Re: X.org 7.3 sure is a mess...

2008-03-24 Thread Scott Bennett
 On Wed, 19 Mar 2008 19:01:28 + Mark Ovens [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
Peter Boosten wrote:
 Ken Gunderson wrote:
 [snip]
 Looks like you're having a problem with your window manager, instead of 
 Xorg.

 Mine (with enlightenment-devel) works like charm. None of the issues
 you describe anyway.

 Peter
 
 So how would you explain that I am seeing same type of behaviors in
 straight startx with default twm, i.e. bundled Xorg wm?
 
 I'm using WindowMaker (wmaker).  Firefox hangs something in a way that
I can't get any response whatsoever from the keyboard, touchpad, keyboard
pointer thingy that looks like a pencil eraser, or trackball.  Because I have
no other box from which to log in remotely, my only option is to power the
system down, turn it back on, reboot, wait for fsck, etc.  Many xscreensaver
modules cause the *server*, not the window manager, to die on a signal 11.
 
 Dunno. But the troubles cannot originate from the xorg ports, or 
 everyone would see the same behaviour, right?
 

  Maybe some other port, or hardware (maybe your video card? - just
  guessing), or the driver for that particular piece of hardware.
 

One would expect so, but it would appear not to be the case. I'm having 
the same problem - if I ssh in from another box I see the Xorg process 
sucking 100% CPU and the state is *GIANT

I'm using an ATI card but people are having the same issue with nVidia 
and Matrox cards. My box has run every version of Xorg since it replaced 
XFree86 on FreeBSD and many versions of XFree86 before that without this 
problem.

 Mine is a Mobility Radeon 9800.

Also, the problem seems to come and go for me as I update my ports, i.e. 
the box has the problem, I run ``portmaster -a'' and the problem goes 
away. sometime later I run ``portmaster -a'' again and the problem 
re-appears. Only seems to happen when X-related stuff gets updated.

 I haven't noticed the intermittency you describe here, but that is
likely due to the fact that updating the various parts of X and X applications
takes so long that I try to avoid doing it very often.

The other thing I've noticed is, on my box at least, that the problem 
always starts when I move the mouse (not every time of course) so could 
it be Xorg 7.3 not playing nicely with the mouse driver - or the USB 
driver since my mouse is a USB one? Which may explain why some people 
see the problem and others don't?

 That's a thought.  The Firefox problem always seems to occur when I
make the first button click anywhere in the Firefox window, but maybe I should
try simply moving the cursor into the window and wait a few seconds to see
what happens before pressing a button.

This is really becoming a big PITA.

 I concur.  Since the upgrade--downgrade is more like it--to 7.3 from
6.9, I only have access to a functioning web browser when I shut down FreeBSD
and boot Windows XP, a very sad state of affairs.


  Scott Bennett, Comm. ASMELG, CFIAG
**
* Internet:   bennett at cs.niu.edu  *
**
* A well regulated and disciplined militia, is at all times a good  *
* objection to the introduction of that bane of all free governments *
* -- a standing army.   *
*-- Gov. John Hancock, New York Journal, 28 January 1790 *
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Re: X.org 7.3 sure is a mess...

2008-03-24 Thread Scott Bennett
 On Wed, 19 Mar 2008 20:09:54 +0100 Peter Boosten [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
Mark Ovens wrote:
 
 The other thing I've noticed is, on my box at least, that the problem 
 always starts when I move the mouse (not every time of course) so could 
 it be Xorg 7.3 not playing nicely with the mouse driver - or the USB 
 driver since my mouse is a USB one? Which may explain why some people 
 see the problem and others don't?

My mouse is on USB, still no problems.

 My trackball is a USB 2.0 device, but the touchpad and pencil eraser
thingy are built into the machine.
 
 This is really becoming a big PITA.
 

So I wonder how we can help the port maintainer to fix the issue. Maybe 
it's an idea to collect some data on installed ports (including 
versions), used hardware and whether or not one has problems?

