Re: [Felvtalk] Thank you for your help

2009-08-13 Thread Belinda Sauro

  Hi Gloria,
 It is suppose to have a kind of hypnotic effect on them to keep them 
clam, I think it simulates the way a mom kitty holds her kitten, can't 
say I noticed that with Fred but he figured since he couldn't reach me 
to bite me anymore it wasn't worth it to try so he stopped after a week, 
maybe not even that long and he is very mellow ever since getting his 
fluids.  I know he feels better and I think he had figured that out too.


Here is the story on it:

http://www.felinecrf.org/giving_sub-qs_syringe.htm#clothes_peg_trick

PS.  the first picture is the kitty without the clothes pins.

--

Belinda
happiness is being owned by cats ...

http://bemikitties.com

http://BelindaSauro.com


___
Felvtalk mailing list
Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org


Re: [Felvtalk] Thank you for your help

2009-08-12 Thread Sharyl
Lorrie,
Just a comment about CRF kitties.  My Pequita was dx with CRF over 3 yrs ago.  
She'll be 17 this Oct.  She has been on meds and daily sub q fluids for most of 
those 3 yrs.  I assist feed her several times per day.  She will only eat from 
a baby spoon.  I do the meds, feedings and fluids on her terms and she is doing 
fine.

Often when a kitty crashed they are are very resistant to treatment.  It is all 
new and strange for them.  Once the person develops a treatment schedule things 
usually go a lot better.  Like people, cats like to know what is going to 
happen and when it is going to happen.  

I just don't want people here to think that treating CRF or any chronic disease 
should not be attempted.  Each kitty is unique and will respond to treatment 
plans differently.  Often members of the CRF group are in a panic mode and are 
still dealing with a kitty in crisis.  You don't know how yours will respond 
until you try.   

Whatever problem our beloved companions have we need to remember to love them 
and treasure each day we have together.
Sharyl

--- On Wed, 8/12/09, Lorrie felineres...@kvinet.com wrote:

 From: Lorrie felineres...@kvinet.com
 Subject: [Felvtalk] Thank you for your help
 To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
 Date: Wednesday, August 12, 2009, 7:46 AM
 Dear Friends, I want to thank all of
 you for your help and advice
 about the FelV cat in my cageless FelV shelter who is
 slowly wasting
 away.  I really appreciate your caring
 responses.  I did not want to
 take Mimi to the vet to be PTS, as it is so stressful for
 her, and
 you helped me make my decision to just love and comfort her
 where she
 is now, in her favorite sleeping place.
 
 Frank, I too am haunted by the memory of taking a dying cat
 to the
 vet and watching him use what little strength he had left
 to fight
 going there.  It was awful, and unless a cat is in
 extreme pain I
 will never do this again.
 
 Maybe I shouldn't comment on this here, but I also have a
 cat who
 is 16 years old and has the beginnings of CRF, so I joined
 the CRF
 group, but I only stayed there about a week.  It tore
 my guts out to
 read about the horrendous things so many of the members
 were putting
 their very old, (16 to 19 years old) termininally ill cats
 through
 They described how the cats no longer came to them for
 love, as they
 knew they'd be poked and prodded!   It
 seemed everyone in the group
 was determined to keep their cats alive no matter what they
 put them
 through. I couldn't stand reading about it, so I dropped
 out. The
 members of this FelV group seem to have a more realistic
 attitude.
 We will all die someday, and keeping people or animals
 alive on
 tubes and needles is not the way I want to leave this
 earth!
 
