Re: [Felvtalk] War on Cats and Others

2013-02-04 Thread Lee Evans
All these killer cat articles are a backlash against TNR. It's unfortunate 
that some people are so mentally paralyzed that they don't realize that spaying 
and neutering a cat (or dog) will stop the reproductive cycle. A spayed cat is 
a spayed cat, one cat. An intact cat is a cat and then more and more cats with 
each birth of kittens. I have spoken to people who say, Well yes, but even if 
you spay the cat you still have a cat. Using this logic, any time you have a 
quantity of individuals who are considered too many, including human 
overpopulation you should look towards a solution that involves killing the 
individuals, which instantly rids the area of the unwanted human or non human 
but doesn't solve the long term problem of overpopulation. Hitler tried this 
form of birth control, killing those individuals that he thought were not 
valuable and should not reproduce. Obviously, it didn't work too well. Any time 
killing is involved in population
 control, there will be people who will not go along with the program because 
of issues like compassion and aversion to death.

Now here's a true study. There was a town in Arizona or Colorado (not sure 
which State) that did have a large number of free-roaming cats. They did trap 
them and kill them and were down to very few cats. Most of the remaining cats 
were kept inside. It was actually against the law to allow cats outside. Mother 
Nature hates to be tampered with. In a year, the town was overrun by rats and 
mice and crop eating small mammals. People were so upset that the City Council 
voted to import several hundred cats from shelters in surrounding towns so that 
they could rebuild their outside cat population.  It seems that in spite of the 
150 million estimate of cats and the billions of dead mice and rats and birds, 
we see no dearth of mice, rats and birds, including song birds. And yes, cats 
are an introduced species although the cat family of larger cats such as 
mountain lions, bob cats and others were here already when explorers arrived to 
settle this continent.
 There was a good reason why the cats came along. If they hadn't, the rats and 
mice that infested the ships would have eaten the food supplies before the 
ships could complete the journey. All that would have been left would have been 
skeletons of starved to death settlers. 


 
Spay and Neuter your cats and dogs and your weird relatives and nasty neighbors 
too!






 From: Kathryn Hargreaves khargrea...@gmail.com
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Sent: Sunday, February 3, 2013 10:02 PM
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] War on Cats and Others
 

Take heart: 
http://www.npr.org/blogs/13.7/2013/02/03/170851048/do-we-really-know-that-cats-kill-by-the-billions-not-so-fast



On Sat, Feb 2, 2013 at 1:41 AM, Lee Evans moonsiste...@yahoo.com wrote:

There is so much nonsense, mythology and prejudice going around when it 
comes to diseases in general, whether cat, dog or human that it's a 
wonder any of us survive the ignorance rather than the disease. An 
acquaintance of mine was told by a licensed veterinarian that she needed to 
have her healthy FIV+ cat euthanized because humans can catch it 
from cats. Meow? My tenant, when I had a rent house, insisted that FIV 
was highly contagious but FeLv was NOT. Tail backwards. People to this 
day refuse to hug a person who is living with HIV but will shake hands 
with someone who has a horrid head cold and get all chummy with people 
who are coughing all over the air.

Many veterinarians seem not to
 like cats to the point of finding reasons to put them to death. Others 
are simply too lazy to study new theories of medicine. In some cases, we
 have not traveled more than inches away from dancing around the bonfire
 to banish evil spirits as a cure for illness.

Finally, we are 
now being treated to amazingly inflated statistics from almost comic 
studies that produced the startling news that cats kill rats and mice. 
Who would have thought!! Not just some rats and mice  but toss in moles,
 voles and gophers, not to mention those things with wings that mostly 
fly.  Stir with a hefty dose of sensationalism due to a slow news day, 
and you come up with BILLIONS of small mammals and birds being 
slaughtered and exterminated by feral cats. Please don't mention though 
that humans  have hunted dozens of species to extinction just to have a 
head to hang on the wall or a rug for the floor, or as a way to stop 
male sexual dysfunction, or to carve into little statues or furniture 
(elephants) or just as a lovely delicacy to eat at a way overpriced 
fancy restaurant. (shark fin soup and other
 disgusting dishes). Sometimes it seems like humans will kill everything
 from snails to whales for the most trivial or ridiculous reason. 
However, just let it be known that cats kill mice and rats for a living 
and you have panic in the streets. Ah well, time to get off my soap box 
and go to bed.



 
Spay and Neuter your cats and 

Re: [Felvtalk] War on Cats and Others

2013-02-04 Thread Marcia Baronda
Love it love it love it!!! You hit the nail on the head Lee, cats kill from 
instinct and hunger. Humans  kill from ego. It makes me sick (what humans do). 
We pulled up into the driveway last night and a bunny ran across. My husband 
said to me, isn't it amazing how the cats don't seem to bother these rabbits? 
 yes it's amazing! Humans are amazing. They come up with the most wonderful 
ideas, like gestation crates, a lovely form of all sorts of deprivation. What 
bothers me is that we think we have the RIGHT to do what we do to other beings. 
OK, I'm done. Thanks for the email(-:

Marcia

Sent from my iPad that my most awesome kids surprised me with, Christmas 2010. 

