OT: autonumbering in Word
This has saved me much hell in auto-numbering and bullets in Word - http://www.tech-tav.com/macro.htm. They are free macros from tech-tav (authorIT producers) that automate autonumbering, bullets, etc. in Word. They work like a charm and they are based on Framemaker principles. All my developers here use Word and I have had all of them load these macros and we have been trouble-free in autonumbering, etc. for months now - no more frantic phone calls to come fix numbering when someone's document craps out or when, a simple edit or copy from one developer's document hoses another's! Once loaded, maintenance/interaction is darn near non-existent and for situations when you have no choice but to use Word, it has made life s much easier. I highly recommend them! TVB Tammy Van Boening Senior Technical Writer Jeppesen Sanderson, Inc. 303-328-4420 tammy.vanboening at jeppesen.com
OT: autonumbering in Word
Great posts, everyone and thanks for all the fish. I mean help. Sorry John, couldn't help it. We've set up numbering in our template with SEQ (sequence) fields and solved some of the problems. To see how SEQ fields work, just generate a caption or an xref in word, toggle the field codes, and take a look. It's also explained in the help, although not really well. But Stuart is right. You can't make a tag that uses SEQ fields, similar to creating a tag using autonumbering in FM. Well, at least we could not figure out how. We also separated the tag families (body, heading, and table) by starting each one with a tag based on (No Style). This allows us to make a feature change to an entire tag family by making the change to only the base tag. It also helps keep the docs generated by the enjanears intact when our template is attached. But as Stuart says, things can get mangled anyway. They somtimes import info from other Word docs when creating their own. The first time I created one of our big docs, I counted 187 tags in the source docs. It was SO much fun cleaning them all out. Fortunately, I have a shovel. :-) But no matter what you do, Word still has ways of using it's native "artificial" intelligence to reformat some things the docs while we sleep. The little paper clip, whom we have renamed from "Clippit" to "Gremlin" is at work. In the long run we plan on doing exactly what Jeremy has suggested. We are already using FM to generate our 3600 page docs from multiple (about 200) imported Word files. We plan to convert them back to individual Word files with Mif2Go, so that the enjanears can mangle, spindle, fold, mutilate, and update them for the next release. We will import the changes using unformatted text back into FM and then regenerate the Word files again with Mif2Go. Diane -Original Message- From: framers-bounces+dgcaller=earthlink@lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-bounces+dgcaller=earthlink.net at lists.frameusers.com]On Behalf Of Jeremy H. Griffith Sent: Friday, May 19, 2006 2:53 PM To: framers at lists.frameusers.com Cc: Fred Ridder; srogers at phoenix-geophysics.com Subject: Re: OT: autonumbering in Word On Fri, 19 May 2006 17:21:46 -0400, "Fred Ridder" wrote: >>From: Stuart Rogers > >>Regrettably, Jon, it sounds from McGhie's explanation that even your >>exhaustively careful preparation of numbering will not immunize you from >>all risks of numbering disaster. Apparently all you have to do is copy some >>numbered (or just bulleted!) content from another document and paste it >>into yours... That's pretty broken, all right... >In my experience with Word, the only truly reliable way to handle >numbering in Word is to avoid the autonumber feature altogether >and instead roll your own with the SEQ field code, which you >wind up using in a way that is fundamentally pretty similar to >FrameMaker's paragraph numbering except that you have to >assign a name to each individual digit's counter rather than being >able to name a complete multi-digit series as in Frame. Yes, I agree. That's the method we use in Mif2Go to make "live" autonumbers in Word docs, based on the Frame counters. The drawback WRT maintenance in Word is that you have to copy the SEQ fields from another para of the same type, or painfully recreate them by hand, for new paras; you can't include SEQ fields (or bullets) in the para format as such. This leads to the best workaround of all: use Frame, and generate the Word version on demand. ;-) We have several customers who do exactly that. It's even possible to do it in what used to be an all-Word shop. After all, if they get working Word files, why do they care *how* they were created? >Unfortunately, since bullets use the same mechanism in Word, you >still have to live with bizarre behavior in that feature... Unless you use Frame/Mif2Go as your Word authoring tool... -- Jeremy H. Griffith, at Omni Systems Inc. http://www.omsys.com/ ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as dgcaller at earthlink.net. Send list messages to framers at lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/dgcaller%40earthlink.net Send administrative questions to lisa at frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
OT: autonumbering in Word, was:Career advice--which application to focus on: FM or Word?
