Re: Is there possible run a MacOS X binary

2016-12-08 Thread Alfred Perlstein



On 12/7/16 10:57 AM, K. Macy wrote:




A MachO activator is indeed not useful without an OSX install.

But let's be honest, Mach IPC is a loadable kernel module requiring no real
kernel changes. It's not upstreamable because of a general poor
understanding of IPC by noisy commentators and a religious aversion to a
technology perceived as having failed in the marketplace of ideas.

I'd be happy to upstream it.  Are there diffs relative to -current?

-Alfred




On Wed, Dec 7, 2016 at 10:45 Warner Losh  wrote:


On Mon, Dec 5, 2016 at 12:31 PM, Kevin P. Neal 
wrote:


On Mon, Dec 05, 2016 at 02:49:07PM -0300, Nilton Jose Rizzo wrote:

  Sorry for cross posting (-current and -ports)
Is there any emulator like linuxator to run Mac OS X binaries, or
is ther any licensing problem?

It may be possible to make an emulator for Darwin (the OS that Mac OS

sits


on top of), but an emulator for Mac OS would probably require a legal

copy


of Mac OS.
So, no, there is no Mac OS emulator for FreeBSD. And I'd be surprised if
it ever happened.



NetBSD has (or had) a macho image activator, which is the first step

in this process. But Kevin is right that most of the functionality of

MacOS isn't in the kernel, and you'd need a copy of MacOS to run it in

emulation. Plus there's a lot of Mach code that MacOS depends on that

has no simple counterparts in FreeBSD, and that would be a lot of work

to make happen. It's one of the things that's a barrier to entry for a

simple, straight forward launchd port, for example.








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Re: Is there possible run a MacOS X binary

2016-12-08 Thread Shane Ambler

On 08/12/2016 09:15, Nilton Jose Rizzo wrote:


   Thankx for all comments.  I know and understood all difficult.

   I'll have to spend my money on the purchase a Machintosh machine.


Now that bhyve has gui support can OSX be started as a bhyve guest?
Has anyone tried to get an openfirmware loader running? Do current macs
still use openfirmware?

For info regarding a compat layer for anyone wanting to work on that -
cocotron.org is an mit licensed project similar to GNUStep - it has
mostly focused on windows compatibility with Foundation usable on *nix
flavours. There is apparently X11 support in AppKit but it needs a lot
of work.

--
FreeBSD - the place to B...Sharing Devices

Shane Ambler

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Re: Is there possible run a MacOS X binary

2016-12-08 Thread Mateusz Piotrowski
On 8 Dec 2016, at 14:07, mokhi  wrote:

> I had started a writing a Mach-O image activator monthes ago, but
> time/daily-life distracted me from continuing it.
> Maybe some day I continue it :D
> Currently it's available on my github[1] if it helps.
> I had some success-like running of some super-simple less-than 'return
> A+B' programs with it :)

Have you considered adding it to the FreeBSD Google Summer of Code Ideas 
wiki[2]?

Maybe some brave student will like the idea and decide to spend some time on 
this project.

Cheers,

-mateusz

[2]: https://wiki.freebsd.org/SummerOfCodeIdeas
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Re: Is there possible run a MacOS X binary

2016-12-08 Thread mokhi
>  Have you considered adding it to the FreeBSD Google Summer of Code Ideas 
> wiki[2]?
>  Maybe some brave student will like the idea and decide to spend some time on 
> this project.
No I didn't, maybe it worth doing it :)
I can do it if you suggest.

I myself was brave (but officially mentor-less) while doing this :D,
(I actually didn't know how i can find a mentor for this idea).
I also didn't find interest among developers after call of review (for
logically good sensible reasons, like why should we add it in kernel,
who will maintain it, instability in first, Apple+Law issues, etc).