On Feb 3, 2013, at 10:57 AM, Alev alev_dur...@yahoo.com wrote:

 Lee,
 
 I couldnt agree more, thank you for this email, I will never stop talking 
 about animal rights to people,
 take care
 
 Sent from my iPhone
 
 On Feb 2, 2013, at 5:41 AM, Lee Evans moonsiste...@yahoo.com wrote:
 
 There is so much nonsense, mythology and prejudice going around when it 
 comes to diseases in general, whether cat, dog or human that it's a wonder 
 any of us survive the ignorance rather than the disease. An acquaintance of 
 mine was told by a licensed veterinarian that she needed to have her healthy 
 FIV+ cat euthanized because humans can catch it from cats. Meow? My tenant, 
 when I had a rent house, insisted that FIV was highly contagious but FeLv 
 was NOT. Tail backwards. People to this day refuse to hug a person who is 
 living with HIV but will shake hands with someone who has a horrid head cold 
 and get all chummy with people who are coughing all over the air.
 
 Many veterinarians seem not to like cats to the point of finding reasons to 
 put them to death. Others are simply too lazy to study new theories of 
 medicine. In some cases, we have not traveled more than inches away from 
 dancing around the bonfire to banish evil spirits as a cure for illness.
 
 Finally, we are now being treated to amazingly inflated statistics from 
 almost comic studies that produced the startling news that cats kill rats 
 and mice. Who would have thought!! Not just some rats and mice  but toss in 
 moles, voles and gophers, not to mention those things with wings that mostly 
 fly.  Stir with a hefty dose of sensationalism due to a slow news day, and 
 you come up with BILLIONS of small mammals and birds being slaughtered and 
 exterminated by feral cats. Please don't mention though that humans  have 
 hunted dozens of species to extinction just to have a head to hang on the 
 wall or a rug for the floor, or as a way to stop male sexual dysfunction, or 
 to carve into little statues or furniture (elephants) or just as a lovely 
 delicacy to eat at a way overpriced fancy restaurant. (shark fin soup and 
 other disgusting dishes). Sometimes it seems like humans will kill 
 everything from snails to whales for the most trivial or ridiculous reason. 
 However, just let it be known that cats kill mice and rats for a living and 
 you have panic in the streets. Ah well, time to get off my soap box and go 
 to bed.
 
  
 Spay and Neuter your cats and dogs and your weird relatives and nasty 
 neighbors too!
 
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Re: [Felvtalk] Introduction

2013-02-04 Thread Sharyl
Laura. I'm afraid with a positive IFA test there isn't a chance Dani will shed 
the virus.  Here is the link to a chart that explains the meaning of the test 
results
http://www.felineleukemia.org/felvhlth.html
 
I have rescued several FeLV kittens.  They lived from 1-4 yrs.  I didn't find 
supplements helpful but others may have had better luck.  Many FeLV kitties on 
this list have lived for several years.
 
You are already on top of what will be best for Dani - good food, lots of love 
and a stress free environment.  Try to stay on top of any health issues.  Since 
her immune system is compromised she may be more susceptible to URIs, etc.
 
By the way I had all my FeLV babies spayed or neutered.  I felt it was more 
stressful for them if left unfixed.  
 
It broke my heart when I lost each of them but I would change what I did.  Each 
was special and brought joy to my heart.  My other rescues were adults.  I had 
them all vaccinated for FeLV and let my positives have the run of the house.  
With 17 other cats that may be hard for you to do.  
 
Bless you for caring and giving Dani a home
Sharyl
  


 From: laurak...@aol.com laurak...@aol.com
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Sent: Sunday, February 3, 2013 5:57 PM
Subject: [Felvtalk] Introduction
  

Hieveryone, 

I am new to this group--and new to FeLV. I just took in an FeLV+ kitty from the 
shelter where I am a volunteer.Her name is Dani and she is beautiful. Long 
story short, she and her three siblings were found outside in a box when they 
were about a week old. They came to the shelter and tested positive for FeLV 
(ELISA).  They were retested and again it was positive. At 9 weeks,they had an 
IFA test, all positive. During this time, they were bottle fed until about 8 
weeks, shuttled to and from the shelter by a staff member. They were also 
treated for URIswith azithromycin. The shelter cultures all incoming cats for 
ringworm and unfortunately theirs came back positive, so they were dipped in 
lyme a couple of times a week for a while and put on Itraconazole. Dani took 
longer to shake it off and so was completely alone for some time. During their 
time at the shelter they were vaccinated with 2 rounds of FVRCP, a rabies 
vaccine and spayed/neutered. Sadly, Dani's
 littermates all came down with different issues(I don't know all the details, 
but I know the vet suspected FIP) and were euthanized. Little Dani was left 
alone, in a bathroom with no windows, and not many visitors. The second I found 
out about her, I set up thesun room off my bedroom (it was unheated but fixed 
that fast) and took her home. 

Anyway, I wanted to give the whole background so you know just how much she has 
been through in her short life. While even here it is not optimal--she is 
isolated--it is so much better than being stuck in the stuffy bathroom. Here, 
she bird watches, has a ton of toys, a much better diet and a ton of cuddles 
(though not as much as I wish. I have 17 other cats.) 

