Re: [Framers] FrameMaker vs Flare
The $360-per-year FrameMaker subscription includes upgrades, so that's significantly cheaper than Flare. On Wed, Jun 27, 2018 at 12:03 PM, Robert Lauriston wrote: > Comparing Flare and standalone FrameMaker, HTML output is more customizable > and it's probably a better single-sourcing tool, except as regards PDF > targets. > > Comparing Flare and FrameMaker plus RoboHelp or WebWorks ePublisher Pro, > hard to say. I'd probably take unstructured FrameMaker and WebWorks over > Flare if I had to choose. > > The learning curve for FrameMaker is plenty steep if you've never used it > before. > > Flare is $1648 with a year of email support and upgrades. You can add a year > of support and upgrades for $400 or two years for $325 each. If you let your > support expire, upgrades are $799, which I believe includes a year of > support and upgrades. > > FrameMaker is $999 perpetual or $360 a year for a subscription that includes > upgrades. Are upgrades included in the subscription price or do you have to > pay for them? > > A FrameMaker perpetual license seems like a bad deal since Adobe now > supports only the current version. In the long run, it would be cheaper to > subscribe. > > On Wed, Jun 27, 2018 at 4:53 AM, Shmuel Wolfson wrote: >> >> It seems that the benefits of Flare over Frame are: >> - More customizable/better HTML output >> - Better support >> - Better single sourcing than unstructured Frame >> - They don't charge an arm and a leg to pay for upgrades >> >> The benefits of Frame over Flare are: >> - Better PDFs >> - Less of learning curve for unstructured Frame, and possibly for >> structured Frame >> >> I don't believe that Adobe has abandoned Frame, but they do charge an >> insane amount for upgrades and the support is not so great, which is similar >> to abandoning their users. Having said that, since I mainly produce PDFs, I >> have no plans on switching to Flare any time soon. >> >> -- >> Shmuel Wolfson >> Technical Writer >> 058-763-7133 >> >> >> On 27-Jun-18 7:59 AM, Alan Litchfield wrote: >>> >>> I don't think the issue in this conversation is about Adobe abandoning >>> FM, but that the corporate model Adobe chooses to use has effectively driven >>> a lot of us old timers out the door, into the arms of its competitors. Yes, >>> there have been a bunch of new features and added support for functions that >>> required external plug-in support previously, but the interface is actually >>> quite hard for me to navigate now, especially now that so many keyboard >>> commands have disappeared or changed. >>> >>> For me, my last favourite version was 7.2 on the Mac (which I still have >>> running by the way, on a G5 tower). Sure it lacked all the fancy mod-cons of >>> later versions but I could run that application for months at a time >>> (without shutting down the computer or program) without issue. Can't say the >>> same for the current version, I'm afraid. And as I said earlier, part of the >>> reason was being locked out of the application due to licensing problems. >>> >>> Version 5.5.2 on Linux was fun while it lasted. Of course, one does miss >>> the hominess of Frame Corp, but that was a long time ago now. >>> >>> Alan >>> >>> -- >>> Dr Alan Litchfield >>> AlphaByte >>> PO Box 1941 >>> Auckland, New Zealand 1140 >>> >>> On 27/06/18 13:42, ideasli...@ideastraining.com wrote: I've been hearing rumors of Adobe's abandonment of Frame for years, if not decades. The timing of these rumors is almost as regular as an atomic clock... Abandonment hasn't happened yet. Oddly, I find the rumors tend to peak before Adobe announces a new version. This list, or any public list, is not a good way to make a decision about FrameMaker. Those that know can't say; those that say usually don't know. David Creamer IDEAS Training __ All of these posts regarding Adobe's poor support/abandonment of FM are one of the reasons why my company decided to focus on another tool and migrate away from FM. All of the technical publications staff (including me) are now using Madcap Flare and we have just completed a 2 year migration of all FM documents into Flare. It was a bit sad to say goodbye to FM, but the handwriting was on the wall. ___ This message is from the Framers mailing list Send messages to framers@lists.frameusers.com Visit the list's homepage at http://www.frameusers.com Archives located at http://www.mail-archive.com/framers%40lists.frameusers.com/ Subscribe and unsubscribe at http://lists.frameusers.com/listinfo.cgi/framers-frameusers.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com >>> ___ >>> >>> This message is from the Framers mailing list >>> >>> Send messages to
Re: [Framers] FrameMaker vs Flare
Comparing Flare and standalone FrameMaker, HTML output is more customizable and it's probably a better single-sourcing tool, except as regards PDF targets. Comparing Flare and FrameMaker plus RoboHelp or WebWorks ePublisher Pro, hard to say. I'd probably take unstructured FrameMaker and WebWorks over Flare if I had to choose. The learning curve for FrameMaker is plenty steep if you've never used it before. Flare is $1648 with a year of email support and upgrades. You can add a year of support and upgrades for $400 or two years for $325 each. If you let your support expire, upgrades are $799, which I believe includes a year of support and upgrades. FrameMaker is $999 perpetual or $360 a year for a subscription that includes upgrades. Are upgrades included in the subscription price or do you have to pay for them? A FrameMaker perpetual license seems like a bad deal since Adobe now supports only the current version. In the long run, it would be cheaper to subscribe. On Wed, Jun 27, 2018 at 4:53 AM, Shmuel Wolfson wrote: > It seems that the benefits of Flare over Frame are: > - More customizable/better HTML output > - Better support > - Better single sourcing than unstructured Frame > - They don't charge an arm and a leg to pay for upgrades > > The benefits of Frame over Flare are: > - Better PDFs > - Less of learning curve for unstructured Frame, and possibly for > structured Frame > > I don't believe that Adobe has abandoned Frame, but they do charge an > insane amount for upgrades and the support is not so great, which is > similar to abandoning their users. Having said that, since I mainly produce > PDFs, I have no plans on switching to Flare any time soon. > > -- > Shmuel Wolfson > Technical Writer > 058-763-7133 > > > On 27-Jun-18 7:59 AM, Alan Litchfield wrote: > >> I don't think the issue in this conversation is about Adobe abandoning >> FM, but that the corporate model Adobe chooses to use has effectively >> driven a lot of us old timers out the door, into the arms of its >> competitors. Yes, there have been a bunch of new features and added support >> for functions that required external plug-in support previously, but the >> interface is actually quite hard for me to navigate now, especially now >> that so many keyboard commands have disappeared or changed. >> >> For me, my last favourite version was 7.2 on the Mac (which I still have >> running by the way, on a G5 tower). Sure it lacked all the fancy mod-cons >> of later versions but I could run that application for months at a time >> (without shutting down the computer or program) without issue. Can't say >> the same for the current version, I'm afraid. And as I said earlier, part >> of the reason was being locked out of the application due to licensing >> problems. >> >> Version 5.5.2 on Linux was fun while it lasted. Of course, one does miss >> the hominess of Frame Corp, but that was a long time ago now. >> >> Alan >> >> -- >> Dr Alan Litchfield >> AlphaByte >> PO Box 1941 >> Auckland, New Zealand 1140 >> >> On 27/06/18 13:42, ideasli...