Re: [Flightgear-devel] Security patches [was Re: portability of simgear]

2013-09-14 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Fri, 13 Sep 2013 23:01:05 +0100, Rebecca wrote in message 
52338b21.9010...@bham.ac.uk:

 From: James Turner zakalawe@ma... - 2013-09-13 06:13:59
  On 11 Sep 2013, at 10:16, Markus Wanner markus@... wrote:

  far more useful would be to get ARM working
 This patch should do that, while changing nothing on x86:
 http://anonscm.debian.org/gitweb/?p=collab-maint/simgear.git;a=blob_plain;f=debian/patches/cppbind-charsignedness.diff;hb=fcca8ff0b3995680e739f0c9499f8c08996513a6
 
 I have successfully compiled 2.12 with all 6 above patches on an
 Ubuntu 13.04 amd64 system, but was unable to get the 2.12 data to
 check whether it actually works.  (fgdata doesn't have a Download
 button on its Gitorious page (flightgear and simgear do), Clone
 requires a Gitorious account which I don't have and would probably be
 very large, and the main site only has up to 2.10.)

..if you have the disk space, head over to Roland's
http://mxchange.org:23456/ and fetch the git bundle 
and updates there, then do the git bundle dance and 
finish it all off by updating your fgdata git tree 
to what branch etc you want.

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Performance and 3d cloud switch

2013-09-10 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Mon, 09 Sep 2013 13:42:06 +0200, Erik wrote in message 
522db40e.5050...@ehofman.com:

 On 09/09/2013 12:59 PM, Renk Thorsten wrote:
 
  A report of performance dramatically improving for advanced weather
  when 3d clouds are switched off in the rendering menu (you still
  get to see 3d clouds)
 
  http://www.flightgear.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=69t=16630start=30#p189983
 
  I've played around with this, and I can't reproduce any significant
  framerate difference. It is true that the cloud effect file doesn't
  condition on the 3d cloud switch at all, so Advanced Weather
  generates 3d clouds no matter what you select here (it can't do 2d
  clouds at all) - which may be a little confusing, but I have no
  good idea how to handle this gracefully. Maybe the switch should go
  away from rendering to the Basic Weather GUI? But that's a side
  issue.
 
  I have no idea where any performance increase might be coming from
  though - as far as I know, the shaders are completely unaware of
  this. Can anyone reproduce the finding? Stuart, any idea where this
  could come from?
 
 I was testing anyhow so I did a quick test. I don't see any
 improvement either. What (I think) can happen is that older (fgrun)
 config files could cause bad behaviour, especially when properties
 change function between FlightGear versions (for instance the effects
 level slider).

..another test case suggestion: if you have a radeon card, pop that 
in and see how it looks with that, if you don't have a radeon card,
try swap out nvidea for nouveau in your /etc/X11/xorg.conf and
install your distro's nouveau and libdrm-nouveau2 etc drivers 
alongside your nvidea drivers and chk framerates etc there:
arnt@celsius:~$ dpkg -l |grep nouveau |fmt -tu
ii libdrm-nouveau2:amd64 2.4.46-2 amd64 Userspace interface to
   nouveau-specific kernel DRM services -- runtime
ii xserver-xorg-video-nouveau 1:1.0.9-2 amd64 X.Org X server -- Nouveau
   display driver
arnt@celsius:~$ 


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...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Performance and 3d cloud switch

2013-09-10 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Tue, 10 Sep 2013 17:55:19 +, Renk wrote in message 
e495a106ff5f31448739e79d34138c192a958...@mbs2.ad.jyu.fi:

  ..another test case suggestion: if you have a radeon card, pop that
  in and see how it looks with that, if you don't have a radeon card,
  try swap out nvidea for nouveau in your /etc/X11/xorg.conf and
  install your distro's nouveau and libdrm-nouveau2 etc drivers
  alongside your nvidea drivers and chk framerates etc there:
  arnt@celsius:~$ dpkg -l |grep nouveau |fmt -tu
  ii libdrm-nouveau2:amd64 2.4.46-2 amd64 Userspace interface to
 nouveau-specific kernel DRM services -- runtime
  ii xserver-xorg-video-nouveau 1:1.0.9-2 amd64 X.Org X server --
  Nouveau display driver
 
 
 Point being? It's well known that the noveau driver doesn't reach the
 performance of the proprietary driver 

..still?  My only Nvidea experience is a coupla weeks now 
in August on XTX Geforge GTS 260 card on the nouveau driver, 
while waiting for a new PSU for my 4890.  FG frame rates 
was 15-20ish and I was able to bog it down once I started 
piling up on eye candy.  The big surprise was how the 4890
was decent, but not much faster.

 (and I have a laptop - pretty
 hard to change the cards...). 

...and pretty easy to swap out nvidea for nouveau in your 
/etc/X11/xorg.conf once you have the driver installed, you may 
have to reboot to get kms going right, though.

 In any case, that doesn't have anything to do with the observation
 made by the forum user.

..easy now, I haven't tried the nvidea driver yet, I got an XTX 
Geforge GTS 260 card along with my 4890 radeon card, the 4890 was 
too tough on my PSU, so I tried the GTS 260 on the nouveau driver
and the darn thing just worked, not much slower than the 4890 on
the radeon driver, the _only_ thing I did to get it working, was 
swap out radeon for nouveau and reboot.  Easy. ;o)


..the interesting part in this thread here, is I see precisely 
the same psycedelic rendering errors with the 4890 on the 
radeon driver, as I see with GTS 260 on the nouveau driver, 
hence my suggestion you nvidea guys take a nouveau look if 
you don't have a radeon card handy.  (No bug yet, RL issues.)

-- 
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...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Howto download aircraft ( and others data ) from Git

2013-09-03 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Tue, 03 Sep 2013 14:28:21 +0100, James wrote in message 
4c5262ae-653a-475f-ad09-91fe74617...@mac.com:

 
 On 3 Sep 2013, at 14:13, grtuxhangar team hohora...@gmail.com wrote:
 
  How could we have FGData split  in several part  which can be
  downloaded easily ? Or is there any other way with Git which is
  similar to the old way with snapshot.  ?
 
 For 3.0 I will be making FGData significantly smaller, since the size
 of the Git repo is indeed a big problem. Some pieces will become
 truly optional, and others will be downloaded in different ways.
 
 However this is all for the future, I'm afraid I don't have a short
 term answer.

..a short term answer would be do a wget -c fgdata.bundle, the 
git bundle dance and then do a git pull to make gitorius happy, 
but do we still have such fgdata.bundle animals anywhere?  

-- 
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...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
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  best case, worst case, and just in case.

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] ..the git bundle dance, was: Howto download aircraft ( and others data ) from Git

2013-09-03 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Tue, 03 Sep 2013 22:27:19 +0200, Roland wrote in message 
52264627.6090...@mxchange.org:

 -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
 Hash: SHA1
 
 Hi,
 
 if you need a bundle file, you can try to download my fgdata.bundle
 (unmodified, but a little out-dated) from my BitTorrent tracker
 (including all updates):
 
 http://mxchange.org:23456/
 
 Roland

..neat, fgdata-update-00*.bundle are updates to your fgdata.bundle, 
how old is fgdata-update-006.bundle?  
And fgdata-update-007.bundle? ;o)

..can we use these in future versions of download_and_compile.sh 
without eating away too much of your bandwidth?  
(Why is gitorius bandwidth limited???)

-- 
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  best case, worst case, and just in case.

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] ..the git bundle dance, was: Howto download aircraft ( and others data ) from Git

2013-09-03 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Tue, 03 Sep 2013 23:46:17 +0200, Roland wrote in message 
522658a9.9080...@mxchange.org:

 -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
 Hash: SHA1
 
 On 09/03/2013 11:22 PM, Arnt Karlsen wrote:
  On Tue, 03 Sep 2013 22:27:19 +0200, Roland wrote in message 
  52264627.6090...@mxchange.org:
  
  -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1
  
  Hi,
  
  if you need a bundle file, you can try to download my
  fgdata.bundle (unmodified, but a little out-dated) from my
  BitTorrent tracker (including all updates):
  
  http://mxchange.org:23456/
  
  Roland
  
  ..neat, fgdata-update-00*.bundle are updates to your fgdata.bundle,
   how old is fgdata-update-006.bundle? And fgdata-update-007.bundle?
  ;o)
  
  ..can we use these in future versions of download_and_compile.sh 
  without eating away too much of your bandwidth? (Why is gitorius
  bandwidth limited???)
  
 The main forum thread is here:
 
 http://www.flightgear.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=17t=17268
 
 If you like you can integrate the torrent links into your script as an
 alternative download method for fgdata bundle. The FG wiki provides
 good help in how to handle bundles:
 
 http://wiki.flightgear.org/FlightGear_Git:_data_developers#Bundle

..heh, we don't get much closer to paste that right in! :o)

 More tomorrow, when I'm back home.
 
 Roland


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[Flightgear-devel] ..the git bundle dance, was: Howto download aircraft ( and others data ) from Git

2013-09-03 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Tue, 3 Sep 2013 16:58:39 +0200, Arnt wrote in message 
20130903165839.2a0ea...@nb6.lan:

 On Tue, 03 Sep 2013 14:28:21 +0100, James wrote in message 
 4c5262ae-653a-475f-ad09-91fe74617...@mac.com:
 
  
  On 3 Sep 2013, at 14:13, grtuxhangar team hohora...@gmail.com
  wrote:
  
   How could we have FGData split  in several part  which can be
   downloaded easily ? Or is there any other way with Git which is
   similar to the old way with snapshot.  ?
  
  For 3.0 I will be making FGData significantly smaller, since the
  size of the Git repo is indeed a big problem. Some pieces will
  become truly optional, and others will be downloaded in different
  ways.
  
  However this is all for the future, I'm afraid I don't have a short
  term answer.
 
 ..a short term answer would be do a wget -c fgdata.bundle, the 
 git bundle dance and then do a git pull to make gitorius happy, 
 but do we still have such fgdata.bundle animals anywhere?  


..primer:
http://git-scm.com/blog/2010/03/10/bundles.html

..up to date recipes and --all:
http://git-scm.com/docs/git-bundle
http://stackoverflow.com/questions/11792671/how-to-git-bundle-a-complete-repo

..forget DVDs, put FG scenery, fgdata 
etc on usb sticks or on sdhc cards: 
arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ du -sch fgdat*
14G fgdata
14G fgdata_2.10.0
27G fgdata_2.12.0
14G fgdata_2.8.0
27G fgdata_2.99.9
93G total
arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ 

..the DVDs will work for Aircraft:
arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ du -sch fgdata_2.99.9/Aircraf*
6.1Gfgdata_2.99.9/Aircraft
984Kfgdata_2.99.9/Aircraft-uiuc
6.1Gtotal
arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ 



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[Flightgear-devel] ..bug, was: Scripted installation

2013-08-29 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Wed, 28 Aug 2013 22:06:26 -0400, Pat wrote in message 
20130828220626.5db52...@spinnaker130432.home:

 I've just updated the script to version 1.9.12 with various changes.
 
 http://www.gitorious.org/fg/fg-download-and-compile-fgmeta/raw/8b99f5eb7be14708c156424af661cb88c68ecb30:download_and_compile.sh
 
 see
 http://www.gitorious.org/fg/fg-download-and-compile-fgmeta/commit/8b99f5eb7be14708c156424af661cb88c68ecb30
  
 for details.
 
 I've requested that this version be merged to the main fgmeta
 repository on master and next.
 
 The main point of the update is that this version builds 2.10.0 as
 stable (-s option) , 2.12.0 and master using the new -B option and
 next, as usual with no option

..today's 1.9.12 above fails here:
arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ bash download_and_compile-1.9-12.sh -B 2.99.9 \
-R HEAD -c y -e -i -a n -p n -d y -r y -j 2 DATA 
B
R
c
e
i
a
p
d
r
j
**
**
* Warning, the compilation process   *
* is going to use 12 or more Gbytes  *
* of space and at least a couple of  *
* hours to download and build FG.*
**
* Please, be patient ..  *
**
**
APT_GET_UPDATE=n
DOWNLOAD_PACKAGES=n
COMPILE=y
RECONFIGURE=y
DOWNLOAD=y
JOPTION= -j2 
OOPTION=
DEBUG=
FGSG_VERSION=
FGSG_REVISION=
FGDATA_BRANCH=
FGDATA_REVISION=
FGDATA_VERSION=
***

 FGFS **

fgdata exists already.
fatal: Not a git repository (or any of the parent directories): .git
arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ 

..my fgdata 
arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ ll install/fgfs/
total 8
drwxr-xr-x 2 arnt arnt 4096 Aug 29 23:23 bin
lrwxrwxrwx 1 arnt arnt   31 Aug 29 23:43 fgdata
- /home/arnt/FG-git/fgdata_2.12.0 
lrwxrwxrwx 1 arnt arnt   31 Aug 29 23:39 fgdata_2.12.0 
- /home/arnt/FG-git/fgdata_2.12.0 
drwxr-xr-x 3 arnt arnt 4096 Aug 24 00:23 share 
arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ ll -d fgdat*
drwxr-xr-x 31 arnt arnt 4096 Aug 28 22:06 fgdata
drwxr-xr-x 30 arnt arnt 4096 Aug 29 19:55 fgdata_2.10.0
drwxr-xr-x 30 arnt arnt 4096 Aug 29 20:07 fgdata_2.12.0
drwxr-xr-x 30 arnt arnt 4096 Aug 29 20:20 fgdata_2.8.0
drwxr-xr-x 30 arnt arnt 4096 Aug 29 23:18 fgdata_2.99.9
arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ 


..I've been playing with this, more on that in my next msg.

 
  -Pat
 
 
 
 On Wed, 28 Aug 2013 16:22:07 +0200
 Gijs de Rooy gijsr...@hotmail.com wrote:
 
   Wil wrote:
   Is the link you gave the master or next branch?
  
  That was the master branch. For other branches, it's easiest to go
  to www.gitorious.org/fg/fgmeta/source/download_and_compile.sh and
  select your preferred branch from the dropdown on the right. It's
  next to the Raw blob link that you can use to download the file.
  
  Gijs

 
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[Flightgear-devel] ..disregard my ..bug, was: Scripted installation

2013-08-29 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Fri, 30 Aug 2013 00:41:12 +0200, Arnt wrote in message 
20130830004112.44327...@nb6.lan:

 
 ..today's 1.9.12 above fails here:
 arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ bash download_and_compile-1.9-12.sh -B 2.99.9 \
 -R HEAD -c y -e -i -a n -p n -d y -r y -j 2 DATA 

..my blunder was doing cp -af fgdata/* fgdata_2.99.9 etc, 
that misses the .git trees, use rsync to copy the data.

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[Flightgear-devel] ..2.99 and 2.12 rocks! :o) was:..disregard my ..bug, was: Scripted installation

2013-08-29 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Fri, 30 Aug 2013 01:56:29 +0200, Arnt wrote in message 
20130830015629.40e02...@nb6.lan:

 On Fri, 30 Aug 2013 00:41:12 +0200, Arnt wrote in message 
 20130830004112.44327...@nb6.lan:
 
  
  ..today's 1.9.12 above fails here:
  arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ bash download_and_compile-1.9-12.sh -B
  2.99.9 \ -R HEAD -c y -e -i -a n -p n -d y -r y -j 2 DATA 
 
 ..my blunder was doing cp -af fgdata/* fgdata_2.99.9 etc, 
 that misses the .git trees, use rsync to copy the data.
 
..I use rsync -av --progress fgdata fgdata_2.99.9 etc, may 
be worth the while to chain rsync with DATA builds to speed
updating your trees 2.99 - 2.12 - 2.10 etc.

-- 
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...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Scripted installation

2013-08-24 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Fri, 23 Aug 2013 21:28:28 -0400, Pat wrote in message 
20130823212828.78c3d...@spinnaker130432.home:

 On Fri, 23 Aug 2013 17:14:34 -0400
 Thanks,
 
 We'll include this in thu about to be released script version 1.9.12
 
 -Pat Callahan

..a wee hint on enabling and disabling e.g. the jpeg-factory 
and the cool SP FDMs would be nice. ;o)


..I ran yesterday's 1.9.12 without building plib and OSG,
openrti, simgear and flightgear builds fine using system plib 
and OSG, which it finds and checks out as ok at buildtime.

..however at runtime, neither run_fgfs_debug.sh nor run_fgfs.sh 
sees libRTI-NG.so.1: bash run_fgfs.sh 
./fgfs: error while loading shared libraries: libRTI-NG.so.1: cannot
open shared object file: No such file or directory a

..simple stupid fix that I don't remember now, 
my current install/openrti/ tree:
arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ ls -1
install/openrti/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libRTI-NG.* \
install/openrti/lib/libRTI-NG.* install/openrti/libRTI-NG.* 
ls: cannot access install/openrti/lib/libRTI-NG.*: No such file or
directory 
ls: cannot access install/openrti/libRTI-NG.*: No such file or directory
install/openrti/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libRTI-NG.so
install/openrti/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libRTI-NG.so.1
install/openrti/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libRTI-NG.so.1.3.0
arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ 


..my fgrun build wails:

 FGRUN *

fgrun exists already.
Already up-to-date.
make: *** No rule to make target `install'.  Stop.


..and my Atlas builds fails with both fltk1.1 and fltk1.3,
fgfs build fails with fltk1.3 and works with fltk1.1,
64-bit Debian Sid/Jessie.

..my diff, WIP, OpenRadar still wants human input on rebuilds:
arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ ll download_and_compile-1.9-12a.diff
-rw-r--r-- 1 arnt arnt 2926 Aug 24 13:58 
download_and_compile-1.9-12a.diff 
arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ md5sum /tmp/download_and_compile-1.9-12a.diff
113b92dc884fcca4997e55e2b46120e1  download_and_compile-1.9-12a.diff
arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ 

-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.
--- download_and_compile-1.9-12.sh	2013-08-23 17:58:55.382955430 +0200
+++ download_and_compile-1.9-12a.sh	2013-08-24 13:55:14.170966999 +0200
@@ -17,7 +17,7 @@
 # You should have received a copy of the GNU General Public License
 # along with this program.  If not, see http://www.gnu.org/licenses/.
 
-VERSION=1.9-12
+VERSION=1.9-12a
 
 #COMPILE GIT FGFS
 
@@ -46,12 +46,12 @@
 LOGSEP=***
 
 WHATTOBUILD=
-WHATTOBUILDALL=( PLIB OSG OPENRTI SIMGEAR FGFS DATA FGRUN FGCOM )
+WHATTOBUILDALL=( OPENRTI SIMGEAR FGFS DATA FGO FGX FGRUN FGCOM FGCOMGUI OPENRADAR ATLAS )
 UPDATE=
 STABLE=
 
-APT_GET_UPDATE=y
-DOWNLOAD_PACKAGES=y
+APT_GET_UPDATE=n
+DOWNLOAD_PACKAGES=n
 
 COMPILE=y
 RECONFIGURE=y
@@ -60,8 +60,8 @@
 JOPTION=
 OOPTION=
 DEBUG=
-WITH_EVENT_INPUT=
-WITH_OPENRTI=
+WITH_EVENT_INPUT=y
+WITH_OPENRTI=y
 FG_SG_BRANCH=next
 FG_SG_REVISION=HEAD
 OSG_VERSION=3.0.1
@@ -237,9 +237,9 @@
 then
 	echo $0 Version $VERSION
 	echo Usage:
-	echo ./$0 [-u] [-h] [-s] [-e] [-i] [-g] [-a y|n] [-c y|n] [-p y|n] [-d y|n] [-r y|n] [ALL|PLIB|OSG|OPENRTI|SIMGEAR|FGFS|FGO|FGX|FGRUN|FGCOM|FGCOMGUI|ATLAS] [UPDATE]
+	echo ./$0 [-u] [-h] [-s] [-e] [-i] [-g] [-a y|n] [-c y|n] [-p y|n] [-d y|n] [-r y|n] [ALL|PLIB|OSG|OPENRTI|SIMGEAR|FGFS|FGO|FGX|FGRUN|FGCOM|FGCOMGUI|OPENRADAR|ATLAS] [UPDATE]
 	echo * without options it recompiles: PLIB,OSG,OPENRTI,SIMGEAR,FGFS,FGRUN
-	echo * Using ALL compiles everything
+	echo * Using ALL (re)compiles everything except PLIB and OSG
 	echo * Adding UPDATE it does not rebuild all (faster but to use only after one successfull first compile)
 	echo Switches:
 	echo * -u  such as using UPDATE
@@ -271,7 +271,7 @@
 echo **
 echo **
 echo * Warning, the compilation process   *
-echo * is going to use 12 or more Gbytes  *
+echo * is going to use 20 or more Gbytes  *
 echo * of space and at least a couple of  *
 echo * hours to download and build FG.*
 echo **
@@ -1075,7 +1075,8 @@
 
 	if [ $DOWNLOAD = y ]
 	then
-		wget http://sites.google.com/site/erobosprojects/flightgear/add-ons/fgo/download/fgo-1-3-1.tar.gz?attredirects=0 -O fgo-1-3-1.tar.gz
+		echo ..if you want a rebuild with fresh fgo code, delete your current fgo tarball and source tree, and re-run. 
+		wget -c http://sites.google.com/site/erobosprojects/flightgear/add-ons/fgo/download/fgo-1-3-1.tar.gz?attredirects=0 -O fgo-1-3-1.tar.gz
 		cd install
 		tar zxvf ../fgo-1-3-1.tar.gz
 
@@ -1480,7 +1481,8 @@
 
 	if [ $DOWNLOAD = y ]
 	then
-		wget $OR_STABLE_RELEASE -O OpenRadar.zip
+		echo ..if you want a rebuild with fresh OpenRadar code, delete your current OpenRadar zipfile and source tree, and re

Re: [Flightgear-devel] Scripted installation

2013-08-24 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Sat, 24 Aug 2013 14:33:57 +0200, Arnt wrote in message 
20130824143357.24a2b...@nb6.lan:

 On Fri, 23 Aug 2013 21:28:28 -0400, Pat wrote in message 
 20130823212828.78c3d...@spinnaker130432.home:
 
  On Fri, 23 Aug 2013 17:14:34 -0400
  Thanks,
  
  We'll include this in thu about to be released script version 1.9.12
  
  -Pat Callahan
 
 ..a wee hint on enabling and disabling e.g. the jpeg-factory 
 and the cool SP FDMs would be nice. ;o)
 
 
 ..I ran yesterday's 1.9.12 without building plib and OSG,
 openrti, simgear and flightgear builds fine using system plib 
 and OSG, which it finds and checks out as ok at buildtime.
 
