Re: [Frameworks] Repair for CP16 cameras

[Scott Dorsey]

For years I used Whitehouse AV, but after the guy's stroke he has been unable
to do a lot of things, but he's still able to do some others.  He still works
on the CP16s but won't touch GSMOs or lenses any longer.  He is in LA.

What is wrong with yours?  The cool thing about these cameras is that all
the controls are electronic, so a cleaning and lube is a very easy job.
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] Homemade fixer?

[Scott Dorsey]

You really need fixer, but because the chemistry is pretty much the same
all over, the fixer used for kodaliths at the print shop or the t-shirt
shop will work... so will the fixer used for x-rays at the hospital. 

You can just make sodium thiosulfate or ammonium thiosulfate solution 
without a hardener... it is asking for emulsion damage to do that, but it
is better than nothing.

The salt solution... sort of works it will work for a little while, but
it won't work very well and you will need to refix your film as soon as 
possible with a proper fixer.  

Find a still photographer in your area who might have some idea of 
old leftover supplies and older photographers.
--scott

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Re: [Frameworks] Advice on combining different frame rates and definitions in adobe premiere

[Scott Dorsey]

Well, it's a bad idea to cut stuff together at different rates because
they're going to have different rate conversion artifacts.  You'll have
3:2 pulldown annoyance on some shots, but not on others.

But you do what you have to do with the material that you have and 
that's how life is, especially in the documentary world where there
is often unreplaceable historical footage involved.

You may find that running 24fps material at 25fps or vice-versa works well
for silent shots but the pitch change on the sound is annoying.  There's
really no other way to deal with 30fps material though (especially with
interlace) other than rate conversion.  

Modern rate conversion algorithms are much less annoying than the horrible
film chain pulldown mess that we saw on TV for so many years, but you can
still tell that something isn't right.  Oh, well.
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] optical soundtrack generator?

[Scott Dorsey]

>   Hi Pip, I?d be happy to use an optical sound camera or lab equivalent

Any lab should be willing to make you an optical track.  Trackwise is gone,
but I know that Colorlab and Fotokem have sound cameras.  I can do 16mm but
not 35mm any longer.
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] optical soundtrack generator?

[Scott Dorsey]

3378 is basically the same as 5278 with an estar base... I have used it in
Bolexes and CP-16s with no problems for years.  The Bolex does have enough
torque to damage things if it jams, but it's not as if jamming is a frequent
problem.  It's higher contrast than the hi-con stock which makes it great
for titling and mattes if you can live with tape splicing it.

For actual sound recording the estar base is a huge win because it does not
expand and contract as much with processing and drying the way acetate does,
so the acetate version only stuck around because it was cheaper.

For a long time I ran Agfa ST-8 through the sound cameras, but that has
become difficult to find.  That's also a polyester base.

I would not worry too much about running the new polyester film stocks in
a well-maintained Bolex.
--scott

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Re: [Frameworks] optical soundtrack generator?

[Scott Dorsey]

Ahh, I get it, you want a digital image of what the soundtrack would like and
you want to plot it out as part of your filmout.

This turns out not to be an easy thing to do because of the frame lines...
it is very very hard to get the bottom of one frame to line up perfectly with
the top of the next one so there is not some discontinuity 24 times a second.
The Arrilaser recorder can do it, but they take a file that consists of 
frames and turn it into a datastream that consists of individual lines, and
plot a line at a time instead of a frame at a time.

But if you want to try it just to see what happens, it should not be all
that hard to write a little script to create two white lines whose width
varies with modulation.  Pull values one at a time out of a .wav file, 
use them to set the width of the line directly.
--scott

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Re: [Frameworks] optical soundtrack generator?

[Scott Stark]

Hi Scott, I¹m not familiar with the Maurer but I want to create the visual
track that I can print to a strip of 35mm film (using a 35mm device I
have). I thought if there was some app or tool that could transfer a piece
of audio to its optical representation that might get me started.

Thanks, Scott

On 9/7/20, 5:03 PM, "FrameWorks on behalf of Scott Dorsey"

wrote:

>I'm not sure what you're asking.  You want a Maurer sound camera or you
>want
>something equivalent?
>--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] optical soundtrack generator?

[Scott Dorsey]

I'm not sure what you're asking.  You want a Maurer sound camera or you want
something equivalent?
--scott
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[Frameworks] optical soundtrack generator?

[Scott Stark]

Hi all, does anyone know of a tool that can generate an optical soundtrack
image? I looked on Google but all I could find was this
<http://www.kapotski.be/wp/?p=628>  which I didn¹t quite understand.

Thanks, Scott



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Re: [Frameworks] Beaulieu 4008ZM4 Super 8 silent camera

[Scott Dorsey]

Take your battery to a local battery rebuilder, they should charge $20 or so
to recell the original battery.

However, if the camera hasn't been run for 40 years, I would want to 
lubricate it before applying power.  I have seen so many people who 
destroyed old cine cameras by running them without oil or grease on 
the intermittents.
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] Slide Projector Controller

[Scott Dorsey]

Okay, probably the way it was supposed to work is that it has cue tones
on the audio track which keys the synchronizer.  Every time the synchronizer
hears the 1kc tone, it presses the CUE button on the Coyote.

So the way you normally do this is that you load the program into the Coyote,
cue up the tape, set the coyote to playback, and then the first beep on the
tape starts the first cue on the coyote, the second beep on the tape starts
the second beep on the coyote.

You can verify this by running the thing and pressing the CUE button by
hand every time you hear a beep and making sure everything lines up properly.

If this is the case and my guess is right then you will need to get
the synchronizer.. I think the audio in and out on the Coyote itself is
just for loading and storing the program from and to tape.

However, this is 40-year-old information from someone who never used that
model in the first place so take it with a grain of salt and ask the guru.
--scott


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Re: [Frameworks] Slide Projector Controller

[Scott Dorsey]

Just because it works in mag tape bypass mode does not mean that the
controller is actually working and hearing audio.

If you load the program into the machine, can you see it?  Going with the
up and down buttons can you see a bunch of cues in there?  Can you play
those cues back by hand in order by pressing the cut button?

I am assuming you're loading the program in off a program tape and not 
punching it all in by hand.  If you punch it in by hand that's fine but
it doesn't validate that the input works.

Does the track on the tape just have 1000kc tones all one after the other,
just the same tone every time and not different ones? 

Do you have the synchronizer device that goes from the tape machine to
the coyote?  Was the original show done with the synchronizer or wild
or with timecode?  If there is timecode on the track, it will be a whining
sound instead of identical beeps.

I have never used a Coyote but I used to have some time on the Eagle and
Show Pro controllers from AVL.  Do you have the Coyote manual?

The expert multimage guy is stevenmichael...@gmail.com and he will almost
certainly be able to figure out how the original configuration was done.
--scott




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Re: [Frameworks] Making clear leader

[Scott Dorsey]

B film will bleach with Farmer's Reducer or reversal process bleach.  The
image is a silver image, so what you're doing is reacting with the silver to
form a soluble salt that you can clear out.

However, the B emulsion is also designed for low temperature processing
so another route is to put it in very hot water and just dissolve all the
gelatin right off.  I once sent an edited negative containing color and B
sections to Commonwealth Film for processing.  Even though the can was untaped
some bozo ran the whole thing through the color processing machine and the
B sections were all perfectly clear afterward because the emulsion was all
completely removed.

