[Finale] OT: Bass Trombone (Brass Band)
Hi Folks, All this talk about bass trombones has got me wondering why the bass trombone is the only non-transposing brass instrument in the traditional British brass band. As I understand it, the practice of transposing all the instruments in a brass band into either Eb or Bb and writing them in treble clef developed in England during the Industrial Revolution. Why didn't the bass trombone follow the same convention? I'm just now finishing the first piece I have written for brass band and find the unusual transposition interesting. Joe - Joe Laird Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] OT: Bass Trombone (Brass Band)
On Mar 7, 2005, at 3:28 PM, Joe Laird wrote: Hi Folks, All this talk about bass trombones has got me wondering why the bass trombone is the only non-transposing brass instrument in the traditional British brass band. As I understand it, the practice of transposing all the instruments in a brass band into either Eb or Bb and writing them in treble clef developed in England during the Industrial Revolution. Why didn't the bass trombone follow the same convention? I'm just now finishing the first piece I have written for brass band and find the unusual transposition interesting. Joe My (perhaps faulty) understanding of the tradition is to help keep all the instruments in the staff. A Bb transposed bass trombone would spend a lot of time below the staff. Add to that the additional worry of the traditional G home key of bass trombone, and things could get a bit hairy. Transposed cornet, alto, baritone, tuba etc. all use the same fingerings, so players can freely move between instruments of the same family with only chops to worry about rather than new fingerings. This doesn't affect tenor trombone, I know, but I have no explanation for that. The alternative explanation is that those who choose to play bass trombone are simply more intelligent than most other brass players, and can deal with the different transposition. I subscribe to this theory myself, having chosen bass trombone at a young age. 8-) Christopher (who, as a mark of his intelligence, thought for years that blowing a pedal Bb would make the TV image shake, and only discovered late in life that it was actually his eyes that were shaking when playing loud and low.) ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] OT: Bass Trombone (Brass Band)
From: Joe Laird [EMAIL PROTECTED] All this talk about bass trombones has got me wondering why the bass trombone is the only non-transposing brass instrument in the traditional British brass band. As I understand it, the practice of transposing all the instruments in a brass band into either Eb or Bb and writing them in treble clef developed in England during the Industrial Revolution. Why didn't the bass trombone follow the same convention? I'm just now finishing the first piece I have written for brass band and find the unusual transposition interesting. Actually the bass trombone is not playing an odd transposition: It is the only instrument, aside from members of the percussion family, which plays loco within the brass band notation system. Formerly the two tenor trombones also did so, insofar that they played tenor clef concert. It is important to realise, that the British brass band movement never was mainly about music. It always was a social vehicle, where music happened to be the topic of the gatherings. By having all of the valved brasses written, so that the relations between graphics and fingerings stayed uniform all over the range of instruments (maybe aside from the 4 valve euphoniums and basses), it was possible to rotate players among all of the instruments as membership fluctuations dictated. Trombones were the-odd-men-out. Some say they often were recruited among ex-service-bandsmen. And the bassbone was even more odd. It was pitched in G like the Brit orchestral bassbone was up to somewhere between 1955 and 1970. After that the one valve Bb bassbone entered the scene. It happened to have the exact same bottom limit as the G variant namely the the cellos lowest C# cum Db. I have played Eric Leidzen's Sinfonietta on a such trombone. The middle movement was written in E major (or was it C# minor) with 4 #'s in my part, whereas the cornets had 6 flats in their parts. My playing in tune on the low C# was a novelty in that band. Wonderful piece by the way. Since then I have, like most bassboners, gone to the 2 valve Bb bassbones, which unlike the single valve instruments have a full chromatic range over their 5, 6, or 7 octave ranges (depending on embouchure). Through the last few years I have been able to acquire 3 Brit bassbones in G, all to be played with a slide handle, as the 6th and 7th positions are out of reach for even players, who like me, suffer from the orangutan syndrome. The 1919 specimen is in high pitch (A=459). The most interesting sample may be the 1978 specimen, which has a D valve. It is one of the last samples made of the version used by the Brit symphs. Even a bone guru like Denis Wick hailed its wonderful low C in the short chorale in Brahms 1. The G bones don't own the broadness and warmth of the larger-bore Bb bassbones. But they own a quality often missed in present day low brass: clarity! It may have surfaced, that I have a love/hate relationship with the brass band entity, where I have played all instruments from Eb cornet through BBb tuba on just about all seatings. It even has taken me to the stage of Royal Albert Hall doing a short solo from a tutti seat. I have learned immensely from my experiences. But by now the sound and the not always very musical approach nauseates me, as does most of the repertory. Klaus ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] OT: Bass Trombone (Brass Band)
At 11:13 PM +0100 3/7/05, Klaus Bjerre wrote: Trombones were the-odd-men-out. Some say they often were recruited among ex-service-bandsmen. And the bassbone was even more odd. It was pitched in G like the Brit orchestral bassbone was up to somewhere between 1955 and 1970. After that the one valve Bb bassbone entered the scene. It happened to have the exact same bottom limit as the G variant namely the the cellos lowest C# cum Db. I have played Eric Leidzen's Sinfonietta on a such trombone. The middle movement was written in E major (or was it C# minor) with 4 #'s in my part, whereas the cornets had 6 flats in their parts. My playing in tune on the low C# was a novelty in that band. Wonderful piece by the way. This brought me up short, Klaus. The one valve Bb bassbone or Bb/F bass has a natural range down to the cello's low C, not C#, and down to the B with the tuning slide extension pulled. Obviously you know this instrument well, so a little more detail would be appreciated. Through the last few years I have been able to acquire 3 Brit bassbones in G, all to be played with a slide handle, as the 6th and 7th positions are out of reach for even players, who like me, suffer from the orangutan syndrome. I once worked with a Bb/F bass player in Toronto who had very short arms, and had had a handle fitted to his normal Bb/F instrument. The real monster is the Eb bass sackbutt, which absolutely requires a handle. John -- John Susie Howell Virginia Tech Department of Music Blacksburg, Virginia, U.S.A 24061-0240 Vox (540) 231-8411 Fax (540) 231-5034 (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]) http://www.music.vt.edu/faculty/howell/howell.html ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] OT: Bass Trombone (Brass Band)
Timpani, if present, are also non-transposing. John On 7 Mar 2005, at 20:28, Joe Laird wrote: Hi Folks, All this talk about bass trombones has got me wondering why the bass trombone is the only non-transposing brass instrument in the traditional British brass band. As I understand it, the practice of transposing all the instruments in a brass band into either Eb or Bb and writing them in treble clef developed in England during the Industrial Revolution. Why didn't the bass trombone follow the same convention? I'm just now finishing the first piece I have written for brass band and find the unusual transposition interesting. Joe - Joe Laird Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