@ideastraining.com wrote: >> >>> I've been hearing rumors of Adobe's abandonment of Frame for years, if >>> not >>> decades. The timing of these rumors is almost as regular as an atomic >>> clock... >>> >>> Abandonment hasn't happened yet. Oddly, I find the rumors tend to peak >>> before Adobe announces a new version. This list, or any public list, is >>> not >>> a good way to make a decision about FrameMaker. Those that know can't >>> say; >>> those that say usually don't know. >>> >>> David Creamer >>> IDEAS Training >>> __ >>> All of these posts regarding Adobe's poor support/abandonment of FM are >>> one >>> of the reasons why my company decided to focus on another tool and >>> migrate >>> away from FM. All of the technical publications staff (including me) are >>> now using Madcap Flare and we have just completed a 2 year migration of >>> all >>> FM documents into Flare. It was a bit sad to say goodbye to FM, but the >>> handwriting was on the wall. >>> >>> ___ >>> >>> This message is from the Framers mailing list >>> >>> Send messages to framers@lists.frameusers.com >>> Visit the list's homepage at http://www.frameusers.com >>> Archives located at http://www.mail-archive.com/fr >>> amers%40lists.frameusers.com/ >>> Subscribe and unsubscribe at http://lists.frameusers.com/li >>> stinfo.cgi/framers-frameusers.com >>> Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com >>> >>> ___ >> >> This message is from the Framers mailing list >> >> Send messages to framers@lists.frameusers.com >> Visit the list's homepage at http://www.frameusers.com >> Archives located at http://www.mail-archive.com/fr >> amers%40lists.frameusers.com/ >> Subscribe and unsubscribe at http://lists.frameusers.com/li >> stinfo.cgi/framers-frameusers.com >> Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com
Re: [Framers] FrameMaker vs Flare
It seems that the benefits of Flare over Frame are: - More customizable/better HTML output - Better support - Better single sourcing than unstructured Frame - They don't charge an arm and a leg to pay for upgrades The benefits of Frame over Flare are: - Better PDFs - Less of learning curve for unstructured Frame, and possibly for structured Frame I don't believe that Adobe has abandoned Frame, but they do charge an insane amount for upgrades and the support is not so great, which is similar to abandoning their users. Having said that, since I mainly produce PDFs, I have no plans on switching to Flare any time soon. -- Shmuel Wolfson Technical Writer 058-763-7133 On 27-Jun-18 7:59 AM, Alan Litchfield wrote: I don't think the issue in this conversation is about Adobe abandoning FM, but that the corporate model Adobe chooses to use has effectively driven a lot of us old timers out the door, into the arms of its competitors. Yes, there have been a bunch of new features and added support for functions that required external plug-in support previously, but the interface is actually quite hard for me to navigate now, especially now that so many keyboard commands have disappeared or changed. For me, my last favourite version was 7.2 on the Mac (which I still have running by the way, on a G5 tower). Sure it lacked all the fancy mod-cons of later versions but I could run that application for months at a time (without shutting down the computer or program) without issue. Can't say the same for the current version, I'm afraid. And as I said earlier, part of the reason was being locked out of the application due to licensing problems. Version 5.5.2 on Linux was fun while it lasted. Of course, one does miss the hominess of Frame Corp, but that was a long time ago now. Alan -- Dr Alan Litchfield AlphaByte PO Box 1941 Auckland, New Zealand 1140 On 27/06/18 13:42, ideasli...@ideastraining.com wrote: I've been hearing rumors of Adobe's abandonment of Frame for years, if not decades. The timing of these rumors is almost as regular as an atomic clock... Abandonment hasn't happened yet. Oddly, I find the rumors tend to peak before Adobe announces a new version. This list, or any public list, is not a good way to make a decision about FrameMaker. Those that know can't say; those that say usually don't know. David Creamer IDEAS Training __ All of these posts regarding Adobe's poor support/abandonment of FM are one of the reasons why my company decided to focus on another tool and migrate away from FM. All of the technical publications staff (including me) are now using Madcap Flare and we have just completed a 2 year migration of all FM documents into Flare. It was a bit sad to say goodbye to FM, but the handwriting was on the wall. ___ This message is from the Framers mailing list Send messages to framers@lists.frameusers.com Visit the list's homepage at http://www.frameusers.com Archives located at http://www.mail-archive.com/framers%40lists.frameusers.com/ Subscribe and unsubscribe at http://lists.frameusers.com/listinfo.cgi/framers-frameusers.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com ___ This message is from the Framers mailing list Send messages to framers@lists.frameusers.com Visit the list's homepage at http://www.frameusers.com Archives located at http://www.mail-archive.com/framers%40lists.frameusers.com/ Subscribe and unsubscribe at http://lists.frameusers.com/listinfo.cgi/framers-frameusers.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com ___ This message is from the Framers mailing list Send messages to framers@lists.frameusers.com Visit the list's homepage at http://www.frameusers.com Archives located at http://www.mail-archive.com/framers%40lists.frameusers.com/ Subscribe and unsubscribe at http://lists.frameusers.com/listinfo.cgi/framers-frameusers.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com
Framemaker vs Flare for pdfs
I tried unsuccessfully a year ago to move from FrameMaker to Flare. After months with tech support to deal with various bugs in Flare, I concluded that it was only a reasonable option for simpler documents that were destined for web based delivery. PDFs particularly, were not as reliable as FM. Any table that had rotated cells was in issue in Flare. Flare has some very nice features, like different styles for different deliveries, but I did not find it an adequate replacement for FM for my needs. I am back to happily using FM and did not renew my license for Madcap Flare. ___ You are currently subscribed to framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to framers@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Re: Framemaker vs Flare for pdfs
I had a similar experience with Flare 7.1. We had a really, really long list of table-related PDF bugs. On Thu, Feb 26, 2015 at 12:24 PM, Philo Calhoun isleofgo...@luxsci.me wrote: I tried unsuccessfully a year ago to move from FrameMaker to Flare. After months with tech support to deal with various bugs in Flare, I concluded that it was only a reasonable option for simpler documents that were destined for web based delivery. PDFs particularly, were not as reliable as FM. Any table that had rotated cells was in issue in Flare. Flare has some very nice features, like different styles for different deliveries, but I did not find it an adequate replacement for FM for my needs. I am back to happily using FM and did not renew my license for Madcap Flare. ___ You are currently subscribed to framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to framers@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
FrameMaker vs Flare
At least for me, Flare is no substitute for FrameMaker. It crashes more often, does not handle large graphics or vector graphics well, will not rotate cells in tables, lacks support for postscript and some open type fonts, and creates some weirdness with PDF output. However, the tech support is responsive to questions. If I were doing a lot of single source projects, I would consider FrameMaker with epublisher. ___ You are currently subscribed to framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to framers@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
FrameMaker vs Flare
At least for me, Flare is no substitute for FrameMaker. It crashes more often, does not handle large graphics or vector graphics well, will not rotate cells in tables, lacks support for postscript and some open type fonts, and creates some weirdness with PDF output. However, the tech support is responsive to questions. If I were doing a lot of single source projects, I would consider FrameMaker with epublisher.
