RE: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up

2008-01-10 Thread Caroline Kaufmann

The saga continues with my sick cat Brumley.  I don't know what to do any more. 
 The conventional vet that saw him on Dec. 24 got the results back from the 
Toxoplasmosis test and is was neg. (I can't remember if I reported this info 
this site or not).  So when the Toxo test came back neg, the vet totally 
reversed gears from the day before (when he said he didn't think it was FIP b/c 
Brumley only test pos. for high globulin and high protein, but not a corona 
virus, antibody, etc.).  So he completely went back on that and said, 
basically, he thinks it's FIP b/c he has nothing else to go on and b/c Brumley 
is showing 2 of the 3 indicators of it (but still no wet indicators like the 
swollen belly).  I think it's the eye that is really throwing him off and I 
can't for the love of god, get any vet to explain/diagnose/tell me what to with 
that eye.  I have asked if I should be putting anything in it and both the 
conventional vet and my holistic vet just say no.  So, I had a phone consult 
about Brumley with my holistic vet and she reviewed the blood work and said she 
doesn't think it's FIP- that a severely dehydrated cat will have high globulin 
and high protein in the blood panel.  And the fact that is his neg. for corona- 
she just doesn't think it's FIP.  She has of course treated FIP cats/kittens 
and had some herself and she told me she has NEVER seen the dry form of FIP 
in a kitten (Brum's 7 mths)-- only in older, adult cats does the dry form come 
out.  She said she always sees it in kittens in the clear wet form with the 
swollen belly and other signs of fluid retention and then they die quickly.  
And Brum's been lingering on like this for a while now  
 
So, I just went about feeding him and making him comfy- moving him into the 
room with the other other guys (he'd already been exposed to them before I had 
him); stopped the subcu fluids b/c I didn't think he needs them.  I guess it's 
been two weeks since then and he just kind of hangs out-- eats- he always eats 
good- no matter what.  But about last week he seemed to lose some personality 
and he laid around a lot and stopped batting around toys.  By this past Sun., 
my mom and I were discussing that he had gone down, down and we were worried.  
I don't have a thermometer for cats, but I could tell he had a fever and just 
felt crappy (altho he still eats and drinks water when feeling bad!).  I gave 
him a fluid treatment- I thought his pink looked really white and thought it 
couldn't hurt.  The fluid bump hung around forever tho?  I got him in to see 
the holistic vet on Monday evening and my mom took him.  The Dr. kind of 
laughed off my mom's concerns that Brumley was going to die and that his eye 
looked horrible.  She told my mom she thinks he has something else going on 
besides the eye-- like some kind of infection somewhere else in the body, but 
she doesn't know where.  So she wanted me to stop his Clavamox and try some 
other immune boosting things.  Again, my mom asked about the eye and should we 
be putting anything in it to treat it, and the Dr. was just like no.  
 
So of course, Brum was better just the next day (Tues.) and I could tell the 
fever broke.  He was batting around a toy the very next morning.  Still eating 
great.
 
But then by Wed. night, he was just sleeping the whole time in a cubby hole, 
seemed to have a fever again and not playing (still eating tho).  So I thought, 
well maybe his holistic vet is right, he is working on fighting off some 
infection and when it gets too hard for his body to fight it, he succumbs a 
little bit and the fever comes back, etc.  So, this morning, it's the same.  
Lots of sleeping and fever still around.  Even worse, his eye looks worse.  I 
swear, it looks like the cavity or something is filled with blood b.c the eye 
appears to be a diff't color than the other and you can see that it looks like 
blood behind the eye.  So now, it looks bloodier and as if the blood has 
settled down to the bottom of the eye more- like it pooled there.  And now, 
there are even more cloudy/greyish white spots on the surface of the eyeball.  
Ugh.  I'm worried.  But my mom is worse-- she's a worry-wart prone to 
histrionics and having these two sick/down cats (Brum and Possum) with her 
around, literally sucks my will to live.  She just wants to keep running 
Brumley to vets b/c she thinks he needs something put into the eyeball and then 
she asks me how long can this go on (meaning how long do we give Brumley a 
chance to fight this off- which I now recall is the same GD thing my stupid 
sister said to me about Monkee after the blood transfusion...sigh).  And it's 
just killing me- the stress.  She totally makes it worse, so keeping her at bay 
is a draining task too.  
 
Plus, it's like, this isn't even my cat!  He technically belongs to the no-kill 
group I vol for, yet I am the only one dealing with the stress of his care and 
illness  It's only the other run-of-the-mill vols that 

RE: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up

2008-01-10 Thread Rosenfeldt, Diane
Caroline -- I wish I could offer some advice or insight, but I can't.
Just hopes that you can get a handle on what's going on with Brumley and
that he feels better soon.  Is there a way you can ask your mother to
step back and stop repeating stuff you've already talked about? ;-)
Sorry the situation is causing you such stress and anger and
frustration.  You are Brumley's angel, and have given him comfort and
peace in his chaotic little life.
 
Diane R.



From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Caroline
Kaufmann
Sent: Thursday, January 10, 2008 12:31 PM
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Subject: RE: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up


The saga continues with my sick cat Brumley.  I don't know what to do
any more.  The conventional vet that saw him on Dec. 24 got the results
back from the Toxoplasmosis test and is was neg. (I can't remember if I
reported this info this site or not).  So when the Toxo test came back
neg, the vet totally reversed gears from the day before (when he said he
didn't think it was FIP b/c Brumley only test pos. for high globulin and
high protein, but not a corona virus, antibody, etc.).  So he completely
went back on that and said, basically, he thinks it's FIP b/c he has
nothing else to go on and b/c Brumley is showing 2 of the 3 indicators
of it (but still no wet indicators like the swollen belly).  I think
it's the eye that is really throwing him off and I can't for the love of
god, get any vet to explain/diagnose/tell me what to with that eye.  I
have asked if I should be putting anything in it and both the
conventional vet and my holistic vet just say no.  So, I had a phone
consult about Brumley with my holistic vet and she reviewed the blood
work and said she doesn't think it's FIP- that a severely dehydrated cat
will have high globulin and high protein in the blood panel.  And the
fact that is his neg. for corona- she just doesn't think it's FIP.  She
has of course treated FIP cats/kittens and had some herself and she told
me she has NEVER seen the dry form of FIP in a kitten (Brum's 7
mths)-- only in older, adult cats does the dry form come out.  She said
she always sees it in kittens in the clear wet form with the swollen
belly and other signs of fluid retention and then they die quickly.  And
Brum's been lingering on like this for a while now  
 
So, I just went about feeding him and making him comfy- moving him into
the room with the other other guys (he'd already been exposed to them
before I had him); stopped the subcu fluids b/c I didn't think he needs
them.  I guess it's been two weeks since then and he just kind of hangs
out-- eats- he always eats good- no matter what.  But about last week he
seemed to lose some personality and he laid around a lot and stopped
batting around toys.  By this past Sun., my mom and I were discussing
that he had gone down, down and we were worried.  I don't have a
thermometer for cats, but I could tell he had a fever and just felt
crappy (altho he still eats and drinks water when feeling bad!).  I gave
him a fluid treatment- I thought his pink looked really white and
thought it couldn't hurt.  The fluid bump hung around forever tho?  I
got him in to see the holistic vet on Monday evening and my mom took
him.  The Dr. kind of laughed off my mom's concerns that Brumley was
going to die and that his eye looked horrible.  She told my mom she
thinks he has something else going on besides the eye-- like some kind
of infection somewhere else in the body, but she doesn't know where.  So
she wanted me to stop his Clavamox and try some other immune boosting
things.  Again, my mom asked about the eye and should we be putting
anything in it to treat it, and the Dr. was just like no.  
 
So of course, Brum was better just the next day (Tues.) and I could tell
the fever broke.  He was batting around a toy the very next morning.
Still eating great.
 
But then by Wed. night, he was just sleeping the whole time in a cubby
hole, seemed to have a fever again and not playing (still eating tho).
So I thought, well maybe his holistic vet is right, he is working on
fighting off some infection and when it gets too hard for his body to
fight it, he succumbs a little bit and the fever comes back, etc.  So,
this morning, it's the same.  Lots of sleeping and fever still around.
Even worse, his eye looks worse.  I swear, it looks like the cavity or
something is filled with blood b.c the eye appears to be a diff't color
than the other and you can see that it looks like blood behind the eye.
So now, it looks bloodier and as if the blood has settled down to the
bottom of the eye more- like it pooled there.  And now, there are even
more cloudy/greyish white spots on the surface of the eyeball.  Ugh.
I'm worried.  But my mom is worse-- she's a worry-wart prone to
histrionics and having these two sick/down cats (Brum and Possum) with
her around, literally sucks my will to live.  She just wants to keep
running Brumley

RE: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up

2008-01-10 Thread MacKenzie, Kerry N.
Caroline, altho I unfortunately won't be able to offer any diagnostic
suggestions myself, if you can send the pic to me at
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
I can try forwarding it to more experienced people.
I can well imagine how frustrated you must be. Thank goodness the little
soul can rely on *you* for care and love.
hugs, Kerry

  _  

From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Caroline
Kaufmann
Sent: Thursday, January 10, 2008 12:31 PM
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Subject: RE: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up


The saga continues with my sick cat Brumley.  I don't know what to do
any more.  The conventional vet that saw him on Dec. 24 got the results
back from the Toxoplasmosis test and is was neg. (I can't remember if I
reported this info this site or not).  So when the Toxo test came back
neg, the vet totally reversed gears from the day before (when he said he
didn't think it was FIP b/c Brumley only test pos. for high globulin and
high protein, but not a corona virus, antibody, etc.).  So he completely
went back on that and said, basically, he thinks it's FIP b/c he has
nothing else to go on and b/c Brumley is showing 2 of the 3 indicators
of it (but still no wet indicators like the swollen belly).  I think
it's the eye that is really throwing him off and I can't for the love of
god, get any vet to explain/diagnose/tell me what to with that eye.  I
have asked if I should be putting anything in it and both the
conventional vet and my holistic vet just say no.  So, I had a phone
consult about Brumley with my holistic vet and she reviewed the blood
work and said she doesn't think it's FIP- that a severely dehydrated cat
will have high globulin and high protein in the blood panel.  And the
fact that is his neg. for corona- she just doesn't think it's FIP.  She
has of course treated FIP cats/kittens and had some herself and she told
me she has NEVER seen the dry form of FIP in a kitten (Brum's 7
mths)-- only in older, adult cats does the dry form come out.  She said
she always sees it in kittens in the clear wet form with the swollen
belly and other signs of fluid retention and then they die quickly.  And
Brum's been lingering on like this for a while now  
 
So, I just went about feeding him and making him comfy- moving him into
the room with the other other guys (he'd already been exposed to them
before I had him); stopped the subcu fluids b/c I didn't think he needs
them.  I guess it's been two weeks since then and he just kind of hangs
out-- eats- he always eats good- no matter what.  But about last week he
seemed to lose some personality and he laid around a lot and stopped
batting around toys.  By this past Sun., my mom and I were discussing
that he had gone down, down and we were worried.  I don't have a
thermometer for cats, but I could tell he had a fever and just felt
crappy (altho he still eats and drinks water when feeling bad!).  I gave
him a fluid treatment- I thought his pink looked really white and
thought it couldn't hurt.  The fluid bump hung around forever tho?  I
got him in to see the holistic vet on Monday evening and my mom took
him.  The Dr. kind of laughed off my mom's concerns that Brumley was
going to die and that his eye looked horrible.  She told my mom she
thinks he has something else going on besides the eye-- like some kind
of infection somewhere else in the body, but she doesn't know where.  So
she wanted me to stop his Clavamox and try some other immune boosting
things.  Again, my mom asked about the eye and should we be putting
anything in it to treat it, and the Dr. was just like no.  
 