Hi Lin,
The great realization I had about Word is that the autonumbering feature
is NOT an attribute of the paragraph style like it is in FrameMaker.
Instead, think of the paragraph styles as being attributes of the
autonumbering feature. In turn, think of the autonumbering as an
attribute of the overall documentation design. When Adobe and Microsoft
designed their autonumbering features, they thought about it in two
entirely different ways.
That being said, I'll try to offer some instructions on using the
feature in Word(let me know if you get stuck).
1. Create all your heading styles first, but DO NOT apply any
autonumbering to them, just format the font and paragraph attributes.
Also, when you create your heading styles, be sure that they are based
on No Style
2. Go to FormatBullets and Numbering. To keep from messing up the
autonumbering, this is the ONLY way to modify the autonumbering in your
document, never go through the paragraph styles.
3. In the Bullets and Numbering box, go to the Outline tab and click the
Reset button to clear out any previously existing numbering formats.
Then select any one of the numbering boxes (except of course the 'None')
and click Customize.
4. Starting at level 1 and ending at level 9 (or however deep you want
your numbering), delete all the content in the Number Format box. This
will remove the default numbering system.
5. Starting at level 9 and working backward, select {1,2,3) in the
Numbering Style box and select the corresponding level number in the
Starting At scroll box. For example, select '9' for level 9, '8' for
level 8, etc. The only reason you want to do this is to keep things from
getting confusing in the next few steps. Go back through each level and
ensure that the only thing that appears in the Numbering Format box is
the shaded level number.
6. Starting again at level 9, put your cursor in the Numbering Format
box (BEFORE the '9') and select '8' in the Previous level number box.
'8' appears in the Numbering Format box before the '9'. If you want to
separate the two numbers type a dash, period, or whatever you want.
7. With level 9 still selected, repeat step 6 over and over, selecting
'7','6','5', etc from the Previous level number box. Make sure your
cursor is where you want the number to appear before you select the
number. When you are done, the box should show 1.2.3.4.5.6.7.8.9 for
level 9.
8. Repeat steps 6 and 7 for levels 8,7,6,5,4,3,2 and 1 in order.
9. check your work. Click through the level box for each level, 1-9. You
should see:
1.
1.2
1.2.3
1.2.3.4
1.2.3.4.5
1.2.3.4.5.6
1.2.3.4.5.6.7
1.2.3.4.5.6.7.8
1.2.3.4.5.6.7.8.9
10. Click the More button on the right side of the Bullets and
Numbering window and locate the Link Level with Style box.
11. In the Level list, select level 1.
12. in the Link level with Style box, select Heading 1.
13. Repeat steps 11-12 for level 2 and Heading 2, level 3 and Heading 3,
etc. For levels 2-9, make sure the Restart after level box is checked
and the correct number appears in the corresponding window. For example,
you want level 2 to restart after a level 1 heading.
14. Select Apply changes to: Whole list.
15. Remember in step 5 changing level 9 to '9, etc? Go back through all
the levels and change them to 1 in the Starting at box.
16. After all is said and done, click the OK button to close the
customization and bullets and numbering windows.
17. To use the autonumbering feature you just created, just assign
headings 1,2, etc. to whatever paragraphs you want.
So, is autonumbering in Word a pain? Yes. Does it work? Yes, but it is
easy to mess up. BTW, you can also assign autonumbering to tables,
figures, examples using similar steps.
...Jon
-Original Message-
From: Lin Surasky [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, May 19, 2006 12:36 PM
To: Jon Harvey
Subject: RE: Career advice--which application to focus on: FM or Word?
Okay, that's not fair. You have my curiosity peaked.
How DOES it actually work, as opposed to how it works (or not) for me
and other unenlightened users?
If it's not too complicated to explain in writing, would you mind? This
is one of those things I'm dying to learn, even though I don't use Word
at all anymore. I just know it has to work, but I've never had success
and it drives me crazy!
