Re: Annoucning DragonFly BSD!
On Thu, 17 Jul 2003, Gregory Sutter wrote: To drag this back to more interesting topics, I'm not yet convinced that branching off 4.X is a good thing. I see all the mound of work to make things work with mutexes, and it still seems like a good thing, and something that CAN be still leveraged, even in a messaging prardigm. I'll admit I might be wrong, but I'd sure appreciate a bit of discussion about it. I *like* the mutex idea, at base, and I really hate to lose the work. On 2003-07-17 08:57 -0700, Julian Elischer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Thu, 17 Jul 2003, Julian Stacey wrote: Matthew Dillon [EMAIL PROTECTED] appeared to write: Announcing DragonFly BSD! http://www.dragonflybsd.org/ - A new kernel - OK - maybe it'll cross fertilise others, but couldn't it run with an exisiting /usr/src ? Free Net or Open. Mat had his commit bit unfairly removed.. what would YOU do? Look, let's not go there again--the past is the past. The current situation is that Matt is using his skills and perspective to branch FreeBSD in an interesting direction. We all know he can do it, so instead of repoliticizing the discussion by harping on how he was treated unfairly, which we know is a subject fraught with disagreement, let's just focus on the work that Matt is doing to further the improvement of BSD technology. OK? Greg Chuck Robey | Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and SF/Fantasy. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. ___ [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Annoucning DragonFly BSD!
On Thu, 17 Jul 2003, Brian Reichert wrote: On Thu, Jul 17, 2003 at 08:56:56PM -0400, Chuck Robey wrote: On Thu, 17 Jul 2003, Gregory Sutter wrote: To drag this back to more interesting topics, I'm not yet convinced that branching off 4.X is a good thing. Gosh, if only there were a DragonFly BSD mailing list, so we _can_ keep on topic somewhere. :) If follks would keep the traffic down, I could host it, but I only have a DSL link, it's not enough for a lot of traffic. If no one does it by Friday night, I'll host one myself. Until then folks, please bear with us, we haven't anywhere else to go to. Chuck Robey | Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and SF/Fantasy. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. ___ [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Annoucning DragonFly BSD!
On Thu, 17 Jul 2003, Larry Rosenman wrote: I have a 768/768 DSL line, and mailman all set up. I also have the disk space. Let me know if you are interested. I'm happy with it, but right now, until we get a bit more organized, we only need one yea vote: Matt's. I *don't* want to inconvenience his plans any (especially not when I'm really sure I don't understand them all yet). Is Larry's offer OK with you, Matt? We need off the FreeBSD lists, before complaints start up. We can advertise later, if it's necessary. LER --On Thursday, July 17, 2003 21:10:26 -0400 Chuck Robey [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Thu, 17 Jul 2003, Brian Reichert wrote: On Thu, Jul 17, 2003 at 08:56:56PM -0400, Chuck Robey wrote: On Thu, 17 Jul 2003, Gregory Sutter wrote: To drag this back to more interesting topics, I'm not yet convinced that branching off 4.X is a good thing. Gosh, if only there were a DragonFly BSD mailing list, so we _can_ keep on topic somewhere. :) If follks would keep the traffic down, I could host it, but I only have a DSL link, it's not enough for a lot of traffic. If no one does it by Friday night, I'll host one myself. Until then folks, please bear with us, we haven't anywhere else to go to. - --- Chuck Robey | Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and SF/Fantasy. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. - --- ___ [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Chuck Robey | Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and SF/Fantasy. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. ___ [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: DragonFly lists are on the DragonFly site...
On Fri, 18 Jul 2003, Nigel Weeks wrote: http://www.dragonflybsd.org/Main/forums.cgi Has both newsgroups and mailing lists on it... Gotcha, I didn't see them (was busy reading the tech stuff). I figure the kernel list is the right one. Thanks. At least the newsgroups work - they've been a hard slog reading them, though... -Original Message- From: Larry Rosenman [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, 18 July 2003 11:33 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Julian Elischer Subject: Re: Annoucning DragonFly BSD! I have a 768/768 DSL line, and mailman all set up. I also have the disk space. Let me know if you are interested. LER --On Thursday, July 17, 2003 21:10:26 -0400 Chuck Robey [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Thu, 17 Jul 2003, Brian Reichert wrote: On Thu, Jul 17, 2003 at 08:56:56PM -0400, Chuck Robey wrote: On Thu, 17 Jul 2003, Gregory Sutter wrote: To drag this back to more interesting topics, I'm not yet convinced that branching off 4.X is a good thing. Gosh, if only there were a DragonFly BSD mailing list, so we _can_ keep on topic somewhere. :) If follks would keep the traffic down, I could host it, but I only have a DSL link, it's not enough for a lot of traffic. If no one does it by Friday night, I'll host one myself. Until then folks, please bear with us, we haven't anywhere else to go to. -- --- --- Chuck Robey | Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and SF/Fantasy. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. -- --- --- ___ [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Larry Rosenman http://www.lerctr.org/~ler Phone: +1 972-414-9812 E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] US Mail: 1905 Steamboat Springs Drive, Garland, TX 75044-6749 ___ [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Chuck Robey | Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and SF/Fantasy. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. ___ [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
dri-devel - HEADS-UP
To those of you running the radeon.ko dri module from the ports (ports/graphics/dri-devel) IF YOU'RE RUNNING CURRENT then you might want to listen up. I just did a rebuild of the system for the first time in about 6 days, and my system rebooted immediately when XFree86 attempted loading the radeon.ko. I always rebuild and reinstall the modules when I do the kernel, but I also always take extra care to copy the ports version of radeon.ko over the one built/installed during the modules build, so I am completely certain that I was using the one from the ports. I reverified that on reboot. While I'm not totally certain it was the dri-devel, I rebuilt it again (it used the same sources as before from ports, on the new kernel sources from /usr/src/sys) and next time, used that to load. Result this time was just fine. I did check, the module binary had changed size (gotten a bit smaller). I don't know for sure if that is from a change in the compiler or a change in kernel sources (probably both). I'd previously built the dri-devel port with the gcc 3.2 compiler, it's in a new rev now. The moral is, I think you need to rebuild/reinstall dri-devel if you're running FreeBSD-current. If anyone can either show I'm wrong, or verify my experience, if you'd post your results you'd be doing everyone a favor. I won't mind being proven wrong. Chuck Robey | Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and SF/Fantasy. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe freebsd-current in the body of the message
RE: console problem
On Wed, 4 Dec 2002, Long, Scott wrote: This problem and the general 'console freeze' problem, and possibly even the 'floppy doesn't work anymore' problem should be fixed. The problem was with the ahc and ahd drivers corrupting the callout list used to trigger timeouts in the kernel. Pardon me for taking this long to answer, but the surest method of proving the fix was a sufficient torture test. It's quite finished now, and this is indeed a fix. I'm curious how you got to looking into the ahc driver for an ostensible syscons bug ... just perusing commit logs? Scott -Original Message- From: Holm Tiffe [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Wednesday, December 04, 2002 7:27 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: console problem Chuck Robey wrote: I've been on vacation for the last week, so I haven't been watching -current like a good boy should, but I've suddenly been seeing a serious problem, and it *might* not have been reported, and seeing as code freeze is almost here, it's worth risking a bit of embarrassment, I guess. Anyhow, it's the console, it's been locking up. I just retried it with a kernel cvsupped not 2 hours ago, and it's still here. All the vty's lock up, and once even froze the PC speaker (beeping annoyingly at me). I see the hanging Speaker problem on an Asus A7V with an Athlon 2000+ and 256 Megs of RAM, so it seems not SMP related, nor Tyan related. Holm -- FreibergNet Systemhaus GbR Holm Tiffe * Administration, Development Systemhaus für Daten- und Netzwerktechnik phone +49 3731 781279 Unternehmensgruppe Liebscher Partnerfax +49 3731 781377 D-09599 Freiberg * Am St. Niclas Schacht 13 http://www.freibergnet.de To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe freebsd-current in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe freebsd-current in the body of the message Chuck Robey | Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and SF/Fantasy. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe freebsd-current in the body of the message
Re: 5.0-DP2 boot failure on a 440GX motherboard
On Tue, 3 Dec 2002, Arun Sharma wrote: On Wed, Nov 20, 2002 at 05:35:53PM -0800, Arun Sharma wrote: On Wed, Nov 20, 2002 at 04:36:58PM -0800, Arun Sharma wrote: This is a dual Pentium III motherboard, with 2 x PIII at 850 MHz. 5.0-DP1 worked just fine on this machine. However, with DP2, I get a garbled console (Everything is ok till the Timecounter.. message). Sometimes the CD manages to boot and get into sysinstall, but hangs shortly thereafter. Even the sysinstall output is garbled. boot -v output captured from a serial console attached. I have debugged this some more. I'm able to boot, if I boot from serial console and am careful not to tickle the vga driver too much i.e. interact with the machine over the network or over the serial console. The moment I try to do anything on vga consoles, I get a hang. Is this a hard hang, or is the vga output frozen (and keyboard still works, X still works, ssh still works) like I've been reporting? Another observation: even when booting from the serial console, when the vga driver probes/attaches the hardware, I see garbage written on my vga console. I tested that 11/25 kernel also has this problem. The problem didn't happen with DP1. -Arun To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe freebsd-current in the body of the message Chuck Robey | Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and SF/Fantasy. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe freebsd-current in the body of the message
Re: console problem
On Mon, 2 Dec 2002, Vallo Kallaste wrote: Anyhow, it's the console, it's been locking up. I just retried it with a kernel cvsupped not 2 hours ago, and it's still here. All the vty's lock up, and once even froze the PC speaker (beeping annoyingly at me). There don't seem to be any hung processes. I can use X, and I can also ssh into the box, so it's the console only. Can't switch to different vty's, and the one i'm on is frozen, no response to any keys. It seems to come on more quickly if I do something serious, like a buildkernel. Happened once on startup, but even though rc hadn't finished, I WAS able to ssh into the box and shut it down (indicating to me that rc had finished, just no response from the console). Machine is a 2 processor Tyan Thunder, 1G memory, two Athlons, scsi disks and eide both. It's interesting that you seem to have almost same machine as I have. Tyan Thunder with SCSI and ATA disks, SMP and the only difference seems to be memory size, 1GB vs. 512MB. Not counting network interfaces and such. I've also lost console after rebuild yesterday. The kernel from Nov. 29 works. Mine (console) not locks up but is simply missing from the start. Otherwise system is up and running. I don't think it's coincidence, something is broken and related to the Tyan mobos we have. Are you using the on-board video? I have an extra video card, and had to reflash the board because before reflash, I used to have this problem. It went away after reflash, and your references to the mobo reminded me. Tonight, I'll see if the video just goes back to the onboard card. Chuck Robey | Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and SF/Fantasy. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe freebsd-current in the body of the message
Re: console problem
On Mon, 2 Dec 2002, Manfred Antar wrote: Anyhow, it's the console, it's been locking up. I just retried it with a kernel cvsupped not 2 hours ago, and it's still here. All the vty's lock up, and once even froze the PC speaker (beeping annoyingly at me). There don't seem to be any hung processes. I can use X, and I can also ssh into the box, so it's the console only. Can't switch to different vty's, and the one i'm on is frozen, no response to any keys. It seems to come on more quickly if I do something serious, like a buildkernel. Happened once on startup, but even though rc hadn't finished, I WAS able to ssh into the box and shut it down (indicating to me that rc had finished, just no response from the console). Machine is a 2 processor Tyan Thunder, 1G memory, two Athlons, scsi disks and eide both. It's interesting that you seem to have almost same machine as I have. Tyan Thunder with SCSI and ATA disks, SMP and the only I have the same problem here on an Intel PR440FX dual pentium-pro MB. Manfred It's not the fact that I have an extra, unused on-board video (checked). Also, when the video output stops, the console still works fine for input (keyboard never stops working normally). Also, I can successfully start X just fine. It's just the vty's output that is stopped (all vtys, alt-Fn has no effect on output, only input). It's not wiped, just no further changes. I tried issuing a vidcontrol; before lockup, color change works fine, after, no effect. It's acting as if the mapping in memory to the video buffer has changed. Chuck Robey | Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and SF/Fantasy. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe freebsd-current in the body of the message
console problem
I've been on vacation for the last week, so I haven't been watching -current like a good boy should, but I've suddenly been seeing a serious problem, and it *might* not have been reported, and seeing as code freeze is almost here, it's worth risking a bit of embarrassment, I guess. Anyhow, it's the console, it's been locking up. I just retried it with a kernel cvsupped not 2 hours ago, and it's still here. All the vty's lock up, and once even froze the PC speaker (beeping annoyingly at me). There don't seem to be any hung processes. I can use X, and I can also ssh into the box, so it's the console only. Can't switch to different vty's, and the one i'm on is frozen, no response to any keys. It seems to come on more quickly if I do something serious, like a buildkernel. Happened once on startup, but even though rc hadn't finished, I WAS able to ssh into the box and shut it down (indicating to me that rc had finished, just no response from the console). Machine is a 2 processor Tyan Thunder, 1G memory, two Athlons, scsi disks and eide both. Chuck Robey | Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and SF/Fantasy. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe freebsd-current in the body of the message
Re: console problem
On Sun, 1 Dec 2002, Manfred Antar wrote: Anyhow, it's the console, it's been locking up. I just retried it with a kernel cvsupped not 2 hours ago, and it's still here. All the vty's lock up, and once even froze the PC speaker (beeping annoyingly at me). There don't seem to be any hung processes. I can use X, and I can also ssh into the box, so it's the console only. Can't switch to different vty's, and the one i'm on is frozen, no response to any keys. It seems to come on more quickly if I do something serious, like a buildkernel. Happened once on startup, but even though rc hadn't finished, I WAS able to ssh into the box and shut it down (indicating to me that rc had finished, just no response from the console). Machine is a 2 processor Tyan Thunder, 1G memory, two Athlons, scsi disks and eide both. I'm seeing the same here and the same on a serial console. Kernel from Friday 29 Nov. 8pm PST sources works So it happened sometime after that Manfred OK, did two full rebuilds,once using ssh, once using x. The one using ssh was fine, the one using X did hang the console, but the only way to notice that was because the PC speaker hangs while sounding off. I read the commitlogs, the only one that seemed at all connected with the console was this one (a weak link, admittedly): begin commit message imp 2002/11/29 16:49:43 PST Modified files: sys/kern subr_bus.c Log: devd kernel improvements: 1) Record all device events when devctl is enabled, rather than just when devd has devctl open. This is necessary to prevent races between when a device arrives, and when devd starts. 2) Add hw.bus.devctl_disable to disable devctl, this can also be set as a tunable. 3) Fix async support. Reset nonblocking and async_td in open. remove async flags. 4) Free all memory when devctl is disabled. Approved by: re (blanket) Revision ChangesPath 1.117 +38 -21src/sys/kern/subr_bus.c ===end commit message== I cc'ed Warner on this. Chuck Robey | Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and SF/Fantasy. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe freebsd-current in the body of the message