I have two big questions: is it possible for her to become negative with a 
positive IFA result at 9 weeks? And, second: how do I best care for her? I have 
her on a high quality canned only diet (wellness and weruva--no fish) and 
minimize stress as much as possible. Are there supplements I should be giving? 
Are NuCat vitamins recommended? Are my food choices OK for her?  I will never 
vaccinate or even take her to a vet (I'd have one come to me if necessary to 
minimize stress.) I feel terrible she is alone alot of the timeand I have 
thought about bringing in another young FeLV + kitty for her, but I am worried 
about causing stress, having it backfire. Ihave all the patience in the world 
when it comes to having cats work out issues, but I'm also very careful when 
bringing in a new cat, quarantining for a couple of weeks, letting her explore 
while I put othersin other rooms, etc. But I wouldn't have that ability to do 
so with a companion for Dani as I
 literally don't have any rooms left. 

Sorry for such a long post! I really want to do right by her. I love her to 
pieces.

Thank you!

Laura and Dani girl
 

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Re: [Felvtalk] Felvtalk Digest, Vol 19, Issue 3

2013-02-04 Thread Kathy Wood
Wondering if anyone has comments on what is happening regarding the below 
circumstances:
Adult cat, female spayed
Tested positive FelV
Has been very actuve  healthy
Now showing 3rd eyelid on both eyes 
No diarreah
Vet has ruled out neurological  parasites, doing full blood panel  xray of 
chest. 

Wondering if folks have ideas

~Kathy Wood~
Sent from my iPhone

On Feb 4, 2013, at 1:00 PM, felvtalk-requ...@felineleukemia.org wrote:

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 When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
 than Re: Contents of Felvtalk digest...
 
 
 Today's Topics:
 
   1. Studies (Lee Evans)
   2. Re: Studies (Alev Durmus)
   3. Introduction (laurak...@aol.com)
   4. Introduction pt 2 (Laura McHugh)
   5. Re: War on Cats and Others (Kathryn Hargreaves)
   6. Re: War on Cats and Others (Lee Evans)
   7. Re: War on Cats and Others (Marcia Baronda)
 
 
 --
 
 Message: 1
 Date: Sun, 3 Feb 2013 12:56:30 -0800 (PST)
 From: Lee Evans moonsiste...@yahoo.com
 To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
 Subject: [Felvtalk] Studies
 Message-ID:
1359924990.29441.yahoomail...@web120006.mail.ne1.yahoo.com
 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
 
 I noticed something about humans that is unique to our species. We seem to 
 have an endless ability to purposely misunderstand what is being said or 
 proposed.? And we put absolute faith in studies. As the secretary of an 
 animal rights organization, a genuine 501 c-3, I have been asked why I was 
 advocating that animals be given the same benefits as humans and wouldn't 
 that be terribly expensive. Duh? I think these people were mostly worried 
 about their own right to eat cows, chickens, sheep, pigs, turkeys, and other 
 edible beings. But I even hear, on occasion that animal rights advocates want 
 there to be some form of education for animals and that if we have our way, 
 there would eventually be no more animals on Earth because we are against 
 ;breeding dogs and cats, etc.. Really!? And when I happened to mention animal 
 welfare, I got the response that there are enough lazy people on welfare, we 
 don't need to put animals on welfare in addition. Welcome to
 the Twilight Zoned Out.
 
 OK. I feel it necessary to clear up all these misconceptions? with a name 
 change. From now on I will tell people I am an Animal Advocate. That means 
 that I speak up for animals. Right? Except in UK where it would mean that an 
 animal can hire me as a lawyer. 
 
 I also seem to have read somewhere that rats, mice, voles, etc. reproduce, 
 much as any other mammal does. A study shows that if the entire New York 
 Sewer system was emptied of rats and mice and a few alligators, if a male and 
 female rat and a male and female mouse were to be placed there on January 1, 
 in just under a year, the entire New York Sewer system would have the same 
 number of rodents as it had before. This study is based on absolutely no 
 verifiable research, and is simply a product of an over-active imagination. 
 As is the study that cats kill BILLIONS of small mammals and birds each year.
 
 I need a cup of coffee. Uh, no. Last study I read, coffee was not good for 
 the health. But that was refuted? by the former study that it is good for the 
 health and can prevent senility. However, I can't have a sandwich any more 
 because whole wheat or any wheat, oats, bananas, orange juice, and most food 
 is a health hazard, except for animal based food I guess because I haven't 
 seen any studies recently to prove that animal protein is harmful and the 
 myth of clogged arteries from animal fat has been debunked, rebunked and 
 debunked again. I'm down to eating floor dust.
 
 
 ?
 Spay and Neuter your cats and dogs and your weird relatives and nasty 
 neighbors too!
 
 
 
 
 
 
 From: Alev alev_dur...@yahoo.com
 To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
 Sent: Sunday, February 3, 2013 10:57 AM
 Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] War on Cats and Others
 
 
 Lee,
 
 
 I couldnt agree more, thank you for this email, I will never stop talking 
 about animal rights to people,
 take care
 
 Sent from my iPhone
 
 On Feb 2, 2013, at 5:41 AM, Lee Evans moonsiste...@yahoo.com wrote:
 
 
 There is so much nonsense, mythology and prejudice going around when it
 comes to diseases in general, whether cat, dog or human that it's a 
 wonder any of us survive the ignorance rather than the disease. An 
 acquaintance of mine was told by a licensed veterinarian that she needed to 
 have 

Re: [Felvtalk] Cat showing 3rd eyelid

2013-02-04 Thread Beth
That would be difficult to tell without the bloodwork results.
Are the gums pale?

