Re: Vote: making wayland=on default

2017-12-21 Thread Grzegorz Junka
On 21/12/2017 03:19, Michael Gmelin wrote: On 21. Dec 2017, at 02:14, Chris H wrote: On Thu, 21 Dec 2017 00:29:40 +0100 "Michael Gmelin" said On 20. Dec 2017, at 18:50, Chris H wrote: On Wed, 20 Dec 2017 17:13:43 +

Re: Vote: making wayland=on default

2017-12-21 Thread Andrea Venturoli
On 12/20/17 23:21, roberth...@rcn.com wrote: First off, I'm not trying to bring up any flame... my questions are real and I'd really welcome good answers. Yuri writes: It appears that this is the case of fixing of something (xorg) that wasn't/isn't broken in the first place. And if

Re: Vote: making wayland=on default

2017-12-21 Thread Niclas Zeising
On 12/20/17 23:21, roberth...@rcn.com wrote: To the list: I salute X for doing its job, but I have no brand loyalty. If something comes along that is some combination of a) more robust, b) faster, and c) as easy to install/manage I'll switch in a heartbeat. (Smaller footprint

Re: Vote: making wayland=on default

2017-12-21 Thread Guido Falsi
On 12/20/2017 21:47, Niclas Zeising wrote: > On 12/20/17 10:20, Johannes Lundberg wrote: >> Hi >> >> I want to suggest that we enable wayland by default. In current state >> having some parts of wayland in ports is basically useless the >> end-users themselves re-build gtk30 and mesa-libs with

Re: Vote: making wayland=on default

2017-12-21 Thread Johannes Lundberg
Thanks for the explanation, Kevin. I should have included more background information about what Wayland is and what turning it on by default means in more detail. Again to clarify, enabling Wayland by default does not change anything, it simply adds more options. Similar to adding a X11 window

Re: Vote: making wayland=on default

2017-12-20 Thread Michael Gmelin
> On 21. Dec 2017, at 02:14, Chris H wrote: > > On Thu, 21 Dec 2017 00:29:40 +0100 "Michael Gmelin" said > >> > On 20. Dec 2017, at 18:50, Chris H wrote: >> > > On Wed, 20 Dec 2017 17:13:43 +

Re: Vote: making wayland=on default

2017-12-20 Thread Sid
Wayland should not be mixed in with other code like gtk3, gtk2, gnome related programs. This will immediately create bloat. Wayland does remove a lot of unneeded obsolete code that is in Xorg, that is put in there by principle, and not much else. If gtk creeps into Wayland, those benefits will

Re: Vote: making wayland=on default

2017-12-20 Thread Chris H
On Thu, 21 Dec 2017 00:29:40 +0100 "Michael Gmelin" said > On 20. Dec 2017, at 18:50, Chris H wrote: > > On Wed, 20 Dec 2017 17:13:43 + said > > On Wed, 20 Dec 2017 16:23:59 + "Johannes Lundberg"

Re: Vote: making wayland=on default

2017-12-20 Thread Kevin Oberman
On Wed, Dec 20, 2017 at 3:29 PM, Michael Gmelin wrote: > > > > On 20. Dec 2017, at 18:50, Chris H wrote: > > > > On Wed, 20 Dec 2017 17:13:43 + > said > > > > On Wed, 20 Dec 2017 16:23:59 + "Johannes Lundberg" <

Re: Vote: making wayland=on default

2017-12-20 Thread Michael Gmelin
> On 20. Dec 2017, at 18:50, Chris H wrote: > > On Wed, 20 Dec 2017 17:13:43 + said > > On Wed, 20 Dec 2017 16:23:59 + "Johannes Lundberg" > said > >> On Wed, Dec 20, 2017 at 4:08 PM, Chris H

Re: Vote: making wayland=on default

2017-12-20 Thread roberthuff
Yuri writes: > It appears that this is the case of fixing of something (xorg) > that wasn't/isn't broken in the first place. And if it is > considered broken, then how, in which way? You ask "Is it broken?". I ask "Is there a better way?" Think about gcc: it was

Re: Vote: making wayland=on default

2017-12-20 Thread Pete Wright
On 12/20/2017 11:49, n...@arrishq.net wrote: Hi, On Wed, 20 Dec 2017, Johannes Lundberg wrote: Hi Personally I see no reason not to make it default on, even with flavors coming up. For any Desktop user (as well as embedded devices like IVI-systems and whatnot), Wayland is the future.

Re: Vote: making wayland=on default

2017-12-20 Thread Niclas Zeising
On 12/20/17 10:20, Johannes Lundberg wrote: Hi I want to suggest that we enable wayland by default. In current state having some parts of wayland in ports is basically useless the end-users themselves re-build gtk30 and mesa-libs with wayland enabled. libwayland-egl.so from mesa-libs and the

Re: Vote: making wayland=on default

2017-12-20 Thread net
Hi, On Wed, 20 Dec 2017, Johannes Lundberg wrote: Hi Personally I see no reason not to make it default on, even with flavors coming up. For any Desktop user (as well as embedded devices like IVI-systems and whatnot), Wayland is the future. There's no escaping that. and why does everyone

Re: Vote: making wayland=on default

2017-12-20 Thread Ultima
I support adding wayland support on by default as well. It still is WIP in several areas one I have not seen mentioned yet includes nvidia graphics cards. Needing to rebuild several ports just to test does seem a bit too much though. Best regards, Richard Gallamore On Wed, Dec 20, 2017 at 11:14