 ..however at runtime, neither run_fgfs_debug.sh nor run_fgfs.sh 
 sees libRTI-NG.so.1: bash run_fgfs.sh 
 ./fgfs: error while loading shared libraries: libRTI-NG.so.1: cannot
 open shared object file: No such file or directory a
 
 ..simple stupid fix that I don't remember now, 
 my current install/openrti/ tree:
 arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ ls -1
 install/openrti/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libRTI-NG.* \
 install/openrti/lib/libRTI-NG.* install/openrti/libRTI-NG.* 
 ls: cannot access install/openrti/lib/libRTI-NG.*: No such file or
 directory 
 ls: cannot access install/openrti/libRTI-NG.*: No such file or
 directory install/openrti/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libRTI-NG.so
 install/openrti/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libRTI-NG.so.1
 install/openrti/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libRTI-NG.so.1.3.0
 arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ 
 
 
 ..my fgrun build wails:
 
  FGRUN *
 
 fgrun exists already.
 Already up-to-date.
 make: *** No rule to make target `install'.  Stop.
 
 
 ..and my Atlas builds fails with both fltk1.1 and fltk1.3,
 fgfs build fails with fltk1.3 and works with fltk1.1,
 64-bit Debian Sid/Jessie.
 
 ..my diff, WIP, OpenRadar still wants human input on rebuilds:
 arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ ll download_and_compile-1.9-12a.diff
 -rw-r--r-- 1 arnt arnt 2926 Aug 24 13:58 
 download_and_compile-1.9-12a.diff 
 arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ md5sum /tmp/download_and_compile-1.9-12a.diff
 113b92dc884fcca4997e55e2b46120e1  download_and_compile-1.9-12a.diff
 arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ 
 

..scratch the above diff, use this:
arnt@nb6:/tmp$ ll do* md5sum do*
-rw-r--r-- 1 arnt arnt 3877 Aug 24 18:54
download_and_compile-1.9-12a.diff
292c76a6d725800f88d2464403756ff2  download_and_compile-1.9-12a.diff 
arnt@nb6:/tmp$ 

..+   echo * Using ALL (re)compiles everything except PLIB, OSG,
OPENRADAR and ATLAS

..my Atlas build fails like in 
http://osdir.com/ml/flightgear-sim/2012-10/msg00122.html 

..Atlas/configure.ac asks for the right thing here: ...
145 dnl Enable serial support on Unix type systems
146 AM_CONDITIONAL(ENABLE_UNIX_SERIAL, true)
147 
148 AC_ARG_ENABLE(simgear-shared, [  --enable-simgear-shared
  Use a shared SimGear library instead of many static libraries.], 
149 ENABLE_SIMGEAR_SHARED=yes,ENABLE_SIMGEAR_SHARED=no) 
150 
151 if test x$ENABLE_SIMGEAR_SHARED != xno; then
152 dnl Use shared library libSimGearCore. libSimGearScene is
not required. 
153 simgear_LIBS=-lSimGearCore
154 else

...but not here

155 dnl Use many static simgear libraries.
156 simgear_LIBS=-lsgmagvar -lsgtiming -lsgmisc -lsgio -lsgserial
-lsgdebug -lsgbucket -lsgstructure -lsgmath -lsgthreads 
157 fi 
158 AC_SUBST(simgear_LIBS)
 
..I guess a new 156: simgear_LIBS=-libSimGearCore -libSimGearScene
should work.


-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.
--- download_and_compile-1.9-12.sh	2013-08-23 17:58:55.382955430 +0200
+++ download_and_compile-1.9-12a.sh	2013-08-24 18:30:26.637901023 +0200
@@ -17,7 +17,7 @@
 # You should have received a copy of the GNU General Public License
 # along with this program.  If not, see http://www.gnu.org/licenses/.
 
-VERSION=1.9-12
+VERSION=1.9-12a
 
 #COMPILE GIT FGFS
 
@@ -46,12 +46,12 @@
 LOGSEP=***
 
 WHATTOBUILD=
-WHATTOBUILDALL=( PLIB OSG OPENRTI SIMGEAR FGFS DATA FGRUN FGCOM )
+WHATTOBUILDALL=( OPENRTI SIMGEAR FGFS DATA FGO FGX FGRUN FGCOM FGCOMGUI )
 UPDATE=
 STABLE=
 
-APT_GET_UPDATE=y
-DOWNLOAD_PACKAGES=y
+APT_GET_UPDATE=n
+DOWNLOAD_PACKAGES=n
 
 COMPILE=y
 RECONFIGURE=y
@@ -60,8 +60,8 @@
 JOPTION=
 OOPTION=
 DEBUG=
-WITH_EVENT_INPUT=
-WITH_OPENRTI=
+WITH_EVENT_INPUT=y
+WITH_OPENRTI=y
 FG_SG_BRANCH=next
 FG_SG_REVISION=HEAD
 OSG_VERSION=3.0.1
@@ -237,9 +237,9 @@
 then
 	echo $0 Version $VERSION
 	echo Usage:
-	echo ./$0 [-u] [-h] [-s] [-e] [-i] [-g] [-a y|n] [-c y|n] [-p y|n] [-d y|n] [-r y|n] [ALL|PLIB|OSG|OPENRTI|SIMGEAR|FGFS|FGO|FGX|FGRUN|FGCOM|FGCOMGUI|ATLAS] [UPDATE]
+	echo ./$0 [-u] [-h] [-s] [-e] [-i] [-g] [-a y|n] [-c y|n] [-p y|n] [-d y|n] [-r y|n] [ALL|PLIB|OSG|OPENRTI|SIMGEAR|FGFS|FGO|FGX|FGRUN|FGCOM|FGCOMGUI|OPENRADAR|ATLAS] [UPDATE]
 	echo * without options it recompiles: PLIB

[Flightgear-devel] ..flightgear now supports X.org's noveau driver on NVIDIA cards, was: Scripted installation

2013-08-24 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Sat, 24 Aug 2013 14:33:57 +0200, Arnt wrote in message 
20130824143357.24a2b...@nb6.lan:

 On Fri, 23 Aug 2013 21:28:28 -0400, Pat wrote in message 
 20130823212828.78c3d...@spinnaker130432.home:
 
  On Fri, 23 Aug 2013 17:14:34 -0400
  Thanks,
  
  We'll include this in thu about to be released script version 1.9.12
  
  -Pat Callahan
 
 ..a wee hint on enabling and disabling e.g. the jpeg-factory 
 and the cool SP FDMs would be nice. ;o)



 ..I ran yesterday's 1.9.12 without building plib and OSG,
 openrti, simgear and flightgear builds fine using system plib 
 and OSG, which it finds and checks out as ok at buildtime.
 
 ..however at runtime, neither run_fgfs_debug.sh nor run_fgfs.sh 
 sees libRTI-NG.so.1: bash run_fgfs.sh 
 ./fgfs: error while loading shared libraries: libRTI-NG.so.1: cannot
 open shared object file: No such file or directory a
 
 ..simple stupid fix that I don't remember now, 
 my current install/openrti/ tree:
 arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ ls -1
 install/openrti/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libRTI-NG.* \
 install/openrti/lib/libRTI-NG.* install/openrti/libRTI-NG.* 
 ls: cannot access install/openrti/lib/libRTI-NG.*: No such file or
 directory 
 ls: cannot access install/openrti/libRTI-NG.*: No such file or
 directory install/openrti/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libRTI-NG.so
 install/openrti/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libRTI-NG.so.1
 install/openrti/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libRTI-NG.so.1.3.0
 arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ 
 
..dunno if it's kosher and halal etc, I simply appended 
/x86_64-linux-gnu to the export line in run_fgfs.sh: 
export \
LD_LIBRARY_PATH=../../plib/lib:../../OpenSceneGraph/lib:../../simgear/lib:../../openrti/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu


..and I'm pleased to confirm FG works with the noveau
driver on my NVIDIA Corporation G92 [GeForce GTS 250] 
(rev a2) card (that came along with my Radeon HD 4890),
FG colors are a little psycedelic, but the framerates
on default settings are in the high teen to low 20ies
at 1280x1024 until you pile up _all_ the eyecandy, 
wonderful work, guys, thank you all. :o)

.._near_ plug-n-play with open drivers, , I just had to 
swap out radeon for nouveau in /etc/X11/korg.conf 
and start up the box after dropping in the GTS 250, the 
4890 wants power in _both_ the 6 pin and 8 pin sockets, 
and, it's going to happen. ;o)

..is Enabling ATI viewport hack something we want 
on NVIDIA cards running on the noveau driver?
Is Enabling ATI viewport hack done with the nvidea 
driver too???

 ..my fgrun build wails:
 
  FGRUN *
 
 fgrun exists already.
 Already up-to-date.
 make: *** No rule to make target `install'.  Stop.


-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

--
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[Flightgear-devel] ..database server on http://wiki.flightgear.org/ is down

2013-08-23 Thread Arnt Karlsen
Hi,

..it returns Sorry! This site is experiencing technical difficulties.

Try waiting a few minutes and reloading.

(Can't contact the database server: Can't connect to local MySQL server
through socket '/var/run/mysqld/mysqld.sock' (111) (localhost))



-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

--
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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Article about non-profit organizations for free software

2013-08-08 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Thu, 8 Aug 2013 14:22:42 -0500, Curtis wrote in message 
CAHtsj_c=Q5kz=6owg77u5v3jbvzdeadxh-zns5dpm+bggux...@mail.gmail.com:
 
 On Thu, Aug 8, 2013 at 3:52 AM, Stefan Seifert n...@detonation.org
 wrote:
 
  Hi!
 
  we had the discussion a while ago and now lwn.net published a great
  article on
  the subject:
 
  http://lwn.net/Articles/561336/
 
  According to
  http://wiki.flightgear.org/Project_Infrastructure_Enhancements
  it's still an open issue on how to handle donations to FlightGear.
 
  Well worth a read,
  Stefan

 Hi Stefan,
 
 Thanks for posting the LWN link.  Definitely some good advice to think
 about.  From the 2 minutes I can afford to think about these things
 right now, I definitely agree that joining an umbrella organization
 would be the best option for FlightGear should we choose to move
 forward on any of this. Finding the right umbrella organization might
 be the trickier part. :-)
 
 Curt.

..indeed, and http://www.wired.com/wiredenterprise/2013/08/osdv/all/
suggests the IRS might have a problem with the GPL allowing profitable
distribution of FG.  Picking the right umbrella organization I guess
will prove crucial, and their lawyers may be able to help shave a few 
years off the approval procedure.  Take care.

-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

--
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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Lots of Progress on Download_and_compile.sh

2013-07-09 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Tue, 9 Jul 2013 01:31:03 -0700, Zhitao wrote in message 
007b01ce7c7e$a7726a60$f6573f20$@gmail.com:

 What's wrong with CMake? I love CMake...

..nothing, it's still used like before, download_and_compile.sh
merely does the boring routine git pull etc stuff for you. ;o)

-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

--
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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Tupolev 154 goes GPL

2013-07-08 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Mon, 8 Jul 2013 13:48:22 +0700, Yurik wrote in message 
201307081348.22614.yu...@kbrare.ru:

 
 Hello All Flightgear developers!
 
 It has been almost 5 years since Tu-154B first appeared in
 FlightGear. Now, after years of development and bug-fixing, release
 3.0 is available - and it is GPL compliant and Rembrandt ready!
 
 Unfortunately, many FlightGear pilots do not even know this airplane
 exists. 

..one way to make it known, is make a wee bit of noise around its
hydrogen sibling: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tupolev_Tu-155 ;o)

 We have now been allowed by Project Tupolev to distribute Tu-154B
 under GNU/GPL. In addition, the model has undergone major overhaul
 regarding the Rembrandt project. It now provides a full specter of
 real lighting, for both exterior model and the cockpit.
 

..and the interior too?  Way different for the 155 and 156.
On the FDM side, the hydrogen and proposed methane fuels are 
liquid at these cryogenic pressures and temperatures, and 
the 155 carried common hydrocarbon jet fuel as back-up.

-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Benchmark matrix

2013-06-21 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Thu, 20 Jun 2013 10:20:03 -0700 (PDT), geneb wrote in message 
alpine.lfd.2.03.1306201018050.25...@deltasoft.com:

 On Thu, 20 Jun 2013, Alan Teeder wrote:
 
  Instead of all this mudslinging about what slows what on which
  processor, could some thought be given to producing a benchmark
  suite for Flightgear.
 
  It would need to take in all of the, by now well known, variables -
  making it by no means a simple beast to manage.
 
  If this could be automated in some way it would be much easier to
  capture, and then submit, consistent data.
 
 A scripted run would be an EXCELLENT tool.

..aye, and a scripted run can be set up to play all the tricks, 
even if it needs to run FG several times to e.g. reset the graphics, 
and it can be set up to finish the run by offering to upload 
the results automatically. :o)


-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] New alpha version of download_and_compile.sh - avoids multiple fgdata downloads.

2013-06-21 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Fri, 21 Jun 2013 07:03:19 -0400, Pat wrote in message 
20130621070319.43455586@spinnaker01:

 I've put a new version of download_and_compile.sh on the team clone 
 
 http://www.gitorious.org/+fg-download-and-compile/fg/fg-download-and-compile-fgmeta/blobs/next/download_and_compile.sh
 
 The big change:
 
   This version changes the way fgdata is handled to prevent
   multiple downloads of the 5G of git archives for fgdata.
   Multiple versions of fgdata can be kept active and up to date
   for testing purposes.  Various build and install trees can be
   created using download_and_compile.sh. Each of these will use
   symlinks to the appropriate fgdata version.
 
 This is an alpha version 
 
   It has not been approved for the main tree.
 
   It has had some testing, but needs others to try it out to
   uncover any bugs.  I recommend using it in a separate
 directory from your usual builds until you have some confidence in
 how it works.  
 
 If you find a bug, create a detailed log by running it like this:
 
   ./download_and_compile.sh -xv
 download_and_compile_diagnostics.log
 
   This log is likely to be large.  Please don't e-mail it to the
   list.
 
   Instead, Email me, find me on irc #flightgear as user pac1 or
   contact me through the flightgear forum.  If you've got my
   phone #, feel free to use it.
 
 Here's the commit note for the change:
 
 Add -D option to change the handling of fgdata
 
   With this change a download_and_compile.sh user can optionally
   use a single copy of fgdata as a base for builds using any
   other version.
 
   The -D option will find and create if not found, version
   directories for fgdata.  Once this is done for one version,
   download_and_compile.sh will use these directories to prevent
   multiple downloads of the entire 5gb git archive, when a
   different version of fgdata is needed.  The directories are
   initially placed at the same level as download_and_compile.sh.
   The directories can be moved higher in the directory tree if
   desired.
 
   When an existing or new build and install tree needs to use a
   particular version of fgdata, a symlink in fgfs/install will
   connect the build to the correct version.  If the correct
   version does not yet exist it will be copied from an existing
   fgdata of another version and changed to the needed version
   using git checkout.
 
   This allows download_and_compile.sh to create as many build
 and install trees as desired, each with different versions and
   options, while keeping network usage to a minimum.
 
   a typical set of fgdata and separate build directories  might
   look like:
 
   ~/work/fg
   ~/work/fg/fgdata_2.8.0
   ~/work/fg/fgdata_2.10.0
   ~/work/fg/fgdata_2.11.0
   ~/work/fg/master
   ~/work/fg/master-openrti-debug
   ~/work/fg/stable
   ~/work/fg/2.10.0-debug
 
   for each build, the required symlink will be created to the
   corresponding fgdata_* directory.

..to avoid the 3-day delay fetching a new 5GB copy of fgdata, 
where do I put my March 29'th-current copy of fgdata?
I now have it as 2.11.0 in ~/FG-git/fgdata 

-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Benchmark matrix

2013-06-21 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Sat, 22 Jun 2013 01:11:39 +1000, Christopher wrote in message 
51c46d2b.8060...@gmail.com:

 On 21/06/13 21:26, Arnt Karlsen wrote:
  On Thu, 20 Jun 2013 10:20:03 -0700 (PDT), geneb wrote in message
  alpine.lfd.2.03.1306201018050.25...@deltasoft.com:
 
  On Thu, 20 Jun 2013, Alan Teeder wrote:
 
  Instead of all this mudslinging about what slows what on which
  processor, could some thought be given to producing a benchmark
  suite for Flightgear.
 
  It would need to take in all of the, by now well known, variables
  - making it by no means a simple beast to manage.
 
  If this could be automated in some way it would be much easier to
  capture, and then submit, consistent data.
 
  A scripted run would be an EXCELLENT tool.
  ..aye, and a scripted run can be set up to play all the tricks,
  even if it needs to run FG several times to e.g. reset the graphics,
  and it can be set up to finish the run by offering to upload
  the results automatically. :o)
 
 
 
 Actually this is probably in my interests, I'm improving the concorde 
 (3D cockpit, less laggy nasal, autopilot - slowly) but I have fairly 
 powerful hardware so I'd like to know how much of what I do affects 
 other users.
 
 A long time ago, I remember using this to try and figure out why I
 was getting 10fps on a nvidia GTX470 with the lowest settings and
 default renderer (I was accidently running a debug build):
 http://wiki.flightgear.org/Howto:Debugging_FlightGear_Crashes#Minimal_Startup_Profile
 
 I might come up with a dash script that tests things in different
 areas with different settings, But that will only be helpful on
 linux. 

..if you specify your FG commandlines, the Windroids will have a
starting point, if they manage to come up with something that works 
on Mac 'n Linux too, we will be able to get a benchmark that fits 
all supported platforms.

 I'll probably just use the telnet server to pull the property
 tree frame rates/spacing I haven't used it yet but I imagine it would
 be quite easy).

..easier than e.g. wget on FG's web property server???  Might unduly
disadvantage Wintendo, they do have Microsoft Internet Explorer built
right into their os, and they may be able to script that too, and 
on benchmarking FG, we want the truth, and we wanna be conservative 
and err on the side of caution. ;o)

-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] reminder: entering feature freeze now

2013-06-19 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Wed, 19 Jun 2013 12:42:33 +0100, Stuart wrote in message 
CAP3ntytxrt_p061QvA2UZKU2XX48kRDq22R2csdr+8=tl69...@mail.gmail.com:

 On Tue, Jun 18, 2013 at 11:08 PM, Kleo G. wrote:
  ALS already has an ON/OFF selection button.
 
  Wouldn't it be useful for Rembrandt to also have such a button,
  thus being able to switch it on or off either without restarting
  the sim?? It would skip all the inconvenience of restarting the sim
  for activating Rembrandt.
 
 Hi Kleo,
 
 I don't think that is possible, as Rembrandt requires a particular
 graphics pipeline
 to be set up that can only be done at startup.
 
 -Stuart

..once started with the standard graphics, we can take FG 
from an app window in e.g. X and go to fullscreen or game 
mode without restarting FG, AFAICT only the graphics is 
restarted, not FG.  
This cannot be done with Rembrandt?
Can it be done with ALS???

-- 
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...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Website down?

2013-06-19 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Wed, 19 Jun 2013 14:23:29 -0500, Curtis wrote in message 
CAHtsj_d4yiSETmD5AQT0=0a_XjGf8AkQFVKgWWEZe6=rxmu...@mail.gmail.com:

 I think there's more things wrong with the machine because everything
 is broke right now.

..http://wiki.flightgear.org/Main_Page is still up, maybe put 
a www mirror somewhere and point to it?

-- 
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...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Turbulence should affect YaSim and JSBSim the same way

2013-06-17 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Sun, 16 Jun 2013 19:09:40 -0600, Jon wrote in message 
005a01ce6af7$58b69470$0a23bd50$@net:

  ..my oversimplification: http://wiki.flightgear.org/YASim guesses
  how it flies from how it looks, while
  http://wiki.flightgear.org/JSBSim knows how it flies and tries to
  show us how that looks, e.g. stalls are assymetrical in YASim but
  (still?) symmetrical in JSBSim.
  
  ..if I guess FG progress correctly, we need to model downwash
  correctly, and if you want assymetrical stalls in JSBSim, you need 2
  halved JSBSim models per plane so each wing etc surface calculation
  is run independently.
 
 I have not tried modeling a piston aircraft in quite some time. [Hal
 Engel's P-51D does stall in either direction, does it not?]

..I haven't tried the P-51Ds much, but yeah, my stalls went both ways
on both FDMs AFAIR, but here I'm going on what I remember from when
YASim was introduced here, and whatever I've picked up on how they
differ, and on my WAG these things have changed since I last checked
the P51Ds 3 or 4 years back.  
My big problem was always too low framerates on T/O. ;o)

 In any case, it should be possible to model aerodynamic effects from
 the propeller in the XML model file for any JSBSim aircraft (in the
 aerodynamics section) - effects that would affect stalling, I
 suspect. It's not that JSBSim doesn't support asymmetric stalls -
 JSBSim doesn't *not* support it.

..my (flawed?) understanding of JSBSim is both wing halves sees the
same wind because they are calculated together as one wing, where
YASim cuts up the wing and calculates the wing sections independently
and adds them up together, AFAIRI from the discussion way back here.

 But, I'm not sure anyone has crafted the aerodynamic/propulsion
 interactions that would effect that. This isn't necessarily the fault
 of users, either. We (JSBSim development community) would ideally
 make available more examples and documentation.
 
 JB


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...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Turbulence should affect YaSim and JSBSim the same way

2013-06-16 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Sun, 16 Jun 2013 23:03:21 +0300, Umut wrote in message 
candytvdfry0hsmpts0+ul4yvhgagtb2ggzpenpbml8kci7k...@mail.gmail.com:

 Hi,
 I have been looking over the FG code for sometime and would like to
 start contributing to the project. I just browsed through the open
 items and figured out Turbulence should affect YaSim and JSBSim the
 same way issue in 3.0 backlog. As the first step, I am trying grasp
 YaSim and JSBSim approaches.

..my oversimplification: http://wiki.flightgear.org/YASim guesses how
it flies from how it looks, while http://wiki.flightgear.org/JSBSim 
knows how it flies and tries to show us how that looks, e.g. stalls 
are assymetrical in YASim but (still?) symmetrical in JSBSim.

..if I guess FG progress correctly, we need to model downwash correctly,
and if you want assymetrical stalls in JSBSim, you need 2 halved JSBSim
models per plane so each wing etc surface calculation is run independently.

