Re: why no Oracle on FreeBSD ?
The reality is that Oracle is meant to be a very expensive solution for companies that don't know what to do. This makes Red Hat etc an ideal contender for this situation as it promises full enterprise support. Whether it is the truth or if its even a good solution is completely irreverent to these 2 tech companies because at the end of the day they are just trying to make money and please the stock holders. snip Huh? Last I remember reading, Oracle hasn't put a native version together for FreeBSD because running it through the linuxlator works well enough to justify not spending engineering resources on it. ___ freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-advocacy To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-advocacy-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: why no Oracle on FreeBSD ?
On Sun 27 Sep 2009 at 12:25:50 PDT Chris Rees wrote: This guy replying to your post was a troll, basically. Ignore him, and Yep. It shows that some Linux fans are just as prone to creating FUD as their adversaries in the Windows world. I'd like to think the BSD community is better than that. ___ freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-advocacy To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-advocacy-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: why no Oracle on FreeBSD ?
Charlie Kester wrote: On Sun 27 Sep 2009 at 12:25:50 PDT Chris Rees wrote: This guy replying to your post was a troll, basically. Ignore him, and Yep. It shows that some Linux fans are just as prone to creating FUD as their adversaries in the Windows world. I'd like to think the BSD community is better than that. I use Linux, I don't do this kind of thing because I use both. I have a machine with FreeBSD on it dual booting Windows 98 SE (So I can play Magic: The Gathering; Spells of the Ancients, and some other stuff) and then I have a Debian box, and another Debian machine dual booting with Windows XP, and my Laptop dual boots Slackware 13.0 and Windows XP, and then on my Wife's Laptop is Windows XP, and OpenSUSE. My FTP server PC runs Slackware 12.2. I use both Linux and BSD because I like both, and anyone who says Linux is better is sadly mistaken, they both are great :) ___ freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-advocacy To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-advocacy-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: why no Oracle on FreeBSD ?
On 25/09/2009 10:28 PM, Saifi Khan wrote: On Thu, 24 Sep 2009, Julian H. Stacey wrote: i noticed that there is no Oracle available for FreeBSD http://www.oracle.com/technology/software/products/database/index.html What could be the reason for that ? Best ask direct of commercial application vendor Oracle. IE wave money under Oracle's nose ask to purchase what you want. If Oracle think there's enough profit in it, there's many BSD consultants eg http://berklix.com/consultants/ willing to work. Cheers, Julian -- i was wondering if there is any technical reason behind this ? Most unlikely. Ask Oracle tell advocacy@ what you find out. I'd bet perceived market share demand as ever, ie Money. Hi Julian: Here is the response on the Oracle forum thread to my posting, FreeBSD is a kernel not used in any extant operating system with the sole exception being Apple's Mac OSX so you are heading, The reality is that Oracle is meant to be a very expensive solution for companies that don't know what to do. This makes Red Hat etc an ideal contender for this situation as it promises full enterprise support. Whether it is the truth or if its even a good solution is completely irreverent to these 2 tech companies because at the end of the day they are just trying to make money and please the stock holders. We have bought the occasional Dell server with Enterprise Red Hat and found all sorts of weird little problems. My preferred story was the Perl that RHE came with was bleeding edge (for the time of release) which at first looked nice. But when I discovered my FreeBSD laptop could parse a 500meg log file 4 times faster then the quad core RHE Dell server I know something was wrong. It was just the version Perl that RHE decided to package up the distribution with. I ended up having to build a later version into /usr/local and everything was fine. But is this really a good solution? Was this worthy of the word enterprise? absolutely not, I mean its not a big deal to build a second Perl into /usr/local on RHE but FreeBSD ports seems like a far cleaner and professional solution if you ask me, just because its not point and click friendly shouldn't be some kind of excuse, to me its and clean and pure as I could dream. We hired a person directly from Oracle full time to build a new database project on Oracle. After it was all built and been using it for about 2 years I just thought it was a bit of a disgrace. Oracle is brittle, unreliable and expensive. We had FreeBSD+MySQL along side it the whole time and it was just so much more reliable and faster for the same amount of hardware. Oracle by packaged design is meant to encourage a comparatively massive amount of hardware investment compared to what could be achieved with MySQL and FreeBSD. I think it is just as much about masking its crap performance then any other argument. I think Oracle is a about of system of making money out of false beliefs, it takes full advantage of corporate companies conservative beliefs and is probably only the reasonable solution for at best 5% of the companies it lives at, its all a matter of opinion which would be argued more from how much money a set of individuals are making out of it over a better technical solution. Some how Oracle want people to believe that a few 100's thousand dollars for their software is vastly superior to any other DB in the world is just nonsense. There is not any other mass scale pieces of software that most company's need where there is some how a magically vastly superior solution. There is no single/few license $100,000 operating system, no single/few license $100,000 excel, no single/few license $100,000 web server. I guess what I am saying at the end of this is that if you can avoid Oracle that is great, I fully recommend you do. Just because you can buy MySQL Enterprise Server far more cheaply and install/deploy it far more easily on more different platforms isn't something to be suspicious about, its just a better software solution and I recommend you take full advantage of it while you still can. ___ freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-advocacy To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-advocacy-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: why no Oracle on FreeBSD ?
