Re: [Frameworks] PacLab's approach to customer service.
When I was in college I read the back of a lab order sheet, it was very interesting. Scott Norwood scanned a 1978 price list from Palmer Films that I kept around, and he has it here: http://www.redballoon.net/wap/ The terms and conditions can be found here: http://www.redballoon.net/wap/pages/wap28.shtml and they are the most amazingly written contract I have ever seen in my life. My lawyer just laughed and laughed when he saw the thing. It basically doesn't obligate the laboratory to do anything at all and declares their right to charge whatever they want for doing it or not. --scott ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks
Re: [Frameworks] PacLab's approach to customer service.
It starts before the lab! Every roll of film you ever bought had a disclaimer on it - if there was something wrong with the film, even if it was the manufacturer's fault, the manufacturer's liability was limited to replacement of that film, only. You could not (successfully) sue them for the cost of the set you burned for the shot, the hundreds of plane tickets purchased to get cast and crew to that location, the millions of dollars you had to pay to get the stars back for a re-shoot, etc. In each case - film manufacturing and lab processing - it makes sense. But that was the last picture of my grandfather before he died! Well, we can give you a replacement roll of film. It is a harsh reality. Tom Durham Cinematheque -Original Message- From: frameworks-boun...@jonasmekasfilms.com [mailto:frameworks-boun...@jonasmekasfilms.com] On Behalf Of Steven Sent: Saturday, August 25, 2012 11:49 AM To: frameworks@jonasmekasfilms.com Subject: Re: [Frameworks] PacLab's approach to customer service. On 8/25/12 12:46 AM, Robert Houllahan wrote: It hard to run a film lab. Mistakes get made. When I was in college I read the back of a lab order sheet, it was very interesting. Essentially once you drop off the film the lab could intentionally destroy your film, open and expose it to lights, etc. etc. and all they would be responsible for was giving you free developing for the amount of film that was destroyed. The images are irreplaceable, and no value can be put on it. imagine if the Zapruda film had been mis-developed. Try cashing in on the insurance on that one - Okay, so first we got to get a new president. . . It sucks when the film is destroyed, and Pac lab may not be the lab for you, you may not connect with them as you or they wish. Plus we don't know the details of the entire conversation - probably no need to share, we've all had conversations that end similar to yours - I've had film ruined because someone elses film ahead of mine had been spliced badly (by the film maker not the lab) and it sucks, heart breaking, so difficult to continue on and you just want to blame someone else, never use that camera again, blame Kodak, Fuji, even yourself for choosing that path - I still will never forgive the neg cutter who gave me a jump cut despite my explicit order not to - saved me 50 cents a splice, and I'm sure others swore by him, and I could tell you more stories and stories. Mourn, grieve, find another lab if you can, or if not approach PAC lab, and say you want it professional, and take the emotion out of it, and move forward. We all feel your pain, and understand the situation, we've had it happen to us, don't let it discourage you. Best -- Steven Gladstone New York Based Filmmaker 917-886-5858 http://www.gladstonefilms.com http://indiekicker.reelgrok.com/ http://www.blakehousemovie.com http://www.hellion.gladstonefilms.com ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks
Re: [Frameworks] PacLab's approach to customer service.
