Re: The Design and Implementation of the FreeBSD Operating System
A few years later about 6 months after the book went out of print I actually bought a box of 20 of the books for something like a dollar a book, from a remainder dealer, just to have a future cache of them that I could give away. Kind of funny to think about that being almost a decade ago... do you still have one of those around by any chance? ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The Design and Implementation of the FreeBSD Operating System
A few years later about 6 months after the book went out of print I actually bought a box of 20 of the books for something like a dollar a book, from a remainder dealer, just to have a future cache of them that I could give away. I probably wouldn't be using FBSD now if it wasn't for your book and Greg Lehey's book back then. I still have both on the shelf. Greg's book is version 3 and your book has an unopened FBSD 4.2 CD package. :) ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: The Design and Implementation of the FreeBSD Operating System
-Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Gonzalo Nemmi Sent: Tuesday, July 22, 2008 2:06 PM To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: The Design and Implementation of the FreeBSD Operating System Actually .. I'd be more than willing to buy an updated version of that book too .. I _do_ undertand your point of view but to be honest, I'd rather buy a new copy that prints everything up to _yesterday_ and that has at least some hints into tomorrow ... If you only knew the work that has to be done behind the scenes to get one of these out that prints everything up to yesterday... Finally; Editor, Publisher, _Dear_Writer_: if you guys are hesitant .. I think there's at least two copies of an updated version of The Design and Implementation .. already sold with a lot more on the way :) Nobody makes a living off writing FreeBSD books. If the planets align and everything works you can perhaps make enough to buy yourself a toy, like a new motorcycle or something. But if you divide it out, for the time it takes to put one of these together, you would make more money flipping burgers. Seriously. Now, Linux or Macintosh, that's a horse of a different color... These are labors of love, or Resume builders, or merely proving to yourself that you can actually do it and play with the Big Boys. When I put out Corporate Networker's Guide, I literally burned the CD for version 4.2 about 4 hours after 4.2-RELEASE was posted and FedExd the final proof and that burned CD about 2 hours after that. The book started showing up in the stores about a month later, and that helped sales because many folks bought the book to get a current CD, mainly to have a real pressed CD, not a burned one. When the second printing came out, the deadline for turning in the final proof and CD was a week before version 4.4 RELEASE came out. I pleaded with the publisher to delay it for just a week to get the next version in, they basically said that any delay would mean no second printing. They have these printing presses so far in advance and your book gets such a narrow slot of time for access to the printer that if you screw it up, the publisher just says hell with you and that's that. That decision probably caused a noticably larger percent of the second printing run to end up remaindered, rather than sold at full price. A few years later about 6 months after the book went out of print I actually bought a box of 20 of the books for something like a dollar a book, from a remainder dealer, just to have a future cache of them that I could give away. Kind of funny to think about that being almost a decade ago... Ted Mittelstaedt Author, FreeBSD Corporate Networker's Guide http://www.freebsd-corp-net-guide.com ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The Design and Implementation of the FreeBSD Operating System
Thank you all for your input. I'm studying up on OS design and implementation for my own personal edification, so I started reading my old college Tanenbaum text Modern Operating Systems. Then I wanted to learn specifically about FreeBSD, so The Design and Implementation of the FreeBSD Operating System was the next logical step. I'll expand to other topics of interest from there. Again, thank you for your comments! Kevin ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The Design and Implementation of the FreeBSD Operating System
Yet your point is completly valid one.. and that's why The Design and Implementation of the FreeBSD Operating System is the only book that I've been hesitant on buying so far ... Lucas (Absolute FreeBSD, 2nd Edition), Lavigne (The Best of FreeBSD Basics), Kong (BSD rootkits), Lehey (Download edition:) ) are all over my desktop as I write this mail, and I consult them daily ... Farrokhi (Network Administration with FreeBSD) and Hong (Building a Server with FreeBSD 7) are the ones coming in the next batch ... Has anyone on the list read Building a Server with FreeBSD 7: A Modular Approach? The description on bookpool.com makes it sound a little basic/superficial, covering topics such as how to install FreeBSD and how to install/configure programs via the ports. I'm already very familiar with these topics; does anyone know if this book covers more advanced topics or details like the nitty-gritty of configuing sendmail, apache, samba, NFS, etc? And what about Absolute FreeBSD? It's updated for FreeBSD 7, so I know it's current. Is it a good book? Is it worth the read? How valuable