 I just would like to ask if anybody else is working on this. And if
 not, can anyone help/guide me through drafting a solution. Regards,

-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Bug 772 (Yasim on ground)

2013-06-11 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Tue, 11 Jun 2013 14:09:27 +0200, James wrote in message 
068d459e-8a17-4403-89b1-92606456d...@mac.com:

 Hi all,
 
 Hyde has submitted a work-around for issue 772, which you can see
 here:
 
   https://gitorious.org/fg/flightgear/merge_requests/1572

..does this test for _both_ speed and altitude?

..I see no test for friction (maybe elsewhere in the code?), 
on e.g. wet ice, wind _should_ push you around, but a wee 
3kts breeze shouldn't move an airliner, a say 30kts gust 
probably should rock it a wee bit, and say a 60kts gale 
should have it skating away.  
Maybe test friction forces against (cross)wind forces?

 He'd like this merged before the freeze (actually it's a fix so it
 can be merged afterwards, but still), I'd like to hear any opinions
 on if this is a bad idea or good idea. Personally I'm not so affected
 by issue 772, but if many people are, the work-around seems
 just-about-acceptable to me.
 
 (Obviously it would be nicer to fix Yasim for real, but let's skip
 that just for a moment)
 
 Does anybody feel strongly that either:
 
  - the bug is very bad, so that the workaround is definitely needed
 (keeping in mind it's a long-standing bug)
  - the work-around is very bad, for some scenario I didn't imagine
 myself? (Helicopters on the ground? But they likely benefit more from
 the fix?)

..one problem with good work-arounnds, is they have a way of becoming
permanent fixes despite their often fundamentally flawed assumptions,
because they work well enough.

 I'm happy to merge the change above to get some feedback, with the
 understanding that if people raise 'problems which are worse than the
 original issue' before 2.12 is final, we could revert it.
 
 James


-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Does Flightgear have a problem with Ubuntu nouveau drivers

2013-06-10 Thread Arnt Karlsen
:00 0
  aacfc000-aad0 ---p  00:00 0
  aad1e000-aad3e000 rw-s 1625df000 00:05 10434 /dev/dri/card0
  aad3e000-ab20 rw-p  00:00 0
  ab20-ab30 rw-p  00:00 0
  ab31e000-ab33e000 rw-s 16259f000 00:05 10434 /dev/dri/card0
  ab33e000-ac40 rw-p  00:00 0
  ac40-ac50 rw-p  00:00 0
  ac51f000-ac53f000 rw-s 16255f000 00:05 10434 /dev/dri/card0
  ac53f000-ac60 rw-p  00:00 0
  ac60-ac70 rw-p  00:00 0
  ac71f000-ac73f000 rw-s 162502000 00:05 10434 /dev/dri/card0
  ac73f000-ac80 rw-p  00:00 0
  ac80-ac90 rw-p  00:00 0
  ac914000-ac97d000 r-xp  08:01 2366503
  /usr/lib/i386-linux-gnu/pulseaudio/libpulsecommon-3.0.so
  ac97d000-ac97e000 r--p 00068000 08:01 2366503
  /usr/lib/i386-linux-gnu/pulseaudio/libpulsecommon-3.0.so
  ac97e000-ac97f000 rw-p 00069000 08:01 2366503
  /usr/lib/i386-linux-gnu/pulseaudio/libpulsecommon-3.0.so
  ac97f000-acb0 rw-p  00:00 0
  acb0-acc0 rw-p  00:00 0
  acc1d000-acc3d000 rw-s 1624e2000 00:05 10434 /dev/dri/card0
  acc3d000-ad20 rw-p  00:00 0
  ad20-ad30 rw-p  00:00 0
  ad31f000-ad33f000 rw-s 162492000 00:05 10434 /dev/dri/card0
  ad33f000-ad40 rw-p  00:00 0
  ad40-ad50 rw-p  00:00 0
  ad51e000-ad53e000 rw-s 16246e000 00:05 10434 /dev/dri/card0
  ad53e000-adc0 rw-p  00:00 0
  adc0-ade0 rw-p  00:00 0
  ade0-adf0 rw-p  00:00 0
  adf1c000-ae60 rw-p  00:00 0
  ae60-ae70 rw-p  00:00 0
  ae707000-ae727000 rw-s 162444000 00:05 10434 /dev/dri/card0
  ae727000-ae72f000 r-xp  08:01 2364464
  /usr/lib/i386-linux-gnu/libXrender.so.1.3.0
  ae72f000-ae73 r--p 7000 08:01 2364464
  /usr/lib/i386-linux-gnu/libXrender.so.1.3.0
  ae73-ae731000 rw-p 8000 08:01 2364464
  /usr/lib/i386-linux-gnu/libXrender.so.1.3.0
  ae731000-ae73a000 r-xp  08:01 2364438
  /usr/lib/i386-linux-gnu/libXcurAborted (core dumped)
 
  Cheers
  Innis
 
 
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...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

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[Flightgear-devel] ..wing rocking and https://launchpad.net/grail

2013-06-05 Thread Arnt Karlsen
Hi,

..one way of gesturing, is rock vigorously your wings, this is the
preferred Kosher response when approaching e.g. Fisk for EAA AirVenture 
at KOSH, and one possible way of supporting this, is have grail read 
FG video output and test it for e.g. rocking wings, grail here means 
Gesture Recognition And Instantiation Library https://launchpad.net/grail
EAA Airventure NOTAM: http://airventure.org/flying/2013_notam.pdf

..in Debianese: 'aptitude install grail-tools', then:
arnt@celsius:~$ dpkg -l |grep grail-tools |fmt -uw 72
ii grail-tools 3.1.0-2 amd64 Gesture Recognition And Instantiation
Library - test tools
arnt@celsius:~$ dpkg -L grail-tools
/.
/usr
/usr/bin
/usr/bin/grail-test-3-1
/usr/bin/grail-test-atomic
/usr/bin/grail-test-propagation
/usr/bin/grail-test-edge
/usr/share
/usr/share/doc
/usr/share/doc/grail-tools
/usr/share/doc/grail-tools/copyright
/usr/share/doc/grail-tools/changelog.Debian.gz
/usr/share/man
/usr/share/man/man1
/usr/share/man/man1/grail-test-atomic.1.gz
/usr/share/man/man1/grail-test-propagation.1.gz
/usr/share/man/man1/grail-test-3-1.1.gz
/usr/share/man/man1/grail-test-edge.1.gz
arnt@celsius:~$ man -k grail
grail-test-3-1 (1)   - dump grail v3 events
grail-test-atomic (1) - dump grail v3 atomic gesture events
grail-test-edge (1)  - test edge swipes
grail-test-propagation (1) - test driver tool for gesture accept/reject
arnt@celsius:~$ 


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  best case, worst case, and just in case.

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Syncing sim time

2013-05-09 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Thu, 9 May 2013 14:57:21 + (UTC), castle...@comcast.net wrote in
message
142462582.1782424.1368111441180.javamail.r...@sz0139a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net:

 Hi,
 
 Thanks to Jan Comans I've been able to sync the 3D clouds across
 three instances of fgfs running on a multi-core machine.  This, in
 turn, provides for some very respectable frame rates of 40 to 50 fps
 per core with a three projector system with older generation Nvidia
 boards ( GT430 and GT440 ) on a 64bit I5 machine.  The visuals will
 be just awesome once the collimated display is completed later this
 year.
 
 However, all is not perfect in simworld.  Since each CPU starts and
 runs independently there is a skew in sim time for each core and AI
 trsffic is just not usable with models disappearing into the screen
 edge and then showing up at the adjacent screen boundary a few
 seconds later.
 
 One possible solution is to start with the sim clock frozen and
 once all instances have booted and initialized send out a control
 packet via the native-ctrls protocols and unfreeze the clocks. A
 better solution would be to use the fdm packets to start the clocks
 since that protocol is already being used to sync the fdm slaves to
 the master.  This network method will still have a bit of latency;
 probably the best solution is to have a freeze flag in a portion of
 shared memory accessed by all cores and then clear the freeze state
 once you are ready to run.  This has an additional advantage of be
 able to stop and start all instances with microsecond accuracy.
 
 Just wondering if anyone has messed in this area and has some
 info/data on such things as to how much latency is tolerable before
 the AI models start breaking up across screen boundaries?  Is there
 clock drift due to variations in delta t's for each CPU/GPU set based
 on rendering times for each screen?  Any need to send out a local sim
 time standard to adjust for any drift and keep things in sync?
 
 Any thoughts, comments, suggestions would be appreciated and will
 earn credits for sim time if you happen to be passing through the
 Colorado Springs area. ;-)
 
 Cheers
 Jack

..the ntp time server gives you too much skewed time?  
On a lan, you should have your box clocks within milliseconds 
from each other. Details in: http://www.ntp.org/ and
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Network_Time_Protocol

..install a ntp server on your master machine and ntp clients 
on your other machines.  Or, set up a ntp server hardware box 
and run ntp clients on all your FG boxes, to bring them closer.
You want the same time error on all your ntp clients.

-- 
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...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Atmospheric Light Scattering

2013-05-02 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Thu, 2 May 2013 12:57:00 +0200, grtuxhangar wrote in message 
CAFEVUtBa7-=VKkc6jWKxGtZ=y7k9d-+2o9v461al4b59cgt...@mail.gmail.com:

 Hello,
 
 If i have offended somebody with my not fluent English, my apologizes
 for it.
 
 No i/(we)  don't use Google , there is not any (free)  good
 translator from English to several language including those
 officially in use in the middle east and north-africa.
 
 
 Anyhow, i was surprised by the Arnt question regarding: how to get a
 screenshot.

..one final chance: Think of the F3 button as you do with your camera
trigger button, and think of your mainframe and FG as your camera.

..now, whenever you take a picture camera, you first aim your camera
towards whatever you want to take a picture of, then you push down
the camera's F3 trigger button to actually take the picture and
record it onto disk or film.

..so, my question is, _how_ do you aim your camera?
 

 Ahmad
 
 
 On 2 May 2013 11:01, TDO Brandano tdo_brand...@hotmail.com wrote:
 
  I strongly suspect we need a French interpreter. Google translate is
  obviously failing to properly traduce the more nuanced meanings and
  contexts.
  Arnt said: just pressing F3, as you said you did, will produce a
  picture of the Cessna C172 on the KSFO runway. There are other
  settings used to start Flightgear and prepare the scene. To
  replicate the same problem we need the entire setup for each
  screenshot. He never claimed that F3 was a custom screenshot button.
  That single your was a synthesis for Using just F3 as you said,
  and would be obvious to anyone using the English language
  regularly. Now, I am the first saying that English is not a very
  pretty language. But it is effective in helping communication,
  because compared to most other options it is fairly easy to learn.
  It still baffles me that there are people working with computers
  around the globe that stubbornly refuse to even attempt to learn a
  little English out of pure campanilism.
 
  --
  Date: Thu, 2 May 2013 02:00:29 +0200
  From: hohora...@gmail.com
  To: flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
 
  Subject: Re: [Flightgear-devel] Atmospheric Light Scattering
 
  Arnt
 
  Oh sorry , i  thought you were using FG for years.
  I know at the beginning we could have some problem.
 
 
  NO it is not MY F3 KEY it is an FG feature Key.
 
 
  Just look at the fgdata/keyboard.xml  content.
 
  you will notice at the line 1134
  the key
   key n=259
nameF3/name
descCapture screen/desc
 
  That file is very useful to understand what are the specific keys
  within FG.
 
  That is.
 
  Ahmad
 
 
  On 2 May 2013 00:39, Arnt Karlsen a...@iaksess.no wrote:
 
  On Wed, 1 May 2013 16:59:41 +0200, grtuxhangar wrote in message
  CAFEVUtAcO--uEpj+vDHCG4k=q0lktoweqnr2avdx+8gshhz...@mail.gmail.com:
 
   Arnst
  
  
   you wrote
  
menu options you used to create these screenshots
  
   ..#3 is why I wand your answer(s):
so we can try reproduce them.
  
   I am not  sure i understand your question :
  
   You want to know how does the screenshots were done ?
  
   I gave you the answer before
  
   Just   USE== F3 key===,  no menu , not any others
   tools, that's done.
 
  ..your F3 key gives me the C172 on the active runway at KSFO.
 
  ..so, my question is, how do you set up your FG screenshot scene,
  _before_ you use the F3 button to take the screenshot?
 
   On 1 May 2013 15:43, Arnt Karlsen a...@iaksess.no wrote:
  
On Wed, 1 May 2013 14:00:03 +0200, grtuxhangar wrote in message
cafevutcj5zknsb+l4_75ea85br-mswbel8zyci08s_n45xr...@mail.gmail.com:
 
 Here you will find both files content which answer your
 request:
 https://sites.google.com/site/grtuxhangarctd/other-download/.fgfsrc
   
..so if I enter those command line options and have exactly the
same models and exactly the same scenery and exactly the same
sim weather, I should see exactly the same thing and be able to
make exactly the same screen shots.
   
..an easier way is, specify everything, e.g. ...
--on-ground  Start at ground level (default)
--in-air Start in air (implied when using
--altitude)
   
...and then your time options and your specific Initial
Position and Orientation: options, e.g.
--runway=rwy_no  Specify starting runway (must also
specify an airport)
... or directly with e.g. these:
--lon=degreesStarting longitude (west = -)
--lat=degreesStarting latitude (south = -)
--altitude=value Starting altitude
(in feet unless --units-meters
specified)
--heading=degreesSpecify heading (yaw) angle (Psi)
--roll=degrees   Specify roll angle (Phi)
--pitch=degrees  Specify pitch angle (Theta)
   
..these options can

Re: [Flightgear-devel] Atmospheric Light Scattering

2013-05-02 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Fri, 3 May 2013 00:14:46 +0200, grtuxhangar wrote in message 
CAFEVUtBn+iz58w=tNERnJ9Wu=x+7pmd72hteekgpycstncj...@mail.gmail.com:

 Arnt,
 
 OK
 I have a question, when you are flying with FG how do you aim your
 camera ?
 
 Your answer is my answer .

..no.  I said one final chance, and you blew it.

 
 Regards
 
 
 
 On 2 May 2013 23:17, Saikrishna Arcot saiarcot...@gmail.com wrote:
 
  He's asking you from what view you take the screenshot. Do you take
  it in the fly-by view? Do you take it in the model view? What is the
  zoom/FOV that you use?
 
  There are several ways/views from which I can take a screenshot of a
  Boeing 777. I can take it from the model view, where I'm positioned
  right behind and above the plane with a zoom/FOV of 40. I can take
  it from the co-pilot's seat looking at the cockpit panel. I can
  take it from a passenger seat looking at the left wing.
 
  Saikrishna Arcot
 
  On Thu 02 May 2013 11:20:11 AM CDT, grtuxhangar team wrote:
   Hi Arnt
  
   Sorry i don't understand your question.
   Screenshot is screenshot  of your  FG SCREEN  , nothing else.
  
   Kind regards
  
   Ahmad
  
  
   On 2 May 2013 17:07, Arnt Karlsen a...@iaksess.no
   mailto:a...@iaksess.no wrote:
  
   On Thu, 2 May 2013 12:57:00 +0200, grtuxhangar wrote in
   message
   CAFEVUtBa7-=VKkc6jWKxGtZ=y7k9d-+2o9v461al4b59cgt...@mail.gmail.commailto:
  y7k9d-%2b2o9v461al4b59cgt...@mail.gmail.com:
  
Hello,
   
If i have offended somebody with my not fluent English, my
   apologizes
for it.
   
No i/(we)  don't use Google , there is not any (free)  good
translator from English to several language including those
officially in use in the middle east and north-africa.
   
   
Anyhow, i was surprised by the Arnt question regarding: how
to get
  a
screenshot.
  
   ..one final chance: Think of the F3 button as you do with
   your camera trigger button, and think of your mainframe and FG
   as your
  camera.
  
   ..now, whenever you take a picture camera, you first aim your
   camera towards whatever you want to take a picture of, then you
   push down the camera's F3 trigger button to actually take the
   picture and record it onto disk or film.
  
   ..so, my question is, _how_ do you aim your camera?
  
  
Ahmad
   
   
On 2 May 2013 11:01, TDO Brandano tdo_brand...@hotmail.com
   mailto:tdo_brand...@hotmail.com wrote:
   
 I strongly suspect we need a French interpreter. Google
   translate is
 obviously failing to properly traduce the more nuanced
   meanings and
 contexts.
 Arnt said: just pressing F3, as you said you did, will
 produce a picture of the Cessna C172 on the KSFO runway.
 There are other settings used to start Flightgear and
 prepare the scene. To replicate the same problem we need
 the entire setup for each screenshot. He never claimed
 that F3 was a custom screenshot
   button.
 That single your was a synthesis for Using just F3 as
 you
   said,
 and would be obvious to anyone using the English language
 regularly. Now, I am the first saying that English is not
 a very pretty language. But it is effective in helping
 communication, because compared to most other options it
 is fairly easy to
  learn.
 It still baffles me that there are people working with
 computers around the globe that stubbornly refuse to even
 attempt to learn
  a
 little English out of pure campanilism.

 --
 Date: Thu, 2 May 2013 02:00:29 +0200
 From: hohora...@gmail.com mailto:hohora...@gmail.com
 To: flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
   mailto:flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net

 Subject: Re: [Flightgear-devel] Atmospheric Light
 Scattering

 Arnt

 Oh sorry , i  thought you were using FG for years.
 I know at the beginning we could have some problem.


 NO it is not MY F3 KEY it is an FG feature Key.


 Just look at the fgdata/keyboard.xml  content.

 you will notice at the line 1134
 the key
  key n=259
   nameF3/name
   descCapture screen/desc

 That file is very useful to understand what are the
 specific keys within FG.

 That is.

 Ahmad


 On 2 May 2013 00:39, Arnt Karlsen a...@iaksess.no
   mailto:a...@iaksess.no wrote:

 On Wed, 1 May 2013 16:59:41 +0200, grtuxhangar wrote in
 message

   
   CAFEVUtAcO--uEpj+vDHCG4k=q0lktoweqnr2avdx+8gshhz...@mail.gmail.commailto:
  q0lktoweqnr2avdx%2b8gshhz...@mail.gmail.com:

  Arnst

Re: [Flightgear-devel] Atmospheric Light Scattering

2013-05-02 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Thu, 02 May 2013 16:17:17 -0500, Saikrishna wrote in message 
5182d7dd.9040...@gmail.com:

 He's asking you from what view you take the screenshot. Do you take
 it in the fly-by view? Do you take it in the model view? What is the 
 zoom/FOV that you use?
 
 There are several ways/views from which I can take a screenshot of a 
 Boeing 777. I can take it from the model view, where I'm positioned 
 right behind and above the plane with a zoom/FOV of 40. I can take it 
 from the co-pilot's seat looking at the cockpit panel. I can take it 
 from a passenger seat looking at the left wing.

..and, you can use e.g. these command line options to aim your 
FG screenshot camera: 
 --fov=degreesSpecify field of view angle
...
 --lon=degreesStarting longitude (west = -)
 --lat=degreesStarting latitude (south = -)
 --altitude=value Starting altitude
(in feet unless --units-meters
specified) 
 --heading=degreesSpecify heading (yaw) angle (Psi)
 --roll=degrees   Specify roll angle (Phi)
 --pitch=degrees  Specify pitch angle (Theta)

..'fgfs -v -h |less ' for a full list, there's probably a way to
use --prop:[type:]name=value to start FG paused, but I'm running
an improvised desktop box now with a disk from a dead laptop that 
used X.org's radeon driver set up for its 256MB 128bit pcie ATI 
FireGL V5200, on a much older 128MB 64bit pci ATI Radeon 9250, 
which doesn't work with firmware for the V5200.


-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

--
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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Atmospheric Light Scattering

2013-05-01 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Wed, 1 May 2013 14:00:03 +0200, grtuxhangar wrote in message 
cafevutcj5zknsb+l4_75ea85br-mswbel8zyci08s_n45xr...@mail.gmail.com:

 Arnt,
 
 I could not answer  that question

..those are 2 questions on the same thing, #1
 ..yes?  I'd like to see the commandlines and

..#2:
 menu options you used to create these screenshots

..#3 is why I wand your answer(s): 
 so we can try reproduce them.

..this is my _guess_:
 This _may_ e.g. be a driver bug on only your box.
 
 Here you will find both files content which answer your request:
 https://sites.google.com/site/grtuxhangarctd/other-download/.fgfsrc

..so if I enter those command line options and have exactly the same
models and exactly the same scenery and exactly the same sim weather,
I should see exactly the same thing and be able to make exactly the 
same screen shots.

..an easier way is, specify everything, e.g. ... 
--on-ground  Start at ground level (default)
--in-air Start in air (implied when using
--altitude)

...and then your time options and your specific Initial 
Position and Orientation: options, e.g.   
--runway=rwy_no  Specify starting runway (must also 
specify an airport)
... or directly with e.g. these:
--lon=degreesStarting longitude (west = -)
--lat=degreesStarting latitude (south = -)
--altitude=value Starting altitude
(in feet unless --units-meters
specified) 
--heading=degreesSpecify heading (yaw) angle (Psi) 
--roll=degrees   Specify roll angle (Phi)
--pitch=degrees  Specify pitch angle (Theta)

..these options can be put in your various screenshot .fgfsrc,
you may e.g. want one for each test case.  And, I can see a 
use for a --startup-paused option, to make screenshots.


 which point to the following
 https://sites.google.com/site/grtuxhangarctd/other-download/preferences-devel.xml
 You can notice that last one is situated within the HOME .fgfs
 directory
 
 These two files refer to our community/team mainframe  which is being
 used to develop our FG models.
 The screenshots are made with it.



 By the way the multi core systems is not used by FlightGear , since
 only OSG can use it ( unfortunately wrongly at least within FG ).
 
 If you are ONLY running FlightGear with your computer you don't need a
 multi core, there won't be any profit.

..I disagree, IME I'm still able to recover 
my boxes when FG hangs or tries frying cpu.

 Multi core is only useful if you are  working  on other developments
 (which explain our equipment).
 
 
 Hope it answer your question.
 
 Kind regard
 
 Ahmad
 
 
 
 On 30 April 2013 15:06, Arnt Karlsen a...@iaksess.no wrote:
 
  On Tue, 30 Apr 2013 14:24:42 +0200, grtuxhangar wrote in message
  CAFEVUtBb=gxvwqaak1u7zzssgn26ndx88zbmg8+5sp1kdi-...@mail.gmail.com:
 
   Hello everybody
  
   Well, let's come to some example, then the users could appreciate
  
   There, a lot of snapshots i have just received from David (one of
   our team's member)
   Those snapshots were done with FG Git, and France 850 Scenery.
   Only the vegetation is being an old one , since getting some
   trouble with the last version.
   The computer is a mainframe with 2 Nvidia cards SLI Architecture
   GPU   geforce GTX 560 ti CUDA Cores:448
 
  ..mainframe???  Details, please.
 