Thanks
-Lin
-Original Message-
From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
rs.com] On Behalf Of Jon Harvey
Sent: Friday, May 19, 2006 9:22 AM
To: Diane Gaskill; framers@FrameUsers.com
Subject: RE: Career advice--which application to focus on: FM or Word?
I agree with most of what you have said about Word. For large
documents, you are often better off using a piece a cardboard
and a crayon than having to resort to Word. However, I've
found that Word's autonumbering feature works better than
most people (including me) have complained about. I used to
get extremely frustrated with it until I quite literally had
an
Re: OT: autonumbering in Word
Jon Harvey wrote: Hi Lin, The great realization I had about Word is that the autonumbering feature is NOT an attribute of the paragraph style like it is in FrameMaker. Instead, think of the paragraph styles as being attributes of the autonumbering feature. In turn, think of the autonumbering as an attribute of the overall documentation design. When Adobe and Microsoft designed their autonumbering features, they thought about it in two entirely different ways. Actually, I think Microsoft thought about it in 17 different ways, all by itself. For a good laugh, read the entire document at http://tinyurl.com/5qo8d (Word's Numbering Explained by John McGhie, a Microsoft Most Valuable Professional). Regrettably, Jon, it sounds from McGhie's explanation that even your exhaustively careful preparation of numbering will not immunize you from all risks of numbering disaster. Apparently all you have to do is copy some numbered (or just bulleted!) content from another document and paste it into yours... -- Stuart Rogers Technical Communicator Phoenix Geophysics Limited Toronto, ON, Canada +1 (416) 491-7340 x 325 srogers phoenix-geophysics com The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness. John Kenneth Galbraith, 1908-2006 The smartest export Canada ever sent to the United States. Get Firefox! http://tinyurl.com/8q9c5 ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Re: OT: autonumbering in Word
From: Stuart Rogers [EMAIL PROTECTED] Regrettably, Jon, it sounds from McGhie's explanation that even your exhaustively careful preparation of numbering will not immunize you from all risks of numbering disaster. Apparently all you have to do is copy some numbered (or just bulleted!) content from another document and paste it into yours... In my experience with Word, the only truly reliable way to handle numbering in Word is to avoid the autonumber feature altogether and instead roll your own with the SEQ field code, which you wind up using in a way that is fundamentally pretty similar to FrameMaker's paragraph numbering except that you have to assign a name to each individual digit's counter rather than being able to name a complete multi-digit series as in Frame. Unfortunately, since bullets use the same mechanism in Word, you still have to live with bizarre behavior in that feature... Fred Ridder _ FREE pop-up blocking with the new MSN Toolbar get it now! http://toolbar.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200415ave/direct/01/ ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
RE: OT: autonumbering in Word
I've tried using the SEQ field codes in Word and, your right, it does work pretty well. However, I found it difficult to maintain. It can be time consuming to update larger documents. Once done tho, it is pretty reliable. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Fred Ridder Sent: Friday, May 19, 2006 5:22 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: framers@lists.frameusers.com Subject: Re: OT: autonumbering in Word From: Stuart Rogers [EMAIL PROTECTED] Regrettably, Jon, it sounds from McGhie's explanation that even your exhaustively careful preparation of numbering will not immunize you from all risks of numbering disaster. Apparently all you have to do is copy some numbered (or just bulleted!) content from another document and paste it into yours... In my experience with Word, the only truly reliable way to handle numbering in Word is to avoid the autonumber feature altogether and instead roll your own with the SEQ field code, which you wind up using in a way that is fundamentally pretty similar to FrameMaker's paragraph numbering except that you have to assign a name to each individual digit's counter rather than being able to name a complete multi-digit series as in Frame. Unfortunately, since bullets use the same mechanism in Word, you still have to live with bizarre behavior in that feature... Fred Ridder _ FREE pop-up blocking with the new MSN Toolbar - get it now! http://toolbar.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200415ave/direct/01/ ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/jharvey%40cambridges oft.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Re: OT: autonumbering in Word
From: Jeremy H. Griffith [EMAIL PROTECTED] snip The drawback WRT maintenance in Word is that you have to copy the SEQ fields from another para of the same type, or painfully recreate them by hand, for new paras; you can't include SEQ fields (or bullets) in the para format as such. Back in the days when our group still used Word for any serious work, our solution was to insert the standard types of numbered paragraphs (5 levels of headings, captions, table titles) complete with the required field codes via macros. For procedure steps you used macros to apply the numbering after you wrote the steps and substeps. _ Dont just search. Find. Check out the new MSN Search! http://search.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200636ave/direct/01/ ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
OT: autonumbering in Word, was:Career advice--which application to focus on: FM or Word?
