Re: [Flightgear-devel] More ideas on dogfighting

2007-05-11 Thread Didier Fabert
There is a way which satisfied everybody : make an official add-on with full weapons capabilities (not me, i'm not please to have this in default code, just because my children play with it). People who doesn't like weapons, doesn't install the add-on. Le Friday 11 May 2007 07:51:51 Ampere K.

Re: [Flightgear-devel] More ideas on dogfighting

2007-05-11 Thread Holger Wirtz
Hello, after reading this thread I also want to drop some words: First I thaught dogfight would be nice. Ok, there will ever be cheaters and people who cannot differentiate between simple fun playing and the real world. But I think this is not the problem of FlightGear. In _my_ opinion

Re: [Flightgear-devel] More ideas on dogfighting

2007-05-11 Thread Vivian Meazza
Holger Wirtz wrote after reading this thread I also want to drop some words: First I thaught dogfight would be nice. Ok, there will ever be cheaters and people who cannot differentiate between simple fun playing and the real world. But I think this is not the problem of FlightGear.

Re: [Flightgear-devel] More ideas on dogfighting

2007-05-11 Thread Detlef Faber
Am Donnerstag, den 10.05.2007, 23:55 +0200 schrieb Maik Justus: Hi, what's about using separate server(s) (not connected to the classical servers) for the dogfight mode? If you log on a classical server, you would have no dogfight capability. Maik I'd agree to seperate the combat ready

[Flightgear-devel] [BUG] FGplib - Animations - Scale

2007-05-11 Thread Vivian Meazza
The scale animation appears to have a bug when applied to submodels. The scaling is applied to a group of submodels, then when the first of the group's life expires, the scale animation is reset and applied to the next group. The use-personality tag might be expected to resolve this issue, but

Re: [Flightgear-devel] More ideas on dogfighting

2007-05-11 Thread Vivian Meazza
Detlef Faber Am Donnerstag, den 10.05.2007, 23:55 +0200 schrieb Maik Justus: Hi, what's about using separate server(s) (not connected to the classical servers) for the dogfight mode? If you log on a classical server, you would have no dogfight capability. Maik I'd agree

Re: [Flightgear-devel] Radar improvement

2007-05-11 Thread Melchior FRANZ
* Vivian Meazza -- Thursday 10 May 2007: I discussed the improved radar with Melchior, he is very reluctant to include it because it is plib only. Yes, I said that I wouldn't like to commit plib-only features. It's ok to have new features in fg/osg that aren't backported to fg/plib, but the

Re: [Flightgear-devel] More ideas on dogfighting

2007-05-11 Thread James Palmer
Thanks to all for the input... the collaboration of many is what makes FG so great in my opinion. I still plan to eventually add some sort of dogfighting capability, HOWEVER,... I plan to start in the area detailed by this

Re: [Flightgear-devel] More ideas on dogfighting

2007-05-11 Thread Bill Galbraith
_ From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of James Palmer Sent: Friday, May 11, 2007 8:06 AM To: FlightGear developers discussions Subject: Re: [Flightgear-devel] More ideas on dogfighting Thanks to all for the input... the collaboration of many is what makes FG

Re: [Flightgear-devel] More ideas on dogfighting

2007-05-11 Thread Gene Buckle
I am one of those who are not enthusiastic about adding weapons to FlightGear. However, if combat capability is added, I think we would need to limit its scope. The only limit that should be in place would be a client control that would ignore physical effects and would not display visual

Re: [Flightgear-devel] Latest OT/OSG/SG/FG unusable

2007-05-11 Thread Csaba Halász
On 5/10/07, Nick Warne [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I am surprised nobody using CVS/SVN FG/SG/OSG reports this issue (or replied to this) - there was a lot of chatter about it in IRC. The OSG SVN from last friday works for me as usual (with SG/FG CVS from the same time). I have given the exact

Re: [Flightgear-devel] More ideas on dogfighting

2007-05-11 Thread Curtis Olson
On 5/11/07, Gene Buckle wrote: Right. Online combat and Chess have two things in common. First, they're both forms of one on one combat and secondly, nobody ever dies from either. Actually, online combat would be safer than Chess I think. You'd never have to worry about playing some nutjob

Re: [Flightgear-devel] More ideas on dogfighting

2007-05-11 Thread Gene Buckle
Suggested Solution #1 - DFMP is server driven and server coordinated: The dogfighting MP (DFMP) should be server driven (thanks to Lethe for the insight into this direction) and server coordinated. ?Clients should send user input information to the server and let the server calculate where

Re: [Flightgear-devel] More ideas on dogfighting

2007-05-11 Thread Curtis Olson
On 5/11/07, Gene Buckle wrote: If this wasn't involving a _simulator_, I might be inclined to agree with you. However, it's a bloody _game_. Things that go *boom* in games are typically pretty cool. (unless you're against the unfair exploitation and destruction of things that don't exist)

Re: [Flightgear-devel] More ideas on dogfighting

2007-05-11 Thread Gene Buckle
thing a 2 year old boy is going to do the first time he sees some longish rigid toy to play with ... of course he's going to pick it up and point it an someone and say bang, bang, bang. Give 'em a P90. They're kid sized. :) (See Gunslinger Girls) So I think we can debate nature vs. nurture

Re: [Flightgear-devel] More ideas on dogfighting

2007-05-11 Thread Gene Buckle
Right. Online combat and Chess have two things in common. First, they're both forms of one on one combat and secondly, nobody ever dies from either. Actually, online combat would be safer than Chess I think. You'd never have to worry about playing some nutjob that just might try to bash

Re: [Flightgear-devel] More ideas on dogfighting

2007-05-11 Thread Martin Spott
Gene Buckle wrote: [... lots of stuff ...] As I already said in an earlier posting: I'm not certain if it's really the kids we have to fear. I guess some grown-ups that are going wild are much worse ! I fear there's not much to add :-/ Martin. -- Unix _IS_ user friendly - it's

Re: [Flightgear-devel] More ideas on dogfighting

2007-05-11 Thread Maik Justus
Hi James, but how do I explain to my daughters, that suddenly one of the circling planes disappears? Periodically! And from the other point of view: -A combat-player probably would not like to decide each time, if the aircraft on the radar is in the civilian mode or in the dogfight mode. -Two

Re: [Flightgear-devel] More ideas on dogfighting

2007-05-11 Thread Vivian Meazza
Well, as the Irish would say, if you want to get there, you don't want to start here. Good luck. And if you want to see how much work would be involved, compare that task with the cutover to osg - now 6 months old and nowhere near completion. Vivian -Original Message- From: [EMAIL

Re: [Flightgear-devel] More ideas on dogfighting

2007-05-11 Thread Martin Spott
Vivian Meazza wrote: Well, as the Irish would say, if you want to get there, you don't want to start here. Good luck. And if you want to see how much work would be involved, compare that task with the cutover to osg - now 6 months old and nowhere near completion. Indeed, implementing the

[Flightgear-devel] Small request about sound in Flightgear

2007-05-11 Thread alexis bory
Hi, I deployed huge efforts to simulate an A-10 with stopped engines at start up. The effect is quite good after the execution of all needed Nasal: gauges to zero, no electrical power, no engine sound. But all of this doesn't exist when FG starts up. The consequence is a huge engine noise at

[Flightgear-devel] More A-10 updates

2007-05-11 Thread alexis bory
hi, Another round of cleaning, less properties spawned every where, a few bugs corrected, cosmetics. attached are: A-10-20070511.diff A-10-fuel.nas (goes in A-10/Nasal repertory) to be removed from CVS: A-10/Nasal/aar.nas thanks, Alexis # Properties under /consumables/fuel/tank[n

Re: [Flightgear-devel] More ideas on dogfighting

2007-05-11 Thread Gene Buckle
I heavily doubt. The simple fact that already these small kids are so much influenced by depiction of war/crime, that they consider taking the flute for a rifle (even resp. especially if it's just a game) as common practice, should scare us - and certainly this doesn't justify turning

[Flightgear-devel] Fly-by view mode

2007-05-11 Thread Curtis Olson
For those that haven't found it yet, the new fly-by view in the CVS version of FlightGear is *really* cool! I find it difficult to fly real time using it, but if you are on autopilot it is nice. Also, it is really neat for watching takeoffs, landings, and other maneuvering in replay mode.

Re: [Flightgear-devel] Latest OT/OSG/SG/FG unusable

2007-05-11 Thread gh.robin
On Fri 11 May 2007 15:28, Csaba Halász wrote: On 5/10/07, Nick Warne [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I am surprised nobody using CVS/SVN FG/SG/OSG reports this issue (or replied to this) - there was a lot of chatter about it in IRC. The OSG SVN from last friday works for me as usual (with SG/FG

[Flightgear-devel] FG air combat thoughts

2007-05-11 Thread pebble garden
I enjoy air combat sims. Adding air combat functionality to FG multiplayer is an interesting prospect, but it's not everyone's cup of tea. Personally I'd like the option, but I'd also like to exempt myself when not in the mood. I've been thinking about it for the last day or so, and here are a

Re: [Flightgear-devel] More ideas on dogfighting

2007-05-11 Thread James Palmer
I'm sorry if I've hit a sore spot with some by bringing up dogfighting development. I still intend to investigate the possibility more, but I will completely make the capability an opt-in type. I'm thinking along the lines of a 3 command line option set. (see only non-dogfighters, see only