Re: current.freebsd.org
On Mon, 8 Jul 2002, David O'Brien wrote: On Mon, Jul 08, 2002 at 12:32:21AM -0400, Chuck Robey wrote: Ohhhkay. The .jp site I found stopped making snaps on 6/21. Seeing as current only stabilized in the last day or so, I think first I'll write them and ask if it's going to start back up again. They never stopped, `make release' has been broken. Just like current.freebsd.org there are holes in snapshots. :-P current.freebsd.org works again now (it's been pointed at the Japanese site, which has up-to-date snaps available). Chuck Robey | Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe freebsd-current in the body of the message
current.freebsd.org
is that machine dead? Is it still the source of current snaps? I need to re-install (having booting problems between old version of FreeBSD and new one, easiest fix is just to re-install) and I want to know where to go for a snap of current. Anyone got one? Chuck Robey | Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe freebsd-current in the body of the message
Re: current.freebsd.org
On Sun, 7 Jul 2002, David W. Chapman Jr. wrote: On Sun, Jul 07, 2002 at 11:28:30PM -0400, Chuck Robey wrote: is that machine dead? Is it still the source of current snaps? I need to re-install (having booting problems between old version of FreeBSD and new one, easiest fix is just to re-install) and I want to know where to go for a snap of current. Anyone got one? Have you tried the jp site? It should be on the list of the ftp sites from sysinstall. Last I checked you could ftp install via ftp from the jp site that hosted the latest snaps. Nope. I checked ftp,ftp2, and ftp3.jp.freebsd.org, and the best they had was a copy of the old 5.0DP1 release. That's months old now, I don't want to install that unless I must. Chuck Robey | Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe freebsd-current in the body of the message
Re: current.freebsd.org
On Sun, 7 Jul 2002, David O'Brien wrote: On Sun, Jul 07, 2002 at 11:28:30PM -0400, Chuck Robey wrote: is that machine dead? It's dead Jim. I've asked [EMAIL PROTECTED] to CNAME current and releng4 to the .jp snap server. Perhaps a reminder to hostmaster by someone else would help. Ohhhkay. The .jp site I found stopped making snaps on 6/21. Seeing as current only stabilized in the last day or so, I think first I'll write them and ask if it's going to start back up again. Manfred Antar told me about ftp.kddlabs.co.jp, which is the good site. Chuck Robey | Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe freebsd-current in the body of the message
Re: Recommended MP development machines...
On 3 Jul, Peter Wemm wrote: Chuck Robey wrote: On Wed, 3 Jul 2002, David O'Brien wrote: On Wed, Jul 03, 2002 at 07:43:22PM -0700, George V. Neville-Neil wrote: I know everyone says they all work but i'd like some recommendations on MP machines for -CURRENT work. I'll be ordering one this week. There is but _1_ dual system to get -- Tyan Thunder K7 (code name Guinness) . http://www.tyan.com/products/html/thunderk7.html. It comes in multiple flavors, but mine is the dual-channel Ultra160, dual-3com 10/100, 5-64bit PCI, 1 AGP version. You can cheap out and not get the non-SCSI S2462NG model. Match this bad-boy up with a pair of fast Athlon `MP' (not `XP') CPU's and it is a totally solid system. Various FreeBSD committers also have this system. There is a newer [more economic] version called the Thunder K7X. http://www.tyan.com/products/html/thunderk7x.html more economic is a poor way to describe it, seeing as it has all the features, plus (1) an updated version of the AMD mp chipset and (2) a fixed onboard usb port. The K7 had a broken on-board usb (the AMD chipset had a PCI contention bug for the usb port, so the tin back panel of the board blocked out the usb, and the K7 came with a PCI usb card, which ate up one of your PCI slots. The K7X has a repaired on-board usb, so you get that PCI slot back. Hm. Do you have any details on this? I've had occasional strange USB-related things happen on this box. Of course, it runs -current which puts me into the USB danger-zone enough as it is.. but what happens when this bug is triggered? I just finished buying the K7X myself, so I did quite a bit of research before rejecting the Asus board, and the K7. This included reading about a half dozen reviews I located via google and tomshardware. I'm quite certain of my facts (and my head is abuzz with lots more board trivia about them) but it's going to take a little bit for me to run down the source of the PCI comment. I'll do that, wait a bit for it. Cheers, -Peter -- Peter Wemm - [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] All of this is for nothing if we don't go to the stars - JMS/B5 -- Chuck Robey | Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe freebsd-current in the body of the message
Re: Recommended MP development machines...
On 3 Jul, Peter Wemm wrote: Chuck Robey wrote: On Wed, 3 Jul 2002, David O'Brien wrote: On Wed, Jul 03, 2002 at 07:43:22PM -0700, George V. Neville-Neil wrote: I know everyone says they all work but i'd like some recommendations on MP machines for -CURRENT work. I'll be ordering one this week. There is but _1_ dual system to get -- Tyan Thunder K7 (code name Guinness) . http://www.tyan.com/products/html/thunderk7.html. It comes in multiple flavors, but mine is the dual-channel Ultra160, dual-3com 10/100, 5-64bit PCI, 1 AGP version. You can cheap out and not get the non-SCSI S2462NG model. Match this bad-boy up with a pair of fast Athlon `MP' (not `XP') CPU's and it is a totally solid system. Various FreeBSD committers also have this system. There is a newer [more economic] version called the Thunder K7X. http://www.tyan.com/products/html/thunderk7x.html more economic is a poor way to describe it, seeing as it has all the features, plus (1) an updated version of the AMD mp chipset and (2) a fixed onboard usb port. The K7 had a broken on-board usb (the AMD chipset had a PCI contention bug for the usb port, so the tin back panel of the board blocked out the usb, and the K7 came with a PCI usb card, which ate up one of your PCI slots. The K7X has a repaired on-board usb, so you get that PCI slot back. Hm. Do you have any details on this? I've had occasional strange USB-related things happen on this box. Of course, it runs -current which puts me into the USB danger-zone enough as it is.. but what happens when this bug is triggered? Sorry it took so long, the web site I originally found it on has apparently disappeared. This link, however, describes the problem neatly: http://www.amd.com/us-en/assets/content_type/white_papers_and_tech_docs/24472.pdf Chuck Robey | Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe freebsd-current in the body of the message
Re: getting back to current
On Sun, 30 Jun 2002, Doug Barton wrote: Chuck Robey wrote: I've just finished going thru another medical session, this one took about 5 months, and because of the extended time spent away, I'm running 4.5 (I've been running current since 1.1, this feels really odd). I need a little bit of help (or advice, maybe) to get me back to current. Glad to hear you're feeling better. :) The bad news is that this is a really terrible time to upgrade to -current. The KSE mark III update just went in, so things are very unstable right now. Clearing out about 50,000 old mails today ... need to update myself. Much thanks for the heads-up. I'm OK with instability, I'm used to that, as long as it works at least a bit. I just finished cvsupping, and the main sources built just fine. I installed a new config (static, the libs are now too old) and fixed all the changes in my config file, so now my kernel file configs but it doesn't build (breaks in 'make depend', I think in genassym). I'm guessing that this is only one of a string of incompatibilities, in jumping from 4.5 back to current. At this point, the only way to build -current on a -stable system is make buildworld; make buildkernel. Make sure that KERNCONF is defined in /etc/make.conf. You'll probably want to read -current and cvs-all for a while before you finish the upgrade though HTH, Doug To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe freebsd-current in the body of the message Chuck Robey | Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe freebsd-current in the body of the message
getting back to current
I've just finished going thru another medical session, this one took about 5 months, and because of the extended time spent away, I'm running 4.5 (I've been running current since 1.1, this feels really odd). I need a little bit of help (or advice, maybe) to get me back to current. I just finished cvsupping, and the main sources built just fine. I installed a new config (static, the libs are now too old) and fixed all the changes in my config file, so now my kernel file configs but it doesn't build (breaks in 'make depend', I think in genassym). I'm guessing that this is only one of a string of incompatibilities, in jumping from 4.5 back to current. I could drag myself thru fixing the bugs I'm hitting, but I was wondering if I could get someone to use my config file (on freefall, APRIL and APRIL.hints, in ~chuckr/) and build me a kernel and a set of modules. I'm asking this because my health isn't yet back fully, and I would like to shortcut this a bit. [my FreeBSD machine is april.chuckr.org, hence the config filename]. I'm not sure what changes have occurred in kernel/module installation, but *you'd* have to be really sure about that, because I wouldn't want someone to scrag their system whilst doing me a favor. If you're not certain, please don't even offer, I'd hate to be the cause of your system meltdown. I appreciate any consideration I get ... Chuck Robey | Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with unsubscribe freebsd-current in the body of the message
Re: Whatever happened to CTM?
On Wed, 21 Mar 2001, Stephen McKay wrote: unfortunatly my provider cut me off and I just got some access back, but not for the location the ctm machine is located at. At this time I do not know yet when it will have access again. Surely FreeBSD Inc (or whatever it is that owns the freebsd.org machines) could spring for a box. Assuming Ulf is still keen, it shouldn't be too hard for him to remote administer it. I've already announced this on the ctm-announce list, but in case some aren't subscribed, a new host has been located for ctm, and I expect it won't take too long to get it back up, hopefully by this weekend sometime. If Ulf's reading this, giving me a change to recover some files from the old host would be appreciated, if it's possible. I've mailed Ulf separately twice, but gotten no response. If the files just aren't any longer available, I will have to make do, it would make at least one item easier, is all. Chuck Robey | Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: lpd panic
On Sun, 26 Nov 2000, Mark Murray wrote: seems to be going ok, but I pick up a kernel panic whilst printing. Ditto. Also on a dual-cpu machine, also a really recent CURRENT. Well, I can catch the panic in gdb, but I'm not sure how to proceed. The active processes (for me) are irq7:lpt0, irq7:ppc0, and gs (ghostscript, being driven from my apsfilter installation). What's the right way to access the stacks of these processes, so that I can look at their stack frames, and get some idea if they're interfering with one another? Chuck Robey | Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
lpd panic
I'm finally having enough time again to look at FreeBSD again, so I went back and I'm looking at my port complaints. In looking at a2ps, after I reinstalled it fresh (so if it'd been changed I would see those) I see it seems to be going ok, but I pick up a kernel panic whilst printing. The process active at the time is (irq7:lpt0), the trace shows it's dying in fork_trampoline. I have a two processor machine in a very recent (hours old) current, and the panic is a "supervisor read, page not present". If this is familiar to anyone, please give me a shout (note I *am* running a smp kernel). If I get no reply, I guess I'm going to see about tracing this thing back. Thanks. -------- Chuck Robey | Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
smp instability
I'm having rather extreme problems with stability on my dual PIII setup. I know this is to be expected, but it's gotten so extreme on my system, I can't spend more than a few minutes before it locks up. Is there any chance that I could make things better by using a sysctl to tell the box it's now a single-cpu system? I can't read man pages at the moment (I'm composing this on my Sparc Ultra-5) so if this might work, and someone knows the exact command to use, I'd appreciate a bit of help. Otherwise, I'm going to have to go to a lot of trouble to move back to a pre-SMPNG system, and I sure don't want to do that. Thanks Chuck (who doesn't even have his .sig now!) To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
RE: smp instability
On Tue, 24 Oct 2000, John Baldwin wrote: On 25-Oct-00 Chuck Robey wrote: I'm having rather extreme problems with stability on my dual PIII setup. I know this is to be expected, but it's gotten so extreme on my system, I can't spend more than a few minutes before it locks up. Is there any chance that I could make things better by using a sysctl to tell the box it's now a single-cpu system? I can't read man pages at the moment (I'm composing this on my Sparc Ultra-5) so if this might work, and someone knows the exact command to use, I'd appreciate a bit of help. You can use kernel.old to compile a UP kernel. I always keep a UP kernel around just in case. Also, when did your SMP box become unstable? There was a known problem with SMP boxes when the vm page zero'ing during the idle loop was first turned on that has since been fixed with the latest commit to vm_machdep.c yesterday. Symptoms were frequent kernel panic 12's with interrupts disabled . No kernel panics, just lockups. I saw the startup problems (having to hit a lot of control-C's to get booted) and I had two kinds of lockup problems, one a complete machine freeze (still pings, but that's all) and also a strange one where an entire mounted filesystem would disappear. I can back up to my kernel.gd I keep around, but I have to get me an older mountd, netstat, ps (and others) before that older kernel is good, and it was from before the /boot/kernel thing (I hated that idea, and still do). I'm going to try the sysctl route first, see if that works. I won't be able to report reliable results until the morning (if it lasts all night, it's a huge fix). As it stands now, no way can I do any compiling. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: smp instability
On Tue, 24 Oct 2000, Mike Meyer wrote: Chuck Robey writes: I'm having rather extreme problems with stability on my dual PIII setup. I know this is to be expected, but it's gotten so extreme on my system, I can't spend more than a few minutes before it locks up. Is there any chance that I could make things better by using a sysctl to tell the box it's now a single-cpu system? I can't read man pages at the moment (I'm composing this on my Sparc Ultra-5) so if this might work, and someone knows the exact command to use, I'd appreciate a bit of help. Try "sysctl -w machdep.smp_active=0". It's not clear how much good this will do since you'll still be running an SMP kernel. Please let us know how that works. With less than a full hour's history, I haven't exactly heavily tested it, but it only lasted 10 minutes last time, and my system is still kicking currently. Regarding that control-C needed on booting thing: when I log in, my call to fortune needs to be interrupted also, so I immediately went and tried a "ktrace fortune". I didn't need to kdump, because doing that ktrace seems to have somehow cleared the control-C thing on all that kicked it off before (not just fortune alone). My system is really repeatable on that, so if it's not yet fixed, and you have other things to try on it, I'd be willing (if my system stays up!) In the meantime, I think that "sysctl -w machdep.smp_active=0" might actually work for me (I did it in single user so the multiuser startup would be cleaner). To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: Where has cvs-cur gone?