So of course, Brum was better just the next day (Tues.) and I could tell
the fever broke.  He was batting around a toy the very next morning.
Still eating great.
 
But then by Wed. night, he was just sleeping the whole time in a cubby
hole, seemed to have a fever again and not playing (still eating tho).
So I thought, well maybe his holistic vet is right, he is working on
fighting off some infection and when it gets too hard for his body to
fight it, he succumbs a little bit and the fever comes back, etc.  So,
this morning, it's the same.  Lots of sleeping and fever still around.
Even worse, his eye looks worse.  I swear, it looks like the cavity or
something is filled with blood b.c the eye appears to be a diff't color
than the other and you can see that it looks like blood behind the eye.
So now, it looks bloodier and as if the blood has settled down to the
bottom of the eye more- like it pooled there.  And now, there are even
more cloudy/greyish white spots on the surface of the eyeball.  Ugh.
I'm worried.  But my mom is worse-- she's a worry-wart prone to
histrionics and having these two sick/down cats (Brum and Possum) with
her around, literally sucks my will to live.  She just wants to keep
running Brumley to vets b/c she thinks he needs something put into the
eyeball and then she asks me how long can this go on (meaning how long
do we give Brumley a chance to fight

RE: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up

2008-01-10 Thread Caroline Kaufmann

Thanks- I will do so tonight when I get home.  
 
I did talk with the holistic vet again and she said when she saw the eye, she 
thought it reminded her of the scarring that can occur on a kitten's eye from 
reoccurring/untreated URI's-- all of which he did have, that came and went 
repeatedly, while the poor thing lingered in a condo and I just didn't get to 
him fast enough (b/c there were other kittens at the time languishing with 
things that seemed more serious that I needed to take in 1st).  So, I 
understand now why she didn't think we needed to put anything in it- b/c she 
thought it was permanent damage (which is what I was hoping I would be in time 
to stop/prevent).  She said if it was scarring like she initially thought, I 
wouldn't be seeing more cloudy spots.  So she asked if he was having discharge 
and told me what to give him based on that.  But he really doesn't have a 
discharge other than crusty brown that he has from both eyes (the healthy one 
too).  He does not have green/yellow/white discharge, or even excessive brown 
discharge from this eye.  So I asked her a follow-up ? based on that and I'm 
waiting to hear back.  
 
I have to give his eye a good look tonight and try to really determine if 
things have changed with it.  He so squirmy with me right now.  He looks like a 
sack of bones and yet, he's so strong when he wants to squirm away.  And he 
definitely doesn't see me as his angel because he runs away from me everytime 
he sees me!  He thinks of me as the treatment monster!
caroline  


Subject: RE: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-upDate: Thu, 10 Jan 2008 14:32:43 
-0600From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org




Caroline, altho I unfortunately won't be able to offer any diagnostic 
suggestions myself, if you can send the pic to me at [EMAIL PROTECTED]
I can try forwarding it to more experienced people.
I can well imagine how frustrated you must be. Thank goodness the little soul 
can rely on *you* for care and love.
hugs, Kerry


From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Caroline 
KaufmannSent: Thursday, January 10, 2008 12:31 PMTo: [EMAIL PROTECTED]: RE: OT: 
sick 6 mo kitten follow-up
The saga continues with my sick cat Brumley.  I don't know what to do any more. 
 The conventional vet that saw him on Dec. 24 got the results back from the 
Toxoplasmosis test and is was neg. (I can't remember if I reported this info 
this site or not).  So when the Toxo test came back neg, the vet totally 
reversed gears from the day before (when he said he didn't think it was FIP b/c 
Brumley only test pos. for high globulin and high protein, but not a corona 
virus, antibody, etc.).  So he completely went back on that and said, 
basically, he thinks it's FIP b/c he has nothing else to go on and b/c Brumley 
is showing 2 of the 3 indicators of it (but still no wet indicators like the 
swollen belly).  I think it's the eye that is really throwing him off and I 
can't for the love of god, get any vet to explain/diagnose/tell me what to with 
that eye.  I have asked if I should be putting anything in it and both the 
conventional vet and my holistic vet just say no.  So, I had a phone consult 
about Brumley with my holistic vet and she reviewed the blood work and said she 
doesn't think it's FIP- that a severely dehydrated cat will have high globulin 
and high protein in the blood panel.  And the fact that is his neg. for corona- 
she just doesn't think it's FIP.  She has of course treated FIP cats/kittens 
and had some herself and she told me she has NEVER seen the dry form of FIP 
in a kitten (Brum's 7 mths)-- only in older, adult cats does the dry form come 
out.  She said she always sees it in kittens in the clear wet form with the 
swollen belly and other signs of fluid retention and then they die quickly.  
And Brum's been lingering on like this for a while now   So, I just went about 
feeding him and making him comfy- moving him into the room with the other other 
guys (he'd already been exposed to them before I had him); stopped the subcu 
fluids b/c I didn't think he needs them.  I guess it's been two weeks since 
then and he just kind of hangs out-- eats- he always eats good- no matter what. 
 But about last week he seemed to lose some personality and he laid around a 
lot and stopped batting around toys.  By this past Sun., my mom and I were 
discussing that he had gone down, down and we were worried.  I don't have a 
thermometer for cats, but I could tell he had a fever and just felt crappy 
(altho he still eats and drinks water when feeling bad!).  I gave him a fluid 
treatment- I thought his pink looked really white and thought it couldn't hurt. 
 The fluid bump hung around forever tho?  I got him in to see the holistic vet 
on Monday evening and my mom took him.  The Dr. kind of laughed off my mom's 
concerns that Brumley was going to die and that his eye looked horrible.  She 
told my mom she thinks he has something else going on besides the eye

RE: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up

2008-01-10 Thread Caroline Kaufmann

Okay.  I know that no one can diagnosis- but just to have people 
compare/contrast/confirm, that might be helpful.  His Holistic vet seems to 
think it's scarring- permanent damage from untreated uri's- which I have never 
seen in a cat before.  So if more experienced people that have seen that and 
can say one way or the other, it MIGHT* make me feel better (not about him 
having permanent eye damage :( , but more so that, yeah, it doesn't look like 
FIP)?
ck


Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2008 15:35:29 -0600From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]: [EMAIL 
PROTECTED]: Re: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-upCaroline,I am not a vet but if it 
will make you feel any better I'll look at it.
On Jan 10, 2008 12:30 PM, Caroline Kaufmann  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

The saga continues with my sick cat Brumley.  I don't know what to do any more. 
 The conventional vet that saw him on Dec. 24 got the results back from the 
Toxoplasmosis test and is was neg. (I can't remember if I reported this info 
this site or not).  So when the Toxo test came back neg, the vet totally 
reversed gears from the day before (when he said he didn't think it was FIP b/c 
Brumley only test pos. for high globulin and high protein, but not a corona 
virus, antibody, etc.).  So he completely went back on that and said, 
basically, he thinks it's FIP b/c he has nothing else to go on and b/c Brumley 
is showing 2 of the 3 indicators of it (but still no wet indicators like the 
swollen belly).  I think it's the eye that is really throwing him off and I 
can't for the love of god, get any vet to explain/diagnose/tell me what to with 
that eye.  I have asked if I should be putting anything in it and both the 
conventional vet and my holistic vet just say no.  So, I had a phone consult 
about Brumley with my holistic vet and she reviewed the blood work and said she 
doesn't think it's FIP- that a severely dehydrated cat will have high globulin 
and high protein in the blood panel.  And the fact that is his neg. for corona- 
she just doesn't think it's FIP.  She has of course treated FIP cats/kittens 
and had some herself and she told me she has NEVER seen the dry form of FIP 
in a kitten (Brum's 7 mths)-- only in older, adult cats does the dry form come 
out.  She said she always sees it in kittens in the clear wet form with the 
swollen belly and other signs of fluid retention and then they die quickly.  
And Brum's been lingering on like this for a while now   So, I just went about 
feeding him and making him comfy- moving him into the room with the other other 
guys (he'd already been exposed to them before I had him); stopped the subcu 
fluids b/c I didn't think he needs them.  I guess it's been two weeks since 
then and he just kind of hangs out-- eats- he always eats good- no matter what. 
 But about last week he seemed to lose some personality and he laid around a 
lot and stopped batting around toys.  By this past Sun., my mom and I were 
discussing that he had gone down, down and we were worried.  I don't have a 
thermometer for cats, but I could tell he had a fever and just felt crappy 
(altho he still eats and drinks water when feeling bad!).  I gave him a fluid 
treatment- I thought his pink looked really white and thought it couldn't hurt. 
 The fluid bump hung around forever tho?  I got him in to see the holistic vet 
on Monday evening and my mom took him.  The Dr. kind of laughed off my mom's 
concerns that Brumley was going to die and that his eye looked horrible.  She 
told my mom she thinks he has something else going on besides the eye-- like 
some kind of infection somewhere else in the body, but she doesn't know where.  
So she wanted me to stop his Clavamox and try some other immune boosting 
things.  Again, my mom asked about the eye and should we be putting anything in 
it to treat it, and the Dr. was just like no.   So of course, Brum was better 
just the next day (Tues.) and I could tell the fever broke.  He was batting 
around a toy the very next morning.  Still eating great. But then by Wed. 
night, he was just sleeping the whole time in a cubby hole, seemed to have a 
fever again and not playing (still eating tho).  So I thought, well maybe his 
holistic vet is right, he is working on fighting off some infection and when it 
gets too hard for his body to fight it, he succumbs a little bit and the fever 
comes back, etc.  So, this morning, it's the same.  Lots of sleeping and fever 
still around.   Even worse, his eye looks worse.  I swear, it looks like the 
cavity or something is filled with blood b.c the eye appears to be a diff't 
color than the other and you can see that it looks like blood behind the eye.  
So now, it looks bloodier and as if the blood has settled down to the bottom 
of the eye more- like it pooled there.  And now, there are even more 
cloudy/greyish white spots on the surface of the eyeball.  Ugh.  I'm worried.  
But my mom is worse-- she's a worry-wart prone to histrionics and having these 
two sick/down cats (Brum and 

Re: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up

2008-01-10 Thread Pat Kachur
I would be gladl to send the picture to my vet - my email is [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  - Original Message - 
  From: Caroline Kaufmann 
  To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
  Sent: Thursday, January 10, 2008 3:46 PM
  Subject: RE: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up



  Thanks- I will do so tonight when I get home.  
   
