Re: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

2009-08-18 Thread Ron Wheeler

You might look at Spring Roo to see where the generation of code is going.
It is very slick. It works very nicely from the UML model.

Document the classes and atomic properties.
Document the relationships. Order has a property which is a set of 
Order Details and Order Details has a reference to an Order
Document the finders I want a findByOder on OrderDetails, I want a 
findByCustomer on Order It can tell from the names what you want.

Document the names of the controllers you want created.
Document the controllers for which you want automatic test scripts.
request that Security be added

Feed your little script into Roo and you get a working Java webapp with 
CRUD for all your objects.


Import that into Eclipse (STS version) and customize it.

Still learning how to use it but it is pretty slick. The visual 
appearance is horrible but it is set up for CSS so it can be fixed up.
All of the CRUD functions are on a single page, so you do have to go in 
and remap your content, menus and functions onto URLs and pages that 
make sense.


It depends on Spring and AOP very heavily. The code generated is very, 
very concise and readable.


I am just getting used to AOP and it looks pretty intimidating.

If we only had Spring for haXe..


Ron

Matt Gitchell wrote:

I figured this is where we'd end up.
I code in either environment with comparable speed, honestly, it's just
getting used to the workflow.
Honest! Now whether that means I code like the freakin' wind in either
or am slow as hell
in both I'll leave for you to decide. Rather than seeing the Eclipse-based
methodology as 'stupid,' I decided to consider it merely different and have
done some tweaks to get it the way I like it, which now I do.

And yes, I do 'think ahead' plenty, but that still doesn't mean that things
don't get moved around all that often. In my particular freelance world, I
end up dealing with 3rd party IT and backend guys and gals, subcontractors
of varying skill, clients who want to change scope, clients who DO change
scope (though they generally get punished financially), the gamut. Some of
these experiences mean changes of plans, which means that the refactoring
aspect is handy and saves me time.

The debug stuff is also very handy. I write code, compile, test; I
repeat this until I have a project done, for the most part. That means
that I engage the debugger more than just occasionally, I really like
having that data there.

I like these additional features, and it's worth the money to me to have
them all part of the same tool. If it saves me, say, 10 hours over the
course of owning the software, I've more than paid for it, and I've more
than paid for it.

Some of us get to work in worlds where we define all variables at the outset
of the project. We then see our projects built exactly to the class diagrams
we built when we set out to start, and we don't deviate. We then get to
write thousands of lines of perfect code, with perfect structure, then
compile it once and find that we've removed every listener, destroyed every
bitmap, caught every error, forseen every use case.

I am not one of those people, so I've bought a tool (and use a platform)
that helps compensate for that.

--Matt


On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 7:21 PM, Steven Sacks flash...@stevensacks.netwrote:

  

The act of writing Actionscript in FlashDevelop is, IMO, better.  FD's code
completion and code gen is easier and faster.  Because code completion and
code gen is the majority of what I do from moment to moment as I'm writing,
it's the better tool.

Refactoring and debugging are not what I spend the majority of my time
doing.  I have Flex Builder.  I use it sometimes, but not always, and
generally I use it with Build Automatically turned on while I code in FD on
the same project and it will spot compile-time errors on the fly.

FDT is a great (albeit expensive) tool, but for day to day coding, I prefer
FlashDevelop because it helps me write code faster.  It might not help me
debug faster, but I spend a lot less time doing that than actually writing
code, which is where FlashDevelop shines.

I'm confused by all these comments about the strength of the refactoring
tool being a deciding factor.  Do you really move stuff around packages that
often? Do you really rename entire classes that often?  I find that thinking
ahead solves that problem, and when it comes up, Find and Replace in files
does a great job, even if it's a few Find and Replaces instead of just one
Refactor command.

Believe me, I (and many others) have asked the FD guys for this feature,
and it's something they're working on adding.  However, it's not something I
use often enough to outweigh the benefits FD provides when actually writing
code.

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RE: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

2009-08-18 Thread Merrill, Jason
 Document the classes and atomic properties.

What's an atomic property?


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Re: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

2009-08-18 Thread Dave Watts
 What's an atomic property?

A property that is a primitive type (string, int, Boolean, etc), I think.

Dave Watts, CTO, Fig Leaf Software
http://www.figleaf.com/

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RE: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

2009-08-18 Thread Merrill, Jason
Why not just call it a primitive then?


Jason Merrill 

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-Original Message-
From: flashcoders-boun...@chattyfig.figleaf.com
[mailto:flashcoders-boun...@chattyfig.figleaf.com] On Behalf Of Dave
Watts
Sent: Tuesday, August 18, 2009 11:22 AM
To: Flash Coders List
Subject: Re: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

 What's an atomic property?

A property that is a primitive type (string, int, Boolean, etc), I
think.

Dave Watts, CTO, Fig Leaf Software
http://www.figleaf.com/

Fig Leaf Software provides the highest caliber vendor-authorized
instruction at our training centers in Washington DC, Atlanta,
Chicago, Baltimore, Northern Virginia, or on-site at your location.
Visit http://training.figleaf.com/ for more information!
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Re: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

2009-08-18 Thread Ron Wheeler

Dave Watts wrote:

What's an atomic property?



A property that is a primitive type (string, int, Boolean, etc), I think.

Dave Watts, CTO, Fig Leaf Software
http://www.figleaf.com/

Fig Leaf Software provides the highest caliber vendor-authorized
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That is what I was trying to convey.
Thanks
Ron

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Re: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

2009-08-18 Thread Ron Wheeler

Merrill, Jason wrote:

Why not just call it a primitive then?

  

That would have been exactly the right thing to say/write.
Sorry.
Couldn't think of the right word at the time. Just getting old, I guess.
Ron

Jason Merrill 

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-Original Message-
From: flashcoders-boun...@chattyfig.figleaf.com
[mailto:flashcoders-boun...@chattyfig.figleaf.com] On Behalf Of Dave
Watts
Sent: Tuesday, August 18, 2009 11:22 AM
To: Flash Coders List
Subject: Re: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

  

What's an atomic property?



A property that is a primitive type (string, int, Boolean, etc), I
think.

Dave Watts, CTO, Fig Leaf Software
http://www.figleaf.com/

Fig Leaf Software provides the highest caliber vendor-authorized
instruction at our training centers in Washington DC, Atlanta,
Chicago, Baltimore, Northern Virginia, or on-site at your location.
Visit http://training.figleaf.com/ for more information!
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RE: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

2009-08-18 Thread Merrill, Jason
 Why not just call it a primitive then?
That would have been exactly the right thing to say/write.
 Sorry. Couldn't think of the right word at the time. 
Just getting old, I guess.

Ah, np, I thought maybe it was some hip new term or something I hadn't
heard of!


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Re: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

2009-08-18 Thread Dave Watts
 Why not just call it a primitive then?

Well, while they're generally the same sort of thing, they can be
different - in many languages, a string isn't really a primitive type
but represents an instance of a String object or an array of
characters, etc. I think the point of calling them atomic is to
indicate that they don't have properties of their own that correspond
to other objects. (atomic == indivisible).

Dave Watts, CTO, Fig Leaf Software
http://www.figleaf.com/

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RE: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

2009-08-18 Thread Merrill, Jason
(atomic == indivisible).

You need to do some reading on string theory. :) 


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Re: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

2009-08-18 Thread Ian Thomas
One for which you shouldn't call the setter unless you're wearing a
lead apron and goggles. ;-)

Ian

On Tue, Aug 18, 2009 at 3:52 PM, Merrill,
Jasonjason.merr...@bankofamerica.com wrote:
 Document the classes and atomic properties.

 What's an atomic property?