RE: Framemaker vs. Flare
Sorry to chime in late. I hadn't had a chance to open all my mail since Thursday. First of all, we're talking a bit about apples and oranges. FrameMaker is a desktop publishing tool while Flare is an online Help, XML-based authoring tool. The two may work hand-in-hand in the near future. For several months, I've understood that Flare v2.0, scheduled for release in the coming months, is supposed to be able to support import of FrameMaker files (not via MIFs, but actual FM files) as it does for Word files. David Schor Technical Communication Manager Emblaze-VCON Ltd. Tel: (+972) 9 7627820 Mobile: 054 4788253 [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.emblaze-vcon.com Wisdom is the quality that keeps you from getting into situations where you need it. Doug Larson -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of AJ Coots Sent: Thursday, August 17, 2006 7:34 PM To: framers@lists.frameusers.com Subject: Framemaker vs. Flare Hello, Has anyone compared the functionality of Adobe Framemaker 7.2 with Madcap Software's (formerly Robohelp) Flare? I am trying to decide which one to go with for the documentation for my company. Framemaker seems to be the industry standard, but is Flare just as good? Any thoughts? Thanks! -Aj ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/davids%40emblaze-vco n.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
RE: Framemaker vs. Flare
I used Flare for several months, starting last November when version 1.0 was still in Beta. I found it to be a viable option to RH. Flare 1.0 has a few bugs and quirks to it but then so does RH. One thing that impressed me about the beta testing was that MadCap really encouraged testers to report bugs, moreso than many software houses I've seen. They even had a contest for who could report the most. As a result, the inaugaral product was actually pretty good, although it still had a few minor problems. If you are looking for a great HAT, Flare 1.0 isn't there yet and I can't speak for v2.0(scheduled for release next month) but MadCap seems to be pretty dedicated to make people forget about RoboHelp. If they continue doing what they are doing, I suspect they are going to get their wish. Jon Harvey Manager, Desktop Documentation CambridgeSoft Corporation 100 CambridgePark Drive Cambridge, MA 02140 Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of AJ Coots Let me re-phrase the question: Has anyone here used Madcap Flare? If you're looking for feedback from people who use Flare, you might want to ask this question on the HATT (Help Authoring Tools and Techniques) Yahoo group, or just search their archives. There are also Madcap user forums: http://tinyurl.com/k5vnk Bob Love people. Use things. Not vice-versa. -- Kelly Rothaus ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/jharvey%40cambridges oft.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
RE: Framemaker vs. Flare
I used the Beta of Flare as, at the time, RoboHelp had been 'sun setted' by Macromedia. As a help tool I thought it was good. It's xml based, which meant no more RoboHelp proprietry kadov tags in the html/css. The promise of support for DITA in future releases was also encouraging. But it's no alternative to Frame! Of course, now Adobe are making encouraging noises about RoboHelp, so I'm not in such a hurry to think of an alternative. Mark -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] m] On Behalf Of AJ Coots Sent: 17 August 2006 20:19 To: framers@lists.frameusers.com Subject: Framemaker vs. Flare Let me re-phrase the question: Has anyone here used Madcap Flare? A.J. Coots Documentation Specialist 16640 SW 72nd Ave. Portland, Oregon 97224-7756 Direct: 503 597 0765 Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/mark.southee%40surfc ontrol.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. Get the latest news on SurfControl and our products, subscribe to our monthly e-newsletter, SurfAdvisory at: http://www.surfcontrol.com/resources/surfadvisory/surfadvisory_signup.aspx * The information in this email is confidential and may be legally privileged. It is intended solely for the addressee. Access to this email by anyone else is unauthorized. If you are not the intended recipient, any disclosure, copying, distribution or any action taken or omitted to be taken in reliance on it, is prohibited and may be unlawful. If you believe that you have received this email in error, please contact the sender. * ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
RE: Framemaker vs. Flare
Hi A.J. (et al.), We have not *used* Flare, but we *have* recently been engaged in an indepth exercise to analyze and evaluate a wide variety of help authoring tools. We found Flare to be deficient in a number of areas (which I will spell out briefly). But in summary (for those of you ready to move on to the next email), I would have to agree with Fred Ridder's statement that it is like comparing power drills to monkey wrenches. Different types of tools with different purposes. Specifically, we found that Flare: --Advertises itself as a help authoring tool (whereas Frame is considered more of a desktop publishing tool, which requires [as others have pointed out] additional tools to convert to online help). --Apparently does not allow you to import Frame content, not even as .MIF files (if that is an issue for you). --Does not offer advanced search features, only simple text searches. --Does not support the ability to directly create PDFs of modular units of documentation. --Does not yet support DITA, though it is coming in a future release. --Requires MS .NET Framework version 2.0. --Is still relatively green (new), thus largely unproven and of questionable stability. This goes along with what others on this thread have also said. --Is VERY expensive, both to purchase and to support downstream. For these and other reasons, we are looking elsewhere for tools to meet our planned strategy. There are other tools out there that we feel will get the job done better. HTH, Chuck Beck -Original Message- Subject: Framemaker vs. Flare Let me re-phrase the question: Has anyone here used Madcap Flare? A.J. Coots Documentation Specialist ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
RE: Framemaker vs. Flare
I used the Beta of Flare as, at the time, RoboHelp had been 'sun setted' by Macromedia. As a help tool I thought it was good. It's xml based, which meant no more RoboHelp proprietry kadov tags in the html/css. The promise of support for DITA in future releases was also encouraging. But it's no alternative to Frame! Of course, now Adobe are making encouraging noises about RoboHelp, so I'm not in such a hurry to think of an alternative. Mark -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] m] On Behalf Of AJ Coots Sent: 17 August 2006 20:19 To: framers@lists.frameusers.com Subject: Framemaker vs. Flare Let me re-phrase the question: Has anyone here used Madcap Flare? A.J. Coots Documentation Specialist 16640 SW 72nd Ave. Portland, Oregon 97224-7756 Direct: 503 597 0765 Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/mark.southee%40surfc ontrol.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. Get the latest news on SurfControl and our products, subscribe to our monthly e-newsletter, SurfAdvisory at: http://www.surfcontrol.com/resources/surfadvisory/surfadvisory_signup.aspx * The information in this email is confidential and may be legally privileged. It is intended solely for the addressee. Access to this email by anyone else is unauthorized. If you are not the intended recipient, any disclosure, copying, distribution or any action taken or omitted to be taken in reliance on it, is prohibited and may be unlawful. If you believe that you have received this email in error, please contact the sender. * ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Framemaker vs. Flare
