Re: Foiling MITM attacks on source and ports trees

2009-01-13 Thread cpghost
On Fri, Jan 02, 2009 at 05:44:12PM +0100, cpghost wrote: Any idea? Could this be implemented as a plugin to Subversion (since it must access previous revisions of files and previously computed digests)? Given read-only access to the repository, a set of simple Python scripts or C/C++ programs

Re: Foiling MITM attacks on source and ports trees

2009-01-09 Thread Chad Perrin
On Wed, Jan 07, 2009 at 08:37:37AM +, Matthew Seaman wrote: You're kind of stuck then aren't you -- at least in respect TLS/SSL and x509 certificates? If you don't trust any of the bodies who have the capability to authenticate the owners of a particular cryptographic key/certificate on

Re: Foiling MITM attacks on source and ports trees

2009-01-09 Thread Chad Perrin
On Tue, Jan 06, 2009 at 09:08:56PM -0800, Walt Pawley wrote: At 12:31 PM -0700 1/6/09, Chad Perrin wrote: On the other hand, I don't trust Verisign, either. What's to trust? If you pay them, you in. Exactly. That's why I -- as the guy sitting in front of the *browser* -- don't trust

Re: Foiling MITM attacks on source and ports trees

2009-01-07 Thread Matthew Seaman
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: RIPEMD160 Chad Perrin wrote: | On Tue, Jan 06, 2009 at 11:11:52AM -0900, Mel wrote: | On Tuesday 06 January 2009 10:31:26 Chad Perrin wrote: | Out-of-band corroboration of a certificate's authenticity is kind of | necessary to the security model of

Re: Foiling MITM attacks on source and ports trees

2009-01-06 Thread Tait
Unless designed carefully, there will be substantial logistical problems to maintaining such lists of signatures. ... You can then verify the correctness of what's on your disk ... The idea is that one needs to get this public key only once ... IMHO, this could or should take place at

Re: Foiling MITM attacks on source and ports trees

2009-01-06 Thread Wojciech Puchar
someone like the FreeBSD Foundation as an appropriate body to own the cert. OT I would actually trust a self-signed cert by the FreeBSD security officer, more then one by Verisign. of course. there is no need to have an authority to make key pairs, everybody do it alone. actually i would

Re: Foiling MITM attacks on source and ports trees

2009-01-06 Thread Chad Perrin
On Tue, Jan 06, 2009 at 10:22:29AM +0100, Wojciech Puchar wrote: someone like the FreeBSD Foundation as an appropriate body to own the cert. OT I would actually trust a self-signed cert by the FreeBSD security officer, more then one by Verisign. of course. there is no need to have an

Re: Foiling MITM attacks on source and ports trees

2009-01-06 Thread Mel
On Tuesday 06 January 2009 10:31:26 Chad Perrin wrote: On Tue, Jan 06, 2009 at 10:22:29AM +0100, Wojciech Puchar wrote: someone like the FreeBSD Foundation as an appropriate body to own the cert. OT I would actually trust a self-signed cert by the FreeBSD security officer, more then

Re: Foiling MITM attacks on source and ports trees

2009-01-06 Thread Olivier Nicole
Hi, It shouldn't be so hard to give every citizen the option to get an online certificate corresponding with their passport and similarly for Chambers of Commerce to provide certificates for businesses. Only that would mean that 200 countries become Certificate Authorities and tens of

OT: The future of CA's (Was: Re: Foiling MITM attacks on source and ports trees)

2009-01-06 Thread Mel
On Tuesday 06 January 2009 17:56:43 Olivier Nicole wrote: Hi, It shouldn't be so hard to give every citizen the option to get an online certificate corresponding with their passport and similarly for Chambers of Commerce to provide certificates for businesses. Only that would mean that

Re: Foiling MITM attacks on source and ports trees

2009-01-06 Thread Walt Pawley
At 12:31 PM -0700 1/6/09, Chad Perrin wrote: On the other hand, I don't trust Verisign, either. What's to trust? If you pay them, you in. -- Walter M. Pawley w...@wump.org Wump Research Company 676 River Bend Road, Roseburg, OR 97471 541-672-8975

Re: Foiling MITM attacks on source and ports trees

2009-01-06 Thread Chad Perrin
On Tue, Jan 06, 2009 at 11:11:52AM -0900, Mel wrote: On Tuesday 06 January 2009 10:31:26 Chad Perrin wrote: Out-of-band corroboration of a certificate's authenticity is kind of necessary to the security model of SSL/TLS. A self-signed certificate, in and of itself, is not really

Re: Foiling MITM attacks on source and ports trees

2009-01-05 Thread Mel
On Saturday 03 January 2009 03:45:11 Matthew Seaman wrote: [*] Buying a high security cert from the likes of Verisign or OpenSRS would set you back about £800 p.a. and it would probably be necessary to use someone like the FreeBSD Foundation as an appropriate body to own the cert. OT I would