 Jason Merrill

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Re: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

2009-08-17 Thread Steven Sacks
The act of writing Actionscript in FlashDevelop is, IMO, better.  FD's code 
completion and code gen is easier and faster.  Because code completion and code 
gen is the majority of what I do from moment to moment as I'm writing, it's the 
better tool.


Refactoring and debugging are not what I spend the majority of my time doing.  I 
have Flex Builder.  I use it sometimes, but not always, and generally I use it 
with Build Automatically turned on while I code in FD on the same project and it 
will spot compile-time errors on the fly.


FDT is a great (albeit expensive) tool, but for day to day coding, I prefer 
FlashDevelop because it helps me write code faster.  It might not help me debug 
faster, but I spend a lot less time doing that than actually writing code, which 
is where FlashDevelop shines.


I'm confused by all these comments about the strength of the refactoring tool 
being a deciding factor.  Do you really move stuff around packages that often? 
Do you really rename entire classes that often?  I find that thinking ahead 
solves that problem, and when it comes up, Find and Replace in files does a 
great job, even if it's a few Find and Replaces instead of just one Refactor 
command.


Believe me, I (and many others) have asked the FD guys for this feature, and 
it's something they're working on adding.  However, it's not something I use 
often enough to outweigh the benefits FD provides when actually writing code.

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Re: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

2009-08-17 Thread Matt Gitchell
I figured this is where we'd end up.
I code in either environment with comparable speed, honestly, it's just
getting used to the workflow.
Honest! Now whether that means I code like the freakin' wind in either
or am slow as hell
in both I'll leave for you to decide. Rather than seeing the Eclipse-based
methodology as 'stupid,' I decided to consider it merely different and have
done some tweaks to get it the way I like it, which now I do.

And yes, I do 'think ahead' plenty, but that still doesn't mean that things
don't get moved around all that often. In my particular freelance world, I
end up dealing with 3rd party IT and backend guys and gals, subcontractors
of varying skill, clients who want to change scope, clients who DO change
scope (though they generally get punished financially), the gamut. Some of
these experiences mean changes of plans, which means that the refactoring
aspect is handy and saves me time.

The debug stuff is also very handy. I write code, compile, test; I
repeat this until I have a project done, for the most part. That means
that I engage the debugger more than just occasionally, I really like
having that data there.

I like these additional features, and it's worth the money to me to have
them all part of the same tool. If it saves me, say, 10 hours over the
course of owning the software, I've more than paid for it, and I've more
than paid for it.

Some of us get to work in worlds where we define all variables at the outset
of the project. We then see our projects built exactly to the class diagrams
we built when we set out to start, and we don't deviate. We then get to
write thousands of lines of perfect code, with perfect structure, then
compile it once and find that we've removed every listener, destroyed every
bitmap, caught every error, forseen every use case.

I am not one of those people, so I've bought a tool (and use a platform)
that helps compensate for that.

--Matt


On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 7:21 PM, Steven Sacks flash...@stevensacks.netwrote:

 The act of writing Actionscript in FlashDevelop is, IMO, better.  FD's code
 completion and code gen is easier and faster.  Because code completion and
 code gen is the majority of what I do from moment to moment as I'm writing,
 it's the better tool.

 Refactoring and debugging are not what I spend the majority of my time
 doing.  I have Flex Builder.  I use it sometimes, but not always, and
 generally I use it with Build Automatically turned on while I code in FD on
 the same project and it will spot compile-time errors on the fly.

 FDT is a great (albeit expensive) tool, but for day to day coding, I prefer
 FlashDevelop because it helps me write code faster.  It might not help me
 debug faster, but I spend a lot less time doing that than actually writing
 code, which is where FlashDevelop shines.

 I'm confused by all these comments about the strength of the refactoring
 tool being a deciding factor.  Do you really move stuff around packages that
 often? Do you really rename entire classes that often?  I find that thinking
 ahead solves that problem, and when it comes up, Find and Replace in files
 does a great job, even if it's a few Find and Replaces instead of just one
 Refactor command.

 Believe me, I (and many others) have asked the FD guys for this feature,
 and it's something they're working on adding.  However, it's not something I
 use often enough to outweigh the benefits FD provides when actually writing
 code.

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Re: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

2009-08-13 Thread Cedric Muller




I didn't say people who used it were retarded, I said the program was.


I am retarded, as I neither use FD nor FlexBuilder ;) 
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Re: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

2009-08-13 Thread allandt bik-elliott (thefieldcomic.com)
had a quick look around and found this list
http://www.flashdevelop.org/wikidocs/index.php?title=Features:Generation

does anyone have the fdt version?

fdt does have control-t but it's a different shortcut - flexbuilder has
nothing of the sort (this like this are the reason i didn't like it)
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Re: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

2009-08-13 Thread Patrick Matte
You don't have to backspace all the way back to the period when you make a
typo in FlexBuilder, you can just backspace the typo, and press control +
space and the menu will popup again. Of course it's not as convenient as the
FD menu.

As for refactoring, find and replace works but the rename function is
FlexBuilder is so effortless and I'm very lazy by nature ;-) By the way, can
FD do find and replace in all the classes of your project? I don't remember,
I haven't used it very much since I started working here on a mac.

I've heard that Adobe has included some of the code generation shortcuts
from FD in FlashBuilder 4, like event handler and getter / setter
generation. Thanks to FD!

I've had some auto-complete mishaps with FD on my computer at home. Even
after re-installing the program and deleting the local settings files, it
still sometimes doesn't auto-import some classes from the flash package and
I have to type my import by hand. Weird.


 From: Steven Sacks flash...@stevensacks.net
 Reply-To: Flash Coders List flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com
 Date: Wed, 12 Aug 2009 22:22:00 -0700
 To: Flash Coders List flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com
 Subject: Re: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc
 
 I'm confused why you would need to look at more than one project at a time,
 and 
 you can switch projects very quickly in FD by using Recent Projects.
 
 It's well established the debugger is limited to tracing, which is generally
 good enough for most of the time.
 
 I don't know what you mean about better syntax and variable scope across
 documents. I find the variable scope feature of FlashDevelop to be fantastic.
 The F4 key is great. If you mean something else, I'm definitely interested.
 
 What plug-ins are you talking about specifically that Eclipse has that help
 with 
 coding Actionscript?
 
 I agree the documentation is lacking. I've discovered new features on
 accident.
 
 I keep hearing about the refactoring feature, but how often are you
 refactoring 
 and how does Find and Replace in Files (CTRL+I) not take care of it?
 
 In FB or FDT, if you make a typo, you lose it and you have to start over.
 This 
 goes for properties and constants, etc.  I don't know about you, but while I'm
 a 
 great typist, I'm not perfect, and FlashDevelop is forgiving and still knows
 what you want, even if you typo or hit backspace to make a correction, where
 if 
 you hit the wrong key or backspace in FB or FDT, you lose everything.  This is
 especially a pain with long names.
 
 The getter/setter code gen for vars and the event code gen are incredible time
 savers.  The default shortcut isn't very good, but you can change it (I use
 ALT+2).
 
 FlexBuilder and FDT offer live code compiling, which FlashDevelop does not.
 FDT's lexical parsing is superior to FlexBuilder, as well.  However, I find
 that 
 those features are not worth the speed tradeoff, and I can just compile
 anytime 
 to see any runtime errors. FlashDevelop's syntax checking is generally good
 enough.
 
 Every developer I know that uses FlashDevelop for about a month can't live
 without it. Every developer that never has or hasn't learned the time-saving
 features it has (lack of documentation definitely doesn't help) doesn't really
 understand how much faster it is to develop in and if you don't have anything
 to 
 compare it to, FlexBuilder and FDT are much better alternatives to coding on
 the 
 timeline (ugh).
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RE: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

2009-08-13 Thread Merrill, Jason
 Even after re-installing the program [FlashDevelop] and deleting the
local settings files, it
still sometimes doesn't auto-import some classes from the flash
package and
I have to type my import by hand. Weird.