  I did talk with the holistic vet again and she said when she saw the eye, she 
thought it reminded her of the scarring that can occur on a kitten's eye from 
reoccurring/untreated URI's-- all of which he did have, that came and went 
repeatedly, while the poor thing lingered in a condo and I just didn't get to 
him fast enough (b/c there were other kittens at the time languishing with 
things that seemed more serious that I needed to take in 1st).  So, I 
understand now why she didn't think we needed to put anything in it- b/c she 
thought it was permanent damage (which is what I was hoping I would be in time 
to stop/prevent).  She said if it was scarring like she initially thought, I 
wouldn't be seeing more cloudy spots.  So she asked if he was having discharge 
and told me what to give him based on that.  But he really doesn't have a 
discharge other than crusty brown that he has from both eyes (the healthy one 
too).  He does not have green/yellow/white discharge, or even excessive brown 
discharge from this eye.  So I asked her a follow-up ? based on that and I'm 
waiting to hear back.  
   
  I have to give his eye a good look tonight and try to really determine if 
things have changed with it.  He so squirmy with me right now.  He looks like a 
sack of bones and yet, he's so strong when he wants to squirm away.  And he 
definitely doesn't see me as his angel because he runs away from me everytime 
he sees me!  He thinks of me as the treatment monster!
  caroline  




Subject: RE: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up
Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2008 14:32:43 -0600
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org


Caroline, altho I unfortunately won't be able to offer any diagnostic 
suggestions myself, if you can send the pic to me at [EMAIL PROTECTED]
I can try forwarding it to more experienced people.
I can well imagine how frustrated you must be. Thank goodness the little 
soul can rely on *you* for care and love.
hugs, Kerry



From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Caroline 
Kaufmann
Sent: Thursday, January 10, 2008 12:31 PM
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Subject: RE: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up


The saga continues with my sick cat Brumley.  I don't know what to do any 
more.  The conventional vet that saw him on Dec. 24 got the results back from 
the Toxoplasmosis test and is was neg. (I can't remember if I reported this 
info this site or not).  So when the Toxo test came back neg, the vet totally 
reversed gears from the day before (when he said he didn't think it was FIP b/c 
Brumley only test pos. for high globulin and high protein, but not a corona 
virus, antibody, etc.).  So he completely went back on that and said, 
basically, he thinks it's FIP b/c he has nothing else to go on and b/c Brumley 
is showing 2 of the 3 indicators of it (but still no wet indicators like the 
swollen belly).  I think it's the eye that is really throwing him off and I 
can't for the love of god, get any vet to explain/diagnose/tell me what to with 
that eye.  I have asked if I should be putting anything in it and both the 
conventional vet and my holistic vet just say no.  So, I had a phone consult 
about Brumley with my holistic vet and she reviewed the blood work and said she 
doesn't think it's FIP- that a severely dehydrated cat will have high globulin 
and high protein in the blood panel.  And the fact that is his neg. for corona- 
she just doesn't think it's FIP.  She has of course treated FIP cats/kittens 
and had some herself and she told me she has NEVER seen the dry form of FIP 
in a kitten (Brum's 7 mths)-- only in older, adult cats does the dry form come 
out.  She said she always sees it in kittens in the clear wet form with the 
swollen belly and other signs of fluid retention and then they die quickly.  
And Brum's been lingering on like this for a while now  
 
So, I just went about feeding him and making him comfy- moving him into the 
room with the other other guys (he'd already been exposed to them before I had 
him); stopped the subcu fluids b/c I didn't think he needs them.  I guess it's 
been two weeks since then and he just kind of hangs out-- eats- he always eats 
good- no matter what.  But about last week he seemed to lose some personality 
and he laid around a lot and stopped batting around toys.  By this past Sun., 
my mom and I were discussing that he had gone down, down and we were worried.  
I don't have a thermometer for cats, but I

RE: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up

2008-01-10 Thread MacKenzie, Kerry N.
Ah, but you *are* his angel, whether he realizes or not. It's such a
blessing this little furball met you, Caroline.

  _  

From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Caroline
Kaufmann
Sent: Thursday, January 10, 2008 2:46 PM
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Subject: RE: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up



Thanks- I will do so tonight when I get home.  
 
I did talk with the holistic vet again and she said when she saw the
eye, she thought it reminded her of the scarring that can occur on a
kitten's eye from reoccurring/untreated URI's-- all of which he did
have, that came and went repeatedly, while the poor thing lingered in a
condo and I just didn't get to him fast enough (b/c there were other
kittens at the time languishing with things that seemed more serious
that I needed to take in 1st).  So, I understand now why she didn't
think we needed to put anything in it- b/c she thought it was permanent
damage (which is what I was hoping I would be in time to stop/prevent).
She said if it was scarring like she initially thought, I wouldn't be
seeing more cloudy spots.  So she asked if he was having discharge and
told me what to give him based on that.  But he really doesn't have a
discharge other than crusty brown that he has from both eyes (the
healthy one too).  He does not have green/yellow/white discharge, or
even excessive brown discharge from this eye.  So I asked her a
follow-up ? based on that and I'm waiting to hear back.  
 
I have to give his eye a good look tonight and try to really determine
if things have changed with it.  He so squirmy with me right now.  He
looks like a sack of bones and yet, he's so strong when he wants to
squirm away.  And he definitely doesn't see me as his angel because he
runs away from me everytime he sees me!  He thinks of me as the
treatment monster!
caroline  



  _  

Subject: RE: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up
Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2008 14:32:43 -0600
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org


Caroline, altho I unfortunately won't be able to offer any
diagnostic suggestions myself, if you can send the pic to me at
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
I can try forwarding it to more experienced people.
I can well imagine how frustrated you must be. Thank goodness
the little soul can rely on *you* for care and love.
hugs, Kerry

  _  

From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Caroline
Kaufmann
Sent: Thursday, January 10, 2008 12:31 PM
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Subject: RE: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up


The saga continues with my sick cat Brumley.  I don't know what
to do any more.  The conventional vet that saw him on Dec. 24 got the
results back from the Toxoplasmosis test and is was neg. (I can't
remember if I reported this info this site or not).  So when the Toxo
test came back neg, the vet totally reversed gears from the day before
(when he said he didn't think it was FIP b/c Brumley only test pos. for
high globulin and high protein, but not a corona virus, antibody, etc.).
So he completely went back on that and said, basically, he thinks it's
FIP b/c he has nothing else to go on and b/c Brumley is showing 2 of the
3 indicators of it (but still no wet indicators like the swollen
belly).  I think it's the eye that is really throwing him off and I
can't for the love of god, get any vet to explain/diagnose/tell me what
to with that eye.  I have asked if I should be putting anything in it
and both the conventional vet and my holistic vet just say no.  So, I
had a phone consult about Brumley with my holistic vet and she reviewed
the blood work and said she doesn't think it's FIP- that a severely
dehydrated cat will have high globulin and high protein in the blood
panel.  And the fact that is his neg. for corona- she just doesn't think
it's FIP.  She has of course treated FIP cats/kittens and had some
herself and she told me she has NEVER seen the dry form of FIP in a
kitten (Brum's 7 mths)-- only in older, adult cats does the dry form
come out.  She said she always sees it in kittens in the clear wet form
with the swollen belly and other signs of fluid retention and then they
die quickly.  And Brum's been lingering on like this for a while now  
 
So, I just went about feeding him and making him comfy- moving
him into the room with the other other guys (he'd already been exposed
to them before I had him); stopped the subcu fluids b/c I didn't think
he needs them.  I guess it's been two weeks since then and he just kind
of hangs out-- eats- he always eats good- no matter what.  But about
last week he seemed to lose some personality and he laid around a lot
and stopped batting around toys.  By this past Sun., my mom and I were
discussing that he had gone down, down and we were worried.  I don't
have a thermometer for cats, but I could tell he had a fever

Re: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up

2008-01-10 Thread Kelley Saveika
They can also get permanent damage from ulcers ... did the vet do a corneal
stain to see if the eye was ulcerated?

On Jan 10, 2008 3:45 PM, Kelley Saveika [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Now I have seen permanent damage from untreated (or even treated URIs).
 Clarissa, a white Persian in our rescue, has one eye that is almost entirely
 white.


 On Jan 10, 2008 3:41 PM, Caroline Kaufmann  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 wrote:

   Okay.  I know that no one can diagnosis- but just to have people
  compare/contrast/confirm, that might be helpful.  His Holistic vet seems to
  think it's scarring- permanent damage from untreated uri's- which I have
  never seen in a cat before.  So if more experienced people that have seen
  that and can say one way or the other, it MIGHT* make me feel better (not
  about him having permanent eye damage :( , but more so that, yeah, it
  doesn't look like FIP)?
  ck
 
 
   --
  Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2008 15:35:29 -0600
  From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
 
  Subject: Re: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up
 
  Caroline,
 
  I am not a vet but if it will make you feel any better I'll look at it.
 