On Tue, 10 Oct 2000, Stephen Hocking wrote: Last one I can find in the FTP repository is cvs-cur.6772.gz. Where are the more recent ones? I'm sorry, I have been recovering from recent surgery again, and just got back to reading email. The vinum volume that ctm resides on has disappeared, and all the usual suspects are being rounded up seriously, it looks like Ulf (who physically controls that machine) took them offline for some reason, I don't know why, I have an email off to him about it. Least I won't have to use that "recovering from surgery" excuse anymore. This last surgery, it finally worked! No more time in the body shop anymore!! yea!! Now I can get back to my main hobby (harrassing BSD folks bwahahahhah) I just got in touch with Ulf (just now). ctm-repair now in progress. Stephen -------- Chuck Robey | Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED]| electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: keyboard problems with X
On Sun, 30 Jul 2000 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The problem I am seeing is that the keyboard isnt even seen. Its useable up until about midway through the boot process, then it goes dead/locks up. The boot continues fine and the machine is up. The mouse is usable in X but not the keyboard. Cant even switch virtual consoles. Is it useable or not, outside of X? Can you single-user boot and get the keyboard working? I am not clear if it's an X problem or a system problem. You said you updated your source tree yesterday. If that was from a recent build, then I don't know, but I'm very curious, just how old was your previous build? The config changed really radically maybe 2 months ago, so maybe your config file is hosed? steve I have, like when I'm running tail on something, and then I try to ctrl-c out of it, the whole console locks solid, and I have to reboot. (although if I was connected to an ethernet, I think I could probably ssh in and reboot.) Also, as an unrelated problem in -CURRENT, I'm experiencing the lockmgr problems that were reported earlier. = | Kenneth Culver | FreeBSD: The best NT upgrade| | Unix Systems Administrator | ICQ #: 24767726 | | and student at The | AIM: muythaibxr | | The University of Maryland, | Website: (Under Construction) | | College Park. | http://www.wam.umd.edu/~culverk/| = On Sun, 30 Jul 2000 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, I updated my source tree yesterday (and kernel) and am having some problems with my keyboard under X. Has anyone else noticed anything strange. steve -- Steve Heistand [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message -------- Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: keyboard problems with X
On Sun, 30 Jul 2000, Kenneth Wayne Culver wrote: My problems are with a previous build of late last week. And my problem isn't with X. My problem only happens when you start "tail" on some file, then try to exit. It locks the console solid... neither the mouse nor the keyboard work. Sorry, Ken, I was looking at his problem. I havne't the vaguest notion where your's comes out of. I might suggest doing a ktrace/kdump and see if maybe something is grabbing the keyboard that you aren't aware of. BTW, notice the new address ... I wanted connectivity NOW, and maybe didn't have the greatest imagination as per domain name, but at least my new dsl is up. I just wish it hadn't taken my voice line to do it. -------- Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: cvs-cur.6450.gz Fatal error: Bytecount too large.
On Sun, 2 Jul 2000, Julian Stacey wrote: Stefan Esser wrote: On 2000-07-01 16:35 -0500, Stephen Hocking [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: again. However, when I attempt to apply cvs-cur.6450.gz I get the above err You have to increase the value of MAX_SIZE in /usr/src/usr.sbin/ctm/ctm/ctm.h to at least 12MB (i.e. 1024*1024*12). This has been fixed in -current (to 20M B) and is awaiting a MFC. Not sure whether the fix went in before cvs-cur.6450, but I think so. In that case just recompile and install ctm. The patch below solves it on 3.4-RELEASE : Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 09:18:26 -0400 (EDT) From: Chuck Robey [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: cvs-cur Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] .. Index: /usr/src/usr.sbin/ctm/ctm/ctm.h === RCS file: /usr/cvs/src/usr.sbin/ctm/ctm/ctm.h,v retrieving revision 1.14 diff -u -3 -r1.14 ctm.h - --- /usr/src/usr.sbin/ctm/ctm/ctm.h 1999/08/28 01:15:59 1.14 +++ /usr/src/usr.sbin/ctm/ctm/ctm.h 2000/06/15 20:25:55 @@ -26,7 +26,7 @@ #include sys/time.h #define VERSION "2.0" - -#define MAXSIZE (1024*1024*10) +#define MAXSIZE (1024*1024*20) Yeah. I committed it to currect myself, Julian. Tomorrow, I'll do the MFC. It was about 2 weeks ago, when a big patch blew up the ctm machine. I announced it pretty widely on the ctm list, I'm really sorry you missed it and had to do that work again. #define SUBSUFF ".ctm" #define TMPSUFF ".ctmtmp" Julian - Julian Stacey http://bim.bsn.com/~jhs/ Kostenlos: FreeBSD 3200 packages, sources, Netscape, WordPerfect StarWriter. RaucherKrebsNebel erregt meinen allergischen Kopfschmerz: Schnupftabak Nutzen! To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message ---- Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: Config problems
cons stuff device vga0at isa? port ? device sc0 at isa? device sio0at isa? port IO_COM1 irq 4 device sio1at isa? port IO_COM2 irq 3 device ppc0at isa? port? irq 7 drq 3 device ppbus0 device lpt0at ppbus? device plip0 at ppbus? device ppi0at ppbus? device pps0at ppbus? # Order is important here due to intrusive probes, do *not* alphabetize # this list of network interfaces until the probes have been fixed. # Right now it appears that the ie0 must be probed before ep0. See # revision 1.20 of this file. #device ed0 at isa? port 0x280 irq 5 iomem 0xd8000 device fxp0 pseudo-device loop pseudo-device vn pseudo-device ether pseudo-device snp 4 #Snoop device - to look at pty/vty/etc.. pseudo-device tun 1 pseudo-device pty 128 pseudo-device streams pseudo-device gzip# Exec gzipped a.out's pseudo-device bpf 4 device pass0 #CAM passthrough driver device pass1 #CAM passthrough driver device pass2 #CAM passthrough driver device pass3 #CAM passthrough driver # KTRACE enables the system-call tracing facility ktrace(2). # This adds 4 KB bloat to your kernel, and slightly increases # the costs of each syscall. options KTRACE #kernel tracing # PS/2 mouse device psm0at atkbdc? irq 12 Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Config problems
I am getting a config error with the new gethints.pl stuff: unrecognized config token 1 This is with a newly cvsupped system, and I checked the version of gethints.pl: ROOT:/usr/src/sys/i386/conf:472 cvs status gethints.pl === File: gethints.pl Status: Up-to-date Working revision:1.4 Sun Jun 18 01:43:22 2000 Repository revision: 1.4 /home/ncvs/src/sys/i386/conf/gethints.pl,v Sticky Tag: (none) Sticky Date: (none) Sticky Options: (none) So I think that's right. My config file before had worked just fine, but as a test, I went thru it and really tried to make it squeaky clean, but it didn't seem to get rid of that error. I don't know if this message indicates a fatal problem or just is a leftover printf, there's damned little in the way of info in it. I don't know, maybe that error message is referring to line 1 of my config file? Here's the start of the config file: machine i386 cpu I586_CPU cpu I686_CPU ident CH maxusers64 # Create a SMP capable kernel (mandatory options): options SMP # Symmetric MultiProcessor Kernel options APIC_IO # Symmetric (APIC) I/O If that doesn't do it, I'm attaching the entire config file to this mail. Sure would appreciate a hint; I'm not a perl hacker, but if I gotta become one to puzzle this out, it's going to take me an long extra while trying to get me a new kernel. Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: Config problems
On Sun, 25 Jun 2000, Kenneth Wayne Culver wrote: Hey chuck, except for the SMP stuff, your config looks mostly like mine (I only have a cpu line for i686) Let me know if there's anything I can do to help though. I'm about ready to post again, so this is good timing. I got the totally vague warning from gethints.pl to quiet by making my disk section look much like the NOTES file. I then ran it by a brand new config, and out spewed more than 25 errors. The entire section on wiring down disks fails, and also all the stuff on npx, even tho that part was copied verbatim from NOTES. I have an Adaptec dual channel controller on my motherboard, and I have 3 disks and 2 cdroms, which I want to wire down. There's lines in the NOTES examples whose meanings just make no sense to me. Let me do a bit of quoting: [from NOTES] hint.scbus.0.at="ahc0" hint.scbus.1.at="ahc1" hint.scbus.1.bus="0" hint.scbus.3.at="ahc2" hint.scbus.3.bus="0" hint.scbus.2.at="ahc2" hint.scbus.2.bus="1" hint.da.0.at="scbus0" hint.da.0.target="0" hint.da.0.unit="0" hint.da.1.at="scbus3" hint.da.1.target="1" hint.da.2.at="scbus2" hint.da.2.target="3" hint.sa.1.at="scbus1" hint.sa.1.target="6" What does ``hint.scbus.1.bus="0"'' mean? Do I have to stick a number after the "device ahc" and "device scbus" lines (the NOTES file doesn't). Are there any other oddities I ought to know of? Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: HEADS UP: Destabilization due to SMP development
On Wed, 21 Jun 2000, Mark Murray wrote: Has anyone given any thought to what it would take to create an open source version of something similar to perforce? ;-) Clearly you have. :-). We await your submissions with baited breath... I have mixed feelings about that. The Perforce people have been willing for FreeBSD to use it free. They're really nice about that, it seems more than a bit discourteous to try to copy it. If you'd asked to duplicate MSWord, they're a unethical monopolist, I wouldn't have any scruples attacking them, but I don't like attacking folks who've been displaying towards free software such a friendly attitude. Makes me (and I sure support free software!) feel like a predator when you go after folks who've been doing good. I think, if you want it fixed, you should go fix cvs. Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
vmware
I fianlly have vmware2 working on my current box, but I have noticed a couple things in my log, and I wanted to ask about them. Here's a little bit at the end: sio1: 3 more silo overflows (total 1268) /dev/vmmon: Vmx86_DestroyVM: unlocked pages: 359971, unlocked dirty pages: 217740 I guess I can understand the large number of silo overflows. I noticed that I can't seem to get any mails when I have vmware working, and I wish that wasn't so. The part that really worries me, tho, is the virtual memory warning. I was doing a lot of Windows software installation (which dragged on *really* slowly), but is there anything to be worried about in that warning above? Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: make(1) patches to bypass quietness prescribed by @-prefixedcommands in Makefiles
On Sun, 14 May 2000, Will Andrews wrote:
Hi all,
Some time ago I was complaining about how there is no way to force make(1)
to display the commands executed by @-prefixed commands in Makefiles. So I
went around and talked to a few people and one guy clued me in on how I
would add something like this (sorry, I don't remember the name right now
as this was a few weeks ago..).
This option is useful for people with complex Makefile hierarchies who
cannot simply insert a `@${ECHO} "SOMEVAR = ${SOMEVAR}"` as needed in their
Makefiles or remove all the @'s in their Makefiles. In particular, I would
use this feature to debug ports.