There were some issues with one of the newer versions - a stable version
I have used that doesn't do that is 3.0.0 beta 9, available from their
site.  Not sure if it's been fixed in the latest release or not. There
is some discussion in their forums about that issue with a certain
release or two of FlashDevelop.  


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Re: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

2009-08-13 Thread Steven Sacks
FlashDevelop does do find and replace in files.  FlexBuilder's rename function 
is very slow sometimes.  FlashDevelop's Find and Replace In Files is nearly 
instant.  Considering how infrequently one uses rename in FlexBuilder, it 
doesn't seem to offset the slowness of day to day coding with it compared to 
FlashDevelop.


To fuel the fire a bit more, IMNSHO, Windows has MUCH better carat control than 
Mac.  This makes writing code (and other documents) a lot easier and faster on 
Windows.  As much as I love OSX (and I really do), Mac's inferior carat control 
is one of the things I find very lacking about it.


The auto-complete mishaps with FD occurred in some (not all) of the beta 
releases, but now that it's a full release version, there are no longer any 
problems.

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Re: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

2009-08-13 Thread Matt Gitchell
They're two different functions. You can do a find/replace on a text string
in FB or FDT through a project, which works the same as FD, but rename will
find all references in the project to the property/class you're renaming and
update there. Same net effect 95/100 times, but it's 'smarter' than just
find/replace. FDT at least also has move which will update all imports in
your project if you change your package structure, which I've found very
handy when the projects move just that much faster than the architecture.As
far as multiple projects goes, I have more than one open/switch between
projects all the time, whether to pinch some code that I haven't had time to
make into a library or just the day-to-day client juggling you do as a small
biz.
I'm interested in what you're saying about caret control tho, I guess
I hadn't realized there was anything all that different. Care to elaborate?

On Thu, Aug 13, 2009 at 2:14 PM, Steven Sacks flash...@stevensacks.netwrote:

 FlashDevelop does do find and replace in files.  FlexBuilder's rename
 function is very slow sometimes.  FlashDevelop's Find and Replace In Files
 is nearly instant.  Considering how infrequently one uses rename in
 FlexBuilder, it doesn't seem to offset the slowness of day to day coding
 with it compared to FlashDevelop.

 To fuel the fire a bit more, IMNSHO, Windows has MUCH better carat control
 than Mac.  This makes writing code (and other documents) a lot easier and
 faster on Windows.  As much as I love OSX (and I really do), Mac's inferior
 carat control is one of the things I find very lacking about it.

 The auto-complete mishaps with FD occurred in some (not all) of the beta
 releases, but now that it's a full release version, there are no longer any
 problems.

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Re: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

2009-08-12 Thread Matt Gitchell
Anyone who has spent any serious time with it knows that it isn't an
option.
Oh come now, don't be ridiculous. I used FlashDevelop in a work setting for
a year or two, and have switched to FDT (Mac). FlashDevelop is indeed a
great tool, but I think FDT edges it out. There are a couple features that
FlashDevelop has that FDT doesn't, but overall FDT has better refactoring,
better code completion, better debugging tools, and enforces better syntax.
There are indeed a few aspects of code writing that are better in
FlashDevelop, but on a project level I feel FDT is a far superior tool. I
haven't touched Flex Builder in a couple years, so I'll leave that out.
I would preface all
this by saying that I almost gave up in the middle of switching to
FDT, but am very happy that I stuck it out;
I think once you stop trying to do things the way FlashDevelop did them
specifically it's much less frustrating.

A quick example:
if you type var _blah:Sprite = new Sprite() in a function in FlashDevelop,
you can right-click and promote that to a class-level private var.
I was frustrated such a simple thing didn't exist in FDT, but then
discovered that you can type (_blah = new Sprite()), hit CMD-1 on _blah, and
then it gives you the same option to create the class-level variable. A
small example, but still indicative of the pain of switching.

After finding those features that 'moved' when I switched to FDT, I've never
thought Gosh, I sure miss FlashDevelop.

I would also mention that the last time I use FlashDevelop was in January,
so maybe they've turned it into God's own IDE since then.

But then again, I'm kind of retarded.

--Matt


On Tue, Aug 11, 2009 at 3:40 PM, Steven Sacks flash...@stevensacks.netwrote:

 My home computer is a Windows XP box.

 My last full-time job was a Mac-only shop.  So, I used Mac every day, 5
 days a week, for 10 months.

 Within a few weeks, I realized I couldn't live without FlashDevelop. I
 installed Parallels 3 with Windows XP and figured out how to use
 FlashDevelop in my workflow there.

 I *love* Expose and Spaces.  However, they are easier to live without than
 FlashDevelop.  FDT and FlexBuilder both suck ass as Actionscript editors
 compared to FlashDevelop.

 I cannot live without FlashDevelop.  Period.  Anyone who has spent any
 serious time with it knows that it isn't an option.  The day they get it
 working on the Mac is the day Flex Builder (ahem, Flash Builder) sales see a
 significant drop.  The only reason so many people buy Flex Builder for Mac
 is because FlashDevelop is currently PC-only.

 Actionscript coding in Eclipse is retarded.  It's slow, clunky and
 basically, sucks.
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Re: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

2009-08-12 Thread Glen Pike
FD equivalent is highlight local var, press Ctrl + Shift + 1 and it 
gives you the option to promote it to class member..

A quick example:
if you type var _blah:Sprite = new Sprite() in a function in FlashDevelop,
you can right-click and promote that to a class-level private var.
I was frustrated such a simple thing didn't exist in FDT, but then
discovered that you can type (_blah = new Sprite()), hit CMD-1 on _blah, and
then it gives you the same option to create the class-level variable. A
small example, but still indicative of the pain of switching.
  


Don't know about refactoring, but FD gives you some nice browsing 
capabilities for SWF's  SWC's + external classpaths are brows-able.


I think this one would come down to price in the end - FDT is nearly 
$600 for the professional version, whereas FD is free and getting better 
everytime I look up something - why does it not autocomplete on XML 
classes - it does if you want it to, but because of E4X, the developers 
thought that people were more likely to want to access XML child nodes 
by E4X than using the XML methods...


I cannot dissmiss FDT because I have not used it, but I like FD and it 
does seem to improve with every new release...


Damn, just got drawn into an Editor debate ;)
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RE: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

2009-08-12 Thread Merrill, Jason
Hear hear. I wish the Flexbuiler team would take some ideas from
Flashdevelop, it's easily my preferred development tool even though I
use both - but for some things, I still find I have to use Flexbuilder
(like when I use Flex Charting).  


Jason Merrill 

Bank of  America   Global Learning 
Shared Services Solutions Development 

Monthly meetings on the Adobe Flash platform for rich media experiences
- join the Bank of America Flash Platform Community 





-Original Message-
From: flashcoders-boun...@chattyfig.figleaf.com
[mailto:flashcoders-boun...@chattyfig.figleaf.com] On Behalf Of Steven
Sacks
Sent: Tuesday, August 11, 2009 6:40 PM
To: Flash Coders List
Subject: Re: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

My home computer is a Windows XP box.

My last full-time job was a Mac-only shop.  So, I used Mac every day, 5
days a 
week, for 10 months.

Within a few weeks, I realized I couldn't live without FlashDevelop. I
installed 
Parallels 3 with Windows XP and figured out how to use FlashDevelop in
my 
workflow there.

I *love* Expose and Spaces.  However, they are easier to live without
than 
FlashDevelop.  FDT and FlexBuilder both suck ass as Actionscript editors

compared to FlashDevelop.