Beth 

 
Don't Litter, Fix Your Critter! www.Furkids.org
 



 From: Kathy Wood klovel...@gmail.com
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Cc: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Sent: Monday, February 4, 2013 1:49 PM
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Felvtalk Digest, Vol 19, Issue 3
 
Wondering if anyone has comments on what is happening regarding the below 
circumstances:
Adult cat, female spayed
Tested positive FelV
Has been very actuve  healthy
Now showing 3rd eyelid on both eyes 
No diarreah
Vet has ruled out neurological  parasites, doing full blood panel  xray of 
chest. 

Wondering if folks have ideas

~Kathy Wood~
Sent from my iPhone___
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Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
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Re: [Felvtalk] hissing

2013-02-04 Thread Beth
It is spread through saliva, but probably not likely to be passed by momentary 
hissing.

Beth 

Don't Litter, Fix Your Critter! www.Furkids.org
 



 From: (ra)chel kandyrac...@gmail.com
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Sent: Monday, February 4, 2013 4:52 PM
Subject: [Felvtalk] hissing
 
I was just wondering, how likely is it that FeLV can be spread through
a moment of hissing?

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Re: [Felvtalk] Introduction

2013-02-04 Thread Cindy McHugh
Hi Laura,

I don’t have a lot of advice for you, as my experience with FeLV is somewhat 
limited. I joined the list when one of the ferals I was feeding tested positive 
when I had him neutered. He lived in our spare room until I found him a forever 
home 10 months later. During this time, he shared the room with another feral 
from the colony. I first tried keeping him by himself, but he was too stressed. 
Our vet didn’t think the other cat had a high risk of contracting the disease 
since he was an adult and they had already lived together, shared food bowls, 
etc. I had the other cat tested months after the FeLV cat was adopted and he 
was fine. 

I think it’s an excellent idea to try integrating another cat with your wee 
kitten. Sadly, most FeLV cats are euthanized and never given the chance you’re 
giving Dani. So an addition would save another life. Since she’s so young, I 
think she’d most likely welcome the company. (But this is just my opinion.)

I just wanted to say thank you for looking past Dani’s disease and loving her 
for who she is. I’m praying she fights off the virus and lives a long and 
healthy life.

Cindy

From: laurak...@aol.com 
Sent: Sunday, February 03, 2013 5:57 PM
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Subject: [Felvtalk] Introduction

Hi everyone, 

I am new to this group--and new to FeLV. I just took in an FeLV+ kitty from the 
shelter where I am a volunteer. Her name is Dani and she is beautiful. Long 
story short, she and her three siblings were found outside in a box when they 
were about a week old. They came to the shelter and tested positive for FeLV 
(ELISA).  They were retested and again it was positive. At 9 weeks, they had an 
IFA test, all positive. During this time, they were bottle fed until about 8 
weeks, shuttled to and from the shelter by a staff member. They were also 
treated for URIs with azithromycin. The shelter cultures all incoming cats for 
ringworm and unfortunately theirs came back positive, so they were dipped in 
lyme a couple of times a week for a while and put on Itraconazole. Dani took 
longer to shake it off and so was completely alone for some time. During their 
time at the shelter they were vaccinated with 2 rounds of FVRCP, a rabies 
vaccine and spayed/neutered. Sadly, Dani's littermates all came down with 
different issues (I don't know all the details, but I know the vet suspected 
FIP) and were euthanized. Little Dani was left alone, in a bathroom with no 
windows, and not many visitors. The second I found out about her, I set up the 
sun room off my bedroom (it was unheated but fixed that fast) and took her 
home. 

Anyway, I wanted to give the whole background so you know just how much she has 
been through in her short life. While even here it is not optimal--she is 
isolated--it is so much better than being stuck in the stuffy bathroom. Here, 
she bird watches, has a ton of toys, a much better diet and a ton of cuddles 
(though not as much as I wish. I have 17 other cats.) 

I have two big questions: is it possible for her to become negative with a 
positive IFA result at 9 weeks? And, second: how do I best care for her? I have 
her on a high quality canned only diet (wellness and weruva--no fish) and 
minimize stress as much as possible. Are there supplements I should be giving? 
Are NuCat vitamins recommended? Are my food choices OK for her? I will never 
vaccinate or even take her to a vet (I'd have one come to me if necessary to 
minimize stress.) I feel terrible she is alone a lot of the time and I have 
thought about bringing in another young FeLV + kitty for her, but I am worried 
about causing stress, having it backfire. I have all the patience in the world 
when it comes to having cats work out issues, but I'm also very careful when 
bringing in a new cat, quarantining for a couple of weeks, letting her explore 
while I put others in other rooms, etc. But I wouldn't have that ability to do 
so with a companion for Dani as I literally don't have any rooms left. 

Sorry for such a long post! I really want to do right by her. I love her to 
pieces.

Thank you!

Laura and Dani girl
 




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Re: [Felvtalk] Introduction

2013-02-04 Thread dlgegg
Hi.  been offline for a few days so please forgive the lateness.  I have a 
mixed group in my house, with 2 feflv +.  Just recently Nitnoy died of a 
urinary tract infection, not the felv.  Annie is still going strong as are all 
my negtives.  Vet said to keep up vaccination for FELV for the others and 
should not have a problem.  Had Nitnoy and Annioe for 4 years and have had no 
problem with the others getting felv.  Everyone is healthy and happy.  Hope 
this helps you.