 
 
  On Jan 10, 2008 12:30 PM, Caroline Kaufmann [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  wrote:
 
  The saga continues with my sick cat Brumley.  I don't know what to do
  any more.  The conventional vet that saw him on Dec. 24 got the results back
  from the Toxoplasmosis test and is was neg. (I can't remember if I reported
  this info this site or not).  So when the Toxo test came back neg, the vet
  totally reversed gears from the day before (when he said he didn't think it
  was FIP b/c Brumley only test pos. for high globulin and high protein, but
  not a corona virus, antibody, etc.).  So he completely went back on that and
  said, basically, he thinks it's FIP b/c he has nothing else to go on and b/c
  Brumley is showing 2 of the 3 indicators of it (but still no wet
  indicators like the swollen belly).  I think it's the eye that is really
  throwing him off and I can't for the love of god, get any vet to
  explain/diagnose/tell me what to with that eye.  I have asked if I should be
  putting anything in it and both the conventional vet and my holistic vet
  just say no.  So, I had a phone consult about Brumley with my holistic vet
  and she reviewed the blood work and said she doesn't think it's FIP- that a
  severely dehydrated cat will have high globulin and high protein in the
  blood panel.  And the fact that is his neg. for corona- she just doesn't
  think it's FIP.  She has of course treated FIP cats/kittens and had some
  herself and she told me she has NEVER seen the dry form of FIP in a kitten
  (Brum's 7 mths)-- only in older, adult cats does the dry form come out.  She
  said she always sees it in kittens in the clear wet form with the swollen
  belly and other signs of fluid retention and then they die quickly.  And
  Brum's been lingering on like this for a while now
 
  So, I just went about feeding him and making him comfy- moving him into
  the room with the other other guys (he'd already been exposed to them before
  I had him); stopped the subcu fluids b/c I didn't think he needs them.  I
  guess it's been two weeks since then and he just kind of hangs out-- eats-
  he always eats good- no matter what.  But about last week he seemed to lose
  some personality and he laid around a lot and stopped batting around toys.
  By this past Sun., my mom and I were discussing that he had gone down, down
  and we were worried.  I don't have a thermometer for cats, but I could tell
  he had a fever and just felt crappy (altho he still eats and drinks water
  when feeling bad!).  I gave him a fluid treatment- I thought his pink looked
  really white and thought it couldn't hurt.  The fluid bump hung around
  forever tho?  I got him in to see the holistic vet on Monday evening and my
  mom took him.  *The Dr. kind of laughed off my mom's concerns that
  Brumley was going to die and that his eye looked horrible.  She told my mom
  she thinks he has something else going on besides the eye-- like some kind
  of infection somewhere else in the body, but she doesn't know where.  *So
  she wanted me to stop his Clavamox and try some other immune boosting
  things.  Again, my mom asked about the eye and should we be putting anything
  in it to treat it, and the Dr. was just like no.
 
  So of course, Brum was better just the next day (Tues.) and I could tell
  the fever broke.  He was batting around a toy the very next morning.  Still
  eating great.
 
  But then by Wed. night, he was just sleeping the whole time in a cubby
  hole, seemed to have a fever again and not playing (still eating tho).  So I
  thought, well maybe his holistic vet is right, he is working on fighting off
  some infection and when it gets too hard for his body to fight it, he
  succumbs a little bit and the fever comes back, etc.  So, this morning, it's
  the same.  Lots of sleeping and fever

Re: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up

2008-01-10 Thread Marylyn
Ask your holistic vet about a referral for yourself to someone who does people 
holistic medicine.  You need a break.  Re your motherthat is a mother 
thing.  Trust me.  If they can't find something to worry about they find 
something.  I don't know who you have for a regular vet but Drs. Koehler and  
Bishop at Middletown Animal Clinic are the most open, honest, knowledgeable 
guys I know and, best of all, if they don't know they will tell you.  Dixie 
Louise has them as her regular vets even though it is a 2 1/2 hour drive one 
way.  I have known Dr. Koehler since (about) 1983, Dr. Bishop and he formed a 
partnership not to much longer.  They have been wonderful with all my critters 
and I can't imagine life without themor without your  holistic vet or Dr. 
Betty Boswell.  If you are limited to regular vets because of Brumley's 
situation, try them.  








 If you have men who will 
exclude any of God's creatures
 from the shelter of compassion 
and pity, you will have men who 
 will deal likewise with their 
fellow man.
  St. Francis
  - Original Message - 
  From: Kelley Saveika 
  To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
  Sent: Thursday, January 10, 2008 3:35 PM
  Subject: Re: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up


  Caroline,

  I am not a vet but if it will make you feel any better I'll look at it.




  On Jan 10, 2008 12:30 PM, Caroline Kaufmann  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

The saga continues with my sick cat Brumley.  I don't know what to do any 
more.  The conventional vet that saw him on Dec. 24 got the results back from 
the Toxoplasmosis test and is was neg. (I can't remember if I reported this 
info this site or not).  So when the Toxo test came back neg, the vet totally 
reversed gears from the day before (when he said he didn't think it was FIP b/c 
Brumley only test pos. for high globulin and high protein, but not a corona 
virus, antibody, etc.).  So he completely went back on that and said, 
basically, he thinks it's FIP b/c he has nothing else to go on and b/c Brumley 
is showing 2 of the 3 indicators of it (but still no wet indicators like the 
swollen belly).  I think it's the eye that is really throwing him off and I 
can't for the love of god, get any vet to explain/diagnose/tell me what to with 
that eye.  I have asked if I should be putting anything in it and both the 
conventional vet and my holistic vet just say no.  So, I had a phone consult 
about Brumley with my holistic vet and she reviewed the blood work and said she 
doesn't think it's FIP- that a severely dehydrated cat will have high globulin 
and high protein in the blood panel.  And the fact that is his neg. for corona- 
she just doesn't think it's FIP.  She has of course treated FIP cats/kittens 
and had some herself and she told me she has NEVER seen the dry form of FIP 
in a kitten (Brum's 7 mths)-- only in older, adult cats does the dry form come 
out.  She said she always sees it in kittens in the clear wet form with the 
swollen belly and other signs of fluid retention and then they die quickly.  
And Brum's been lingering on like this for a while now  
 
So, I just went about feeding him and making him comfy- moving him into the 
room with the other other guys (he'd already been exposed to them before I had 
him); stopped the subcu fluids b/c I didn't think he needs them.  I guess it's 
been two weeks since then and he just kind of hangs out-- eats- he always eats 
good- no matter what.  But about last week he seemed to lose some personality 
and he laid around a lot and stopped batting around toys.  By this past Sun., 
my mom and I were discussing that he had gone down, down and we were worried.  
I don't have a thermometer for cats, but I could tell he had a fever and just 
felt crappy (altho he still eats and drinks water when feeling bad!).  I gave 
him a fluid treatment- I thought his pink looked really white and thought it 
couldn't hurt.  The fluid bump hung around forever tho?  I got him in to see 
the holistic vet on Monday evening and my mom took him.  The Dr. kind of 
laughed off my mom's concerns that Brumley was going to die and that his eye 
looked horrible.  She told my mom she thinks he has something else going on 
besides the eye-- like some kind of infection somewhere else in the body, but 
she doesn't know where.  So she wanted me to stop his Clavamox and try some 
other immune boosting things.  Again, my mom asked about the eye and should we 
be putting anything in it to treat it, and the Dr. was just like no.  
 
So of course, Brum was better just the next day (Tues.) and I could tell 
the fever broke.  He was batting around a toy the very next morning.  Still 
eating great.
 
But then by Wed. night, he was just sleeping the whole time in a cubby 
hole

Re: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up

2008-01-10 Thread laurieskatz
Caroline, we had a kitty with an apparent eye problem that the vet thought was 
a dental problem. I don't want to scare you...but wondering if the vet has 
ruled out cancer?
Laurie


Re: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up

2008-01-06 Thread wendy
Caroline,

Bless you for taking care of these babies.  You are truly going above and 
beyond and it sounds like you've found your calling.  I hope you got conclusive 
yet good news for the sick kitten on Friday.

:)
Wendy
 
Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful committed citizens can change the 
world - indeed it is the only thing that ever has! ~~~ Margaret Meade ~~~



- Original Message 
From: Caroline Kaufmann [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Sent: Thursday, December 27, 2007 8:39:08 PM
Subject: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up

Okay, the results are not all in, but I finally talked to the Vet about the 
blood tests from the sick kitten I took in- which he suspect FIP in.  The cat 
was NEGATIVE for Felv (so that's the second time he's tested neg.- first at 
approx. 2 mths old, now at 6 mths).  He NEGATIVE for FIV (which he had not yet 
been tested for ever).  The vet also says that so far, it looks like it's not 
FIP and he talked about how there is no conclusive test, etc., so for now, he 
has to go by the presence of antibodies- which he says are usually higher if 
the cat has dry FIP and then even higher if it's wet FIP.  He says the 
antibodies are just not high enough to for it to be FIP- either the dry or wet 
form.  So he remains concerned tho that it's a an infectious (i.e., contagious) 
disease.  What he is waiting on now is the toxoplasmosis test b/c now he is 
suspecting that.  He said the results of that test will be in tomorrow.  He 
also said the blood is showing high
 globulin levels and high white blood cells- both of which indicate some kind 
of an infection, but he just doesn't know what kind yet.  
I do have a phone consultation appointment tomorrow at 5:00 with the holistic 
vet (Marylyn-- Dr. Maier) who treated Monkee at the end of his life and whom 
Monkee loved- at a time when he was utterly miserable and fed up with vets!  We 
are consulting on this kitten and then also to discuss general care of fosters 
and things I can do holistically to help them rehab faster.  I may end up 
taking Yoda to her anyway b/c of the diarrhea that I can't get traditional vets 
to address.  Hopefully, I will have the blood tests results on my sick kitten 
emailed to me before then, so I can forward them to her for her review and 
second opinion.  I feel better because I am finally getting some freaking 
vets lined up so that I can finally take care of these fosters without always 
feeling like I'm supposed to do so without ever having veterinary access unless 
a cat is pretty much dying in my arms.  Monkee died in my arms despite all the 
things we did to save him and
 there is NO WAY I'm going to allow another cat to die in my arms- especially 
these fosters who seem to have totally treatable (possibly preventable) things 
going on with them!  Urg.  So we continue to forge ahead.
Poor kitty feels so much better and I'm worried about continuing to give him 
fluids.  Dr. Maier said in an email that if he is doing that much better and 
has had 3 treatments of subcu fluids, it's probably not necessary to do them 
today.  But when I talked to the conventional vet that saw the cat on Monday, 
he said to continue them b/c extra fluids are extra fluids, it can't really 
hurt him (I beg to differ- it's very traumatic b/c it's just me and him in a 
contest of wills and strength and it's pretty horrible- he gets that huge 
needle out everytime and I have to re-stick him-- which is hell for me and 
him), and without really seeing the cat, he can't tell me to discontinue 
fluids.  Well, my mom and I have discussed it and I'm doing them tonight.  
It's too much on him and me.  He's feeling too good now so that he really 
fights the fluid giving.  I always recall that Dr. Maier- in all her holistic 
wisdom- said (when I first took Monkee to her),
 that you don't want the treatment to be worse than the disease.  I think 
that solves my dilemma for now.
Caroline
 
 



The best games are on Xbox 360. Click here for a special offer on an Xbox 360 
Console. Get it now!


