[fonc] Re: Ceres and Oberon

2011-08-31 Thread Eduardo Cavazos
Alan Kay wrote: I'm glad that he has finally come to appreciate OOP. There are two kinds of people on this list. Those who can tell when Alan is joking and those that can't. :-D Don't know which I am but I can at least say that the OOP that is in Oberon is not what Alan had in mind when he

Re: [fonc] Re: Ceres and Oberon

2011-08-31 Thread Alan Kay
Hi folks I was going to let this go ... but there are some important historical facts that are at least fascinating -- and they certainly put some of this into better context. Many of these threads can be chased back to the development of the Algol language and especially the B5000 computer

P.S. Re: [fonc] Re: Ceres and Oberon

2011-08-31 Thread Alan Kay
P.S. I should have directly pointed out that there were many earlier systems that did the experiment of taking a single language and writing everything in it. (Some earlier than Smalltalk, etc., although it was interesting for being early, small, and very high level) Cheers, Alan

Re: [fonc] Re: Ceres and Oberon

2011-08-31 Thread Jecel Assumpcao Jr.
Alan, thanks for the detailed history! 1966 was the year I entered grad school (having programmed for 4-5 years, but essentially knowing nothing about computer science). Shortly after encounters with and lightning bolts from the sky induced by Sketchpad and Simula, I found the Euler papers

Re: [fonc] Re: Ceres and Oberon

2011-08-31 Thread Alan Kay
The Flex Machine was the omelet you have to throw away to clean the pan, so I haven't put any effort into saving that history. But there were 4 or 5 pretty good things and 4 or 5 really bad things that helped the Alto-Smalltalk effort a few years later. I'd say that the huge factors after

[fonc] More information about the text layout engine for paragraphs in VPRI Tech Report

2011-08-31 Thread nchen . dev
Hi I briefly remember Alan and other members of VPRI doing a presentation of the text layout engine while they were here for a short visit to the University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign. I'm currently dealing with some layout work in Morphic and would like to take a deeper look at the

Re: [fonc] More information about the text layout engine for paragraphs in VPRI Tech Report

2011-08-31 Thread Julian Leviston
vpri.og is working for me. Are you talking about Gezira/Nile? http://www.vpri.org/vp_wiki/index.php/Gezira Julian On 01/09/2011, at 5:40 AM, nchen@mac.com wrote: Hi I briefly remember Alan and other members of VPRI doing a presentation of the text layout engine while they were here

Re: [fonc] More information about the text layout engine for paragraphs in VPRI Tech Report

2011-08-31 Thread nchen . dev
vpri.org just came back up a few hours ago. I was talking about Text Field Spec for LObjects at http://www.vpri.org/vp_wiki/index.php/Main_Page. I found the old image with the prototype and have been able to download it and play with it. Ted Kaehler has also been kind enough to answer some