I cannot live without FlashDevelop.  Period.  Anyone who has spent any
serious 
time with it knows that it isn't an option.  The day they get it working
on the 
Mac is the day Flex Builder (ahem, Flash Builder) sales see a
significant drop. 
  The only reason so many people buy Flex Builder for Mac is because 
FlashDevelop is currently PC-only.

Actionscript coding in Eclipse is retarded.  It's slow, clunky and
basically, sucks.
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RE: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

2009-08-12 Thread Merrill, Jason
But here's where FDT doesn't edge it out: it ain't free. 


Jason Merrill 

Bank of  America   Global Learning 
Shared Services Solutions Development 

Monthly meetings on the Adobe Flash platform for rich media experiences
- join the Bank of America Flash Platform Community 





-Original Message-
From: flashcoders-boun...@chattyfig.figleaf.com
[mailto:flashcoders-boun...@chattyfig.figleaf.com] On Behalf Of Matt
Gitchell
Sent: Wednesday, August 12, 2009 11:57 AM
To: Flash Coders List
Subject: Re: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

Anyone who has spent any serious time with it knows that it isn't an
option.
Oh come now, don't be ridiculous. I used FlashDevelop in a work setting
for
a year or two, and have switched to FDT (Mac). FlashDevelop is indeed a
great tool, but I think FDT edges it out. There are a couple features
that
FlashDevelop has that FDT doesn't, but overall FDT has better
refactoring,
better code completion, better debugging tools, and enforces better
syntax.
There are indeed a few aspects of code writing that are better in
FlashDevelop, but on a project level I feel FDT is a far superior tool.
I
haven't touched Flex Builder in a couple years, so I'll leave that out.
I would preface all
this by saying that I almost gave up in the middle of switching to
FDT, but am very happy that I stuck it out;
I think once you stop trying to do things the way FlashDevelop did them
specifically it's much less frustrating.

A quick example:
if you type var _blah:Sprite = new Sprite() in a function in
FlashDevelop,
you can right-click and promote that to a class-level private var.
I was frustrated such a simple thing didn't exist in FDT, but then
discovered that you can type (_blah = new Sprite()), hit CMD-1 on _blah,
and
then it gives you the same option to create the class-level variable. A
small example, but still indicative of the pain of switching.

After finding those features that 'moved' when I switched to FDT, I've
never
thought Gosh, I sure miss FlashDevelop.

I would also mention that the last time I use FlashDevelop was in
January,
so maybe they've turned it into God's own IDE since then.

But then again, I'm kind of retarded.

--Matt


On Tue, Aug 11, 2009 at 3:40 PM, Steven Sacks
flash...@stevensacks.netwrote:

 My home computer is a Windows XP box.

 My last full-time job was a Mac-only shop.  So, I used Mac every day,
5
 days a week, for 10 months.

 Within a few weeks, I realized I couldn't live without FlashDevelop. I
 installed Parallels 3 with Windows XP and figured out how to use
 FlashDevelop in my workflow there.

 I *love* Expose and Spaces.  However, they are easier to live without
than
 FlashDevelop.  FDT and FlexBuilder both suck ass as Actionscript
editors
 compared to FlashDevelop.

 I cannot live without FlashDevelop.  Period.  Anyone who has spent any
 serious time with it knows that it isn't an option.  The day they get
it
 working on the Mac is the day Flex Builder (ahem, Flash Builder) sales
see a
 significant drop.  The only reason so many people buy Flex Builder for
Mac
 is because FlashDevelop is currently PC-only.

 Actionscript coding in Eclipse is retarded.  It's slow, clunky and
 basically, sucks.
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Re: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

2009-08-12 Thread Matt Gitchell
True dat. In fact my sole regret about switching is that I bought it when
the exchange rate was extraordinarily crappy. C'est la vie, I
guess.They do have the 'lighter' version now
for cheap but I don't know what the differences are.

On Wed, Aug 12, 2009 at 10:22 AM, Merrill, Jason 
jason.merr...@bankofamerica.com wrote:

 But here's where FDT doesn't edge it out: it ain't free.


 Jason Merrill

 Bank of  America   Global Learning
 Shared Services Solutions Development

 Monthly meetings on the Adobe Flash platform for rich media experiences
 - join the Bank of America Flash Platform Community





 -Original Message-
 From: flashcoders-boun...@chattyfig.figleaf.com
 [mailto:flashcoders-boun...@chattyfig.figleaf.com] On Behalf Of Matt
 Gitchell
 Sent: Wednesday, August 12, 2009 11:57 AM
 To: Flash Coders List
 Subject: Re: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

 Anyone who has spent any serious time with it knows that it isn't an
 option.
 Oh come now, don't be ridiculous. I used FlashDevelop in a work setting
 for
 a year or two, and have switched to FDT (Mac). FlashDevelop is indeed a
 great tool, but I think FDT edges it out. There are a couple features
 that
 FlashDevelop has that FDT doesn't, but overall FDT has better
 refactoring,
 better code completion, better debugging tools, and enforces better
 syntax.
 There are indeed a few aspects of code writing that are better in
 FlashDevelop, but on a project level I feel FDT is a far superior tool.
 I
 haven't touched Flex Builder in a couple years, so I'll leave that out.
 I would preface all
 this by saying that I almost gave up in the middle of switching to
 FDT, but am very happy that I stuck it out;
 I think once you stop trying to do things the way FlashDevelop did them
 specifically it's much less frustrating.

 A quick example:
 if you type var _blah:Sprite = new Sprite() in a function in
 FlashDevelop,
 you can right-click and promote that to a class-level private var.
 I was frustrated such a simple thing didn't exist in FDT, but then
 discovered that you can type (_blah = new Sprite()), hit CMD-1 on _blah,
 and
 then it gives you the same option to create the class-level variable. A
 small example, but still indicative of the pain of switching.

 After finding those features that 'moved' when I switched to FDT, I've
 never
 thought Gosh, I sure miss FlashDevelop.

 I would also mention that the last time I use FlashDevelop was in
 January,
 so maybe they've turned it into God's own IDE since then.

 But then again, I'm kind of retarded.

 --Matt


 On Tue, Aug 11, 2009 at 3:40 PM, Steven Sacks
 flash...@stevensacks.netwrote:

  My home computer is a Windows XP box.
 
  My last full-time job was a Mac-only shop.  So, I used Mac every day,
 5
  days a week, for 10 months.
 
  Within a few weeks, I realized I couldn't live without FlashDevelop. I
  installed Parallels 3 with Windows XP and figured out how to use
  FlashDevelop in my workflow there.
 
  I *love* Expose and Spaces.  However, they are easier to live without
 than
  FlashDevelop.  FDT and FlexBuilder both suck ass as Actionscript
 editors
  compared to FlashDevelop.
 
  I cannot live without FlashDevelop.  Period.  Anyone who has spent any
  serious time with it knows that it isn't an option.  The day they get
 it
  working on the Mac is the day Flex Builder (ahem, Flash Builder) sales
 see a
  significant drop.  The only reason so many people buy Flex Builder for
 Mac
  is because FlashDevelop is currently PC-only.
 
  Actionscript coding in Eclipse is retarded.  It's slow, clunky and
  basically, sucks.
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Re: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

2009-08-12 Thread Ruy Adorno
I'm on the 50/50 team, using flexBuilder/mac at working and 
flashDevelop/windows at home.
By now I love so many features in the both world that I can say which 
one is the best, but the flashDevelop native support to haxe is a key 
point when you want to work with it.
Finally, despite all the comparisons, I think that the flash community 
should be really proud to have such a great opensource tool like Flash 
Develop.


Ruy Adorno
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Re: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

2009-08-12 Thread Steven Sacks

I didn't say people who used it were retarded, I said the program was.