Attached is the patch. If I can get permission, I'd like to commit this to
code on -current, with a possible MFC in a few weeks (?). I'd like to hear
any complaints about this code, including any style(9) mistakes, whether
this option would be considered bloat, and whether the variable name
``beLoud'' is appropriate in this context. ;-)
Oh, what a nice present! Thanks!
Thanks,
--------
Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing.
New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up
fictitious words in the dictionary.
To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: make(1) patches to bypass quietness prescribed by @-prefixedcommands in Makefiles
On Sun, 14 May 2000, Will Andrews wrote: On Sun, May 14, 2000 at 01:25:16PM -0600, Lyndon Nerenberg wrote: I like the idea, but the -l flag conflicts with a different usage for SVR4 derived makes (on at least AIX, Irix, and Solaris): -l load Specifies that no new jobs (commands) should be started if there are others jobs running and the load average is at least load (a floating-point number). With no argument, removes a previous load limit. Compatibility with those other makes is pretty low to begin with, but it doesn't hurt, I guess, to allow for this. -dl is ok with me. I just wouldn't consider the compatibility thing a real issue if it weren't this easy to satisfy. Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: a better idea for package dependencies
On Tue, 9 May 2000, David O'Brien wrote: On Mon, May 08, 2000 at 06:30:17PM -0400, Kenneth Wayne Culver wrote: Actually, it has to do with the pkg_ commands, which I believe are built when you make world... yes. and aren't part of the ports, And are only used for Ports. Thus their behavior defines the behavior of the Ports Collection. Thus it is a Ports issue. IF the pkg_* utils were ports, how would you install them?? Oh, will you get off it? Finally someone posts something about a *technical* issue, it's got at least some reasonable claim to be on the list (it's sure involving sysinstall, if obliquely) and it's not giving a lot of noise. There must be better things to complain about. I could offer you maybe a dozen if you're not feeling particularly investigatory right now. Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: Archive pruning
On Sat, 29 Apr 2000, gh wrote: For an opinion from a reasonably new-comer and non-developer, I think at least the main source tree should remain *completely* complete. As someone mentioned, why not have "lite" mirrors? Oh, for god's sake, PLEASE let this drop! I don't want to insult a newcomer, but you've picked a very poor thing to comment on. Try another, maybe one that's a bit fresher. -------- Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: Archive pruning
On Tue, 25 Apr 2000, Richard Wackerbarth wrote: On Tue, 25 Apr 2000, you wrote: I told myself I wouldn't get into this debate with you again, Richard, but you're not listening. The vast majority (all? I might have missed one) of the other respondants Actually, I didn't start this. Someone else brought up the idea. I did. I wanted to test the opinions. I said I had enough responses, about 40 messages ago. Damn, people, if you're *really* tired of hearing from Richard on this, for god's sake control your keyboards, they're running amuck! Let's see if you guys can just let it die, ok? The quiet majority that might benefit are not very likely to speak up when they are told some is impossible. Quiet majority hehe! Right Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Archive pruning
I want to bring up a suggestion. I just want a little bit of argument on it ... and if you're violently opposed, just say so, that's fine. I want to suggest that, once a year, we go thru the cvs archive, and prune away all history more than 3 (or maybe 2, maybe 4) years old. This could be done without too much pain, I think, in a script. The purpose is to put some kind of cap on growth of the FreeBSD source archive. While folks do sometimes go hunting for hugely old materials in the tree, I normally couldn't care less (when browsing) about history that old. Do we really need 5 year old history? Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: Archive pruning
On Mon, 24 Apr 2000, David O'Brien wrote: On Mon, Apr 24, 2000 at 08:15:45PM -0400, Chuck Robey wrote: I want to bring up a suggestion. I just want a little bit of argument on it ... and if you're violently opposed, just say so, that's fine. I'm "violently opposed". :-) While folks do sometimes go hunting for hugely old materials in the tree, I've often traced files back to the begining of FreeBSD time (and then continued in the CSRG SCCS tree). I've done this numerious times, especially the contributed sources like GCC and GNU grep. Do we really need 5 year old history? Yes. OK. Thanks, I wanted some opinions, and I guess I have enough to satisfy me. -------- Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: Archive pruning
On Mon, 24 Apr 2000, Bakul Shah wrote: Do we really need 5 year old history? That really depends on your point of view. "Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it" -- Santayana "The only thing we learn from history is that we learn nothing from history." -- Hegel I am with Hegel in the very long term but what is the rush about pruning? Set a cron job to ask this in the year 2037! In the short term it is valuable to trace back the genesis of various features/bugs. With cvs annotate you can even find out who put in a feature or bug and bug that person about it (as I was just this past week about something I had written over four years back). The networking code is so convoluted that having all the history (which we don't) can be very valuable in unravelling all the development strands. Well, I wasn't talking about a harsh pruning, but I haven't seen much support for the idea, so maybe it better drop. The idea came when I was making room for vmware ... boy, I wish that the new generation of 18G Ultra160 disks would come out already ... the only reasonably priced one is the Seagate, but it could be aptly nicknamed the "data furnace" from just how hot it runs. I need more disk! -------- Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: Anyone have OpenSSH + X11-fwd working?
On Fri, 21 Apr 2000, Warner Losh wrote: In message [EMAIL PROTECTED] "Andrew Reilly" writes: : Have you got "X11Forwarding yes" Ahem. "ForwardX11 yes" is what's documented and is known to work. While this whole thing is being discussed, does anyone know of either a configuration variable or environmental variable that ssh reads, that will give the same effect as the -q flag, so that I can stop seeing those stupid warnings about the size of the key being off by one? Thanks. -------- Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: cvsup crash
On Wed, 19 Apr 2000, Alexander N. Kabaev wrote: Actually, it seems that Java borrowed a whole lot of ideas from Modula-3. And C++ experience can even hurt instead helping when switching to Java. Java inherits some parts of C++ syntax but is based on rather different design. That statement, about "C++ experience can even hurt instead helping when switching to Java" is pretty specious. I've heard it said that knowing C ruins you for learning C++, and your statement holds about the same amount of water. If you think the latter is right, you might believe the former, but I sure don't buy it, it sounds awfully conceited. C++ and Java are *quite* similar. There are differences, and personally, I think Java is quite a bit better for them, but they aren't based on radically different designs, and quite often, code parts will look identical. Yes, there are differences, and Yes, some of those differences are major, but they are from the same tree, and knowing C++ isn't going to hurt you one bit in learning Java ... it'll just make you appreciate Java all the more. One think I like about Modula-3, I have to agree, is that it has some of the nicer features or Java. I think interfaces are great, and I have very dire opinions about the quality of most template code (from C++). -------- Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: Integrating QMAIL in the world
On Fri, 14 Apr 2000, Joe Greco wrote: In other words, if we're going to be replacing sendmail with an alternative MTA, I'd prefer postfix over qmail, and I believe I can marshall some pretty strong arguments for that position. Perhaps it's time to revisit something I proposed several years ago. Remove Sendmail from the base system - or, at least, make it a "package" that is removable with the package management tool. Then be able to add another mailer (or an updated Sendmail) in its place. Ideally, Sendmail would be available as a package for installation as part of the base system, just like games or info or proflibs. I would love to see this happen with other components of the system as well, such as BIND. While it is fantastic that FreeBSD comes out of the box so fully functional, it does make it a bit of a pain for those of us who intend to build servers - we have to disable the original before installing a new package. :-/ I always keep hearing the same line. You guys *know* perfectly well how to do it, and it's not a big thing to you, you even admit it's only "a bit of a pain". To most of the rest of the world, it's a huge thing, and they don't have the least clue how to do it. If you guys want so desperately to make things 1% easier, why have I never seen anyone bring out a parallel "sparse" FreeBSD? It wouldnt' be a large thing to do, and you who keep on asking for it, you know that very well. Just have a reasonable bit of compassion for everyone else. That's not to say the huge hurt it would do to FreeBSD to all reviewers and the public at large, just to save you "a bit of a pain". ---- Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: Integrating QMAIL in the world
On Sat, 15 Apr 2000, Joe Greco wrote: Uh, Chuck, can you tell me how many BIND and Sendmail advisories there have been in the last five years? Wouldn't it be nice if we could just tell newbies, "hey, yeah, that Sendmail has a known security issue, pkg_delete it and then add this new one here". Or would you prefer to explain to someone who doesn't "have the least clue how to do it" how to upgrade BIND and Sendmail to the latest? The concept is beneficial from _many_ angles, not just the one I gave. Despite my tendency to promote the traditional BSD distribution style, that does not mean that I feel that everything in FreeBSD should arrive as it did on the 4.4BSD tape. I think that the ability to be able to select modules for inclusion or exclusion would be particularly useful. If you want to pick another one and by default install that, fine. If you want to force new users to read all about mailers just to get their first mail working, no, that's just too much, Joe, you're asking too much of folks. If you've got a bone to pick with sendmail, that's ok, but you have to pick a better one. If you can't decide on the best one, then how in the heck do you expect Joe Public to do better? ALWAYS provide sensible default values, not a bunch of expert questions. ---- Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: Integrating QMAIL in the world
On Sat, 15 Apr 2000, Joe Greco wrote: Chuck, Please go back and read what I _wrote_. Your response assumes I made I've got your message, I quoted it fully in my first response. You asked to "Remove Sendmail from the base system", and that's a direct quote, Joe. statements that I certainly did not, and suggests to me that you missed every third word in my previous messages. :-( In particular, I advocated including Sendmail in the base system in a manner that would allow it to be trivially removed (or, alternatively, not including it but making it a selectable package, like X11). No, you said remove it, or at least make it removeable. I responded that you can't just remove it. Go to your sent mail message folder, I'm not making this up. I said don't remove it (not "don't make it removeable"). You're the one who's sticking new words in. This could, for example, be done in the very same way that we currently do loads of other crap, like /usr/games, proflibs, etc. More ideally, it would be done in a format compatible with the package management system, so that one could simply "pkg_delete" Sendmail and install a new one. Am I getting through now? :-) You asked in your mail to remove it, I said you can't leave ordinary users without a good default. Your context in what you said was that it was a minor pain to have to remove the default mailer. I stand by what I said. You changed your message, and if you want, I can send your message back to you. If you argue *only* that some easier method be arranged so that mailers can be swapped out, that I fully approve of. I never said otherwise, and I don't like much the way you changed things. In fact, what the heck, here's your original message, cut out of my reply (where I quoted all of your part of the exchange): Perhaps it's time to revisit something I proposed several years ago. Remove Sendmail from the base system - or, at least, make it a "package" that is removable with the package management tool. Then be able to add another mailer (or an updated Sendmail) in its place. Ideally, Sendmail would be available as a package for installation as part of the base system, just like games or info or proflibs. I would love to see this happen with other components of the system as well, such as BIND. While it is fantastic that FreeBSD comes out of the box so fully functional, it does make it a bit of a pain for those of us who intend to build servers - we have to disable the original before installing a new package. :-/ ---- Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: Installworld to /some/where/...
On Thu, 6 Apr 2000, Yu Guo/PEK/Lotus wrote: Just do a make DESTDIR=/mnt/installdir installworld Or remotely mount /usr/obj and /usr/src, and do 15 make installworlds on 15 machines. In fact, I'm not totally sure that first method works, because I think that perl, at least, records the name of DESTDIR during the 'make buildworld' so moving DESTDIR only in installworld, that might bomb later when you ran it. In fact, I think that will happen, and to cc1 (of gcc) also, because the 'specs' get set during buildworld, don't they? The above would only be safe, I think, if you did the make buildworld with the same DESTDIR. Anyone know if that's true? Hi, Is it possible to do an installworld not to / of existing system, but to, say, subdirs somewhere, which could be mountpoints for another disk? Something like: /mnt/installdir/ /mnt/installdir/compat /mnt/installdir/etc /mnt/installdir/usr /mnt/installdir/var /mnt/installdir/ The reason I'm asking is that I'm looking for a method to easily clone/upgrade a bunch of servers without having to do 'make world' on all of them. I'm not satisfied either with using dd - the machines are not identical, there are some bits and pieces of config specific to each machine. So far the best method was to do a make world, but it becomes more and more a nuisance and waste of time... Andrzej Bialecki // [EMAIL PROTECTED] WebGiro AB, Sweden (http://www.webgiro.com) // --- // -- FreeBSD: The Power to Serve. http://www.freebsd.org // --- Small Embedded FreeBSD: http://www.freebsd.org/~picobsd/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message ---- Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: Perl 5.6.0?
On Mon, 3 Apr 2000, Christopher Masto wrote: On Sun, Apr 02, 2000 at 05:56:22PM -0400, Chuck Robey wrote: On Sun, 2 Apr 2000, Thomas T. Veldhouse wrote: Are there any plans to merge perl-5.6.0 into current? I don't have any plans for using it currently, but I curious. Hmm. What with the nightmarish build structure of perl, I'm sure that reading this is just going to wreck Mark's day. In light of that, and in the absence of both any real software that needs the upgrade, and lack of confidence in a really squeaky new release, why don't we all grant Mark a little slack on this, at least for a while. I've been running Perl 5 since before it was included with FreeBSD, and I've never noticed anything nightmarish about the build process. I tried 5.6 a couple of days ago, and it built and tested out of the box. It's the way that perl builds itself. Isn't perl the only thing we build that *doesn't* use make alone to guide the build process? Isn't perl the only thing in the tree that uses itself to build it's manpages? Have you looked at the make files for perl, say the one in gnu/usr.bin/perl/perl? It works *real* slickly, but it sure wouldn't have been easy to piece together. Maybe you misinterpreted what I said to mean "the build is screwed up". I think the job done was great, but I wouldn't want to get the job of modifying it, say moving it's local library location. -------- Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: Perl 5.6.0?