On Fri, 25 Sep 2009, Chad Perrin wrote: On Thu, Sep 24, 2009 at 09:15:43PM +0530, Saifi Khan wrote: i noticed that there is no Oracle available for FreeBSD http://www.oracle.com/technology/software/products/database/index.html I unfortunately don't have anything to offer as a direct answer to that, other than perhaps Oracle's short-sightedness. I wonder why you ask, though. Do you plan to use Oracle for some specific real world purpose? Are you simply trying to learn about Oracle? Are you just curious about the lack of Oracle for FreeBSD? Here is some background to help you understand the requirement: i was conducting a system administration session for some IT admins and managers, here in Hyderabad, Andhra Pradesh, INDIA. One of the folks has a PostgreSQL on FreeBSD setup running since last 4 yrs without any issues. They have recently received Oracle database server and need to set up on Windows 2003 server. Since the folks have prior experience with FreeBSD it seemed logical to try and setup Oracle on FreeBSD on IBM x-series server. i was particularly interested since the acquisition dataset growth rate was like 30-50 GB per week, stored on a SAN. thanks Saifi. ___ freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-advocacy To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-advocacy-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: why no Oracle on FreeBSD ?
Since the folks have prior experience with FreeBSD it seemed logical to try and setup Oracle on FreeBSD on IBM x-series server. Did you try the linux compatibility setup? It's for a much older version, but might be interesting to play with at least. http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en/books/handbook/linuxemu-oracle.html Tony ___ freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-advocacy To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-advocacy-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: why no Oracle on FreeBSD ?
On Thu, 24 Sep 2009, Julian H. Stacey wrote: i noticed that there is no Oracle available for FreeBSD http://www.oracle.com/technology/software/products/database/index.html What could be the reason for that ? Best ask direct of commercial application vendor Oracle. IE wave money under Oracle's nose ask to purchase what you want. If Oracle think there's enough profit in it, there's many BSD consultants eg http://berklix.com/consultants/ willing to work. Cheers, Julian -- i was wondering if there is any technical reason behind this ? Most unlikely. Ask Oracle tell advocacy@ what you find out. I'd bet perceived market share demand as ever, ie Money. Hi Julian: Here is the response on the Oracle forum thread to my posting, FreeBSD is a kernel not used in any extant operating system with the sole exception being Apple's Mac OSX so you are heading, full speed ahead, toward disappointment. FreeBSD handles many things very differently from the UNIX System 5 standard so you can not just kludge your way into this. What fascinates me about your request is why you care. FreeBSD is going nowhere at a staggeringly fast pace. And to the same place as went Oracle Database version 8.0. Obscurity. Install Oracle's Enterprise Linux and you will have a real operating system in less time than you've spent monitoring this thead. And as an additional value it will support the Oracle technology stack while you are still young enough to use it. and IF you can match up the system calls, then you can 'make it work'. The relevant links are 1. http://forums.oracle.com/forums/thread.jspa?threadID=952076tstart=0 2. http://forums.oracle.com/forums/thread.jspa?threadID=952076tstart=0 The response seems to suggest that there is some feature used by Oracle which is expected from a UNIX Sys 5 std and perhaps FreeBSD does not support/have the syscall. Given the response, What is your analysis of the situation ? thanks Saifi. ___ freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-advocacy To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-advocacy-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: why no Oracle on FreeBSD ?
Saifi Khan saifi.k...@datasynergy.org writes: The response seems to suggest [...] ...nothing except that whoever wrote it has absolutely no idea what they're talking about. DES -- Dag-Erling Smørgrav - d...@des.no ___ freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-advocacy To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-advocacy-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: why no Oracle on FreeBSD ?