I used Flare for several months, starting last November when version 1.0 was still in Beta. I found it to be a viable option to RH. Flare 1.0 has a few bugs and quirks to it but then so does RH. One thing that impressed me about the beta testing was that MadCap really encouraged testers to report bugs, moreso than many software houses I've seen. They even had a contest for who could report the most. As a result, the inaugaral product was actually pretty good, although it still had a few minor problems. If you are looking for a great HAT, Flare 1.0 isn't there yet and I can't speak for v2.0(scheduled for release next month) but MadCap seems to be pretty dedicated to make people forget about RoboHelp. If they continue doing what they are doing, I suspect they are going to get their wish. Jon Harvey Manager, Desktop Documentation CambridgeSoft Corporation 100 CambridgePark Drive Cambridge, MA 02140 Original Message- > From: framers-bounces+rshelton=opentext.com at lists.frameusers.com > [mailto:framers-bounces+rshelton=opentext.com at lists.frameusers.com]On > Behalf Of AJ Coots > > Let me re-phrase the question: Has anyone here used Madcap Flare? > If you're looking for feedback from people who use Flare, you might want to ask this question on the HATT (Help Authoring Tools and Techniques) Yahoo group, or just search their archives. There are also Madcap user forums: http://tinyurl.com/k5vnk Bob "Love people. Use things. Not vice-versa." -- Kelly Rothaus ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as jharvey at cambridgesoft.com. Send list messages to framers at lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/jharvey%40cambridges oft.com Send administrative questions to lisa at frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Framemaker vs. Flare
I used the Beta of Flare as, at the time, RoboHelp had been 'sun setted' by Macromedia. As a help tool I thought it was good. It's xml based, which meant no more RoboHelp proprietry kadov tags in the html/css. The promise of support for DITA in future releases was also encouraging. But it's no alternative to Frame! Of course, now Adobe are making encouraging noises about RoboHelp, so I'm not in such a hurry to think of an alternative. Mark -Original Message- From: framers-bounces+mark.southee=surfcontrol@lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-bounces+mark.southee=surfcontrol.com at lists.frameusers.co m] On Behalf Of AJ Coots Sent: 17 August 2006 20:19 To: framers at lists.frameusers.com Subject: Framemaker vs. Flare Let me re-phrase the question: Has anyone here used Madcap Flare? A.J. Coots Documentation Specialist 16640 SW 72nd Ave. Portland, Oregon 97224-7756 Direct: 503 597 0765 Email: aj.coots at veris.com ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as Mark.Southee at surfcontrol.com. Send list messages to framers at lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/mark.southee%40surfc ontrol.com Send administrative questions to lisa at frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. Get the latest news on SurfControl and our products, subscribe to our monthly e-newsletter, SurfAdvisory at: http://www.surfcontrol.com/resources/surfadvisory/surfadvisory_signup.aspx * The information in this email is confidential and may be legally privileged. It is intended solely for the addressee. Access to this email by anyone else is unauthorized. If you are not the intended recipient, any disclosure, copying, distribution or any action taken or omitted to be taken in reliance on it, is prohibited and may be unlawful. If you believe that you have received this email in error, please contact the sender. *
Framemaker vs. Flare
Hi A.J. (et al.), We have not *used* Flare, but we *have* recently been engaged in an indepth exercise to analyze and evaluate a wide variety of help authoring tools. We found Flare to be deficient in a number of areas (which I will spell out briefly). But in summary (for those of you ready to move on to the next email), I would have to agree with Fred Ridder's statement that it is like comparing power drills to monkey wrenches. Different types of tools with different purposes. Specifically, we found that Flare: --Advertises itself as a help authoring tool (whereas Frame is considered more of a desktop publishing tool, which requires [as others have pointed out] additional tools to convert to online help). --Apparently does not allow you to import Frame content, not even as .MIF files (if that is an issue for you). --Does not offer advanced search features, only simple text searches. --Does not support the ability to directly create PDFs of modular units of documentation. --Does not yet support DITA, though it "is coming in a future release". --Requires MS .NET Framework version 2.0. --Is still relatively green (new), thus largely unproven and of questionable stability. This goes along with what others on this thread have also said. --Is VERY expensive, both to purchase and to support downstream. For these and other reasons, we are looking elsewhere for tools to meet our planned strategy. There are other tools out there that we feel will get the job done better. HTH, Chuck Beck -Original Message- Subject: Framemaker vs. Flare Let me re-phrase the question: Has anyone here used Madcap Flare? A.J. Coots Documentation Specialist
Framemaker vs. Flare
I used the Beta of Flare as, at the time, RoboHelp had been 'sun setted' by Macromedia. As a help tool I thought it was good. It's xml based, which meant no more RoboHelp proprietry kadov tags in the html/css. The promise of support for DITA in future releases was also encouraging. But it's no alternative to Frame! Of course, now Adobe are making encouraging noises about RoboHelp, so I'm not in such a hurry to think of an alternative. Mark -Original Message- From: framers-bounces+mark.southee=surfcontrol@lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-bounces+mark.southee=surfcontrol.com at lists.frameusers.co m] On Behalf Of AJ Coots Sent: 17 August 2006 20:19 To: framers at lists.frameusers.com Subject: Framemaker vs. Flare Let me re-phrase the question: Has anyone here used Madcap Flare? A.J. Coots Documentation Specialist 16640 SW 72nd Ave. Portland, Oregon 97224-7756 Direct: 503 597 0765 Email: aj.coots at veris.com ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as Mark.Southee at surfcontrol.com. Send list messages to framers at lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/mark.southee%40surfc ontrol.com Send administrative questions to lisa at frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. Get the latest news on SurfControl and our products, subscribe to our monthly e-newsletter, SurfAdvisory at: http://www.surfcontrol.com/resources/surfadvisory/surfadvisory_signup.aspx * The information in this email is confidential and may be legally privileged. It is intended solely for the addressee. Access to this email by anyone else is unauthorized. If you are not the intended recipient, any disclosure, copying, distribution or any action taken or omitted to be taken in reliance on it, is prohibited and may be unlawful. If you believe that you have received this email in error, please contact the sender. *
Framemaker vs. Flare