On Sun, 2 Apr 2000, Thomas T. Veldhouse wrote: Are there any plans to merge perl-5.6.0 into current? I don't have any plans for using it currently, but I curious. Hmm. What with the nightmarish build structure of perl, I'm sure that reading this is just going to wreck Mark's day. In light of that, and in the absence of both any real software that needs the upgrade, and lack of confidence in a really squeaky new release, why don't we all grant Mark a little slack on this, at least for a while. Else we're going to have a drooling Mark on our hands :-) Unless, of course, you want to do it *for* Mark? Thanks, Tom Veldhouse [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message -------- Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: SMP buildworld times / performance tests
On Wed, 29 Mar 2000, Matthew Dillon wrote: time make -j 20 buildworldbuild FreeBSD-current using 4.0 kernel 4745.607u 1673.646s 1:29:07.45 120.0% 1323+1599k 8237+251565io 1615pf+0w time make -j 20 buildworldbuild FreeBSD-current using 5.0 kernel 4696.987u 1502.278s 1:10:34.17 146.4% 1359+1641k 10889+4270io 1779pf+0w Difference: 19 minutes, or a 21% improvement. Bob Bishop got 7% with an earlier patch (hopefully his system is no longer locking up and he can repeat his test with the current stuff). Goddamn. That's significant! Congratulations, Matt. Did it again! Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: CTM deltas
On Sat, 11 Mar 2000 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The latest CTM delta for -CURRENT on ftp.freebsd.org is 4257 (March 6). Because all of the mirrors for CTM are in countries other than the US, would there be any differences between the deltas they have and the ones that ftp.freebsd.org should have? (I don't understand this crypto thing all too well.) Also, is there some reason that CTM deltas aren't on the FTP servers? The deltas stop at 4257 on one of the mirrors in Taiwan too, and I can't contact either of the other two Taiwanese mirrors or the South African mirror listed on http://www.freebsd.org/handbook/mirrors-ctm.html (the one in Germany is fine, and has all the deltas through 4265 at this point). So many points to address here ... 1) please, bring ctm problems to the attention of [EMAIL PROTECTED] If you think they are general in nature, you can use ctm-announce, which is a public list. Don't use current, they're mostly uninterested in CTM stuff. 2) Archive site has changed, try ftp.freesoftware.com. You *should* have read that on logging into ftp.freebsd.org. 3) I don't see the numbers you see. On current, the latest delta is cvs-cur.6161.gz. I checked the src-3 one also, in case you maybe meant that, it's also a long way off of 4257. I think you must have your numbers messed up; please recheck them. 4) As long as you're not talking about Mark Murray's CTM of int'l crypto, there's only *one* source of ctm deltas, and I'm it. They are all now signed with GNU's gpg, and any you get are identically the same. Doesn't matter where you pick them up from. Most folks get them from the mailing lists from [EMAIL PROTECTED] 5) Just checked with the new ftp site; ftp.freesoftware.com isn't correctly mirroring ctm deltas. The other sites are OK. I'll get right on that, thanks for pointing me at it. The last ctm delta that ftp.freesoftware.com has is a week or two old: cvs-cur.6147.gz. Any more questions, send them to [EMAIL PROTECTED], not this list. Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: which(1), rewritten in C?
On Thu, 2 Mar 2000, Alfred Perlstein wrote: * Dan Papasian [EMAIL PROTECTED] [000302 18:17] wrote: While this may sound crazy, I was tired of 'which' taking a long time to complete on my 486 dx4/100 when it was under extereme pressure, so I rewrote it in C :) ...snip NOTE: This version of which has exactly the same behavior. Also, the above test was not performed when the box was under load.. and on slower machines/under load, the differences are of course, more noticable. You may all go ahead and call me crazy now. ...I've got the fear of posting the source, but what the heck, getting nitpicked is good education :) http://bugg.strangled.net/which.c Any flames^Wthoughts? It doesn't seem to handle multiple arguments. File a PR and fix the issues and I'll look at getting it into post 4.0. Hey Alfred, what Perl program is he talking about? Which is a builtin for csh and tcsh (my shells). Or is he talking about some other 'which'? -Alfred To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message -------- Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: which(1), rewritten in C?
On Thu, 2 Mar 2000, Laurence Berland wrote: Which is also a perl script, which sh uses (since it's not a builtin there). It does the same thing as the which that's built in to bash and tcsh and csh Oh, then it does it dynamically? That must be why it's slow. OK, thanks. Chuck Robey wrote: On Thu, 2 Mar 2000, Alfred Perlstein wrote: * Dan Papasian [EMAIL PROTECTED] [000302 18:17] wrote: While this may sound crazy, I was tired of 'which' taking a long time to complete on my 486 dx4/100 when it was under extereme pressure, so I rewrote it in C :) ...snip NOTE: This version of which has exactly the same behavior. Also, the above test was not performed when the box was under load.. and on slower machines/under load, the differences are of course, more noticable. You may all go ahead and call me crazy now. ...I've got the fear of posting the source, but what the heck, getting nitpicked is good education :) http://bugg.strangled.net/which.c Any flames^Wthoughts? It doesn't seem to handle multiple arguments. File a PR and fix the issues and I'll look at getting it into post 4.0. Hey Alfred, what Perl program is he talking about? Which is a builtin for csh and tcsh (my shells). Or is he talking about some other 'which'? -Alfred To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message ---- Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message ---- Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: kdelibs port broken?
On Sun, 27 Feb 2000, Daniel O'Connor wrote: On 27-Feb-00 Chuck Robey wrote: fine example, tho. We break the location of the config files that all tcl packages rely upon to build, for the purpose of allowing folks to run multiple versions simultaneously. Tcl isn't the only one like that, either. Anyone who wants to be able to build other tcl software that isn't derived from a port would be well advised to avoid using our port. This is done because none of those programs/libs developed a system on their own which allowed multiple versions to be on the same machine OR made SURE that they where backward compatible.. Its not the ports collection thats at fault, the people who did it this way are cleaning up the mess made by other coders. This happens for tcl, gtk, qt.. There are quite a number. (at least 3! ;) Can I ask you, why could this not have been done through a system of symlinks and a little batch-file to switch them? Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: kdelibs port broken?
On Mon, 28 Feb 2000, Daniel O'Connor wrote: On 27-Feb-00 Chuck Robey wrote: This happens for tcl, gtk, qt.. There are quite a number. (at least 3! ;) Can I ask you, why could this not have been done through a system of symlinks and a little batch-file to switch them? How could you run multiple applications which use different versions of the same library? A lot of them have support files which are loaded by the library when ITs loaded by the app. You would end up with all sorts of nasty race conditions when people run multiple apps etc.. The config files that I would be controlling aren't used during program runtime, only during build. The stuff would link just as it is now, but you'd use a short "versioning" script to set up the config file symlinks, so that if you wanted to build a app that wasn't a FreeBSD port, it would find it's correct config file, right where it expects to find it. Some stuff, like tclsh, could have a default link, say from tclsh to tclsh8.2, or allow a user to set that. That could be a local option, but it's icing on the cake as far as I'm concerned. The only real thing I would be after is the ability to stick the config file locations in the places that the original developers (and the configuration scripts they build with) expect them to be. Anything done as far as executeable names, I don't really care too much about. -------- Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: freezing
On Thu, 17 Feb 2000, Joao Pedras wrote: eheh I mean dead frozen, like if I was watching at a screeshot of a X session ]:) I used to get this on a game, which was trying somehow to load a font that wasn't correct. I found it wasn't really frozen, though, because you *could* telnet in (very slow). Are you *really* sure it's frozen? Do you have a network connection you can test telnet or ping with, or maybe a serial terminal you could hook to it? Alfred Perlstein wrote: Do you mean dead frozen, as in needs a reboot? or frozen for a second or so? The first one I haven't seen recently, the second I have noticed. -Alfred ^\ /^ O O o00-(_)-00o-- Common sense is the collection of prejudices acquired by age eighteen. -- Albert Einstein - PGP key available upon request or may be cut at http://pedras.webvolution.net/pgpkey.html To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message -------- Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: FreeBSD RC-4.0 Issues
On Tue, 15 Feb 2000, Steve wrote: Steve steve Hi I Installed a fresh copy of RC-4.0 recently and here are a few more little things I noticed (these are 'straight out of the box' kind of errors): 1. While attempting to add in linux support: bash-2.03# make install === Installing for linux_base-6.1 === linux_base-6.1 depends on executable: rpm - not found ===Verifying install for rpm in /usr/ports/misc/rpm === Extracting for rpm-2.5.6 Checksum OK for rpm-2.5.6.tar.gz. === rpm-2.5.6 depends on executable: gmake - found === rpm-2.5.6 depends on executable: autoconf - found === rpm-2.5.6 depends on shared library: gdbm.2 - not found ===Verifying install for gdbm.2 in /usr/ports/databases/gdbm === Extracting for gdbm-1.8.0 Checksum OK for gdbm-1.8.0.tar.gz. === gdbm-1.8.0 depends on executable: libtool - not found ===Verifying install for libtool in /usr/ports/devel/libtool === Building for libtool-1.3.3 make: don't know how to make ./libtool.m4. Stop *** Error code 2 2. I installed netscape communicator 4.7 (not the USA one) and I get: bash-2.03# ./communicator-4.7 ld.so failed: Can't find shared library "libXt.so.6.0" That version of netscape seems to want the aout XFree86 stuff. I think a XFree86 binary distribution prepared for FreeBSD 2.X will fix you up nicely. I installed mine in /usr/X11R6/lib/aout. Don't forget to take care of ldconfig, because it makes a big difference when dealing with the old aout stuff. Hope that helps :) This is looking like a kick ass release. Steve To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message ---- Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: .gdbinit for kernel
On Fri, 11 Feb 2000, Greg Lehey wrote: On Thursday, 10 February 2000 at 23:28:14 -0500, Chuck Robey wrote: I was wondering if anyone had a .gdbinit that one could use, in remote debugging a kernel, that had a working kldstat in it? I found one in Greg's vinum directory, but it's a little broken here and there (although much of it does work). I want to invoke some of the ddb functions remotely, and be able to look at the module status. The .gdbinit.kernel in the vinum directory *should* work. If there's any problem with it, I'll try to fix it. What's the problem? When I try to do a kldstat, it tells me there's no file variable to set. It's too late now, I gotta go, but if you wait until I get home tomorrow, I'll give you the exact error. I'm doing remote debugging into another current box. I really appreciate the work you went to, to create that tool to begin with; it oughta be pointed to by some README, don't you think? Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: /usr/ports/ too big?