Color film is going to be more problematic... if it is long perf it's probably
best to just use it for soundtrack fill...
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] Book

[Scott MacDonald]

*Way to go, Jonathan!*

*I look forward to reading it.*

*Scott*

On Tue, Jul 7, 2020 at 9:44 AM Jonathan Walley  wrote:

> Dear Frameworkers,
>
> I am pleased to announce the publication of my book, *Cinema Expanded:
> Avant-Garde Film in the Age of Intermedia*, from Oxford University Press:
>
>
> https://global.oup.com/academic/product/cinema-expanded-9780190938642?lang=en=us
>
> This very long book benefited substantially from discussions and debates
> on this very forum over many years, as well as from information, ideas,
> materials, time, and energy from many of this lists members. It makes a
> very “cine-centric” argument about expanded cinema, placing it primarily in
> the context of avant-garde/experimental film culture.
>
> I’m not fishing for compliments or congratulations (nor complaints), just
> passing along information to any interested parties. I highly recommend the
> e-book version, in which the images (over 270 of them) are reproduced in
> color (they are BW in print) and enlargeable.
>
> I’m especially excited that this book has been released in the same year
> as the 50th anniversary edition of Gene Youngblood’s *Expanded Cinema*.
> While my account differs from Gene’s, it is certainly in dialogue with that
> landmark book.
>
> I beg your forgiveness for this brief eruption of self-aggrandizement.
>
> All best wishes,
> Jonathan
>
>
> Dr. Jonathan Walley
> Associate Professor
> Department of Cinema
> Denison University
> https://denison.edu/people/jonathan-walley
>
>
>
>
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Re: [Frameworks] Tripod Wanted

[Scott Dorsey]

I think the heavier Ries tripods are probably the best for fending off
alligators, if only because they extend to nearly six feet and you want to
keep alligators as far away from you as possible.
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] 16mm Film Projector

[Scott Dorsey]

> Thanks everyone for your help with the resources and everything! I managed
> to get a projector and I just bought a replacement bulb, but it immediately
> started smoking and heating up. Does anyone know what the problem could be?

It's been sitting on a shelf for decades without anything being cleaned or
lubricated.  The belts are bad, the grease is all caked up on everything.
It needs a PM... find a local tech to just do a cleaning and lube.  And hope
you didn't do too much collateral damage by running it without one.
--scott


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Re: [Frameworks] FrameWorks Digest, Vol 121, Issue 1: Re: 6mm Film Projector

[Scott Dorsey]

I do not like slotload projectors, but there are a lot of companies out
there that refurbish and sell projectors.  Ken Layton is an honest and 
reasonable source for refurbed classroom projectors, so is Urbanski Films.
DuAll sometimes have some in stock.  Optech Light Bulbs in Andover, MA
sometimes has B classroom projectors.  Cardinal Sound and Motion Picture
will have theatre projectors including the big arc head Elmos, but they
won't touch classroom stuff.
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] Experimental films on photography

[Scott Dorsey]

Anyone mentioned La Jetee yet?
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] 16mm Film Projector

[Scott Dorsey]

Abdul Setoua is in Astoria, NY, he has a 718 area code number as I recall.
PAV is on Long Island.  But it's not THAT hard to ship stuff off.
--scott


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Re: [Frameworks] 16mm Film Projector

[Scott Dorsey]

> How would I go about repairing it and/or figuring out what=E2=80=99s wrong =
> with it?

I am assuming that there is nothing wrong with it, that it is perfectly fine
and just needs maintenance.  If it needs repair, that is a different matter.

Most projectors have service manuals available which will describe how to do
the standard cleaning and lubrication, and if you are lucky that is all you
will need.  Eikis are more prone than most for the lube to really glop up
to the point where it needs total dissassembly and cleaning with naptha rather
than just the cleaning and lube procedure in the manual.  That quickly runs
into time.

As Julian noted, most Bell and Howell 500-series projectors have a worm gear 
which is made of a material that is incompatible with the lubricants they
used, and which cracks.  A new worm gear is available for $20 from Urbanski.
It is an eight hour job to get the thing apart and back together.  I tend to
replace the bearings too since after spending all that time you might as well
replace anything that might wear.  I'd replace the cam followers too if I could
get them, but I can't.  Optech in Boston might; they have hoarded spare 
500-series parts for years.  300-series and 1500-series B projectors don't do 
this but they all have their own oddities.

As he mentioned, the urethane rollers on many Elmo models fail.  
New replacements are available.  They aren't cheap, but they aren't very
time consuming to replace and it's the time charges that will kill you.
This is also not a failure, it's a wear item that you expect to replace now
and then, just like you expect to put new brakes on your car.

If you would not be comfortable disassembling a manual transmission or you
think 3-in-1 oil is actually good for something, please, please have a tech
do the work for you.  These projectors are not being made any more and when
they get wrecked they aren't getting replaced.  Proper maintenance will keep
them running a long time.
--scott

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Re: [Frameworks] 16mm Film Projector

[Scott Dorsey]

The problem with those freebies is that they aren't free.  People get them,
they don't want to pay to have them cleaned and lubed before they use them,
and then they wreck the cams in an hour of using them dry.  Budget maybe
$200 to $300 to have a free projector put into condition to use. 

Please do not apply power to a projector that has been on the shelf for
decades.
--scott

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Re: [Frameworks] film: from start to finish

[Scott Dorsey]

> Would someone point me to a comprehensive resource for learning to make a 
> film, start to finish, on film?

A good discussion is in "A Primer for Filmmaking" by Roberts and Sharples.

--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] 16mm Film Projector

[Scott Dorsey]

There are lots of free projectors out there... and people buy them but
then find out that a PM is going to cost them money.  Budget some money
to clean up a projector that has not been run in decades.  Even if it has
very few hours on it, it's going to need cleaning and lubrication and
rubber parts will be old and cracked.
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] Arri S Tech Question

[Scott Dorsey]

You could probably get an M42-to-PL adaptor and then an Olympus-to-M42
adaptor and screw them together if you really are married to that 
configuration.  I wouldn't try it with a zoom, though... every time you
add an adaptor you're adding more error to your backfocus distance.
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] Looking for camera repair

[Scott Dorsey]

When was the last time it got a PM?  It likely just needs to be completely
torn down, cleaned, and lubricated.

The DeVry is very easy to work on... way easier than an eyemo.  Any cine
tech should be able to do it, but be aware that it is still time-consuming.
DuAll is nice if you're convenient to New York but there are plenty of other
shops out there.  Get the lens backfocus tested while it's on the bench.
--scott

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Re: [Frameworks] EIKI slimline 16mm projector query

[Scott Dorsey]

The heavy takeup reel isn't taking up better because it's heavy, it is taking
up better because the diameter of the center hub is larger.  Just fix it.
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] Have old 35mm b + w ?

[Scott Dorsey]

I'd ask a lab if they had any ancient intermediate films in the closet.
They'll be long KS perf which may or may not be a problem for you.

If you wanted 16mm, I have a couple cans of Television Recording Film
around here somewhere with mid-seventies date codes...
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] EIKI slimline 16mm projector query

[Scott Dorsey]

In addition to the belt, there is a slip clutch that goes bad.  The belts 
should be replaced every decade or so just pre-emptively, but in a pinch
cleaning them with 409 (buyl cellosolve kitchen degreaser) will often help.
If the slip clutch is slipping too much, take it apart, wash the parts 
with 409, and put it back together.
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] Lens caps

[Scott Dorsey]

What is the diameter of the lens inside and out?

I have used the plastic covers from round military electronics connectors as
lenscaps for smaller lenses.  I really prefer threaded lenscaps though.
--scott

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Re: [Frameworks] Quote of the Day

[Scott Dorsey]

> The only movie about epidemics I like is The Andromeda Strain.

Andromeda Strain is a great, great film.  However I urge you to watch
this short film of Steven King's story "Night Surf" which I think is
quite well-done:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LaDu0agqtjc

--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] Free junk film

[Scott Dorsey]

It is taken!
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] Free junk film

[Scott Dorsey]

I have here a box that mostly contains interviews on original reversal film
with magfilm sound tracks on each.  Lots of people talking about UFOs and 
various silliness but some documentary shots of various sorts.  Also has
some special effects shots... mattes that don't match up with anything, etc.