Hello, Has anyone compared the functionality of Adobe Framemaker 7.2 with Madcap Software's (formerly Robohelp) Flare? I am trying to decide which one to go with for the documentation for my company. Framemaker seems to be the industry standard, but is Flare just as good? Any thoughts? Thanks! -Aj ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Re: Framemaker vs. Flare
Has anyone compared the functionality of Adobe Framemaker 7.2 with Madcap Software's (formerly Robohelp) Flare? I am trying to decide which one to go with for the documentation for my company. Framemaker seems to be the industry standard, but is Flare just as good? Any thoughts? Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but the FM functionality in the Madcap product is, as of right now, still under very limited alpha testing and has not even gone beta yet. Besides, and again, correct me, but Madcap's FM-wannabe is going to be called Blaze, and I don't know if that's even hit alpha yet. So...if you are looking to implement something in the next couple of quarters and want FM-type binary files, you're choice may be limited. John Posada Senior Technical Writer I think the problem, to be quite honest with you, is that you've never actually known what the question is. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Re: Framemaker vs. Flare
And in addition to John's accurate comments, do you want to bet your job and company on the first release of a new product (Blaze)? Or are you just talking about online help delivery with Flare? Art On 8/17/06, John Posada [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Has anyone compared the functionality of Adobe Framemaker 7.2 with Madcap Software's (formerly Robohelp) Flare? I am trying to decide which one to go with for the documentation for my company. Framemaker seems to be the industry standard, but is Flare just as good? Any thoughts? Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but the FM functionality in the Madcap product is, as of right now, still under very limited alpha testing and has not even gone beta yet. Besides, and again, correct me, but Madcap's FM-wannabe is going to be called Blaze, and I don't know if that's even hit alpha yet. So...if you are looking to implement something in the next couple of quarters and want FM-type binary files, you're choice may be limited. John Posada Senior Technical Writer -- Art Campbell [EMAIL PROTECTED] ... In my opinion, there's nothing in this world beats a '52 Vincent and a redheaded girl. -- Richard Thompson No disclaimers apply. DoD 358 ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Re: Framemaker vs. Flare
With Adobe having purchased Macromedia some time ago and announcing continued support for RoboHelp (see [1]http://www.winwriters.com/articles/rh2/index.html), which earlier Macromedia had purportedly wanted to drop, it will be interesting to see what will come out. My guess is Adobe will revamp FrameMaker to work with RoboHelp rather than, or maybe in addition to, Word, something Frame users have requested for many years now. Wow, no more MIF imports!! The last few versions of RoboHelp have worked (poorly) with WebWorks, and I see Adobe, whose animosity toward Microsoft is well known, as wanting to dominate our market. While Flare, which was created by former Macromedia/Blue Sky RoboHelp people when Macromedia was killing RoboHelp, seems to be attracting many people (see [2]http://www.techwr-l.com/techwhirl/archives/0603/techwhirl-0603-00862.html ), I'm all for the Adobe products. Admittedly, I don't know much about Flare. But imagine an integrated suite of tools intended just for us: Frame, RoboHelp, Photoshop, Illustrator, Flash, others (???)... --Sean Pollock, MidNyteOyl __ From: John Posada [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: AJ Coots [EMAIL PROTECTED], framers@lists.frameusers.com Subject: Re: Framemaker vs. Flare Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 11:18:41 -0700 (PDT) Has anyone compared the functionality of Adobe Framemaker 7.2 with Madcap Software's (formerly Robohelp) Flare? I am trying to decide which one to go with for the documentation for my company. Framemaker seems to be the industry standard, but is Flare just as good? Any thoughts? Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but the FM functionality in the Madcap product is, as of right now, still under very limited alpha testing and has not even gone beta yet. Besides, and again, correct me, but Madcap's FM-wannabe is going to be called Blaze, and I don't know if that's even hit alpha yet. So...if you are looking to implement something in the next couple of quarters and want FM-type binary files, you're choice may be limited. John Posada Senior Technical Writer I think the problem, to be quite honest with you, is that you've never actually known what the question is. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/spolloc1%40hotmail.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. References 1. http://www.winwriters.com/articles/rh2/index.html 2. http://www.techwr-l.com/techwhirl/archives/0603/techwhirl-0603-00862.html ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
RE: Framemaker vs. Flare
Hmmm, I am making process sheets for circuit board assembly. I need a standard format, as all the engineers have to this point been making their own documentation and now I'm here to standardize it all. We are in print right now (MS Word) but I want to be able to expand to go online with the process sheets eventually. A.J. Coots Documentation Specialist -Original Message- From: Ridder, Fred [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, August 17, 2006 12:05 PM To: AJ Coots Subject: RE: Framemaker vs. Flare This is like comparing MS Word to RoboHelp. Different tools for different purposes, and optimized for different types of deliverables. Flare is barely competent as a tool for production of books because it's intended to produce online help. FrameMaker is great for making books, but can only produce help with some add-on conversion tool. My opinions only; I don't speak for Intel. Fred Ridder (fred dot ridder at intel dot com) Intel Parsippany, NJ -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of AJ Coots Sent: Thursday, August 17, 2006 1:34 PM To: framers@lists.frameusers.com Subject: Framemaker vs. Flare Hello, Has anyone compared the functionality of Adobe Framemaker 7.2 with Madcap Software's (formerly Robohelp) Flare? I am trying to decide which one to go with for the documentation for my company. Framemaker seems to be the industry standard, but is Flare just as good? Any thoughts? Thanks! -Aj ___ ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Framemaker vs. Flare
Let me re-phrase the question: Has anyone here used Madcap Flare? A.J. Coots Documentation Specialist 16640 SW 72nd Ave. Portland, Oregon 97224-7756 Direct: 503 597 0765 Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
RE: Framemaker vs. Flare