 Lorrie
 
 
 ___
 Felvtalk mailing list
 Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
 http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
 


  

___
Felvtalk mailing list
Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org


Re: [Felvtalk] Thank you for your help

2009-08-12 Thread MaryChristine
i think it's really natural for us to want to try EVERYTHING to help our
beloved ones, even when, sometimes, it's in our best interests and not
really theirs. that's what i believe that i have learned from my cats in
their final days. i know that, early on, i kept some of mine around
longer than i would do now, but not from meanness, rather from lack of
awareness. i had to learn... to separate out their needs from mine, to ask
them what they needed, to truly listen to what they were telling me.

people learn at different rates; i try very hard (not always successfully,
as those reading another FeLV list can attest) not to judge others'
progress.

i actually have a kitty in terminal crf right now; she bit the hell out of
me the last two times i tried to hydrate her. she's my remaining heartcat,
and her refusing treatment is killing me--but how can i not honor her
choices, after all she's given me through the years? she's the official
international spokescat for the Calico Liberation Coalition, CaLiCo, a
4-paw-declawed, harlequin girl that refuses to purr tho will, very
occasionally, practice Rhythmic Growling--to force her to do anything would
be an assault on her very cathood. she's someplace close to 16 years
old, and has blessed my life with bite wounds and attiTUDE for over ten
years now--i adore her, and know completely that in her furry little
multicolored heart, she  feels the same way toward me. i will do what is
best for her when her job on this earth is complete; no matter how much it
pains me--i know that she will tell me if she needs help, tho actually i'm
just hoping she'll allow me to be with her when the time comes, and not just
leave me an email.

the wisest advice i've ever gotten, though, is that it's best to send them
across the bridge one day too soon, than five minutes too late. feeling
guilty about their, not being ready, when they weren't yet suffering, is
pointless, but nothing compared to the knowledge that one has waited too
long.

sometimes, tho, we need to go through the latter to understand. we need to
be gentle with one another as we learn these horrible lessons. and hope that
what we learn so painfully can help someone else learn them with less
difficulty.



-- 
Spay  Neuter Your Neighbors!
Maybe That'll Make The Difference

MaryChristine
Special-Needs Coordinator, Purebred Cat Breed Rescue (www.purebredcats.org)
Member, SCAT (Special-Cat Action Team)
___
Felvtalk mailing list
Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org


Re: [Felvtalk] Thank you for your help

2009-08-12 Thread Amy Dalgliesh
MaryChristine,
What is it about those sassy, fiesty, independant calico girls that makes us 
love them so?  We must be suckers for punishment, cause they sure do love to 
dole it out.  One of mine is ancient, weighs less than 6 lbs, toothless and I 
still can't pill her.  She's the smallest cat of the bunch, but she can move a 
15 lb male from his bowl of canned food just by staring at him.  I'm crazy 
about her and I celebrate her attitude.

--- On Wed, 8/12/09, MaryChristine twelvehousec...@gmail.com wrote:


From: MaryChristine twelvehousec...@gmail.com
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Thank you for your help
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Date: Wednesday, August 12, 2009, 11:12 AM


i think it's really natural for us to want to try EVERYTHING to help our
beloved ones, even when, sometimes, it's in our best interests and not
really theirs. that's what i believe that i have learned from my cats in
their final days. i know that, early on, i kept some of mine around
longer than i would do now, but not from meanness, rather from lack of
awareness. i had to learn... to separate out their needs from mine, to ask
them what they needed, to truly listen to what they were telling me.

people learn at different rates; i try very hard (not always successfully,
as those reading another FeLV list can attest) not to judge others'
progress.

i actually have a kitty in terminal crf right now; she bit the hell out of
me the last two times i tried to hydrate her. she's my remaining heartcat,
and her refusing treatment is killing me--but how can i not honor her
choices, after all she's given me through the years? she's the official
international spokescat for the Calico Liberation Coalition, CaLiCo, a
4-paw-declawed, harlequin girl that refuses to purr tho will, very
occasionally, practice Rhythmic Growling--to force her to do anything would
be an assault on her very cathood. she's someplace close to 16 years
old, and has blessed my life with bite wounds and attiTUDE for over ten
years now--i adore her, and know completely that in her furry little
multicolored heart, she  feels the same way toward me. i will do what is
best for her when her job on this earth is complete; no matter how much it
pains me--i know that she will tell me if she needs help, tho actually i'm
just hoping she'll allow me to be with her when the time comes, and not just
leave me an email.

the wisest advice i've ever gotten, though, is that it's best to send them
across the bridge one day too soon, than five minutes too late. feeling
guilty about their, not being ready, when they weren't yet suffering, is
pointless, but nothing compared to the knowledge that one has waited too
long.

sometimes, tho, we need to go through the latter to understand. we need to
be gentle with one another as we learn these horrible lessons. and hope that
what we learn so painfully can help someone else learn them with less
difficulty.