The first person willing to pay media mail shipping gets it.  I have no
rights to any of the interviews so I'd kind of prefer it goes to a school
or something that is going to use it for editing practice.  But once it is
is out of my hands it becomes your problem.
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] Long shot: Looking for Canon Scoopic 16m

[Scott Dorsey]

Chambless almost always has them, and Chambless will do competent refurb
jobs on them.  Of course, you have to pay Chambless prices but that is how
it goes.

You do know that there are plenty of other reflex cameras out there besides
the Scoopic and the Bolex, right?
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] when was the film splicer invented?

[Scott Dorsey]

> Leo Catozzo was allergic to acetone and invented the tape splicer, it says 
> here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leo_Catozzo

Catozzo invented the perforating splicer, that used unperforated tape and 
cut new holes in the tape with dies as you made the splice.  These are very
fast and convenient and projectionists love them, but the chad that gets 
punched out of the holes always winds up where it doesn't belong.

Splicers using perforated tape like the modern Hollywood Film splicers were
in common use before Catozzo invented the guillotine splicer.  Those are
much slower to use... the guillotine splicer is lightning fast and was a huge
thing when it came out.
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] when was the film splicer invented?

[Scott Dorsey]

Tape is edited with razor blades.  Film is edited with a splicer.

Here is a fair video on the tape editing process:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iTh8FAoI4PU

In very early days, film would be edited in a block sort the way tape
is edited... the block had pins that locked up the perforations, and you
would scrape and cement the same way you do with film in a hot splicer.
I have never seen this in real life but it was apparently done in the
Edison days.

Cement splicing came in first, with devices that weren't that different
than a modern Meier-Hancock in general appearance, and I think that
was pretty much universal by 1920.  Cement splicing is still used today
for camera originals.

I don't know when tape splicing of workprints came in, but it was in common
use in the forties.  Tape splices aren't clean on screen but they can be
undone without losing any frames so they are great for workprints where
you may want to be changing things around a lot.

Ultrasonic splicers came around in the seventies when estar stock first
appearing... it couldn't be cemented, and tape splices are ugly. 

Scissors are handy for roughing out and cutting huge chunks of frames out
before splicing, but they aren't much good for getting precise overlap.
Small sharp scissors are a must-have for editing, along with a china marker.

Your tape splicer likely has a gadget for making clean splices between
frame line, and another one for making diagonal cuts.  The diagonal cutter
is for editing magfilm, so you get a smooth transition between sounds.

Kodak patented a tape splicer that made wierd U-shaped cuts, and sold it
as the Presstape Splicer.  The splices are very very strong going through
a projector but look just horrible on screen.
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] Looking to buy Bolex or similar

[Scott Dorsey]

The problem is that there aren't many people who can service the things
any longer, whereas it used to be there were thousands of older guys who
had been through Filmo and Eyemo school in the service who were doing 
camera service.  So what you save in lower prices due to reduced demand,
you pay double for in higher prices for refurbishment and basic maintenance.
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] Looking to buy Bolex or similar

[Scott Dorsey]

Yes, I mean Du-All.  

I noticed Chambless's website is down today.  Are they okay?
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] Looking to buy Bolex or similar

[Scott Dorsey]

Jeff, is the Rex 1 possible to refit with a Rex 5 finder?  The Rex 1 finder is
really kind of horrible but I have never seen a retrofit done before.

> Get a 10mm Rx Switar and you're good to go.

I second this recommendation... I had no idea how cool this lens was until a
few years ago.  
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] Looking to buy Bolex or similar

[Scott Dorsey]

You tried DuArt and B's used division? 
--scott
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[Frameworks] Thanks!

[Scott MacDonald]

*Thanks, Frameworkers,*

*I now have Guy Maddin's contact information.*

*All the best!*

*Scott*
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[Frameworks] Guy Maddin

[Scott MacDonald]

*Dear FRAMEWORKERS,*

*Hope you're doing okay in this strange strange moment, or as okay as
possible,. wherever you are.*

*If somebody has Guy Maddin's contact information, could you send it to my
personal email?*

*THANKS, in advance.*

*Scott*
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Re: [Frameworks] optical/mechanical v. digital

[Scott Dorsey]

I think they are talking about using a digital simulation of the large shutter
angle technique.
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] 35mm Oxberry 5333 Filmstrip / Slide Stand

[Scott Dorsey]

Interesting... oxberry.com was active in February but appears to have been
put on hold now.  They were actually pretty good about support for their
older gear.

Do you have the pinout for the A connector?  Do you have the controller
box?

Frank Wyle at the Library of Congress has worked on these... I always threw
the damn things away and installed Acme cameras.  International Cinema in
Miami also likely will have documentation for them.

If you don't have the controller box you could likely rig one up... as I
recall there are a couple motors, one runninng continuously and one not, and
a solenoid.  Would not be too hard to rig something up if you had the pinout
and controller diagrams.
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] Eclair NPR

[Scott Dorsey]

There are literally dozens and dozens of different motors for the NPR,
everybody and his brother made one.  As Jeff says, if you want to shoot
synch, you probably want the Alcan.

Now, there are some other motors out there that give you crystal control
and varying speeds, and some of them that do ramps and fancy things, and 
if you come across one I wouldn't turn it down, but they are not as common
as the Alcan and not as well-supported.

Also be aware that not all Perfectone motors are crystal-synch... there 
is one model Perfectone that is fairly accurate but will still require an
umbilical.

I don't know where to send you... Chambless always has motors for those
things, but they want ludicrously high prices for them given the current
market for 16mm gear.  And there's no reason to replace your motor when it
is likely not difficult to repair at someplace like DuAll or Whitehouse.
--scott

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Re: [Frameworks] Eclair NPR

[Scott Dorsey]

If the problem is the motor, pull the motor and ship it to DuAll or someone
that works on those.  There is no reason to ship the whole camera if there
is a motor issue.  (That said, if it's been a decade since the camera has
had a PM, it might be a good idea to ship it in for a PM as well).

The electronics in those motors aren't that hard to work on; anybody that
does camera electronics should be okay with it.  It's not like a GSMO or
something full of weird proprietary parts.  However, it's likely to be 
PM time too.
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] Eclair NPR

[Scott Dorsey]

Which motor does it have?  I am presuming the motor is the issue?  There
are probably more different motors available for the NPR than any other
camera made.  If it's one of the crystal sync motors, the electronics on
them aren't hard to work on and most of what goes bad are electrolytic
capacitors.  If it's a wild DC motor, before doing anything open up the
brush compartments and make sure the brushes are in good condition.  Always
keep spare brushes on hand.
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] Affect

[Scott Dorsey]

"Affect" is another word that I think started out as psychological jargon and
has become more widespread.
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] Cameraless film in the university

[Scott Hammen]

I’ve been following these posts hoping that there would, sooner or later,
be some mention of actual films.


Perhaps the “old masters” like Man Ray, Len Lye, and Brakhage don’t need
special mention, but, before closing the thread, it would be great to see
some recommendations of a few cameraless films worth trying to see.


Any suggestions ?


