I've been reading through a lot of the TerraGear code after I've read the
center line problem but I'm interested in tackling a different problem. It
doesn't help I don't have an intimate knowledge of C++, nor have I ever
properly compiled TerraGear on Linux... so please bear with me.
Yes, I understand that. My vision was the flag would be set before
genapts is ran. Or are all airports generated at a single pass? If
that's the case perhaps genapts should use the literal runway number
from apt.dat, and apt.dat can be edited to replace the leading zero with
a space on US GA
Given the number of airfields in the US I think this is a good idea as long as
we can implement it without breaking genapts,
I'm going to go forward with heuristically-defining other runway markings since
there shouldn't be any problems with defining single-wide markings for some
I just wanted to drop a note I will be contacting the Software Freedom Law
Center - http://www.softwarefreedom.org - on behalf of FlightGear.
If you have any questions, comments or concerns please don't hesitate to email
me -off the list-.
I've been doing research into copyrights and am shocked to see there is no (C)
(years)-2010 FlightGear anywhere in FGRun or in the main flight simulation
However, it appears looking through a sample of the source code the code is
indeed (C) (year) by the authors who wrote it. This
With regards to what has been said, the GPLv2 gives the end user the right to
both modify the software and, if certain conditions are met, distribute the
software. It does NOT change the fact that all the contributors actually own
the copyright on the software, or it appears in FlightGears'
I appreciate your comments, but in that case, why is FlightGear licensed under
the GPL at all if we're not willing to enforce it? The GPL is designed to be as
open as possible, but still giving rights to the people who hold the copyright
on the product!
See section 1 of GPLv2:
I don't know if we've gone final with everything yet, but if we haven't, would
it be possible for somebody here to:
* double-check to see if the mushroom water-towers still exist under the town
definition in materials.xml; and, if so,
* remove them.
As we'll have a lot more areas defined as
It's been a long time since I (re-)wrote the random object code for OSG, but
recollection is that we use the same random number seed when generating
random model placements, to ensure that a building is in the same place on
I suspect that part of the problem with the
I'm a bit confused. Are random objects actually starting up at different
points in each run now? I haven't noticed that nor have I seen a report of
that. All I've seen in this thread is that the code that resets the random
generator in each tile (well, several times per tile) may be affecting
I've /probably/ done the most extensive amount of research into this at the
moment, some key points:
1) If we want or need legal representation, please visit
I have already contacted them, so please don't send them a bunch of emails
Hello all -
My previous email may have been lost in the fray so I'd just like to float my
If you have contributed code, please check to make sure your copyright, and the
date, is in the header for the source code you have contributed.
This will make it easier for us to
I've made some simple Hawaii textures based on real, freely available USGS
aerial imagery of Oahu. I have sand, grass, scrub and farming textures so far.
I'd be happy to provide these even though they're not excellent.
Recently, I have been working on Switzerland scenery for FlightGear. Hopefully
beta landcover will be released soon.
At the moment, I've been making use of as many materials as I can find to
accurately model the control tower at LSZB - Bern/Belp, and through some
pictures I've noticed
I have failed yet again to get TerraGear running on two computers.
I recently tried a technique for the first time to determine land cover from
satellite images. I am glad to say I succeeded, but there are still a number of
problems with the scenery, from null values to cloud cover.
Either Curt or someone who has contributed a significant amount of code to the
FlightGear project should look into talking with an open source lawyer.
On copyright grounds, we can only sue to enforce the GPL. Basically, we can
only make FPS GPL-compliant, which I do not believe they are, but I
For the love of...
Whatever your opinion on the legality of what they are doing, this is indeed a
problem and reflects negatively on the community.
Ignoring it will not make it go away. We need to know what we can do.
Please, please, someone with a copyright interest in the software please
I'm using the most recent .exe build of TerraGear from the uni-duisburg website.
I believe I have followed all the steps properly to set up the work directory -
I have run hgtchop, terrafit, genapts, and ogr-decode on everything, and have a
work folder which appears to resemble what it
I'm trying to figure out the best way to model the Rheinfall in Switzerland for
an upcoming scenery project.