On Wed, 9 Feb 2000, Matthew Dillon wrote: : a target "overview" into each /usr/ports/*/Makefile to list all available : subdiretories. Then, with some other command, one could fetch the : current port's directory from the cvs server to install the port. : : Do these thoughts make any sense? : :Yes, this has been desired for some time, but without an actual :implementation we're kinda stuck. :) : :-Alfred It's a nice problem to have, I guess :-) I really like the idea of having a target overview. It would be utterly trivial to have a module list in the Makefile and to change the dependancies to run 'make modulename' in the parent directory rather then in the subdirectory (which might not exist). There's only one person who can make something like this happen. Flattening out the unecessarily deep ports directory structure would help, too. Probably, 98 percent of it could be done with a script, and it would greatly decrease cvsup time and space. -------- Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: ifconfig hang
On Sun, 6 Feb 2000, Bill Paul wrote: Of all the gin joints in all the towns in all the world, Chuck Robey had to walk into mine and say: I'm trying to get current up on another test box, Who's exact CPU type and hardware configuration must be a state secret, since you didn't describe them here. Come _on_ people, how often do I have to keep harping on this? Don't just tell me "I have a box." Tell me about it! OK, I'm pasting in the dmesg for this Pentium 120 box. Summarizing, it's a machine with no IDE drives, one NCR controller, one scsi main disk, one scsi cdrom, one vga card, and the CNET controller. Has 128M of RAM. I've been gazing at the mobo, but I can't yet spot who made it, at least not without taking it out and looking on the flip side. Intel processor, AMI bios. But. I don't honestly think it's your problem, Bill. I have the same card on my Alpha, solid as a rock, which is why I stuck the new CNET card to replace the noname NE2000 clone it started with. This was running a 5 year old BSDi, and now I'm trying to get current on it. It doesn't hang until *after* ifconfig has returned, maybe a second later. I have time to hit return a couple times, get a couple of new prompts back; the DDB trace seems to be from the shell. I've duplicated this about 10 times now with no variation, trying little config file changes. I'm trying not to have to hand-copy that darn stack trace; if you can't do without it, I guess I will have to make a null-modem cable and try remote debugging, I sure don't want to type all that stuff in. Outside of doing network stuff, the box seems very stable. I wonder if some module is being loaded that I am not aware of, and that's the source of the hang. If you guys don't trip to this, that's what I'll try next (remote debugging), so if you want, just don't respond, I'll have to get the soldering iron out and make the cable next. == the dmesg === Copyright (c) 1992-2000 The FreeBSD Project. Copyright (c) 1982, 1986, 1989, 1991, 1993 The Regents of the University of California. All rights reserved. FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT #0: Tue Feb 1 00:44:19 EST 2000 [EMAIL PROTECTED]:/usr/src/sys/compile/OEARTH Timecounter "i8254" frequency 1193182 Hz Timecounter "TSC" frequency 12541 Hz CPU: Pentium/P54C (120.00-MHz 586-class CPU) Origin = "GenuineIntel" Id = 0x525 Stepping = 5 Features=0x1bfFPU,VME,DE,PSE,TSC,MSR,MCE,CX8 real memory = 134217728 (131072K bytes) avail memory = 126976000 (124000K bytes) Preloaded elf kernel "kernel" at 0xc02e7000. Intel Pentium detected, installing workaround for F00F bug md0: Malloc disk npx0: math processor on motherboard npx0: INT 16 interface pcib0: Host to PCI bridge on motherboard pci0: PCI bus on pcib0 isab0: Intel 82371FB PCI to ISA bridge at device 7.0 on pci0 isa0: ISA bus on isab0 ata-pci0: Intel PIIX ATA controller port 0x3000-0x300f at device 7.1 on pci0 sym0: 825a port 0x6000-0x60ff mem 0xf020-0xf0200fff,0xf0202000-0xf02020ff irq 15 at device 18.0 on pci0 sym0: No NVRAM, ID 7, Fast-10, SE, parity checking dc0: ASIX AX88140A 10/100BaseTX port 0x6100-0x617f mem 0xf0201000-0xf020107f irq 12 at device 19.0 on pci0 dc0: Ethernet address: 00:80:ad:41:4a:95 miibus0: MII bus on dc0 amphy0: Am79C873 10/100 media interface on miibus0 amphy0: 10baseT, 10baseT-FDX, 100baseTX, 100baseTX-FDX, auto vga-pci0: ARK Logic 1000PV SVGA controller mem 0xf000-0xf01f at device 20.0 on pci0 fdc0: NEC 72065B or clone at port 0x3f0-0x3f5,0x3f7 irq 6 drq 2 on isa0 fdc0: FIFO enabled, 8 bytes threshold fd0: 1440-KB 3.5" drive on fdc0 drive 0 atkbdc0: keyboard controller (i8042) at port 0x60-0x6f on isa0 atkbd0: AT Keyboard irq 1 on atkbdc0 vga0: Generic ISA VGA at port 0x3c0-0x3df iomem 0xa-0xb on isa0 sc0: System console on isa0 sc0: VGA 16 virtual consoles, flags=0x200 sio0 at port 0x3f8-0x3ff irq 4 flags 0x10 on isa0 sio0: type 16550A sio1 at port 0x2f8-0x2ff irq 3 on isa0 sio1: type 16550A ppc0: Parallel port at port 0x378-0x37f irq 7 on isa0 ppc0: SMC-like chipset (ECP/EPP/PS2/NIBBLE) in COMPATIBLE mode ppi0: Parallel I/O on ppbus0 lpt0: Printer on ppbus0 lpt0: Interrupt-driven port plip0: PLIP network interface on ppbus0 Waiting 15 seconds for SCSI devices to settle Mounting root from ufs:da0s1a cd0 at sym0 bus 0 target 2 lun 0 cd0: SANYO CRD-254S 1.02 Removable CD-ROM SCSI-2 device cd0: 3.300MB/s transfers cd0: cd present [319360 x 2048 byte records] da0 at sym0 bus 0 target 0 lun 0 da0: SEAGATE ST15230N 0298 Fixed Direct Access SCSI-2 device da0: 10.000MB/s transfers (10.000MHz, offset 8), Tagged Queueing Enabled da0: 4095MB (8386733 512 byte sectors: 255H 63S/T 522C) -------- Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal pr
Re: UPDATING - kernel fails to compile
On Sun, 6 Feb 2000, Dan Langille wrote: After a make -k -DNOFSCHG installworld and a make installworld, I'm getting this: install -c -s -o root -g wheel -m 555 genassym /usr/bin install: genassym: No such file or directory *** Error code 71 It's a do-once type of thing, like the xinstall stuff. Go install genassym once, it won't bother you again. It was discussed in the lists, and doesn't affect most build intervals. You got *lucky*. Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: UPDATING - kernel fails to compile
On Sun, 6 Feb 2000, Dan Langille wrote: It's a do-once type of thing, like the xinstall stuff. Go install genassym once, it won't bother you again. It was discussed in the lists, and doesn't affect most build intervals. You got *lucky*. Ahh yes, and it's in UPDATING. my bad. Sorry. I tried that. Then did a make installworld. Then I found that conifig wasn't installed either. so I did a That's ALWAYS true. ALWAYS when building a kernel, make very sure that your config is from the same sources as the kernel. *very* often with current, config changes things, and an old config just won't cut it. That kind of thing doesn't belong in UPDATING, either. I think it's already in the handbook, and an up-to-date config will notice for you when your kernel sources are newer than your config sources, and issue you a warning. Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
ifconfig hang
I'm trying to get current up on another test box, and this one has a CNET AX8814 equipped network card. One second after I do a ifconfig: ifconfig dc0 inet (somaddr) netmask (somemask) it hangs. It does this with a completely static kernel (shouldn't be loading any modules), even if I start up in single-user. My config has: device isa device eisa device pci device miibus # MII bus support device dc0 as far as network. My dmesg on the machine shows what I take to be a normal dc0 entry, but something I don't recognize for "amphy0" (I added cariage returns 'cause I know my mailer will do a worse job if I don't): dc0: ASIX AX88140A 10/100BaseTX port 0x6100-0x617f mem 0xf0201000-0xf020107f irq 12 at device 19.0 on pci0 dc0: Ethernet address: 00:80:ad:41:4a:95 miibus0: MII bus on dc0 amphy0: Am79C873 10/100 media interface on miibus0 amphy0: 10baseT, 10baseT-FDX, 100baseTX, 100baseTX-FDX, auto Any idea why my hang might be happening? -------- Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: UPDATING
On Wed, 2 Feb 2000, Max Khon wrote: hi, there! On Tue, 1 Feb 2000, Warner Losh wrote: In message [EMAIL PROTECTED] Max Khon writes: : actually xinstall cannot be built before make world or make buildworld : because of undefined symbols `setflags'. What's the right thing then? make buildworld; cd /usr/src/usr.bin/xinstall; make depend all install and then, make installworld Nope. If buildworld completed right, then only need the make install in xinstall. xinstall will already be built. /fjoe To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message -------- Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: More world breakage
On Sun, 30 Jan 2000, Brian Somers wrote: I'm quite happy to DTRT(tm); I'm unsure that backing this change out _is_ the right thing however. Can we discuss it some more first please? I think that getflags()/setflags() should stay where they are, but I can't comment on the namespace pollution issue. If/When the functions are renamed, they'll probably break make world again (because the new libc and old install will be there for a while), but to be honest, this *is* current. I think the issue to focus on is the function names. I agree that folks should read current, and be able to do fixes. Do the fix, though, in a way that *doesn't* require yet another fix later on, and post the extraordinary steps clearly here, in a "HEADS-UP" mail that folks will definitely see, and maybe stick something in UPDATING too? At least, give everyone a fair chance, don't embed the fix as the end of a 1,000 words of context email, at the end of a long thread. That wouldn't be fair. Not for extraordinary breakage. -------- Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: Printer fiascos.
On Sun, 30 Jan 2000, David Gilbert wrote: "Sean" == Sean O'Connell [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Sean On 2000 Jan 29, David Gilbert opined: "Sean" == Sean O'Connell [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Sean lptcontrol -p I will try this. It still seems that there's a misfeature that it just doesn't work by default. Sean Yep. It is odd that it completely locks your box waiting for Sean paper. I have seen other printers which end up printing garbage Sean after this but never a locked box. And notice it's not for everyone. I don't know why yours locks up and mine doesn't, but my printer, in the last month, has begun to occaisonally fail to pick up a sheet of paper. It stops the print, but nothing worse than that. I haven't really investigated it, and for me, since I don't see your problem, the fix is a couple of suitably applied alcohol wipes, probably. What I'm saying is, don't start trying to over-generalize your problem. It'll make it harder for you to find, and give FreeBSD an unnecessarily bad rep over that. BTW, that lptcontrol -p means you have something wrong with your parallel interface, because it's not responding to interrupts. This often means you have some IO card you forgot (like a sound card) sitting unbeknownst to you on IRQ 7, messing up the printer. The -p means it just polls the printer to pass in new characters, instead of reacting by interrupt. If the -p thing works for you, I would go looking at hardware, myself. Sheesh. This is a FreeBSD-questions type thing, not current. That's a different problem... That problem has something to do with flow control... and I've had that happen, too. Dave. ---- Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
cvsup8
What happened, it fell off the edge of the earth? Nslookup can't find it anymore. Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: cvsup8
On Wed, 26 Jan 2000, Matthew Hunt wrote: On Wed, Jan 26, 2000 at 01:38:44PM -0500, Chuck Robey wrote: What happened, it fell off the edge of the earth? Nslookup can't find it anymore. I seem to recall an announcement from John yesterday or so, saying that it was going to fall off the edge of the earth temporarily. Yeah, now I remember, thanks guys. I'd thought that huge cvsup thread was about 8 coming on line, not going off. Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: [ID 20000124.004] perl in malloc(): warning: recursive callon
On Mon, 24 Jan 2000, Lars Eggert wrote: Ilya, thanks for the quick response. Signals and Perl do not mix. Please do not use signals if a segfault is not a desirable form of output. Never? After reading perlipc I was under the impression that using signals was okay if you keep your handlers simple. I may have to use to another form of IPC if signals cannot be made safe. Our malloc can't be used in a signal handler. Lars Lars Eggert [EMAIL PROTECTED] Information Sciences Institute http://www.isi.edu/~larse/ University of Southern California To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message -------- Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: [ID 20000124.004] perl in malloc(): warning: recursive callon
On Tue, 25 Jan 2000, Ilya Zakharevich wrote: On Tue, Jan 25, 2000 at 02:44:05PM -0500, Chuck Robey wrote: On Mon, 24 Jan 2000, Lars Eggert wrote: Ilya, thanks for the quick response. Signals and Perl do not mix. Please do not use signals if a segfault is not a desirable form of output. Never? After reading perlipc I was under the impression that using signals was okay if you keep your handlers simple. I may have to use to another form of IPC if signals cannot be made safe. Our malloc can't be used in a signal handler. One can write a signal handler in such a way that no mallocs are going to be called (see my example). But this would not help: segfaults will happen anyway. Do you know for a fact that perl, in the signal handler code, is not calling malloc? Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: Please help spread the CVSup mirror load more evenly
On Mon, 24 Jan 2000, Warner Losh wrote: Agreed. The making lots of connections was a bad idea. However, I've rarely seen low latency and low bandwidth go together. I've also problems connecting accross high loss links more often. Sure, it is a statistical argument. I still think that the n connections wouldn't be that expensive. The cost, iirc, of a connection that drops is very low. I can certainly see enough problems with it to encourage jdp to not implement it, despite being the person that proposed it... That's the precise reason I suggested a system that used no probing, had feedback, and forced shared load in spite of user misconfiguration. Got shouted down. Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: Please help spread the CVSup mirror load more evenly
On Mon, 24 Jan 2000, Warner Losh wrote:
In message [EMAIL PROTECTED] Chuck Robey
writes:
: That's the precise reason I suggested a system that used no probing, had
: feedback, and forced shared load in spite of user misconfiguration. Got
: shouted down.
One reason I think that you've been shouted down (and me too, since I
had similar ideas) is that people in the past have had problems with
different cvsup servers being at different points in time and have
been screwed to som eextent or another by this time skew.
Oh. If that's a problem, it would be a fatal problem (would be for me,
sometimes).
There is a large resistance to automatically switching cvsup servers.
It is my perception that the cvsup servers are much better now than
they were even 6 months ago (well, cvsup{1,2} do seem to be much more
heavily used than 6,7,8).
Warner
Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing.
New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up
fictitious words in the dictionary.