Scott Hammen

On Thu, 13 Feb 2020 at 16:08, Ignacio Tamarit 
wrote:

> Hi Albert!
>
> I do know that there was a class of cameraless animation at FUC (Fundación
> Universidad del Cine) for the people that study the animation degree, but I
> think that is over.  Also at FUC, at the Técnicas Audiovisuales subject,
> which is the one where students can have a insight in experimental cinema,
> there is a coverage of found footage and cameraless films. For two years I
> was invited to this classes to do a lecture on Cameraless cinema and
> project films on 16 mm.
>
>
> All the best,
>
> Ignacio
>
> El jue., 13 feb. 2020 a las 11:00, Albert Alcoz ()
> escribió:
>
>> Thank you very much for these positive answers.
>>
>> Today Frameworks has given me a joy.
>>
>> It's great to see cameraless film is an important issue in the university.
>>
>> I will use all these thoughts for the academic paper.
>>
>> Best,
>> Albert
>>
>> On Thu, Feb 13, 2020 at 10:56 AM Carolina Cappa 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Hola Alberto,
>>>
>>> At the University of Buenos Aires we regularly include a 16 mm
>>> cameraless film workshop as part of the Audiovisual Technology biannual
>>> subject. We've been doing it since 2015 and in crowded classrooms as this
>>> university is public and free. I don't actually know if students finally
>>> get to use it in the audiovisual industry though I've seen some
>>> products using other animation techniques derived from this.
>>>
>>> Saludos
>>> Carolina
>>>
>>>
>>> El jue., 13 feb. 2020 a las 3:43, Ruth Hayes ()
>>> escribió:
>>>
>>>> At The Evergreen State College we teach direct animation and cameraless
>>>> film in our foundation program and in some other classes depending on the
>>>> subject. As with others responding, I’ve found it a great way to bring fine
>>>> arts students in to animation and media production. Also, Devon Damonte
>>>> teaches a summer course here, Visual Music on 16mm and 35mm Film that
>>>> involves all sorts of cameraless techniques including making photograms and
>>>> hand-processing. Students appreciate the materiality of working with film
>>>> and photo processes, especially if all they’ve done before is digital. It’s
>>>> also a way to get them into thinking about forms beyond the narrative and
>>>> single channel presentation.
>>>>
>>>> Ruth
>>>>
>>>> http://www.randommotion.com-
>>>>
>>>> sites.evergreen.edu/ruthhayes/
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Feb 12, 2020, at 3:58 AM, Albert Alcoz 
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Hello,
>>>>
>>>> Does anyone know if cameraless film is a common subject at university?
>>>>
>>>> I am investigating the role of cameraless film in the studies of Fine
>>>> Arts and Media Studies.
>>>>
>>>> Most of cameraless film workshops are organized by art centers,
>>>> alternative spaces or private film schools but i wonder the role it has
>>>> within the university.
>>>>
>>>> Is it taught as a technique that can be applied in the audiovisual
>>>> industry (such as video clips, advertisements, fiction animated films,
>>>> etc.) or as a line to develop artistic projects or personal film
>>>> developments?
>>>>
>>>> Would be great to know personal experiences concerning teaching this
>>>> animation technique related to experimental cinema.
>>>>
>>>> Best,
>>>> Albert
>>>> --
>>>> http://albertalcoz.com/ <http://www.albertalcoz.com/>
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>>>>
>>>>
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>>>
>>>
>>> ___
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>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> http://albertalcoz.com/ <http://www.albertalcoz.com/>
>> ___
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>>
>
>
> --
> Ignacio Tamarit
> Lumiton Museo Usina Audiovisual
> Cabral 2354, Munro, Vicente López.
> Tel.: 4721-9255.
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>


-- 
06.88.08.50.61
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Re: [Frameworks] Expanded Cinema 50

[Scott MacDonald]

*Congratulations Gene--didn't see this coming, but glad it's arrived!*


*The original was one of the first film books I ever bought (and it
inspired, in recent years, to press for color imagery in several of my
books).*

*Scott*

On Wed, Feb 5, 2020 at 10:46 PM Gene Youngblood  wrote:

> Colleagues,
>
> You might like to know that a 50th Aniversary Edition of my book Expanded
> Cinema (1970) will be published next month by Fordham University Press
> (NYC). It’s been out of print in English for 43 years, during which it has
> come to be recognized as a classic. Fordham’s flyer for the book is
> attached. Comments about it about it are in this 30-minute video, currently
> on Fordham’s home page: https://www.fordhampress.com/
>
>
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[Frameworks] Akiva Gottlieb

[Scott MacDonald]

*Dear Frameworkers,*

*Happy January.*

*Does anyone have contact information for Akiva Gottlieb, who sometimes
writes for The Nation, Slant, and other publications?*

*Please contact me off-line >.*

*Thanks!*

*Scott*
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Re: [Frameworks] Mac OS Catalina

[Scott Dorsey]

Don't blame Apple for this.

If you want a stable system, take it off the internet and lock it down.
Don't install updates, don't make any system changes.  Backup your work
daily and every six months or so use clonezilla or something similar to
take an image of it.

Once you put the system on the internet you are dealing with the internet
environment, which includes lots of bad people who are constantly searching
for the latest vulnerability in your system, and lots of people who are
good but severely misguided who are constantly updating websites and web
applications to require the latest browser and other updates on your desktop
computer.

You don't want to deal with this with an editing workstation.  If you want
to edit, don't do it on the computer you surf the web with, don't do it on
a machine that you do anything else with.
--scott
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[Frameworks] This week [January 4 - 12, 2020] in avant garde cinema

[Scott Stark]

rship. This illustrated talk will examine different ways in which film
and video artists have experimented with various modes of authorship‹
including non-authorship itself ‹ to result in work that engages in a
dialogue with anonymity. Originally presented in 2017 at the Elias Querejeta
Zine Eskola in San Sebastian, the illustrated talk will run approximately 45
minutes, and will be followed by a screening of approximately 60 minutes,
featuring work by Rebecca Baron & Doug Goodwin, James N. Kienitz Wilkins,
Jen Proctor, Scott Stark, and more. Thanks to the artists for generously
letting me screen their work, and to Carlos Muguiro at EQZE for the original
invitation to present this talk. - Mark Toscano More info: veggiecloud.net

FRIDAY, JANUARY 10, 2020

1/10
39004 Santander, Cantabria: Centro Cultural Doctor Madrazo
6pm, Casimiro Sainz, S/N
CINEINFINITO #120: HOWARD GUTTENPLAN
New York City Diary ¹74 (1974), 16mm, color, silente, 15 min. European Diary
¹78 (1978), 16mm, color, silente, 13 min. San Francisco Diary ¹79 (1979),
16mm, color, silente, 9 min. Formato de proyección: HD

SUNDAY, JANUARY 12, 2020

1/12
Los Angeles, California: Filmforum
http://www.lafilmforum.org/
<https://hi-beam.us9.list-manage.com/track/click?u=e4e99825c1d97f8de6eaffad3
=00dc721f1a=f36020cad0>
7:30 pm, Spielberg Theatre at the Egyptian, 6712 Hollywood Blvd.,
THE 57TH ANN ARBOR FILM FESTIVAL TOURING PROGRAM #1
Come see some of the best experimental films of 2018 and 2019, in this
touring program with highlights from the Ann Arbor Film Festival. Digital
program 1 includes nine contemporary experimental, animated, documentary,
and narrative videos, including The Divine Way by Illaria Di Carlo, La Mesa
by Adrian Garcia Gomez, Mom¹s Clothes by Jordan Wong, Screen by Christoph
Girardet and Matthias Müller, As Above, So Below by Cooper Holoweski,
Leafcutters by Catherine Chalmers, We Were Hardly More Than Children by
Cecelia Condit, Phantom Ride Phantom by Siegfried A. Fruhauf, and 2Missed
Calls by LNZ Arturo. Tickets: $12 general; $8 students (with ID)/seniors; $8
for American Cinematheque members; free for Filmforum Members. Paid tickets
available in advance through the American Cinematheque from Fandango or at
the door. Filmforum member tickets available through Brown Paper Tickets at
https://57thaafftour.bpt.me or at the door.


Let us know about your alternative film/video event!

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Re: [Frameworks] How do people encode DVDs for international distribution? NTSC / PAL?

[Scott Dorsey]

It has long been standard practice in the UK and Europe to run 24 fps films
at 24 fps.  It drives people with perfect pitch crazy, but for the most part
the effect is much less noticeable than the 3:2 pulldown that we got in the
US for 30 fps conversion.

There is software out there that will stick an interpolated frame in every
second in order to stretch your 24 fps material out to 24 fps.

But... all that said... we live in an HD world today, why is anyone still
trying to accomodate all the horrible baggage that came with SD?  Is there
really any demand for SD material today?  I'd say just ignore the DVD.
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] Vinegar syndrome?