Hi Lin,
The great realization I had about Word is that the autonumbering feature
is NOT an attribute of the paragraph style like it is in FrameMaker.
Instead, think of the paragraph styles as being attributes of the
autonumbering feature. In turn, think of the autonumbering as an
attribute of the overall documentation design. When Adobe and Microsoft
designed their autonumbering features, they thought about it in two
entirely different ways.
That being said, I'll try to offer some instructions on using the
feature in Word(let me know if you get stuck).
1. Create all your heading styles first, but DO NOT apply any
autonumbering to them, just format the font and paragraph attributes.
Also, when you create your heading styles, be sure that they are based
on "No Style"
2. Go to Format>Bullets and Numbering. To keep from messing up the
autonumbering, this is the ONLY way to modify the autonumbering in your
document, never go through the paragraph styles.
3. In the Bullets and Numbering box, go to the Outline tab and click the
Reset button to clear out any previously existing numbering formats.
Then select any one of the numbering boxes (except of course the 'None')
and click Customize.
4. Starting at level 1 and ending at level 9 (or however deep you want
your numbering), delete all the content in the Number Format box. This
will remove the default numbering system.
5. Starting at level 9 and working backward, select {1,2,3) in the
Numbering Style box and select the corresponding level number in the
Starting At scroll box. For example, select '9' for level 9, '8' for
level 8, etc. The only reason you want to do this is to keep things from
getting confusing in the next few steps. Go back through each level and
ensure that the only thing that appears in the Numbering Format box is
the shaded level number.
6. Starting again at level 9, put your cursor in the Numbering Format
box (BEFORE the '9') and select '8' in the Previous level number box.
'8' appears in the Numbering Format box before the '9'. If you want to
separate the two numbers type a dash, period, or whatever you want.
7. With level 9 still selected, repeat step 6 over and over, selecting
'7','6','5', etc from the Previous level number box. Make sure your
cursor is where you want the number to appear before you select the
number. When you are done, the box should show "1.2.3.4.5.6.7.8.9" for
level 9.
8. Repeat steps 6 and 7 for levels 8,7,6,5,4,3,2 and 1 in order.
9. check your work. Click through the level box for each level, 1-9. You
should see:
1.
1.2
1.2.3
1.2.3.4
1.2.3.4.5
1.2.3.4.5.6
1.2.3.4.5.6.7
1.2.3.4.5.6.7.8
1.2.3.4.5.6.7.8.9
10. Click the "More" button on the right side of the Bullets and
Numbering window and locate the "Link Level with Style" box.
11. In the Level list, select level 1.
12. in the "Link level with Style" box, select "Heading 1".
13. Repeat steps 11-12 for level 2 and Heading 2, level 3 and Heading 3,
etc. For levels 2-9, make sure the "Restart after level box is checked
and the correct number appears in the corresponding window. For example,
you want level 2 to restart after a level 1 heading.
14. Select "Apply changes to: Whole list".
15. Remember in step 5 changing level 9 to '9", etc? Go back through all
the levels and change them to 1 in the Starting at box.
16. After all is said and done, click the OK button to close the
customization and bullets and numbering windows.
17. To use the autonumbering feature you just created, just assign
headings 1,2, etc. to whatever paragraphs you want.
So, is autonumbering in Word a pain? Yes. Does it work? Yes, but it is
easy to mess up. BTW, you can also assign autonumbering to tables,
figures, examples using similar steps.
...Jon
-Original Message-
From: Lin Surasky [mailto:lin.sura...@retalix.com]
Sent: Friday, May 19, 2006 12:36 PM
To: Jon Harvey
Subject: RE: Career advice--which application to focus on: FM or Word?
Okay, that's not fair. You have my curiosity peaked.
How DOES it "actually" work, as opposed to how it works (or not) for me
and other unenlightened users?