Best wishes, Mokhi.
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Re: Is there possible run a MacOS X binary

2016-12-08 Thread mokhi
I had started a writing a Mach-O image activator monthes ago, but
time/daily-life distracted me from continuing it.
Maybe some day I continue it :D
Currently it's available on my github[1] if it helps.
I had some success-like running of some super-simple less-than 'return
A+B' programs with it :)


Best regards, Mokhi.
==
[1] https://github.com/m0khi/FreeBSD_MachO
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Re: Is there possible run a MacOS X binary

2016-12-07 Thread Nilton Jose Rizzo
Em Wed, 07 Dec 2016 18:57:36 +, K. Macy escreveu
> >
> >
> >
> A MachO activator is indeed not useful without an OSX install.
> 
> But let's be honest, Mach IPC is a loadable kernel module requiring 
> no real kernel changes. It's not upstreamable because of a general poor
> understanding of IPC by noisy commentators and a religious aversion 
> to a technology perceived as having failed in the marketplace of ideas.
> 
> On Wed, Dec 7, 2016 at 10:45 Warner Losh  wrote:
> 
> > On Mon, Dec 5, 2016 at 12:31 PM, Kevin P. Neal 
> > wrote:
> >
> > > On Mon, Dec 05, 2016 at 02:49:07PM -0300, Nilton Jose Rizzo wrote:
> >
> > >>
> >
> > >>
> >
> > >>  Sorry for cross posting (-current and -ports)
> >
> > >>
> >
> > >>
> >
> > >> Is there any emulator like linuxator to run Mac OS X binaries, or
> >
> > >> is ther any licensing problem?
> >
> > >
> >
> > > It may be possible to make an emulator for Darwin (the OS that Mac OS
> > sits
> >
> > > on top of), but an emulator for Mac OS would probably require a legal
> > copy
> >
> > > of Mac OS.
> >
> > >
> >
> > > So, no, there is no Mac OS emulator for FreeBSD. And I'd be surprised if
> >
> > > it ever happened.
> >
> >
> >
> > NetBSD has (or had) a macho image activator, which is the first step
> >
> > in this process. But Kevin is right that most of the functionality of
> >
> > MacOS isn't in the kernel, and you'd need a copy of MacOS to run it in
> >
> > emulation. Plus there's a lot of Mach code that MacOS depends on that
> >
> > has no simple counterparts in FreeBSD, and that would be a lot of work
> >
> > to make happen. It's one of the things that's a barrier to entry for a
> >
> > simple, straight forward launchd port, for example.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
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   Thankx for all comments.  I know and understood all difficult.
   
   I'll have to spend my money on the purchase a Machintosh machine.

---
/*
**Nilton José RizzoUFRRJ
**http://www.rizzo.eng.br  http://www.ufrrj.br
**http://lattes.cnpq.br/0079460703536198
**/

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Re: Is there possible run a MacOS X binary

2016-12-07 Thread K. Macy
>
>
>
A MachO activator is indeed not useful without an OSX install.

But let's be honest, Mach IPC is a loadable kernel module requiring no real
kernel changes. It's not upstreamable because of a general poor
understanding of IPC by noisy commentators and a religious aversion to a
technology perceived as having failed in the marketplace of ideas.



On Wed, Dec 7, 2016 at 10:45 Warner Losh  wrote:

> On Mon, Dec 5, 2016 at 12:31 PM, Kevin P. Neal 
> wrote:
>
> > On Mon, Dec 05, 2016 at 02:49:07PM -0300, Nilton Jose Rizzo wrote:
>
> >>
>
> >>
>
> >>  Sorry for cross posting (-current and -ports)
>
> >>
>
> >>
>
> >> Is there any emulator like linuxator to run Mac OS X binaries, or
>
> >> is ther any licensing problem?
>
> >
>
> > It may be possible to make an emulator for Darwin (the OS that Mac OS
> sits
>
> > on top of), but an emulator for Mac OS would probably require a legal
> copy
>
> > of Mac OS.
>
> >
>
> > So, no, there is no Mac OS emulator for FreeBSD. And I'd be surprised if
>
> > it ever happened.
>
>
>
> NetBSD has (or had) a macho image activator, which is the first step
>
> in this process. But Kevin is right that most of the functionality of
>
> MacOS isn't in the kernel, and you'd need a copy of MacOS to run it in
>
> emulation. Plus there's a lot of Mach code that MacOS depends on that
>
> has no simple counterparts in FreeBSD, and that would be a lot of work
>
> to make happen. It's one of the things that's a barrier to entry for a
>
> simple, straight forward launchd port, for example.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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Re: Is there possible run a MacOS X binary