To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: Please help spread the CVSup mirror load more evenly
On Mon, 24 Jan 2000, Warner Losh wrote: In message [EMAIL PROTECTED] Chuck Robey writes: : Oh. If that's a problem, it would be a fatal problem (would be for me, : sometimes). It used to be a big problem. When cvsup was first getting mirrors, some seemed to update every 15 minutes, while others updated what seemed like every two days. A big part of the problem was contention at the main cvsup server. Since cvsup has gone to cvsup-master this problem has all but disappeared. The mirrors all have good connectivity and can get updates on a timely basis. [some deletions] For people updating 2x a day or less often, I doubt that switching between responding cvsup servers would cause great pain, or any effects at all. It is a hard problem to get right all the time Well, I really hate the idea of lots of network pinging, both because it's not reliable for network probing, not reliable for machine load probing, and causes more congestion, so I wanted a way to force loadsharing, one that allowed some feedback so that real backups could be adjusted to. OTOH, there's no way I will try to fight folks with elephantine memories. I even began looking at Modula-3, seeing if I could offer a diff set to jdp. You know what I realized, and (for some reason) no one in my memory has ever written: modula-3, in features, looks a lot like Java. It's not a stylistic descendant of C like Java is, but featurewise, it is. Warner Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: Possible CTM problem
On Tue, 25 Jan 2000, Peter Jeremy wrote: Looking at my CTM logs, I seem to be missing some pieces in the last 3 cvs-cur postings (cvs-cur 6021, 6022, 6023). I get two pieces simultaneously and then nothing until the next part. Is anyone else seeing this? Chuck isn't sure if it's anything he's done. Looking back, the `first two pieces simultaneously' seems to be the normal behaviour, but I'd expect to see the 3rd piece 30-60 minutes later, followed by successive parts every hour. The last delta with more than 3 parts was cvs-cur.5999 (arrived 18 Jan), so the problem (if there is one) has occurred since then. If you need to, you can fetch them via ftp. Like I said, I was generating a large amount of extra (very small) deltas while I was testing the upgrade to allow PGP signing, I didn't think I'd caused any lossage, but it's *possible*. I announced on the ctm-announce list that I would be generating those extra deltas. Anyhow, all the testing is over, I'm just waiting on some admin stuff before I start sending the CTM pieces (of deltas, the pieces are the mailed version of the binary gzipped deltas) out. Probably be tomorrow or the next day. Peter To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message -------- Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: bzip2 in src tree (Was Re: ports/16252: bsd.port.mk: Add bzip2support for distribution patches)
On Sun, 23 Jan 2000, Juergen Lock wrote: In article [EMAIL PROTECTED] you write: ... A case would have to be built that bzip2 does something critical that cannot be done without bzip2. Else, it stays as a fine port. Heck, emacs is a fine port too, but it'll never get into the base system. Very true, but i can actually think of one thing were bzip2 would really be useful: to better compress the kernel on install floppies so you could keep more things in it. (like ptys and pass which would make fixit more useful, or pppoe which was thrown out too recently if i'm not mistaken.) Btw you could probably also kgzip the loader, that would free up some space too. Juergen Lock: It's Better! Chuck: Better doesn't count, only need, functionality and compatibility. Juergen Lock: It's Better! How come I get the feeling that you didn't read the post? Regards, Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: bzip2 in src tree (Was Re: ports/16252: bsd.port.mk: Add bzip2 support for distribution patches)
On Sun, 23 Jan 2000, David O'Brien wrote: On Sun, Jan 23, 2000 at 10:26:48AM +0100, Oliver Fromme wrote: Saving 10% or 20% on disk space is not worth wasting = 10 times more CPU time than gzip. Disk space is cheap nowadays, but upgrading to a CPU that is 10 times faster is not. And just how do I increase the space on a CDROM??? Go look how many port distribution files on your last CDROM set were in bzip2 format -- there is a reason for that. David, no one is arguing if bzip2 is or is not a good tool, nor are they arguing if it's good for ports. The answer to both those arguments is very obviously "yes". The argument was whether, currently, bzip2 should be placed in the source tree for the base system. We *don't* need two compressors, and (again currently) gzip is overwhelmingly more popular at ftp sites than bzip2. Furthermore bzip2 has drawbacks for running on the core system, most especially for small ones. I don't need to go over those, you already know them. Lifting those restrictions is not necessary for the base system, seeing as it would have fatal drawbacks for small systems which would see no help from bzip2 (small systems don't have ports). It is a very good thing to have bzip2 on your system, but it's *not* a requirement. Like I said before, most of the same arguments apply to, say, emacs. You'd have to be nuts (if you ran a good sized system) not to have bzip2, but it's just not a requirement. Having a compressor at all is the requirement, and gzip currently is better for that. Ask me again in 18 months, maybe bzip2 will use less memory and be faster, and it's quite likely that it will be far more popular at ftp sites. -------- Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: bzip2 in src tree (Was Re: ports/16252: bsd.port.mk: Add bzip2support for distribution patches)
On Sun, 23 Jan 2000, Alex Zepeda wrote: On Sun, 23 Jan 2000, Chuck Robey wrote: Ask me again in 18 months, maybe bzip2 will use less memory and be faster, and it's quite likely that it will be far more popular at ftp sites. Have you looked at the memory usage when you use the -s flag? No, I said ask me again in 18 months, not NOW. Even if it didn't have the memory problem, gzip has greater compatibility and does the minimum job. It's not required for the base system. It's stupid not to have it in a larger system, but *that's the reason for ports*. Ports are optional, right? - alex Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: bzip2 in src tree (Was Re: ports/16252: bsd.port.mk: Add bzip2support for distribution patches)
On Sat, 22 Jan 2000, Will Andrews wrote: On Sun, Jan 23, 2000 at 12:44:46AM +0900, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Truely, I wish to import bzip2 to -current src tree. :) Is there a problem about some restriction for distributing bzip2? # I'm sorry I don't know about that. 2 5003-0 (00-01-22 12:27:37) [will@shadow /usr/ports/archivers/bzip2]% cat pkg/DESCR This is bzip2, a advanced block-sorting file compressor. It is believed to be free from any patents. WWW: http://sourceware.cygnus.com/bzip2/ Nope - looks like it could be a candidate for importing to the source tree. However, I'm not sure everyone on current@ is going to agree, since we already have something for compression (gzip) that is pretty standard around the world. You guys better understand, having software be legally *able* to be in the source tree is a *very* far way from needing it in the source tree. A very strong case would have to be built that we cannot really do without it. Seeing as gzip fills the requirement with undeniably maximum compatibility, the mere fact that bzip2 compresses smaller doesn't sound like a good reason in of and itself. We would not be able to get rid of gzip anyhow (for compatibility reasons) so we'd end up having to have two tools where one does the job well enough now. A case would have to be built that bzip2 does something critical that cannot be done without bzip2. Else, it stays as a fine port. Heck, emacs is a fine port too, but it'll never get into the base system. Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: Please help spread the CVSup mirror load more evenly
On Fri, 21 Jan 2000, Warner Losh wrote: In message [EMAIL PROTECTED] Chuck Robey writes: : I would think using a fixed order would be a really bad thing, causing : overload of the first server in line. Did I misunderstand you? How about : doing a script (say in perl, it has random numbers) that randomly picks : the server from a list? That way, the list could even be weighted, so as : to allow for greater or lesser machine resources (like net access). That's one of the things I have to fix up. This script is good for me, but bad for everyone. Enhancements like this would be a good thing. Got time? I don't know perl. Darn. Yes, I will learn perl. Now. Warner Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: Please help spread the CVSup mirror load more evenly
On Fri, 21 Jan 2000, Warner Losh wrote: In message [EMAIL PROTECTED] John Polstra writes: : Can you make cvsup accept multiple servers to try in it's configuration : file? : : I'll add that to the to-do list. I have a very crude script that does its own (fixed) round robin of multiple servers. It tries three times fast (yes, I know that's likely bad) and then goes to the next one on the list. If all else fails, it will try the first one on the list in "forever" mode (with the nice random retries). I'll have to see about puitting into good shape and posting it. I would think using a fixed order would be a really bad thing, causing overload of the first server in line. Did I misunderstand you? How about doing a script (say in perl, it has random numbers) that randomly picks the server from a list? That way, the list could even be weighted, so as to allow for greater or lesser machine resources (like net access). -------- Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: when is FreeBSD-4.0 up for release ?
On Fri, 21 Jan 2000, Will Andrews wrote: On Fri, Jan 21, 2000 at 03:33:19PM -0800, David O'Brien wrote: What do you mean? JKH said there would be a Feature Freeze on Jan 15 and it happened. What more did JKH need to say on the topic? I lost some mail from early this week, but I didn't get anything from Jordan saying the FF was in effect. He said it would be in effect January 15th - not necessarily that it went into effect. Perhaps I'm just twisting words a little bit. You really must not have been listening, Will. Jordan did everything *including* falling down laughing at about 3-4 different sets of folks who misinterpreted feature freeze to mean code freeze. I could understand, somewhat, you making that mistake, but missing the fact of the feature freeze itself? I think it was David O'Brien, in fact, who posted it here in 2 inch high letters! No kidding. You must have been hitting the delete key too fast, on several different days. Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: Please help spread the CVSup mirror load more evenly
On Fri, 21 Jan 2000, David O'Brien wrote: On Fri, Jan 21, 2000 at 07:03:51PM -0500, Chuck Robey wrote: I don't know ... I think it might be a good idea for the cvsup client to make a connection to a cvsup master, get redirected from that master to the actual handler of the connection, and then work. That way, a config file on the master could be set up to know the capabilities of the other machines (network availability, machine speed, etc) and dole out connections weighted on that. How is a cvsup master to know anything about the path from me to any given cvsup mirror? Knowing something about the path from me to the master and the path from the master to the mirror tells zero about the path from me to the mirror. Being on an .EDU network, I have a *very* different path to other .EDU machine participating in Inetnet2. My path to cvsup3 is a prime example. This "cvsup master" will have no idea about this. I guess it means, is the main component trying to be balanced the server resources or the network resources. I may be wrong, but I think that the server resources are more likely to be the most important bottleneck, and this method detects that, with minimal network effects. If you think that it's really the network that's going to be the bottleneck, then you wouldn't want to use this method. I don't think I'm wrong, but I'm willing to listen to arguments on it. -------- Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, FreeBSD, [EMAIL PROTECTED] | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
breakage
Sure would be nice if some folks would start testing before committing. I'm starting to wonder how long it'll be before it builds again. I understand screwups (god know I better!) but if you don't test before commit, that's taking things a step too far. Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, New Year's Resolution: I | electronics, communications, and will not sphroxify gullible| signal processing. people into looking up | I run picnic.mat.net: FreeBSD-current(i386) and fictitious words in the| jaunt.mat.net : FreeBSD-current(Alpha)| dictionary.| To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: Feature test for OpenSSL + RSA
On Mon, 17 Jan 2000, Kris Kennaway wrote:
No, you meant ${RM}
I couldn't find this defined in /usr/share/mk/* - it's only in
bsd.port.mk, AFAICT.
I'm note sure mine's up to date, where the definition is on line 876 of
bsd.port.mk ... but I'm *sure* it's in there, it has been for ages!
Kris
"How many roads must a man walk down, before you call him a man?"
"Eight!"
"That was a rhetorical question!"
"Oh..then, seven!" -- Homer Simpson
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--------
Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming,
New Year's Resolution: I | electronics, communications, and
will not sphroxify gullible| signal processing.
people into looking up | I run picnic.mat.net: FreeBSD-current(i386) and
fictitious words in the| jaunt.mat.net : FreeBSD-current(Alpha)|
dictionary.|
To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Re: Feature test for OpenSSL + RSA
On Mon, 17 Jan 2000, Kris Kennaway wrote:
On Tue, 18 Jan 2000, Chuck Robey wrote:
No, you meant ${RM}
I couldn't find this defined in /usr/share/mk/* - it's only in
bsd.port.mk, AFAICT.
I'm note sure mine's up to date, where the definition is on line 876 of
bsd.port.mk ... but I'm *sure* it's in there, it has been for ages!
Reread the above. I know it's in bsd.port.mk, but that doesn't help me
when I'm building in /usr/src/secure/lib/libcrypto ;-)
Oops. Damn.
Kris
"How many roads must a man walk down, before you call him a man?"
"Eight!"
"That was a rhetorical question!"
"Oh..then, seven!" -- Homer Simpson
----
Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming,
New Year's Resolution: I | electronics, communications, and
will not sphroxify gullible| signal processing.
people into looking up | I run picnic.mat.net: FreeBSD-current(i386) and
fictitious words in the| jaunt.mat.net : FreeBSD-current(Alpha)|
dictionary.|
To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: i want to join the mailing list.!