[Scott Dorsey]

Vinegar syndrome is caused by a reaction involving triphenyl phosphate which
was used as a plasticizer for some triacetate films.  Films that used other
plasticizers don't ever go vinegar.  Films that used a plasticizer mixture
including TPP sometimes go vinegar and sometimes don't.  Films of the same
kind from different batches may have slightly different base materials.

Very early safety films made with diacetate bases have no plasticizer and
aren't subject to vinegar syndrome at all.

Iron oxide catalyzes the reaction, so film on old rusty steel reels is much
more prone to vinegar syndrome.  If you can use archive reels and cans, by
all means do so, but if you can't, at least use plastic or aluminum reels.
This also is the case for magstripes and fullcoat... the iron oxide coating
appears to make them much more prone to vinegar.

The chemistry isn't really a mystery, but the exact base formulation of some
older films is.
--scott

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Re: [Frameworks] meditative films?

[Scott Dorsey]

First of all, this is a metafilm, some hollywood propaganda, and it is
not meditative at all, but it is a thing that students should see in any
introduction to film class:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DhhnFP1GWHI

The youtube version looks terrible, if anyone knows of a better one I would
love to see it.

I guess I think of Jordan Belson's _Cycles_ as the kind of thing you are
looking for.  Pennebaker's _Daybreak Express_ is a cool and beautiful film
that starts slow, then becomes very upbeat and exciting, but then becomes
slow and quiet again at the end.  

McLaren's _A Chairy Tale_ is kind of weird and might be a bit long for
keeping students attention, but I think it makes a point about being
loved and appreciated.

Keaton's _The Railrodder_ is on youtube and it is in many ways a kind of
slow and contemplative film.   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xYmcN12M97o
May require some explanation about swimming the atlantic and so forth.

So many of the abstract films I can think of are anything but slow and 
contemplative...
--scott



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Re: [Frameworks] 16mm test films

[Scott Dorsey]

I have buzz track films in stock for $50 each.  They are original SMPTE
films that have been in storage for a long time.

I have no idea about the others.  Trackwise made me some MF test tones
on their Maurer twenty years ago, but Fran is long retired now.

I could make you a second generation mag azimuth test after lining my
dubber up with an original Disney one that I have... but for many years
I have been telling people never to trust that sort of thing and I am
not going to stop now.
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] X-Ray motion-pictures

[Scott Dorsey]

Okay, old guy tells stories.


Back in the twenties and thirties, doctors would employ open fluoroscopes,
with an X-ray source behind the patient and a fluorescent screen in front
of them.  X-rays passing through the patient would cause the screen to 
illuminate and the doctor could see what was going on inside in realtime.

Many of the old classic sequences that still show up in educational films
such as the man eating and man voicing different vowels and consonants,
were shot off the screen of an open fluoroscope.

This approach has some problems namely it takes a lot of radiation to
get a nice bright image, and all of that radiation (not just the backscatter)
is pointed at the doctor.  So although you can see open fluoroscopes in old
movies where W.C. Fields has swallowed his cigar, you will not see them in
use today.

Because doctors needed to see movement and didn't want to irradiate themselves
constantly, a number of manufacturers made cinefluoroscope systems with a 
Mitchell or Acme 35mm pin-registered camera movement, a very fast lens,
and a fluorescent screen all in one package.  The high speed Leitz Noctilux
lenses were originally designed for these applications.

These were in common use for heart imaging until maybe a decade ago, and
if you are looking for a film image you may be able to find cardiological
radiologists around with a film cineangography system.  These systems all
provide full aperture 35mm images.  So if you want 16mm you'd have to get
the lab to bump it down.

All of these systems today have been replaced with high resolution video
systems.  The nice thing about the video systems is that they result in
less radiation to the patient because the light sensor is faster than Tri-X.
These systems are small and convenient enough that some cardiologists will
have their own system rather than contracting it out to a radiologist.
The bad thing about them is that they tend to have more smear on motion
than the film systems because of the longer persistence phosphors.

Now... if you don't need to deal with human beings, you can pour a whole
lot more radiation into the object.  There are a bunch of fairly inexpensive
X-ray inspection systems for PC boards that give you realtime video with
decent resolution.  Not very high energy radiation since they just need to
be looking at thin board traces for the most part.

So... if I were looking to rent some time on a machine, I would ask a 
cardiologist if they could recommend a local radiology guy, or I would
talk to PC board fab people, depending on whether I was looking at people
or objects.  I have only done static x-rays, not moving ones, and there
aren't a lot of folks doing moving ones artistically today so it could be
really cool.
--scott


lens was originally designed 

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Re: [Frameworks] Processing KODAK Tri-X Reversal Film 7266

[Scott Dorsey]

What -is- Sprint Standard Film Developer?  Do you have a formula for it?
Is it just a metol-hq like D-76 and other minicam developers for hand
processing?

D-19 is a high contrast, high activity developer, closer to Dektol than
a minicam film developer.  It is still just metol and hydroquinone in
the end, but will need way shorter developing times to get the same gamma
as D-76 and the like.  It is fairly easy to make, all the reagents are
pretty common ones.
--scott


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Re: [Frameworks] Variable Shutter

[Scott Dorsey]

You don't say what model Bolex it is, but if it's an H16, the mechanism is
still in production and you should be able to buy shutter parts new from
bolex.ch in Europe.

US parts distribution is still through Chambless which is not exactly the
most fun company to deal with.

Note that there were a lot of H16 variants with and without the variable
pitch shutter, so make sure you know precisely what parts you need to order.
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] Re-setting/aligning Bolex shutter

[Scott Dorsey]

Take it back.  Someone worked on the shutter, they didn't set the shutter
phase correctly when they re-assembled it... they need to make it right.
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] N

[Scott Dorsey]

I didn't think it was all that great, but the sequel with Peter Lorre was
wonderful.
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] The Sublimity of Document

[Scott MacDonald]

*Hey Brigitta,*

*I hope you find it useful.*

*Scott*

On Wed, Jul 31, 2019 at 4:21 AM Brigitta Burger-Utzer <
brigi...@sixpackfilm.com> wrote:

> very interesting, dear Scott and thanks especially for the discount, I
> will order one of the books right now!
> all the best, Brigitta Burger-Utzer, sixpackfilm
>
>
> Am 31.07.2019 um 00:54 schrieb Scott MacDonald :
>
> *FRAMEWORKERS:*
>
> *I want to let you know about a new book of mine, called The Sublimity of
> Document: Cinema As Diorama--it's a follow-up to Avant-Doc (2015).*
>
> *The Sublimity of Document is a collection of in-depth interviews with
> moving-image artists making films that explore the territory between
> documentary and experimental cinema. The book brings together interviews
> with Ron Fricke, Gustav Deutsch, Laura Poitras, Fred Wiseman (on Hospital),
> Nikolaus Geyrhalter, Bill Morrison, Brett Story, Abbas Kiarostami (on
> Five), Lois Patiño, Dominic Gagnon, Erin Espelie, Yance Ford (on Strong
> Island), Janet Biggs, Carlos Adriano, Craig Johnson, Ben Russell (on Good
> Luck), Betzy Bromberg, James Benning (Goes Digital); three Executive
> Directors of DER (the distributor Documentary Educational Resources): Su
> Cabezas, Cynthia Close, and Alice Apley); Maxim Pozdorovkin (on Our New
> President); along with several veterans of Harvard's Sensory Ethnography
> Lab and their collaborators: J.P. Sniadecki, Stephanie Spray, Véréna
> Paravel, Libbie Dina Cohen, and Joshua Bonnetta. Color and b images; 550
> pages.*
>
> *If you order the order the book online at global.oup.com/academic
> <http://global.oup.com/academic> with the promotion code AAFLYG6, you can
> save 30% (the book is then $27.97).*
>
>
> *“MacDonald focuses...on work that stares more than stipulates. Sublime
> documents, those films that make us gasp at the wonder of the world more
> than the genius of the artist, are a forgotten treasure, until now. Reading
> this book can only enlarge our love for what the camera sees when it looks
> afresh at the world we think we already know.”—Bill Nichols, author of
> Introduction to Documentary 3rd edition.*
>
> *Best,*
> *Scott*
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[Frameworks] The Sublimity of Document