is its content? (I know I'm asking some very subjective questions, but if I'm going to spend hundreds of $$$ to build my library in this area, I'd like at least a couple of opinions about the books I buy.) So far .. there are only three books I would have bought but I didn't because I thought the situation could improve ... those are: The Design and Implementation of the FreeBSD Operating System, BSD Hacks and The FreeBSD HandBook... same reason for all of them .. too old by now (although I think I'll buy BSD Hacks anyways .. I just can't resist buying Lavigne books :( ) Personally, I don't think I'd ever buy The FreeBSD Handbook. It's a really good resource, but as long as it's actively updated electronically it's too dynamic to buy a hardcopy. I'd much rather read it online where I can get the latest revisions. Kevin ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The Design and Implementation of the FreeBSD Operating System
On Wed, Jul 23, 2008 at 08:12:02AM -0400, FreeBSD Questions wrote: Yet your point is completly valid one.. and that's why The Design and Implementation of the FreeBSD Operating System is the only book that I've been hesitant on buying so far ... Lucas (Absolute FreeBSD, 2nd Edition), Lavigne (The Best of FreeBSD Basics), Kong (BSD rootkits), Lehey (Download edition:) ) are all over my desktop as I write this mail, and I consult them daily ... Farrokhi (Network Administration with FreeBSD) and Hong (Building a Server with FreeBSD 7) are the ones coming in the next batch ... Has anyone on the list read Building a Server with FreeBSD 7: A Modular Approach? The description on bookpool.com makes it sound a little basic/superficial, covering topics such as how to install FreeBSD and how to install/configure programs via the ports. I'm already very familiar with these topics; does anyone know if this book covers more advanced topics or details like the nitty-gritty of configuing sendmail, apache, samba, NFS, etc? I have read this book. It's not very useful to me since I run FreeBSD 7 as a desktop. But I did find it interesting. The book provides setup info for many server services. And what about Absolute FreeBSD? It's updated for FreeBSD 7, so I know it's current. Is it a good book? Is it worth the read? How valuable is its content? (I know I'm asking some very subjective questions, but if I'm going to spend hundreds of $$$ to build my library in this area, I'd like at least a couple of opinions about the books I buy.) Yes. Yes. Very valuable. I give it 5/5 stars. So far .. there are only three books I would have bought but I didn't because I thought the situation could improve ... those are: The Design and Implementation of the FreeBSD Operating System, BSD Hacks and The FreeBSD HandBook... same reason for all of them .. too old by now (although I think I'll buy BSD Hacks anyways .. I just can't resist buying Lavigne books :( ) Personally, I don't think I'd ever buy The FreeBSD Handbook. It's a really good resource, but as long as it's actively updated electronically it's too dynamic to buy a hardcopy. I'd much rather read it online where I can get the latest revisions. Kevin ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The Design and Implementation of the FreeBSD Operating System
FreeBSD Questions wrote: And what about Absolute FreeBSD? It's updated for FreeBSD 7, so I know it's current. Is it a good book? Is it worth the read? How valuable is its content? (I know I'm asking some very subjective questions, but if I'm going to spend hundreds of $$$ to build my library in this area, I'd like at least a couple of opinions about the books I buy.) Absolute FreeBSD is an excellent book, a must have if you ask me. Excellent tips, very good explanation of how things work, relaxed and easy writing style. You will get a lot out of this book. (Note: it is concentrated on server tasks, you will not get any X tips from it) Personally, I don't think I'd ever buy The FreeBSD Handbook. It's a really good resource, but as long as it's actively updated electronically it's too dynamic to buy a hardcopy. I'd much rather read it online where I can get the latest revisions. Kevin ___ True, the handbook is under constant development - and it should be, to match the system I have a printed version, and it is outdated in several sections. I find hardcopies easier to read though. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The Design and Implementation of the FreeBSD Operating System
On Wed, Jul 23, 2008 at 04:12:51PM +0300, Manolis Kiagias wrote: FreeBSD Questions wrote: And what about Absolute FreeBSD? It's updated for FreeBSD 7, so I know it's current. Is it a good book? Is it worth the read? How valuable is its content? (I know I'm asking some very subjective questions, but if I'm going to spend hundreds of $$$ to build my library in this area, I'd like at least a couple of opinions about the books I buy.) Absolute FreeBSD is an excellent book, a must have if you ask me. Excellent tips, very good explanation of how things work, relaxed and easy writing style. You will get a lot out of this book. (Note: it is concentrated on server tasks, you will not get any X tips from it) I also recommend _X Power Tools_ for X-related info. Doesn't have everything I would like to know about X, but it filled in many gaps for me. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The Design and Implementation of the FreeBSD Operating System