On Tue, 11 Jan 2000, °í¹ü¼® wrote: how do i.? :) http://www.freebsd.org/support.html#mailing-list Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, New Year's Resolution: I | electronics, communications, and will not sphroxify gullible| signal processing. people into looking up | I run picnic.mat.net: FreeBSD-current(i386) and fictitious words in the| jaunt.mat.net : FreeBSD-current(Alpha)| dictionary.| To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: No cvs-cur CTM deltas
On Tue, 4 Jan 2000, Peter Jeremy wrote: The last cvs-cur CTM delta I received was cvs-cur.5961, which arrived just over 24 hours ago. Is there a problem with the CTM generation? Fixed that problem (security thing) found another. Still working on it. Peter Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, New Year's Resolution: I | electronics, communications, and will not sphroxify gullible| signal processing. people into looking up | I run picnic.mat.net: FreeBSD-current(i386) and fictitious words in the| jaunt.mat.net : FreeBSD-current(Alpha)| dictionary.| To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: xntpd - VERY old folks, how about updating? :-)
On Sun, 2 Jan 2000, Karl Denninger wrote: If you intend to keep up this "sour grapes" attitude, despite all the helpful answers you have gotten so far, you should consider stopping before you have worn out your welcome. -- Poul-Henning Kamp FreeBSD coreteam member profanity censored Yes, the "F-word". You have no ability to determine "my welcome". Karl, you've now managed to irritate a lot of folks. Jumping on Steve, who is normally a huge worker, and totally inoffensive, was really pushing things, but then jumping on Poul, who is somewhat easier to touch off, well, you have been just about advertising "I want a fight!", although no one's really given you much reason for it. Poul's response was right, you should come back in a few days, when you've had time to cool off. No one else really wants to keep the fight going. ---- Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, New Year's Resolution: I | electronics, communications, and will not sphroxify gullible| signal processing. people into looking up | I run picnic.mat.net: FreeBSD-current(i386) and fictitious words in the| jaunt.mat.net : FreeBSD-current(Alpha)| dictionary.| To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Karl's day off
OK, enough of this, let Karl be on his own for a while. Stop responding, Karl's too mad to think clearly, and you guys are just baiting him. Anyone responding is asking for addition to the kill-file. I already posted this to ports, where the other part of this has unfortunately spilled into. I won't post again. Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, New Year's Resolution: I | electronics, communications, and will not sphroxify gullible| signal processing. people into looking up | I run picnic.mat.net: FreeBSD-current(i386) and fictitious words in the| jaunt.mat.net : FreeBSD-current(Alpha)| dictionary.| To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: Your misleading, no, LYING message to me
On Sun, 2 Jan 2000, Amancio Hasty wrote: I have to say that PHK has become the MASTER at pissing people off, ensuring that his opponent goes the deep end and staying calm so the blame obviously does not fall on him. Got to admit his formula is very very nice 8) By a long shot the problem is NOT Karl. It takes at least TWO to engage in a combatitive conflict -- that is if you are not schizophreniac. The proper tactic to resolve the conflict should have been to wait a cool off period and then slug it off technically. Nevertheless, instead of waiting for Karl to cool off and attempt to ration with him , it was much easier to drive him further down: hence thru censorship the "technical" argument was won with virtually no technical effort at all -- Like I said earlier very very nice tactic ! Amancio, you are making assumptions, ones that are completely incorrect here. Karl's frothing started with a lot of raging at Steve on the ports list, and at the entire structure of ports. Poul didn't get into it until quite a bit later, and it was Karl who went after Poul, not vice versa. Poul reacted to someone accusing him of a complete lack of integrity (with no more evidence than McCarthy had in the 50's) merely by asking him to step back a little ways before he really annoyed folks. I wonder if I would react as well? What's more, while you're right that Poul's sometimes been abrasive in the past, his behaviour has been so above reproach here that I felt it necessary to jump in, just to highlight the fact, and maybe to avoid having people jump at the assumption you made (I referenced that directly in my post). I've never met Poul personally, but I *have* met Jonathan Bresler. That last post of Karl's, well, if that doesn't categorize him in your eyes, then I guess nothing will. Believe me, Amancio, Jonathan didn't deserve that. I think everyone really should let this darn thread die -------- Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, New Year's Resolution: I | electronics, communications, and will not sphroxify gullible| signal processing. people into looking up | I run picnic.mat.net: FreeBSD-current(i386) and fictitious words in the| jaunt.mat.net : FreeBSD-current(Alpha)| dictionary.| To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
The mails from dev-null
On Sun, 2 Jan 2000 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Congratulations, Karl. You just proven to the world what a complete asshole you really are. Now get out of here. We don't want you. Will whoever this is, please stop? There is no valid reason for anonymity here (and to be honest, in this situation, it rather strikes me as cowardly) and we don't need the sentiments, because you're only going to provoke this further. Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, New Year's Resolution: I | electronics, communications, and will not sphroxify gullible| signal processing. people into looking up | I run picnic.mat.net: FreeBSD-current(i386) and fictitious words in the| jaunt.mat.net : FreeBSD-current(Alpha)| dictionary.| To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: Your misleading, no LYING message to me
On Sun, 2 Jan 2000, Matthew Dillon wrote: -- enters stage right ... opens door ... heyy a party! And nobody invited me! U, Why's the piano broken in two and all the tables overturned? Ahhh, whats with all the stares? guys? Guys! exits stage left (at a run) -- -Matt Aww, you missed it! We had a broken bottle with your name on it! :-) Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, New Year's Resolution: I | electronics, communications, and will not sphroxify gullible| signal processing. people into looking up | I run picnic.mat.net: FreeBSD-current(i386) and fictitious words in the| jaunt.mat.net : FreeBSD-current(Alpha)| dictionary.| To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
multiple cd devices
I've been doing a lot of neatening up here, and one of the tasks was to get both of the cdrom drives I have (one per machine) moved over so that they are on the same machine. This was so I can use the one that's a writer in conjuntion with a reader, and do duplication. Anyhow, getting the kernel to recognize cd1 was no problem, but getting /dev/MAKEDEV to do that was a hairy PITA. I couldn't locate, in either cd(4) or cd(9), the information on the maj/min numbers, so that I could just do the mknod's manually, and MAKEDEV would simply do nothing if I entered './MAKEDEV cd1'. After *much* screwing about, in desperation (trying wierd combinations) I did a './MAKEDEV cd2', and *that* made my cd1 devices (not the cd2 ones, but I didn't have a cd2, I didn't care). This sounds pretty wrong, I think MAKEDEV is busted for this, right? And, if you don't want to have the actual maj/min numbers for the cd devices in the man pages (because you want Unix unfriendly), well, shouldn't there be a pointer to a include file that would be up to date with that info, so at least the info is available somehow? BTW, all the other MAKEDEV combinations, like cd*, cd1*, cd1a, etc, all failed noisily, like: ROOT:/dev:113 sh MAKEDEV cd1a [: 1a: bad number [: 1a: bad number Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, New Year's Resolution: I | electronics, communications, and will not sphroxify gullible| signal processing. people into looking up | I run picnic.mat.net: FreeBSD-current(i386) and fictitious words in the| jaunt.mat.net : FreeBSD-current(Alpha)| dictionary.| To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: multiple cd devices
On Fri, 31 Dec 1999, Brian Fundakowski Feldman wrote: The way certain devices, like cd with its monotonically increasing counter where devices are probed in order and assigned device based on precedence and not hardwiring/controller connection, work is consistent between the kernel and MAKEDEV. If you have 2 cd devices, you have cd0 and cd1, so MAKEDEV accepts "cd2" for "two cd devices". All CD devices work that way. Disks don't, because there is potential for hard-wiring there, and will often be gaps. Why are "certain" devices wildly different than all other ones? I've never encountered that kind of syntax before, and I can't see that it's documented anywhere at all. Certainly, MAKEDEV itself (in it's comments) treats cd* just like all the others, specifying that the number following is a unit number, and *not* a quantity. I don't know when this happened, but it's surely not obvious. Not one word in the handbook, either. In fact, according to cd(4), you *can* specify the unit number: ... Prior to FreeBSD 2.1, the first device found will be attached as cd0 the next, cd1, etc. Beginning in FreeBSD 2.1 it is possible to specify what cd unit a device should come on line as; refer to scsi(4) for details on kernel configura- tion. That makes this odd setup even odder. Can't understand why this was done. -------- Chuck Robey| Interests include C Java programming, New Year's Resolution: I | electronics, communications, and will not sphroxify gullible| signal processing. people into looking up | I run picnic.mat.net: FreeBSD-current(i386) and fictitious words in the| jaunt.mat.net : FreeBSD-current(Alpha)| dictionary.| To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: linux /proc and vmware.
On Thu, 16 Dec 1999, Andrew Gallatin wrote: Julian Elischer writes: might I suggest that we make a decision to allow procfs to be mounted with a -linux flag and act more like the linux programs expect.? (particularly we could mount it at /compat/linux/proc with the -linux flag). That would be wonderful. I'd also like to see us have enough information in /proc to be able to divorce ps friends from libkvm. It would be nice to be able to have most tools continue to work if you have mismatched kernels userlands. I thought the work was going in precisely the opposite way, so that jail could work without any visibility to /proc. Chuck Robey| Interests include C programming, Electronics, 213 Lakeside Dr. Apt. T-1 | communications, and signal processing. Greenbelt, MD 20770| I run picnic.mat.net: FreeBSD-current(i386) and (301) 220-2114 | jaunt.mat.net : FreeBSD-current(Alpha) To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: why 'The legacy aout build' was removed from current ?
On Fri, 10 Dec 1999, Daniel C. Sobral wrote: What Motoyuki-san is complaining about is that applications that depend on a.out libraries will suffer. Alas, I don't think that's the case, since all these libraries are (or ought to be, anyway) in compat. Looking at copious examples from real life, forcing 3rd party developers to upgrade is a good way to lose 3rd party developers. It just *sounds* like a good way to go. As long as this is a change for building world, and not making changes to the kern/imgact things (so we keep on executing aout binaries) then this is probably the best way to go. OTOH, going the other way around is the reason why we (users) had to deal with things like 1 Mb RAM and 64 Kb segments in the age of 486s, one generation after the introduction of the 80386. As a free operating system supported by volunteer effort, we are interested in driving the hardware to it's limits instead of being limited by the ways we once did things. Absolutely, but (here's the caveat) if it *doesn't* hold up any new development, and there's a significant base of users actually deriving benefit from it, then I wouldn't agree. I'm kinda binary about that test, because I fully agree that, if it holds up technology in a project like ours, it's out the door! Stopping the new aout world builds doesn't injure users of aout software, it only *really* strongly discourages new development in aout. I think it just needed to be emphasized that the aout imgact stuff isn't being tossed, so aout executables will still work (those that aren't otherwise incompatible). Chuck Robey| Interests include C programming, Electronics, 213 Lakeside Dr. Apt. T-1 | communications, and signal processing. Greenbelt, MD 20770| I run picnic.mat.net: FreeBSD-current(i386) and (301) 220-2114 | jaunt.mat.net : FreeBSD-current(Alpha) To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: why 'The legacy aout build' was removed from current ?
On Thu, 9 Dec 1999, Daniel C. Sobral wrote: Motoyuki Konno wrote: I think we don't need "a.out world" any more, but a.out support (a.out lib/shared lib, etc.) is still needed. Some commercial programs such as Netscape are in a.out only, so we still have to make a.out binaries. Please see Netscape plugin port (ports/www/flashplugin) to find out why we still have to need a.out support. Current is not a general use platform. And if we want them (third party) to support FreeBSD-elf by the time 4.x becomes -stable, we better lock them out of it *now*. The main reason for removing the legacy support is forcing people to switch. This isn't taking the execution of aout binaries out, just stopping a world build. This is only going to stop 3rd party developers from making a 4.0 aout platform to create *more* aout binaries. They'll probably hang on for dear life on 2.2, just as long as they can. Looking at copious examples from real life, forcing 3rd party developers to upgrade is a good way to lose 3rd party developers. It just *sounds* like a good way to go. As long as this is a change for building world, and not making changes to the kern/imgact things (so we keep on executing aout binaries) then this is probably the best way to go. -------- Chuck Robey| Interests include C programming, Electronics, 213 Lakeside Dr. Apt. T-1 | communications, and signal processing. Greenbelt, MD 20770| I run picnic.mat.net: FreeBSD-current(i386) and (301) 220-2114 | jaunt.mat.net : FreeBSD-current(Alpha) To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: Mount problems after lockup
On Sun, 5 Dec 1999, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: It is really a good idea to read the current mailing list if you run current on your machine. copy MAKEDEV from src/etc/MAKEDEV to /dev, and run it to recreate your disk devices. Poul-Henning Excuse me, Poul, I have to switch back and forth for a day on one machine, can I run MAKEDEV to prepare for the new devs without ruining the system for a kernel that's about 4 months old? [No, it's not my machine, I run current -- real current]. Chuck Robey| Interests include C programming, Electronics, 213 Lakeside Dr. Apt. T-1 | communications, and signal processing. Greenbelt, MD 20770| I run picnic.mat.net: FreeBSD-current(i386) and (301) 220-2114 | jaunt.mat.net : FreeBSD-current(Alpha) To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
Re: Mount problems after lockup
On Mon, 6 Dec 1999, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: In message [EMAIL PROTECTED], Chuck Rob ey writes: On Sun, 5 Dec 1999, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: It is really a good idea to read the current mailing list if you run current on your machine. copy MAKEDEV from src/etc/MAKEDEV to /dev, and run it to recreate your disk devices. Poul-Henning Excuse me, Poul, I have to switch back and forth for a day on one machine, can I run MAKEDEV to prepare for the new devs without ruining the system for a kernel that's about 4 months old? No, 4 months is too old. Then if I have to do this in multiple steps, can I upgrade to current as it was before you changed out the bdevs-cdevs (I'll hunt down the commit) and do that in one step, get it working, then MAKEDEV and do another step taking it the rest of the way to current? I don't want to move it with no ability to fall back on an old kernel, as I step it towards current. -- Poul-Henning Kamp FreeBSD coreteam member [EMAIL PROTECTED] "Real hackers run -current on their laptop." FreeBSD -- It will take a long time before progress goes too far! To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message ---- Chuck Robey| Interests include C programming, Electronics, 213 Lakeside Dr. Apt. T-1 | communications, and signal processing. Greenbelt, MD 20770| I run picnic.mat.net: FreeBSD-current(i386) and (301) 220-2114 | jaunt.mat.net : FreeBSD-current(Alpha) To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message