The bottom line is, you can use Flex Builder to do your debugging if you need 
it, but for coding, which is what you spend the majority of your time doing, all 
the Eclipse-based Actionscript editors suck ass compared to FlashDevelop.


If you make a typo in FB or FDT, you're screwed. You have to go all the way back 
to the period.  In FlashDevelop, you're fine.  It still offers you the 
auto-completion (is this what you meant?).  FlashDevelop's class importing 
doesn't require you to type the entire package first.  You just type the class 
name and the entire package appears no matter where the class is.


And to the person who says that Flex Builder organizes your imports for you and 
FlashDevelop doesn't, that takes a few seconds ONE TIME for you to do in 
FlashDevelop (using the awesome CTRL+T shortcut that FlashDevelop has and 
FlexBuilder doesn't), whereas all the shortcomings of Flex Builder's 
auto-completion cost you a few seconds over and over constantly, plus added 
frustration.  It's not even open to debate which one wins when it comes to 
time-savings and saved frustration.  What you're talking about is an aesthetic, 
not a function, and it's easy to do in FlashDevelop.  There is no comparable 
solution in Flex Builder for auto-completion and code-gen.


The code gen in FlashDevelop is superior to Flex Builder. The auto-completion is 
superior.  The class importing is superior.  The workflow is superior.  You can 
open any .as file without it having to be part of your project.  If you really 
want the debugger, then use it for that.  I keep Flex Builder open while I code 
in FlashDevelop for that specific reason.


Code with the coding tool, compile with the debugging tool.  Flex Builder sucks 
at coding, and is great at debugging.

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Re: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

2009-08-12 Thread Steven Sacks

Oh yeah, and Flex Builder is $500 whereas FlashDevelop is free.
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Re: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

2009-08-12 Thread Juan Pablo Califano
Yes, it's the same back-end used by Flex Builder, if I'm not mistaken. Fdb
is indeed almost unusable without a GUI, unless you're a command line freak
and a bit of a masochist, IMO (and you never tried a visual debugger).

The idea of integrating a GUI for fdb into FlashDevelop has been
mentioned in the FD forum a number of times. I don't know the current status
of this feature, though. Last time I checked (about 6 or 7 months), it was
on the wish list, but I couldn't find any info on its status. I hope they
manage to get it working. It'd be awesome.

Cheers
Juan Pablo Califano

2009/8/12 Ian Thomas i...@eirias.net

 On Wed, Aug 12, 2009 at 9:22 PM, Matt Gitchellm...@moonbootmedia.com
 wrote:
  Yeah but if you want to debug/profile anything, you gotta pay that 5
 bones
  you mentioned earlier in this scenario, and I dunno, a coding environment
  without debugging now seems a little silly to me. I wish they'd do a
  standalone version of the profiler in Flex Builder, to be honest.

 Just as a complete aside, in case people don't realise, there _is_ a
 debugger included with the Flex SDK (i.e. the free downloadable SDK).
 It's a command-line shell called fdb; it's a bit of a pain to use, but
 it can be a godsend if you don't have a full Flex license and if
 inserting trace() statements everywhere hasn't helped. :-D

 Ian
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Re: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

2009-08-12 Thread Anthony Pace
(back to the original topic... PC costs less for the same amount of power)

I have used the Flex IDE for free on an academic license, and I do like
that I can use other eclipse plugins with it; yet, I really do like
flashdevelop.

There are only a few things I don't like about flashdevelop:
1. You can't view more than one project at a time unless you run in
multi instance mode
2. It's debugging is restricted to the basic output panel, so you will
have to use something demonster debugger.
3. It needs better syntax and variable scope analysis across documents. 
(the more I learn about compilers design and interpreters the more I
think about what is possible and it shocks me that we aren't there yet)
4. Lack of plugins in contrast to eclipse based solutions.
5.The customization of environment variables should have detailed help
for newbies.
6. Their website sucks(just a wiki and a forum); yet, that is totally OT.
7. no built in collaboration and no built in upload features
8. preview options for html across multiple browsers and devices is
lacking; to say the least.

I have used it on a flashdevelop on a couple of projects where I was the
only developer, and I didn't have the Flex 3 or Flash IDE available, and
it worked well; as well, if I am experimenting with something I prefer
to use flashdevelop or the flash timeline.

Just keep in mind...Free isn't always easy; yet, it is free.

Thanks,
Anthony


//
Dave Watts wrote:
 If you make a typo in FB or FDT, you're screwed. You have to go all the way
 back to the period.  In FlashDevelop, you're fine.  It still offers you the
 auto-completion (is this what you meant?).  FlashDevelop's class importing
 doesn't require you to type the entire package first.  You just type the
 class name and the entire package appears no matter where the class is.
 

 Actually, with Flex projects in FB, I don't have to type the entire
 package first; if it's in the project, I type in the name of the class
 and FB builds the import statement for me. Personally, I don't mind
 the typo issue, since I try to take full advantage of the autocomplete
 in the first place, so I very rarely have to type more than a couple
 of characters.

 But, I'll definitely have to give FD a whirl based on your fervent
 recommendation. I just do Flex, not Flash, so I haven't felt compelled
 to go look at other editors (and I use Eclipse for practically
 everything else).

 Dave Watts, CTO, Fig Leaf Software
 http://www.figleaf.com/

 Fig Leaf Software provides the highest caliber vendor-authorized
 instruction at our training centers in Washington DC, Atlanta,
 Chicago, Baltimore, Northern Virginia, or on-site at your location.
 Visit http://training.figleaf.com/ for more information!

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Re: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

2009-08-12 Thread Steven Sacks
I'm confused why you would need to look at more than one project at a time, and 
you can switch projects very quickly in FD by using Recent Projects.


It's well established the debugger is limited to tracing, which is generally 
good enough for most of the time.


I don't know what you mean about better syntax and variable scope across 
documents. I find the variable scope feature of FlashDevelop to be fantastic. 
The F4 key is great. If you mean something else, I'm definitely interested.


What plug-ins are you talking about specifically that Eclipse has that help with 
coding Actionscript?


I agree the documentation is lacking. I've discovered new features on accident.

I keep hearing about the refactoring feature, but how often are you refactoring 
and how does Find and Replace in Files (CTRL+I) not take care of it?


In FB or FDT, if you make a typo, you lose it and you have to start over.  This 
goes for properties and constants, etc.  I don't know about you, but while I'm a 
great typist, I'm not perfect, and FlashDevelop is forgiving and still knows 
what you want, even if you typo or hit backspace to make a correction, where if 
you hit the wrong key or backspace in FB or FDT, you lose everything.  This is 
especially a pain with long names.


The getter/setter code gen for vars and the event code gen are incredible time 
savers.  The default shortcut isn't very good, but you can change it (I use ALT+2).


FlexBuilder and FDT offer live code compiling, which FlashDevelop does not. 
FDT's lexical parsing is superior to FlexBuilder, as well.  However, I find that 
those features are not worth the speed tradeoff, and I can just compile anytime 
to see any runtime errors. FlashDevelop's syntax checking is generally good enough.


Every developer I know that uses FlashDevelop for about a month can't live 
without it. Every developer that never has or hasn't learned the time-saving 
features it has (lack of documentation definitely doesn't help) doesn't really 
understand how much faster it is to develop in and if you don't have anything to 
compare it to, FlexBuilder and FDT are much better alternatives to coding on the 
timeline (ugh).

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Re: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

2009-08-11 Thread Steven Sacks

My home computer is a Windows XP box.

My last full-time job was a Mac-only shop.  So, I used Mac every day, 5 days a 
week, for 10 months.


Within a few weeks, I realized I couldn't live without FlashDevelop. I installed 
Parallels 3 with Windows XP and figured out how to use FlashDevelop in my 
workflow there.