Re: Foiling MITM attacks on source and ports trees

2009-01-03 Thread Matthew Seaman
RW wrote: On Fri, 02 Jan 2009 17:30:12 + Vincent Hoffman vi...@unsane.co.uk wrote: Admittedly this doesn't give a file by file checksum That's not really a problem, it's no easier to create a collision in a .gz file than a patch file. The more substantial weakness is that the key is

Re: Foiling MITM attacks on source and ports trees

2009-01-03 Thread cpghost
On Sat, Jan 03, 2009 at 01:38:25AM +, RW wrote: On Fri, 02 Jan 2009 17:30:12 + Vincent Hoffman vi...@unsane.co.uk wrote: Admittedly this doesn't give a file by file checksum That's not really a problem, it's no easier to create a collision in a .gz file than a patch file. The

Re: Foiling MITM attacks on source and ports trees

2009-01-03 Thread cpghost
On Sat, Jan 03, 2009 at 12:45:11PM +, Matthew Seaman wrote: RW wrote: On Fri, 02 Jan 2009 17:30:12 + Vincent Hoffman vi...@unsane.co.uk wrote: Admittedly this doesn't give a file by file checksum That's not really a problem, it's no easier to create a collision in a .gz file

Re: Foiling MITM attacks on source and ports trees

2009-01-03 Thread RW
On Sat, 3 Jan 2009 19:46:59 +0100 cpghost cpgh...@cordula.ws wrote: On Sat, Jan 03, 2009 at 01:38:25AM +, RW wrote: On Fri, 02 Jan 2009 17:30:12 + Vincent Hoffman vi...@unsane.co.uk wrote: Admittedly this doesn't give a file by file checksum That's not really a problem, it's

Re: Foiling MITM attacks on source and ports trees

2009-01-02 Thread Vincent Hoffman
cpghost wrote: Hello, with MITM attacks [1] on the rise, I'm concerned about the integrity of local /usr/src, /usr/doc, and /usr/ports trees fetched through csup (and portsnap) from master or mirror servers. [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Man-in-the-middle_attack There's already a

Re: Foiling MITM attacks on source and ports trees

2009-01-02 Thread Matt
On Fri, Jan 2, 2009 at 10:44 AM, cpghost cpgh...@cordula.ws wrote: Hello, with MITM attacks [1] on the rise, I'm concerned about the integrity of local /usr/src, /usr/doc, and /usr/ports trees fetched through csup (and portsnap) from master or mirror servers. [1]

Re: Foiling MITM attacks on source and ports trees

2009-01-02 Thread cpghost
On Fri, Jan 02, 2009 at 11:26:45AM -0600, Matt wrote: On Fri, Jan 2, 2009 at 10:44 AM, cpghost cpgh...@cordula.ws wrote: Hello, with MITM attacks [1] on the rise, I'm concerned about the integrity of local /usr/src, /usr/doc, and /usr/ports trees fetched through csup (and portsnap) from

Re: Foiling MITM attacks on source and ports trees

2009-01-02 Thread cpghost
On Fri, Jan 02, 2009 at 05:30:12PM +, Vincent Hoffman wrote: cpghost wrote: Hello, with MITM attacks [1] on the rise, I'm concerned about the integrity of local /usr/src, /usr/doc, and /usr/ports trees fetched through csup (and portsnap) from master or mirror servers. [1]

Re: Foiling MITM attacks on source and ports trees

2009-01-02 Thread Wojciech Puchar
It's a beginning for sure. I assume (403 error) Max generates and saves digests on his snapshots and the verification script does the same locally and simply compares both lists. it's plain paranoia. Yes such attacks are possible but usually there 100 other ways to compromise Your systems. if

Re: Foiling MITM attacks on source and ports trees

2009-01-02 Thread cpghost
On Fri, Jan 02, 2009 at 08:04:10PM +0100, Wojciech Puchar wrote: It's a beginning for sure. I assume (403 error) Max generates and saves digests on his snapshots and the verification script does the same locally and simply compares both lists. it's plain paranoia. Yes such attacks are

Re: Foiling MITM attacks on source and ports trees

2009-01-02 Thread Wojciech Puchar
other ways to compromise Your systems. if one really care then make your VPN for all your computers, use one that is unknown for others to download portsnap etc. and then use rsync to populate it to other machines. I'm already getting the files from one location and disseminate them via

Re: Foiling MITM attacks on source and ports trees

2009-01-02 Thread cpghost
On Fri, Jan 02, 2009 at 10:53:29PM +0100, Wojciech Puchar wrote: other ways to compromise Your systems. if one really care then make your VPN for all your computers, use one that is unknown for others to download portsnap etc. and then use rsync to populate it to other machines. I'm

Re: Foiling MITM attacks on source and ports trees

2009-01-02 Thread RW
On Fri, 02 Jan 2009 17:30:12 + Vincent Hoffman vi...@unsane.co.uk wrote: Admittedly this doesn't give a file by file checksum That's not really a problem, it's no easier to create a collision in a .gz file than a patch file. The more substantial weakness is that the key is verified against