Re: [Fis] information.energy

2014-08-04 Thread Francesco Rizzo
Cari colleghi,
permettetemi di ribadire che:
-il concetto-processo di informazione vale per tutti gli esseri viventi
(umani, animali e vegetali) e per tutto ciò che è stato creato o si è
formato e continua a crearsi e formarsi anche ad opera dell'uomo
(concepimento di bambini, buchi neri, pensiero, poesia, musica, arte,
prodotti industriali, innovazioni tecno-scientifiche, montagne, stelle,
galassie, etc.);
- l'energia libera o neg-entropia non è altro  che informazione (frutto
della separazione delle molecole di un gas calde e veloci da un lato e
fredde e lente dall'altro lato che determinano il gradiente termico; invece
l'energia degradata o entropia non è altro che dis-informazione o
deformazione dovuta alla confusione o equilibrio molecolare; quindi le
distinzioni tra diversi tipi e categorie di informazione (naturale o
termodinamica, genetica, matematica, semantica) si debbono o possono  fare,
ma non intaccano l'unicità epistemica e concettuale dell'informazione;
- la triade semiotica "significazione, informazione e comunicazione" è
fondamentale per il nostro dibattito, ma è la comunicazione a implicare
un'interazione tra chi trasmette o enuncia segni linguistici e chi li
riceve o accoglie sulla base di uno o più codici.
So di essere schematico e frammentario, ma non mi manca l'umiltà per
ricevere critiche, suggerimenti ed osservazioni integrative e/o correttive.
Grazie e saluti.
Francesco Rizzo.



2014-08-04 16:21 GMT+02:00 Stanley N Salthe :

> Bob -- Note that I was pointing out "a sense" in which information implies
> something different from energy -- especially in the context of dialectics,
> which is the basis of Joseph's approach. There can be no 'precipitated'
> energy (matter) without some kind of form, realizing one or some
> constraints, but the concept of information (its history) tends to imply
> interaction.
>
> STAN
>
>
> On Sun, Aug 3, 2014 at 11:13 PM, Robert E. Ulanowicz 
> wrote:
>
>> > Stanley N Salthe 
>> > 9:32 AM (0 minutes ago)
>> > to Joseph
>> > Joseph -- Commenting on:
>> > ...
>>
>> > Is there not also a sense that information implies more than one entity
>> > (sender-receiver, object-interpreter)? That too would tend to align with
>> > the idea of energy being primary.
>>
>>
>> But Stan, you were one of the first to recognize the broader nature of
>> information as constraint. It is also inherent in structure (Collier's
>> "enformation"). Hence, wherever inhomogeneities exist, so does information
>> -- an argument for a common origin. Bob
>>
>>
>
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Re: [Fis] information.energy

2014-08-04 Thread Stanley N Salthe
Bob -- Note that I was pointing out "a sense" in which information implies
something different from energy -- especially in the context of dialectics,
which is the basis of Joseph's approach. There can be no 'precipitated'
energy (matter) without some kind of form, realizing one or some
constraints, but the concept of information (its history) tends to imply
interaction.

STAN


On Sun, Aug 3, 2014 at 11:13 PM, Robert E. Ulanowicz  wrote:

> > Stanley N Salthe 
> > 9:32 AM (0 minutes ago)
> > to Joseph
> > Joseph -- Commenting on:
> > ...
> > Is there not also a sense that information implies more than one entity
> > (sender-receiver, object-interpreter)? That too would tend to align with
> > the idea of energy being primary.
>
>
> But Stan, you were one of the first to recognize the broader nature of
> information as constraint. It is also inherent in structure (Collier's
> "enformation"). Hence, wherever inhomogeneities exist, so does information
> -- an argument for a common origin. Bob
>
>
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[Fis] information.energy

2014-08-03 Thread Stanley N Salthe
Stanley N Salthe 
9:32 AM (0 minutes ago)
to Joseph
Joseph -- Commenting on:

 We may agree that, if they are not identical, energy and information
always accompany one another and may have emerged together from some as yet
incompletely defined substrate. However, they may not be, do not have to be
and for me are not at the same ontological level, and energy is primary
being less abstract.

Is there not also a sense that information implies more than one entity
(sender-receiver, object-interpreter)? That too would tend to align with
the idea of energy being primary.

STAN
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