  

Never miss a thing.  Make Yahoo your home page. 
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

RE: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up

2008-01-02 Thread Caroline Kaufmann

During our phone consult, she mentioned about a ton of homeopathic remedies.  I 
have them written down in my cat binder at home.  Some for the eyes to help 
with the URIs and tear stains, etc.  I know she mentioned Thuja a lot.  She 
reccomended a book that Washington Homeopathic Products (Homeopathyworks.com) 
sells regarding homeopathic treatment for cats and that I should consider 
ordering the animal rescue kit for cats to have on hand.  I did order both 
the book and the kit on Friday, so am not buying any homeopathic treatments at 
this time- waiting on my kit.  It should have all the things she mentioned 
during our consult.  
 
After my appt. Sat. with Possum, everyone is now getting the week treatment of 
Wrm Clear.  She says this kills just about everything- that it will get 
tapeworms (interesting...) and also cocidia, maybe even giardia.  It just makes 
the gut so inhospitable, that both parasites and bacteria can't continue to 
live there.  This is mainly for Yoda- to see if it helps clear up his diarrhea 
b/c Dr. Maier thinks something might be hanging around in there.  Also, since 
I've had Possum over a month and he eats wonderfully, and we've now gone 
through 1 1/2 tubes of nutrical, she asked if he's gotten any bigger and I said 
only longer.  Like he's grown longer, but still isn't the size he should be 
for his age (6 mths-- Yoda puts him to shame body-wise).  So she wanted Possum 
to get a treatment of wrm clear to make sure he doesn't have a tapeworm or 
something hanging around (I haven't seen any segments tho- and believe me, I 
look for those things...ewww!).  
 
I'm also treating everyone with whatever the name of the homeopathic rem is for 
over-vaccination.  And colostrum- Dr. Maier gave me some.  I ran out forever 
ago and started using Just Born instead, then ran out of that, and due to 
expenses and just plain forgetfullness, forgot to get more.  Dr. Maier says the 
only kind to use in the New Zealand Bovine so I'll probably just get it from 
her for now on.  By the way, she set me up to get things from her for treatment 
of my fosters so that the group I vol for will pay for it...she rocks!  I got 
the wrm clear, triple antibiotic eye ointment (she says not to use terramycin- 
which I have been shying away from anyway b/c I have noted it seems to cause 
eye irritation in my cats- guess I was right), tobramycin eye drops, the one 
homeopathic rem for vaccinations, a bottle of colostrum, and a spray bottle of 
cat nap-- all so that I didn't have to pay (which is really only fair b/c 
these are fosters and I'm breaking myself paying for premium foods, crates, 
bowls, ferret hammocks, and even litter sometimes).  I did have to pay for 
the Possum office visit- which was fine b/c her rates are so freaking 
reasonable, but b/c I am a foster, she gave me a percent discount.  So I 
finally just feel better all around- no longer like I am out there alone on a 
raft with all these special needs cats that technically don't belong to me b/c 
they are fosters- attempting to care for them without the assistance- when 
necessary- of a discounted vet/vet period!  Ensuring my psychologcial 
well-being in the situation I am in is obviously really important too.  And 
feeling I was expected to do this, sans vet care, was NOT working for me.
 
And admittedly, I was out of town Sun. night through Tues. evening, so I didn't 
have tons of time to observe the Possum, post-Dr. visit, but already there's 
been even more improvement.  He just seems even more perky!  Last night and 
this morning, he's just a wide-eyed, perky little thing.  He may still be 
adoptable yet!  Given another month with me, he may be 85% almost normal!  And 
he's the best little bed sleeper (he's so teeny and gentle- he sleeps curled in 
my arms or up partially on my pillow and we have these little love fests in the 
morning while my snooze alarm goes off)- he'd make such a great buddy for 
someone who wants a gentle (i.e. not a high energy maniac of kitten), lovey 
dovey bed buddy!
 
Caroline  


From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]: [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Re: OT: sick 6 mo kitten 
follow-upDate: Mon, 31 Dec 2007 18:56:28 -0600



What did Dr. Maier say about supplements?  
 
 
 
 
 
 
 If you have men who will 
exclude any of God's creatures 
from the shelter of compassion and pity, you will have men who  
will deal likewise with their fellow man.   
   St. Francis

- Original Message - 
From: Caroline Kaufmann 
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Sent: Monday, December 31, 2007 6:45 PM
Subject: RE: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up
Well, I think I just never saw him drink b/c I had him only from last sat. 
night until monday in my bedroom with my other cats (I have two large rooms 
connected- so they have tons of space.  All

Re: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up

2008-01-01 Thread Marylyn
Unasked for advise:  I know you know this but I have to repeat it.
Be very careful when you are close to the face of a feral/barn/alley/unknown 
cat.  I had a very small cat bite and break a finger costing me two surgeries, 
the possibility of losing part of the finger etc.   I was at the ER and being 
treated within 15 minutes of the bite and seeing the wonderful surgeons at U of 
L's Hand Clinic in less than 24 hours so lack of attention was not an issue.  
No need to be afraid but be alert to sight/flight signs in the cats.  You are 
going to be bitten and scratched.  That is part of the game.  And yes, I 
snuggle mine and still deal with ferals/strays/throw-alwaysthose little 
ones who need a kind word and kind hand.  

Again, you are doing great.  Now set up a law practice dedicated to animals.  
:




 If you have men who will 
exclude any of God's creatures
 from the shelter of compassion 
and pity, you will have men who 
 will deal likewise with their 
fellow man.
  St. Francis
  - Original Message - 
  From: Marylyn 
  To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
  Sent: Monday, December 31, 2007 6:56 PM
  Subject: Re: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up


  What did Dr. Maier say about supplements?  






   If you have men who will 
exclude any of God's creatures
   from the shelter of 
compassion and pity, you will have men who 
   will deal likewise with 
their fellow man.
St. Francis
- Original Message - 
From: Caroline Kaufmann 
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Sent: Monday, December 31, 2007 6:45 PM
Subject: RE: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up


Well, I think I just never saw him drink b/c I had him only from last sat. 
night until monday in my bedroom with my other cats (I have two large rooms 
connected- so they have tons of space.  All but Possum sleep in the condo- 
which is set up by the front window- at night).  But we did keep him in a 
separate crate in the room until the vet visit last monday, and that vet said 
to isolate him, so poor kitty and his crate went to the basement.  I felt 
horrible, but we are just currently running out of rooms.  So, he was stuck 
down there all alone and since he wasn't with me in my room, I wasn't able to 
see what he does.  He spent most of his time down there crying crying crying 
(broke my heart) and knocking over his coop cup of water and food in his 
desperate attempts to reach thru the crate.  It was horrible, I know, but our 
basement doesn't have a real door- it's a folding levelor blind-like door and 
every cat, save for the teeny barn kittens, have made short shrift of it!  
Anyway, per Dr. Maier's advice- after she told me her analysis of the blood 
tests (she doesn't think it's FIP (she said severe dehydration will cause high 
protein and high globulin in the blood- also, he didn't test pos. for any 
corona virus, so I don't see how the conventional vet can say FIP???).  She 
thinks it's just very very very bad malnourishment/dehydration, infection from 
chronic URIs setting in, stress, etc).  So, I moved him into my room on Sat., 
per her okay and recc that it would be better for him.  Since he and Possum are 
both special needs, slow (which incidentally makes them really good kitties b/c 
they don't have the energy to be bad!), both recovering from what is 
hopefully only malnourishment, etc., they both stay out in the room/sleep with 
me on the bed at night (they are both such good little boys)!  So I finally saw 
him drink water and it's all at once, wonderful and hilarious!  He drinks 
voraciously (as voraciously as he eats his wet food- well, he's into the 
crunchies too, but the wet food eating it funnier b/c he smacks him lips and 
gobbles and just makes all these snarfling noises while eating- and gets it all 
over his nose- like he never tasted anything so good!).  So the water drinking 
is similar-- very loud, very intense, and when he looks up, he has it all over 
his chin and nose!  So, I am no longer concerned about water drinking.  I add a 
lot of water to his wet food too and he doesn't seem to mind.  He's not 
dehydrated anymore either.  He still looks like an old man cat to me tho- which 
is sad because he's only 6 months.  Sigh.  He looks like what my 19 yo Rambo 
looked like his last year of life.  He really bounced back after just coming to 
my house, getting fluids and the shot of penicillin, but he seems to have 
leveled off now.  We'll see...I really hope it's not dry FIP.  I just can't go 
through that.  Tackling this malnourishment and weakened state has been hard

Re: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up

2008-01-01 Thread MaryChristine
(oh, it's been a long year already... i know what you MEANT, marylyn,
but i have this image in my head of all these cats and dogs lining up at
caroline's door, as CLIENTS. really, she SWORE she was spayed! well,
yeah, i DID bite him, but you would have too!. and them paying her in
rawhide bones and enormous bags of primo catnip)

MC

On Jan 1, 2008 8:12 AM, Marylyn [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

  Unasked for advise:  I know you know this but I have to repeat it.
 Be very careful when you are close to the face of a
 feral/barn/alley/unknown cat.  I had a very small cat bite and break a
 finger costing me two surgeries, the possibility of losing part of the
 finger etc.   I was at the ER and being treated within 15 minutes of the
 bite and seeing the wonderful surgeons at U of L's Hand Clinic in less than
 24 hours so lack of attention was not an issue.  No need to be afraid but be
 alert to sight/flight signs in the cats.  You are going to be bitten and
 scratched.  That is part of the game.  And yes, I snuggle mine and still
 deal with ferals/strays/throw-alwaysthose little ones who need a kind
 word and kind hand.