There is no land cover layer for waterfalls. A fountain-like particulate model
may work but there are problems with creating terrain-like models.
What is the best way to go about this?
There's a big visual problem with some airports, especially when they are next
to lakes or water in the more top-drawer scenery.
For an airport like Innsbruck, where the airport automatically generated grass
polygon juts into the river cs_lake, or like Honolulu or Macau, when there is
More and more users are starting to generate scenery which cannot be reconciled
with the mapserver database - usually, by taking CORINE and OSM data and
incorporating them together. Some of the results are very nice and are
inspiring others to contribute in certain parts of the world,
To help put things in perspective, the people who are generating the beautiful
scenery on the forum are using the same CORINE data set we are attempting to
get into the scenery, and are using OSM roads, the license about which I am
The advantage of this is we get to fly over higher
Replying to Heiko:
But increases the attractiveness of a whole project called FlightGear, as it
shows that it is not difficult to make an attractive qualitity scenery for
free, and enlarges the freedom of use to any users.
I am not arguing that point - as I said the CORINE data is available
I appreciate the ephithet being hurled in my direction, especially because all
we are pointing out is that CORINE data should eventually be part of the land
cover database anyways, which may deprecate some (but not necessarily all) of
the third-party scenery projects currently being produced,
Currently, TerraGear is mostly being redeveloped in order to handle more
detailed scenery - recent advances in FlightGear scenery data technology have
made this necessary. I think this is a lot of GIS C++ work - I am primarily a
data contributor. So please note anything you do should
Just tonight I have finished modeling the first skyscraper in FlightGear for
Vancouver, BC, Canada.
I am running FlightGear and the modeling software on an old laptop (which I am
using FlightGear on solely for scenery development purposes). I downloaded the
proper world scenery tile from:
This isn't just a Terrasync problem as I have scenery files in multiple scenery
folders for testing purposes. So if the helipad was in my Scenery2/ folder, it
also wouldn't work...
The solution as I think has been said is to figure out if there is a way to get
the name of the top
I have sent Martin an updated layout for KTPA. As is my understanding, thie
runways will be updated in the next world scenery build, unless I've done
Protect Your Site and
c) Doesn't 213 seem like a small number compared to the thousands of
updates that have been applied to Robin's apt.dat since FG forked
it in 2008?
If you are looking for a project, we need someone to incorporate the new
X-Plane format into TerraGear - while keeping polygon counts as low as
With a large addition to the database today, there are now 2009 unique models
in the scenery model database! We have now surpassed the 2000 mark as the
FlightGear world continues to be populated, especially with non-generic models.
A thank you to everyone who has submitted unique models to the
Part of the texture problem is with the current data format we are using -
there are a number of airports where the texture is incorrect, especially the
threshold textures - but we currently only have four options for runways. Also,
some countries use yellow textures for some airports - see
Just to comment on this recent thread, most of my scenery work is not in
TerraSync nor complied - the areas I know of are the Caribbean between Anguilla
and Nevis, all of Hawai'i but Ni'ihau, and I believe Oakland Int'l Airport.
I have available a finished London landclass and a finished
Based on my (brief) reading of some United States statutes, I would suggest we
can continue using these trademarks until asked not to do so. I don't think
this will bring forth a lawsuit, most likely a cease and desist action which is
easily complied with, if it is on trademark
You are all being ridiculous except for Curt.
We have the ability to sell the product and could theoretically get sued even
though we are open-source. As I have said, the best thing to do is put in a
legal disclaimer saying we are not affiliated with any companies which may be
Fair use is also a defense for trademarks.
The problem is these are defenses - they will only work if we are defendants in
a lawsuit, and we don't want to litigate.
We should take a path which maximizes our resources while minimizes our
potential to get sued, or at least have a lot of data
I don't have commit power, but I strongly recommend you include text along with
the model which says Red Bull does not endorse your model or FlightGear. I'd
also write why you think it's okay to use the trademark in this instance, which
is to accurately reflect a real-life livery of a
It has been very frustrating to watch this community repeatedly trip over legal
issues. This has finally become a great enough source of frustration to me
where all I can say is good luck in the future and enjoy the scenery (whenever
it comes out).