 Cindy McHugh ci...@furangels.org wrote: 
 Hi Laura,
 
 I don’t have a lot of advice for you, as my experience with FeLV is somewhat 
 limited. I joined the list when one of the ferals I was feeding tested 
 positive when I had him neutered. He lived in our spare room until I found 
 him a forever home 10 months later. During this time, he shared the room with 
 another feral from the colony. I first tried keeping him by himself, but he 
 was too stressed. Our vet didn’t think the other cat had a high risk of 
 contracting the disease since he was an adult and they had already lived 
 together, shared food bowls, etc. I had the other cat tested months after the 
 FeLV cat was adopted and he was fine. 
 
 I think it’s an excellent idea to try integrating another cat with your wee 
 kitten. Sadly, most FeLV cats are euthanized and never given the chance 
 you’re giving Dani. So an addition would save another life. Since she’s so 
 young, I think she’d most likely welcome the company. (But this is just my 
 opinion.)
 
 I just wanted to say thank you for looking past Dani’s disease and loving her 
 for who she is. I’m praying she fights off the virus and lives a long and 
 healthy life.
 
 Cindy
 
 From: laurak...@aol.com 
 Sent: Sunday, February 03, 2013 5:57 PM
 To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
 Subject: [Felvtalk] Introduction
 
 Hi everyone, 
 
 I am new to this group--and new to FeLV. I just took in an FeLV+ kitty from 
 the shelter where I am a volunteer. Her name is Dani and she is beautiful. 
 Long story short, she and her three siblings were found outside in a box when 
 they were about a week old. They came to the shelter and tested positive for 
 FeLV (ELISA).  They were retested and again it was positive. At 9 weeks, they 
 had an IFA test, all positive. During this time, they were bottle fed until 
 about 8 weeks, shuttled to and from the shelter by a staff member. They were 
 also treated for URIs with azithromycin. The shelter cultures all incoming 
 cats for ringworm and unfortunately theirs came back positive, so they were 
 dipped in lyme a couple of times a week for a while and put on Itraconazole. 
 Dani took longer to shake it off and so was completely alone for some time. 
 During their time at the shelter they were vaccinated with 2 rounds of FVRCP, 
 a rabies vaccine and spayed/neutered. Sadly, Dani's littermates all came down 
 with different issues (I don't know all the details, but I know the vet 
 suspected FIP) and were euthanized. Little Dani was left alone, in a bathroom 
 with no windows, and not many visitors. The second I found out about her, I 
 set up the sun room off my bedroom (it was unheated but fixed that fast) and 
 took her home. 
 
 Anyway, I wanted to give the whole background so you know just how much she 
 has been through in her short life. While even here it is not optimal--she is 
 isolated--it is so much better than being stuck in the stuffy bathroom. Here, 
 she bird watches, has a ton of toys, a much better diet and a ton of cuddles 
 (though not as much as I wish. I have 17 other cats.) 
 
 I have two big questions: is it possible for her to become negative with a 
 positive IFA result at 9 weeks? And, second: how do I best care for her? I 
 have her on a high quality canned only diet (wellness and weruva--no fish) 
 and minimize stress as much as possible. Are there supplements I should be 
 giving? Are NuCat vitamins recommended? Are my food choices OK for her? I 
 will never vaccinate or even take her to a vet (I'd have one come to me if 
 necessary to minimize stress.) I feel terrible she is alone a lot of the time 
 and I have thought about bringing in another young FeLV + kitty for her, but 
 I am worried about causing stress, having it backfire. I have all the 
 patience in the world when it comes to having cats work out issues, but I'm 
 also very careful when bringing in a new cat, quarantining for a couple of 
 weeks, letting her explore while I put others in other rooms, etc. But I 
 wouldn't have that ability to do so with a companion for Dani as I literally 
 don't have any rooms left. 
 
 Sorry for such a long post! I really want to do right by her. I love her to 
 pieces.
 
 Thank you!
 
 Laura and Dani girl
  
 
 
 
 
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Re: [Felvtalk] Introduction

2013-02-04 Thread dlgegg
Hi, Laura,
back again.  just read the rest of your story.  My top number has been 7, don't 
know how you do it with 17.  It sems we all agree that giving love, reducing 
stress and feeding hihg quality food is the best route to go. Annie was also 
very stressed before I got her.  She lost her owner of 4 years, was left alone 
in a trailer for 3 weeks with somjeone to change her box and feed her, no 
interaction.  Then they stuffed her in a box, brought her to the vet and then I 
brought her home to a 2 story house, another cat and 2 new humans.  She spent 
the first week or so in the basement with midnight trips up for food and water. 
 She is still skittish, especially when Harley, Casey or Homie decide to stalk 
her, but other than that, is doing very well.  
By all means, if you wat to, adopt another positive cat to give her company, 
but you might also want to consider allowing her into the house with the others 
- providing everyone gets along

 Cindy McHugh ci...@furangels.org wrote: 
 Hi Laura,
 
 I don’t have a lot of advice for you, as my experience with FeLV is somewhat 
 limited. I joined the list when one of the ferals I was feeding tested 
 positive when I had him neutered. He lived in our spare room until I found 
 him a forever home 10 months later. During this time, he shared the room with 
 another feral from the colony. I first tried keeping him by himself, but he 
 was too stressed. Our vet didn’t think the other cat had a high risk of 
 contracting the disease since he was an adult and they had already lived 
 together, shared food bowls, etc. I had the other cat tested months after the 
 FeLV cat was adopted and he was fine. 
 