 Again, you are doing great.  Now set up a law practice dedicated to
 animals.  :




  If you have men who will
 exclude any of God's creatures
  from the shelter of
 compassion and pity, you will have men who
  will deal likewise with
 their fellow man.
   St.
 Francis

 - Original Message -
 *From:* Marylyn [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 *To:* felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
 *Sent:* Monday, December 31, 2007 6:56 PM
 *Subject:* Re: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up

 What did Dr. Maier say about supplements?






  If you have men who will
 exclude any of God's creatures
  from the shelter of
 compassion and pity, you will have men who
  will deal likewise with
 their fellow man.
   St.
 Francis

 - Original Message -
 *From:* Caroline Kaufmann [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 *To:* felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
 *Sent:* Monday, December 31, 2007 6:45 PM
 *Subject:* RE: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up

 Well, I think I just never saw him drink b/c I had him only from last sat.
 night until monday in my bedroom with my other cats (I have two large rooms
 connected- so they have tons of space.  All but Possum sleep in the condo-
 which is set up by the front window- at night).  But we did keep him in a
 separate crate in the room until the vet visit last monday, and that vet
 said to isolate him, so poor kitty and his crate went to the basement.  I
 felt horrible, but we are just currently running out of rooms.  So, he was
 stuck down there all alone and since he wasn't with me in my room, I wasn't
 able to see what he does.  He spent most of his time down there crying
 crying crying (broke my heart) and knocking over his coop cup of water and
 food in his desperate attempts to reach thru the crate.  It was horrible, I
 know, but our basement doesn't have a real door- it's a folding levelor
 blind-like door and every cat, save for the teeny barn kittens, have made
 short shrift of it!  Anyway, per Dr. Maier's advice- after she told me her
 analysis of the blood tests (she doesn't think it's FIP (she said severe
 dehydration will cause high protein and high globulin in the blood- also, he
 didn't test pos. for any corona virus, so I don't see how the conventional
 vet can say FIP???).  She thinks it's just very very very bad
 malnourishment/dehydration, infection from chronic URIs setting in, stress,
 etc).  So, I moved him into my room on Sat., per her okay and recc that it
 would be better for him.  Since he and Possum are both special needs, slow
 (which incidentally makes them really good kitties b/c they don't have the
 energy to be bad!), both recovering from what is hopefully only
 malnourishment, etc., they both stay out in the room/sleep with me on the
 bed at night (they are both such good little boys)!  So I finally saw him
 drink water and it's all at once, wonderful and hilarious!  He drinks
 voraciously (as voraciously as he eats his wet food- well, he's into the
 crunchies too, but the wet food eating it funnier b/c he smacks him lips and
 gobbles and just makes all these snarfling noises while eating- and gets it
 all over his nose- like he never tasted anything so good!).  So the water
 drinking is similar-- very loud, very intense, and when he looks up, he has
 it all over his chin and nose!  So, I am no longer concerned about water
 drinking.  I add a lot of water to his wet food too and he doesn't seem to
 mind.  He's not dehydrated anymore either.  He still looks

Re: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up

2008-01-01 Thread MaryChristine
aw, sounds like you're exactly what this little one needed to help bring
him around!

to answer your question about how/why a conventional vet could even consider
FIP in a cat who doesn't have a positive FeCoV titre, two options:
   1) the titre is useless, as has been mentioned before, as it reflects
EXPOSURE to the virus--numbers vary on how long it takes the average cat
to process the virus out and stop shedding, so a cat who has mutated the
virus into FIP after a stressor may have exposed quite awhile before and
thus be negative. while i cat with a very high titres, and no other
indicators, may just have been hanging out with a lot of kitties who are
shedding the virus. so if all the other symptoms of FIP are there, a titre
just doesn't matter
2) the titre is useless, but too many vets just don't get that yet. and
antech labs, who SWEAR that their test can differentiate between the strains
of FeCoV and therefore it DOES test for FIP rather than the virus push that
VERY HARD. they do not mention that no outside researchers have been able to
replicate their results, and no one actually working in FIP believes there
is, yet, a way to predict which strain will mutate.

there is a really simple test -- and cheap -- that any vet can do in their
office, with grocery-store ingredients. right now i can't remember
(anything) the name of the test, which i'd never heard of before; also, the
IFA, so well-known to us from dealing with FeLV, is now being used to help
diagnose FIP. again, i don't remember the details--but they are in the
petsmart charities program on FIP that i've mentioned before. (i'm in the
middle of some major legal stuff of my own right now, and as my friends on
the list know, i'm barely answering mail)--so i can't go digging for the
link right now. (instead, i'm digging through 5 hard drives for old emails,
IMs and chat logs from 2000 on!)

MC

-- 

Spay  Neuter Your Neighbors!
Maybe That'll Make The Difference

MaryChristine

AIM / YAHOO: TenHouseCats
MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
ICQ: 289856892


Re: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up

2008-01-01 Thread Marylyn
Or lots of mice, nice juicy mice.  






 If you have men who will 
exclude any of God's creatures
 from the shelter of compassion 
and pity, you will have men who 
 will deal likewise with their 
fellow man.
  St. Francis
  - Original Message - 
  From: MaryChristine 
  To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
  Sent: Tuesday, January 01, 2008 2:24 PM
  Subject: Re: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up


  (oh, it's been a long year already... i know what you MEANT, marylyn, but 
i have this image in my head of all these cats and dogs lining up at caroline's 
door, as CLIENTS. really, she SWORE she was spayed! well, yeah, i DID 
bite him, but you would have too!. and them paying her in rawhide bones 
and enormous bags of primo catnip) 

  MC


  On Jan 1, 2008 8:12 AM, Marylyn [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

Unasked for advise:  I know you know this but I have to repeat it.
Be very careful when you are close to the face of a 
feral/barn/alley/unknown cat.  I had a very small cat bite and break a finger 
costing me two surgeries, the possibility of losing part of the finger etc.   I 
was at the ER and being treated within 15 minutes of the bite and seeing the 
wonderful surgeons at U of L's Hand Clinic in less than 24 hours so lack of 
attention was not an issue.  No need to be afraid but be alert to sight/flight 
signs in the cats.  You are going to be bitten and scratched.  That is part of 
the game.  And yes, I snuggle mine and still deal with 
ferals/strays/throw-alwaysthose little ones who need a kind word and kind 
hand.  

Again, you are doing great.  Now set up a law practice dedicated to 
animals.  :




 If you have men who will 
exclude any of God's creatures
 from the shelter of 
compassion and pity, you will have men who 
 will deal likewise with 
their fellow man.
  St. 
Francis
  - Original Message - 
  From: Marylyn 
  To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
  Sent: Monday, December 31, 2007 6:56 PM
  Subject: Re: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up


  What did Dr. Maier say about supplements?  






   If you have men who will 
exclude any of God's creatures
   from the shelter of 
compassion and pity, you will have men who 
   will deal likewise with 
their fellow man.
St. 
Francis
- Original Message - 
From: Caroline Kaufmann 
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Sent: Monday, December 31, 2007 6:45 PM
Subject: RE: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up


Well, I think I just never saw him drink b/c I had him only from last 
sat. night until monday in my bedroom with my other cats (I have two large 
rooms connected- so they have tons of space.  All but Possum sleep in the 
condo- which is set up by the front window- at night).  But we did keep him in 
a separate crate in the room until the vet visit last monday, and that vet said 
to isolate him, so poor kitty and his crate went to the basement.  I felt 
horrible, but we are just currently running out of rooms.  So, he was stuck 
down there all alone and since he wasn't with me in my room, I wasn't able to 
see what he does.  He spent most of his time down there crying crying crying 
(broke my heart) and knocking over his coop cup of water and food in his 
desperate attempts to reach thru the crate.  It was horrible, I know, but our 
basement doesn't have a real door- it's a folding levelor blind-like door and 
every cat, save for the teeny barn kittens, have made short shrift of it!  
Anyway, per Dr. Maier's advice- after she told me her analysis of the blood 
tests (she doesn't think it's FIP (she said severe dehydration will cause high 
protein and high globulin in the blood- also, he didn't test pos. for any 
corona virus, so I don't see how the conventional vet can say FIP???).  She 
thinks it's just very very very bad malnourishment/dehydration, infection from 
chronic URIs setting in, stress, etc).  So, I moved him into my room on Sat., 
per her okay and recc that it would be better for him.  Since he and Possum are 
both special needs, slow (which incidentally makes them really good kitties b/c 
they don't have the energy to be bad!), both recovering from what is 
hopefully only malnourishment, etc., they both stay out in the room/sleep with 
me on the bed at night (they are both such good

RE: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up

2007-12-31 Thread Caroline Kaufmann

Well, I think I just never saw him drink b/c I had him only from last sat. 
night until monday in my bedroom with my other cats (I have two large rooms 
connected- so they have tons of space.  All but Possum sleep in the condo- 
which is set up by the front window- at night).  But we did keep him in a 
separate crate in the room until the vet visit last monday, and that vet said 
to isolate him, so poor kitty and his crate went to the basement.  I felt 
horrible, but we are just currently running out of rooms.  So, he was stuck 
down there all alone and since he wasn't with me in my room, I wasn't able to 
see what he does.  He spent most of his time down there crying crying crying 
(broke my heart) and knocking over his coop cup of water and food in his 
desperate attempts to reach thru the crate.  It was horrible, I know, but our 
basement doesn't have a real door- it's a folding levelor blind-like door and 
every cat, save for the teeny barn kittens, have made short shrift of it!  
Anyway, per Dr. Maier's advice- after she told me her analysis of the blood 
tests (she doesn't think it's FIP (she said severe dehydration will cause high 
protein and high globulin in the blood- also, he didn't test pos. for any 
corona virus, so I don't see how the conventional vet can say FIP???).  She 
thinks it's just very very very bad malnourishment/dehydration, infection from 
chronic URIs setting in, stress, etc).  So, I moved him into my room on Sat., 
per her okay and recc that it would be better for him.  Since he and Possum are 
both special needs, slow (which incidentally makes them really good kitties b/c 
they don't have the energy to be bad!), both recovering from what is 
hopefully only malnourishment, etc., they both stay out in the room/sleep with 
me on the bed at night (they are both such good little boys)!  So I finally saw 
him drink water and it's all at once, wonderful and hilarious!  He drinks 
voraciously (as voraciously as he eats his wet food- well, he's into the 
crunchies too, but the wet food eating it funnier b/c he smacks him lips and 
gobbles and just makes all these snarfling noises while eating- and gets it all 
over his nose- like he never tasted anything so good!).  So the water drinking 
is similar-- very loud, very intense, and when he looks up, he has it all over 
his chin and nose!  So, I am no longer concerned about water drinking.  I add a 
lot of water to his wet food too and he doesn't seem to mind.  He's not 
dehydrated anymore either.  He still looks like an old man cat to me tho- which 
is sad because he's only 6 months.  Sigh.  He looks like what my 19 yo Rambo 
looked like his last year of life.  He really bounced back after just coming to 
my house, getting fluids and the shot of penicillin, but he seems to have 
leveled off now.  We'll see...I really hope it's not dry FIP.  I just can't go 
through that.  Tackling this malnourishment and weakened state has been hard 
enough...
caroline


From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]: [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Re: OT: sick 6 mo kitten 
follow-upDate: Mon, 31 Dec 2007 17:38:57 -0600



Try dripping water or a water fountain.  Ebony loved to drink from the faucet.  
I like the fountain better because the water can be filtered.  
 