On Wed, Jul 23, 2008 at 8:12 AM, FreeBSD Questions [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: details like the nitty-gritty of configuing sendmail, apache, samba, NFS, etc? You might want to look at specific books targeting that software. Check o'rielly.For example http://search.oreilly.com/?q=sendmail Note: you can also look at google books for some of these titles. I have managed to find more that one that I needed and it's a free resource. http://books.google.com/ And what about Absolute FreeBSD? It's updated for FreeBSD 7, so I know it's current. Is it a good book? Is it worth the read? How valuable is its content? (I know I'm asking some very subjective questions, but if I'm going to spend hundreds of $$$ to build my library in this area, I'd like at least a couple of opinions about the books I buy.) I read it. I think it's a good FreeBSD book. Personally, I don't think I'd ever buy The FreeBSD Handbook. It's a really good resource, but as long as it's actively updated electronically it's too dynamic to buy a hardcopy. I'd much rather read it online where I can get the latest revisions. Do you mean The Complete FreeBSD? Thats available online for free. http://www.lemis.com/grog/Documentation/CFBSD/ The The FreeBSD Handbook is the free resource available on www.freebsd.org http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en/books/handbook/ Kevin ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- regards, dg using fsdb(8) and clri(8) was like climbing Mount Everest in sandals and shorts. Since writing that, I've tried them more than once and discovered that I was wrong. You don't get the shorts. -- M.W. Lucas ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The Design and Implementation of the FreeBSD Operating System
FreeBSD Questions wrote: This book was printed in August 2004. This predates FBSD 5, and I know there were some significant changes between the 4.x and 5.x branches. We've progressed further and are now into version 7. How well does this book apply to more current versions of FreeBSD, such as version 7? I stand ready for correction, but Design Implementation is mostly about, well, the design of the system itself ... not an operational manual but a programmer's guide to OS internals. And, not only that, but it's about 4.4BSD (1993?), so the exact OS described is quite old*; however, it's of great value not only as history but as 4.4BSD has fed code into not only FreeBSD, but NetBSD, OpenBSD, and others. (see /usr/share/misc/bsd-family-tree). If that's not of interest to you I'd not worry about this book --- no offence to Mr. McKusick et al, of course. Kevin Kinsey *Notwithstanding the fact that most likely the reason the last edition was printed in '04 was because they'd updated it to reflect changes in the previous 10 years. Perhaps another edition around 2013-14? -- I can't understand why people are frightened of new ideas. I'm frightened of the old ones. -- John Cage ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The Design and Implementation of the FreeBSD Operating System
Kevin Kinsey [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: FreeBSD Questions wrote: This book was printed in August 2004. This predates FBSD 5, and I know there were some significant changes between the 4.x and 5.x branches. We've progressed further and are now into version 7. How well does this book apply to more current versions of FreeBSD, such as version 7? I stand ready for correction, but Design Implementation is mostly about, well, the design of the system itself ... not an operational manual but a programmer's guide to OS internals. Quite correct. And, not only that, but it's about 4.4BSD (1993?), so the exact OS described is quite old*; Not quite correct. The more recent edition was retitled to more accurately denote the fact that it covers FreeBSD (5). -- Lowell Gilbert, embedded/networking software engineer, Boston area http://be-well.ilk.org/~lowell/ ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The Design and Implementation of the FreeBSD Operating System
Kevin Kinsey [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I stand ready for correction, but Design Implementation is mostly about, well, the design of the system itself ... not an operational manual but a programmer's guide to OS internals. And, not only that, but it's about 4.4BSD (1993?), so the exact OS described is quite old*; however, it's of great value not only as history but as 4.4BSD has fed code into not only FreeBSD, but NetBSD, OpenBSD, and others. (see /usr/share/misc/bsd-family-tree). If that's not of interest to you I'd not worry about this book --- no offence to Mr. McKusick et al, of course. Your thinking of The Design and Implementation of the 4.4BSD Operating System not The Design and Implementation of the FreeBSD Operating System. They are, believe it or not, two different books. Your point is just as valid though as far as it being not an operational manual but a programmer's guide to OS internals. -- James Tanis Technical Coordinator Monsignor Donovan Catholic High School e: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The Design and Implementation of the FreeBSD Operating System