   NV Driver 319.12
 
  ..which NV 319.12 driver?
 
   Starting with FG snapshots Without ALS and With Rembrandt
 
  ..yes?  I'd like to see the commandlines and menu options you
  used to create these screenshots so we can try reproduce them.
  This _may_ e.g. be a driver bug on only your box.
 
 
  ..only these 2 screenshots are directly comparable to
  the 3 test cases you present, so I'd like to see your
  Without ALS and With Rembrandt version of these 2:
   Now FG snapshots Without ALS and Without Rembrandt
  
  
  https://sites.google.com/site/grtuxhangarctd/other-download/P-38_demo2.png
 
   Now, sorry, FG snapshots With ALS and Without Rembrandt
  
  https://sites.google.com/site/grtuxhangarctd/other-download/P-38_demo1.png
 
  ..2(?) years back, I was the only one here to see all pitch
  black aircraft with ATI Radeon cards on X.org radeon drivers.
 
   Who said we don't need  a specific version when using ALS ?
  
   BTW We had to search for a  place were we could load Model with
   ALS You probably notice, it is the P-38L model, to fly with
   Rembrandt or Without Rembrandt
   ONLY one model to load  :) .
   Sorry it is not ALS Compliant.
 
  ..are there other ALS-non-compliant models?
 
   We have not chosen the most beautiful one it is only an example.
  
  
   You may want to take acknowledge of  some snapshots done with
   Rembrandt , part of the grtux_hangar related.
  
   there the link
   https://picasaweb.google.com/117502256492585017152
 
  ..does any of these compare the ALS vs Rembrandt vs default etc test

Re: [Flightgear-devel] Atmospheric Light Scattering

2013-05-01 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Wed, 1 May 2013 16:59:41 +0200, grtuxhangar wrote in message 
CAFEVUtAcO--uEpj+vDHCG4k=q0lktoweqnr2avdx+8gshhz...@mail.gmail.com:

 Arnst
 
 
 you wrote
 
  menu options you used to create these screenshots
 
 ..#3 is why I wand your answer(s):
  so we can try reproduce them.
 
 I am not  sure i understand your question :
 
 You want to know how does the screenshots were done ?
 
 I gave you the answer before
 
 Just   USE== F3 key===,  no menu , not any others tools,
 that's done.

..your F3 key gives me the C172 on the active runway at KSFO. 

..so, my question is, how do you set up your FG screenshot scene, 
_before_ you use the F3 button to take the screenshot?

 On 1 May 2013 15:43, Arnt Karlsen a...@iaksess.no wrote:
 
  On Wed, 1 May 2013 14:00:03 +0200, grtuxhangar wrote in message
  cafevutcj5zknsb+l4_75ea85br-mswbel8zyci08s_n45xr...@mail.gmail.com:

   Here you will find both files content which answer your request:
   https://sites.google.com/site/grtuxhangarctd/other-download/.fgfsrc
 
  ..so if I enter those command line options and have exactly the same
  models and exactly the same scenery and exactly the same sim
  weather, I should see exactly the same thing and be able to make
  exactly the same screen shots.
 
  ..an easier way is, specify everything, e.g. ...
  --on-ground  Start at ground level (default)
  --in-air Start in air (implied when using
  --altitude)
 
  ...and then your time options and your specific Initial
  Position and Orientation: options, e.g.
  --runway=rwy_no  Specify starting runway (must also
  specify an airport)
  ... or directly with e.g. these:
  --lon=degreesStarting longitude (west = -)
  --lat=degreesStarting latitude (south = -)
  --altitude=value Starting altitude
  (in feet unless --units-meters
  specified)
  --heading=degreesSpecify heading (yaw) angle (Psi)
  --roll=degrees   Specify roll angle (Phi)
  --pitch=degrees  Specify pitch angle (Theta)
 
  ..these options can be put in your various screenshot .fgfsrc,
  you may e.g. want one for each test case.  And, I can see a
  use for a --startup-paused option, to make screenshots.

-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

--
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Re: [Flightgear-devel] I need a tiny bit of help if possible.

2013-04-30 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Tue, 30 Apr 2013 07:02:52 +0100, Alex wrote in message 
dub122-ds225618437bfa38b6caf244de...@phx.gbl:

 Hello there,
 
  
 
 In the http://wiki.flightgear.org/Howto:Set_up_a_multiplayer_server
 article/page.
 
  
 
 I found on this line in the CompilingFGMS section:
 
  
 
 Once the program has been installed, you need to copy the
 fgms_example.conf file from the /fgms/fgms-0-x/src/server directory,
 into the build-fgms directory. To do this from inside
 the /fgms/fgms-0-x/src/server directory, you can use this command:
 cp ./fgms_example.conf ~/build-fgms/


 I do exactly what the tutorial says, but I get stuck when it gets to
 fgms_example.conf, which I can't find in the directory that it says
 its in.
 
  
 
 Could you please help me? Also, Do servers have to be on a specific
 port?
 
..if you have ssh on your server-box, try:
scp fgms_example.conf user@server-box:/path/ 

..other ideas: netcat, ftp or just type it in from ssh,
many ways to skin this cat.

-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

--
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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Atmospheric Light Scattering

2013-04-30 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Tue, 30 Apr 2013 14:24:42 +0200, grtuxhangar wrote in message 
CAFEVUtBb=gxvwqaak1u7zzssgn26ndx88zbmg8+5sp1kdi-...@mail.gmail.com:

 Hello everybody
 
 Well, let's come to some example, then the users could appreciate
 
 There, a lot of snapshots i have just received from David (one of our
 team's member)
 Those snapshots were done with FG Git, and France 850 Scenery.
 Only the vegetation is being an old one , since getting some trouble
 with the last version.
 The computer is a mainframe with 2 Nvidia cards SLI Architecture
 GPU   geforce GTX 560 ti CUDA Cores:448

..mainframe???  Details, please.

 NV Driver 319.12

..which NV 319.12 driver?
 
 Starting with FG snapshots Without ALS and With Rembrandt

..yes?  I'd like to see the commandlines and menu options you 
used to create these screenshots so we can try reproduce them.
This _may_ e.g. be a driver bug on only your box.


..only these 2 screenshots are directly comparable to 
the 3 test cases you present, so I'd like to see your 
Without ALS and With Rembrandt version of these 2:
 Now FG snapshots Without ALS and Without Rembrandt
 
 https://sites.google.com/site/grtuxhangarctd/other-download/P-38_demo2.png

 Now, sorry, FG snapshots With ALS and Without Rembrandt
 https://sites.google.com/site/grtuxhangarctd/other-download/P-38_demo1.png

..2(?) years back, I was the only one here to see all pitch 
black aircraft with ATI Radeon cards on X.org radeon drivers.

 Who said we don't need  a specific version when using ALS ?
 
 BTW We had to search for a  place were we could load Model with ALS
 You probably notice, it is the P-38L model, to fly with Rembrandt or
 Without Rembrandt
 ONLY one model to load  :) .
 Sorry it is not ALS Compliant.

..are there other ALS-non-compliant models?
 
 We have not chosen the most beautiful one it is only an example.
 
 
 You may want to take acknowledge of  some snapshots done with
 Rembrandt , part of the grtux_hangar related.
 
 there the link
 https://picasaweb.google.com/117502256492585017152

..does any of these compare the ALS vs Rembrandt vs default etc test 
cases?  All I've seen there this far, are pretty screenshots. 

 All the best to FG Community
 
 Ahmad
 
 
 


-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

--
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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Atmospheric Light Scattering

2013-04-25 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Thu, 25 Apr 2013 06:24:41 +, Renk wrote in message 
e495a106ff5f31448739e79d34138c192a740...@mbs4.ad.jyu.fi:

 
 Hi Henri,
 
  However your approach is questionable.

..Stefan addressed this properly. ;o)

 Please... can we keep some basic fairness and decency here?

..yes, but we also need some patience with non-native English 
writers who _should_ include their French etc original so we 
don't get people wound up on questionable translations of things 
that may warrant discussion. 

-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

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[Flightgear-devel] ..is defusedxml useful in FG? Provides another way of memory protection.

2013-04-19 Thread Arnt Karlsen
Hi,

..is defusedxml useful in FG?  Provides another way to 
protect memory, summary of wishlist bug #705691:
http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=705691
Package: wnpp
Severity: wishlist
Owner: Luke Faraone lfara...@debian.org

* Package name: defusedxml
  Version : 0.4.1
  Upstream Author : Christian Heimes christ...@python.org
* URL : https://pypi.python.org/pypi/defusedxml
* License : Python
  Programming Lang: Python
  Description : XML bomb protection for Python stdlib modules

The results of an attack on a vulnerable XML library can be fairly
dramatic. With just a few hundred bytes of XML data an attacker can
occupy several gigabytes of memory within seconds. An attacker can also
keep CPUs busy for a long time with a small to medium size request.

This library allows for XML to be parsed in a manner that avoids these
pitfalls.

-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

--
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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Translations

2013-04-06 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Thu, 4 Apr 2013 10:39:12 -0500, Saikrishna wrote in message 
cabi0mt4ifu7gj1itjxx7zsyuk-ucxwaxrjwgvxivbxy7kpv...@mail.gmail.com:

 So the XML files cannot be converted to PO/POT?

..the issue here is legal, GPL files _cannot_ be converted to any 
BSD license, that would be a copyright violation, software piracy. 

..going the oposite way, BSD-GPL is often possible, exactly because 
the BSD licenses are less restricitive than the GPL licenses.

 What if the headings (the XML tags in this case) were taken from the
 file and used in the translation files? But then it would probably
 still be under the GPL license.

..correct, if you lose probably to say But then it would 
still be under the GPL license.

..of course if you yourself wrote or bought and owns the file in
question, you also decide under which licenses you publish it.

-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

--
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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Kinect for pc for head tracking?

2013-03-19 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Sun, 17 Mar 2013 12:33:13 +, Alasdair wrote in message 
5145b809.9040...@btinternet.com:

 On reflection, I must apologise to Arnt for my inappropriately rough 
 choice of words.

..my delay forgiving you was part doing some R/C gear range tests,
part finishing 2 planes and part missing I lost my net link. :o)

 I suspect you may more a comedian than a fool..

..hum, I'm going to hear that a lot more if things work the way 
I want them to... ;o)

 Sorry Arnt.
 
 AC

..no problem. :o)

-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

--
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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Kinect for pc for head tracking?

2013-03-16 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Sat, 16 Mar 2013 01:17:41 -0700, Zhitao wrote in message 
001a01ce221e$bbcde800$3369b800$@gmail.com:

 Thanks Alan.
 
 It's funny that you are able to tell English is not my first
 language. :) Believe me I tried my best to hide that.

..one problem with that, is you trick people into assuming a 
lot of cultural things that lead to misunderstandings, your
otherwise excellent English language post _could_ come across 
as e.g. a Microsoft shill or FlightSimPro trying to cover-up 
code theft or trying to frame GPL or FlightGear code as stolen 
from Microsoft or somesuch, http://groklaw.net/ has covered
this kinda cases for 10 years now, and all it really takes, is
someone here like Thorsten Renk having a bad day.

..if you had e.g. pasted in your (Han Chinese?) original draft, 
we would immediately know English is not your Native language, 
and read it with the appropriate tolerance filters.


-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Kinect for pc for head tracking?

2013-03-15 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Fri, 15 Mar 2013 01:48:33 -0700, Zhitao wrote in message 
000601ce2159$e149f710$a3dde530$@gmail.com:

 Hi,
 
  
 
 I understand some of the reasons why Flightgear is hesitating to use
 trackir in the game, now Kinect sensor is available for PC, and it is
 far more powerful than the trackir, and with a more open SDK and
 license.

..I can easily see the licensing problems, FG is GPLv2.

..but how is it more powerful?  What TrackIR does: ...
http://www.naturalpoint.com/trackir/02-products/product-how-TrackIR-works.html

...can be done externally with a webcamera and GPLv3 code:
http://info.ee.surrey.ac.uk/Personal/Z.Kalal/tld.html
http://libccv.org/post/ccv-now-has-a-state-of-art-tracking-algorithm/

..or hacked in from FG compatible GPLv2-and-later code:
http://www.lavrsen.dk/foswiki/bin/view/Motion/TrackingControl
http://www.lavrsen.dk/foswiki/bin/view/Motion/MotionOverview
http://www.lavrsen.dk/foswiki/bin/view/Motion/MotionDetectionSettings

..I dunno these guys, but they too discuss this, 
and I'm gone flying on the fjord ice. ;o):
http://www.societyofrobots.com/programming_computer_vision_tutorial_pt4.shtml


 Which makes me wonder if anyone in the Flightgear core
 development is willing to consider using the Kinect for the head
 tracking in Flightgear. After all, head tracking is one of the most
 important aspect of flight sim.
 
  
 
 I am very interested in everyone's opinions, not just for Kinect with
 Flightgear, but also other means of head movement tracking.

..why stop there? ;o)

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...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
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  best case, worst case, and just in case.

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Advanced Weather updates

2013-03-03 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Sun, 3 Mar 2013 10:29:35 -, Vivian wrote in message 
000301ce17fa$0169d920$043d8b60$@lineone.net:

 Well gitorious is good for something! The patches still exist! I've
 put them here if anyone wants to do something with them:
 
 https://www.dropbox.com/home/Public/Patches/MoveModels

..do you have an e.g. gitorius url for these?  
Dropbox requires signing up for an account and that I|we run 
a binary blob as a deamon to watch my dropbox folder that 
I|we may not try to reverse-engineer, AFAIU their TOS at
https://www.dropbox.com/terms ,  maybe the reason nobody has 
done anything with your patches.
 
 They worked, and have no bugs that I'm aware of. They were rejected
 it was alleged that there are ways of doing it better, but no one
 could be bothered to actually do the necessary work.  I don't know if
 they still apply. 
 
 Vivian

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] How to get my bug fix into the git?

2013-03-01 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Fri, 1 Mar 2013 02:14:59 -0700, Zhitao wrote in message 
004601ce165d$409a80c0$c1cf8240$@gmail.com:

 Hi everyone,
 
  
 
 I am new to the FlightGear project, I just found and fixed my first
 bug, I am wondering how to get my fix into the main git next branch?

..you put it here?: https://code.google.com/p/flightgear-bugs/

..attach your patch to your message, or to your bug report.

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...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
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  best case, worst case, and just in case.

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] YouTube

2013-02-28 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Wed, 27 Feb 2013 19:13:16 -0800, gabe wrote in message 
CA+rqJ2psOqLDGMtL7dEKus=bxxcqak1dqr61vj8ia+_pnt-...@mail.gmail.com:

 Dear Flightgear developers,
 
 I am starting a youtube channel and was hoping that you would kindly
 grant me permission to post videos of Flightgear on my channel. 

..url? 

 I don't discourage people from getting it, but encourage them to find
 opensource alternatives, such as Flightgear. Thank you for your help,
 and I hope you have a great day!
 
 Thanks for the great game,
 


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...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
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  best case, worst case, and just in case.

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Flightgear-devel Digest, Vol 82, Issue 19

2013-02-27 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Wed, 27 Feb 2013 06:14:12 -0800 (PST), geneb wrote in message 
alpine.lfd.2.03.1302270609420.21...@deltasoft.com:

 On Wed, 27 Feb 2013, BARANGER Emmanuel wrote:
 
 
  And then FX X is dead. It no longer exists. If you compare, do it
  with what exists. Xplane 10 (64 bit) or Prepar3D, this is the
  surviving of FS X (production of Lockheed Martin)
 
 While your diatribe makes ZERO sense to me, you're incorrect that
 FSX is dead. 

..I thought Microsoft end-lifed it?

 It's still being sold (you can buy brand new copies
 from Amazon, right now) and it's still heavily supported by the
 third-party developer community.

..yes, but not by Microsoft?

 The geneology(sp!) of FSX goes like this:
 
 ESP - FSX
  |
  - Prepar3D



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  best case, worst case, and just in case.

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] interface flightgaer with vb

2013-02-25 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Sun, 24 Feb 2013 22:09:58 -0800 (PST), Michael wrote in message 
1361772598.56473.yahoomailclas...@web140206.mail.bf1.yahoo.com:

 --- On Mon, 2/25/13, akram mohammed akramka...@hotmail.com wrote:
 
 i need help how to interface flightgear with visual basic gui
 project ,

..that would make it Microsoft-_only_, you wanna do something 
that's usable by us all, regardless of operatingsystems, etc?

 like starting engine and landing gear from vb,in detail because i
 am beginner.

..the GUIs we have are, fgrun, fgo, fgx (did I miss any?) that will
set up a flightgear startup commandline.  

..another option you wanna try, is e.g. --httpd= and then point 
a web browser to http://127.0.0.1: and use that to do the things 
you propose, in FG's property tree published on --httpd=, you
can even put it an your lan or out on the web and have people fly
your FG, and even show them what's going on thru the --jpg-httpd=port
screen shot server, or use the jpgs to build a movie.

..ofcourse it is possible to write a gui program that uses http
polls to do the web browser job, in a much more intuitive way.

 It's all in C++. Either try that or do some easy beginner stuff in VB
 alike a clock etc. :-)

..if you do it in C++, you also fairly quickly become a useful 
flightgear developer.

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] download_and_compile w, x and v options

2013-02-24 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Sun, 24 Feb 2013 13:44:54 -0500, Pat wrote in message 
20130224134454.6bd9636c@spinnaker:

 Here are two patches and a combined patch for both.
 These patches include changes to the help.
 
 patch-1.9-8-xv.patch adds the x and v options for debugging.  
 
 patch-1.9-8-w.patch adds the w option, w standing for Where to Build
 
 patch-1.9-8-wxv.patch combines both changes.

..alongside those, I like to see _what_ I build|t _when_, so I
auto-rename my logs, and I believe -s should build 2.10 now:
arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ ll download_and_compile-1.9-8a.patch \
md5sum download_and_compile-1.9-8a.patch 
-rw-r--r-- 1 arnt arnt 1441 Feb 24 23:24
download_and_compile-1.9-8a.patch 
a342d108f121322f076ef7de063ab1e4  download_and_compile-1.9-8a.patch
arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ 

 I'm in the process of working out how to do a variety of builds
 for testing the download and compile script.  The x and v options help
 in that regard.  
 
 The w option allows me to test different download_and_compile builds
 with different options in different directories from a single copy of
 download_and_compile.sh
 
 Like so:
 
 download_and_compile.sh -w master ALL 
 download_and_compile.sh -w master_e -e ALL # new event model
 download_and_compile.sh -w master_r -r ALL # openrti
 download_and_compile.sh -w master_er -er ALL # both
 
 However just using a different directory is a bit inefficient.  It
 results in multiple copies of git that are separate clones of the
 gitorious repository.
 
 Anders made a suggestion on IRC I'm going to follow up on.  You can
 have local git clones that share the same .git/* files via file links

..you feed 4 build trees from 1 git clone, how?  
A du -sch $git-n-build-trees on them all?  

 I think that means we could have several local clones of a single
 local git repository.  The various local clones would support building
 multiple branches and  versions, without having to sync each clone
 independently with gitorious.

..you only do an e.g. git branch 2.10 ;git checkout, 
and no git pull???

 The script would still work just as well for someone who just wanted
 to compile a single version
 
 -Pat
 
 Note for those reading on the devel list, the patches are based on
 download_and_compile.sh version 1.9-8, as of today, that's available
 from http://assistenza.larasrl.net/brisa/fgfs/download_and_compile.sh
 
 
 
 
 


-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.
--- download_and_compile-1.9-8.sh	2013-02-18 22:57:33.0 +0100
+++ download_and_compile-1.9-8a.sh	2013-02-22 20:56:26.878177657 +0100
@@ -18,7 +18,7 @@
 # along with this program.  If not, see http://www.gnu.org/licenses/.
 
 
-VERSION=1.9-8
+VERSION=1.9-8a
 
 #COMPILE GIT FGFS
 
@@ -35,6 +35,9 @@
 
 
 LOGFILE=compilation_log.txt
+# LOGFILE=compiled_$*_
+STTL=$(date +%F+%T-%Z )
+# WTL=$($* |tr [:blank:] + )
 LOGSEP=***
 
 WHATTOBUILD=
@@ -140,7 +143,7 @@
 OSG_STABLE_REVISION=http://www.openscenegraph.org/svn/osg/OpenSceneGraph/tags/OpenSceneGraph-3.0.1;
 
 # common stable branch for flightgear, simgear and fgdata
-FGSG_STABLE_GIT_BRANCH=release/2.8.0
+FGSG_STABLE_GIT_BRANCH=release/2.10.0
 FGRUN_STABLE_GIT_BRANCH=master
 OPENRTI_STABLE_GIT_BRANCH=release-0.3
 
@@ -151,9 +154,9 @@
 OPENRTI_UNSTABLE_GIT_BRANCH=master
 
 # stable GIT revision: release tag
-SIMGEAR_STABLE_REVISION=version/2.8.0-final
-FGFS_STABLE_REVISION=version/2.8.0-final
-FGFS_DATA_STABLE_REVISION=version/2.8.0-final
+SIMGEAR_STABLE_REVISION=version/2.10.0-final
+FGFS_STABLE_REVISION=version/2.10.0-final
+FGFS_DATA_STABLE_REVISION=version/2.10.0-final
 OPENRTI_STABLE_REVISION=OpenRTI-0.3.0
 
 # FGCOM
@@ -1506,7 +1509,7 @@
 	fi
 fi
 
-
+mv -vf $LOGFILE compiled_$WTL_$*_$STTL
 
 echo To start fgfs, run the run_fgfs.sh file
 echo To start terrasync, run the run_terrasync.sh file
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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Discussion culture clashes

2013-02-23 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Sat, 23 Feb 2013 07:13:21 +, Renk wrote in message 
e495a106ff5f31448739e79d34138c192789b...@mbs2.ad.jyu.fi:

..see?  Here you go again, snipping away too agressively, so
the pointer to my forgotten point, is lost.  Fix that. ;o)

  ..a point I forgot to make: you (or your MUA?) don't attribute
  properly what I wrote below, which may be part of the thread
  breaking problem.
 