-- 
Spay  Neuter Your Neighbors!
Maybe That'll Make The Difference

MaryChristine
Special-Needs Coordinator, Purebred Cat Breed Rescue (www.purebredcats.org)
Member, SCAT (Special-Cat Action Team)
___
Felvtalk mailing list
Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org



  
___
Felvtalk mailing list
Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org


Re: [Felvtalk] Thank you for your help

2009-08-12 Thread MaryChristine
it's the red gene, i'm told

On Wed, Aug 12, 2009 at 12:44 PM, Amy Dalgliesh ajdalgli...@yahoo.comwrote:

 MaryChristine,
 What is it about those sassy, fiesty, independant calico girls that makes
 us love them so?  We must be suckers for punishment, cause they sure do love
 to dole it out.  One of mine is ancient, weighs less than 6 lbs, toothless
 and I still can't pill her.  She's the smallest cat of the bunch, but she
 can move a 15 lb male from his bowl of canned food just by staring at him.
 I'm crazy about her and I celebrate her attitude.

 --- On Wed, 8/12/09, MaryChristine twelvehousec...@gmail.com wrote:


 From: MaryChristine twelvehousec...@gmail.com
 Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Thank you for your help
 To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
 Date: Wednesday, August 12, 2009, 11:12 AM


 i think it's really natural for us to want to try EVERYTHING to help our
 beloved ones, even when, sometimes, it's in our best interests and not
 really theirs. that's what i believe that i have learned from my cats in
 their final days. i know that, early on, i kept some of mine around
 longer than i would do now, but not from meanness, rather from lack of
 awareness. i had to learn... to separate out their needs from mine, to ask
 them what they needed, to truly listen to what they were telling me.

 people learn at different rates; i try very hard (not always successfully,
 as those reading another FeLV list can attest) not to judge others'
 progress.

 i actually have a kitty in terminal crf right now; she bit the hell out of
 me the last two times i tried to hydrate her. she's my remaining heartcat,
 and her refusing treatment is killing me--but how can i not honor her
 choices, after all she's given me through the years? she's the official
 international spokescat for the Calico Liberation Coalition, CaLiCo, a
 4-paw-declawed, harlequin girl that refuses to purr tho will, very
 occasionally, practice Rhythmic Growling--to force her to do anything would
 be an assault on her very cathood. she's someplace close to 16 years
 old, and has blessed my life with bite wounds and attiTUDE for over ten
 years now--i adore her, and know completely that in her furry little
 multicolored heart, she  feels the same way toward me. i will do what is
 best for her when her job on this earth is complete; no matter how much it
 pains me--i know that she will tell me if she needs help, tho actually i'm
 just hoping she'll allow me to be with her when the time comes, and not
 just
 leave me an email.

 the wisest advice i've ever gotten, though, is that it's best to send them
 across the bridge one day too soon, than five minutes too late. feeling
 guilty about their, not being ready, when they weren't yet suffering, is
 pointless, but nothing compared to the knowledge that one has waited too
 long.

 sometimes, tho, we need to go through the latter to understand. we need to
 be gentle with one another as we learn these horrible lessons. and hope
 that
 what we learn so painfully can help someone else learn them with less
 difficulty.