I *love* Expose and Spaces.  However, they are easier to live without than 
FlashDevelop.  FDT and FlexBuilder both suck ass as Actionscript editors 
compared to FlashDevelop.


I cannot live without FlashDevelop.  Period.  Anyone who has spent any serious 
time with it knows that it isn't an option.  The day they get it working on the 
Mac is the day Flex Builder (ahem, Flash Builder) sales see a significant drop. 
 The only reason so many people buy Flex Builder for Mac is because 
FlashDevelop is currently PC-only.


Actionscript coding in Eclipse is retarded.  It's slow, clunky and basically, 
sucks.
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Re: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

2009-08-11 Thread Patrick Matte
I work on a mac at the office but I'd rather work on windows.

If I had to choose between FlashDevelop and FlexBuilder, I'd have to go with
FlexBuilder.

FlashDevelop is really cool and all, it's main advantage I think is that
it's super easy to setup a project and start coding compared to FlexBuilder.
But FlashDevelop lacks the powerful refactoring features from FlexBuilder
and it won't keep your import statements organized like FlexBuilder does.

I've never used the Flex framework, I just use FlexBuilder to code for
Flash. I know FlashBuilder 4 will have some new features like the ones that
make FlashDevelop so nice. I hope they also make some improvements to the
refactoring features..



 From: Steven Sacks flash...@stevensacks.net
 Reply-To: Flash Coders List flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com
 Date: Tue, 11 Aug 2009 15:40:19 -0700
 To: Flash Coders List flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com
 Subject: Re: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc
 
 My home computer is a Windows XP box.
 
 My last full-time job was a Mac-only shop.  So, I used Mac every day, 5 days a
 week, for 10 months.
 
 Within a few weeks, I realized I couldn't live without FlashDevelop. I
 installed 
 Parallels 3 with Windows XP and figured out how to use FlashDevelop in my
 workflow there.
 
 I *love* Expose and Spaces.  However, they are easier to live without than
 FlashDevelop.  FDT and FlexBuilder both suck ass as Actionscript editors
 compared to FlashDevelop.
 
 I cannot live without FlashDevelop.  Period.  Anyone who has spent any serious
 time with it knows that it isn't an option.  The day they get it working on
 the 
 Mac is the day Flex Builder (ahem, Flash Builder) sales see a significant
 drop. 
   The only reason so many people buy Flex Builder for Mac is because
 FlashDevelop is currently PC-only.
 
 Actionscript coding in Eclipse is retarded.  It's slow, clunky and basically,
 sucks.
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Re: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

2009-08-11 Thread Juan Pablo Califano
I run Windows XP both at home and work.

For a short period, I worked on a Linux (Debian) box at work, because the
machine I got happened to had Debian installed and my boss, a Linux fan,
insisted that I should try it. At the time FlashDevelop was my main editor,
so I had to run some Sun VM that booted a virtual windows. I also use the
Flash IDE on a daily basis. Mostly for minor editing, but I need to
run Flash almost every day. It was naturally slow and some shortcuts
wouldn't work, which was a pain. I'd spend most of the time using Windows on
the VM, so it made no sense and I soon gave up and installed Windows XP.

I'm one of the retardeds using Flex Builder for AS coding ;). It has its
pitfalls and I do miss some FD features, which I used almost exclusively for
a long year. But now I can't live without a debugger that actually works,
something I missed for years; and a passable profiler, which is not so great
for measuring performance, IMO, but is invaluable when you're looking /
testing for memory leaks. Once you learn to use it, the profilers that
basically output System.totalMemory look like a bad joke. I hope some day
they finally get around to add a GUI debugger to FD; having a nice profiler
wouldn't hurt, either. But for now, I'd choose FB any day.


Cheers
Juan Pablo Califano


2009/8/11 Steven Sacks flash...@stevensacks.net

 My home computer is a Windows XP box.

 My last full-time job was a Mac-only shop.  So, I used Mac every day, 5
 days a week, for 10 months.

 Within a few weeks, I realized I couldn't live without FlashDevelop. I
 installed Parallels 3 with Windows XP and figured out how to use
 FlashDevelop in my workflow there.

 I *love* Expose and Spaces.  However, they are easier to live without than
 FlashDevelop.  FDT and FlexBuilder both suck ass as Actionscript editors
 compared to FlashDevelop.

 I cannot live without FlashDevelop.  Period.  Anyone who has spent any
 serious time with it knows that it isn't an option.  The day they get it
 working on the Mac is the day Flex Builder (ahem, Flash Builder) sales see a
 significant drop.  The only reason so many people buy Flex Builder for Mac
 is because FlashDevelop is currently PC-only.

 Actionscript coding in Eclipse is retarded.  It's slow, clunky and
 basically, sucks.

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[Flashcoders] mac vs pc

2009-08-10 Thread Allandt Bik-Elliott (Receptacle)
i'd completely understand if nobody wanted to touch this one but i  
thought i'd throw it out there


a bit of background: I've been developing on mac for 7 or 8 years, the  
first 5 were as an enthusiastic amateur but more recently i've gone  
full time flash developing. As time has progressed, i've started to  
use more tools to help with coding, I've tried FDT on Eclipse for mac  
which i found (at the time) to be overpriced, overfinicky, flaky and  
unreliable (i realise that with the release of the standalone FDT  
package the flakiness is something that has been rectified) and  
flexbuilder just doesn't have any of the text manipulation tools that  
a good coding IDE should imo (duplicating / transposing lines of code  
shouldn't require a mouse) so i've settled for using FlashDevelop  
(which i LOVE) with Parallels as a vm to run it.


This setup has kept me going for a while but it's not without it's  
problems: the keyboard changes from my mac-based Flash IDE to the pc- 
based FlashDevelop IDE has been a headache, I have 3 sources of  
program failures as opposed to 2 (Flash, FlashDevelop AND Parallels)  
which, while they don't account for a lot of my day, are usually  
pretty savage when they do occur. However, as I've been using a pc at  
work, I've really started to seriously consider simply buying a pc on  
my next round of hardware spend (end of this year, beginning of next)  
and be done with it. The mac will always be at the center of my home  
media but this is for my take along, work machine.


So the question I'm really getting to is, how many people use osX  
(using windows in boot camp doesn't count) and how many are using  
windows for their main work machine and what kind of software setup  
are you using?


thanks for your time guys
Allandt


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Re: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

2009-08-10 Thread John R. Sweeney Jr
90% Mac, 10% PC. 

PC for mostly Director development
MAC for Flash, web, audio and video work.

John


on 8/10/09 5:55 AM, Allandt Bik-Elliott (Receptacle) at
alla...@receptacledesign.com wrote:

 So the question I'm really getting to is, how many people use osX
 (using windows in boot camp doesn't count) and how many are using
 windows for their main work machine and what kind of software setup
 are you using?
 
 thanks for your time guys
 Allandt


John R. Sweeney Jr.
Interactive Multimedia Developer


OnDemand Interactive Inc
945 Washington Blvd.
Hoffman Estates, IL 60169
Office/Fax: 847.310.5959
Cellular: 847.651.4469
www.ondemandinteractive.com


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Re: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

2009-08-10 Thread Glen Pike

Using Win XP + Flash Develop + CS3 IDE

Situation - maintaining a legacy AS2 Flash touchscreen interface app 
that runs on Linux  (hopefully) developing/porting this to AS3, 
possibly with capability of compiling straight from FD.


Reason for not using Linux - I can't be bothered with the time  effort 
of getting all my UI driven programs set up on something like Gentoo, 
Ubuntu is easier, but GIMP sucks and I don't wish to re-learn all my 
software apps.  I'll keep my Linux boxes as webservers and svn repo's 
for now.


Reason for not using Mac - I already pay through the nose for my Adobe 
Software thanks, don't see the point of paying through the nose for 
hardware that I can't mess with.