 Well, here's my info for starters then.
Computer:  Dell Inspiron XPS
CPU:  3.4 GHz P4 w/HTT enabled
RAM:  1 GB
Graphics card:  ATI Radeon JN R420 Mobility M18 (*)
Built-in pointing devices:  Synaptics Touchpad, GlidePoint
eraserhead thingy
External pointing device:  Logitech USB Trackball (**)

(*)  When X is started, the following messages appear in /var/log/message:
info: [drm] Setting GART location based on new memory map
info: [drm] Loading R300 Microcode
info: [drm] writeback test succeeded in 1 usecs

However, near the end of /var/log/Xorg.0.log this is apparently reconsidered:
(II) RADEON(0): [DRI] installation complete
(II) RADEON(0): [drm] Added 32 65536 byte vertex/indirect buffers
(II) RADEON(0): [drm] Mapped 32 vertex/indirect buffers
(II) RADEON(0): [drm] dma control initialized, using IRQ 16
(II) RADEON(0): [drm] Initialized kernel GART heap manager, 5111808
(WW) RADEON(0): DRI init changed memory map, adjusting ...
(WW) RADEON(0):   MC_FB_LOCATION  was: 0xefffe000 is: 0xefffe000
(WW) RADEON(0):   MC_AGP_LOCATION was: 0xffc0 is: 0xf07ff000
(II) RADEON(0): RADEONRestoreMemMapRegisters() :
(II) RADEON(0):   MC_FB_LOCATION   : 0xefffe000 0xefffe000
(II) RADEON(0):   MC_AGP_LOCATION  : 0xf07ff000
(II) RADEON(0): Direct rendering enabled
(II) RADEON(0): Render acceleration unsupported on Radeon 9500/9700 and 
newer.
(II) RADEON(0): Render acceleration disabled
(II) RADEON(0): Using XFree86 Acceleration Architecture (XAA)
Screen to screen bit blits
Solid filled rectangles
8x8 mono pattern filled rectangles
Indirect CPU to Screen color expansion
Solid Lines
Scanline Image Writes
Offscreen Pixmaps
Setting up tile and stipple cache:
32 128x128 slots
32 256x256 slots
16 512x512 slots
(II) RADEON(0): Acceleration enabled

...and a bit later...
(II) RADEON(0): RandR 1.2 enabled, ignore the following RandR disabled 
message.
(--) RandR disabled

...and several Initializing  lines later...
(II) Loading sub module GLcore
(II) LoadModule: GLcore
(II) Loading /usr/local/lib/xorg/modules/extensions//libGLcore.so
(II) Module GLcore: vendor=X.Org Foundation
compiled for 1.4.0, module version = 1.0.0
ABI class: X.Org Server Extension, version 0.3
(II) GLX: Initialized MESA-PROXY GL provider for screen 0

(**) The driver identifies the trackball as having 5 buttons, though in fact,
it only has 4.  This has been the case as long as I've been running FreeBSD
(i.e., since 5.2.1) and is not new to 6.3.

The only problem I'm having since 7.3 btw (I forgot about that, but just 
remembered) is everytime I start nethack-qt (either local or remote) X 
restarts, kicking me out of my session.

 Does it restart by itself?  Or simply crash on a signal 11?


  Scott Bennett, Comm. ASMELG, CFIAG
**
* Internet:   bennett at cs.niu.edu  *
**
* A well regulated and disciplined militia, is at all times a good  *
* objection to the introduction of that bane of all free governments *
* -- a standing army.   *
*-- Gov. John Hancock, New York Journal, 28 January 1790 *
**
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Re: X.org 7.3 sure is a mess...

2008-03-24 Thread Peter Boosten

Scott Bennett wrote:

 On Wed, 19 Mar 2008 20:09:54 +0100 Peter Boosten [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
The only problem I'm having since 7.3 btw (I forgot about that, but just 
remembered) is everytime I start nethack-qt (either local or remote) X 
restarts, kicking me out of my session.



 Does it restart by itself?  Or simply crash on a signal 11?



It just restarted, I had to logon again, but it has already been solved: 
I removed all the 'Acceleration' stuff from the conf file. Apparently my 
hardware didn't like that.


Peter
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Re: X.org 7.3 sure is a mess...

2008-03-24 Thread Scott Bennett
 Sorry about the delay in my response.  I got tied up in lots of unrelated
matters for several days.
 On Wed, 19 Mar 2008 21:55:43 +0100 Dominic Fandrey [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
Scott Bennett wrote:
  Now that I've upgraded to X.org 7.3, I'm wishing that I hadn't done it.
 ...
  I'm still discovering more and more broken stuff in 7.3 each day.  It's
 only partially usable. ...