not everyone is going digital and this is not why that is not an argument that i would align with or make ever he is probably right he is not desperate for your biz digital stuff gets screwed up too this polarized chatter is not healthy film vs digital its sad dont we have anything more to discuss? Cari Machet NYC 646-436-7795 carimac...@gmail.com AIM carismachet Skype carimachet - 646-652-6434 Syria +963-099 277 3243 Amman +962 077 636 9407 Berlin +49 152 11779219 Twitter: @carimachet https://twitter.com/carimachet Ruh-roh, this is now necessary: This email is intended only for the addressee(s) and may contain confidential information. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any use of this information, dissimination, distribution, or copying of this email without permission is strictly prohibited. On Sun, Aug 26, 2012 at 9:32 AM, Tom Whiteside tom.whites...@duke.eduwrote: It starts before the lab! Every roll of film you ever bought had a disclaimer on it - if there was something wrong with the film, even if it was the manufacturer's fault, the manufacturer's liability was limited to replacement of that film, only. You could not (successfully) sue them for the cost of the set you burned for the shot, the hundreds of plane tickets purchased to get cast and crew to that location, the millions of dollars you had to pay to get the stars back for a re-shoot, etc. In each case - film manufacturing and lab processing - it makes sense. But that was the last picture of my grandfather before he died! Well, we can give you a replacement roll of film. It is a harsh reality. Tom Durham Cinematheque -Original Message- From: frameworks-boun...@jonasmekasfilms.com [mailto: frameworks-boun...@jonasmekasfilms.com] On Behalf Of Steven Sent: Saturday, August 25, 2012 11:49 AM To: frameworks@jonasmekasfilms.com Subject: Re: [Frameworks] PacLab's approach to customer service. On 8/25/12 12:46 AM, Robert Houllahan wrote: It hard to run a film lab. Mistakes get made. When I was in college I read the back of a lab order sheet, it was very interesting. Essentially once you drop off the film the lab could intentionally destroy your film, open and expose it to lights, etc. etc. and all they would be responsible for was giving you free developing for the amount of film that was destroyed. The images are irreplaceable, and no value can be put on it. imagine if the Zapruda film had been mis-developed. Try cashing in on the insurance on that one - Okay, so first we got to get a new president. . . It sucks when the film is destroyed, and Pac lab may not be the lab for you, you may not connect with them as you or they wish. Plus we don't know the details of the entire conversation - probably no need to share, we've all had conversations that end similar to yours - I've had film ruined because someone elses film ahead of mine had been spliced badly (by the film maker not the lab) and it sucks, heart breaking, so difficult to continue on and you just want to blame someone else, never use that camera again, blame Kodak, Fuji, even yourself for choosing that path - I still will never forgive the neg cutter who gave me a jump cut despite my explicit order not to - saved me 50 cents a splice, and I'm sure others swore by him, and I could tell you more stories and stories. Mourn, grieve, find another lab if you can, or if not approach PAC lab, and say you want it professional, and take the emotion out of it, and move forward. We all feel your pain, and understand the situation, we've had it happen to us, don't let it discourage you. Best -- Steven Gladstone New York Based Filmmaker 917-886-5858 http://www.gladstonefilms.com http://indiekicker.reelgrok.com/ http://www.blakehousemovie.com http://www.hellion.gladstonefilms.com ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks
Re: [Frameworks] PacLab's approach to customer service.
Not that I want a response to this, but when someone is criticized by name and quoted like this on a public discussion forum for his potential clients, I have to assume I'm not the only one to think: What happened during the confrontation before that quote that prompted him to give you that response? (Why wouldn't he want you as a customer?) Again, I'm not personally interested in the details. But I'm not sure if it is good form to post such a quote without more context. Even Angie's List would want more information in a negative review. James Kreul kre...@gmail.com On Aug 24, 2012 5:17 PM, m...@spaz.org wrote: Direct quote from Brian Brown at PacLab after being confronted about having ruined 4 of 7 reels of film. Well I develop film for Spike Lee and Martin Scorsese and between you and them, I'd be fine with you never coming back again. ... And we wonder why everyone is going digital. ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks
Re: [Frameworks] PacLab's approach to customer service.
I've always found them to be nice people. Owen On Aug 24, 2012, at 6:17 PM, m...@spaz.org wrote: Direct quote from Brian Brown at PacLab after being confronted about having ruined 4 of 7 reels of film. Well I develop film for Spike Lee and Martin Scorsese and between you and them, I'd be fine with you never coming back again. ... And we wonder why everyone is going digital. ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks
