wanted to try a tonic that has worked 
wonders on cancers, etc.  Vet said ok but keep a record of what I did in case 
it worked.  She actually seemed to improve.  I was feeding with an eye dropper 
aruond 50 ml every hour (i can ad mixed with 3 cans hot water so she could 
swallow and also to egt fluids into her.  She got around 50ml of tonic also.  
She took a turn for the
 worse this am at 3:30, but then seemed to get better.  She was breathing 
easier, heart was strong and she responded to my voice and touch.  By 12:45, 
she had gone completely the opposite direction.  I was holding her aganst me as 
she seemed to like the body warmth when she gasped 3 or 4 times and the light 
in her eyes went out.  I knew she was going and I told her it was all right.  
She held on with her claws, gave a sigh and that was all.

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Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat

2012-10-16 Thread Lee Evans
Beth, How wonderful you are.  I had a similar but happier experience.  I was 
known in my city as a rescuer and am on the Board of an animal rights 
organization.  However, I surrendered many cats to the Humane Society, a 
supposedly no-kill shelter in San Antonio, Tx.  Whenever I filled out the 
surrender form, I always added that the cat must be returned to me for any 
reason at any time, whether it was FIV or FeLv or some other situation that 
made the cat unadoptable.  I put it all over the form, told the intake people 
and they agreed.  I knew that they killed FIV+ and FeLv+ cats without asking 
questions.  Most people don't realize this or just don't care as long as they 
can tell themselves that they did their best for the cat.  In addition, the HS 
allows anyone to visit with the cats in visitation rooms, small cubicles with 
cat toys where the cats can be handled and potential adopters can get to know 
them.  This shelter is better than most
 because their intake form does have a place to state that the people 
surrendering the cat can have him/her back in case of something that makes the 
cat unadoptable.  Anyway, one evening the supervising intake person called me.  
She was near tears.  I hadn't surrendered any cats so I wondered what was 
wrong.  She said that they had gotten in two young, gorgeous cats who had 
tested FIV+ and she was ordered to have them euthanized the next day.  She 
asked me if I would foster, since she knew I did not euthanize FIV+ cats.  I 
had none at the time, but I had about 20 other cats.  So I told her that if she 
took the two cats who were occupying my spare room at that time and who tested 
negative for everything, were already fixed and had their rabies shots I would 
take the FIV+ cats.  The exchange was made before the shelter opened the next 
day.  This was entirely against the rules but no one complained.  I got Sugar 
Plum Fairy, a lovely blue-eyed
 white cat who was NOT deaf and Sir Walter, a husky, healthy tabby and white 
boy.  Both were fixed and had their rabies shots.  That was about 7 years ago. 
I named the white one Sugar Plum Fairy and the tabby and white Sir Walter 
because he looked regal. Sugar Plum Fairy is still with me along with 4 other 
FIV+ cats who live in separate quarters from my main group.  Sir Walter passed 
a month ago from kidney cancer.  Up until a month before he passed, he was a 
happy, overweight puss with an attitude.  Sugar is fine because she has other 
companions.  I also have two FIV+ cats mixed in with my main group because they 
are lay back non-fighters who get along with everyone.  No kill shelters are 
becoming much more aware that FIV and FeLv do not have to be a death sentence 
for cats surrendered to them.  It's so awful that Alev had such a painful 
experience.  This used to be the norm in this country but things are slowly 
changing.  We always have to
 speak up for the cats and make sure that we have an understanding when we 
surrender one to a shelter that they will return the cat if anything is wrong.  
Get it in writing and call frequently, visit frequently if you can to see how 
your cat is doing.  The two who were exchanged for Sugar and Wally got adopted 
within two weeks of arriving at the shelter.  FIV is not contagious unless the 
cats get into a major biting and fighting situation.  Most FIV+ cats who are 
neutered do not bite and fight since this is behavior during mating season.  
However, the five cats I have in my special FIV section exhibited some left 
over hostility tendencies from their pre-neuter days.  That's why they are 
separate from my main group.  The two who are mixed in never exhibited even a 
hiss at anyone.


 
Spay and Neuter your cats and dogs and your weird relatives and nasty neighbors 
too!





 From: Beth create_me_...@yahoo.com
To: FeLV Talk Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Sent: Tuesday, October 16, 2012 10:48 AM
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat
 



Alev -

I'm so sorry you had this experience. Unfortunately many no-kill shelters are 
really not totally no-kill - they do euthanize for FeLV  FIV, usually because 
they have no place to house/foster the positive cats. 