Hardly a conviction...simply what the sales staff told me. I'm an babe-in-the-woods about all this. Just hoping for some guidance from the more experienced of you out there in cyber space. It looks like Flare is not very well known, even by it's own sales staff! A.J. Coots Documentation Specialist Portland, Oregon 97224-7756 Direct: 503 597 0765 Internal Ext. #515 Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: Art Campbell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, August 17, 2006 12:18 PM To: AJ Coots Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: Framemaker vs. Flare AJ, perhaps you'd better tell Madcap about your conviction that Flare is their FM killer; they seem to have the wrong info on their www site According to their www site, Flare is their help authoring tool. Help. Not books, XML, DITA. Just help. FM is a much more full-featured authoring environment that isn't designed just for help. And concerning Blaze: MadCap Blaze(tm) - Your Frame Alternative Blaze is the latest product under development from MadCap Software. Scheduled for release early 2007, Blaze will be the ideal solution for easily producing very long documents for print-such as books, manuals and illustrated guides-using the latest technological advances available. For years, authors have had to choose between ease of use (e.g., Microsoft(r) Word(tm)) or the power to handle very large documents (e.g., Adobe(r) FrameMaker(r)). Now, with MadCap Blaze, authors have a complete package: ease of use, power to create long documents, flexibility, and an eye toward the future. Cheers, Art On 8/17/06, AJ Coots [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Again...it's not Blaze it's Flare that is the contender with Framemaker. A.J. Coots Documentation Specialist 16640 SW 72nd Ave. Portland, Oregon 97224-7756 Direct: 503 597 0765 Internal Ext. #515 Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: Art Campbell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, August 17, 2006 11:47 AM To: John Posada Cc: AJ Coots; framers@lists.frameusers.com Subject: Re: Framemaker vs. Flare And in addition to John's accurate comments, do you want to bet your job and company on the first release of a new product (Blaze)? Or are you just talking about online help delivery with Flare? Art On 8/17/06, John Posada [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Has anyone compared the functionality of Adobe Framemaker 7.2 with Madcap Software's (formerly Robohelp) Flare? I am trying to decide which one to go with for the documentation for my company. Framemaker seems to be the industry standard, but is Flare just as good? Any thoughts? Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but the FM functionality in the Madcap product is, as of right now, still under very limited alpha testing and has not even gone beta yet. Besides, and again, correct me, but Madcap's FM-wannabe is going to be called Blaze, and I don't know if that's even hit alpha yet. So...if you are looking to implement something in the next couple of quarters and want FM-type binary files, you're choice may be limited. John Posada Senior Technical Writer -- Art Campbell [EMAIL PROTECTED] ... In my opinion, there's nothing in this world beats a '52 Vincent and a redheaded girl. -- Richard Thompson No disclaimers apply. DoD 358 -- Art Campbell [EMAIL PROTECTED] ... In my opinion, there's nothing in this world beats a '52 Vincent and a redheaded girl. -- Richard Thompson No disclaimers apply. DoD 358 ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Re: Framemaker vs. Flare
;- ) I think we all have been mislead by sales guys occasionally. If you're making initial startup decisions for your company or department though, you increase your risk substantially if you go exclusively with any new product or technology. Nobody ever got fired for recommending Microsoft, Sun, or IBM. Or Frame. Bottom line is: Be conservative with your production system; go with proven performers. Feel free to experiment, of course -- I'm sure many people on the list have already signed up for Blaze alpha/betas/trials. Including Adobe employees. But I don't think anyone's planning to make it their production system until they've beaten on it for months or years. It's a new product from a relatively new company, and many people don't have great product memories from the Madcap principal's last company, RoboHelp. Art On 8/17/06, AJ Coots [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hardly a conviction...simply what the sales staff told me. I'm an babe-in-the-woods about all this. Just hoping for some guidance from the more experienced of you out there in cyber space. It looks like Flare is not very well known, even by it's own sales staff! A.J. Coots Documentation Specialist Portland, Oregon 97224-7756 Direct: 503 597 0765 Internal Ext. #515 Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: Art Campbell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, August 17, 2006 12:18 PM To: AJ Coots Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: Framemaker vs. Flare AJ, perhaps you'd better tell Madcap about your conviction that Flare is their FM killer; they seem to have the wrong info on their www site According to their www site, Flare is their help authoring tool. Help. Not books, XML, DITA. Just help. FM is a much more full-featured authoring environment that isn't designed just for help. And concerning Blaze: MadCap Blaze(tm) - Your Frame Alternative Blaze is the latest product under development from MadCap Software. Scheduled for release early 2007, Blaze will be the ideal solution for easily producing very long documents for print-such as books, manuals and illustrated guides-using the latest technological advances available. For years, authors have had to choose between ease of use (e.g., Microsoft(r) Word(tm)) or the power to handle very large documents (e.g., Adobe(r) FrameMaker(r)). Now, with MadCap Blaze, authors have a complete package: ease of use, power to create long documents, flexibility, and an eye toward the future. Cheers, Art On 8/17/06, AJ Coots [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Again...it's not Blaze it's Flare that is the contender with Framemaker. snp -- Art Campbell [EMAIL PROTECTED] ... In my opinion, there's nothing in this world beats a '52 Vincent and a redheaded girl. -- Richard Thompson No disclaimers apply. DoD 358 ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
RE: Framemaker vs. Flare
Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of AJ Coots Let me re-phrase the question: Has anyone here used Madcap Flare? If you're looking for feedback from people who use Flare, you might want to ask this question on the HATT (Help Authoring Tools and Techniques) Yahoo group, or just search their archives. There are also Madcap user forums: http://tinyurl.com/k5vnk Bob Love people. Use things. Not vice-versa. -- Kelly Rothaus ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Framemaker vs. Flare
Hello, Has anyone compared the functionality of Adobe Framemaker 7.2 with Madcap Software's (formerly Robohelp) Flare? I am trying to decide which one to go with for the documentation for my company. Framemaker seems to be the industry standard, but is Flare just as good? Any thoughts? Thanks! -Aj
Framemaker vs. Flare
> Has anyone compared the functionality of Adobe Framemaker 7.2 with > Madcap Software's (formerly Robohelp) Flare? > > I am trying to decide which one to go with for the > documentation for my company. Framemaker seems to be the > industry standard, but is Flare just as good? Any thoughts? Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but the FM functionality in the Madcap product is, as of right now, still under very limited alpha testing and has not even gone beta yet. Besides, and again, correct me, but Madcap's FM-wannabe is going to be called Blaze, and I don't know if that's even hit alpha yet. So...if you are looking to implement something in the next couple of quarters and want FM-type binary files, you're choice may be limited. John Posada Senior Technical Writer "I think the problem, to be quite honest with you, is that you've never actually known what the question is."