Did you check the integrity of your libraries? Are you maybe using portupgrade 
that keeps copies of old libraries in /usr/local/lib/compat/pkg ? Maybe some 
things are still linked against these, this can lead to a load of trouble.

You can install sysutils/bsdadminscripts and run pkg_libchk to check the 
integrity of your system.

 Thank you for that suggestion.  I tried running it, and it did produce
some messages like 

diablo-jre-1.5.0.07.01_3: /usr/local/diablo-jre1.5.0/lib/i386/libdcpr.so misses 
libjvm.so

However, xscreensaver{,-demo} did not appear in the output, nor did firefox.
The only package with a name beginning xorg- that appeared got this message:

xorg-printserver-6.9.0_2: /usr/X11R6/bin/Xprt misses libXdmcp.so.0

I'm not sure what to do about these or the others that were listed, but in any
case, the bsdadminscripts package of scripts appears to deal only with packages
and not with ports installed as ports rather than packages.  Because the X.org
upgrade process builds essentially all of the X.org core software from ports,
the scripts have limited applicability to the current situation.


  Scott Bennett, Comm. ASMELG, CFIAG
**
* Internet:   bennett at cs.niu.edu  *
**
* A well regulated and disciplined militia, is at all times a good  *
* objection to the introduction of that bane of all free governments *
* -- a standing army.   *
*-- Gov. John Hancock, New York Journal, 28 January 1790 *
**
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Re: X.org 7.3 sure is a mess...

2008-03-20 Thread Norberto Meijome
On Wed, 19 Mar 2008 19:01:28 +
Mark Ovens [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Peter Boosten wrote:
  Ken Gunderson wrote:
  [snip]
  Looks like you're having a problem with your window manager, instead of 
  Xorg.
 
  Mine (with enlightenment-devel) works like charm. None of the issues
  you describe anyway.
 
  Peter
  
  So how would you explain that I am seeing same type of behaviors in
  straight startx with default twm, i.e. bundled Xorg wm?
  
  
  Dunno. But the troubles cannot originate from the xorg ports, or 
  everyone would see the same behaviour, right?
  
 
   Maybe some other port, or hardware (maybe your video card? - just
   guessing), or the driver for that particular piece of hardware.
  
 
 One would expect so, but it would appear not to be the case. I'm having 
 the same problem - if I ssh in from another box I see the Xorg process 
 sucking 100% CPU and the state is *GIANT

I would very much like to see a process using  100% CPU :)

What CPU ? I haven't seen GIANT on Xorg for a while...but, again, I don't check
all the time :d

anyway... my xorg sits at 7.81% on select...i've been on this session for 17
hours, and have a heavily loaded xfce session with 10 virt desktops. I actually
recently removed the lower limit for cpufreq to drop the freq and i've been
hovering @ 200 Mhz (measured once a second in gkrellm), although right now I'm
between 800 and 1000 Mhz.

could you please send your xorg.conf ? 

have you tried attaching ktrace to xorg in those situations and seeing what it
is doing ? 
what about other system vitals ? is your disk trashing ? RAM usage? 

 
 I'm using an ATI card but people are having the same issue with nVidia 
 and Matrox cards. My box has run every version of Xorg since it replaced 
 XFree86 on FreeBSD and many versions of XFree86 before that without this 
 problem.
 
 Also, the problem seems to come and go for me as I update my ports, i.e. 
 the box has the problem, I run ``portmaster -a'' and the problem goes 
 away. sometime later I run ``portmaster -a'' again and the problem 
 re-appears. Only seems to happen when X-related stuff gets updated.

maybe if you can pinpoint WHAT gets updated it would be of more help :)

the ati drivers had several updates over the last few months...

 The other thing I've noticed is, on my box at least, that the problem 
 always starts when I move the mouse (not every time of course) so could 
 it be Xorg 7.3 not playing nicely with the mouse driver - or the USB 
 driver since my mouse is a USB one? Which may explain why some people 
 see the problem and others don't?

I'd like to see a count of hands ... who DOESN'T use USB mice or
built-in-mice-in-laptops nowadays...

by any chance you wouldn't have the xcomposite extension enabled... ? 