 I think it’s an excellent idea to try integrating another cat with your wee 
 kitten. Sadly, most FeLV cats are euthanized and never given the chance 
 you’re giving Dani. So an addition would save another life. Since she’s so 
 young, I think she’d most likely welcome the company. (But this is just my 
 opinion.)
 
 I just wanted to say thank you for looking past Dani’s disease and loving her 
 for who she is. I’m praying she fights off the virus and lives a long and 
 healthy life.
 
 Cindy
 
 From: laurak...@aol.com 
 Sent: Sunday, February 03, 2013 5:57 PM
 To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
 Subject: [Felvtalk] Introduction
 
 Hi everyone, 
 
 I am new to this group--and new to FeLV. I just took in an FeLV+ kitty from 
 the shelter where I am a volunteer. Her name is Dani and she is beautiful. 
 Long story short, she and her three siblings were found outside in a box when 
 they were about a week old. They came to the shelter and tested positive for 
 FeLV (ELISA).  They were retested and again it was positive. At 9 weeks, they 
 had an IFA test, all positive. During this time, they were bottle fed until 
 about 8 weeks, shuttled to and from the shelter by a staff member. They were 
 also treated for URIs with azithromycin. The shelter cultures all incoming 
 cats for ringworm and unfortunately theirs came back positive, so they were 
 dipped in lyme a couple of times a week for a while and put on Itraconazole. 
 Dani took longer to shake it off and so was completely alone for some time. 
 During their time at the shelter they were vaccinated with 2 rounds of FVRCP, 
 a rabies vaccine and spayed/neutered. Sadly, Dani's littermates all came down 
 with different issues (I don't know all the details, but I know the vet 
 suspected FIP) and were euthanized. Little Dani was left alone, in a bathroom 
 with no windows, and not many visitors. The second I found out about her, I 
 set up the sun room off my bedroom (it was unheated but fixed that fast) and 
 took her home. 
 
 Anyway, I wanted to give the whole background so you know just how much she 
 has been through in her short life. While even here it is not optimal--she is 
 isolated--it is so much better than being stuck in the stuffy bathroom. Here, 
 she bird watches, has a ton of toys, a much better diet and a ton of cuddles 
 (though not as much as I wish. I have 17 other cats.) 
 
 I have two big questions: is it possible for her to become negative with a 
 positive IFA result at 9 weeks? And, second: how do I best care for her? I 
 have her on a high quality canned only diet (wellness and weruva--no fish) 
 and minimize stress as much as possible. Are there supplements I should be 
 giving? Are NuCat vitamins recommended? Are my food choices OK for her? I 
 will never vaccinate or even take her to a vet (I'd have one come to me if 
 necessary to minimize stress.) I feel terrible she is alone a lot of the time 
 and I have thought about bringing in another young FeLV + kitty for her, but 
 I am worried about causing stress, having it backfire. I have all the 
 patience in the world when it comes to having cats work out issues, but I'm 
 also very careful when bringing in a new cat, quarantining for a couple of 
 weeks, letting her explore while I put others in other rooms, etc. But I 
 wouldn't 

Re: [Felvtalk] hissing

2013-02-04 Thread dlgegg
If hissing spread FELV, my whole crew would have it by now.  We all do a lot of 
hissing and slapping.

 Beth create_me_...@yahoo.com wrote: 
 It is spread through saliva, but probably not likely to be passed by 
 momentary hissing.

Beth 

Don't Litter, Fix Your Critter! www.Furkids.org
 



 From: (ra)chel kandyrac...@gmail.com
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Sent: Monday, February 4, 2013 4:52 PM
Subject: [Felvtalk] hissing
 
I was just wondering, how likely is it that FeLV can be spread through
a moment of hissing?

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Re: [Felvtalk] War on Cats and Others

2013-02-04 Thread dlgegg
AMEN!  COULD NOT HAVE SAID IT BETTER.  I WOULD RATHER DEAL WITH AN ANIMAL, WILD 
OR TAME ANY DAY THAN HUMANS.  God never should have given us dominion over the 
world, we are not worthy of that position!


 Marcia Baronda marciabmar...@gmail.com wrote: 
 Love it love it love it!!! You hit the nail on the head Lee, cats kill from 
 instinct and hunger. Humans  kill from ego. It makes me sick (what humans 
 do). We pulled up into the driveway last night and a bunny ran across. My 
 husband said to me, isn't it amazing how the cats don't seem to bother these 
 rabbits?  yes it's amazing! Humans are amazing. They come up with the most 
 wonderful ideas, like gestation crates, a lovely form of all sorts of 
 deprivation. What bothers me is that we think we have the RIGHT to do what we 
 do to other beings. OK, I'm done. Thanks for the email(-:
 
 Marcia
 
 Sent from my iPad that my most awesome kids surprised me with, Christmas 
 2010. 
 
 On Feb 3, 2013, at 10:57 AM, Alev alev_dur...@yahoo.com wrote:
 
  Lee,
  
  I couldnt agree more, thank you for this email, I will never stop talking 
  about animal rights to people,
  take care
  
  Sent from my iPhone
  
  On Feb 2, 2013, at 5:41 AM, Lee Evans moonsiste...@yahoo.com wrote:
  
  There is so much nonsense, mythology and prejudice going around when it 
  comes to diseases in general, whether cat, dog or human that it's a wonder 
  any of us survive the ignorance rather than the disease. An acquaintance 
  of mine was told by a licensed veterinarian that she needed to have her 
  healthy FIV+ cat euthanized because humans can catch it from cats. Meow? 
  My tenant, when I had a rent house, insisted that FIV was highly 
  contagious but FeLv was NOT. Tail backwards. People to this day refuse to 
  hug a person who is living with HIV but will shake hands with someone who 
  has a horrid head cold and get all chummy with people who are coughing all 
  over the air.
  