Saifi Khan wrote: On Thu, 24 Sep 2009, Julian H. Stacey wrote: i noticed that there is no Oracle available for FreeBSD http://www.oracle.com/technology/software/products/database/index.html What could be the reason for that ? Best ask direct of commercial application vendor Oracle. IE wave money under Oracle's nose ask to purchase what you want. If Oracle think there's enough profit in it, there's many BSD consultants eg http://berklix.com/consultants/ willing to work. Cheers, Julian -- i was wondering if there is any technical reason behind this ? Most unlikely. Ask Oracle tell advocacy@ what you find out. I'd bet perceived market share demand as ever, ie Money. Hi Julian: Here is the response on the Oracle forum thread to my posting, FreeBSD is a kernel not used in any extant operating system with the sole exception being Apple's Mac OSX so you are heading, full speed ahead, toward disappointment. FreeBSD handles many things very differently from the UNIX System 5 standard so you can not just kludge your way into this. What fascinates me about your request is why you care. FreeBSD is going nowhere at a staggeringly fast pace. And to the same place as went Oracle Database version 8.0. Obscurity. Install Oracle's Enterprise Linux and you will have a real operating system in less time than you've spent monitoring this thead. And as an additional value it will support the Oracle technology stack while you are still young enough to use it. and IF you can match up the system calls, then you can 'make it work'. The relevant links are 1. http://forums.oracle.com/forums/thread.jspa?threadID=952076tstart=0 2. http://forums.oracle.com/forums/thread.jspa?threadID=952076tstart=0 The response seems to suggest that there is some feature used by Oracle which is expected from a UNIX Sys 5 std and perhaps FreeBSD does not support/have the syscall. Given the response, What is your analysis of the situation ? That whoever wrote that post is very closed minded, has no problem condemning something prior to investigation, and perhaps wears a pair of glasses that only come in one shade. It makes me very proud to be a member of this great community, where the attitude is more 'get the job done with whatever tool suits the task', as opposed to 'if you don't use this, then forget it'. I completely and utterly disagree with the claims made in that post. I've been using FreeBSD for nearly 10 years, and I vouch for the fact that FreeBSD has made huge strides during that time. Not only is the OS mature, but so are the people who write it, maintain it, and advocate it. Was about to add 'defend it' to the last sentence there, but it's not even necessary. FreeBSD's track record, and the fact that it's used in the most critical of infrastructures proves that FreeBSD merrily holds it's own water, without a word ever needing to be spoken. Steve smime.p7s Description: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature
Re: why no Oracle on FreeBSD ?
2009/9/25 Saifi Khan saifi.k...@datasynergy.org On Thu, 24 Sep 2009, Julian H. Stacey wrote: i noticed that there is no Oracle available for FreeBSD http://www.oracle.com/technology/software/products/database/index.html What could be the reason for that ? Best ask direct of commercial application vendor Oracle. IE wave money under Oracle's nose ask to purchase what you want. If Oracle think there's enough profit in it, there's many BSD consultants eg http://berklix.com/consultants/ willing to work. Cheers, Julian -- i was wondering if there is any technical reason behind this ? Most unlikely. Ask Oracle tell advocacy@ what you find out. I'd bet perceived market share demand as ever, ie Money. Hi Julian: Here is the response on the Oracle forum thread to my posting, FreeBSD is a kernel not used in any extant operating system with the sole exception being Apple's Mac OSX so you are heading, full speed ahead, toward disappointment. FreeBSD handles many things very differently from the UNIX System 5 standard so you can not just kludge your way into this. What fascinates me about your request is why you care. FreeBSD is going nowhere at a staggeringly fast pace. And to the same place as went Oracle Database version 8.0. Obscurity. Install Oracle's Enterprise Linux and you will have a real operating system in less time than you've spent monitoring this thead. And as an additional value it will support the Oracle technology stack while you are still young enough to use it. and IF you can match up the system calls, then you can 'make it work'. The relevant links are 1. http://forums.oracle.com/forums/thread.jspa?threadID=952076tstart=0 2. http://forums.oracle.com/forums/thread.jspa?threadID=952076tstart=0 The response seems to suggest that there is some feature used by Oracle which is expected from a UNIX Sys 5 std and perhaps FreeBSD does not support/have the syscall. Given the response, What is your analysis of the situation ? thanks Saifi. ___ freebsd-questi...@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org I have seen a guide on howto get oracle to run on bsd, it did use linux compatibility though. I have to say though the reality of the situation is you are probably best running oracle on solaris with a zfs fs underneath it. Forget the wrongs and rights and what should bes, the reality is you will find everything easier from a comercial support point of view with that combination. ___ freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-advocacy To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-advocacy-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: why no Oracle on FreeBSD ?
