Re: FreeBSD News blog
On Sun, Jul 27, 2008 at 06:15:49PM -0400, J.C. wrote: > Really, it's just about the software. I could not agree more. :-) Oh, and don't forget that BSD licensed software is also Free Software, so if you want that, you got that. It is fun to point this fact out to some "Linux evangelists" and see the expression on their face. But to be fair, many Linux users *are* knowledgeable and value BSD systems because of their technical merits. At least I have met many such users. This does not mean that they are using it, but that's ok. If you get used to a particular tool, you are most productive with that tool. I also have trouble understanding some aspects of Linux sysadmin work at times when I have to do something quickly, or even some aspects of Net/OpenBSD since I have been a FreeBSD user for the last 9 years, so I am most productive with (Free)BSD. -- Regards: Szilveszter ADAM Budapest Hungary ___ freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-advocacy To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]"
Re: FreeBSD News blog
On Sun, 27 Jul 2008 18:15:49 -0400
J.C. <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I would also caution against going after Windows users too
> aggressively. FreeBSD is for users who can handle a UNIX-like
> operating systems. Ample documentation and an approachable community
> do not change the fact that any UNIX-like system, be it Linux,
> FreeBSD, or any other, is considerably more difficult to learn and
> less accessible than a Windows system.
"Linux is for people who hate Windows, BSD is for people who love UNIX."
B
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{Beto|Norberto|Numard} Meijome
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Re: FreeBSD News blog
>> Folks want an OS, not a religion - this is where we beat Linux single >> handed. > > probably one of the nicest (+ more accurate) comparisons i've yet read on > this. > couldn't agree more... I second that. Being a computer lover, I was drawn to free/open source software because of its superior quality, the elevated levels of competence of its users, and the comparatively limitless technical capabilities. Software freedom is very attractive but hardly a moral requirement, not to mention an absolute non-issue for the unsophisticated 99% of computer users. I began looking at the BSDs, etc. after being repulsed by the unintelligent religiosity of the GNU/Linux communities, especially (with a few exceptions) the senseless illogic and useless appeals to emotion of one of Free Software's most outspoken advocates. I was surprised to learn that what I valued most about "Linux systems" is actually true of *any* UNIX or UNIX-like operating system. Then I learned that FreeBSD is both reasonable towards proprietary software *and* a better operating system internally, and I was sold. >> It is of utmost importance to tell a Windows user, that we are NOT Linux. >> Don't say FreeBSD is a Linux alternative - they might get the wrong >> impression. There are very subtle psychological fallacies at work with Linux. Take laundry detergent as an example. Manufacturers have long known that many people choose their brand of detergent using trivial (and I would argue nonsensical) criteria, like the images, shapes, and colors of the packaging, vivid word imagery like "Fresh Breeze" or "Refreshing Lavender", perceived (instead of actual) quality differences resulting from advertising or higher price, the imagery used in advertising, the smell, the perceived status of using higher-priced detergent, or simply being the same brand that one grew up with. Thus, companies like Proctor & Gamble actually have several brands of laundry detergent "competing" with each other to increase the likelihood that a customer will choose one of their brands. This is also why there are so many "makes" of GM automobiles. I remember how, growing up, my father would never fill up at any gas station except Mobile (a common gas station chain in the eastern United States) because they had "better gas", and, for a long time, I believed that. Does Mobile really have better gas than their competitors? I doubt it. Did my dad know that gas stations like Mobile routinely buy gas from other chains that they're supposedly competing with? *That's* a good question. : ) What first frustrated me about Linux is actually the main reason for its popularity: the hundreds of distributions of the exact same operating system with mostly the exact same software, differing only by mostly trivial characteristics like the choice of desktop environment or package management system, which applications are included by default and in the repositories, the default theme of the user interface, and the wallpaper. And users will actually argue over which is better. Even though it's possible to use Red Hat packages and repositories to maintain a live "Debian" system, for example. Ubuntu is a particularly "fashionable" distribution at the moment. Flashy? Certainly. Accessible? Sure. I always keep an Xubuntu Live CD on hand for when I just want a graphical operating system up and working quickly. But as a primary operating system, is it that much better than mature distributions like Fedora? Not really. Do its annoying design limitations in the name of "accessibility" and immaturity piss me off? Very quickly. Its popularity is mainly because of those trivial secondary characteristics, i.e. it's "cool". Experienced Linux users know that Linux is Linux is Linux, but many don't seem to know that Unix is Unix is Unix, and Linux is just another Unix*. This is a great place to start talking about Unix. Those powerful command lines in "Linux" that they love so much? They work the same on *any* UNIX-like system. Shell scripts? Configurable window managers? Desktop environments? Apache? Postgre? MySQL? PHP? All identical. So many of the things people love about "Linux" are really characteristics of UNIX-like systems. Talk about why Unix is so great. Explain that Linux is not Unix. Then explain why FreeBSD is better than Linux. If that doesn't work, maybe we could make a hundred different distributions of wallpaper and desktop themes, to ease the transition a little bit? ; ) I would also caution against going after Windows users too aggressively. FreeBSD is for users who can handle a UNIX-like operating systems. Ample documentation and an approachable community do not change the fact that any UNIX-like system, be it Linux, FreeBSD, or any other, is considerably more difficult to learn and less accessible than a Windows system. Since about 99% of computer users have no computer literacy at all, there are many people for whom *any* Unix system is completely inappropriate. The emergence of qual
Re: FreeBSD News blog
On Thu, 24 Jul 2008 19:34:03 -0400
"Gerard van Essen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> is there anything you guys think I should add/change to make the website
> even better for newbies, for people moving on from Linux and those who just
> want to read what's happening in "FreeBSD land".