[Scott MacDonald]

*FRAMEWORKERS:*

*I want to let you know about a new book of mine, called The Sublimity of
Document: Cinema As Diorama--it's a follow-up to Avant-Doc (2015).*

*The Sublimity of Document is a collection of in-depth interviews with
moving-image artists making films that explore the territory between
documentary and experimental cinema. The book brings together interviews
with Ron Fricke, Gustav Deutsch, Laura Poitras, Fred Wiseman (on Hospital),
Nikolaus Geyrhalter, Bill Morrison, Brett Story, Abbas Kiarostami (on
Five), Lois Patiño, Dominic Gagnon, Erin Espelie, Yance Ford (on Strong
Island), Janet Biggs, Carlos Adriano, Craig Johnson, Ben Russell (on Good
Luck), Betzy Bromberg, James Benning (Goes Digital); three Executive
Directors of DER (the distributor Documentary Educational Resources): Su
Cabezas, Cynthia Close, and Alice Apley); Maxim Pozdorovkin (on Our New
President); along with several veterans of Harvard's Sensory Ethnography
Lab and their collaborators: J.P. Sniadecki, Stephanie Spray, Véréna
Paravel, Libbie Dina Cohen, and Joshua Bonnetta. Color and b images; 550
pages.*

*If you order the order the book online at global.oup.com/academic
<http://global.oup.com/academic> with the promotion code AAFLYG6, you can
save 30% (the book is then $27.97).*


*“MacDonald focuses...on work that stares more than stipulates. Sublime
documents, those films that make us gasp at the wonder of the world more
than the genius of the artist, are a forgotten treasure, until now. Reading
this book can only enlarge our love for what the camera sees when it looks
afresh at the world we think we already know.”—Bill Nichols, author of
Introduction to Documentary 3rd edition.*

*Best,*
*Scott*
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Re: [Frameworks] 35 mm Projectors

[Scott Dorsey]

Sadly everyone and his brother has excellent rock-steady Simplex and
Century machines in their back rooms trying to unload them these days.
It is a tragedy, because in another 20 years or so they're likely to be
worth a fortune (the way all of these things tend to go in cycles).  I
have seen so many fine machines headed off to scrap metal and I urge
anyone at an academic institution that does not have an auditorium
equipped for 35mm to do so today because it can be done at such cut rate
prices now.
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] Saturated color film?

[Scott Dorsey]

Ektachrome 7294, cross-processed as negative.  Color will be a little weird
because the curves won't match when you cross-process, but there will
certainly be plenty of it.

Next step down would be to just shoot 7294, underexpose a stop and a half and
push one stop.

The expensive and most dramatic effect would be to have the lab pull
separations onto panchromatic B high contrast stock and then have them
recombine them back into a color print.  The effect is like a poster, with
very solid colors.
--scott

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Re: [Frameworks] Tri x reversal super 8

[Scott Dorsey]

> If I rate it at 200 ASA Daylight, and open up two stops, this should be
> correct, no?

Why opening two stops?  Do you have a prism that loses 3/4 of the light
or some other reason your f-stop on the lens doesn't reflect the real t-stop?
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] Tri x reversal super 8

[Scott Dorsey]

> I am not getting it. Is 200 ISO the native speed of the film? Or is it 160 ?

It is both.  The film is less sensitive to red light than to blue light,
so if you expose it in red light, the effective ASA is lower.  If you
are exposing with tungsten light, you use 160 ASA, while if you are exposing
with daylight, you use 200 ASA. 

> Most Super-8 cameras have an orange filter for daylight.
> But for b one would always open the filter right?

Right, you disable the 85 filter.  It's a bad idea in any case.
--scott

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Re: [Frameworks] 16mm processing

[Scott Dorsey]

It's true that the color films are never going to give you the degree of
snap that you get from a B film because they just don't have a huge amount
of silver in them.  A more reactive developer than Rodinol might be worth
trying.  

I'd just do a foot or so of film in a roll film tank for test purposes,
since you can work with the lights up and read a book while you are waiting
for extended development time.  You'll likely be doing a lot of tests.
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] 16mm processing

[Scott Dorsey]

Are you processing short lengths in a tank or are you using a rewind tank
or something else?

A rewind tank will greatly increase required development time.

"Expose for the shadows, develop for the highlights."  If the highlights
are grey, extend the development time.
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] encoding dolby SR/D to print on 35mm film

[Scott Dorsey]

Dolby SR/D -is- an AC-3 datastream.
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] encoding dolby SR/D to print on 35mm film

[Scott Dorsey]

It's not THAT unusual to provide mono digital soundtracks, with audio all
coming from the center channel.  AC-3 digital encoding on the film, just
only one of the six channels used.  This is seen a lot for reissues of
classic films although Woody Allen used it for his last few new releases.

It's not related to Dolby SR at all.  It's "Dolby Digital."
Yeah, I know the button on the machine is marked SR/D but that is marketing.
--scott


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Re: [Frameworks] encoding dolby SR/D to print on 35mm film

[Scott Dorsey]

Tell them you just want dolby analogue track, that you will supply
2-channel 48ksamp/sec audio for analogue track and they don't need to
provide AC-3 encoded tracks.

Unless you -do- want AC-3 encoded Dolby Digital, in which case you
should talk to sound post guys... it should be fairly easy for any
sound post house to prep your tracks.  But it may not be needed anyway
depending on where you intend on screening.
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] shooting a projection with 16mm film

[Scott Dorsey]

I agree about shooting a test... but I suggest shooting a test at 1fps or
so... keep the shutter open as long as you can

Even wide open that may not be enough.
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] Lens repairs?

[Scott Dorsey]

You might try Optech in Boston.  They don't have a lot of parts for 
older camera lenses available, since they work mostly on projection
lenses, but they do good work (if not quickly).
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] shooting a projection with 16mm film

[Scott Dorsey]

Does it have to be in realtime?  Light levels will be very very low,
but undercranking the camera might make it possible to record something.
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] 60 Hz frequency in a 50 Hz Environment

[Scott Dorsey]

I'm not surprised.

Arri used to sell 50 and 60 Hz variants of these with different gears
installed.  An Arri tech out there might be able to get you the correct
gear for 50 Hz operation.

However, the easiest solution might just be to run it off a 60 Hz 
inverter and a big battery, if this is a temporary operation.
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] FOUND FOOTAGE MAGAZINE - CALL FOR PAPERS_ISSUE#6

[Scott MacDonald]

*Hey Cesar,*

*I'm toying with the idea of doing a piece on three attempts to work with
documents of the First World War: Morrison's Beyond Zero: 1914-1918, *
*the Gianikian/Ricci Lucchi trilogy--Prisoners of War, On the Heights All
Is Peace, and Oh! Uomo--and Peter Jackson's They Shall Not Grow Old.*

*But you may have a concern that (A) you just did a Gianikian/RicciLucchi
spread and (B) you might not want something from me so soon.*

*I'm not positive I would make the July deadline in any case, but maybe. *

*What do you think?*

*Scott*

On Tue, May 14, 2019 at 4:07 AM FFM INFO 
wrote:

> Dear friends,
>
> Just a brief reminder for the *Found Footage Magazine* issue#6 call for
> proposals.
>
>
> Deadline for submitting your writings is *July 15, 2019. *
>
> More info: http://foundfootagemagazine.com
>
>
> Thank you all!
>
>
> Cristina Martínez
>
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Re: [Frameworks] ISCO 35mm-65mm

[Scott Dorsey]

You could try asking Isco.  It likely won't be cheap.