Most unlikely. Ask Oracle tell advocacy@ what you find out. I'd bet perceived market share demand as ever, ie Money. Hi Julian: Here is the response on the Oracle forum thread to my posting, FreeBSD is a kernel not used in any extant operating system with the sole exception being Apple's Mac OSX so you are heading, ... Given the response, What is your analysis of the situation ? Hi Saifi, I wrote: Best ask direct of commercial application vendor Oracle. IE wave money under Oracle's nose ask to purchase what you want. I meant contact Oracle Inc _Direct_ ask to purchase licenses for BSD. Not ask a forum of users including the clueless Oracle user you quoted. If you only want to buy a few licenses. Oracle probably won't be interested (unless you convince them you'r a path finder for more purchasers to come); ... but on top of Krad's Solaris approach, if you wanted to try out Oracle, as well as native, you might perhaps try it on a linux or opensolaris within eg FreeBSD/branches/-current/ports/emulators/virtualbox/ (if you try it get stuck there's an emulat...@freebsd list). Cheers, Julian -- Julian Stacey: BSD Unix Linux C Sys Eng Consultants Munich http://berklix.com Mail ASCII plain text not HTML Base64. http://asciiribbon.org Virused Microsoft PCs cause spam. http://berklix.com/free/ ___ freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-advocacy To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-advocacy-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: why no Oracle on FreeBSD ?
That whoever wrote that post is very closed minded, has no problem condemning something prior to investigation, and perhaps wears a pair of glasses that only come in one shade. Oracle is an expensive business application that is expected to be VERY reliable. It's expected to have a high end support infrastructure behind it. This is why they limit the number of operating systems to a very specific few, that are backed by companies with a reputation. I'm not vouching for them, but most businesses aren't looking to plunk down $50,000 or $100,000 for a database product for their mission critical application, and run it on something that lacks a commercial support infrastructure behind it. RedHat is the only reason linux has gotten as far as it has in the heavy business and gov't world. I completely and utterly disagree with the claims made in that post. I've been using FreeBSD for nearly 10 years, and I vouch for the fact that FreeBSD has made huge strides during that time. Not only is the OS mature, but so are the people who write it, maintain it, and advocate it. While it has, it's still lagging. I can't even get a decent shell from the FreeBSD install CD or boot CD. If the installer fails at getting the first package, after you re-enter the information to try again, it seems to pick up on package #2, skipping the first, which is probably the kernel. I took a hiatus(sp) from FreeBSD and when I came back after spending a bunch of time in the Linux world, I noticed some pretty sore things. I'm not hating on BSD, I'm still kind of meh about Linux, but I can see why companies do what they do. A small firm webhosting stuff with MySQL is one thing. Large corporations running mission critical databases is another. I assume Oracle goes through heavy lengths to certify their product on the few OSes they officially support. Probably Solaris, Redhat and their own Linux distro. This is a huge deal to them. Think of it as an appliance. If you hate Linux, help Solaris. Run your oracle on your Solaris system, and hit it from your FreeBSD system. I'd be willing to bet there is little to no commercial demand for Oracle on FreeBSD. Heck, look at all the SGI went through with Oracle, and the rumors were that Oracle ran faster than any other platform on IRIX for a while. Oracle wouldn't release it, maybe becuase Ellison and McNealy are BFF or something. ___ freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-advocacy To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-advocacy-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: why no Oracle on FreeBSD ?