 --
 Spay  Neuter Your Neighbors!
 Maybe That'll Make The Difference

 MaryChristine
 Special-Needs Coordinator, Purebred Cat Breed Rescue (www.purebredcats.org
 )
 Member, SCAT (Special-Cat Action Team)
 ___
 Felvtalk mailing list
 Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
 http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org




 ___
 Felvtalk mailing list
 Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
 http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org




-- 
Spay  Neuter Your Neighbors!
Maybe That'll Make The Difference

MaryChristine
Special-Needs Coordinator, Purebred Cat Breed Rescue (www.purebredcats.org)
Member, SCAT (Special-Cat Action Team)
___
Felvtalk mailing list
Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org


Re: [Felvtalk] Thank you for your help

2009-08-12 Thread Belinda Sauro

My thoughts on this:

It tore my guts out to read about the horrendous things so many of the members 
were putting their very old, (16 to 19 years old) termininally ill cats 
through
I just want to give another perspective, Fred is 18 or so now, he was 15 
when he was diagnosed very early CRF and hyper thyroid, I'm on the CRF 
list you spoke of and I can't thank all of them for all the support I 
have gotten to keep Fred going.  When I first started doing the fluids 
he needs daily he would bite me, he didn't like it, but after a week of 
using clothes pins on him he accepted it and has been getting them for 
over 2 years with no problems.  Did it hurt him to put clothes pins down 
his neck for a week, no, I tried it on myself first, it felt like 
pressure but there was no pain, and he still tried to bite me but 
realised he couldn't reach me anymore and gave up.


He also gets pills 4 or 5 times a day and of course he doesn't love it 
but my way of thinking is if you add it all up for the 30 minutes or so 
a day that it totals for the time I have to give him pills and fluids, 
he has lived a good quality of life for 3 more years ... I guarantee you 
he would have died years ago without my intervention.


When anyone animal, person doesn't feel good they don't want to be 
messed with, I know that from my own experience, when I am sick, I don't 
want to eat or drink or want anyone to bother me.  That doesn't mean I 
want to die.  Once you get over the hump with help from your family and 
meds and feel better things get back to somewhat normal, as normal as 
they can be when you have a terminal condition.  Yes I know at some 
point Fred will eventually not do as well and no matter what I do will 
keep getting worse because I do know CRF doesn't get cured BUT I will do 
everything I can to keep Fred here with me feeling as well as can be 
expected with his age and condition.  Am I selfish, perhaps, but as you 
said, this is what I would want for myself, I am not leaving easily when 
it is my time and everyone that knows me knows that.


Fred used to sleep on my pillow every night but I have his bed set up 
with everything but the litter box right there for him, so he prefers to 
stay there, he still comes in on occasion and stays a while, then goes 
back to his room.  Do I think he doesn't like me anymore, no, he comes 
to me many times throughout the day and sits on my chest a few minutes 
so I can love him but he doesn't like me to give him his pills and if he 
weren't so lazy and a little weak he probably would run and hide, but it 
takes all of 10 seconds and it is over.  It took a good 8 months or so 
to get him stable when we first found out he was CRF, he stopped eating 
and got a feeding tube.  He gained back all the weight he lost and and 
pulled the tube out himself.  Up until recently was keeping his weight 
pretty stable.  He is losing weight now, he has virtually no muscle in 
either back leg and I can see he is getting to the point where things 
are going to start deteriorating as they do with this condition.  I 
don't know how much longer we have but as long as he enjoys going out to 
lay in the sun, enjoys spending time with me I will do everything in my 
power to keep him going.


Do I think anything I have done to keep Fred with me is horrendous, no, 
some people may, but I don't.  I have gotten 3 more years of some very 
good memories with my Fred and I think for the most part Fred has 
enjoyed being here those 3 extra years.  Everyone has their own ideas 
about quality of life, I personally think some people give up too early 
because of my beliefs and sometimes it is very hard for me to not say 
something but then I remember it is their pet and as long as whatever 
they are doing is out of love for that pet then I really can't say 
anything.  What one person thinks is horrendous is loving and 
compassionate care to another.  We can only do what we think is best for 
those in our care according to what our beliefs are ...


When it is obvious to me that nothing I do will make any difference 
anymore then I will let Fred go.  At some point the body, animal or 
human just can't go on anymore and when that is evident then I know I 
have done all I can I won't be happy about it but ...



Belinda
happiness is being owned by cats ...

http://bemikitties.com

http://BelindaSauro.com


___
Felvtalk mailing list
Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org


Re: [Felvtalk] Thank you for your help

2009-08-12 Thread Gloria B. Lane
I have to ask, Belinda - what are the clothes pins for?  Have had CRF  
cats, never tried that.