ICE in Miami might have some damaged ones with good front elements that
could be parted out.  You could ask them, but they really don't like 
looking through bins of stuff for low-profit items.

If you could get the thing, replacing it would not be too hard.
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] Kodachrome

[Scott Dorsey]

> I gotta say, the more I learn about photographic chemistry, the more I am
> saddened that it has become such a rare, niche activity. 

It was once a field of very active research and development.  If you are
curious about B photography I strongly recommend getting a first edition
of C.E.Kenneth Mees' book _Theory of the Photographic Process_.  If you
are curious about color photography I recommend getting a third edition.
A lot of cool stuff was removed from later edition (like a huge amount of
information about gelatin physics) in order to fit the details about color.

Copies are out there and shouldn't be very expensive.  There are plenty of
other good books, but most of them will be found in the references in the
back of Mees.
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] Walking theme

[Scott MacDonald]

*Hey Ron,*

*And Snow's See You Later/Au Revoir, in a way.*

*Didn't know about Nikki Swift--thanks for the heads-up!*

*Best Regards,*
*Scott*

On Fri, May 3, 2019 at 8:31 AM Green, Ron Green  wrote:

> Hi Scott,
>
> Michael Snow's "walking woman" stuff, e.g. *New York Eye and Ear Control*
>
> Frampton's cornfield film...
>
> and
>
> Nikki Swift's walking video projects:
> https://www.nicolettecinemagraphics.com/videography/video-walkthroughs/
>
> There must be others...
>
> Best wishes,
> Ron
> Nicolettecinemagraphics - Video Walkthroughs
> <https://www.nicolettecinemagraphics.com/videography/video-walkthroughs/>
> Video walkthroughs allow a buyer or patron to feel like they’ve seen a
> location without leaving their house, saving you the time.
> www.nicolettecinemagraphics.com
>
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[Frameworks] Thank you!

[Scott MacDonald]

*Frameworkers!*

*Thanks to all who have brought my attention to films focused on walking.*

*Much appreciated!*

*Scott*
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[Frameworks] walking

[Scott MacDonald]

*Hey Frameworkers,*

*A colleague is interested in films in which walking is a central formal
thread.*

*Do any of you have suggestions? *

*Please contact me separately.*

*Scott*
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Re: [Frameworks] Film Festival Blues

[Scott Dorsey]

I agree that prescreening is the problem but the -reason- why prescreening
is so difficult is the sheer volume of material coming in.
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] Kodachrome

[Scott Dorsey]

> So, just for the fun of it let me ask, what happens if you process
> kodachrome in C41 chemistry? Anything? Mud?

Nothing, because all the cool stuff in C41 is in the film rather than in
the processing.

Each layer of C41 has the color dyes and couplers already in there with the
silver halides and the sensitizing dyes.  On the top is the blue layer
with no sensitizing dyes, then there is a deeply dyed yellow filter layer
to block out all blue, then there are layers below sensitive to red and
green.  The red and green layers are -also- unfortunately sensitive to
blue (as natural halides are) so that yellow filter prevents them from
getting them exposed by blue light.  It's not perfect and it doesn't block
UV effectively, which is why occasionally pink flowers would photograph as
blue on older Kodacolor emulsions.

Anyway... so you expose the film and each of the layers gets a latent image
appropriate to the color it's sensitized to, and you send it to the lab.
It's first developed in an ordinary B developer to develop silver images,
then a color developer connects the color dyes up to the silver.  The
excess color dyes are removed in a clearing bath, the silver is bleached out,
the dyes are stabilized, any residual silver is fixed just for stability,
and the lights are turned on.

Initially in the C-22 days these were done with multiple baths, but these
days some kits have it down to just a developer/color developer and a 
blix.  Modern developing kits also do things like having multiple developers
with different temperature sensitivities which compensate for one another,
so you don't need the high precision water baths that you did when C-41
first came out.

One of the nice things have having split bleach and fix is that you can
eliminate the bleach in order to leave a B image on top of the color dye
image.  This gives you much lower saturation but about a stop greater
sensitivity.  It's a useful effect to lower saturation but it was also used
by press photographers in the seventies to get an extra stop out of the film.

So... if you run B film through C-41... you get a B image... then it
bleaches it away and you get a roll of blank film.  The color dyes don't
get attached because they aren't there.  Same thing happens if you were
to run Kodachrome or Agfacolor films through the C-41 machine.

E-6 is a special case because the E-6 dye coupler chemistry is very similar
to that of C-41 and they use the same color developing agent.  So you can
cross process C-41 in E-6 chemistry and vice-versa and get an image, though
your color rendition won't be anything approaching accurate.
--scott

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Re: [Frameworks] Kodachrome

[Scott Dorsey]

Oh, you could probably get a K-14 line running.  Dwayne's Photo had one 
running a few years ago and still has the analytic chemist on staff
although they don't have some of the other people on the line.

The problem with K-14, which is also the wonderful thing about it, is
that the dyes are not in the individual film layers.  So you have to 
develop it to B images, then bleach out the silver, then expose it to
red light to get a positive latent image on the top red layer, develop
it into B images, attach a red dye to the developed silver, bleach 
out the silver, expose it to green light to get a positive latent image 
on the green layer, develop it into B images, attach a green dye to 
the developed silver, bleach out the silver, expose it to blue light
to get a positive latent image on the blue layer, develop it into B
images, attach a blue due to developed silver, bleach out the silver,
then remove all residual halides and harden the emulsion.

This is leaving out all the stop baths and clearing baths.

So you have three B developers involved, all of which are designed to
have -slightly- different curves and which have to be kept under control
by a chemist to make sure they hit the curves perfectly.  If you think
crossover on E-6 is a nightmare, this is way worse because you have 
independent control over everything.

Then you have three color re-exposures which have to be done precisely
and cleanly.  The process control is very elaborate.  Very small changes
can effect color a lot, so you are pretty much stuck with a big roller
transport system and nitrogen burst agitation.  The one that Kodak had
in Hawaii was over two miles long from end to end.

With E-6 pretty much all the chemicals can be made up from common reagents
except for the color developer.  With K-14 you have all kinds of dyes and
dye couplers that have to be synthesized specifically for the K-14 lab.
It's something that can be done, but it's nontrivial.

Oh yeah... and to do all of that process control, you need not only to be
able to do constant titration but also to run pc strips... and Kodak is not
going to sell you brand new Kodachrome pc strips anymore.  I suspect that
running out of strips is what finally got Duane's to shut their K-14 line
down.

The cool thing: because the dyes are added in after the fact and aren't part
of the emulsion, you can use a much wider variety of possible dyes when you
design the process.. dyes with a wider color gamut and much better stability
than conventional Kodak-process color films.  This is why in the 21st century
the one Kodak process that should have survived into the digital world is
Kodachrome because it is so valuable as a long-term archiving material.  
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] Kodachrome

[Scott Dorsey]

Kodachrome cannot be processed to a color image any longer.  Not K-14, not
K-12, no way, no how.

You can process it to a B image but what you get is poorer quality than
what you'd get if you'd just shot B film.

However, there is now a usable 16mm Ektachrome stock if you like that
reversal look.  It runs E-6.
--scott


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Re: [Frameworks] Combilabor CMB info?

[Scott Dorsey]

According to the 1998 Photo-Lab-Index on my desk, those were distributed in
the US by HP Marketing, Pinebrook, NJ.  No info on Europe but you
could try HP at +1 973-808-9010 and see if there is anyone left that knows it.
--scott


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Re: [Frameworks] Locked focus ring

[Scott Dorsey]

Likely the lubrication has gunked up, especially if it is a much older
lens.  If you put a couple of drops of naptha or Ronsonol around the ring
so that it can get down into the helicoil, you can probably dissolve enough
of the gunked-up grease to free it.  

It won't stay free, though... someone has to take the thing apart and 
properly lubricate it.  But you have to get it free in order to take it
apart.