If it's not too complicated to explain in writing, would you mind? This
is one of those things I'm dying to learn, even though I don't use Word
at all anymore. I just know it has to work, but I've never had success
and it drives me crazy!
Thanks
-Lin
> -Original Message-
> From:
> framers-bounces+lin.surasky=retalix.com at lists.frameusers.com
> [mailto:framers-bounces+lin.surasky=retalix.com at lists.frameuse
rs.com] On Behalf Of Jon Harvey
> Sent: Friday, May 19, 2006 9:22 AM
> To: Diane Gaskill; framers at FrameUsers.com
> Subject: RE: Career advice--which application to focus on: FM or Word?
>
> I agree with most of what you have said about Word. For large
> documents, you are often better off using a piece a cardboard
> and a crayon than having to resort to Word. However, I've
> found that Word's autonumbering feature works better than
>
OT: autonumbering in Word
Jon Harvey wrote:
> Hi Lin,
>
> The great realization I had about Word is that the autonumbering feature
> is NOT an attribute of the paragraph style like it is in FrameMaker.
> Instead, think of the paragraph styles as being attributes of the
> autonumbering feature. In turn, think of the autonumbering as an
> attribute of the overall documentation design. When Adobe and Microsoft
> designed their autonumbering features, they thought about it in two
> entirely different ways.
Actually, I think Microsoft thought about it in 17 different ways, all
by itself. For a good laugh, read the entire document at
http://tinyurl.com/5qo8d ("Word's Numbering Explained" by John McGhie, a
Microsoft Most Valuable Professional).
Regrettably, Jon, it sounds from McGhie's explanation that even your
exhaustively careful preparation of numbering will not immunize you from
all risks of numbering disaster. Apparently all you have to do is copy
some numbered (or just bulleted!) content from another document and
paste it into yours...
--
Stuart Rogers
Technical Communicator
Phoenix Geophysics Limited
Toronto, ON, Canada
+1 (416) 491-7340 x 325
srogers phoenix-geophysics com
"The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in
moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification
for selfishness."
John Kenneth Galbraith, 1908-2006
"The smartest export Canada ever sent to the United States."
Get Firefox!
http://tinyurl.com/8q9c5
OT: autonumbering in Word
>From: Stuart Rogers >Regrettably, Jon, it sounds from McGhie's explanation that even your >exhaustively careful preparation of numbering will not immunize you from >all risks of numbering disaster. Apparently all you have to do is copy some >numbered (or just bulleted!) content from another document and paste it >into yours... In my experience with Word, the only truly reliable way to handle numbering in Word is to avoid the autonumber feature altogether and instead roll your own with the SEQ field code, which you wind up using in a way that is fundamentally pretty similar to FrameMaker's paragraph numbering except that you have to assign a name to each individual digit's counter rather than being able to name a complete multi-digit series as in Frame. Unfortunately, since bullets use the same mechanism in Word, you still have to live with bizarre behavior in that feature... Fred Ridder _ FREE pop-up blocking with the new MSN Toolbar ? get it now! http://toolbar.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200415ave/direct/01/
OT: autonumbering in Word
> In my experience with Word, the only truly reliable way to > handle numbering in Word is to avoid the autonumber feature > altogether and instead roll your own with the SEQ field code, Right, but the fact is, it's obviously *supposed* to work somehow, isn't it? You're not supposed to have to roll your own field code, and it's certainly not designed to break after a certain number of pages. Are you supposed to be able to do autonumbering for any number of heading levels by setting the Styles, or are you supposed to use Format > Bullets and Numbering to set those styles? I've never seen the original documentation. What's *their* way to do it? Anne The information contained in or attached to this e-mail contains confidential or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient, be aware that any disclosure, copying, distribution or use of the contents of this e-mail is PROHIBITED. If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify the sender and delete the e-mail immediately. Thank you.