I find this interesting- wasn't it you (beside Martin) telling us that Google
Earth can't be used anymore for scenery models due to legal issues?
Yes. The Google Maps/Google Earth license is not compatible with the GPL. If
you are interested in this OpenStreetMap has a good discussion of the
Well, until now you didn't say much about in this topic here. But as I can
see, you are the one in the whole Project who does understand much more of
laws and legal issues than anyone others here.
I cannot tell if this is sarcasm but in defense I have done a lot of reading to
try and figure
There is a lot of custom scenery I've contributed just sitting on the mapserver.
Due to some problems it seems as contributions in the scenery department have
fallen off recently, despite some great recent work with adding buildings to
New York City, and a new contributor adding
First and foremost, a huge THANK YOU goes out to Martin Spott. Without his
help, including giving access to resources I otherwise would not have, I would
have not been able to create the underlying data for this scenery much less
generate it. So thank you, Martin.
This scenery product is
Thanks for the help with the airports, I'll recompile the scenery to fix the
problem. I'm still learning my way around TerraGear.
Is the problem with KVUO's definition, or rather within the program?
While a quick aerial check of KVUO shows the runway does have basic markings,
I've just finished compiling custom Rio de Janeiro scenery. It is beautiful and
I didn't mess up airport elevations this time :)
It should be available on my website soon,
However Sugarloaf Mountain just does not exist in the scenery.
If you want to get 'really' fancy, rwy_prec.cxx and rwy_visual.cxx should also
be updated at line 101 with the same fix.
It's a major breakthrough. An authentic gaming
smartphone on the
It seems to me, on line 97 of rwy_nonprec.cxx, the current line:
double length = rwy_info.length / 2.0 + 2.0;
// we also check for the displaced threshold, which may make the runway too
short (old KVUO bug).
double length = ((rwy_info.length - (rwy_info.disp_thresh1 +
A number of Pacific Northwest airports have changed their identification.
For instance Ranger Creek, WA (near Mt. Rainier) is now K21W (from 6WA8?).
Pierce Co. Thun is now KPLU, from 1S0.
Tillamook is now KTMK, from S47.
How do we make these changes?
If someone could commit these to git and update materials.xml, well, I'd be
Not the best textures admittedly ... but considering we don't currently have a
I've also been making other textures other than just golf courses, here's a
list of them. Feel free to commit or add them as I don't have access, am not
completely sure what to do, and am not even sure if these are quality.
Most of these were created out of the desire to get some real Pacific
I have a shapefile of buildings in Honolulu and I'm trying to figure out the
best way to turn this into FlightGear scenery.
I'm less interested in generating all ~12 buildings ( think of the frame
rate hit ! ) and more interested in getting the footprints of the tallest
As an aside, someone needs to check the runway startup code, I'm sure my cessna
or piper cub started on Helipad 1 at KOAK.
Also will be looking at the golf course texture, it's displaying way too large.
Couple things I've noticed with 2.4.0:
- the dirt texture maps to rock - which makes KOAK look very strange as there
is a thin dirt barrier between the airport and the ocean which is now mapped to
rock. Rock and dirt are two different concepts. Unfortunately, a lot of the
time remotely sensed
The coordinates for the runway ends for the ES03 Hova airport John Denker
The other airport wasn't available unfortunately, and I don't have TaxiDraw to
fix and send this in.
Consider airports may appear misplaced for two reasons:
I don't know why it's crashing, but I've done tests with +600 objects all in a
very small area and sometimes there is a slight delay as FlightGear loads a new
view as all the objects load. Not a lag, but you look out the window and
suddenly an object appears.
If the scenery is crashing, then I
I believe the Anchorage terminal is in the scenery models repository, but no
one I know of has worked on Alaska scenery until this month.
While there are some square degrees still conspicuous by their absence, here is
11 square degrees worth of Alaska land cover data, developed specifically for
This is somewhat off-topic to FlightGear, so I apologize - but I respond to
John Denker: Having looked over what you are trying to do, I strongly recommend
using QGIS with the GRASS plugin.