Re: Vote: making wayland=on default

2017-12-20 Thread Johannes Lundberg
Hi Yuri To be clear, we're not transitioning to anything, we're simply adding more options. Compare it to adding a new window manager for X, it doesn't mean you have to stop using the existing ones... On Wed, Dec 20, 2017 at 5:39 PM, Yuri wrote: > On 12/20/17 01:20, Johannes

Re: Vote: making wayland=on default

2017-12-20 Thread Chris H
On Wed, 20 Dec 2017 17:13:43 + said On Wed, 20 Dec 2017 16:23:59 + "Johannes Lundberg" said On Wed, Dec 20, 2017 at 4:08 PM, Chris H wrote: > On Wed, 20 Dec 2017 09:20:20 + "Johannes Lundberg"

Re: Vote: making wayland=on default

2017-12-20 Thread Yuri
On 12/20/17 01:20, Johannes Lundberg wrote: For any Desktop user (as well as embedded devices like IVI-systems and whatnot), Wayland is the future. There's no escaping that. Over the history of its development, Wayland could never clearly answer the question "What are the benefits of Wayland

re: Vote: making wayland=on default

2017-12-20 Thread Sid
I would rather see smaller window managers work with Wayland first. If gtk2 and gtk3 want to enable it fine. But gtk2 and gtk3 shouldn't be mixed in with Wayland by default, which is what will happen if it is enabled before it gets a foothold with other window managers.

Re: Vote: making wayland=on default

2017-12-20 Thread blubee blubeeme
On Thu, Dec 21, 2017 at 12:23 AM, Johannes Lundberg wrote: > On Wed, Dec 20, 2017 at 4:08 PM, Chris H wrote: > > On Wed, 20 Dec 2017 09:20:20 + "Johannes Lundberg" < > johal...@gmail.com> > > said > > > >> Hi > >> > >> I want to suggest that we

Re: Vote: making wayland=on default

2017-12-20 Thread Johannes Lundberg
On Wed, Dec 20, 2017 at 4:08 PM, Chris H wrote: > On Wed, 20 Dec 2017 09:20:20 + "Johannes Lundberg" > said > >> Hi >> >> I want to suggest that we enable wayland by default. In current state >> having some parts of wayland in ports is basically

Re: Vote: making wayland=on default

2017-12-20 Thread Chris H
On Wed, 20 Dec 2017 09:20:20 + "Johannes Lundberg" said Hi I want to suggest that we enable wayland by default. In current state having some parts of wayland in ports is basically useless the end-users themselves re-build gtk30 and mesa-libs with wayland enabled.

Re: Vote: making wayland=on default

2017-12-20 Thread Johannes Lundberg
On Wed, Dec 20, 2017 at 1:13 PM, antranigv wrote: > Hi! > > Trying to understand the changes that would be made by making wayland=on > by default. > > I see a lot of people moving to Wayland from X, but if we do wayland=on, > what will this mean to Xorg people? from the

Re: Vote: making wayland=on default

2017-12-20 Thread Tommi Pernila
Looking forward to testing Wayland more on FreeBSD. So yes please! -Tommi On Wed, Dec 20, 2017 at 2:56 PM, Michael Gmelin wrote: > > > > On 20. Dec 2017, at 13:32, Baptiste Daroussin wrote: > > > >> On Wed, Dec 20, 2017 at 09:20:20AM +, Johannes

Re: Vote: making wayland=on default

2017-12-20 Thread Michael Gmelin
> On 20. Dec 2017, at 13:32, Baptiste Daroussin wrote: > >> On Wed, Dec 20, 2017 at 09:20:20AM +, Johannes Lundberg wrote: >> Hi >> >> I want to suggest that we enable wayland by default. In current state >> having some parts of wayland in ports is basically useless the

Re: Vote: making wayland=on default

2017-12-20 Thread Baptiste Daroussin
On Wed, Dec 20, 2017 at 09:20:20AM +, Johannes Lundberg wrote: > Hi > > I want to suggest that we enable wayland by default. In current state > having some parts of wayland in ports is basically useless the > end-users themselves re-build gtk30 and mesa-libs with wayland > enabled. > >

Re: Vote: making wayland=on default

2017-12-20 Thread Johannes Lundberg
> > The normal scenario would be for FreeBSD to wait until other distros have > throughly vetted the application/protocol/device/other and then consider > adding it to the basic FreeBSD structure. Unfortunately, by that time the > target has moved on and FreeBSD is as all too often late to the

Re: Vote: making wayland=on default

2017-12-20 Thread Carmel NY
On Wed, 20 Dec 2017 09:20:20 +, Johannes Lundberg stated: >Hi > >I want to suggest that we enable wayland by default. In current state >having some parts of wayland in ports is basically useless the >end-users themselves re-build gtk30 and mesa-libs with wayland >enabled. > >libwayland-egl.so

Vote: making wayland=on default

2017-12-20 Thread Johannes Lundberg
Hi I want to suggest that we enable wayland by default. In current state having some parts of wayland in ports is basically useless the end-users themselves re-build gtk30 and mesa-libs with wayland enabled. libwayland-egl.so from mesa-libs and the extra libraries and headers from gtk30 adds