  Many veterinarians seem not to like cats to the point of finding reasons 
  to put them to death. Others are simply too lazy to study new theories of 
  medicine. In some cases, we have not traveled more than inches away from 
  dancing around the bonfire to banish evil spirits as a cure for illness.
  
  Finally, we are now being treated to amazingly inflated statistics from 
  almost comic studies that produced the startling news that cats kill rats 
  and mice. Who would have thought!! Not just some rats and mice  but toss 
  in moles, voles and gophers, not to mention those things with wings that 
  mostly fly.  Stir with a hefty dose of sensationalism due to a slow news 
  day, and you come up with BILLIONS of small mammals and birds being 
  slaughtered and exterminated by feral cats. Please don't mention though 
  that humans  have hunted dozens of species to extinction just to have a 
  head to hang on the wall or a rug for the floor, or as a way to stop male 
  sexual dysfunction, or to carve into little statues or furniture 
  (elephants) or just as a lovely delicacy to eat at a way overpriced fancy 
  restaurant. (shark fin soup and other disgusting dishes). Sometimes it 
  seems like humans will kill everything from snails to whales for the most 
  trivial or ridiculous reason. However, just let it be known that cats kill 
  mice and rats for a living and you have panic in the streets. Ah well, 
  time to get off my soap box and go to bed.
  
   
  Spay and Neuter your cats and dogs and your weird relatives and nasty 
  neighbors too!
  
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Re: [Felvtalk] War on Cats and Others

2013-02-04 Thread dlgegg
This is what I keep trying to tell people around here.  It seems their minds 
are completely closed on the subject, so I say let them get overrun by mice, 
etc.  My house is mice free thanks to my 65 girls and 1 boy, all of whom ae 
spayed/neutered.  I was over run with mice once when my cats were all too old 
to chase them anymore.  That ended when my new pride adopted me one by one.
And I live in the middle of the woods.
 Lee Evans moonsiste...@yahoo.com wrote: 
 All these killer cat articles are a backlash against TNR. It's unfortunate 
 that some people are so mentally paralyzed that they don't realize that 
 spaying and neutering a cat (or dog) will stop the reproductive cycle. A 
 spayed cat is a spayed cat, one cat. An intact cat is a cat and then more and 
 more cats with each birth of kittens. I have spoken to people who say, Well 
 yes, but even if you spay the cat you still have a cat. Using this logic, any 
 time you have a quantity of individuals who are considered too many, 
 including human overpopulation you should look towards a solution that 
 involves killing the individuals, which instantly rids the area of the 
 unwanted human or non human but doesn't solve the long term problem of 
 overpopulation. Hitler tried this form of birth control, killing those 
 individuals that he thought were not valuable and should not reproduce. 
 Obviously, it didn't work too well. Any time killing is involved in population
  control, there will be people who will not go along with the program because 
 of issues like compassion and aversion to death.

Now here's a true study. There was a town in Arizona or Colorado (not sure 
which State) that did have a large number of free-roaming cats. They did trap 
them and kill them and were down to very few cats. Most of the remaining cats 
were kept inside. It was actually against the law to allow cats outside. Mother 
Nature hates to be tampered with. In a year, the town was overrun by rats and 
mice and crop eating small mammals. People were so upset that the City Council 
voted to import several hundred cats from shelters in surrounding towns so that 
they could rebuild their outside cat population.  It seems that in spite of the 
150 million estimate of cats and the billions of dead mice and rats and birds, 
we see no dearth of mice, rats and birds, including song birds. And yes, cats 
are an introduced species although the cat family of larger cats such as 
mountain lions, bob cats and others were here already when explorers arrived to 
settle this continent.
  There was a good reason why the cats came along. If they hadn't, the rats 
 and mice that infested the ships would have eaten the food supplies before 
 the ships could complete the journey. All that would have been left would 
 have been skeletons of starved to death settlers. 


 
Spay and Neuter your cats and dogs and your weird relatives and nasty neighbors 
too!






 From: Kathryn Hargreaves khargrea...@gmail.com
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Sent: Sunday, February 3, 2013 10:02 PM
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] War on Cats and Others
 

Take heart: 
http://www.npr.org/blogs/13.7/2013/02/03/170851048/do-we-really-know-that-cats-kill-by-the-billions-not-so-fast



On Sat, Feb 2, 2013 at 1:41 AM, Lee Evans moonsiste...@yahoo.com wrote:

There is so much nonsense, mythology and prejudice going around when it 
comes to diseases in general, whether cat, dog or human that it's a 
wonder any of us survive the ignorance rather than the disease. An 
acquaintance of mine was told by a licensed veterinarian that she needed to 
have her healthy FIV+ cat euthanized because humans can catch it 
from cats. Meow? My tenant, when I had a rent house, insisted that FIV 
was highly contagious but FeLv was NOT. Tail backwards. People to this 
day refuse to hug a person who is living with HIV but will shake hands 
with someone who has a horrid head cold and get all chummy with people 
who are coughing all over the air.