If it's a good lens (ie. not a TV camera lens) it's likely worth having
a local camera repair shop do a clean and lube.  Most of those older
C-mount lenses are easy enough to work on that your local tech should
have no problem.  It's not like working on a modern zoom with a bunch
of moving elements that are all coupled together, it's just one element
moving in and out.
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] Looking for Lenses for short throw on 16mm Eiki projectors

[Scott Dorsey]

Eiki lenses are 42.5mm standard.  You can sleeve an Elmo lens to fit
an Eiki but you can't make 52.5mm lenses fit.

Lenses for Bauer, Philips, Kinoton Siemens, and Meopta projectors will
fit an Eiki.

ICE in Florida had a bunch of 35-65mm Isco Kiptaron zooms that they were
selling on ebay for around $150 each, and that is a pretty sharp lens in
that mount.  Certainly sharper than any of the vintage lenses.  You could
call and ask if they still had any in stock.  35mm is not super short
throw, but it's about as short as you can get and still keep good edge
sharpness and it's dirt cheap compared with a new prime lens.
--scott



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Re: [Frameworks] tips for shooting on print stock?

[Scott Dorsey]

It's cheaper but it's print perf which means it's hard to print well,
and it's polyester which means no cement splicing.  And slow of course,
although that could be a plus.
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] Fixed Pattern Noise in 2K Scan

[Scott Dorsey]

Can you send it back for a rescan?
--scott

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Re: [Frameworks] TAGARNO 35AX-XENON

[Scott Dorsey]

Okay, because there is one model that is sold in the US under the name of
Vanguard which calls itself a xenon unit but in fact uses a Marc-300 lamp
and should be avoided.

If anyone has any service documentation on any of these cineangiography
viewers, I would love  to see it.
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] TAGARNO 35AX-XENON

[Scott Dorsey]

Is this a machine intended for medical use, to view cineangiograms?
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] tips for shooting on print stock?

[Scott Dorsey]

5 seems optimistic.  Shoot a test.
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] Cinestill DF 96 Monobath

[Scott Dorsey]

> I often have issues with it coming out with very low
> contrast, would a monobath be useful in countering that?

No, a monobath will make the problem worse because it will be compensating,
that is it will develop more in the shadows than in the highlights.  The
developer and fixer are in a race with the developer turning exposed halide
into silver while the fixer is removing halide at the same time.  So you get
interactions that you don't get with normal development.

Is your contrast low because the midtones are low or is your contrast low
because the fog level is so high?  Increasing your developing time or using
a more active developer will increase contrast in the midtones... but it
will make fog worse.

If you are using expired film that is partially fogged, you can add
benzotriazole (Kodak Anti-Fog #2) to the developer and it will reduce
or eliminate the aerial fog but it will require increased
developing time AND increased exposure.  
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] Cinestill DF 96 Monobath

[Scott Dorsey]

I have not but I have used other monobaths before.  They are convenient,
but allow no control over gamma or really any part of the characteristic
curve.  Most of them are inherently very compensating because the development
is limited by the fixation.  If you like that look, good.  Otherwise not so
good.

The Air Force was very big on monobath processing for aerial film back in
Vietnam, because temperature and time were not very critical and for people 
developing film in tents in the middle of a grassy field it reduced the
handling considerably and got film out to analysts faster.  Most of the 
monobath technology we have today came out of the space program and the Air 
Force.

If you're in an environment where you can't get even processing, and I can
see a lot of folks hand-processing motion picture film by rewind or in
a bucket having that problem, the monobath could be a big help.  On the 
other hand, so could a divided developer like Diafine.
--scott

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Re: [Frameworks] Bell & Howell Film 70 series

[Scott Dorsey]

This is the camera they handed out to Marines in Vietnam.  Marines could not
damage it.  This is pretty amazing.  They are cheap and plentiful on the used
market because they all lasted.

That said:
1. There is no single frame
2. There is no reflex viewing
3. It takes standard C-mount lenses which is good
4. I forget which viewfinder you get with that model.  Some of the B finders
   require additional finder lenses for each focal length lens you use.  Some
   do not.
5. It requires regular lubrication.  If you get one, use turbine oil or Mitchell
   camera oil on it and follow the directions in the manual.
6. There is a through-lens prism gadget that can be used for through-lens 
   framing and focussing, but you can't get it.  They didn't survive the
   Marines.
7. It has a very very wide speed range.

I think from your description that you would be happier with a Bolex, either
reflex or not.  They will do single frame and are good rostrum and animation
cameras.  Be aware that the finders are not always quite accurate and that
the reflex models require special lenses for anything wider than 25mm.  But
there are lots of animation rigs for them.
--scott


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Re: [Frameworks] 16mm black film for scratching

[Scott Dorsey]

If you want some fogged film, I have some you're welcome to... but you should
know that you will get a different look on scratches with film as with black
leader... and the black on the black leader is blacker than most film.

Magfilm is usually long-pitch and polyester based, just like print stock.
--scott
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Re: [Frameworks] Pageant Flicker

[Scott Dorsey]

I think he means that when you go from sound speed to silent speed, the 
shutter angle changes in order to reduce flicker at the lower speed, by 
means of a little metal clip on each shutter blade that is moved in and 
out by centrifugal force, and that on many of the Pageants that clip sticks 
and so it takes a second or so for it to move.  And during that second or
so there is noticeable flicker.

If you run a 60 Hz Pageant at 50 Hz, it will behave differently because the
motor will be running 20% slower.  It will probably take less time for the
clip to move.  Pageants designed for 50 Hz will run at the same speeds and
probably behave similarly, but I have never seen one and can't say for sure.

I would suggest if the original poster wants the exact effect that they 
bring their own projector and run it on a a 60 Hz inverter abroad.
--scott

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Re: [Frameworks] Jonas Mekas

[Scott Hammen]

Since some Frameworkers may not see (or care about) Facebook, I thought
this post from Tara Merenda Nelson
should reach them anyway:

Jonas Mekas was a great filmmaker, but to me his greatest legacy will be
his cooperative, collaborative work in service to experimental film. He
wasn’t in it for himself alone; he understood that filmmaking requires
community, and he showed up for our community in every way possible. When
nobody would write about avant garde film, he started a column in the
newspaper, then a critical journal in which other artists could contribute
their own thoughts. He worked with artists to promote and distribute their
films all over the world. He saw the importance of preserving the films
made by artists long before there was popular support for such a thing. In
every interview I have read, he tells the stories of others, anyone who
helped shoot or made connections or drove the van. His films are full of
people, real people whom he loved and cared about, not just as characters
or subjects. He showed up for screenings, participated in discussions, and
shared his movies with everyone until the day he died.
Sometimes I get very discouraged by the disgraceful history of the American
avant garde, and by the increasingly self-serving, capitalist model that
has nearly taken over the practice of making and showing experimental film.
But losing Jonas today has gotten me fired up to do better, and to carry on
the practice of contributing to the community that Jonas and his
collaborators helped build in the first place.
Filmmaking is a community, not a competition.
Long Live Experimental Cinema!
Cheers Jonas.



On Wed, 23 Jan 2019 at 18:04, FrameWorks Admin 
wrote:

> Yes he passed away early this morning, peacefully at home.
> He was 96 and still very active. He already prepared two books to be
> released this spring.
> There will be a Buddhist ceremony in the near future.
> - Pip Chodorov
>
>
>
> On Jan 23, 2019, at 5:58 PM, Jonathan Walley  wrote:
>
> Hello Frameworks community,
>
> I’ve just heard that Jonas Mekas has died:
>
> http://www.artnews.com/2019/01/23/jonas-mekas-key-experimental-filmmaker-dies-96/
>
> I wish I had something compelling to say at this point, but I’m stunned
> into silence for the moment.
>
> All best wishes to everyone,
> Jonathan
>
>
> ___
> FrameWorks mailing list
> FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com
> https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks
>


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