It is routine for shelters to make you sign all rights over to them. It usually 
will say in that ppw that they euthanize for FeLV  FIV.
It is also normal for you to have to go through the same adoption process as 
anyone else even if you were the one surrendering the animal.
It is crazy, though, that they would not call you  give you the chance to take 
the cat back or permanently foster her. However, their reasoning might have 
been that the cat had been outside  they were afraid you may re-release her 
with a contagious virus.

I had this happen with an FIV+ cat when I 1st moved into my neighborhood. I 
found the cat  he was injured. I already had 5 cats  could not take another, 
so I took him to a local emergency vet that had an injured stray 

Re: [Felvtalk] Nitnoy and felv

2012-10-16 Thread Marcia Baronda
So terribly sad and so hard when they seem to get better. I think that is what 
makes it so damn hard to make a final decision. When the choice is in our hands 
it just not something that I think any of us take lightly. I'm so sorry about 
Nitnoy. Im sure her life with you was wonderful and I can only hope you take 
comfort in that.
Take care
Marcia

Sent from my iPad that my most awesome kids surprised me with, Christmas 2010. 

On Oct 16, 2012, at 6:28 PM, Lee Evans moonsiste...@yahoo.com wrote:

 I'm so sorry.  I know how  much you must grieve but you need to rejoice that 
 you were holding her lovingly when she passed and you spoke to her and told 
 her it was all right to leave.  She is having no pain now, no discomfort, 
 wherever it is that we all go when we pass.  But you are still here stuck 
 with the pain and grief.  Please be nice to yourself and do something to 
 relieve your unhappiness.  You did a wonderful thing for Nitnoy.  You gave 
 her 4 years of quality life and love.  Some people don't get as much.  Hugs 
 and blessings to you.
  
 Spay and Neuter your cats and dogs and your weird relatives and nasty 
 neighbors too!
 
 
 From: dlg...@windstream.net dlg...@windstream.net
 To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
 Sent: Monday, October 15, 2012 5:07 PM
 Subject: [Felvtalk] Nitnoy and felv
 
 My Nitnoy crossed over today at 12:45.She had been with me since 2008, 
 survived a raccoon biting of her tail and being FELV +.  There was nothing to 
 idicate whaat was going on.  During the holidays, she was not doing well so 
 took her to ER.  They did x-rays and complete bloodwork.  I had told them she 
 was FELV+ but they did not seem upset that she was just 1 point low on red 
 and white cells.  After the holiday, I took her to my vet as she was not 
 improving, had not passed urine or stool.  First thing he did was look at her 
 anal glands.  They were impacted and infected.  He cleaned them out and gave 
 her Covina and we brought home Orbax to be given once daily.  Everything was 
 much better, she was back to her self.  Then Friday, she began hiding, not 
 eating or drinking so took her to vet on Saturday.  ONE THING SHE DID THAT 
 STRUCK ME ODD - SHE TRIED TO EAT THE FIRBARK THAT MY ORCHIDS ARE PLANTED IN.  
 Sat when we got to vet, my dr was not there, but his wife (also a vet) was.  
 She said her lymph glands were slightly enlarged and gums very pale.  We did 
 another blood panel.  Her white cells were .98 and her red blood cells were 
 3.2.  Kidney and liver functions were normal as were creatine and bun.  We 
 thought about going to ER for transfusion, but she would have to stay over 
 the weekend in a cage and we decided the stress would outweigh any good it 
 might do plus her body might just kill the new blood and we would be right 
 back where we started plus stress.  Again, gave Covina shot and started again 
 on Orbax.  I wanted to try a tonic that has worked wonders on cancers, etc.  
 Vet said ok but keep a record of what I did in case it worked.  She actually 
 seemed to improve.  I was feeding with an eye dropper aruond 50 ml every hour 
 (i can ad mixed with 3 cans hot water so she could swallow and also to egt 
 fluids into her.  She got around 50ml of tonic also.  She took a turn for the 
 worse this am at 3:30, but then seemed to get better.  She was breathing 
 easier, heart was strong and she responded to my voice and touch.  By 12:45, 
 she had gone completely the opposite direction.  I was holding her aganst me 
 as she seemed to like the body warmth when she gasped 3 or 4 times and the 
 light in her eyes went out.  I knew she was going and I told her it was all 
 right.  She held on with her claws, gave a sigh and that was all.
 
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