On Fri, Sep 25, 2009 at 9:28 AM, telmn...@757.org wrote: That whoever wrote that post is very closed minded, has no problem condemning something prior to investigation, and perhaps wears a pair of glasses that only come in one shade. Oracle is an expensive business application that is expected to be VERY reliable. It's expected to have a high end support infrastructure behind it. This is why they limit the number of operating systems to a very specific few, that are backed by companies with a reputation. I'm not vouching for them, but most businesses aren't looking to plunk down $50,000 or $100,000 for a database product for their mission critical application, and run it on something that lacks a commercial support infrastructure behind it. RedHat is the only reason linux has gotten as far as it has in the heavy business and gov't world. I completely and utterly disagree with the claims made in that post. I've been using FreeBSD for nearly 10 years, and I vouch for the fact that FreeBSD has made huge strides during that time. Not only is the OS mature, but so are the people who write it, maintain it, and advocate it. While it has, it's still lagging. I can't even get a decent shell from the FreeBSD install CD or boot CD. If the installer fails at getting the first package, after you re-enter the information to try again, it seems to pick up on package #2, skipping the first, which is probably the kernel. I took a hiatus(sp) from FreeBSD and when I came back after spending a bunch of time in the Linux world, I noticed some pretty sore things. I'm not hating on BSD, I'm still kind of meh about Linux, but I can see why companies do what they do. A small firm webhosting stuff with MySQL is one thing. Large corporations running mission critical databases is another. I assume Oracle goes through heavy lengths to certify their product on the few OSes they officially support. Probably Solaris, Redhat and their own Linux distro. This is a huge deal to them. Think of it as an appliance. If you hate Linux, help Solaris. Run your oracle on your Solaris system, and hit it from your FreeBSD system. I'd be willing to bet there is little to no commercial demand for Oracle on FreeBSD. Heck, look at all the SGI went through with Oracle, and the rumors were that Oracle ran faster than any other platform on IRIX for a while. Oracle wouldn't release it, maybe becuase Ellison and McNealy are BFF or something. ...and this, of course, brings us to the purchase of Sun Microsystems by Oracle. Expect Oracle to put a lot of emphasis on Solaris in the future. ___ freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-advocacy To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-advocacy-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: why no Oracle on FreeBSD ?
On Thu, Sep 24, 2009 at 09:15:43PM +0530, Saifi Khan wrote: i noticed that there is no Oracle available for FreeBSD http://www.oracle.com/technology/software/products/database/index.html I unfortunately don't have anything to offer as a direct answer to that, other than perhaps Oracle's short-sightedness. I wonder why you ask, though. Do you plan to use Oracle for some specific real world purpose? Are you simply trying to learn about Oracle? Are you just curious about the lack of Oracle for FreeBSD? Depending on your reasons for asking, it might be worthwhile to investigate alternatives. FTD apparently found Oracle to fall short of expectations, and EnterpriseDB's variant of PostgreSQL rose to the challenge: http://tinyurl.com/yd9lon5 (I used TinyURL to avoid running afoul of line-wrap, et cetera.) It might be worth looking into. It's easy (relative to most DMBS-to-DBMS migrations) to migrate a database from Oracle to PostgreSQL, too, thanks to substantial feature parity between the two. There's a slightly different write-up of the FTD migration on EnterpriseDB's success stories page: http://www.enterprisedb.com/learning/success.do -- Chad Perrin [ original content licensed OWL: http://owl.apotheon.org ] pgp3MO1a94PBe.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: why no Oracle on FreeBSD ?
On Fri, Sep 25, 2009 at 10:28:20AM -0400, telmn...@757.org wrote: I'd be willing to bet there is little to no commercial demand for Oracle on FreeBSD. I wonder how much difference Oracle availability on FreeBSD would make, here. -- Chad Perrin [ original content licensed OWL: http://owl.apotheon.org ] pgpRQf87Cf2uW.pgp Description: PGP signature
why no Oracle on FreeBSD ?
Hi: This is a newbie query. i noticed that there is no Oracle available for FreeBSD http://www.oracle.com/technology/software/products/database/index.html What could be the reason for that ? thanks Saifi. ___ freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-advocacy To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-advocacy-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: why no Oracle on FreeBSD ?
Saifi Khan wrote: Hi: This is a newbie query. i noticed that there is no Oracle available for FreeBSD http://www.oracle.com/technology/software/products/database/index.html What could be the reason for that ? Best ask direct of commercial application vendor Oracle. IE wave money under Oracle's nose ask to purchase what you want. If Oracle think there's enough profit in it, there's many BSD consultants eg http://berklix.com/consultants/ willing to work. Cheers, Julian -- Julian Stacey: BSD Unix Linux C Sys Eng Consultants Munich http://berklix.com Mail ASCII plain text not HTML Base64. http://asciiribbon.org Virused Microsoft PCs cause spam. http://berklix.com/free/ ___ freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-advocacy To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-advocacy-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: why no Oracle on FreeBSD ?
On Thu, 24 Sep 2009, Julian H. Stacey wrote: Saifi Khan wrote: Hi: This is a newbie query. i noticed that there is no Oracle available for FreeBSD http://www.oracle.com/technology/software/products/database/index.html What could be the reason for that ? Best ask direct of commercial application vendor Oracle. IE wave money under Oracle's nose ask to purchase what you want. If Oracle think there's enough profit in it, there's many BSD consultants eg http://berklix.com/consultants/ willing to work. Cheers, Julian -- i was wondering if there is any technical reason behind this ? thanks Saifi. ___ freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-advocacy To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-advocacy-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