Many veterinarians seem not to
 like cats to the point of finding reasons to put them to death. Others 
are simply too lazy to study new theories of medicine. In some cases, we
 have not traveled more than inches away from dancing around the bonfire
 to banish evil spirits as a cure for illness.

Finally, we are 
now being treated to amazingly inflated statistics from almost comic 
studies that produced the startling news that cats kill rats and mice. 
Who would have thought!! Not just some rats and mice  but toss in moles,
 voles and gophers, not to mention those things with wings that mostly 
fly.  Stir with a hefty dose of sensationalism due to a slow news day, 
and you come up with BILLIONS of small mammals and birds being 
slaughtered and exterminated by feral cats. Please don't mention though 
that humans  have hunted dozens of species to extinction just to have a 
head to hang on the wall or a rug for the floor, or as a way to stop 
male sexual dysfunction, or 

Re: [Felvtalk] Studies

2013-02-04 Thread dlgegg
RE:  your last paragraph   We need to exist only on synthetic food produced by 
chemicals and Monsanto and their friends.

 Lee Evans moonsiste...@yahoo.com wrote: 
 I noticed something about humans that is unique to our species. We seem to 
 have an endless ability to purposely misunderstand what is being said or 
 proposed.  And we put absolute faith in studies. As the secretary of an 
 animal rights organization, a genuine 501 c-3, I have been asked why I was 
 advocating that animals be given the same benefits as humans and wouldn't 
 that be terribly expensive. Duh? I think these people were mostly worried 
 about their own right to eat cows, chickens, sheep, pigs, turkeys, and other 
 edible beings. But I even hear, on occasion that animal rights advocates want 
 there to be some form of education for animals and that if we have our way, 
 there would eventually be no more animals on Earth because we are against 
 ;breeding dogs and cats, etc.. Really!  And when I happened to mention animal 
 welfare, I got the response that there are enough lazy people on welfare, we 
 don't need to put animals on welfare in addition. Welcome to
  the Twilight Zoned Out.

OK. I feel it necessary to clear up all these misconceptions  with a name 
change. From now on I will tell people I am an Animal Advocate. That means that 
I speak up for animals. Right? Except in UK where it would mean that an animal 
can hire me as a lawyer. 

I also seem to have read somewhere that rats, mice, voles, etc. reproduce, much 
as any other mammal does. A study shows that if the entire New York Sewer 
system was emptied of rats and mice and a few alligators, if a male and female 
rat and a male and female mouse were to be placed there on January 1, in just 
under a year, the entire New York Sewer system would have the same number of 
rodents as it had before. This study is based on absolutely no verifiable 
research, and is simply a product of an over-active imagination. As is the 
study that cats kill BILLIONS of small mammals and birds each year.

I need a cup of coffee. Uh, no. Last study I read, coffee was not good for the 
health. But that was refuted  by the former study that it is good for the 
health and can prevent senility. However, I can't have a sandwich any more 
because whole wheat or any wheat, oats, bananas, orange juice, and most food is 
a health hazard, except for animal based food I guess because I haven't seen 
any studies recently to prove that animal protein is harmful and the myth of 
clogged arteries from animal fat has been debunked, rebunked and debunked 
again. I'm down to eating floor dust.


 
Spay and Neuter your cats and dogs and your weird relatives and nasty neighbors 
too!






 From: Alev alev_dur...@yahoo.com
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Sent: Sunday, February 3, 2013 10:57 AM
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] War on Cats and Others
 

Lee,


I couldnt agree more, thank you for this email, I will never stop talking 
about animal rights to people,
take care

Sent from my iPhone

On Feb 2, 2013, at 5:41 AM, Lee Evans moonsiste...@yahoo.com wrote:


There is so much nonsense, mythology and prejudice going around when it 
comes to diseases in general, whether cat, dog or human that it's a 
wonder any of us survive the ignorance rather than the disease. An 
acquaintance of mine was told by a licensed veterinarian that she needed to 
have her healthy FIV+ cat euthanized because humans can catch it 
from cats. Meow? My tenant, when I had a rent house, insisted that FIV 
was highly contagious but FeLv was NOT. Tail backwards. People to this 
day refuse to hug a person who is living with HIV but will shake hands 
with someone who has a horrid head cold and get all chummy with people 
who are coughing all over the air.

Many veterinarians seem not to
 like cats to the point of finding reasons to put them to death. Others 
are simply too lazy to study new theories of medicine. In some cases, we
 have not traveled more than inches away from dancing around the bonfire
 to banish evil spirits as a cure for illness.

Finally, we are 
now being treated to amazingly inflated statistics from almost comic 
studies that produced the startling news that cats kill rats and mice. 
Who would have thought!! Not just some rats and mice  but toss in moles,
 voles and gophers, not to mention those things with wings that mostly 
fly.  Stir with a hefty dose of sensationalism due to a slow news day, 
and you come up with BILLIONS of small mammals and birds being 
slaughtered and exterminated by feral cats. Please don't mention though 
that humans  have hunted dozens of species to extinction just to have a 
head to hang on the wall or a rug for the floor, or as a way to stop 
male sexual dysfunction, or to carve into little statues or furniture 
(elephants) or just as a lovely delicacy to eat at a way overpriced 
fancy restaurant. (shark fin soup and other
 disgusting