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Re: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

2009-08-10 Thread Matt Gitchell
FDT, which I love. Love! It does take a while to get to a point where you're
maximizing what it offers your workflow, but so worth it.Switched from PC
(and FlashDevelop) to Mac at the beginning of the
year, not a huge difference on balance
as each are annoying in their own way.

On Mon, Aug 10, 2009 at 3:55 AM, Allandt Bik-Elliott (Receptacle) 
alla...@receptacledesign.com wrote:

 i'd completely understand if nobody wanted to touch this one but i thought
 i'd throw it out there

 a bit of background: I've been developing on mac for 7 or 8 years, the
 first 5 were as an enthusiastic amateur but more recently i've gone full
 time flash developing. As time has progressed, i've started to use more
 tools to help with coding, I've tried FDT on Eclipse for mac which i found
 (at the time) to be overpriced, overfinicky, flaky and unreliable (i realise
 that with the release of the standalone FDT package the flakiness is
 something that has been rectified) and flexbuilder just doesn't have any of
 the text manipulation tools that a good coding IDE should imo (duplicating /
 transposing lines of code shouldn't require a mouse) so i've settled for
 using FlashDevelop (which i LOVE) with Parallels as a vm to run it.

 This setup has kept me going for a while but it's not without it's
 problems: the keyboard changes from my mac-based Flash IDE to the pc-based
 FlashDevelop IDE has been a headache, I have 3 sources of program failures
 as opposed to 2 (Flash, FlashDevelop AND Parallels) which, while they don't
 account for a lot of my day, are usually pretty savage when they do occur.
 However, as I've been using a pc at work, I've really started to seriously
 consider simply buying a pc on my next round of hardware spend (end of this
 year, beginning of next) and be done with it. The mac will always be at the
 center of my home media but this is for my take along, work machine.

 So the question I'm really getting to is, how many people use osX (using
 windows in boot camp doesn't count) and how many are using windows for their
 main work machine and what kind of software setup are you using?

 thanks for your time guys
 Allandt


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Re: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

2009-08-10 Thread allandt bik-elliott
just to add in one of the pro's in my list of pro's and cons, i can  
get a fairly high spec pc for relatively low price (the msi laptops  
have quad-core processors, 1gb nvidia 9800 gs graphics cards and blu  
ray drives for less than a macbook pro. I would be more prepared to  
swallow the extra cost of another mbp if they had better spec'd  
graphics cards



a


On 10 Aug 2009, at 15:45, Matt Gitchell wrote:

FDT, which I love. Love! It does take a while to get to a point  
where you're
maximizing what it offers your workflow, but so worth it.Switched  
from PC

(and FlashDevelop) to Mac at the beginning of the
year, not a huge difference on balance
as each are annoying in their own way.

On Mon, Aug 10, 2009 at 3:55 AM, Allandt Bik-Elliott (Receptacle) 
alla...@receptacledesign.com wrote:

i'd completely understand if nobody wanted to touch this one but i  
thought

i'd throw it out there

a bit of background: I've been developing on mac for 7 or 8 years,  
the
first 5 were as an enthusiastic amateur but more recently i've gone  
full
time flash developing. As time has progressed, i've started to use  
more
tools to help with coding, I've tried FDT on Eclipse for mac which  
i found
(at the time) to be overpriced, overfinicky, flaky and unreliable  
(i realise

that with the release of the standalone FDT package the flakiness is
something that has been rectified) and flexbuilder just doesn't  
have any of
the text manipulation tools that a good coding IDE should imo  
(duplicating /
transposing lines of code shouldn't require a mouse) so i've  
settled for

using FlashDevelop (which i LOVE) with Parallels as a vm to run it.

This setup has kept me going for a while but it's not without it's
problems: the keyboard changes from my mac-based Flash IDE to the  
pc-based
FlashDevelop IDE has been a headache, I have 3 sources of program  
failures
as opposed to 2 (Flash, FlashDevelop AND Parallels) which, while  
they don't
account for a lot of my day, are usually pretty savage when they do  
occur.
However, as I've been using a pc at work, I've really started to  
seriously
consider simply buying a pc on my next round of hardware spend (end  
of this
year, beginning of next) and be done with it. The mac will always  
be at the

center of my home media but this is for my take along, work machine.

So the question I'm really getting to is, how many people use osX  
(using
windows in boot camp doesn't count) and how many are using windows  
for their

main work machine and what kind of software setup are you using?

thanks for your time guys
Allandt


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Re: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

2009-08-10 Thread Karl DeSaulniers

99% Mac and 1% PC
I only use PCs to test websites on IE.
Mac for everything else I need.

Karl


On Aug 10, 2009, at 9:10 AM, John R. Sweeney Jr wrote:


90% Mac, 10% PC.

PC for mostly Director development
MAC for Flash, web, audio and video work.

John


on 8/10/09 5:55 AM, Allandt Bik-Elliott (Receptacle) at
alla...@receptacledesign.com wrote:


So the question I'm really getting to is, how many people use osX
(using windows in boot camp doesn't count) and how many are using
windows for their main work machine and what kind of software setup
are you using?

thanks for your time guys
Allandt



John R. Sweeney Jr.
Interactive Multimedia Developer


OnDemand Interactive Inc
945 Washington Blvd.
Hoffman Estates, IL 60169
Office/Fax: 847.310.5959
Cellular: 847.651.4469
www.ondemandinteractive.com


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http://designdrumm.com

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Re: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

2009-08-10 Thread Christian Pugliese
50% Mac  all my freelancer jobs
50% PC  all may day job

if I could I'd use 100% of Mac, but the agency I work for only uses PCs...
perhaps I love the Mac I miss a looot a FlashDevelop version for OSX.

Christian Pugliese
www.chrisid.com




On Mon, Aug 10, 2009 at 15:20, Karl DeSaulniers k...@designdrumm.comwrote:

 99% Mac and 1% PC
 I only use PCs to test websites on IE.
 Mac for everything else I need.

 Karl


 On Aug 10, 2009, at 9:10 AM, John R. Sweeney Jr wrote:

  90% Mac, 10% PC.

 PC for mostly Director development
 MAC for Flash, web, audio and video work.

 John


 on 8/10/09 5:55 AM, Allandt Bik-Elliott (Receptacle) at
 alla...@receptacledesign.com wrote:

  So the question I'm really getting to is, how many people use osX
 (using windows in boot camp doesn't count) and how many are using
 windows for their main work machine and what kind of software setup
 are you using?

 thanks for your time guys
 Allandt



 John R. Sweeney Jr.
 Interactive Multimedia Developer


 OnDemand Interactive Inc
 945 Washington Blvd.
 Hoffman Estates, IL 60169
 Office/Fax: 847.310.5959
 Cellular: 847.651.4469
 www.ondemandinteractive.com


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 Design Drumm
 http://designdrumm.com

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Re: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

2009-08-10 Thread peter

Allandt,

99% Mac, website development, Flash IDE and Flash/Flex Builder,  
(intermediate complex) dynamic websites (ARP/AFMPHP, SWX, PHP, MySQL),  
testing in mainstream browser(s).


1% PC, mainly testing in IE.

Additional 2 cents: I'll also do 95% of teaching software engineering  
on a Mac. Unfortunately 3D programming (currently VRML although  
Papervision3d is in the picture) and streaming media are the  
bottlenecks.


Would be nice to know some results of your research. Thanks.

Succes,
Peter

Citeren Allandt Bik-Elliott (Receptacle) alla...@receptacledesign.com:


[...]
So the question I'm really getting to is, how many people use osX
(using windows in boot camp doesn't count) and how many are using
windows for their main work machine and what kind of software setup are
you using?

thanks for your time guys
Allandt



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Re: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

2009-08-10 Thread Taka Kojima
100% PC. I have a PC at home and a Mac at work, but I'm running Vista on an
8 core Mac Pro (no paralleling, I boot up in Windows through base camp).