 This is really becoming a big PITA.

i understand, but without concrete information it wont go anywhere fast :)

B
_
{Beto|Norberto|Numard} Meijome

He loves nature in spite of what it did to him.
  Forrest Tucker

I speak for myself, not my employer. Contents may be hot. Slippery when wet.
Reading disclaimers makes you go blind. Writing them is worse. You have been
Warned.
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Re: X.org 7.3 sure is a mess...

2008-03-19 Thread Mark Ovens

Peter Boosten wrote:

Ken Gunderson wrote:

[snip]
Looks like you're having a problem with your window manager, instead of 
Xorg.


Mine (with enlightenment-devel) works like charm. None of the issues
you describe anyway.

Peter


So how would you explain that I am seeing same type of behaviors in
straight startx with default twm, i.e. bundled Xorg wm?



Dunno. But the troubles cannot originate from the xorg ports, or 
everyone would see the same behaviour, right?




 Maybe some other port, or hardware (maybe your video card? - just
 guessing), or the driver for that particular piece of hardware.


One would expect so, but it would appear not to be the case. I'm having 
the same problem - if I ssh in from another box I see the Xorg process 
sucking 100% CPU and the state is *GIANT


I'm using an ATI card but people are having the same issue with nVidia 
and Matrox cards. My box has run every version of Xorg since it replaced 
XFree86 on FreeBSD and many versions of XFree86 before that without this 
problem.


Also, the problem seems to come and go for me as I update my ports, i.e. 
the box has the problem, I run ``portmaster -a'' and the problem goes 
away. sometime later I run ``portmaster -a'' again and the problem 
re-appears. Only seems to happen when X-related stuff gets updated.


The other thing I've noticed is, on my box at least, that the problem 
always starts when I move the mouse (not every time of course) so could 
it be Xorg 7.3 not playing nicely with the mouse driver - or the USB 
driver since my mouse is a USB one? Which may explain why some people 
see the problem and others don't?


This is really becoming a big PITA.

Regards,

Mark
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Re: X.org 7.3 sure is a mess...

2008-03-19 Thread Peter Boosten

Mark Ovens wrote:


The other thing I've noticed is, on my box at least, that the problem 
always starts when I move the mouse (not every time of course) so could 
it be Xorg 7.3 not playing nicely with the mouse driver - or the USB 
driver since my mouse is a USB one? Which may explain why some people 
see the problem and others don't?


My mouse is on USB, still no problems.



This is really becoming a big PITA.



So I wonder how we can help the port maintainer to fix the issue. Maybe 
it's an idea to collect some data on installed ports (including 
versions), used hardware and whether or not one has problems?


The only problem I'm having since 7.3 btw (I forgot about that, but just 
remembered) is everytime I start nethack-qt (either local or remote) X 
restarts, kicking me out of my session.


Peter

--
http://www.boosten.org
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Re: X.org 7.3 sure is a mess...

2008-03-19 Thread Dominic Fandrey

Scott Bennett wrote:

 Now that I've upgraded to X.org 7.3, I'm wishing that I hadn't done it.
...
 I'm still discovering more and more broken stuff in 7.3 each day.  It's
only partially usable. ...


Did you check the integrity of your libraries? Are you maybe using portupgrade 
that keeps copies of old libraries in /usr/local/lib/compat/pkg ? Maybe some 
things are still linked against these, this can lead to a load of trouble.


You can install sysutils/bsdadminscripts and run pkg_libchk to check the 
integrity of your system.

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Re: X.org 7.3 sure is a mess...

2008-03-18 Thread Wojciech Puchar
well i just reinstalled my packages from scratch (too much mess till 
today), with Xorg 7.3, now opera only not firefox, xterm, gimp etc..


all works fine


On Tue, 18 Mar 2008, Scott Bennett wrote:


Now that I've upgraded to X.org 7.3, I'm wishing that I hadn't done it.
Firefox hangs the server, using lots of CPU time, and the only way to get
the screen, keyboard, and mouse access again is to power the machine down and
up again, and then reboot.  The xscreensaver modules mostly display nicely in
the little window in the xscreensaver preferences panel, but about half of
them when run in full-screen mode immediately crash the X server on a signal
11.  PuTTY (installed from a port) is missing its terminal fonts, so I'm
stuck using ssh(1) inside an xterm.
I'm still discovering more and more broken stuff in 7.3 each day.  It's
only partially usable.  How did this release ever make it out the door?  What
a mess.  I suppose I can restore from the backups to get back to 6.9, though,
but what a drag.  All that mucking around to get through the upgrade, and for
this??  Pardon my frustration, please.