 Arnt, you do know that 'you' in the English language doesn't
 necessarily refer to you personally, but that it doubles as an
 unspecified 'one'?

..true, and if I meant more than you Renk, I would have said 
(or your MUAs?). :o)  
On the other hand though, it _may_ be a combination of several 
peoples MUA configurations, or even a bug in my MUA that has 
been triggered by this thread.  Either way, I still need that 
pointer to your original message if you want me understanding
your point of view, so I asked because I saw more people might
have the same need and because we are in the same time zone.

 If I say 'If you don't understand, then do X' I mean 'Anyone who
 doesn't understand should do X'. So the remarks are pretty much
 addressed to anyone, including myself, certainly not to you
 personally. It occurred to me later that this feature of English
 might lead to trouble with some non-native speakers - sorry for any
 confusion.
 
 * Thorsten

.. :o)

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Discussion culture clashes

2013-02-22 Thread Arnt Karlsen
, there was an argument that  012345Z
 23010KT 5000 SHRA SCT012 BKN018 OVC060 15/11 Q1010 is wrongly
 interpreted because it comes out much darker than in 2.0.0 -
 illustrated with screenshots showing 3/8 cloud cover. The familiar
 trumps the correct, even given that 3/8 cloud cover is definitely not
 what the METAR says - it doesn't matter that we now have the correct
 cloud cover specified by the weather, it matters that it's no longer
 what is familiar, and this isn't the way to make an argument. Having
 z/Z control visibility because one is used to it is no argument for
 or against it. 
 
 The way I see it, arguments should be backed up with evidence. The
 memory consumption of loading 20 km (50 km, 100 km) of terrain is a
 number in a certain range - we don't need to toss concerns back and
 forth if we go ahead and measure the number, and we should base
 decisions on evidence rather than belief if we can get the evidence.
 
 I don't think these are grossly unreasonable foundations for
 meaningful, productive discussions. I'm not in a position to make
 anyone else adopt such standards as the goal for having a
 discussions, but could we perhaps give it a thought?
 
 * Thorsten

..ayup, and you should ask for possibly missing bits etc before 
you get annoyed, rather than get annoyed first and then ask. ;o)

-- 
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...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
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  best case, worst case, and just in case.

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Discussion culture clashes

2013-02-22 Thread Arnt Karlsen
 for all the nvidea
 people, and they can then take their time to try figure out how to 
 fix this properly once we the ATI viewport fix tested on the X.org 
 radeon etc free drivers too. 
 
  I'm even observing that any change is held to the
  standard of what was previously installed and is perceived wrong if
  different. In the forum, there was an argument that  012345Z
  23010KT 5000 SHRA SCT012 BKN018 OVC060 15/11 Q1010 is wrongly
  interpreted because it comes out much darker than in 2.0.0 -
  illustrated with screenshots showing 3/8 cloud cover. The familiar
  trumps the correct, even given that 3/8 cloud cover is definitely
  not what the METAR says - it doesn't matter that we now have the
  correct cloud cover specified by the weather, it matters that it's
  no longer what is familiar, and this isn't the way to make an
  argument. Having z/Z control visibility because one is used to it
  is no argument for or against it. 
  
  The way I see it, arguments should be backed up with evidence. The
  memory consumption of loading 20 km (50 km, 100 km) of terrain is a
  number in a certain range - we don't need to toss concerns back and
  forth if we go ahead and measure the number, and we should base
  decisions on evidence rather than belief if we can get the evidence.
  
  I don't think these are grossly unreasonable foundations for
  meaningful, productive discussions. I'm not in a position to make
  anyone else adopt such standards as the goal for having a
  discussions, but could we perhaps give it a thought?
  
  * Thorsten
 
 ..ayup, and you should ask for possibly missing bits etc before 
 you get annoyed, rather than get annoyed first and then ask. ;o)
 


-- 
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...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] CMake question simgear include option

2013-02-15 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Fri, 15 Feb 2013 08:48:59 +, James wrote in message 
954f9f95-7614-4c0e-a82f-3b589fa4e...@mac.com:

 
 On 14 Feb 2013, at 18:58, HB-GRAL flightg...@sablonier.ch wrote:
 
  With simple -DCMAKE_INSTALL_PREFIX it finds the custom location
  of the headers and libs without any other option, but when I add 
  -DSIMGEAR_INCLUDE_DIR=/path/to/include it takes the headers from
  this location, but not the libs anymore, it falls back to another
  simgear install on my system (which is in path). So I need to
  remove default simgear from my path, and then cmake works perfect.
  
  Sometimes I wonder with what things I can struggle with flightgear 
  compilation and why only ME have such problems. ;-)
 
 Avoid setting the include path directly, would be my advice.
 
 If you want to use different simgear builds, then keep the completely
 separate.
 
 Eg, I have:
 
   ~/FGFS/
   simgear
   flightgear

..these above (SGFG) are your one git source tree?

 
   fgBuild # configured with
 CMAKE_INSTALL_PREFIX=~/FGFS/dist sgBuild  # configured
 with CMAKE_INSTALL_PREFIX=~/FGFS/dist dist
 
   fgBuild2# configured with
 CMAKE_INSTALL_PREFIX=~/FGFS/dist2 sgBuilld2   # configured with
 CMAKE_INSTALL_PREFIX=~/FGFS/dist2 dist2

..and dist  dist2 are 2 separate build and install trees that 
you feed from your one git tree?

 And this works fine for me, the different diet trees can have totally
 different version / config options since there is no overlap at all.
 
 James

-- 
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...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] OSX 10.5 compilation

2013-02-14 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Wed, 13 Feb 2013 10:39:45 +, James wrote in message 
403c7d2a-377f-4f69-951d-7d574ba84...@mac.com:

 
 On 13 Feb 2013, at 10:05, ys flightg...@sablonier.ch wrote:
 
  Are you using a flag on jenkins shell or rb script I couldn't see
  and I need to take into account? should I try on another machine
  first ... Or is there some mystic endianess I should take into
  account for this first generation intel macs? I wonder that I had
  absolutely no problems with alut and 2.8 some months ago.
 
 If you're on Intel, and the 2.10 official release works, I am
 stumped. The code is /extremely/ simple - open file, read some bytes.
 There's no scripts or options or anything to control it, as far as I
 know.
 
 And there's no mystic endian-ness, and plenty of people on Linux use
 32-bit builds - so I really have no idea what might be going.
 
 Sorry, not helpful I realise.

..does it work in any of FreeBSD, NetBSD or OpenBSD?  
Those are the closest relatives to Apple's Mac OS X:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OS_X
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_OS_X
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OpenStep
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GNUstep


..finally, the problem _may_ be Apple policy, e.g. endlifing 
OS x 10.5 or expansion of iTunes style restrictions on 
unapproved apps, where e.g. FlightGear is NIH, after all,
Steve Jobs wanted nuclear war on Android:
http://www.google.com/search?q=%22Steve+Jobs%22+%22nuclear+war%22+android
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mobile_operating_system#Market_share
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Not_invented_here
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_Inc._litigation#Norwegian_Consumer_Council
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_Inc._litigation#Apple_v._Samsung:_Android_phones_and_tablets
http://www.groklaw.net/staticpages/index.php?page=AppleSamsung
http://www.groklaw.net/staticpages/index.php?page=AppleSamsung
http://www.groklaw.net/staticpages/index.php?page=20120817052356762

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...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
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  best case, worst case, and just in case.

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] ..bug, FG-2.10.0 make[2]: *** [utils/fgadmin/src/fgadmin] Error 1

2013-02-14 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Wed, 13 Feb 2013 08:24:05 +0100, Roland wrote in message 
511b3f95.8040...@mxchange.org:

 -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
 Hash: SHA1
 
 Undefined references are mostly linker problems. Please try to do a
 make distclean 

..like here?:
arnt@celsius:~/FG-git/fgfs/flightgear$ make distclean
make: *** No rule to make target `distclean'.  Stop.
arnt@celsius:~/FG-git/fgfs/flightgear$ cd -
/home/arnt/FG-git
arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ make distclean
make: *** No rule to make target `distclean'.  Stop.
arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ cd fgfs/
arnt@celsius:~/FG-git/fgfs$ make distclean
make: *** No rule to make target `distclean'.  Stop.
arnt@celsius:~/FG-git/fgfs$ 

..or the cmake(?) way: rm -Rvf build/fgfs ? 

 and reconfigure/compile. That usually helped here.
 
 Regards,
   Roland



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...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
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  best case, worst case, and just in case.

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Questions about download_and_compile.sh

2013-02-14 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Wed, 13 Feb 2013 21:34:50 -0500, Pat wrote in message 
20130213213450.239d3734@spinnaker:

  Questions for those familiar with cmake and download_and_compile.sh: 
 
 1.  Why does the download_and_compile script section for OSG, do
   cmake ../../OpenSceneGraph/ 
   without any options, followed immediately by 
 
   cmake -D CMAKE_BUILD_TYPE=Release \
   -D CMAKE_CXX_FLAGS=-O3 \
   -D__STDC_CONSTANT_MACROS \
   -D CMAKE_C_FLAGS=-O3 \
   -D CMAKE_INSTALL_PREFIX:PATH=$INSTALL_DIR_OSG \
   ../../OpenSceneGraph/
 
 2.  Why does download_and_compile build simgear and openrti from
   sources in simgear/simgear and openrti/openrti 
   while OpenSceneGraph is done from sources in OpenSceneGraph,
   without the extra sub-directory/folder.
 
 3.  Why does the script only do reconfigure 
   if the script is NOT running in update mode? Wouldn't you need
   to reconfigure if there were a new module?

..4. Has anyone managed to get the script to fetch updates 
with the -s (stable) switch?  (It should fetch bug fixes etc.)


-- 
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...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Autumn colors

2013-02-14 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Thu, 14 Feb 2013 10:17:13 +, Renk wrote in message 
e495a106ff5f31448739e79d34138c192789b...@mbs2.ad.jyu.fi:

 Just what is it you want to customize?
 
 Consider a simple 'snow in the mountains'. You can have
 
 * early snow up north, the leaves have just started turning and the
 snow is on slightly yellowish trees up the slopes, no snow on green
 trees down
 * one day later - a bit of snow is still on the ground but has
 dropped from the trees
 
 * late snow - no snow on either slopes or valleys, but all leaves
 have fallen
 
 * snowfall a while ago, then winds - snow on the ground both on the
 slopes and in the valley, but the wind has cleared the snow from the
 trees on the slopes 
 
 * fresh snowfall in midwinter - both ground and trees are snw covered
 
 (...) add your other 10 different combinations here

..the obvious way to control all this, is use e.g. FG time 
and METAR history to set up a credible scenery appearance.

-- 
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...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Autumn colors

2013-02-14 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Thu, 14 Feb 2013 13:01:58 +, Renk wrote in message 
e495a106ff5f31448739e79d34138c192789b...@mbs2.ad.jyu.fi:

  ..the obvious way to control all this, is use e.g. FG time

..to clarify FG time: what we set using FG's Time Options:

  and METAR history to set up a credible scenery appearance.
 
 Right, so we somehow get the METARs for the last month for a
 location, 

..from weather history databases, and not only METARs, 
e.g. http://om.yr.no/verdata/klimadata/ (or in googlish:
http://translate.google.com/translate?sl=autotl=enjs=nprev=_thl=enie=UTF-8eotf=1u=http%3A%2F%2Fom.yr.no%2Fverdata%2Fklimadata%2F
) 

..and more people are thinking this way, e.g.:
http://forums.vatsim.net/viewtopic.php?t=23335
 

 have the environment model run the consequences and use
 that. Sounds not so easy to me.

..no, but it's possible to shag in meteorologists here, best way 
is polish the build-from-source scripts and expand them beyond 
Debian and ubuntu users, most people are still using Wintendo, 
and today we only offer them the binaries, and the big scare.

..even if we have a sizable GNU/Linux crowd in e.g. yr.no, we 
don't wanna scare them off with POSIX sh, cvs, svn, git, gcc,
autotools, cmake _etc_, I want them diving right into the FG
weather model source trees and give us clue whacks.

 But... I never fly with real weather fetch, and I sometimes feel like
 flying in summer even when it's actually winter!

..I went for the real deal on the fjord ice, 5 cm snow on top 
of the ice, floats are nice skis. ;o)  I tested tufts to see 
stalls, worked nicely.  I use the big 7mm fluffy kinda wool 
yarn taped to the leading edge and stretched back to the 
trailing edge, that leaves it half way back onto the ailerons 
in flight.

-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

--
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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Autumn colors

2013-02-13 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Wed, 13 Feb 2013 08:17:32 +, Renk wrote in message 
e495a106ff5f31448739e79d34138c192789a...@mbs2.ad.jyu.fi:

  OK, now I understand. Here's a screenshot:
 
  https://dl.dropbox.com/u/57645542/fgfs-screen-099.png
 
  It's not good for UK - but I guess we can fix that eventually.
 
 
 Do you have any reference material how autumn/winter colors in the UK
 should look like?
 
 
  ..desert?  Severe drought?

..those were suggestions ;o), looked quite like the desert around 
In Amenas, Algeria, if I can believe the oily news pictures.

 -20 degrees, 10 cm snow - now remove the snow, and what is underneath
 will pretty much look like this - soil, dead branches, dead plants,
 decayed leaves. This is what the color is for - providing a plausible
 background for frost and snow patterns with incomplete cover of the
 ground (which look silly superimposed on bright breen fields).

..maybe in the old days, nowadays, some grass is green, most 
of it, say 4/5 is a pale dull yellow when the snow comes.
Climate change, grass grows about 3 months longer now, than 
in the 1960-ies when grass was cut once, nowadays farmers get 
3 harvests.

-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

--
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Re: [Flightgear-devel] getting the latest download_and_compile.sh

2013-02-12 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Tue, 12 Feb 2013 06:59:52 -0500, Pat wrote in message 
20130212065952.2995aaff@spinnaker:

  
 
 http://www.gitorious.org/fg/fgmeta/blobs/raw/master/download_and_compile.sh
 
 this retrieves version 1.9.4

..nope, 1.9-4 last time I chkd.

 replacing master with next gets version 1.4
 
 Is there a way to wget 1.9.6?

..1.9-6, at the Mirror site:, e.g. with: 'wget -c \
http://assistenza.larasrl.net/brisa/fgfs/download_and_compile.sh '

-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

--
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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Autumn colors

2013-02-12 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Tue, 12 Feb 2013 22:08:54 -, Vivian wrote in message 
000301ce096d$8bf3d0a0$a3db71e0$@lineone.net:
 
 OK, now I understand. Here's a screenshot:
 
 https://dl.dropbox.com/u/57645542/fgfs-screen-099.png
 
 It's not good for UK - but I guess we can fix that eventually.

..desert?  Severe drought?

-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

--
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[Flightgear-devel] ..bug, FG-2.10.0 make[2]: *** [utils/fgadmin/src/fgadmin] Error 1

2013-02-12 Thread Arnt Karlsen
Hi,

..openrti-0.3 and SG-2.10.0 builds fine, FG-2.10.0 fails here:
[ 96%] Built target UGsmooth
[ 96%] Built target FGAdminUI
Linking CXX executable fgadmin
/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libfltk.a(Fl_Preferences.o):function
Fl_Plugin_Manager::load(char const*): error: undefined reference 
to 'dlopen' 
collect2: error: ld returned 1 exit status 
make[2]: *** [utils/fgadmin/src/fgadmin] Error 1 
make[1]: *** [utils/fgadmin/src/CMakeFiles/fgadmin.dir/all] 
Error 2 make: *** [all]
Error 2 [  1%] Built target fgjs
[  1%] Built target js_demo
[  6%] Built target yasim
[ 12%] Built target yasim-proptest
[ 27%] Built target JSBSim
[ 89%] Built target fgfs
[ 89%] Built target metar
[ 89%] Built target terrasync
[ 95%] Built target fgviewer
[ 95%] Built target fgelev
[ 95%] Built target GPSsmooth
[ 95%] Built target MIDGsmooth
[ 96%] Built target UGsmooth
[ 96%] Built target FGAdminUI
Linking CXX executable fgadmin
/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libfltk.a(Fl_Preferences.o):function
Fl_Plugin_Manager::load(char const*): error: undefined reference to
'dlopen' collect2: error: ld returned 1 exit status 
make[2]: *** [utils/fgadmin/src/fgadmin] Error 1 
make[1]: *** [utils/fgadmin/src/CMakeFiles/fgadmin.dir/all] Error 2
make: *** [all] Error 2 

..'dpkg -l |grep fltk ' on http://pastie.org/6147410 ,
arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ dpkg -l |grep fltk |fmt -tu
ii fltk1.1-doc 1.1.10-14 all Fast Light Toolkit - documentation
ii fltk1.3-doc 1.3.0-8 all Fast Light Toolkit - documentation
ii fltk1.3-games 1.3.0-8 amd64 Fast Light Toolkit - example games:
   checkers, sudoku
ii libfltk-cairo1.3:amd64 1.3.0-8 amd64 Fast Light Toolkit - Cairo
   rendering layer support
ii libfltk-forms1.3:amd64 1.3.0-8 amd64 Fast Light Toolkit - Forms
   compatibility layer support
ii libfltk-gl1.3:amd64 1.3.0-8 amd64 Fast Light Toolkit - OpenGL
   rendering support
ii libfltk-images1.3:amd64 1.3.0-8 amd64 Fast Light Toolkit - image
   loading support
ii libfltk1.1:amd64 1.1.10-14 amd64 Fast Light Toolkit - shared
libraries rc libfltk1.1-dev 1.1.10-14 amd64 Fast Light Toolkit -
development files ii libfltk1.3:amd64 1.3.0-8 amd64 Fast Light Toolkit
- main shared library ii libfltk1.3-compat-headers 1.3.0-8 all Fast
Light Toolkit - compatibility header symlinks
ii libfltk1.3-dbg 1.3.0-8 amd64 Fast Light Toolkit - shared libraries
   with debugging symbols
ii libfltk1.3-dev 1.3.0-8 amd64 Fast Light Toolkit - development files
ii python-fltk 1.3.0-1 amd64 Python wrapper for the Fast Light Toolkit
ii python-fltk-dbg 1.3.0-1 amd64 Python wrapper for the Fast Light
   Toolkit - Debugging symbols
ii python-fltk-doc 1.3.0-1 all Documentation for pyFltk
arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ 


..full FG build log: http://pastie.org/6147206

..diff -u download_and_compile-1.9-6.sh download_and_compile.sh 
on http://pastie.org/6147347 ,  2.8.0-final became 2.10.0. ;o)

-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

--
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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Final release checklist

2013-02-11 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Mon, 11 Feb 2013 19:35:51 +0100, Torsten wrote in message 
51193a07.5060...@t3r.de:

 Hi all
 
 unless we don't have any major release blockers, we are going to
 release version 2.10 during the next weekend.
 
 So, if there is anything still overlooked, please shout out now.
 
 Do we have the latest getstart.pdf compiled and picked into the
 release branch?
 
 Anything else to think about?

..the ATI view-port hack, is it necessary with radeon drivers,
does it do harm with radeon drivers, and is there a commandline 
way to disable it?  It's on by default with radeon drivers.

..is --jpeg-factory still visible in fgfs -v -h when built 
without jpeg-factory?  Was visible in my working fgfs-2.11,
I don't remember whether the kinky FDMs were visible.

..is FG-2.10 being released with a 2.10 scenery, or are we 
re-using the 2.8 scenery?  
The 2.8 scenery works ok with fgfs-git/2.11.

..the Brisa script on the Primary site: download_and_compile.sh at
http://wiki.flightgear.org/Scripted_Compilation_on_Linux_Debian/Ubuntu
is version 1.9-4 and builds fgfs-2._8_ with the -s switch, and 2.8 
_is_ the latest stable release right now.  

..the Mirror: download_and_compile.sh is version 1.9-6, and 
should build the same version, AFAICT from my diff, but it 
has other fixes, Debian's libfltk1.1(-dev) is tossed for 
libfltk1.3(-dev), fgcom, and some clean-up around Atlas.

-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

--
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Re: [Flightgear-devel] FG Git compilation fail on Linux x86_64

2013-02-10 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Sun, 10 Feb 2013 02:32:32 +0100, Roland wrote in message 
5116f8b0.9070...@mxchange.org:

 -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
 Hash: SHA1
 
  
 
  ..how did you set the --jpeg-factory option???
  
 
 For SimGear:
 //Enable JPEG-factory support
 JPEG_FACTORY:BOOL=ON
 
 And FlightGear:
 //Set to ON to build FlightGear with JPEG-factory support
 JPEG_FACTORY:BOOL=ON
 
 You can find it in CMakeCache.txt.
 
 Roland

..thanks, I'm trying to get it working with the -O option,
diverse variants on -O=JPEG_FACTORY:BOOL=ON fails, is -O
a CMake-only option?  It does not work with -O-n, which is
make's  -n, --just-print, --dry-run, --recon
 Print the commands that would be executed, but do not
 execute them., according to man make.

-- 
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...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] ..I have openrti seen ok at build time but not at runtime?????, was: ..has anyone tried testing FG build scripts in fresh trees?

2013-02-10 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Sun, 10 Feb 2013 08:33:02 -0500, Pat wrote in message 
20130210083302.31853835@spinnaker:

 When I wrote that OpenRTI builds, I did not realize that
 download_and_compile.sh 1.9.4 will build OpenRTI even though the i
 option is not set. Without the i option, it never gets used. So forget
 anything I've said about this so far. 
 
 I'll send a note to Fancesco to add a condition 
  ! $WITH_OPENRTI =  

..frantastic. ;o)

 to the part of download_and_compile.sh that builds OpenRTI. 
 
 Meanwhile testing fresh builds continues on 32 bit Ubuntu 12.10
 
 rm -rf master/build

..a bit brutal, you probably mean build/openrti ?

 rm -rf master/install
 download_and_compile...

..and then a tree output so we can see how these should look?

-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] FG Git compilation fail on Linux x86_64

2013-02-10 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Sun, 10 Feb 2013 16:16:01 +, Kleo wrote in message 
bay146-w8ed9fcf93d9cfcbf62a28cc...@phx.gbl:

 
 Hello!
 I got another FG compiling error today, 

..which branch are you pulling now?

..I did my last next/2.11.0 build 5 minutes ago, using my 
non-svn version of download_and_compile.sh, built ok AFAICT, 
but bombs out on openRTI, Pat or Francesco may have a fix 
on the openRTI issue soon.

 this time at 36%, 

..to pinpoint things, I build with -J 1 to keep the exact 
same sequence, makes diffs much smaller and easier to read. 

 here is the
 output:
 
 ---
 [ 35%] Building CXX object
 src/Main/CMakeFiles/fgfs.dir/__/GUI/MapWidget.cxx.o [ 35%] Building
 CXX object src/Main/CMakeFiles/fgfs.dir/__/GUI/WaypointList.cxx.o
 [ 35%] Building CXX object
 src/Main/CMakeFiles/fgfs.dir/__/GUI/dialog.cxx.o [ 36%] Building CXX
 object
 src/Main/CMakeFiles/fgfs.dir/__/GUI/FGPUIDialog.cxx.o 
 /home/orpheus/flightgear/flightgear/src/GUI/FGPUIDialog.cxx:
 In member function 'puObject*
 FGPUIDialog::makeObject(SGPropertyNode*, int,
 int)': /home/orpheus/flightgear/flightgear/src/GUI/FGPUIDialog.cxx:1060:33:


..less -N fgfs/flightgear/src/GUI/FGPUIDialog.cxx and scrolling down:
1054 
1055 } else if (type == loglist) {
1056 LogList* obj = new LogList(x, y, width, height, 20);
1057 string logClass = props-getStringValue(logclass);
1058 if (logClass == terrasync) {
1059   simgear::SGTerraSync* tsync = (simgear::SGTerraSync*)
 globals-get_subsystem(terrasync); 
1060   obj-setBuffer(tsync-log()); 
1061 } else {
1062   FGNasalSys* nasal = (FGNasalSys*) 
globals-get_subsystem(nasal); 
1063  obj-setBuffer(nasal-log()); 
1064 }
1065 

..you have libsvn-dev?
arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ dpkg -l |grep libsvn |fmt -tu
ii libsvn-dev 1.7.5-1 amd64 Development files for Apache Subversion
   libraries
ii libsvn-perl 1.7.5-1 amd64 Perl bindings for Apache Subversion
ii libsvn1:amd64 1.7.5-1 amd64 Shared libraries used by Apache
Subversion arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ 

 error: 'class simgear::SGTerraSync' has no member named
 'log' /home/orpheus/flightgear/flightgear/src/GUI/FGPUIDialog.cxx: In
 member function 'virtual void
 LogList::update()': 
 /home/orpheus/flightgear/flightgear/src/GUI/FGPUIDialog.cxx:1527:30:
 error: 'class simgear::BufferedLogCallback' has no member named
 'stamp' /home/orpheus/flightgear/flightgear/src/GUI/FGPUIDialog.cxx:1528:51:
 error: void value not ignored as it ought to
 be /home/orpheus/flightgear/flightgear/src/GUI/FGPUIDialog.cxx: In
 member function 'void
 LogList::setBuffer(simgear::BufferedLogCallback*)': 
 /home/orpheus/flightgear/flightgear/src/GUI/FGPUIDialog.cxx:1538:25:
 error: 'class simgear::BufferedLogCallback' has no member named
 'stamp' make[2]: ***
 [src/Main/CMakeFiles/fgfs.dir/__/GUI/FGPUIDialog.cxx.o] Error 1
 make[1]: *** [src/Main/CMakeFiles/fgfs.dir/all] Error 2 make: ***
 [all] Error 2 --
 
 This occurs regardless if SP_FDMS is ON or OFF.

..ok.  How do you set SP_FDMS ON or OFF?

 Cheers
 /Klearchos
 -   

-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

--
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Re: [Flightgear-devel] FG Git compilation fail on Linux x86_64

2013-02-10 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Sun, 10 Feb 2013 18:38:53 +, Kleo wrote in message 
bay146-w48556e82b528ffd5c046c0cc...@phx.gbl:

 I use -j 5 since my i7 is a quadcore, but I can try with -j 1
 tomorrow and let you know of the outcome. 

..I use -j 1 _only_ to get rid of diff noise, anything higher 
will throw things around depending on how you move the mouse 
around, or which website you visit, etc, etc, but it makes 
_no_ difference to how things compile and break, AFAIK.

..an i7?  Try: 'grep ht /proc/cpuinfo |wc -l ' ;o)

-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] FG Git compilation fail on Linux x86_64

2013-02-09 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Fri, 8 Feb 2013 20:45:06 +, Kleo wrote in message 
bay146-w100e6899ae10b34c10ff8fcc...@phx.gbl:

 
 Hello!
 
 I just pulled FG Git for compiling and testing it. At first I tried
 with SP_FDMS, yet the build fails at 61%, giving me this output:
 
 
 [ 61%] Building CXX object
 src/Main/CMakeFiles/fgfs.dir/__/FDM/groundcache.cxx.o [ 61%] Building
 CXX object src/Main/CMakeFiles/fgfs.dir/__/FDM/SP/ACMS.cxx.o [ 61%]
 Building CXX object
 src/Main/CMakeFiles/fgfs.dir/__/FDM/SP/ADA.cxx.o 
 /home/orpheus/flightgear/flightgear/src/FDM/SP/ADA.cxx:
 In member function 'virtual void
 FGADA::init()': /home/orpheus/flightgear/flightgear/src/FDM/SP/ADA.cxx:190:42:
 error: 'printf' was not declared in this scope make[2]: ***
 [src/Main/CMakeFiles/fgfs.dir/__/FDM/SP/ADA.cxx.o] Error 1 make[1]:
 *** [src/Main/CMakeFiles/fgfs.dir/all] Error 2 make: *** [all] Error
 2 $

..exactly how did you try to do this compile?

 
 I then tried without SP_FDMS and the compilation fails at 98%, output
 follows:
 
 
 [ 98%] Built target fgpanel
 [ 98%] Building CXX object utils/fgai/CMakeFiles/fgai.dir/fgai.cxx.o
 /home/orpheus/flightgear/flightgear/utils/fgai/fgai.cxx: In function
 'int main(int,
 char**)': /home/orpheus/flightgear/flightgear/utils/fgai/fgai.cxx:532:59:
 error: 'EOF' was not declared in this
 scope /home/orpheus/flightgear/flightgear/utils/fgai/fgai.cxx:550:13:
 error: 'logbuf' has not been
 declared /home/orpheus/flightgear/flightgear/utils/fgai/fgai.cxx:551:13:
 error: 'logbuf' has not been declared make[2]: ***
 [utils/fgai/CMakeFiles/fgai.dir/fgai.cxx.o] Error 1 make[1]: ***
 [utils/fgai/CMakeFiles/fgai.dir/all] Error 2 make: *** [all] Error 2 $

..I too get this.  If you need FG right now for e.g. PPL training,
try mkdir -vp test-tree ;cd test-tree ;wget -c \
http://www.gitorious.org/fg/fgmeta/blobs/raw/master/download_and_compile.sh
chmod -x download_and_compile.sh  
sh download_and_compile.sh -s -a n -p n -j 2 ALL , -s should 
get you the last stable version, -a n -p n keeps Debian and
Ubuntu .deb packages away from your Gentoo box.


 System is a Gentoo Linux x86_64 system on an i7@2.8GHz, Nvidia
 GeForce GTX260, 12GB RAM. GCC ver. 4.5.4 Up to 3 weeks ago FG Git was
 compiling without errors, both with and without SP_FDMS. Let me know
 if you require more info! 
 
 Thanks for the help and the amazing work you all do! FG has helped me
 a lot in my PPL course! :)
 
 
 Best Regards,
 Klearchos (muadib25), SE-MUA.
 Sweden
 

-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] FG Git compilation fail on Linux x86_64

2013-02-09 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Sat, 09 Feb 2013 11:24:25 +, James wrote in message 
216ae244-fe2e-4304-9351-078fc5353...@mac.com:

 
 On 9 Feb 2013, at 11:16, Arnt Karlsen a...@c2i.net wrote:
 
  ..I too get this.  If you need FG right now for e.g. PPL training,
 
 If you are using FlightGear for anything serious,  you should't be
 doing so using 'next' which is unstable and may have temporarily
 broken features.
 
 The fgai issue, I believe Mathias has pushed a fix for, 

..yup, that compiles ok now.

 I'll take a look at the other failure now.

..how do I enable these and the --jpeg-factory with the
download_and_compile.sh script, can I do it with cmake 
arguments or do I need to edit cmake things? 

-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

--
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Re: [Flightgear-devel] FlightGear Jenkins Build win32 #926 and older quits

2013-02-09 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Sat, 9 Feb 2013 20:39:40 -, Vivian wrote in message 
01ce0705$9574e520$c05eaf60$@lineone.net:

 Heiko
 
  Today I wanted to test all the new things I missed in the last
  couple of weeks.
  So updated FGdata, and downloaded the last win32 build on the
  Jenkins build server.
  
  To my surprise, fgfs.exe quits when pressing the launch button in
  FGRun.

..exactly why does FGRun need FLTK 1.3 and FG FLTK 1.1???
These things may be related, I get FGRun build failures:
-- Found X11_Xft...
-- Using FLTK_LIBRARIES for fgrun:
fltk_images;fltk_forms;fltk_gl;/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libGL.so;fltk;/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libSM.so;/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libICE.so;/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libX11.so;/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libXext.so;/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libm.so;/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libXinerama.so;/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libXft.so
CMake Error at CMakeLists.txt:228 (message): 
FLTK 1.3 is required

..last time I tried build FG with FLTK 1.3 to keep FGRun happy, 
my FG build failed.

  The console only shows following strange error message as I haven't
  used no 
  aircraft with something like that:
  
  
  Failed to create alias
  at /controls[0]/refuelling[0]/refuelling-drogues-pos- norm
  [0]. Source /sim[0]/multiplay[0]/generic[0]/float[2] is already
  aliasing another
  property.
  Failed to set alias
  to /controls/refuelling/refuelling-drogues-pos-norm
  
  
  Setting log level to debug doesn't give anything, but setting to
  log-level bulk
  give me following:
  
  
  general:3:..\..\..\FlightGear\src\Main\main.cxx:311:FlightGear:
  Version unknown version
  general:3:..\..\..\FlightGear\src\Main\main.cxx:312:Built with
  Microsoft Visual C++ version 1600
  
  
  I used the latest win32 build #926, but also tried build numbers
  down to
 #920.
  None of them worked for me.
 
 I've just rebuilt SG/FG with MSVC10 using the up-to-date code with
 the same result: FG quits immediately
 
 Vivian  

-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] FG Git compilation fail on Linux x86_64

2013-02-09 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Sun, 10 Feb 2013 00:20:51 +0100, Roland wrote in message 
5116d9d3.6070...@mxchange.org:

 -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
 Hash: SHA1
 
 On 02/09/2013 11:59 PM, Arnt Karlsen wrote:
  On Sat, 09 Feb 2013 11:24:25 +, James wrote in message 
  216ae244-fe2e-4304-9351-078fc5353...@mac.com:
  
  
  On 9 Feb 2013, at 11:16, Arnt Karlsen a...@c2i.net wrote:
  
  ..I too get this.  If you need FG right now for e.g. PPL 
  training,
  
  If you are using FlightGear for anything serious,  you should't 
  be doing so using 'next' which is unstable and may have 
  temporarily broken features.
  
  The fgai issue, I believe Mathias has pushed a fix for,
  
  ..yup, that compiles ok now.
  
  I'll take a look at the other failure now.
  
  ..how do I enable these and the --jpeg-factory with the 
  download_and_compile.sh script, can I do it with cmake arguments
  or do I need to edit cmake things?
  
 I still have trouble:
 http://pastie.org/6106572

..duh!  Next time.  Thanks.  If you can live without --jpeg-factory
for a wee while, I have both SG and FG compiling ok tonight, except
it bombs out with arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ bash run_fgfs.sh \
--show-aircraft 
./fgfs: error while loading shared libraries: libRTI-NG.so.1: cannot
open shared object file: No such file or directory a
rnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ 

..how did you set the --jpeg-factory option???

-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

--
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[Flightgear-devel] ..missing ‘EOF’ declaration around fgfs/flightgear/utils/fgai/fgai.cxx:532:59: ?

2013-02-07 Thread Arnt Karlsen
Hi,

..looks like I was caught in the middle of something:
[ 97%] Building CXX object
utils/fgai/CMakeFiles/fgai.dir/HLAAircraftClass.cxx.o 
/home/arnt/FG-git/fgfs/flightgear/utils/fgai/fgai.cxx:
In function ‘int main(int, char**)’: 
/home/arnt/FG-git/fgfs/flightgear/utils/fgai/fgai.cxx:532:59:
error: ‘EOF’ was not declared in this scope

..I'm guessing the next 2 logbuf not declared messages, 
are consequenses from the above error. 
/home/arnt/FG-git/simgear/simgear

 FGFS **

flightgear exists already.
Already on 'next'
Already up-to-date.
[  0%] [  0%] Built target js_demo
Built target fgjs
[  5%] Built target yasim-proptest
[ 10%] Built target yasim
[ 10%] Built target metar
[ 11%] Built target terrasync
[ 27%] Built target JSBSim
[ 27%] [ 33%] Built target fgelev
Built target fgviewer
[ 33%] Built target GPSsmooth
[ 34%] Built target MIDGsmooth
[ 34%] Built target UGsmooth
[ 34%] Built target FGAdminUI
[ 34%] Building CXX object utils/fgai/CMakeFiles/fgai.dir/fgai.cxx.o
[ 96%] Built target fgfs
[ 97%] Built target fgadmin
[ 97%] Building CXX object
utils/fgai/CMakeFiles/fgai.dir/HLAAircraftClass.cxx.o 
/home/arnt/FG-git/fgfs/flightgear/utils/fgai/fgai.cxx: In function ‘int
main(int, char**)’: 
/home/arnt/FG-git/fgfs/flightgear/utils/fgai/fgai.cxx:532:59:
error: ‘EOF’ was not declared in this scope 
/home/arnt/FG-git/fgfs/flightgear/utils/fgai/fgai.cxx:550:13:
error: ‘logbuf’ has not been declared 
/home/arnt/FG-git/fgfs/flightgear/utils/fgai/fgai.cxx:551:13:
error: ‘logbuf’ has not been declared 
make[2]: *** [utils/fgai/CMakeFiles/fgai.dir/fgai.cxx.o] Error 1 
make[2]: *** Waiting for unfinished jobs 
make[1]: *** [utils/fgai/CMakeFiles/fgai.dir/all] Error 2 
make: *** [all] Error 2
[  0%] Built target fgjs 
[  0%] Built target js_demo 
[  5%] Built target yasim 
[ 10%] Built target yasim-proptest 
[ 26%] Built target JSBSim 
[ 88%] Built target fgfs
[ 88%] Built target metar
[ 89%] Built target terrasync
[ 95%] Built target fgviewer
[ 95%] Built target fgelev
[ 95%] Built target GPSsmooth
[ 96%] Built target MIDGsmooth
[ 96%] Built target UGsmooth
[ 96%] Built target FGAdminUI
[ 97%] Built target fgadmin
[ 97%] Building CXX object utils/fgai/CMakeFiles/fgai.dir/fgai.cxx.o
/home/arnt/FG-git/fgfs/flightgear/utils/fgai/fgai.cxx: In 
function ‘int main(int, char**)’: 
/home/arnt/FG-git/fgfs/flightgear/utils/fgai/fgai.cxx:532:59:
error: ‘EOF’ was not declared in this scope 
/home/arnt/FG-git/fgfs/flightgear/utils/fgai/fgai.cxx:550:13:
error: ‘logbuf’ has not been declared 
/home/arnt/FG-git/fgfs/flightgear/utils/fgai/fgai.cxx:551:13:
error: ‘logbuf’ has not been declared 
make[2]: *** [utils/fgai/CMakeFiles/fgai.dir/fgai.cxx.o] Error 1 
make[1]: *** [utils/fgai/CMakeFiles/fgai.dir/all] Error 2 
make: *** [all] Error 2
 
* FGO ** 



-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

--
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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Point release experiment

2013-02-06 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Wed, 06 Feb 2013 23:12:25 +, James wrote in message 
fa73c35d-94c2-4730-9715-96efe2ae9...@mac.com:

 (Following on from my previous email about Stuart's random-buildings
 commit)
 
 Many people have observed that FlightGear hits maximum quality in the
 weeks immediately following a release, since we have the maximum
 amount of feedback and testing from users. (And since most people
 don't look at RC builds until the are called final - though at least
 on Mac that's somewhat better this time around).
 
 Since the Mac release process is now 100% automated, I intend to try
 an experiment - once 2.10.0 is completely done, I'll cherry pick any
 commits I judge to be bug-fixes, or 100% safe improvements (such as
 Stuart's aforementioned fix) to the release branch, to become a
 2.10.1, and potentially 2.10.2 and so on.
 
 This is not an official plan, or a formal change to release plan,
 which I think works pretty well - and it's not something I want to
 commit too - I'm just curious what quality level could be achieved
 during the life-time of 2.10.0, by attempting this. If I get it
 completely wrong, and make a mess of the branch, it won't matter
 since we could always re-branch from the 2.10.0 tag.

...or from 2.10.666. ;o)  Go for it! :o)

-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

--
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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Two rendering issues

2013-02-05 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Tue, 5 Feb 2013 16:36:35 +0100, Arnt wrote in message 
20130205163635.762a1...@celsius.lan:

  Could the ATI hack have done something weird? Any ideas
 welcome, I have no good plan of attack for this yet.

..if you can tell me how to diable it, and enable it, I can 
tell you how both cases look on running the radeon driver.

..last time I saw FG flicker, I was pushing my Radeon 9250 too 
hard, 2048x1536x24(or32?)bpp@59.somethingHz, I had to back off
58.something to lose the flickering.

-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

--
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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Two rendering issues

2013-02-05 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Tue, 5 Feb 2013 16:49:44 +0100, Arnt wrote in message 
20130205164944.7c842...@celsius.lan:

 On Tue, 5 Feb 2013 16:36:35 +0100, Arnt wrote in message 
 20130205163635.762a1...@celsius.lan:
 
   Could the ATI hack have done something weird? Any ideas
  welcome, I have no good plan of attack for this yet.
 
 ..if you can tell me how to diable it, and enable it, 

...and preferrably from the commandline ;o)

 I can tell you how both cases look on running the radeon driver.

..er, once I have FG up from bash run_fgfs.sh --geometry=1600x1080 ,
do I have the ATI hack enabled, or disabled?  It looked funny, and
playing with the rendering and shader menus works, but I tried to 
pick a screen shot folder, I got these:
r300: ERROR: FS input WPOS unassigned, not enough hardware slots. (it's
not a bug, do not report it) 
run_fgfs.sh: line 5:  9713 Segmentation fault  ./fgfs
--fg-root=$PWD/../fgdata/ $@

[1]+  Exit 139bash run_fgfs.sh --geometry=1600x1080
arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ 

 ..last time I saw FG flicker, I was pushing my Radeon 9250 too 
 hard, 2048x1536x24(or32?)bpp@59.somethingHz, I had to back off
 58.something to lose the flickering.

..an error message suggestion: 
r300: ERROR: FS input WPOS unassigned, not enough hardware slots. (it's
not a bug, do not report it) # might read: it's not a FG bug, might be
hardware or graphics drivers?, to help build debug skills and help
debug non-FG errors that now deny us new FG developers.  




-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

--
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[Flightgear-devel] ..a wee airplane refuelling and drouge alias bug? Fixed?

2013-02-05 Thread Arnt Karlsen
Hi,

..a wee airplane refuelling and drouge alias bug?  Fixed?:
arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ bash run_fgfs.sh  --show-aircraft
Failed to create alias at 
/controls[0]/refuelling[0]/refuelling-drogues-pos-norm[0].
Source /sim[0]/multiplay[0]/generic[0]/float[2] is already aliasing
another property. 
Failed to set alias to /controls/refuelling/refuelling-drogues-pos-norm



-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Release candidates

2013-02-05 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Thu, 31 Jan 2013 02:14:08 +0100, Arnt wrote in message 
20130131021408.75b70...@celsius.lan:

 On Wed, 30 Jan 2013 11:11:36 +0100, Erik wrote in message 
 5108f1d8.3090...@ehofman.com:
 
  On 01/30/2013 08:10 AM, Renk Thorsten wrote:
   It does run on my Win 7 laptop with nvidia graphics hardware (and
   nvidia graphics drivers installed.)  I will get it uploading ...
   740Mb!  So much for the CD distribution. :-)  Didn't Bill Gates
   famously say 640Mb should be enough for anyone?
  
   Um... which reminds me - I had on my old computer a bunch of
   obsolete cloud models and textures flagged  and done long-term
   testing that they really aren't used - that's probably 20-30 MB
   worth of files that can go. In all the confusion migrating to a
   new machine I forgot about that - do you want me to look for that
   list? Doesn't really get us to CD size, but still...
  
  Are the Winter textures still needed?
 
 ..only we want to support realistic winter flying.  Once I 
 have a flyable FG-git going, I'll advice on the realism.

..ok, it flies ;o): bash run_fgfs.sh --geometry=1920x1200 \
 --fg-scenery=/home/arnt/FG-git/FGScenery-2.8 --httpd=8765 \
 --disable-terrasync --enable-fullscreen --control=keyboard \
 --prop:/controls/gear/brake-parking=1 --timeofday=noon 
except I couldn't find where in the prop tree to turn off the 
ATI hack.

..the noon lighting is waaay off, think sunrise and sunset, only 
in the South (or North for penguins), and we don't have smog 
except around Nikel, Russia, on a typical CAVOK day at ENAN, 
the clean air will have you smog breathers from the smoky South,
guesstimate the distance to Senja (the island due East) at 1km, 
1.5km, 2km etc, it's 30km, make it look like 1.5km and keep 
an 150km visibility, and it should be realistic.  I can imagine 
Southern high latitudes will need a similar treatment.

..the trees needs snow, or frost sheen, and conifers company, 
pine and spruce is farmed in wood fields, not spread all 
over the country like birch.  
It takes wind or rain to get the white stuff off trees, conifers
will carry snow on branches far into the spring, think Easter 
time.  Trees get smaller towards the coast. 

..snow cover is continous up here, until around Easter. 

..the mountains ... are we getting a new scenery for 2.10?
I tested with the 2.8 scenery.

-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

--
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Re: [Flightgear-devel] ..has anyone tried testing FG build scripts in fresh trees?

2013-02-02 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Fri, 1 Feb 2013 23:18:05 -0500, Pat wrote in message 
20130201231805.3e3875a7@spinnaker:

 libRTI-NG.so.1 should be in test-tree/install/openrti/libRTI-NG.so.1
 
 
 The following works for me:
 
 #bin/bash
 TEST_TREE=$1
 if [ $TEST_TREE ==  ]
 then
   TEST_TREE=test-tree
 fi
 mkdir -vp test-tree
 cd test-tree
 wget -c \
 http://www.gitorious.org/fg/fgmeta/blobs/raw/master/download_and_compile.sh
 sh download_and_compile.sh -j 2 |tee download_and_compile.sh--j-2.log
 sh download_and_compile.sh -a n -p n -d n -j 2 ALL |tee \
 download_and_compile.sh-a-n--p-n--d-n--j-2-ALL.log
 
 run_fgrun.sh and Flightgear started right 
 
 
 after the first  download_and_compile.sh, libRTI-NG.so.1 should be in
 test-tree/install/openrti/libRTI-NG.so.1

..nope, not here:
rnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ tree install/openrti/lib/ 
install/openrti/lib/
└── x86_64-linux-gnu
...
├── libRTI-NG.so - libRTI-NG.so.1
├── libRTI-NG.so.1 - libRTI-NG.so.1.3.0
└── libRTI-NG.so.1.3.0

..but I'mone step closer, now it cranks, puffs 'n smokes, do I 
need the Enabling ATI viewport hack with the radeon driver???: 
arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ bash run_fgfs.sh --geometry=1600x1080 
[1] 12795
arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ Enabling ATI viewport hack
Animated jetways ... initialized
KMA20 audio panel initialized
KI266 dme indicator #0 initialized
loading scenario 'nimitz_demo'
Electrical system initialized
r300 FP: Compiler Error:
compiler/r500_fragprog_emit.c::emit_paired(): emit_alu: Too many
instructions Using a dummy shader instead.
r300 FP: Compiler Error:
compiler/r500_fragprog_emit.c::emit_paired(): emit_alu: Too many
instructions Using a dummy shader instead.
glLinkProgram  FAILED
Program  infolog:
error: fragment shader varying rawpos not written by vertex shader
.error: shader uses too many varying components (44  40), but the
driver will try to optimize them out; this is non-portable out-of-spec
behavior

run_fgfs.sh: line 5: 12797 Segmentation fault  ./fgfs
--fg-root=$PWD/../fgdata/ $@

[1]+  Exit 139bash run_fgfs.sh --geometry=1600x1080
arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ 

..this compile and segfault was done on system plib and system osg:
arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ dpkg -l |grep libplib |fmt -tu
ii libplib-dev 1.8.5-6 amd64 Portability Libraries: Development package
ii libplib1 1.8.5-6 amd64 Portability Libraries: Run-time package
arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ dpkg -l |grep openscenegraph |fmt -tu
ii libopenscenegraph-dev 3.0.1-4 amd64 3D scene graph, development files
ii libopenscenegraph80 3.0.1-4 amd64 3D scene graph, shared libs
ii openscenegraph 3.0.1-4 amd64 3D scene graph, utilities and examples
   (binaries)
ii openscenegraph-doc 3.0.1-4 all 3D scene graph, documentation
ii openscenegraph-examples 3.0.1-4 all 3D scene graph, examples
(sources) 
ii openscenegraph-plugin-citygml-shared 0.14+svn128-1+3p0p1+4 amd64
libcitygml OpenSceneGraph plugin (shared version) 
ii openscenegraph-plugin-citygml-static 0.14+svn128-1+3p0p1+4 amd64
libcitygml OpenSceneGraph plugin (static version)
arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ 

..my patch needs more work, fgrun compile fails on libfltk1.3-dev:
-- Performing Test HAVE_FLTK_1_3
-- Performing Test HAVE_FLTK_1_3 - Failed
CMake Error at CMakeLists.txt:228 (message):
  FLTK 1.3 is required

arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ ll download_and_compile-1.9-4a.patch md5sum
download_and_compile-1.9-4a.patch -rw-r--r-- 1 arnt arnt 2853 Feb  3
06:51 download_and_compile-1.9-4a.patch
79dd3f7d7363231d705c336733073475  download_and_compile-1.9-4a.patch
arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ 


 A side note:
   $sh download_and_compile.sh. 
 will work even without the chmod -x download_and_compile.sh

..aye, and svn can be tossed out too, git speaks svn, and
I'll put fgdata in my FG-git tree root and link it home:
arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ ll -d install/fgfs/fgdata fgdata
drwxr-xr-x 31 arnt arnt 4096 Feb  3 06:11 fgdata
lrwxrwxrwx  1 arnt arnt   24 Feb  3 06:12 install/fgfs/fgdata
- /home/arnt/FG-git/fgdata arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ 

-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.
--- download_and_compile-1.9-4.sh	2013-01-04 11:43:24.0 +0100
+++ download_and_compile-1.9-4a.sh	2013-02-03 04:27:30.598266993 +0100
@@ -18,7 +18,7 @@
 # along with this program.  If not, see http://www.gnu.org/licenses/.
 
 
-VERSION=1.9-4
+VERSION=1.9-4a
 
 #COMPILE GIT FGFS
 
@@ -272,7 +272,7 @@
 DISTRO_PACKAGES=libopenal-dev libalut-dev libalut0  libfltk1.3-dev libfltk1.3 cvs subversion cmake make build-essential automake zlib1g-dev zlib1g libwxgtk2.8-0 libwxgtk2.8-dev fluid gawk gettext libxi-dev libxi6 libxmu-dev libxmu6 libboost-dev libasound2-dev libasound2 libpng12-dev libpng12-0 libjasper1 libjasper-dev libopenexr-dev libboost-serialization-dev git-core libhal-dev libqt4-dev scons python-tk python-imaging-tk libsvn-dev libglew1.5-dev  libxft2 libxft-dev

Re: [Flightgear-devel] ..has anyone tried testing FG build scripts in fresh trees?

2013-02-02 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Sun, 3 Feb 2013 07:12:14 +0100, Arnt wrote in message 
20130203071214.01dbf...@celsius.lan:

 ..my patch needs more work, fgrun compile fails on libfltk1.3-dev:
 -- Performing Test HAVE_FLTK_1_3
 -- Performing Test HAVE_FLTK_1_3 - Failed
 CMake Error at CMakeLists.txt:228 (message):
   FLTK 1.3 is required

..and tossing out libfltk1.1-dev to fit libfltk1.3-dev, kills 
the fgfs compile.  I need sleep now. ;o)

-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

--
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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Release candidates

2013-01-31 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Thu, 31 Jan 2013 13:49:18 +0100, Geoff wrote in message 
1359636558.2578.5.camel@DELL02:

 Hi Curt,
 
 Downloaded 2.10 RC1 - Wow over a 20 minutes 
 even at about 550 MB/s, but I guess all good things 
 come with a little pain ;=))

..here, you build on your own makefg script?
(http://geoffair.org/tmp/makefg )

 But noted you 'forgot' to adjust the default install 
 folder - it still reads C:\PF\FlightGear-2.8.0.4 
 as the default install folder. And likewise the name 
 for the default desktop icon.
 
 After manually changing those to 2.10.0.1, fgrun loaded 
 fine with the correct paths, and fgfs ran fine in the 
 first quick test using the 777-200... Will naturally report 
 any bugs found...
 
 The 740 MB setup exe expands to 1.4 GB on disk...

..the 800MB CDs works on Microsoft boxes?

 Since I am also interested in producing a RC from my 
 own build curious how you 'separate' the RC data from 
 the git master fgdata.
 
 Checked fg/fgmeta but could not find any 'script' 
 to do this... Can you add your 'scripts' to there? Or 
 did I miss something?

...

 Anyway, just some thoughts on trying to reduce the 
 initial 'pain' of a new user to be able to quickly 
 get and try FG!

..possibly getting your script working in a fresh tree?
New people will start with a blank fresh brand new tree,
go in there, DL your makefg and run it.

..I tried that with Francesco Brisa's download_and_compile.sh
which failed for me, and then I tried your script in that same 
tree with sh ./makefg -h and found it gets most things right:
makefg: Some _VERY_ important 'prefix' items for 'configure'.
makefg: *** CHECK THEM CAREFULLY! *** and the FG data path.
makefg: PLIB:   /usr - version [1.8.5] SKIP

..makefg finds and uses system plib ok, but ignores system OSG, 
I have: arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ dpkg -l |grep libplib |fmt -tu
ii libplib-dev 1.8.5-6 amd64 Portability Libraries: Development package
ii libplib1 1.8.5-6 amd64 Portability Libraries: Run-time package
arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ dpkg -l |grep openscenegraph |fmt -tu
ii libopenscenegraph-dev 3.0.1-4 amd64 3D scene graph, development files
ii libopenscenegraph80 3.0.1-4 amd64 3D scene graph, shared libs
ii openscenegraph 3.0.1-4 amd64 3D scene graph, utilities and examples
   (binaries)
ii openscenegraph-doc 3.0.1-4 all 3D scene graph, documentation
ii openscenegraph-examples 3.0.1-4 all 3D scene graph, examples
(sources) ii openscenegraph-plugin-citygml-shared 0.14+svn128-1+3p0p1
amd64 libcitygml OpenSceneGraph plugin (shared version)
arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ 

makefg: OSG:/home/arnt/FG-git/install/OSG301 
- *NEW INSTALLATION* to OSG301 ... 
makefg: BOOST:  /usr - version [1.49.00] OK
makefg: SG: /home/arnt/FG-git/install/simgear 
- version [2.11.0] ...
makefg: FG: /home/arnt/FG-git/install/flightgear 
- *NEW INSTALLATION* to flightgear 
Francesco's download_and_compile.sh uses /home/arnt/FG-git/fgfs

makefg: FGRUN:  /home/arnt/FG-git/install/fgrun 
- *NEW INSTALLATION* to fgrun/fgrun 
makefg: TG: /home/arnt SKIP 
makefg: ATLAS:  /home/arnt/FG-git/install/Atlas SKIP 
makefg: FGDATA: /home/arnt/FG-git/fgdata 
- version [2.11.0] SKIP



 And Curt, I hope you can 'publish' your 'scripts' 
 somewhere, to help others like me generate a Windows 
 setup install exe...

..hear, hear. ;o)  One way this could be done, is set up an 
.exe that installs a build script, or some FG-builder program.
Being able to make newbie Windroids Simply click the button, 
would make Wintendo support _much_ easier.

-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

--
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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Release candidates

2013-01-31 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Thu, 31 Jan 2013 19:07:25 +0100, Geoff wrote in message 
1359655645.2578.10.camel@DELL02:

 Hi Curt, 
 
 Thanks for the reply.
 
  I believe Fred intentionally chose to use 
  the same registry key from one version to the next.
 
 Ok, that's understandable... my last install was 
 2.8.0.4, but I wanted them separated... not over-written...
 
 But then not sure why not choose just C:\PF\FlightGear 
 which is where an earlier version was put...
 
 But maybe you are right, if I uninstall the current 
 FOUR(4) versions I have installed, it may choose just
 '/FlightGear/'...

..one of the things I suggested waaay back, before cmake, is:
  On Sun, 1 Feb 2009 21:30:20 +0100, Arnt wrote in message 
 20090201213020.29336...@a45.fmb.no:
 
  On Sun, 1 Feb 2009 16:41:40 +0100, Melchior wrote in message 
  200902011641.41...@rk-nord.at:
  
   * Curtis Olson -- Friday 30 January 2009:
The traditional unix scheme, and most linux packaging schemes,
assume only one version of the software at one time. [...]
  
  ..name caller idea from brlcad-7.14.0's ./configure --help:
  Program names:
  --program-prefix=PREFIXprepend PREFIX to installed 
  program names 
  --program-suffix=SUFFIXappend SUFFIX to installed 
  program names 
  --program-transform-name=PROGRAM   run sed PROGRAM on installed 
  program names
  
  ..these differ from its path names:
  Installation directories:
--prefix=PREFIX install architecture-independent 
  files in PREFIX [/usr/brlcad]
--exec-prefix=EPREFIX   install architecture-dependent 
  files in EPREFIX [PREFIX]

..if this is possible with cmake, you could put all 
your binaries in the same tree and use names like e.g.
/usr/bin/arnt's-git-fgfs-with-wood-gasifier-in-the-An2
and /usr/bin/2.10-fgfs-with-charcoal-gasifier-in-the-An2
and use any combination of this and other name schemes 
with distro packaging to keep things out of each others 
way, e.g. most people might wanna keep e.g. fgfs-2.0, 
fgfs-2.4, non-OSG-fgfs-2.4, fgfs-2.6, fgfs-2.8 and a 
bunch of their latest FG-git builds handy, both for 
user support and for their own reasons, e.g. to compare 
new work with older builds.

 So please forget that I used the word 'forgot' ;=))
 
  There is a make target in the flightgear top level ...
 
 And assume the 'make' target is $ make package, or 
 $ make package_source which seem to be the only 
 possible targets shown for $ make help
  
 But running the first with -n seemed only to do the 
 binaries, no data, and the second seemed to only be 
 regarding fg source, again not fgdata...
 
 So maybe I do not quite understand ;=((
 
 Regards,
 Geoff.


-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

--
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[Flightgear-devel] ..cmake macro to find and set up OSG, was: ..subversive ; o) patch, was: OT: makefg and finding OSG in linux

2013-01-31 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Fri, 1 Feb 2013 04:19:31 +0100, Arnt wrote in message 
20130201041931.748e1...@celsius.lan:

 On Fri, 1 Feb 2013 02:28:40 +0100, Arnt wrote in message 
 20130201022840.5e985...@celsius.lan:
 
  On Thu, 31 Jan 2013 22:05:02 +0100, Arnt wrote in message 
  20130131220502.2537d...@celsius.lan:
  
second, you require svn (and cvs?) to do 
   svn co, that can be done with git svn clone -s, for cvs et 
   al I'll need to chk, I guess you want your Windroid script 
   kiddies ;oD to use the one git, not 3 different kindsa svn,
   cvs etc to build (the) _one_ Flight Sim.
  
  ..subversive ;o) patch:
  arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ ll su* md5sum su*
  -rw-r--r-- 1 arnt arnt 4311 Feb  1 00:40
  subversion-of-svn-4-makefg-1.3.12a.patch
  d02880ea23df9bd982f4f778aa7accc8
  subversion-of-svn-4-makefg-1.3.12a.patch 
  arnt@celsius:~/FG-git$ 
  
  ..motivation, background and recipe ideas:
  http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/git-svn-tutorial
  http://stackoverflow.com/questions/3239759/checkout-remote-branch-using-git-svn
  http://git.or.cz/course/svn.html
  http://www.kernel.org/pub/software/scm/git/docs/git-svn.html
  
  ..cvs is a _lot_ messier... 
  
  ..and I'm still stuck on discovering system OSG.
 
 ..I got one step further:
 arnt@celsius:~$ osgversion --version-number
 3.0.1
 arnt@celsius:~$ which osgversion
 /usr/bin/osgversion
 arnt@celsius:~$ 

...and found this: ;o)
http://svn.tevs.eu/osgPPU/trunk/CMakeModules/OsgPPUMacroUtils.cmake

..now, where do I the _total_ cmake newbie stick up this?

-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.
--- makefg-1.3.12	2013-02-01 00:07:53.196781629 +0100
+++ makefg-1.3.12a	2013-02-01 00:34:16.456595377 +0100
@@ -85,8 +85,9 @@
 # 2012-08-07 - Fix to build TG - added SG directory export
 # 2012-10-31 - Some fixes to run in fgx.ch - if PLIB_PATH=, set ADDPLIBDIRS
 # 2013-01-02 - Fix SG libraries names, and adjust FGRUN cmake step
-SCDATE=2013-01-02
-SCVERSION=1.3.12
+# 2013-02-01 - ..ditch subversion and svn co  for git svn clone -s 
+SCDATE=2013-02-01
+SCVERSION=1.3.12a
 #
 # 2009-10-31  - allow option to use alternate OpenAL sources
 # OpenAL-Soft 1.9.563 compiled from source from http://kcat.strangesoft.net/openal.html
@@ -460,7 +461,7 @@
 
 install_svn_boost()
 {
-svn co http://svn.boost.org/svn/boost/trunk boost-trunk
+git svn clone -s http://svn.boost.org/svn/boost/trunk boost-trunk
 if [ -d boost-trunk ]; then
 cd boost-trunk
 if [ -f bootstrap.sh ]; then
@@ -482,8 +483,8 @@
   pgm_exit
fi
cd $CBD/install
-   echo2 $BN: Running svn co http://svn.boost.org/svn/boost/trunk boost
-   svn co http://svn.boost.org/svn/boost/trunk boost
+   echo2 $BN: Running git svn clone -s http://svn.boost.org/svn/boost/trunk boost
+   git svn clone -s http://svn.boost.org/svn/boost/trunk boost
if [ -d boost ]; then
   cd boost
   echo2 $BN: Moving boost headers to an 'include' directory...
@@ -2988,7 +2989,7 @@
   LIST2=libglut3-dev libopenal-dev libalut-dev libalut0 libfltk1.1-dev
   LIST3=libfltk1.1 zlib1g-dev zlib1g libwxgtk2.8-0 libwxgtk2.8-dev
   LIST4=libjpeg62-dev libjpeg62 libxi-dev libxi6 libxmu-dev libxmu6
-  LIST5=fluid gawk gettext gcc g++ cmake cvs subversion
+  LIST5=fluid gawk gettext gcc g++ cmake cvs
   LIST6=git-core curl xlibmesa-gl-dev freeglut3-dev glutg3-dev libglut3-dev xorg-dev
   LIST7=libalut-dev zlib1g-dev libtiff4 libtiff4-dev libtiff-tools libtiff-opengl
   if [ $DISTRIB_RELEASE = 8.04 ]; then
@@ -3057,7 +3058,7 @@
 # PLIB_SOURCE_DIR=plib-1.8.5 OR plib, depending on PLIBTRUNK
 # INSTALL_DIR_PLIB=$INSTALL_DIR/$PLIB_SOURCE_DIR
 cd $CBD
-#svn co http://plib.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/plib/trunk plib
+#git svn clone -s http://plib.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/plib/trunk plib
 #cd plib
 if [ $PLIBADD = 1 ]  [ `is_in_args PLIB` -gt 0 ] ; then
echo2 $BN: Processing PLIB ...
@@ -3076,9 +3077,9 @@
 fi
   else
  # need to do a CHECKOUT
- echo2 $BN: PLIB checkout with svn co http://plib.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/plib/trunk $PLIB_SOURCE_DIR
+ echo2 $BN: PLIB checkout with git svn clone -s http://plib.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/plib/trunk $PLIB_SOURCE_DIR
  echo2 $BN: Doing PLIB checkout of trunk ... moment...
- svn co http://plib.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/plib/trunk $PLIB_SOURCE_DIR
+ git svn clone -s http://plib.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/plib/trunk $PLIB_SOURCE_DIR
  PLIBCO=1
  echo2 $BN: Done plib checkout. Force SG/FG AUTO and CLEAN
  SGAUTO=1
@@ -3215,11 +3216,11 @@
fi
if [ ! -d $OSG_SOURCE_DIR ]; then
   echo2 This is a NEW svn download of OSG...
-  echo2 CMD: svn co $OSG_SVN $OSG_SOURCE_DIR
+  echo2 CMD: git svn clone -s $OSG_SVN $OSG_SOURCE_DIR
   ask
   echo2 Doing svn download of OSG ... moment

Re: [Flightgear-devel] Release candidates

2013-01-30 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Wed, 30 Jan 2013 11:11:36 +0100, Erik wrote in message 
5108f1d8.3090...@ehofman.com:

 On 01/30/2013 08:10 AM, Renk Thorsten wrote:
  It does run on my Win 7 laptop with nvidia graphics hardware (and
  nvidia graphics drivers installed.)  I will get it uploading ...
  740Mb!  So much for the CD distribution. :-)  Didn't Bill Gates
  famously say 640Mb should be enough for anyone?
 
  Um... which reminds me - I had on my old computer a bunch of
  obsolete cloud models and textures flagged  and done long-term
  testing that they really aren't used - that's probably 20-30 MB
  worth of files that can go. In all the confusion migrating to a new
  machine I forgot about that - do you want me to look for that list?
  Doesn't really get us to CD size, but still...
 
 Are the Winter textures still needed?

..only we want to support realistic winter flying.  Once I 
have a flyable FG-git going, I'll advice on the realism.

-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

--
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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Textures bug

2013-01-30 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Sat, 26 Jan 2013 16:18:14 +0100, mer...@centrum.cz wrote in message 
20130126161814.7b021...@centrum.cz:

 Hello,
 with current Git version of Flightgear, i'm experiencing textures
 bug. See screenshots. http://www.imagehosting.cz/?v=fgfsscreen.jpg
 http://www.imagehosting.cz/?v=fgfsscumu.jpg
 http://www.imagehosting.cz/?v=fgfsscxcx.jpg
 http://www.imagehosting.cz/?v=fgfssccic.jpg
 
 I tried many combinations of Rendering options and some commandline
 options without success.
 
 I'm running Ubuntu 12.10 with radeon driver.

..first verify you have _all_ the firmware this driver needs,
on Debian we need firmware-linux-nonfree for the KMS stuff,
Ubuntu is similar. E.g. dpkg -l |grep firmware-linux

..later, you are also able to test with the radeonhd and fglrx 
drivers and post the output and pix of FG runs with those 
drivers, to help pinpoint the bug you found.  These latter 2
drivers require you disable KMS, and possibly even a reboot.

 I tried two different graphic cards with the same result.
 RV630 [Radeon HD 3600 Series]
 Cape Verde PRO [Radeon HD 7700 Series]
 
 $ ./run_fgfs.sh --version
 FlightGear version: 2.11.0
 Revision: 11f15a9b36ef3ca8e1bdc53b52e9e7f316ccc102
 Build-Id: none
 FG_ROOT=/media/mermar/aaa/fgfs/install/fgfs/fgdata
 FG_HOME=/home/mermar/.fgfs
 FG_SCENERY=
 SimGear version: 2.11.0
 PLIB version: 185
 
 There are no error messages in the console.
 
 With version 2.6 from Ubuntu repository, I'v got the same wrong
 output.

 Version 2.4 worked fine.

..does it (FG-2.4) _still_ work fine?

..if you no longer have it installed, you should be able to 
install it adding a deb line from whichever older version 
Ubuntu you had when you had FG-2.4, and install FG-2.4 with 
e.g. aptitude -t experimental install flightgear (modify 
as you see fit, experimental - your old Ubuntu version), 
and test it with your current Ubuntu's radeon, radeonhd 
and fglrx drivers.