Very rarely do I use any of GRASS' built-in visualization programs - and very
rarely do I use any of
Admittedly I work with GRASS solely on the text-based side - rarely if ever
touching the GUI - but hopefully I can help:
1) To be honest, it's probably easiest to continue to use d.his and then
display the resulting map using the GRASS plugin - QGIS doesn't really have
many (if any?)
I've released a beta build of the area surrounding PAJN (two square degrees)
I've used a different technique to create the data for the underlying scenery.
Please let me know what you think, as I'm not too happy with the outcome - I
I apologize in advance considering I'm in a very complaining mood at the moment.
I've just compiled 4 square degrees of scenery around the Minneapolis/St. Paul
area in an attempt to figure out whether or not my Alaska scenery creation
process worked on places in the lower 48 states.
Very good read - thanks. I was worried the limit had been reached and that may
have been demoralizing - but I'm going to keep pushing forward now.
Still, as a scenery developer and not a programmer, I'm still wondering what
the limit is before the swirlies start floating around. Is it vertices?
I have just uploaded 15 square degrees of land cover data to my website.
These is the raw shapefiles needed to run TerraGear - they're ready to go to
create scenery. THIS IS NOT FINISHED SCENERY.
However after generating shapefiles for Lake Tahoe/Reno I realized that this
scenery touched the
Looks like coastline correction and vmap0 classification, apart from the
previously submitted Oakland data? Good work, but curious as to why TerraGear
would be so problematic.
The USA's land cover is in raster format, so this data is just the end result
of the script which cleans and
NLCD 2006 data. Previous digitization efforts have usually used NOAA coastal
land cover data, but that is obviously only for coastal regions.
Get your Android app more play: Bring it to the BlackBerry
Just compiled three degrees of improved scenery in southwest Colorado
(including airports KDRO, KTEX). My problem is FlightGear hangs upon loading
the scenery. It's still responsive because the refresh-meter keeps working in
the bottom left, but the scenery never loads.
Thanks for your response.
The TerraGear build finished successfully, could this be a problem with a
stable 2.4 build not liking a new TerraGear scenery format, especially with
I haven't been able to test this, but if anyone wants to test newly generated
quality scenery, Durango and Telluride are available here:
Three square degrees of scenery from 37-38N to 107-110W, about a 95Mb download.
As we've now proven highly detailed scenery is now only for the latest versions
of FlightGear, perhaps it is time to create two scenery forks - basic scenery
and advanced scenery.
This would serve two purposes, first to keep scenery available to
lower-end/lower-bandwidth users, and to increase
The DC area buildings are placed accurately, but the underlying terrain is not
placed as accurately.
I am assuming you are using the default scenery and not the updated Washington
DC scenery, which is available here and should fix your problem, if that is
indeed your problem:
The new build of the Durango scenery is available at
I'm sure there's going to be problems with this scenery as well - the file size
went up slightly but probably not enough to solve the problem.
The problem with the first batch was that Scrub Cover
I have hope as the file size actually went down in this build, but perhaps
something else went awry.
The only change is remapping Scrub to ShrubCover. Please let me know if
In other news, this is 3 square degrees of scenery - I
Roland, thank you for the screenshots!
From your screenshots it looks to me as if the ShrubCover worked this time
around as this was the cause of the null-elevation ocean areas in the first
The other elevation errors, do they still drop down to zero elevation as well?
If so, then
It looks like there are a number of holes in the SRTM-1 data. I don't know if
GRASS can export HGT files using r.out.binary so I'm not sure if I can fill
nulls, so I'll have to go back and re-generate the scenery using SRTM-3 data.
Think I've got it this time. I did test though, still works only with versions
Download here: http://www.stattosoftware.com/flightgear/Durango.zip (90Mb)
Please let me know if this works for you - if it does I'll keep compiling
Colorado scenery, possibly to co-release with the next
Also, note the scenery is not working because of specific problems with the
cs_scrub.shp file. There are no elevation problems with the SRTM, for whatever
reason the Scrub file is not being turned into scenery properly.