2016-12-07 Thread Matthieu Volat
On Mon, 5 Dec 2016 14:31:06 -0500
"Kevin P. Neal"  wrote:

> On Mon, Dec 05, 2016 at 02:49:07PM -0300, Nilton Jose Rizzo wrote:
> > 
> > 
> >  Sorry for cross posting (-current and -ports)
> > 
> > 
> > Is there any emulator like linuxator to run Mac OS X binaries, or 
> > is ther any licensing problem?
> 
> It may be possible to make an emulator for Darwin (the OS that Mac OS sits
> on top of), but an emulator for Mac OS would probably require a legal copy
> of Mac OS.
> 
> So, no, there is no Mac OS emulator for FreeBSD. And I'd be surprised if
> it ever happened.
> 

You can have a look at darling  which aim to 
provide the macos(x) equivalent to wine (so, no kernel bits?), but given how 
I'm currently struggling with wine on FreeBSD, I would not bet this will work 
without some porting.

(Note that lots of parts of macos are closed source (frameworks, and aqua), so 
unlike linux, you can't just grab their libraries like that, and there's the 
problem of the display)

-- Matthieu


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Description: OpenPGP digital signature


Re: Is there possible run a MacOS X binary

2016-12-07 Thread David Chisnall
On 5 Dec 2016, at 19:31, Kevin P. Neal  wrote:
> 
>> Is there any emulator like linuxator to run Mac OS X binaries, or 
>> is ther any licensing problem?
> 
> It may be possible to make an emulator for Darwin (the OS that Mac OS sits
> on top of), but an emulator for Mac OS would probably require a legal copy
> of Mac OS.
> 

NetBSD started working on one, and had it at a state where it could run the 
Darwin version of XFree86 (which should give you some idea of how old it was), 
but it couldn’t run the Mac Window Server and I don’t think it’s maintained. 
It’s not very interesting, because you need all of the frameworks and programs 
from OS X for it to be useful, and the license prohibits using them in such a 
way (and even if you did get it to work, you wouldn’t be able to run Mac apps 
at the same time as X apps without running XQuartz, and at that point you may 
as well just run macOS).

There is a more recent project called Darling (https://www.darlinghq.org) that 
tries to run Mac apps on Linux using a custom Mach-O loader, bits of GNUstep, 
and some of their own stuff.  No one has ever tried using it on FreeBSD, to the 
best of my knowledge.  It’s GPLv3, so I’m not motivated to contribute to it 
(though it does incorporate some of my code in various places).

David



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Description: S/MIME cryptographic signature


Re: Is there possible run a MacOS X binary

2016-12-07 Thread Warner Losh
On Mon, Dec 5, 2016 at 12:31 PM, Kevin P. Neal  wrote:
> On Mon, Dec 05, 2016 at 02:49:07PM -0300, Nilton Jose Rizzo wrote:
>>
>>
>>  Sorry for cross posting (-current and -ports)
>>
>>
>> Is there any emulator like linuxator to run Mac OS X binaries, or
>> is ther any licensing problem?
>
> It may be possible to make an emulator for Darwin (the OS that Mac OS sits
> on top of), but an emulator for Mac OS would probably require a legal copy
> of Mac OS.
>
> So, no, there is no Mac OS emulator for FreeBSD. And I'd be surprised if
> it ever happened.

NetBSD has (or had) a macho image activator, which is the first step
in this process. But Kevin is right that most of the functionality of
MacOS isn't in the kernel, and you'd need a copy of MacOS to run it in
emulation. Plus there's a lot of Mach code that MacOS depends on that
has no simple counterparts in FreeBSD, and that would be a lot of work
to make happen. It's one of the things that's a barrier to entry for a
simple, straight forward launchd port, for example.

Warner
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