OT: autonumbering in Word
I've tried using the SEQ field codes in Word and, your right, it does work pretty well. However, I found it difficult to maintain. It can be time consuming to update larger documents. Once done tho, it is pretty reliable. -Original Message- From: framers-bounces+jharvey=cambridgesoft@lists.frameusers.com [mailto:framers-bounces+jharvey=cambridgesoft.com at lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Fred Ridder Sent: Friday, May 19, 2006 5:22 PM To: srogers at phoenix-geophysics.com Cc: framers at lists.frameusers.com Subject: Re: OT: autonumbering in Word >From: Stuart Rogers >Regrettably, Jon, it sounds from McGhie's explanation that even your >exhaustively careful preparation of numbering will not immunize you from >all risks of numbering disaster. Apparently all you have to do is copy some >numbered (or just bulleted!) content from another document and paste it >into yours... In my experience with Word, the only truly reliable way to handle numbering in Word is to avoid the autonumber feature altogether and instead roll your own with the SEQ field code, which you wind up using in a way that is fundamentally pretty similar to FrameMaker's paragraph numbering except that you have to assign a name to each individual digit's counter rather than being able to name a complete multi-digit series as in Frame. Unfortunately, since bullets use the same mechanism in Word, you still have to live with bizarre behavior in that feature... Fred Ridder _ FREE pop-up blocking with the new MSN Toolbar - get it now! http://toolbar.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200415ave/direct/01/ ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as jharvey at cambridgesoft.com. Send list messages to framers at lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/jharvey%40cambridges oft.com Send administrative questions to lisa at frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
OT: autonumbering in Word
I'm not sure I see why it matters, Anne. A broken feature is a broken feature, no matter how you access it and try to control it. As Stuart points out, you can follow Jon's carefully designed series of 17 steps and still have autonumbering that can be broken by a simple editing operation. It's a broken feature and if I need to use numbering I use a method that works first time, every time. The SEQ code is how Word did numbering before it added new codes for preformatted section autonumbering and *long* before they tried to make the application so bloody "smart" that it would automatically apply autonumbering when you do nothing more explicit than type a digit or a dash as the first character of a paragraph. The feature has never worked right since they tried to make it too smart by half. My opinions only; I don;t speak for Intel. Fred Ridder Intel Parsippany, NJ >From: "Anne Robotti" >To: >Subject: RE: OT: autonumbering in Word >Date: Fri, 19 May 2006 17:24:59 -0400 > > > In my experience with Word, the only truly reliable way to > > handle numbering in Word is to avoid the autonumber feature > > altogether and instead roll your own with the SEQ field code, > >Right, but the fact is, it's obviously *supposed* to work somehow, isn't >it? > >You're not supposed to have to roll your own field code, and it's >certainly not designed to break after a certain number of pages. > >Are you supposed to be able to do autonumbering for any number of >heading levels by setting the Styles, or are you supposed to use Format > > Bullets and Numbering to set those styles? > >I've never seen the original documentation. What's *their* way to do it? > >Anne > > > >The information contained in or attached to this e-mail contains >confidential or privileged information. If you are not the intended >recipient, be aware that any disclosure, copying, distribution or use of >the contents of this e-mail is PROHIBITED. If you have received this e-mail >in error, please notify the sender and delete the e-mail immediately. Thank >you. >___ > > >You are currently subscribed to Framers as DocuDoc at hotmail.com. > >Send list messages to framers at lists.frameusers.com. > >To unsubscribe send a blank email to >framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com >or visit >http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/docudoc%40hotmail.com > >Send administrative questions to lisa at frameusers.com. Visit >http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. I'm not sure I see why it matters, Anne. A broken feature is a broken feature, no matter how you access it and try to control it. As Stuart points out, you can follow Jon's carefully designed series of >From: "Anne Robotti" >To: >Subject: RE: OT: autonumbering in Word >Date: Fri, 19 May 2006 17:24:59 -0400 > > > In my experience with Word, the only truly reliable way to > > handle numbering in Word is to avoid the autonumber feature > > altogether and instead roll your own with the SEQ field code, > >Right, but the fact is, it's obviously *supposed* to work somehow, isn't >it? > >You're not supposed to have to roll your own field code, and it's >certainly not designed to break after a certain number of pages. > >Are you supposed to be able to do autonumbering for any number of >heading levels by setting the Styles, or are you supposed to use Format > > Bullets and Numbering to set those styles? > >I've never seen the original