Because I am using ignore-landmass, it is being turned into ocean, which of
I'm done trying to play with this for the moment, but anyone who wishes to play
with the shapefiles can download them at
There are 8 total chunks of shapefiles for Colorado scenery available, let me
know if you would like me to post any of
Just reporting, I've been working on creating some models near PASI.
When I started up PASI using fgfs --disable-real-weather-fetch --airport=PASI
none of the OBJECT_STATIC or OBJECT_SHARED models loaded. OBJECT_SIGN models
DID load, however.
I was rather livid for a few
I need to stop sending emails when tired :)
All the data continuously generated in your IT infrastructure
contains a definitive record of
Thank you for testing!
When you said nothing showed up, were you flying over ocean, or an endless void
of nothing at all?
There seems to be a problem loading this newly generated scenery and I have no
idea how to fix it.
I've released a new version of Minneapolis scenery:
I cannot make this scenery load in version 2.4, probably because it hopefully
fixes the nasty 'swirlies' problem.
If anyone gets this scenery to work, and it actually
Thanks for the update, is there any way I may be able to ask you for a
screenshot of the concrete things?
To everyone: any noticeable problems with scenery tile loading, swirlies, or
holes down to sea level?
Minneapolis used OSM roads (well, just motorways), I don't know how that
changes distribution but if there are no problems feel free to distribute the
I have no idea how this would be distributed en masse. Part of the problem is
it does not work in 2.4.
Thank you to everyone for the
I would be happy to help, though I don't know of many non-CORINE sceneries
(Helgoland and some photoreal sceneries). I can make a list of the sceneries
I've created and hopefully other scenery developers will come forward?
All the sceneries I've been creating are GPL, with the
Well, the scenery structure is dissimilar to the normal structure of patching
A scenery like Washington, DC does not have the same frame rate hit as Juneau
or Innsbruck does.
And as stated there are now sceneries incompatible with older versions of
The problem is, some new
Here is a list of scenery I have generated. Some of the scenery is not on the
mapserver, but should not be considered private, as I have always intended
for this scenery to be included in the public server.
Switzerland (partially replaces Bodensee)
Colorado (entire state)*
Considering the same legal issues arise frequently, would you mind posting a
link to the discussion, because all I can find is this:
And in a quick response to the second question, your scenery would be more
detailed if you built it using
It looks like the trademark claim is energy based, in my opinion no possible
consumer confusion between a piece of integrated software fetching a virtual
world from a computer server and natural gas drilling.
Terrasync only downloads from the Terrasync server. If the scenery data on the
Custom layer has not been placed in the Terrasync server, you will not be able
to download it.
I have no idea why the improved Washington, DC is not on the Terrasync server
(or for that matter, the improved Rio de
Forgive my ignorance, but what is the current reason for the backlog of adding
new scenery areas to the custom scenery server?
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I have 17 chunks of 3x1 degree or 2x2 degree raw shapefile data I've been
generating from USGS data for the western United States.
These should be as topologically clean (as is practicable with shapefiles)
because they've been exported from a 'clean' GRASS database and are ready to
I have made a couple airports which are not in the airport database in the 8.10
format in TaxiDraw.
Before anyone tells me about 8.50 these airports are nothing more than missing
What is the best way to add them to apt.dat, so I might be able to use
Terragear with these
The airports I would like to add within my area of interest are HUJI Jinja,
HUKJ Kajjansi, and HUKK Kakira. They are all in Uganda - many Ugandan airports
are not in the database, but there are also less than five airports with paved
runways in the country, as far as I can tell.
How can I
I know I can export airports as .dat files. I'm more wondering about the
file format for the .dat file, 8.10 and 8.50.
If I export the files as .dat, can I simply append these files to apt.dat or
do I have to merge them somehow?
And these airstrips are just a runway and one or two or three
I now have landcover for more than 2/3rds of the state of california batch
processed, along with parts of Southern Oregon (including Crater Lake):
The exciting news is the very northern block actually is flush with the very
southern edge of the
Towns are not point features. The vmap0 represents towns as points, but these
particular points are parsed by terragear and turned into 1km by 1km polygons
which are burned into the terrain. That gives the square appearance in the
In custom scenery, medium to low
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