 
 
 
 
 
 If you have men who will 
exclude any of God's creatures 
from the shelter of compassion and pity, you will have men who  
will deal likewise with their fellow man.   
   St. Francis

- Original Message - 
From: Caroline Kaufmann 
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Sent: Thursday, December 27, 2007 8:54 PM
Subject: RE: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up
I have never seen him drink water, so I am not sure.  But he's been urinating a 
lot- of course that could be from the fluids.  He was dehydrated on Monday, but 
he bounced back so much after the shot of Penicillin and one bought of subcu 
fluids- it was really remarkable.  And of course, the vet isn't able to see 
that.  Since I have never seen him drink water, I have been adding water and 
KMR to his wet food- just to make sure to get some extra in.  He eats almost 
all of his food up, so he's certainly getting moisture that way.caroline 


Date: Thu, 27 Dec 2007 20:47:47 -0600From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]: [EMAIL 
PROTECTED]: Re: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up
That is great news, that everything is negative.
Is he drinking normally?  Is he dehydrated?  If he is not dehydratedI would 
not see any need for fluids (but I'm not a vet, this is not to be construed as 
veterinary advice, yadda yadda)
Kelley
 
On Dec 27, 2007 8:39 PM, Caroline Kaufmann [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

Okay, the results are not all in, but I finally talked to the Vet about the 
blood tests from the sick kitten I took in- which he suspect FIP in.  The cat 
was NEGATIVE for Felv (so that's

Re: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up

2007-12-31 Thread Marylyn
What did Dr. Maier say about supplements?  






 If you have men who will 
exclude any of God's creatures
 from the shelter of compassion 
and pity, you will have men who 
 will deal likewise with their 
fellow man.
  St. Francis
  - Original Message - 
  From: Caroline Kaufmann 
  To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
  Sent: Monday, December 31, 2007 6:45 PM
  Subject: RE: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up


  Well, I think I just never saw him drink b/c I had him only from last sat. 
night until monday in my bedroom with my other cats (I have two large rooms 
connected- so they have tons of space.  All but Possum sleep in the condo- 
which is set up by the front window- at night).  But we did keep him in a 
separate crate in the room until the vet visit last monday, and that vet said 
to isolate him, so poor kitty and his crate went to the basement.  I felt 
horrible, but we are just currently running out of rooms.  So, he was stuck 
down there all alone and since he wasn't with me in my room, I wasn't able to 
see what he does.  He spent most of his time down there crying crying crying 
(broke my heart) and knocking over his coop cup of water and food in his 
desperate attempts to reach thru the crate.  It was horrible, I know, but our 
basement doesn't have a real door- it's a folding levelor blind-like door and 
every cat, save for the teeny barn kittens, have made short shrift of it!  
Anyway, per Dr. Maier's advice- after she told me her analysis of the blood 
tests (she doesn't think it's FIP (she said severe dehydration will cause high 
protein and high globulin in the blood- also, he didn't test pos. for any 
corona virus, so I don't see how the conventional vet can say FIP???).  She 
thinks it's just very very very bad malnourishment/dehydration, infection from 
chronic URIs setting in, stress, etc).  So, I moved him into my room on Sat., 
per her okay and recc that it would be better for him.  Since he and Possum are 
both special needs, slow (which incidentally makes them really good kitties b/c 
they don't have the energy to be bad!), both recovering from what is 
hopefully only malnourishment, etc., they both stay out in the room/sleep with 
me on the bed at night (they are both such good little boys)!  So I finally saw 
him drink water and it's all at once, wonderful and hilarious!  He drinks 
voraciously (as voraciously as he eats his wet food- well, he's into the 
crunchies too, but the wet food eating it funnier b/c he smacks him lips and 
gobbles and just makes all these snarfling noises while eating- and gets it all 
over his nose- like he never tasted anything so good!).  So the water drinking 
is similar-- very loud, very intense, and when he looks up, he has it all over 
his chin and nose!  So, I am no longer concerned about water drinking.  I add a 
lot of water to his wet food too and he doesn't seem to mind.  He's not 
dehydrated anymore either.  He still looks like an old man cat to me tho- which 
is sad because he's only 6 months.  Sigh.  He looks like what my 19 yo Rambo 
looked like his last year of life.  He really bounced back after just coming to 
my house, getting fluids and the shot of penicillin, but he seems to have 
leveled off now.  We'll see...I really hope it's not dry FIP.  I just can't go 
through that.  Tackling this malnourishment and weakened state has been hard 
enough...
  caroline





From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Subject: Re: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up
Date: Mon, 31 Dec 2007 17:38:57 -0600


Try dripping water or a water fountain.  Ebony loved to drink from the 
faucet.  I like the fountain better because the water can be filtered.  






 If you have men who will 
exclude any of God's creatures
 from the shelter of 
compassion and pity, you will have men who 
 will deal likewise with 
their fellow man.
  St. 
Francis
  - Original Message - 
  From: Caroline Kaufmann 
  To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
  Sent: Thursday, December 27, 2007 8:54 PM
  Subject: RE: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up


  I have never seen him drink water, so I am not sure.  But he's been 
urinating a lot- of course that could be from the fluids.  He was dehydrated on 
Monday, but he bounced back so much after the shot of Penicillin and one bought 
of subcu fluids- it was really remarkable.  And of course, the vet isn't able 
to see that.  Since I have never seen him drink water, I have been adding

Re: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up

2007-12-27 Thread Kelley Saveika
That is great news, that everything is negative.
Is he drinking normally?  Is he dehydrated?  If he is not dehydratedI
would not see any need for fluids (but I'm not a vet, this is not to be
construed as veterinary advice, yadda yadda)

Kelley



On Dec 27, 2007 8:39 PM, Caroline Kaufmann [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:

 Okay, the results are not all in, but I finally talked to the Vet about
 the blood tests from the sick kitten I took in- which he suspect FIP in.
 The cat was NEGATIVE for Felv (so that's the second time he's tested neg.-
 first at approx. 2 mths old, now at 6 mths).  He NEGATIVE for FIV (which he
 had not yet been tested for ever).  The vet also says that so far, it looks
 like it's not FIP and he talked about how there is no conclusive test, etc.,
 so for now, he has to go by the presence of antibodies- which he says are
 usually higher if the cat has dry FIP and then even higher if it's wet
 FIP.  He says the antibodies are just not high enough to for it to be FIP-
 either the dry or wet form.  So he remains concerned tho that it's a an
 infectious (i.e., contagious) disease.  *What he is waiting on now is the
 toxoplasmosis test b/c now he is suspecting that.*  He said the results of
 that test will be in tomorrow.  He also said the blood is showing high
 globulin levels and high white blood cells- both of which indicate some kind
 of an infection, but he just doesn't know what kind yet.
 I do have a phone consultation appointment tomorrow at 5:00 with the
 holistic vet (Marylyn-- Dr. Maier) who treated Monkee at the end of his life
 and whom Monkee loved- at a time when he was utterly miserable and fed up
 with vets!  We are consulting on this kitten and then also to discuss
 general care of fosters and things I can do holistically to help them rehab
 faster.  I may end up taking Yoda to her anyway b/c of the diarrhea that I
 can't get traditional vets to address.  Hopefully, I will have the blood
 tests results on my sick kitten emailed to me before then, so I can forward
 them to her for her review and second opinion.  I feel better because I am
 finally getting some freaking vets lined up so that I can finally take care
 of these fosters without always feeling like I'm supposed to do so without
 ever having veterinary access unless a cat is pretty much dying in my arms.
 Monkee died in my arms despite all the things we did to save him and there
 is NO WAY I'm going to allow another cat to die in my arms- especially these
 fosters who seem to have totally treatable (possibly preventable) things
 going on with them!  Urg.  So we continue to forge ahead.
 Poor kitty feels so much better and I'm worried about continuing to give
 him fluids.  Dr. Maier said in an email that if he is doing that much better
 and has had 3 treatments of subcu fluids, it's probably not necessary to do
 them today.  But when I talked to the conventional vet that saw the cat on
 Monday, he said to continue them b/c extra fluids are extra fluids, it
 can't really hurt him (I beg to differ- it's very traumatic b/c it's just
 me and him in a contest of wills and strength and it's pretty horrible- he
 gets that huge needle out everytime and I have to re-stick him-- which is
 hell for me and him), and without really seeing the cat, he can't tell me
 to discontinue fluids.  Well, my mom and I have discussed it and I'm doing
 them tonight.  It's too much on him and me.  He's feeling too good now so
 that he really fights the fluid giving.  I always recall that Dr. Maier- in
 all her holistic wisdom- said (when I first took Monkee to her), that you
 don't want the treatment to be worse than the disease.  I think that solves
 my dilemma for now.
 Caroline



 --
 The best games are on Xbox 360. Click here for a special offer on an Xbox
 360 Console. Get it now! http://www.xbox.com/en-US/hardware/wheretobuy/




-- 
Rescuties - Saving the world, one cat at a time.

http://www.rescuties.org

Vist the Rescuties store and save a kitty life!