Framemaker vs. Flare
And in addition to John's accurate comments, do you want to bet your job and company on the first release of a new product (Blaze)? Or are you just talking about online help delivery with Flare? Art On 8/17/06, John Posada wrote: > > Has anyone compared the functionality of Adobe Framemaker 7.2 with > > Madcap Software's (formerly Robohelp) Flare? > > > > I am trying to decide which one to go with for the > > documentation for my company. Framemaker seems to be the > > industry standard, but is Flare just as good? Any thoughts? > > Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but the FM functionality in the > Madcap product is, as of right now, still under very limited alpha > testing and has not even gone beta yet. > > Besides, and again, correct me, but Madcap's FM-wannabe is going to > be called Blaze, and I don't know if that's even hit alpha yet. > > So...if you are looking to implement something in the next couple of > quarters and want FM-type binary files, you're choice may be limited. > > > John Posada > Senior Technical Writer -- Art Campbell art.campbell at gmail.com "... In my opinion, there's nothing in this world beats a '52 Vincent and a redheaded girl." -- Richard Thompson No disclaimers apply. DoD 358
Framemaker vs. Flare
With Adobe having purchased Macromedia some time ago and announcing continued support for RoboHelp (see [1]http://www.winwriters.com/articles/rh2/index.html), which earlier Macromedia had purportedly wanted to drop, it will be interesting to see what will come out. My guess is Adobe will revamp FrameMaker to work with RoboHelp rather than, or maybe in addition to, Word, something Frame users have requested for many years now. Wow, no more MIF imports!! The last few versions of RoboHelp have worked (poorly) with WebWorks, and I see Adobe, whose animosity toward Microsoft is well known, as wanting to dominate our market. While Flare, which was created by former Macromedia/Blue Sky RoboHelp people when Macromedia was "killing" RoboHelp, seems to be attracting many people (see [2]http://www.techwr-l.com/techwhirl/archives/0603/techwhirl-0603-00862.html ), I'm all for the Adobe products. Admittedly, I don't know much about Flare. But imagine an integrated suite of tools intended just for us: Frame, RoboHelp, Photoshop, Illustrator, Flash, others (???)... --Sean Pollock, MidNyteOyl __ From: John Posada To: AJ Coots , framers at lists.frameusers.com Subject: Re: Framemaker vs. Flare Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 11:18:41 -0700 (PDT) > > Has anyone compared the functionality of Adobe Framemaker 7.2 with > > Madcap Software's (formerly Robohelp) Flare? > > > > I am trying to decide which one to go with for the > > documentation for my company. Framemaker seems to be the > > industry standard, but is Flare just as good? Any thoughts? > >Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but the FM functionality in the >Madcap product is, as of right now, still under very limited alpha >testing and has not even gone beta yet. > >Besides, and again, correct me, but Madcap's FM-wannabe is going to >be called Blaze, and I don't know if that's even hit alpha yet. > >So...if you are looking to implement something in the next couple of >quarters and want FM-type binary files, you're choice may be limited. > > >John Posada >Senior Technical Writer > >"I think the problem, to be quite honest with you, is that you've never actually known what the question is." >___ > > >You are currently subscribed to Framers as spolloc1 at hotmail.com. > >Send list messages to framers at lists.frameusers.com. > >To unsubscribe send a blank email to >framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com >or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/spolloc1%40hotmail.com > >Send administrative questions to lisa at frameusers.com. Visit >http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. References 1. http://www.winwriters.com/articles/rh2/index.html 2. http://www.techwr-l.com/techwhirl/archives/0603/techwhirl-0603-00862.html
Framemaker vs. Flare
Hmmm, I am making process sheets for circuit board assembly. I need a standard format, as all the engineers have to this point been making their own documentation and now I'm here to standardize it all. We are in print right now (MS Word) but I want to be able to expand to go online with the process sheets eventually. A.J. Coots Documentation Specialist -Original Message- From: Ridder, Fred [mailto:fred.rid...@intel.com] Sent: Thursday, August 17, 2006 12:05 PM To: AJ Coots Subject: RE: Framemaker vs. Flare This is like comparing MS Word to RoboHelp. Different tools for different purposes, and optimized for different types of deliverables. Flare is barely competent as a tool for production of books because it's intended to produce online help. FrameMaker is great for making books, but can only produce help with some add-on conversion tool. My opinions only; I don't speak for Intel. Fred Ridder (fred dot ridder at intel dot com) Intel Parsippany, NJ -Original Message- From: framers-bounces+fred.ridder=intel@lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-bounces+fred.ridder=intel.com at lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of AJ Coots Sent: Thursday, August 17, 2006 1:34 PM To: framers at lists.frameusers.com Subject: Framemaker vs. Flare Hello, Has anyone compared the functionality of Adobe Framemaker 7.2 with Madcap Software's (formerly Robohelp) Flare? I am trying to decide which one to go with for the documentation for my company. Framemaker seems to be the industry standard, but is Flare just as good? Any thoughts? Thanks! -Aj ___
Framemaker vs. Flare
Let me re-phrase the question: Has anyone here used Madcap Flare? A.J. Coots Documentation Specialist 16640 SW 72nd Ave. Portland, Oregon 97224-7756 Direct: 503 597 0765 Email: aj.coots at veris.com
Framemaker vs. Flare
