Re: FOP Helvetica - is it really Arial?
DuCharme, Bob (LNG) wrote: Here's some interesting historical background from a typographer type (no pun intended) who clearly gets all worked up over the issue: http://www.ms-studio.com/articles.html Bob DuCharmewww.snee.com/bob see http://www.snee.com/bob/xsltquickly for info on book "XSLT Quickly" from Manning Publications. I think that the sheer beauty of this site is intimately related to the fact that Mark Simonson does get worked up about the details. I hear that's where the devil resides. The angels must be there as well. Peter
RE: FOP Helvetica - is it really Arial?
Here's some interesting historical background from a typographer type (no pun intended) who clearly gets all worked up over the issue: http://www.ms-studio.com/articles.html Bob DuCharmewww.snee.com/bob see http://www.snee.com/bob/xsltquickly for info on book "XSLT Quickly" from Manning Publications.
Re: FOP Helvetica - is it really Arial?
Scott Moore wrote: Thanks for all the responses. I'm gonna go with the assumption that Helvetica = Arial and not embed the Arial.TTF file, which bloats the PDF. According to http://partners.adobe.com/asn/developer/acrosdk/docs/filefmtspecs/PDFReference.pdf page 795, Helvetica, Arial and ArialMT are something like synonyms for the built-in sans-serif font. I vaguely remember I read somewhere else on the Adobe site that the 5 font-families supported are Times New Roman, Arial, Courier New, Symbol and Zapf Dingbats, which are incidentally the names of the fonts used in MS Windows. The font metrics file from Adobe uses Helvetica, the canonical name. AFAIK the real fonts Helvetica, Arial and Arial MT are somewhat different, the latter two are designed to resemble the first, which is historically the first being designed, while still have enough differences in details to avoid copyright problems and accusations of plagiarism. J.Pietschmann
RE: FOP Helvetica - is it really Arial?
Thanks for all the responses. I'm gonna go with the assumption that Helvetica = Arial and not embed the Arial.TTF file, which bloats the PDF. Thanks, Scott > -Original Message- > From: Jeremias Maerki [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Wednesday, May 22, 2002 1:56 AM > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: Re: FOP Helvetica - is it really Arial? > > > AFAIK the standard fonts specified in the PDF spec match the base 14 > fontset of PostScript which includes Helvetica, Times, Courier, Symbol > and ZapfDingbats. Acrobat 3.x, I think, used Helvetica and Times. > Current versions include Arial. Helvetica is then replaced by ArialMT. > Furthermore, I've read (and experienced myself) that Arial > (by Microsoft) > is not the same as Helvetica. Don't know about ArialMT (by Adobe). > >
Re: FOP Helvetica - is it really Arial?
AFAIK the standard fonts specified in the PDF spec match the base 14 fontset of PostScript which includes Helvetica, Times, Courier, Symbol and ZapfDingbats. Acrobat 3.x, I think, used Helvetica and Times. Current versions include Arial. Helvetica is then replaced by ArialMT. Furthermore, I've read (and experienced myself) that Arial (by Microsoft) is not the same as Helvetica. Don't know about ArialMT (by Adobe). > Scott Moore wrote: > > There's a debate raging in our company right now about the use of Arial and > > Helvetica in FOP produced PDF. After careful examination of both fonts, I > > can see absolutely no difference, even though Helvetica has minor but > > distinguishable differences from Arial. > > > > I'm using the information on this website to distinguish between the two > > fonts: http://www.ms-studio.com/articlesarialsid.html > > > > It appears to me that Helvetica is actually Arial in the PDF. Even when I > > have Acrobat Reader 5.0 list the fonts, it says Helvetica maps to ArialMT. > > > > So, my question is: is this a problem with FOP or Acrobat Reader? Is > > Helvetica something that Acrobat Reader renders or did FOP use Arial for the > > Helvetica font? I'm not exactly sure how fonts work in PDF, but I've read > > Helvetica comes standard with PDF. I find it strange that Helvetica is > > mapping to Arial though. > > AFAIK the standard fonts supported by the Adobe tools (and the > PDF format) include Arial, but not Helvetica. The glyphs rendered > for FOP "Helvetica" are certainly taken from Arial. I'm not sure > whether the font metrics used by FOP is indeed generated from an > Helvetica font, or whether it is actually an Arial font, with the > name being some historic relict (AFAIK early PDF specs had > Helvetica instead of arial in them). Cheers, Jeremias Märki mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] OUTLINE AG Postfach 3954 - Rhynauerstr. 15 - CH-6002 Luzern Tel. +41 41 317 2020 - Fax +41 41 317 2029 Internet http://www.outline.ch
Re: FOP Helvetica - is it really Arial?
Scott Moore wrote: There's a debate raging in our company right now about the use of Arial and Helvetica in FOP produced PDF. After careful examination of both fonts, I can see absolutely no difference, even though Helvetica has minor but distinguishable differences from Arial. I'm using the information on this website to distinguish between the two fonts: http://www.ms-studio.com/articlesarialsid.html It appears to me that Helvetica is actually Arial in the PDF. Even when I have Acrobat Reader 5.0 list the fonts, it says Helvetica maps to ArialMT. So, my question is: is this a problem with FOP or Acrobat Reader? Is Helvetica something that Acrobat Reader renders or did FOP use Arial for the Helvetica font? I'm not exactly sure how fonts work in PDF, but I've read Helvetica comes standard with PDF. I find it strange that Helvetica is mapping to Arial though. AFAIK the standard fonts supported by the Adobe tools (and the PDF format) include Arial, but not Helvetica. The glyphs rendered for FOP "Helvetica" are certainly taken from Arial. I'm not sure whether the font metrics used by FOP is indeed generated from an Helvetica font, or whether it is actually an Arial font, with the name being some historic relict (AFAIK early PDF specs had Helvetica instead of arial in them). J.Pietschmann
