Re: [Fis] The unification of the theories of information based on the cateogry theory

2018-02-27 Thread Francesco Rizzo
Caro Sun, e cari tutti, ecco la traduzione in inglese del messaggio del 21 febbraio scorso. Cari saluti. Francesco Dear everyone, on February 8 I sent you a message whose content, without any presumption, can be useful to resolve the over-epistemo-logical issues that have arisen. Then I send it

Re: [Fis] The unification of the theories of information based on the cateogry theory

2018-02-21 Thread Francesco Rizzo
Cari Tutti, l'8 febbraio Vi ho inviato un messaggio il cui contenuto, senza alcuna presunzione, può essere utile per dirimere le questioni onto-epistemo-logiche che sono sorte. Allora lo trasmetto nuovamente. Caro Terry estensibile a tutti, è sempre un piacere leggerTi e capirTi. La general

Re: [Fis] The unification of the theories of information based on the cateogry theory

2018-02-21 Thread Xueshan Yan
Dear colleagues, In the first half of this month, we have a heated discussion about the relationship among Information, Language, and Communication started by Sung. I am simply summing up part of the different opinions as follows: Sung: Without a language, no communication would be

Re: [Fis] The unification of the theories of information based on the cateogry theory

2018-02-14 Thread Loet Leydesdorff
Dear Koichiro and colleagues, The ancient Greeks had several notions of time. The main point for our discussion seems to me the distinction between historical time and event time. Trajectories, for example, can be formed in historical time by series of relations; trajectories are observable.

Re: [Fis] The unification of the theories of information based on the cateogry theory

2018-02-14 Thread Guy A Hoelzer
Hi Christophe, I completely agree that there is an important distinction between the communication between attached beams and the semantic communication between agents. Like you, I have long been interested in the evolution of biological signaling systems. My dissertation research included

Re: [Fis] The unification of the theories of information based on the cateogry theory

2018-02-14 Thread Christophe Menant
Dear Soren, Thanks for your comments. Interpretation and agency are indeed key items. An approach based on internal constraint saisfactiont allows to address them together, with autonomy also. In a few words: An agent is an entity submitted to internal constraints and capable of actions for the

Re: [Fis] The unification of the theories of information based on the cateogry theory

2018-02-13 Thread Guy A Hoelzer
Hi All, I want to pick on Christophe’s post to make a general plea about FIS posting. This is not a comment on meaning generation by agents. Christophe wrote: "Keeping in mind that communications exist only because agents need to manage meanings for given purposes”. This seems to imply

Re: [Fis] The unification of the theories of information based on the cateogry theory

2018-02-13 Thread Christophe Menant
Dear Terry and FISers, It looks indeed reasonable to position the term 'language' as ‘simply referring to the necessity of a shared medium of communication’. Keeping in mind that communications exist only because agents need to manage meanings for given purposes. And the concept of agent can be

Re: [Fis] The unification of the theories of information based on the cateogry theory

2018-02-13 Thread Gordana Dodig-Crnkovic
Hello Terry, Sung, FIS colleagues There is a notion of “body language”. Perhaps it might be possible to develop a general theory of language that can take into account bacteria and dogs (according to Nature http://www.nature.com/news/dogs-can-tell-when-praise-is-sincere-1.20514) as well as

Re: [Fis] The unification of the theories of information based on the cateogry theory

2018-02-12 Thread Xueshan Yan
Dear Javier and Dear Stan, Javier: 1. I very much agree with you as follows: “I think that only signals can be transmitted, not information. Information can only be gained by an observer (a self-referential system) that draws a distinction.” A Chinese scholar Dongsheng Miao’s argument is:

Re: [Fis] The unification of the theories of information based on the cateogry theory

2018-02-10 Thread tozziarturo
Dear Karl, your analysis about Wittgenstein does not take into account the second Wittgenstein, who repudiated his own idea from the Tractatus. I think, in touch with Carnap on other issues, that the use of the terms "symbol", "signal", "marker", "information" into scientific sentences does

Re: [Fis] The unification of the theories of information based on the cateogry theory

2018-02-10 Thread Karl Javorszky
Using the logical language to understand Nature The discussion in this group refocuses on the meaning of the terms “symbol”, “signal”, “marker” and so forth. This is a very welcome development, because understanding the tools one uses is usually helpful when creating great works. There is

Re: [Fis] The unification of the theories of information based on the cateogry theory

2018-02-10 Thread Stanley N Salthe
Xueshan -- I think one can condense some of your insights hierarchically, as: In a system having language, information seemingly may be obtained in other ways as well. It would be a conceptually broader category. Thus (using the compositional hierarchy): [information [language [signal]]]

Re: [Fis] The unification of the theories of information based on the cateogry theory

2018-02-10 Thread Xueshan Yan
Dear Colleagues, I have read the article "The languages of bacteria" which Gordana recommended, and has gained a lot of inspiration from it. In combination with Sung's comparative linguistics exploration on cell language and human language, I have the following learning feelings to share with

Re: [Fis] The unification of the theories of information based on the cateogry theory

2018-02-08 Thread Sungchul Ji
Hi Terry, and FISers, Can it be that "language metaphor" is akin to a (theoretical) knife that, in the hands of a surgeon, can save lives but, in a wrong hand, can kill? All the best. Sung From: Francesco Rizzo <13francesco.ri...@gmail.com> Sent: Thursday,

Re: [Fis] The unification of the theories of information based on the cateogry theory

2018-02-07 Thread Francesco Rizzo
Caro Terry estensibile a tutti, è sempre un piacere leggerTi e capirTi. La general theory of information è preceduta da un sistema (o semiotica) di significazione e seguita da un sistema (o semiotica ) di comunicazione. Tranne che quando si ha un processo comunicativo come il passaggio di un

Re: [Fis] The unification of the theories of information based on the cateogry theory

2018-02-07 Thread Terrence W. DEACON
Dear FISers, In previous posts I have disparaged using language as the base model for building a general theory of information. Though I realize that this may seem almost heretical, it is not a claim that all those who use linguistic analogies are wrong, only that it can be causally misleading. I

Re: [Fis] The unification of the theories of information based on the cateogry theory

2018-02-07 Thread Jose Javier Blanco Rivero
In principle I agree with Terry. I have been thinking of this, though I am still not able to make a sound formulation of the idea. Still I am afraid that if I miss the chance to make at least a brief formulation of it I will lose the opportunity to make a brainstorming with you. So, here it comes:

Re: [Fis] The unification of the theories of information based on the cateogry theory

2018-02-07 Thread Gordana Dodig-Crnkovic
In agreement with Sung I see the value of “language metaphor" that can be applied to physical objects when they are used for communication. Description of “chemical language” used by bacteria can be found e.g. here http://genesdev.cshlp.org/content/15/12/1468.full.pdfStephan and number of other