Gloria



On Aug 12, 2009, at 1:11 PM, Belinda Sauro wrote:


   My thoughts on this:
It tore my guts out to read about the horrendous things so many of  
the members were putting their very old, (16 to 19 years old)  
termininally ill cats through
I just want to give another perspective, Fred is 18 or so now, he  
was 15 when he was diagnosed very early CRF and hyper thyroid, I'm  
on the CRF list you spoke of and I can't thank all of them for all  
the support I have gotten to keep Fred going.  When I first started  
doing the fluids he needs daily he would bite me, he didn't like it,  
but after a week of using clothes pins on him he accepted it and has  
been getting them for over 2 years with no problems.  Did it hurt  
him to put clothes pins down his neck for a week, no, I tried it on  
myself first, it felt like pressure but there was no pain, and he  
still tried to bite me but realised he couldn't reach me anymore and  
gave up.


He also gets pills 4 or 5 times a day and of course he doesn't love  
it but my way of thinking is if you add it all up for the 30 minutes  
or so a day that it totals for the time I have to give him pills and  
fluids, he has lived a good quality of life for 3 more years ... I  
guarantee you he would have died years ago without my intervention.


When anyone animal, person doesn't feel good they don't want to be  
messed with, I know that from my own experience, when I am sick, I  
don't want to eat or drink or want anyone to bother me.  That  
doesn't mean I want to die.  Once you get over the hump with help  
from your family and meds and feel better things get back to  
somewhat normal, as normal as they can be when you have a terminal  
condition.  Yes I know at some point Fred will eventually not do as  
well and no matter what I do will keep getting worse because I do  
know CRF doesn't get cured BUT I will do everything I can to keep  
Fred here with me feeling as well as can be expected with his age  
and condition.  Am I selfish, perhaps, but as you said, this is what  
I would want for myself, I am not leaving easily when it is my time  
and everyone that knows me knows that.


Fred used to sleep on my pillow every night but I have his bed set  
up with everything but the litter box right there for him, so he  
prefers to stay there, he still comes in on occasion and stays a  
while, then goes back to his room.  Do I think he doesn't like me  
anymore, no, he comes to me many times throughout the day and sits  
on my chest a few minutes so I can love him but he doesn't like me  
to give him his pills and if he weren't so lazy and a little weak he  
probably would run and hide, but it takes all of 10 seconds and it  
is over.  It took a good 8 months or so to get him stable when we  
first found out he was CRF, he stopped eating and got a feeding  
tube.  He gained back all the weight he lost and and pulled the tube  
out himself.  Up until recently was keeping his weight pretty  
stable.  He is losing weight now, he has virtually no muscle in  
either back leg and I can see he is getting to the point where  
things are going to start deteriorating as they do with this  
condition.  I don't know how much longer we have but as long as he  
enjoys going out to lay in the sun, enjoys spending time with me I  
will do everything in my power to keep him going.


Do I think anything I have done to keep Fred with me is horrendous,  
no, some people may, but I don't.  I have gotten 3 more years of  
some very good memories with my Fred and I think for the most part  
Fred has enjoyed being here those 3 extra years.  Everyone has their  
own ideas about quality of life, I personally think some people give  
up too early because of my beliefs and sometimes it is very hard for  
me to not say something but then I remember it is their pet and as  
long as whatever they are doing is out of love for that pet then I  
really can't say anything.  What one person thinks is horrendous is  
loving and compassionate care to another.  We can only do what we  
think is best for those in our care according to what our beliefs  
are ...


When it is obvious to me that nothing I do will make any difference  
anymore then I will let Fred go.  At some point the body, animal or  
human just can't go on anymore and when that is evident then I know  
I have done all I can I won't be happy about it but ...



Belinda
happiness is being owned by cats ...

http://bemikitties.com

http://BelindaSauro.com


___
Felvtalk mailing list
Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org



___
Felvtalk mailing list
Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org