 Scott Bennett, Comm. ASMELG, CFIAG
**
* Internet:   bennett at cs.niu.edu  *
**
* A well regulated and disciplined militia, is at all times a good  *
* objection to the introduction of that bane of all free governments *
* -- a standing army.   *
*-- Gov. John Hancock, New York Journal, 28 January 1790 *
**
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Re: X.org 7.3 sure is a mess...

2008-03-18 Thread Peter Boosten



Scott Bennett wrote:

 Now that I've upgraded to X.org 7.3, I'm wishing that I hadn't done it.
Firefox hangs the server, using lots of CPU time, and the only way to get
the screen, keyboard, and mouse access again is to power the machine down and
up again, and then reboot.  The xscreensaver modules mostly display nicely in
the little window in the xscreensaver preferences panel, but about half of
them when run in full-screen mode immediately crash the X server on a signal
11.  PuTTY (installed from a port) is missing its terminal fonts, so I'm
stuck using ssh(1) inside an xterm.
 I'm still discovering more and more broken stuff in 7.3 each day.  It's
only partially usable.  How did this release ever make it out the door?  What
a mess.  I suppose I can restore from the backups to get back to 6.9, though,
but what a drag.  All that mucking around to get through the upgrade, and for
this??  Pardon my frustration, please.



Looks like you're having a problem with your window manager, instead of 
Xorg.


Mine (with enlightenment-devel) works like charm. None of the issues you 
describe anyway.


Peter

--
http://www.boosten.org
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Re: X.org 7.3 sure is a mess...

2008-03-18 Thread Norberto Meijome
On Tue, 18 Mar 2008 11:19:19 +0100
Peter Boosten [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Looks like you're having a problem with your window manager, instead of 
 Xorg.
 
 Mine (with enlightenment-devel) works like charm. None of the issues you 
 describe anyway.

indeed - i've jumped onto 7.3 as soon as it hit the ports tree. I'm using XFCE 
4, on a relatively slow single cpu laptop and it just works as great as ever 
(quite well :P ).

what cpu / wm are you using? what were you using before the upgrade ?

_
{Beto|Norberto|Numard} Meijome

Caminante no hay camino, se hace camino al andar
   Antonio Machado

I speak for myself, not my employer. Contents may be hot. Slippery when wet. 
Reading disclaimers makes you go blind. Writing them is worse. You have been 
Warned.
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Re: X.org 7.3 sure is a mess...

2008-03-18 Thread Peter Boosten



Norberto Meijome wrote:

On Tue, 18 Mar 2008 11:19:19 +0100
Peter Boosten [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

Looks like you're having a problem with your window manager, instead of 
Xorg.


Mine (with enlightenment-devel) works like charm. None of the issues you 
describe anyway.


indeed - i've jumped onto 7.3 as soon as it hit the ports tree. I'm using XFCE 
4, on a relatively slow single cpu laptop and it just works as great as ever 
(quite well :P ).

what cpu / wm are you using? what were you using before the upgrade ?


Are you asking me?

I'm on a very old laptop, a Toshiba Satellite Pro 4300 (I think), 500Mhz 
Celeron. I tried a myriad different wm's, but none of them really were 
what I was searching for (but they worked all). I didn't try KDE/Gnome, 
because my old laptop would not be able to handle them, and have 
functionality I'm not looking for.


While enlightenment-devel still has its bugs (for instance 'lock screen' 
really does, it won't accept any password as valid - but it doesn't 
hang) it's fast, small, cool :-)


Peter

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Re: X.org 7.3 sure is a mess...

2008-03-18 Thread Peter Boosten

Ken Gunderson wrote:

[snip]
Looks like you're having a problem with your window manager, instead of 
Xorg.


Mine (with enlightenment-devel) works like charm. None of the issues
you describe anyway.

Peter


So how would you explain that I am seeing same type of behaviors in
straight startx with default twm, i.e. bundled Xorg wm?



Dunno. But the troubles cannot originate from the xorg ports, or 
everyone would see the same behaviour, right?


Maybe some other port, or hardware (maybe your video card? - just 
guessing), or the driver for that particular piece of hardware.


Peter

--
http://www.boosten.org
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