( I've just subscribed to your RSS ;) thanks! ).
n ideas below, each n/$0.02 :)
- provide links to interesting discussions happening in the different mailing
lists similar to blog pings / digg or ./ even? . For example, the one at
-security@ , 'Subject: A new kind of security needed , Date: Wed, 16 Jul 2008
17:10:32 -0700' .
- for the v. technical minded, new to *BSD or not, it may be interesting to
know what is the latest feature MFC'ed ( eg, Julian E's multiple routing code).
Similarly, 'requests for test of new features' ( NAT-T patchset a few weeks
back in -net@ ).
- idem major additions to ports ( eg, a major application / framework / tool
added...? maybe this is available @ freshports , but i think freshports is
just automated stuff...
B
_
{Beto|Norberto|Numard} Meijome
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he were already in, I don't think they'd let him out."
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Re: FreeBSD News blog
On Fri, 25 Jul 2008 11:46:21 +0200
Raven <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Gerard van Essen wrote:
> > is there anything you guys think I should add/change to make the website
> > even better for newbies, for people moving on from Linux and those who just
> > want to read what's happening in "FreeBSD land".
> >
> To BSD users, your Blog makes perfect sense.
> I read it with interest, follow the links and mostly share your view.
> . . but I'm a Unix user since 1989.
>
> There are very few things that make "normal" users interested in FreeBSD.
> Maybe our development model, the ports, and our tolerant community.
> (Everything comes from a single source, no one tells you to RTFM -
> Newbies like that)
Quality of documentation in FreeBSD is astounding compared to that of any Linux
distro - the fact that there aren't x00s of BSD distros obviously makes it
'simpler' to document, but comparing to any one big distro, i think the
consistent quality of documentation throughout the 'ecosystem' ( website,
handbook (site + installed), mailing lists, manpages, configuration files,etc)
> Folks want an OS, not a religion - this is where we beat Linux single
> handed.
probably one of the nicest (+ more accurate) comparisons i've yet read on this.
couldn't agree more...
> It is of utmost importance to tell a Windows user, that we are NOT Linux.
> Don't say FreeBSD is a Linux alternative - they might get the wrong
> impression.
+1
> The "marketing strategy" should be a tad more aggressive.
> FreeBSD was there before everyone else, and we will be there after them.
> (You wouldn't believe how many ppl are impressed by that fact)
> They might also like to know, that FreeBSD/Windows can be dual booted
> by the Vista loader.
> (Afaik, this is not possible with Linux)
interesting, didn't know that (possibly because i haven't touched vista).
b
_
{Beto|Norberto|Numard} Meijome
"Gravity cannot be blamed for people falling in love."
Albert Einstein
I speak for myself, not my employer. Contents may be hot. Slippery when wet.
Reading disclaimers makes you go blind. Writing them is worse. You have been
Warned.
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Re: FreeBSD News blog
Gerard van Essen wrote: is there anything you guys think I should add/change to make the website even better for newbies, for people moving on from Linux and those who just want to read what's happening in "FreeBSD land". To BSD users, your Blog makes perfect sense. I read it with interest, follow the links and mostly share your view. . . but I'm a Unix user since 1989. There are very few things that make "normal" users interested in FreeBSD. Maybe our development model, the ports, and our tolerant community. (Everything comes from a single source, no one tells you to RTFM - Newbies like that) Folks want an OS, not a religion - this is where we beat Linux single handed. It is of utmost importance to tell a Windows user, that we are NOT Linux. Don't say FreeBSD is a Linux alternative - they might get the wrong impression. The "marketing strategy" should be a tad more aggressive. FreeBSD was there before everyone else, and we will be there after them. (You wouldn't believe how many ppl are impressed by that fact) They might also like to know, that FreeBSD/Windows can be dual booted by the Vista loader. (Afaik, this is not possible with Linux) . . and don't embed Flash 9 on a BSD site. ___ freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-advocacy To unsubscribe, send any mail to "[EMAIL PROTECTED]"