 Is there something I can do to fix this? Or can someone please help
 me?

..first, the exact commandline you use to start FG,
then the output from that commandline in that xterm.
If this is a radeon bug, the radeon team will have 
a bunch of things they want you to do.  
Do you have reportbug installed?  If not, install 
it now, e.g. reportbug radeon gives you a nice 
intro guide on writing bug reports.

-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

--
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Re: [Flightgear-devel] HUD, runway projection

2013-01-30 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Wed, 30 Jan 2013 22:02:24 +0100, Alex wrote in message 
20130130220224.2bc98cdf@main:

 Ahoy Guys,
 
 while doing some research for the wiki[1] the idea came across to
 center the (seemingly not properly working) runway projection, the
 big fat arrow on the default HUD, pointing to one o'clock here[2], and
 make it more flexible. Even though it does not actually project the
 active runway on the HUD, it still points to its direction. I am aware
 that sooner or later canvas[3] will replace the actual HUD system and
 therefore probably not much effort will go into the current one
 anymore. However, until then it would be nice to make something more
 useful out of it or, as a second option, disable the instrument in
 Huds/default.xml. And because the arrow is very obvious, just letting
 it hang out at the corner does not make the HUD prettier.
 
 Enclosed are two patches, both tested on FG 2.10 and git next:
 HUD-runway_offset-fgdata.diff
   Changes the coordinates in runway.xml to have it centered. Nearly,
 at least. For unknown reason it disappears if centered along the
 y-axis. Therefore that one unit offset in the patch.
 HUD-runway_property-fg_source.diff
   Alters the property for the airport runway is pointing at from
   /sim/presets/airport-id to /sim/tower/airport-id. Right after
   starting FG these are the same but now the user is able to make the
   arrow pointing to some other airport or to the closest one by
 setting up the Tower Position via menu.
 
 A screenshot[4] showing the centered one for your approval or not.
 
 Thank you very much
 Alex
 
 [1] http://wiki.flightgear.org/HUD
 [2] http://wiki.flightgear.org/File:HUD_default_overview.png
 [3] http://wiki.flightgear.org/Canvas_HUD

..[3] got me a wee bit confused, fpv here means 
Flight Path Velocity Vector, not First Person View?
I played with FPV and OSD in the search field, OSD 
is FPV-slang for HUD, and these comes in _all_ kinds 
of screen style variants, so I guess we could use a 
wee mention to point FPV people the right way here. ;o)

 [4] http://www.zimagez.com/zimage/fgfs-screen-259.php

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[Flightgear-devel] ..has anyone tried testing FG build scripts in fresh trees?

2013-01-30 Thread Arnt Karlsen
Hi,

..has anyone tried testing FG build scripts in fresh trees?

..as in, mkdir -vp test-tree ;cd test-tree ;wget -c \
http://www.gitorious.org/fg/fgmeta/blobs/raw/master/download_and_compile.sh
;chmod -x download_and_compile.sh  ;\
sh download_and_compile.sh -a n -p n -d n -j 2 ALL , like our recipe:
http://wiki.flightgear.org/Scripted_Compilation_on_Linux_Debian/Ubuntu
says is possible?  I get errors, the weird part is I can prime my
test tree, and then most parts of download_and_compile.sh works, e.g.
plib, openrti, OSG, SG and FG all builds ok, but FG bombs right out:
./run_fgfs.sh
./fgfs: error while loading shared libraries: libRTI-NG.so.1: cannot
open shared object file: No such file or directory


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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Add/Set properties to/in MP Protocol

2012-12-31 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Sun, 30 Dec 2012 06:23:36 +0100, Jörg wrote in message 
1356845016.1846.28.camel@emma-work1:

 But to get people convinced to use/install FGCOM you first have to
 attract them - and for that you need MPchat. Also you need it to
 contact all pilots passing by in a normal, playing, non controlled,
 standard FGFS mode! You will never get ALL pilots (newbies or not) to
 switch frequencies every few minutes to make sure they notice an ATC
 trying to get their attention! Pilots do not do that in the real
 world either!

..here, we can lean onto the alleged RL al-TSAida hysteria 
and launch AI Air Force interceptors and missiles, etc. ;o) 
Happy New Year! :o)

 So we do need MPchat - at least to tell those
 fun-pilots that there is an ATC and what is the FGCOM-frequency!!


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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Real-Time Radio Propagation

2012-12-13 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Wed, 12 Dec 2012 23:03:45 -, Vivian wrote in message 
001201cdd8bc$f5eb6b30$e1c24190$@lineone.net:

 Don't we need radar altitude for buildings  etc. for radar
 altimeters, but probably not trees?

..at some stage, tree canopies will be dense enough to mask 
the ground, or give double reflections, or some such.

 A radar altimeter needs to sample both the terrain and hard objects
 on it.

..tree canopies dense enough to mask the ground, are probably
hard enough to make radar vendors scare their clients from 
touching or ignoring them.

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Real-Time Radio Propagation

2012-12-13 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Thu, 13 Dec 2012 16:29:49 +0200, Adrian wrote in message 
201212131629.50248.kanto...@gmail.com:

 On Thursday, December 13, 2012 15:04:16 Renk Thorsten wrote:
 
  
  Somewhat related to the above - *if* the radio propagation model
  could be shown to be more realistic - what framerate loss would
  this be worth as compared to a faster, less realistic model? And
  does this question matter at all if this is implemented optionally
  - should not the user decide this?
  
 
 Hi Thorsten, Torsten, all,
 
 Regarding the performance, you are correct, the user can decide on
 what to spend the CPU cycles.
 But for the sake of documenting this issue, I have performed a test:
 
 
 The test is performed in standard condition: on ground, all terrain
 finished loading, visibility set to 40 miles, LOD range bare 6
 meters, 3 stations tuned, each at limit of loaded terrain, approx 100
 km medium distance to them. First image shows subsystem enabled,
 second shows subsystem disabled. I have highlighted with red the
 relevant areas in the images. As always, click for details. 
 
 http://wiki.flightgear.org/File:Radio-perf7b.png  Radio subsystem
 enabled. http://wiki.flightgear.org/File:Radio-perf9b.png  Radio
 subsystem disabled. Notice DME indication has appeared.
 
 In both cases, the FPS observed was 39. In long flight tests, the FPS 
 difference is more like 3-5 from disabled to enabled.
 
 Now, regarding terrain influence, modes of propagation, and clutter
 influence on diffraction at different frequencies, you can observe
 the details on the upper left of the images. I won't get into details
 anymore, because I have done that already in a couple of messages.
 
 If anyone wishes to add more information on the subject of
 performance, I invite you to use the wiki page:
  http://wiki.flightgear.org/Talk:Radio_propagation
 
 I'm open to any other technical questions regarding the radio
 propagation algorithms used.

..maybe add a commandline suggestion so we can hope to compare
apples with apples and pears with pears etc?  
Without a commandline suggestion, you pile up all sorts of
irrelevant factors such as which runway you took off from 
etc, whereby you may load a different set of tiles, _etc_. 

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  best case, worst case, and just in case.

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[Flightgear-devel] ..coding style conversion ideas, was: Real-Time Radio Propagation

2012-12-13 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Thu, 13 Dec 2012 13:04:16 +, Renk wrote in message 
e495a106ff5f31448739e79d34138c191e179...@mbs3.ad.jyu.fi:

 (With regard to Adrian's code, I am well aware that factors like
 style, performance,... are also relevant).

..given the diverse coder background here, with ditto diverse 
coding style backgrounds, I found reason to google and wound up 
with 'Emacs coding style conversion script' and found this:
http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1654164 (scroll down to): 
I really wish I could find something for Emacs which 
automatically detects the style of the code I'm editing 
and switches the coding style to that.

..motivations, orthodoxy, etc:
http://www.kernel.org/doc/Documentation/CodingStyle
http://coding.smashingmagazine.com/2012/10/25/why-coding-style-matters/
http://www.yolinux.com/TUTORIALS/LinuxTutorialC++CodingStyle.html

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Musings on FG on Linux/Windows

2012-12-02 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Sun, 2 Dec 2012 08:47:06 -0600, Curtis wrote in message 
CAHtsj_fx33eVFv_s_F0hzHyd=kcjp6fqlq+k2i-094dbr46...@mail.gmail.com:

 On Sun, Dec 2, 2012 at 7:53 AM, Hans Janssen
 handigehan...@gmail.comwrote:
 
  On 12/02/2012 02:35 PM, Curtis Olson wrote:
and as far as I know, there isn't an upper
   limit to the number of participants in a hangout.
 
  The limit is 10 according to this.
  https://support.google.com/plus/bin/answer.py?hl=enanswer=1216374
 
 
 Hmmm, you learn something new every day ... :-)
 
 Poking around on the skype site it looks like we can do audio-only (+
 text message chat) calls with up to 100 participants for free.  Maybe
 that's would be the thing to try first if there was interest in a
 weekly (?) skype call.

..I seem to remember talk of a FG voip client on multiplayer
servers years back here?  
Dropping FG graphics for webcam video, would land us a video 
conference setup.  

..combining these, would allow us a _real_ FG airshow online, 
a lot of the going to airshows, is chatting with people at 
these airshows, airshows _are_ after all, social events.


..meanwhile, practical ideas:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BigBlueButton
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FreeSWITCH
https://www.webhuddle.com/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Openmeetings
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_web_conferencing_software
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Web_conferencing

..a quicker but proprietary way is use paltalk express:
http://express.paltalk.com/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paltalk#Paltalk_Express

-- 
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...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Musings on FG on Linux/Windows

2012-11-28 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Tue, 27 Nov 2012 21:51:57 -0500, Pat wrote in message 
20121127215157.0f27252b@spinnaker:

 For me the question is not so much how to get there, but where do we
 want to go and who's going to make the effort.

..that will be decided meritocratically by whoever codes 
something that's more than good enough for the rest of us.

 From reading this thread and others, a lot of work done on
 managing the release process.  Is there still some work to do in the
 area of builds for various audiences?

..some, yes, IMO mostly pieceing together e.g. the buildscripts
I suggested, with distro specific packaging scripts.  
The latter are usually (IME rpm in my Red Hat days) capable of
producing the right binaries from your git etc FG source tree,
and can be installed alongside the official distro's FG, with
non-conflicting binary names a la /usr/bin/arnt's-fgfs-wo-jpg-factory
if this brl-cad.org binary nameing idea survived FG's move to cmake. 

..so for each distro release, we may want a stable release, a 
bleading edge, and a last night's bug hunter build, which is
why we should automate this scheme, if we even think of trying it.

 Which distros have flightgear and what version do they have in their
 repositories?

..most general use desktop distros, and they usually go 
with the lates stable release, in the Debian Stable case, 
we're even more paranoid, flightgear-1.9.1-1.1+b1, you need 
to upgrade to the development release (always Debian Sid) 
where we now have flightgear-2.6.0-1.

..special use distros usually don't, unless special use 
happens to be gaming, flight simulation, flightgear
or flightgear development. ;o)

 Where did the package for Ubuntu come from? 

..not sure, Debian Sid would be my guess.

 Who built the package? Who maintains it?  

..in Debian and Ubuntu, Ove Kaaven:
http://packages.ubuntu.com/quantal/games/flightgear

 Is there a way to manage packaging across distros?

..not _a_, but _many_ ways.  Debian probably has the best 
(and biggest) pile of tools to do this, I have this vision
of somebody running this virtual build-n-test cluster off
his git tree from a laptop, or some such.  


-- 
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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Musings on FG on Linux/Windows

2012-11-28 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Wed, 28 Nov 2012 23:03:55 +0100, ThorstenB wrote in message 
50b68a4b.7050...@gmail.com:

 * Debian (2.6.0 (not 2.8.0!) accepted into stable on October 30th)
 http://packages.debian.org/de/sid/flightgear

..while I agree Debian Sid is stable enough for most people here,
Debian policy defines Sid as unstable.

..and I now remember another neat tool for FG packaging etc management:
whohas, aptitude etc install it, then try 'whohas flightgear '. ;o)

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Musings on FG on Linux/Windows

2012-11-27 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Tue, 27 Nov 2012 09:39:42 +, Renk wrote in message 
e495a106ff5f31448739e79d34138c191e169...@mbs1.ad.jyu.fi:

  No it doesn't. There's nothing preventing us from providing
  packages for older distribution versions.
 
 This sounds very neat, and if this works in practice, then I take my
 comment back - being able to get an rpm for any major Linux
 distribution would be equivalent to the Windows installer in terms of
 usability.

..the best way to get there, is build upon scripts like:
http://wiki.flightgear.org/Scripted_Compilation_on_Linux_Debian/Ubuntu
and http://geoffair.net/fg/ ...

...like http://wiki.flightgear.org/CentOS does, and build deb, rpm etc
distro packages, rather than just build binaries out of the sources.

..in the Debian, Ubuntu etc world, .deb packages can be built like:
http://www.linuxjournal.com/content/using-checkinstall-build-packages-source
or http://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/maint-guide/build.en.html 
from http://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/maint-guide/index.en.html


..for rpm, I recommend reading the output of 'man rpmbuild'.

.._sometimes_, deb, rpm etc packages can be converted to other distro
packaging formats with /usr/bin/alien, details in 'man alien', this 
approach may fail on e.g. Ubuntu developers disagreeing with Debian
.deb packaging policy, or a rpm database not seeing conflicts coming
with a .deb binary, checkinstall may help you solve those conflicts.

..some guys are just plain lucky, e.g.
http://wiki.flightgear.org/Building_Flightgear_-_Gentoo


..these build scripts can also be packaged as e.g. deb, rpm etc
meta-packages that can be used to e.g. set up a build server.

-- 
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...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Strange GPU behaviour

2012-11-24 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Sat, 24 Nov 2012 09:50:56 +, Renk wrote in message 
e495a106ff5f31448739e79d34138c191e169...@mbs1.ad.jyu.fi:
 
 Hooray came up with the idea that power management might have to do
 something with it - judging by other people's posts, the behaviour
 that the performance level never goes all the way even with prefer
 max. performance set seems to be normal when running under battery -
 so does the driver perhaps think it runs under battery even if in
 reality it doesn't? Unfortunately right now I've gnome3 installed
 which has zilch in terms of configuration of power management, so I
 probably need to wait for Monday to get the bandwidth to install KDE
 and see if that makes a difference. Or is there a quicker way to test
 this?

..also try some lightweight DE, e.g. LXDE, Fluxbox, Window Maker, 
Xfce, fvwm etc.  

..or try run FG as a DE, right from the login screen, with 
your fgfs command line in your  ~/.xsessionrc:
http://knoppix.net/forum/threads/28595-Create-.xsessionrc-for-quick-session-changes

..other ideas; set up runlevels specifically for FG, or set up
FG users specifically for FG, e.g. fg-git-debug with a nice 
nasty debug fgfs command line in fg-git-debug/.xsessionrc:
http://wiki.flightgear.org/Howto:Debugging_FlightGear_Crashes

..I understand this was run at FSweekend 2010:
http://wiki.flightgear.org/FSweekend_2010#.xinitrc

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] FSWeekend 2012...

2012-11-16 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Thu, 15 Nov 2012 21:44:59 +0100, Gijs wrote in message 
dub002-w526f44a3616768d066e468d3...@phx.gbl:

 Anyone got a Kinect or two? This would make a nice attention-grabber
 (controlling an aircraft by moving your bare hands in space) :-)
 
 http://threegearsystems.blogspot.nl/2012/11/flightgear-demo.html
 

..enjoy the legal side: ;o)
http://uk.gamespot.com/news/microsoft-denies-kinect-hack-claims-6283696
http://www.zdnet.com/blog/open-source/microsoft-surrenders-on-linux-kinect-hack/7769

..the tech side:
http://www.linuxjournal.com/content/kinect-linux
http://openkinect.org/wiki/Main_Page
http://www.freenect.com/
http://www.kinecthacks.com/kinect-linux-multitouch-screen/
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=llNSQ2u2rT4feature=related

..alternatives independent of Kinect:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1GhNXHCQGsMfeature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NCtYdUEMotgfeature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=91tYEgpmN4Mfeature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ni9nAm-Thswfeature=related

..further hacks... ;o)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aiNX-vpDhMofeature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sw4RvwhQ73Efeature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cVCghLfdzsYfeature=related

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Next FlightGear release (Feb. 17 2013)

2012-11-16 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Fri, 16 Nov 2012 15:27:52 +0100, Torsten wrote in message 
50a64d68.80...@t3r.de:

 in just about one month from now we are entering another round of the 
 release process, starting with the four weeks feature freeze period.
 This is probably a good time to check in all the great and fancy new 
 features that still hide in your local branches.  I'd also like to
 see JSBSim synced before December, 17th.

..this is too late for e.g. commercial actors who might wanna stick
a FG-3.0.0 dvd on their Christmas magazines, looong lead times. 

 How should we call our new baby? Is it 3.0.0 or is it 2.10.0?

..if we want to adjust to other peoples long lead times, cases can 
be made for delaying 2.10 into March (Because it's not ready) or 
for 2.12 around Easter and 2.14 next Soptember to celebrate my
election into parliament or whatever.  Just an idea. ;o)

 This is a carry-over from our last release and gets answered along
 with: Is Rembrandt production ready?

..this would be a 3.0.0 trigger. :o)

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] FlightGear at TU Delft

2012-11-10 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Fri, 9 Nov 2012 20:37:10 +, Stuart wrote in message 
CAP3ntysv=1xcks8nk_ssk3+e8-wwrbmwulwomaquy3vy0gd...@mail.gmail.com:

 On Mon, Sep 10, 2012 at 12:26 PM, Jan Comans wrote:
  We should have a random number generator in simgear that returns
  the same random number within the same period of time (I believe
  it was set to 1 second) to prevent short time quirks between
  different machines. This was specially added for (random) clouds.
 
  I have looked at this, but as far as I can see FG calls the regular
  time seed intialization instead of the 'time period' one. I think
  the period is even 10min. But I recall having some issues with
  giving the whole simulation a fixed seed (either through the
  srand10 method or providing a custom seed). Next to that, the time
  period seed relies on the fact that system clocks are more or less
  in sync. Normally NTP should take care of that, but with our sim
  being tweaked constantly this is difficult to guarantee. This for
  me is also a reason for providing a separate rng to handle the part
  that I'm interested in. As I said before, form me this was just a
  quick and dirty hack to get the results we needed. Personally, I
  think it would be beneficial to put the randomness somewhere in the
  property tree so that the cloud code can build 'deterministic'
  clouds from these values. In this way, other FG instances could be
  coupled in way similar to using --fdm=external, and just receive
  the basic random seeds that would result in the same cloud fields
  on every instance. But that's just my idea without having looked at
  the code too much.
 
 I've committed a change to keep the clouds in sync across
 multi-process systems.
 
 It relies on the clocks of the systems being roughly in sync as the
 seed changes every 10 minutes.

..are we now close to be able to run a FlightGear clock service, 
e.g. over a multiplayer network, independently from real time or 
hardware clocks, to e.g. render a 4K cinematic quality movie at 
say 4% of real time speeds 'n framerates?

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] 3d clouds on multi-display systems (was Re: FSWeekend 2012...)

2012-11-10 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Fri, 09 Nov 2012 21:08:07 +0100, Torsten wrote in message 
509d62a7.7000...@t3r.de:

 Am 08.11.2012 23:24, schrieb Stuart Buchanan:
  I'm confused.  From my reading of Durk's post, 3D clouds would
  appear to work fine for a multi-display system out-of-the-box,
  but your comment here indicates
  that there is an issue that requires fixing by restricting the
  random seed.
 
 Hi Stuart,
 
 just one more note about multi-displays on a single machine: With our 
 four cards driving eight displays at 1600x1200,

..you have 60fps with with one display, with the 8 too?

-- 
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...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] Moonlight reloaded

2012-11-09 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Fri, 9 Nov 2012 10:49:30 +, Renk wrote in message 
e495a106ff5f31448739e79d34138c191e161...@mbs1.ad.jyu.fi:

 
 I was toying with this for a while, but now I have a reasonably cheap
 solution to render moonlight effects:
 
 http://www.flightgear.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=47t=14755start=195#p170250
 
 Now, all I need is the info about the current moon phase and if the
 moon is above the horizon which is *somewhere* to set the moonlight
 strength paramater, and we're good to go. Anyone knows how to get at
 this info?

..chk down $YOUR.GIT-ROOT/simgear/simgear/ephemeris 
Disclaimer: my tree was last updated Feb 21'st.

-- 
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...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

--
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Re: [Flightgear-devel] FG Steering Committee :-) Was: Stand-alone ATC client and Canvas

2012-10-08 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Tue, 9 Oct 2012 00:34:13 +0200, Martin wrote in message 
20121008223413.ga1...@cray1.mgras.de:

 On Mon, Oct 08, 2012 at 09:33:36PM +, Martin Spott wrote:
 
  Well, but the wording You are advised not to start working on
  anything directly related to this is highly inappropriate.
  Apparently someone has completely failed to understand the topic.
 
 It came to my attention he's a Wiki moderator and it looks like he
 enjoys abusing his powers to enforce advice against development ideas
 which don't conform to his personal favourites.
 
 This is sad, very sad,
 
   Martin.

..somebody I should have trolled away for making people use 
C#, Mono etc to try trap them in Microsoft submarine patent 
litigation?

-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

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Re: [Flightgear-devel] X-Plane sued for patent infringement

2012-09-15 Thread Arnt Karlsen
On Sat, 15 Sep 2012 08:42:40 +0200, Tim wrote in message 
CAPK_1fyqmUGgLrEO8KEUPGNvUHb5Frcr=ypieemg7m_oyjn...@mail.gmail.com:

 http://games.slashdot.org/story/12/09/14/2048240/patent-troll-sues-x-plane
 
 It turns out that the patent has nothing to do with flight simulation
 but with remote license checking, but still. The Slashdot article has
 the line X-plane is a cross-platform flight simulator app, notably
 the only serious one that supports Mac OSX and Linux. In the comments
 the serious part refers to X-Plane being FAA certified. Now, I
 know that software isn't FAA certified -- complete systems --are and
 that FlightGear has been used in commercial simulators too, but
 someone (Curt?) with the real details might want to chime in with a
 correction.

..looks like Austin's big sin was make X-plane an Android app. 
Who are the other 8 app developers?

..he should have dual-licensed X-Plane, _much_ easier to 
find pro bono lawyer etc help with the GPL.   Oh well.

-- 
..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt Karlsen
...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry...
  Scenarios always come in sets of three: 
  best case, worst case, and just in case.

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