Re: [Foundation-l] Push translation

2010-07-26 Thread Pavlo Shevelo
I don't know whether other wikipedias have similar policies, but on the Italian Wikipedia an article which is just a machine translation can be speedy deleted according to our policies. The reason is that machine translations are not good enough and the autotranslated text is too difficult to

Re: [Foundation-l] Discussion Questions for Potentially-Objectionable Content

2010-07-26 Thread David Goodman
A child seeing such a page will ordinarily go instead to something they understand. Unless we're talking about teen-agers. I see this as an excellent example of the slippery slope we would be in if we did anything targeted at facilitating censorship, especially considering the author of the book

Re: [Foundation-l] Discussion Questions for Potentially-Objectionable Content

2010-07-26 Thread Oliver Keyes
Wikipedia images and pages normally have descriptive titles. If you want to prevent children seeing bad stuff on the internet, set up a web blocker. Mind you, if you want to prevent children seeing bad stuff on the internet, best to raise them in an Amish village. On Mon, Jul 26, 2010 at 5:05 PM,

Re: [Foundation-l] Discussion Questions for Potentially-Objectionable Content

2010-07-26 Thread Gerard Meijssen
Hoi, Children in Romania know what to expect of a pizdăhttp://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/pizd%C4%83#Romanian, children in Indonesia know it for the tempikhttp://en.wiktionary.org/w/index.php?title=tempikaction=editredlink=1.. They are both descriptive and you do not know at all that you want to look

Re: [Foundation-l] Discussion Questions for Potentially-Objectionable Content

2010-07-26 Thread wiki-list
David Goodman wrote: A child seeing such a page will ordinarily go instead to something they understand. Unless we're talking about teen-agers. I see this as an excellent example of the slippery slope Would that be the slippery slope to the thin end of the wedge perchance? we would be in

Re: [Foundation-l] Discussion Questions for Potentially-Objectionable Content

2010-07-26 Thread Ryan Kaldari
On 7/24/10 9:45 PM, Milos Rancic wrote: In other words cultural context is usually just an excuse for POV pushing of various kinds. Actually, I think the opposite is true. Right now we impose our arbitrary Western moral standards on the rest of the world, and because those standards are

Re: [Foundation-l] Discussion Questions for Potentially-Objectionable Content

2010-07-26 Thread David Gerard
On 26 July 2010 20:08, Ryan Kaldari rkald...@wikimedia.org wrote: failure offer filtering. Frankly, we're already filtering content, even on en.wiki, but only according to a default Western/American POV. We use line drawings instead of photos in articles on sex positions. And this was a

Re: [Foundation-l] Discussion Questions for Potentially-Objectionable Content

2010-07-26 Thread Milos Rancic
On Mon, Jul 26, 2010 at 9:08 PM, Ryan Kaldari rkald...@wikimedia.org wrote: On 7/24/10 9:45 PM, Milos Rancic wrote: In other words cultural context is usually just an excuse for POV pushing of various kinds. Actually, I think the opposite is true. Right now we impose our arbitrary Western

Re: [Foundation-l] Discussion Questions for Potentially-Objectionable Content

2010-07-26 Thread David Gerard
On 26 July 2010 20:40, Milos Rancic mill...@gmail.com wrote: If photos of Tienanmen protests are forbidden in China, we should remove them for population from China. I certainly hope you're saying this as an attempt at reductio ad absurdum. - d.

Re: [Foundation-l] Discussion Questions for Potentially-Objectionable Content

2010-07-26 Thread Milos Rancic
On Mon, Jul 26, 2010 at 9:43 PM, David Gerard dger...@gmail.com wrote: On 26 July 2010 20:40, Milos Rancic mill...@gmail.com wrote:  If photos of Tienanmen protests are forbidden in China, we should remove them for population from China. I certainly hope you're saying this as an attempt at

Re: [Foundation-l] Discussion Questions for Potentially-Objectionable Content

2010-07-26 Thread Ryan Kaldari
I don't think using an illustration of Bukake rather than a photo is a failure of neutrality, but perhaps we'll have to agree to disagree on that. Regardless, as a global project, we need to seriously consider what steps we can take to accommodate cultures very different from our own, while

Re: [Foundation-l] Discussion Questions for Potentially-Objectionable Content

2010-07-26 Thread Ryan Kaldari
I should make the disclaimer that all of my opinions expressed on this list are as a community member rather than a WMF employee. I have no official involvement in the current study or any decision making power thereof. I just code donation banners :) Ryan Kaldari On 7/26/10 2:14 PM, Ryan

Re: [Foundation-l] Discussion Questions for Potentially-Objectionable Content

2010-07-26 Thread David Gerard
On 26 July 2010 22:14, Ryan Kaldari rkald...@wikimedia.org wrote: I don't see anything threatening about Mr. Harris evaluating the issues, As has been pointed out several times already, the presumption that there is a case to answer. (#5 on the original board resolution.) I note also that

Re: [Foundation-l] free software policies

2010-07-26 Thread Joe Corneli
Hi SJ: I've been thinking about your note. Maybe programmes would be a better word than policies. I hope here to put my note in a pro-active frame. In fact there are lots of things that we could do, but here is where it would be nice to know more about who we are! You and I already discussed

Re: [Foundation-l] Discussion Questions for Potentially-Objectionable Content

2010-07-26 Thread Milos Rancic
On Mon, Jul 26, 2010 at 9:50 PM, Milos Rancic mill...@gmail.com wrote: On Mon, Jul 26, 2010 at 9:43 PM, David Gerard dger...@gmail.com wrote: On 26 July 2010 20:40, Milos Rancic mill...@gmail.com wrote:  If photos of Tienanmen protests are forbidden in China, we should remove them for

Re: [Foundation-l] Push translation

2010-07-26 Thread stevertigo
Mark Williamson node...@gmail.com wrote: I would like to add to this that I think the worst part of this idea is the assumption that other languages should take articles from en.wp. The idea is that most of en.wp's articles are well-enough written, and written in accord with NPOV to a

Re: [Foundation-l] Push translation

2010-07-26 Thread Oliver Keyes
The idea is that most of en.wp's articles are well-enough written, and written in accord with NPOV to a sufficient degree to overcome any such criticism of 'imperial encyclopedism.' - really? It's a) not particularly well-written, mostly and b) referenced overwhelmingly to English-language

Re: [Foundation-l] Push translation

2010-07-26 Thread Shiju Alex
really? It's a) not particularly well-written, mostly and b) referenced overwhelmingly to English-language sources, most of which are, you guessed it.. Western in nature. Very much true. Now English Wikipedians want some one to translate and use the exact copy of en:wp in all other