On Wed, Jul 23, 2008 at 12:06 AM, Gonzalo Nemmi [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tuesday 22 July 2008 15:23:15 Erik Trulsson wrote: On Tue, Jul 22, 2008 at 11:09:17AM -0400, FreeBSD Questions wrote: This book was printed in August 2004. This predates FBSD 5, and I know there were some significant changes between the 4.x and 5.x branches. We've progressed further and are now into version 7. How well does this book apply to more current versions of FreeBSD, such as version 7? The 2004 edition of that book does cover FreeBSD 5.2 (says so clearly on the cover anyway.) This means that all the major changes between 4.x and 5.x should be included in it. There have been many changes in FreeBSD since then, of course, but most of those changes have been fairly evolutionary in nature, so most of the book should still apply reasonably well. Actually .. I'd be more than willing to buy an updated version of that book too .. I _do_ undertand your point of view but to be honest, I'd rather buy a new copy that prints everything up to _yesterday_ and that has at least some hints into tomorrow ... Yet your point is completly valid one.. and that's why The Design and Implementation of the FreeBSD Operating System is the only book that I've been hesitant on buying so far ... Lucas (Absolute FreeBSD, 2nd Edition), Lavigne (The Best of FreeBSD Basics), Kong (BSD rootkits), Lehey (Download edition:) ) are all over my desktop as I write this mail, and I consult them daily ... Farrokhi (Network Administration with FreeBSD) and Hong (Building a Server with FreeBSD 7) are the ones coming in the next batch ... So far .. there are only three books I would have bought but I didn't because I thought the situation could improve ... those are: The Design and Implementation of the FreeBSD Operating System, BSD Hacks and The FreeBSD HandBook... same reason for all of them .. too old by now (although I think I'll buy BSD Hacks anyways .. I just can't resist buying Lavigne books :( ) (let alone the fact that I would rather buy them all through freebsdmall.com that from amazon .. I think freebsdmall would do good if they would offer the whole Reed's Media library and the No Starch Press BSD related titles ... i would surely buy everything from them =P) Finally; Editor, Publisher, _Dear_Writer_: if you guys are hesitant .. I think there's at least two copies of an updated version of The Design and Implementation .. already sold with a lot more on the way :) -- Blessings Gonzalo Nemmi I couldn't agree more with Gonzalo... i find myself in the exact same position. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The Design and Implementation of the FreeBSD Operating System
On Tue, Jul 22, 2008 at 11:09:17AM -0400, FreeBSD Questions wrote: This book was printed in August 2004. This predates FBSD 5, and I know there were some significant changes between the 4.x and 5.x branches. We've progressed further and are now into version 7. How well does this book apply to more current versions of FreeBSD, such as version 7? The 2004 edition of that book does cover FreeBSD 5.2 (says so clearly on the cover anyway.) This means that all the major changes between 4.x and 5.x should be included in it. There have been many changes in FreeBSD since then, of course, but most of those changes have been fairly evolutionary in nature, so most of the book should still apply reasonably well. -- Insert your favourite quote here. Erik Trulsson [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The Design and Implementation of the FreeBSD Operating System
On Tuesday 22 July 2008 15:23:15 Erik Trulsson wrote: On Tue, Jul 22, 2008 at 11:09:17AM -0400, FreeBSD Questions wrote: This book was printed in August 2004. This predates FBSD 5, and I know there were some significant changes between the 4.x and 5.x branches. We've progressed further and are now into version 7. How well does this book apply to more current versions of FreeBSD, such as version 7? The 2004 edition of that book does cover FreeBSD 5.2 (says so clearly on the cover anyway.) This means that all the major changes between 4.x and 5.x should be included in it. There have been many changes in FreeBSD since then, of course, but most of those changes have been fairly evolutionary in nature, so most of the book should still apply reasonably well. Actually .. I'd be more than willing to buy an updated version of that book too .. I _do_ undertand your point of view but to be honest, I'd rather buy a new copy that prints everything up to _yesterday_ and that has at least some hints into tomorrow ... Yet your point is completly valid one.. and that's why The Design and Implementation of the FreeBSD Operating System is the only book that I've been hesitant on buying so far ... Lucas (Absolute FreeBSD, 2nd Edition), Lavigne (The Best of FreeBSD Basics), Kong (BSD rootkits), Lehey (Download edition:) ) are all over my desktop as I write this mail, and I consult them daily ... Farrokhi (Network Administration with FreeBSD) and Hong (Building a Server with FreeBSD 7) are the ones coming in the next batch ... So far .. there are only three books I would have bought but I didn't because I thought the situation could improve ... those are: The Design and Implementation of the FreeBSD Operating System, BSD Hacks and The FreeBSD HandBook... same reason for all of them .. too old by now (although I think I'll buy BSD Hacks anyways .. I just can't resist buying Lavigne books :( ) (let alone the fact that I would rather buy them all through freebsdmall.com that from amazon .. I think freebsdmall would do good if they would offer the whole Reed's Media library and the No Starch Press BSD related titles ... i would surely buy everything from them =P) Finally; Editor, Publisher, _Dear_Writer_: if you guys are hesitant .. I think there's at least two copies of an updated version of The Design and Implementation .. already sold with a lot more on the way :) -- Blessings Gonzalo Nemmi ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
