Re: [fonc] Kernel & Maru

2012-04-12 Thread John Zabroski
I understand that AST-editing and even things like TurleScript are cumbersome for many reasons, and that "trapped" is a good way to describe their limitations. But automatically generating IDEs doesn't require the IDEs it generates require rigid user inputs and modal interaction. If anything, pla

Re: [fonc] Article "Lisp as the Maxwell’s equations of software"

2012-04-12 Thread Julian Leviston
This section at once both interests and bothers me > The great Norwegian mathematician Niels Henrik Abel was once asked how he had > become so good at mathematics. He replied that it was “by studying the > masters, not their pupils”. The current essay is motivated by Abel’s > admonishment. As a

Re: [fonc] Kernel & Maru

2012-04-12 Thread Alan Kay
Hi John Yes you are right about Teitelbaum ... As far as "Hansen" the time period is right -- but I think there were several such ... the one I remember seeing was "syntax driven ..." There was a feeling of being trapped ... Cheers, Alan > > From: John Zab

Re: [fonc] Kernel & Maru

2012-04-12 Thread John Zabroski
I would have to dust off my copy of the SG thesis, but I am pretty sure Tom made allowances for free-form syntax editing as well. The major drawback to using free-form syntax editing is that you get fewer guard conditions when deciding grammatical correctness, and so error reporting and recovery i

Re: [fonc] Kernel & Maru

2012-04-12 Thread Alan Kay
Yes, that was part of Tom's work ... Cheers, Alan > > From: John Zabroski >To: Fundamentals of New Computing ; Alan Kay > >Sent: Thursday, April 12, 2012 4:46 PM >Subject: Re: [fonc] Kernel & Maru > > >What does it have to do with thinking about programming

Re: [fonc] Kernel & Maru

2012-04-12 Thread John Zabroski
By the way, I think you are referring to the work done by Reps's thesis advisor, Tim Teitelbaum, and his Cornell Program Synthesizer. Teitelbaum and Reps still work together to this day. Over a year ago I e-mailed Reps asking, "Why did the Synthesizer Generator fail to become mainstream?" Reps,

Re: [fonc] Physics Simulation (Re: Everything You Know (about Parallel Programming) Is Wrong!: A Wild Screed about the Future)

2012-04-12 Thread BGB
On 4/11/2012 11:14 PM, Josh Gargus wrote: On Apr 8, 2012, at 7:31 PM, BGB wrote: now, why, exactly, would anyone consider doing rendering on the server?... One reason might be to amortize the cost of global illumination calculations. Since much of the computation is view-independent, a Rea

[fonc] Article "Lisp as the Maxwell’s equations of software"

2012-04-12 Thread Andre van Delft
FYI: Michael Nielsen wrote a large article "Lisp as the Maxwell’s equations of software", about the famous page 13 of the LISP 1.5 Programmer’s Manual; see http://www.michaelnielsen.org/ddi/lisp-as-the-maxwells-equations-of-software/ The article is discussed on Reddit: http://www.reddit.com/r/p

Re: [fonc] Kernel & Maru

2012-04-12 Thread John Zabroski
What does it have to do with thinking about programming? Are you referring to editing an AST directly? On Apr 12, 2012 7:31 PM, "Alan Kay" wrote: > Hi John > > The simple answer is that Tom's stuff happened in the early 80s, and I was out > of PARC working on things other than Smalltalk. > > I'm

Re: [fonc] Kernel & Maru

2012-04-12 Thread Alan Kay
Hi John The simple answer is that Tom's stuff happened in the early 80s, and I was out of PARC working on things other than Smalltalk. I'm trying to remember something similar that was done earlier (by someone can't recall who, maybe at CMU) that was a good convincer that this was not a grea

Re: [fonc] Kernel & Maru

2012-04-12 Thread John Zabroski
It depends what your goals are. If you want to automatically derive an IDE from a grammar then the best work is the Synthesizer Generator but it is limited to absolutely noncircular attribute grammars IIRC. But it had wicked cool features like incremental live evaluation. Tom Reps won a ACM Disssrt

Re: [fonc] Kernel & Maru

2012-04-12 Thread John Zabroski
On Apr 11, 2012 2:53 PM, "Shawn Morel" wrote: > > This thread is a real treasure trove! Thanks for all the pointers Alan :) > > > A nice feature of Smalltalk (which has been rarely used outside of a small group) is a collection of tools that can be used to create an entirely different language wit

Re: [fonc] Kernel & Maru

2012-04-12 Thread GrrrWaaa
Absolutely ditto. In order to understand Kernel and $vau, I tried reconstructing it using my favourite prototyping language (Lua). Far from complete, but enough to define 'define', 'if' etc.; for me pretty amazing that it works at all. Of course it's easier, since Lua already supports higher

Re: [fonc] Summer Internships At VPRI?

2012-04-12 Thread Emaad Ahmed Manzoor
Hello, Just adding to my previous mail, I would also be interested in working with any organizations on this list pursuing similar goals. Please do get in touch with me if you feel my experience and motivations are a good fit for your research. Thank you, Emaad. On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 9:18 PM,

[fonc] Summer Internships At VPRI?

2012-04-12 Thread Emaad Ahmed Manzoor
Hello, I am a senior computer science undergraduate at BITS - Pilani, Goa Campus [1], India. I hope to gain some experience doing research in programming languages and compiler design. I was wondering, is the VPRI and FONC team open to accommodating international interns from mid-May to August th