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/redirect-home?tag=rescuties-20

http://www.zazzle.com/rescuties*

Please help Clarissa!

http://rescuties.chipin.com/clarissasheart


RE: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up

2007-12-27 Thread Caroline Kaufmann

I have never seen him drink water, so I am not sure.  But he's been urinating a 
lot- of course that could be from the fluids.  He was dehydrated on Monday, but 
he bounced back so much after the shot of Penicillin and one bought of subcu 
fluids- it was really remarkable.  And of course, the vet isn't able to see 
that.  Since I have never seen him drink water, I have been adding water and 
KMR to his wet food- just to make sure to get some extra in.  He eats almost 
all of his food up, so he's certainly getting moisture that way.
caroline 


Date: Thu, 27 Dec 2007 20:47:47 -0600From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]: [EMAIL 
PROTECTED]: Re: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up
That is great news, that everything is negative.
Is he drinking normally?  Is he dehydrated?  If he is not dehydratedI would 
not see any need for fluids (but I'm not a vet, this is not to be construed as 
veterinary advice, yadda yadda)
Kelley
 
On Dec 27, 2007 8:39 PM, Caroline Kaufmann [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

Okay, the results are not all in, but I finally talked to the Vet about the 
blood tests from the sick kitten I took in- which he suspect FIP in.  The cat 
was NEGATIVE for Felv (so that's the second time he's tested neg.- first at 
approx. 2 mths old, now at 6 mths).  He NEGATIVE for FIV (which he had not yet 
been tested for ever).  The vet also says that so far, it looks like it's not 
FIP and he talked about how there is no conclusive test, etc., so for now, he 
has to go by the presence of antibodies- which he says are usually higher if 
the cat has dry FIP and then even higher if it's wet FIP.  He says the 
antibodies are just not high enough to for it to be FIP- either the dry or wet 
form.  So he remains concerned tho that it's a an infectious ( i.e., 
contagious) disease.  What he is waiting on now is the toxoplasmosis test b/c 
now he is suspecting that.  He said the results of that test will be in 
tomorrow.  He also said the blood is showing high globulin levels and high 
white blood cells- both of which indicate some kind of an infection, but he 
just doesn't know what kind yet.  I do have a phone consultation appointment 
tomorrow at 5:00 with the holistic vet (Marylyn-- Dr. Maier) who treated Monkee 
at the end of his life and whom Monkee loved- at a time when he was utterly 
miserable and fed up with vets!  We are consulting on this kitten and then also 
to discuss general care of fosters and things I can do holistically to help 
them rehab faster.  I may end up taking Yoda to her anyway b/c of the diarrhea 
that I can't get traditional vets to address.  Hopefully, I will have the blood 
tests results on my sick kitten emailed to me before then, so I can forward 
them to her for her review and second opinion.  I feel better because I am 
finally getting some freaking vets lined up so that I can finally take care of 
these fosters without always feeling like I'm supposed to do so without ever 
having veterinary access unless a cat is pretty much dying in my arms.  Monkee 
died in my arms despite all the things we did to save him and there is NO WAY 
I'm going to allow another cat to die in my arms- especially these fosters who 
seem to have totally treatable (possibly preventable) things going on with 
them!  Urg.  So we continue to forge ahead. Poor kitty feels so much better and 
I'm worried about continuing to give him fluids.  Dr. Maier said in an email 
that if he is doing that much better and has had 3 treatments of subcu fluids, 
it's probably not necessary to do them today.  But when I talked to the 
conventional vet that saw the cat on Monday, he said to continue them b/c 
extra fluids are extra fluids, it can't really hurt him (I beg to differ- 
it's very traumatic b/c it's just me and him in a contest of wills and strength 
and it's pretty horrible- he gets that huge needle out everytime and I have to 
re-stick him-- which is hell for me and him), and without really seeing the 
cat, he can't tell me to discontinue fluids.  Well, my mom and I have 
discussed it and I'm doing them tonight.  It's too much on him and me.  He's 
feeling too good now so that he really fights the fluid giving.  I always 
recall that Dr. Maier- in all her holistic wisdom- said (when I first took 
Monkee to her), that you don't want the treatment to be worse than the 
disease.  I think that solves my dilemma for now. Caroline  

The best games are on Xbox 360. Click here for a special offer on an Xbox 360 
Console. Get it now!-- Rescuties - Saving the world, one cat at a 
time.http://www.rescuties.orgVist the Rescuties store and save a kitty 
life!http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/redirect-home?tag=rescuties-20http://www.zazzle.com/rescuties*Please
 help Clarissa!http://rescuties.chipin.com/clarissasheart
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Re: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up

2007-12-27 Thread Belinda Sauro

 Caroline,
Fred gets fluids everyday and I bet your vet gave you those monster 
size 18 gauge needles called kitty harpoons on the CRF site.  You can 
order size 20 gauge terumo needles from 
http://thrivingpets.com/products/item-detail.php?formStockId=392N1, I 
order Fred's here.  They are very sharp and a whole lot smaller than the 
kitty harpoons, most cats tolerate them very well, since they are very 
sharp they go in very nicely.  It does take a bit longer for the fluids 
to go through but since it doesn't hurt Fred is fine with it.  Fred was 
a terror when we started fluids, he would bite me, he has been getting 
them for about a year and a half now and is doing really well.  The 
thing about dehydration is a cat that is dehyrdrated feels pretty 
crappy, it's equivalent to having a horrible hang over.


--

Belinda
happiness is being owned by cats ...

Be-Mi-Kitties
http://bemikitties.com

Post Adoptable FeLV/FIV/FIP Cats/Kittens
http://adopt.bemikitties.com

FeLV Candlelight Service
http://bemikitties.com/cls

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Re: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up

2007-12-27 Thread Kelley Saveika
I like the 20 gauge also..but that is what my vet always gave me...

On Dec 27, 2007 8:56 PM, Belinda Sauro [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

  Caroline,
 Fred gets fluids everyday and I bet your vet gave you those monster
 size 18 gauge needles called kitty harpoons on the CRF site.  You can
 order size 20 gauge terumo needles from
 http://thrivingpets.com/products/item-detail.php?formStockId=392N1, I
 order Fred's here.  They are very sharp and a whole lot smaller than the
 kitty harpoons, most cats tolerate them very well, since they are very
 sharp they go in very nicely.  It does take a bit longer for the fluids
 to go through but since it doesn't hurt Fred is fine with it.  Fred was
 a terror when we started fluids, he would bite me, he has been getting
 them for about a year and a half now and is doing really well.  The
 thing about dehydration is a cat that is dehyrdrated feels pretty
 crappy, it's equivalent to having a horrible hang over.

 --

 Belinda
 happiness is being owned by cats ...

 Be-Mi-Kitties
 http://bemikitties.com

 Post Adoptable FeLV/FIV/FIP Cats/Kittens
 http://adopt.bemikitties.com

 FeLV Candlelight Service
 http://bemikitties.com/cls

 HostDesign4U.com [affordable hosting  web design]
 http://HostDesign4U.com http://hostdesign4u.com/

 

 BMK Designs [non-profit animals websites]
 http://bmk.bemikitties.com





-- 
Rescuties - Saving the world, one cat at a time.

http://www.rescuties.org

Vist the Rescuties store and save a kitty life!

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/redirect-home?tag=rescuties-20

http://www.zazzle.com/rescuties*

Please help Clarissa!

http://rescuties.chipin.com/clarissasheart


RE: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up

2007-12-27 Thread Caroline Kaufmann

Okay, that helps a lot.  Yeah, you could tell he felt pretty crappy on Monday 
when he saw the vet.  I knew that, the techs knew that, the vet knew that, the 
cat knew that!  But he really rallied so much the very next day and he no 
longer feels crappy.  It's more behavioral now where he's pissed about being 
segregated in his pitiful crate in the downstairs and he knows there's buddies 
upstairs to play with and he's NOT happy about it.  But physically, he looks so 
much better.  His coat is already smoother and shiny and just feels so much 
better-- it's really kind of freaky.  
 
I will order some of those needles because I am NOT doing it with that horrible 
needle anymore.  I was telling people about it (people who don't do this work) 
and I'm like, you don't understand my pain! b/c this needle is huge!  When I 
had to give Monkee his subcu epogen, it was with this teeny tiny little needle 
and that little beefcake- even being as sick as he was- didn't even feel it.  
But this needle is horrible.  It pains me to stick him with it.  And he manages 
to get his back leg up and pull it out with a foot (and I know he knows exactly 
what he's doing!) and then we have to start over again...so I'm not putting 
us through that tonight.  I think we will both be better off...
caroline  Date: Thu, 27 Dec 2007 18:56:02 -0800 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 
felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up  
Caroline, Fred gets fluids everyday and I bet your vet gave you those monster 
 size 18 gauge needles called kitty harpoons on the CRF site. You can  order 
size 20 gauge terumo needles from  
http://thrivingpets.com/products/item-detail.php?formStockId=392N1, I  order 
Fred's here. They are very sharp and a whole lot smaller than the  kitty 
harpoons, most cats tolerate them very well, since they are very  sharp they 
go in very nicely. It does take a bit longer for the fluids  to go through but 
since it doesn't hurt Fred is fine with it. Fred was  a terror when we started 
fluids, he would bite me, he has been getting  them for about a year and a 
half now and is doing really well. The  thing about dehydration is a cat that 
is dehyrdrated feels pretty  crappy, it's equivalent to having a horrible hang 
over.  --   Belinda happiness is being owned by cats ...  Be-Mi-Kitties 
http://bemikitties.com  Post Adoptable FeLV/FIV/FIP Cats/Kittens 
http://adopt.bemikitties.com  FeLV Candlelight Service 
http://bemikitties.com/cls  HostDesign4U.com [affordable hosting  web 
design] http://HostDesign4U.com    BMK Designs [non-profit 
animals websites] http://bmk.bemikitties.com  
_
Get the power of Windows + Web with the new Windows Live.
http://www.windowslive.com?ocid=TXT_TAGHM_Wave2_powerofwindows_122007

Re: OT: sick 6 mo kitten follow-up

2007-12-27 Thread Belinda Sauro
   Smart vet I've always gotten the 18 and they are pretty huge 
compared tot the 20's!!


--

Belinda
happiness is being owned by cats ...

Be-Mi-Kitties
http://bemikitties.com

Post Adoptable FeLV/FIV/FIP Cats/Kittens
http://adopt.bemikitties.com

FeLV Candlelight Service
http://bemikitties.com/cls

HostDesign4U.com [affordable hosting  web design]
http://HostDesign4U.com



BMK Designs [non-profit animals websites]
http://bmk.bemikitties.com