Re: [fonc] goals

2010-07-14 Thread BGB
- Original Message - From: K. K. Subramaniam subb...@gmail.com To: fonc@vpri.org Cc: BGB cr88...@hotmail.com Sent: Tuesday, July 13, 2010 9:47 PM Subject: Re: [fonc] goals On Wednesday 14 Jul 2010 9:25:11 am BGB wrote: there is much emphasis on people understanding an entire

Re: [fonc] goals (beyond the pleasure trap?)

2010-07-14 Thread Reuben Thomas
On 14 July 2010 10:49, Antoine van Gelder anto...@g7.org.za wrote: Questions such as how do we define a downward trajectory? or which direction is simple in? or even how can we even possibly hope to measure simple?! There is nothing hard about simplification per se. I don't think I've made a

Re: [fonc] goals

2010-07-14 Thread Reuben Thomas
On 14 July 2010 00:01, John Zabroski johnzabro...@gmail.com wrote: [1] http://www.cs.stir.ac.uk/~kjt/techreps/pdf/TR141.pdf  FOR FUN: Where is the bug here?  The authors claim they are measuring the *economic* expressiveness of languages. I think I don't really follow you here (you seem in a

Re: [fonc] goals

2010-07-14 Thread John Zabroski
Well, you're right. The way I phrased it isn't at all proper. I meant the authors were using economy of expression [1] as their metric. In programming languages lingo, the phrase more expressive the authors use is co-opting the meaning of expressive as defined by Felleisen's expressiveness

Re: [fonc] automation

2010-07-14 Thread Ryan Mitchley
Julian Leviston wrote: This is essentially what I refer to when I talk about planck size of algorithms. You can't get any simpler than a certain size and therefore not only is it incredibly understandable, it simply won't break. Say we have a Maximum Length Sequence constructed using a

Re: [fonc] automation

2010-07-14 Thread BGB
I think it is mostly because the internet is composed of well-defined / agreed-upon protocols and data formats. each part is largely decoupled from the others. it sends and accepts data, and it responds to whatever is happening. often, the protocols are very much layered, with most layers not