documentation. What's *their* way to do it? > >Anne > > > >The information contained in or attached to this e-mail contains >confidential or privileged information. If you are not the intended >recipient, be aware that any disclosure, copying, distribution or use of >the contents of this e-mail is PROHIBITED. If you have received this e-mail >in error, please notify the sender and delete the e-mail immediately. Thank >you. >___ > > >You are currently subscribed to Framers as DocuDoc at hotmail.com. > >Send list messages to framers at lists.frameusers.com. > >To unsubscribe send a blank email to >framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com >or visit >http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/docudoc%40hotmail.com > >Send administrative questions to lisa at frameusers.com. Visit >http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. _ Don?t just search. Find. Check out the new MSN Search! http://search.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200636ave/direct/01/
OT: autonumbering in Word
I agree. What I've been able to do is create autonumbered documents that seem to hold better than a house of cards. I still can't build a fortress tho. There's always gonna be someone who can mess it up. It's not necessarily because they are careless either. Microsoft has tried so hard to automate features in Word that a writer doing one thing can cause another to change without the writer knowing about it. When using the autonumbering feature, the writer just has to know what those things are. If they do, they can prevent/fix a lot of their problems. For example, one thing I discovered is to base all autonumber headings on "no style". BTW, if you want to import bullets or autonumbered content, just assign your document's native autonumbered headings to them. (Actually, I'm not sure this will work, but if it doesn't, it is easy to fix.) >Regrettably, Jon, it sounds from McGhie's explanation that even your >exhaustively careful preparation of numbering will not immunize you from >all risks of numbering disaster. Apparently all you have to do is copy >some numbered (or just bulleted!) content from another document and >paste it into yours... -- Stuart Rogers Technical Communicator Phoenix Geophysics Limited Toronto, ON, Canada +1 (416) 491-7340 x 325 srogers phoenix-geophysics com "The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness." John Kenneth Galbraith, 1908-2006 "The smartest export Canada ever sent to the United States." Get Firefox! http://tinyurl.com/8q9c5 ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as jharvey at cambridgesoft.com. Send list messages to framers at lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/jharvey%40cambridges oft.com Send administrative questions to lisa at frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
OT: autonumbering in Word
On Fri, 19 May 2006 17:21:46 -0400, "Fred Ridder" wrote: >>From: Stuart Rogers > >>Regrettably, Jon, it sounds from McGhie's explanation that even your >>exhaustively careful preparation of numbering will not immunize you from >>all risks of numbering disaster. Apparently all you have to do is copy some >>numbered (or just bulleted!) content from another document and paste it >>into yours... That's pretty broken, all right... >In my experience with Word, the only truly reliable way to handle >numbering in Word is to avoid the autonumber feature altogether >and instead roll your own with the SEQ field code, which you >wind up using in a way that is fundamentally pretty similar to >FrameMaker's paragraph numbering except that you have to >assign a name to each individual digit's counter rather than being >able to name a complete multi-digit series as in Frame. Yes, I agree. That's the method we use in Mif2Go to make "live" autonumbers in Word docs, based on the Frame counters. The drawback WRT maintenance in Word is that you have to copy the SEQ fields from another para of the same type, or painfully recreate them by hand, for new paras; you can't include SEQ fields (or bullets) in the para format as such. This leads to the best workaround of all: use Frame, and generate the Word version on demand. ;-) We have several customers who do exactly that. It's even possible to do it in what used to be an all-Word shop. After all, if they get working Word files, why do they care *how* they were created? >Unfortunately, since bullets use the same mechanism in Word, you >still have to live with bizarre behavior in that feature... Unless you use Frame/Mif2Go as your Word authoring tool... -- Jeremy H. Griffith, at Omni Systems Inc. http://www.omsys.com/
OT: autonumbering in Word
>From: "Jeremy H. Griffith" >The drawback WRT maintenance in Word is that you have to >copy the SEQ fields from another para of the same type, or >painfully recreate them by hand, for new paras; you can't >include SEQ fields (or bullets) in the para format as such. Back in the days when our group still used Word for any serious work, our solution was to insert the standard types of numbered paragraphs (5 levels of headings, captions, table titles) complete with the required field codes via macros. For procedure steps you used macros to apply the numbering after you wrote the steps and substeps. _ Don?t just search. Find. Check out the new MSN Search! http://search.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200636ave/direct/01/