I can and do use Macs, I'm not a PC fanatic per se, but I just find PC's to
be a faster workflow for me in terms of development. Also, Macs have shoddy
FTP clients, even Filezilla is a bit sketchy on OS X.

I'm the only person on my team that uses a PC development environment.


On Mon, Aug 10, 2009 at 11:28 AM, Christian Pugliese pugli...@gmail.comwrote:

 50% Mac  all my freelancer jobs
 50% PC  all may day job

 if I could I'd use 100% of Mac, but the agency I work for only uses PCs...
 perhaps I love the Mac I miss a looot a FlashDevelop version for OSX.

 Christian Pugliese
 www.chrisid.com




 On Mon, Aug 10, 2009 at 15:20, Karl DeSaulniers k...@designdrumm.com
 wrote:

  99% Mac and 1% PC
  I only use PCs to test websites on IE.
  Mac for everything else I need.
 
  Karl
 
 
  On Aug 10, 2009, at 9:10 AM, John R. Sweeney Jr wrote:
 
   90% Mac, 10% PC.
 
  PC for mostly Director development
  MAC for Flash, web, audio and video work.
 
  John
 
 
  on 8/10/09 5:55 AM, Allandt Bik-Elliott (Receptacle) at
  alla...@receptacledesign.com wrote:
 
   So the question I'm really getting to is, how many people use osX
  (using windows in boot camp doesn't count) and how many are using
  windows for their main work machine and what kind of software setup
  are you using?
 
  thanks for your time guys
  Allandt
 
 
 
  John R. Sweeney Jr.
  Interactive Multimedia Developer
 
 
  OnDemand Interactive Inc
  945 Washington Blvd.
  Hoffman Estates, IL 60169
  Office/Fax: 847.310.5959
  Cellular: 847.651.4469
  www.ondemandinteractive.com
 
 
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  Design Drumm
  http://designdrumm.com
 
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Re: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

2009-08-10 Thread Jer Brand
99% PC. I do a ton of work with accessibility, and it's a PITA on a Mac. Not
to mention the money. I do my freelance work on an Alienware M-17 (raid-0,
dual vid, reasonable dual proc) that was cheaper than the macbook pro. And
obviously the macbook didn't offer raid nor SLI.

As for setup, I flip-flop between Flex builder (doing both Flex and
ActionScript 3 Projects) and FlashDevelop.

Our artists are on Mac, and I have one at home (a mini) I toy with, but not
for flash.

Jer
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Re: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

2009-08-10 Thread FlashDev

100% Win XP Prof (Waiting for 7 to be shipped), CS4  FlashDevelop

We use a mac to test websites and air applications thats about it!

SJM

Allandt Bik-Elliott (Receptacle) wrote:
i'd completely understand if nobody wanted to touch this one but i 
thought i'd throw it out there


a bit of background: I've been developing on mac for 7 or 8 years, the 
first 5 were as an enthusiastic amateur but more recently i've gone 
full time flash developing. As time has progressed, i've started to 
use more tools to help with coding, I've tried FDT on Eclipse for mac 
which i found (at the time) to be overpriced, overfinicky, flaky and 
unreliable (i realise that with the release of the standalone FDT 
package the flakiness is something that has been rectified) and 
flexbuilder just doesn't have any of the text manipulation tools that 
a good coding IDE should imo (duplicating / transposing lines of code 
shouldn't require a mouse) so i've settled for using FlashDevelop 
(which i LOVE) with Parallels as a vm to run it.


This setup has kept me going for a while but it's not without it's 
problems: the keyboard changes from my mac-based Flash IDE to the 
pc-based FlashDevelop IDE has been a headache, I have 3 sources of 
program failures as opposed to 2 (Flash, FlashDevelop AND Parallels) 
which, while they don't account for a lot of my day, are usually 
pretty savage when they do occur. However, as I've been using a pc at 
work, I've really started to seriously consider simply buying a pc on 
my next round of hardware spend (end of this year, beginning of next) 
and be done with it. The mac will always be at the center of my home 
media but this is for my take along, work machine.


So the question I'm really getting to is, how many people use osX 
(using windows in boot camp doesn't count) and how many are using 
windows for their main work machine and what kind of software setup 
are you using?


thanks for your time guys
Allandt


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Re: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

2009-08-10 Thread Leandro Ferreira
50/50. Win XP/ Flashdevelop at work, osX and FlashDevelop at home.


  Leandro Ferreira


On Mon, Aug 10, 2009 at 16:02, FlashDev fl...@funkdaweb.com wrote:

 100% Win XP Prof (Waiting for 7 to be shipped), CS4  FlashDevelop

 We use a mac to test websites and air applications thats about it!

 SJM


 Allandt Bik-Elliott (Receptacle) wrote:

 i'd completely understand if nobody wanted to touch this one but i thought
 i'd throw it out there

 a bit of background: I've been developing on mac for 7 or 8 years, the
 first 5 were as an enthusiastic amateur but more recently i've gone full
 time flash developing. As time has progressed, i've started to use more
 tools to help with coding, I've tried FDT on Eclipse for mac which i found
 (at the time) to be overpriced, overfinicky, flaky and unreliable (i realise
 that with the release of the standalone FDT package the flakiness is
 something that has been rectified) and flexbuilder just doesn't have any of
 the text manipulation tools that a good coding IDE should imo (duplicating /
 transposing lines of code shouldn't require a mouse) so i've settled for
 using FlashDevelop (which i LOVE) with Parallels as a vm to run it.

 This setup has kept me going for a while but it's not without it's
 problems: the keyboard changes from my mac-based Flash IDE to the pc-based
 FlashDevelop IDE has been a headache, I have 3 sources of program failures
 as opposed to 2 (Flash, FlashDevelop AND Parallels) which, while they don't
 account for a lot of my day, are usually pretty savage when they do occur.
 However, as I've been using a pc at work, I've really started to seriously
 consider simply buying a pc on my next round of hardware spend (end of this
 year, beginning of next) and be done with it. The mac will always be at the
 center of my home media but this is for my take along, work machine.

 So the question I'm really getting to is, how many people use osX (using
 windows in boot camp doesn't count) and how many are using windows for their
 main work machine and what kind of software setup are you using?

 thanks for your time guys
 Allandt


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Re: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

2009-08-10 Thread John R. Sweeney Jr
Fetch v5.2.1 works perfectly on all my Macs.

John


on 8/10/09 1:46 PM, Taka Kojima at t...@gigafied.com wrote:

 Also, Macs have shoddy
 FTP clients, even Filezilla is a bit sketchy on OS X.


John R. Sweeney Jr.
Interactive Multimedia Developer


OnDemand Interactive Inc
945 Washington Blvd.
Hoffman Estates, IL 60169
Office/Fax: 847.310.5959
Cellular: 847.651.4469
www.ondemandinteractive.com


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Re: [Flashcoders] mac vs pc

2009-08-10 Thread Karl DeSaulniers

Fetch v4.0.3 here, and still going strong.

Karl


On Aug 10, 2009, at 11:35 PM, John R. Sweeney Jr wrote:


Fetch v5.2.1 works perfectly on all my Macs.

John


on 8/10/09 1:46 PM, Taka Kojima at t...@gigafied.com wrote:


Also, Macs have shoddy
FTP clients, even Filezilla is a bit sketchy on OS X.



John R. Sweeney Jr.
Interactive Multimedia Developer


OnDemand Interactive Inc
945 Washington Blvd.
Hoffman Estates, IL 60169
Office/Fax: 847.310.5959
Cellular: 847.651.4469
www.ondemandinteractive.com


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