Hardly a conviction...simply what the sales staff told me. I'm an babe-in-the-woods about all this. Just hoping for some guidance from the more experienced of you out there in cyber space. It looks like Flare is not very well known, even by it's own sales staff! A.J. Coots Documentation Specialist Portland, Oregon 97224-7756 Direct: 503 597 0765 Internal Ext. #515 Email: aj.coots at veris.com -Original Message- From: Art Campbell [mailto:art.campb...@gmail.com] Sent: Thursday, August 17, 2006 12:18 PM To: AJ Coots Cc: jposada01 at yahoo.com Subject: Re: Framemaker vs. Flare AJ, perhaps you'd better tell Madcap about your conviction that Flare is their FM killer; they seem to have the wrong info on their www site According to their www site, Flare is their help authoring tool. Help. Not books, XML, DITA. Just help. FM is a much more full-featured authoring environment that isn't designed just for help. And concerning Blaze: "MadCap Blaze(tm) - Your Frame Alternative Blaze is the latest product under development from MadCap Software. Scheduled for release early 2007, Blaze will be the ideal solution for easily producing very long documents for print-such as books, manuals and illustrated guides-using the latest technological advances available. For years, authors have had to choose between ease of use (e.g., Microsoft(r) Word(tm)) or the power to handle very large documents (e.g., Adobe(r) FrameMaker(r)). Now, with MadCap Blaze, authors have a complete package: ease of use, power to create long documents, flexibility, and an eye toward the future." Cheers, Art On 8/17/06, AJ Coots wrote: > Again...it's not Blaze it's Flare that is the contender with Framemaker. > > > > A.J. Coots > Documentation Specialist > > > > 16640 SW 72nd Ave. > Portland, Oregon 97224-7756 > > Direct: 503 597 0765 > Internal Ext. #515 > Email: aj.coots at veris.com > > > -Original Message- > From: Art Campbell [mailto:art.campbell at gmail.com] > Sent: Thursday, August 17, 2006 11:47 AM > To: John Posada > Cc: AJ Coots; framers at lists.frameusers.com > Subject: Re: Framemaker vs. Flare > > And in addition to John's accurate comments, do you want to bet your job > and > company on the first release of a new product (Blaze)? > > Or are you just talking about online help delivery with Flare? > > Art > > On 8/17/06, John Posada wrote: > > > Has anyone compared the functionality of Adobe Framemaker 7.2 with > > > Madcap Software's (formerly Robohelp) Flare? > > > > > > I am trying to decide which one to go with for the > > > documentation for my company. Framemaker seems to be the > > > industry standard, but is Flare just as good? Any thoughts? > > > > Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but the FM functionality in the > > Madcap product is, as of right now, still under very limited alpha > > testing and has not even gone beta yet. > > > > Besides, and again, correct me, but Madcap's FM-wannabe is going to > > be called Blaze, and I don't know if that's even hit alpha yet. > > > > So...if you are looking to implement something in the next couple of > > quarters and want FM-type binary files, you're choice may be limited. > > > > > > John Posada > > Senior Technical Writer > > -- > Art Campbell > art.campbell at gmail.com > "... In my opinion, there's nothing in this world beats a '52 Vincent >and a redheaded girl." -- Richard Thompson > No disclaimers apply. > DoD 358 > -- Art Campbell art.campbell at gmail.com "... In my opinion, there's nothing in this world beats a '52 Vincent and a redheaded girl." -- Richard Thompson No disclaimers apply. DoD 358
Framemaker vs. Flare
;- ) I think we all have been mislead by sales guys occasionally. If you're making initial startup decisions for your company or department though, you increase your risk substantially if you go exclusively with any new product or technology. Nobody ever got fired for recommending Microsoft, Sun, or IBM. Or Frame. Bottom line is: Be conservative with your production system; go with proven performers. Feel free to experiment, of course -- I'm sure many people on the list have already signed up for Blaze alpha/betas/trials. Including Adobe employees. But I don't think anyone's planning to make it their production system until they've beaten on it for months or years. It's a new product from a relatively new company, and many people don't have great product memories from the Madcap principal's last company, RoboHelp. Art On 8/17/06, AJ Coots wrote: > > Hardly a conviction...simply what the sales staff told me. > > I'm an babe-in-the-woods about all this. Just hoping for some guidance > from the more experienced of you out there in cyber space. > > It looks like Flare is not very well known, even by it's own sales > staff! > > > A.J. Coots > Documentation Specialist > Portland, Oregon 97224-7756 > > Direct: 503 597 0765 > Internal Ext. #515 > Email: aj.coots at veris.com > > > -Original Message- > From: Art Campbell [mailto:art.campbell at gmail.com] > Sent: Thursday, August 17, 2006 12:18 PM > To: AJ Coots > Cc: jposada01 at yahoo.com > Subject: Re: Framemaker vs. Flare > > AJ, perhaps you'd better tell Madcap about your conviction that Flare > is their FM killer; they seem to have the wrong info on their www > site > > According to their www site, Flare is their help authoring tool. Help. > Not books, XML, DITA. Just help. FM is a much more full-featured > authoring environment that isn't designed just for help. > > And concerning Blaze: > > "MadCap Blaze(tm) - Your Frame Alternative > > Blaze is the latest product under development from MadCap Software. > Scheduled for release early 2007, Blaze will be the ideal solution for > easily producing very long documents for print-such as books, manuals > and illustrated guides-using the latest technological advances > available. For years, authors have had to choose between ease of use > (e.g., Microsoft(r) Word(tm)) or the power to handle very large > documents > (e.g., Adobe(r) FrameMaker(r)). Now, with MadCap Blaze, authors have a > complete package: ease of use, power to create long documents, > flexibility, and an eye toward the future." > > Cheers, > Art > > On 8/17/06, AJ Coots wrote: > > Again...it's not Blaze it's Flare that is the contender with > Framemaker. > > -- Art Campbell art.campbell at gmail.com "... In my opinion, there's nothing in this world beats a '52 Vincent and a redheaded girl." -- Richard Thompson No disclaimers apply. DoD 358
Framemaker vs. Flare
Original Message- > From: framers-bounces+rshelton=opentext.com at lists.frameusers.com > [mailto:framers-bounces+rshelton=opentext.com at lists.frameusers.com]On > Behalf Of AJ Coots > > Let me re-phrase the question: Has anyone here used Madcap Flare? > If you're looking for feedback from people who use Flare, you might want to ask this question on the HATT (Help Authoring Tools and Techniques) Yahoo group, or just search their archives. There are also Madcap user forums: http://tinyurl.com/k5vnk Bob "Love people. Use things. Not vice-versa." -- Kelly Rothaus