Re: [Flightgear-devel] Latest OT/OSG/SG/FG unusable

2007-05-11 Thread Georg Vollnhals
gh.robin schrieb: Again, After many research, i have found an OSG svn/cvs version which suit to me, good frame rate close to that one i get with plib (plib with 3D clouds and shadow). That version is dated 10-04-2007. Regards Hi Gérard, as my OSG framerate has dropped from 85

Re: [Flightgear-devel] Fly-by view mode

2007-05-11 Thread Melchior FRANZ
* Curtis Olson -- Friday 11 May 2007: For those that haven't found it yet, the new fly-by view [...] Unfortunately, it makes obvious that the OpenAL spatial sound wasn't properly finished. The listener position is just not right, and I assume it is this simplification in main.cxx: // Right

Re: [Flightgear-devel] Fly-by view mode

2007-05-11 Thread Curtis Olson
OpenAL has it's own coordinate system. There are two issues to think about. 1. it makes no sense physically to hear cockpit sounds from the external views, yet we probably want that to happen, but the 3d nature of openal makes this a bit interesting. 2. openal has a 3d world coordinate system,

Re: [Flightgear-devel] More ideas on dogfighting

2007-05-11 Thread Georg Vollnhals
James Palmer schrieb: I'm sorry if I've hit a sore spot with some by bringing up dogfighting development. I still intend to investigate the possibility more, but I will completely make the capability an opt-in type. I'm thinking along the lines of a 3 command line option set. (see only

Re: [Flightgear-devel] Latest OT/OSG/SG/FG unusable

2007-05-11 Thread gh.robin
On Fri 11 May 2007 22:30, Georg Vollnhals wrote: gh.robin schrieb: Again, After many research, i have found an OSG svn/cvs version which suit to me, good frame rate close to that one i get with plib (plib with 3D clouds and shadow). That version is dated 10-04-2007. Regards

Re: [Flightgear-devel] More ideas on dogfighting

2007-05-11 Thread Martin Spott
Gene Buckle wrote: Horsepucky. Combat in Flight Gear would _never_ be a shoot-em game. Virtual != Real. EVER. If your little linoleum lizard can't understand that, it's YOUR fault. Don't nanny-state me because you can't grow a pair. Hey, thanks for providing such a nice occasion to laugh

Re: [Flightgear-devel] Latest OT/OSG/SG/FG unusable

2007-05-11 Thread Georg Vollnhals
gh.robin schrieb: Hello Georg, Because, i have a lot of backup (SG/FG/OSG) , i did rebuilt FG with an older OSG (10-04-2007) i had kept. Not from a new download The best, i guess, for you is to download from my URL the sources. I have built a tar.gz file which contains

Re: [Flightgear-devel] Fly-by view mode

2007-05-11 Thread Curtis Olson
On 5/11/07, Curtis Olson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: For those that haven't found it yet, the new fly-by view in the CVS version of FlightGear is *really* cool! I find it difficult to fly real time using it, but if you are on autopilot it is nice. Also, it is really neat for watching takeoffs,

Re: [Flightgear-devel] More ideas on dogfighting

2007-05-11 Thread syd sandy
On Fri, 11 May 2007 21:58:50 + (UTC) Martin Spott [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Gene Buckle wrote: Horsepucky. Combat in Flight Gear would _never_ be a shoot-em game. Virtual != Real. EVER. If your little linoleum lizard can't understand that, it's YOUR fault. Don't nanny-state me

Re: [Flightgear-devel] Latest OT/OSG/SG/FG unusable

2007-05-11 Thread Georg Vollnhals
Georg Vollnhals schrieb: gh.robin schrieb: Hello Georg, Because, i have a lot of backup (SG/FG/OSG) , i did rebuilt FG with an older OSG (10-04-2007) i had kept. Not from a new download The best, i guess, for you is to download from my URL the sources. I have

[Flightgear-devel] More A-10 updates - replace previous broken diff file

2007-05-11 Thread alexis bory
hi, Sorry for the previous malformed diff file. Description Cleaning, less properties spawned everywhere, a few bugs corrected, cosmetics. in the attached tarball A-10-diff-20070512.tgz: A-10-20070512.diff (made from $FGROOT/Aircraft/A-10 Nasal/A-10-fuel.nas (new file) to be deleted:

Re: [Flightgear-devel] More ideas on dogfighting

2007-05-11 Thread Ampere K. Hardraade
On Friday 11 May 2007 10:28, Gene Buckle wrote: Banned? BANNED?! Good luck with that. If this wasn't involving a _simulator_, I might be inclined to agree with you. However, it's a bloody _game_. Things that go *boom* in games are typically pretty cool. While development over the past