Re: well, try here first...
Robert Bonomi wrote: > > Date: Wed, 14 Nov 2012 05:48:48 +0100 > > From: Polytropon > > Subject: Re: well, try here first... > > > > On Tue, 13 Nov 2012 20:20:51 -0700, Chad Leigh Shire.Net LLC wrote: > > > > > > To be fair, a lot of the same rules exist for English. The > > > comma is not optional or left to preferences in English, > > > either. There are definite rules and it brings structure. > > > > That matches what I've learned in school, but it doesn't match > > realitiy anymore. :-) > > > > A famous thing is "comma in lists": Unlike German, where "and" > > substitutes a comma, in English it seems to be valid to put a > > comma infront of "and": > > In 'classic' English (as taught in the 60s and earlier), a comma > was _required_ before a trailing 'and' in a list of 3 or more > items, and forbidden if there were only two items. By the time I got to high school (mid-60's), the comma before 'and' (or 'or') in a list of three or more was being taught as optional. My junior-in-college daughter tells me it is still being taught that way today. She and I have each come to the conclusion that it should _not_ be considered optional, because omitting it can sometimes cause the last two items in the list to appear as one item (at least on a first reading -- and one should not need to read things a second time to understand the punctuation). Last I heard, we have the Associated Press to thank for this travesty, their style manual having been revised in the late 1950's or early 1960's to say something along the lines of "don't use a comma in that situation unless it's necessary for clarity." I suppose it may have had something to do with saving a fraction of a second of Teletype time, and a minuscule amount of space in a newspaper column (which could occasionally lengthen/shorten a story by an entire line), every time such a construct turned up in a news story. Neither column space nor Teletype time was exactly inexpensive back then. > The accepted 'rules' changed about the time "new math" was foisted > on the world. The most visible ones involved comma placement, and > punctuation inside trailing quotes. > > The password is "frodo." > It is 5 characters long. > > The password is "frodo." > It is 6 characters long. > > BAH, HUMBUG!!! > > Make the first one: > The password is "frodo". > and all the ambiguity goes away.<*snarl*> I think the AP may have been behind this one too, although I don't see how the rationalization could have involved either space or transmission time. Meanwhile, a question mark or exclamation point in the same circumstances is supposed to be placed inside _or_ outside the closing quotation mark, depending on whether or not it is part of the material being quoted. IMO it makes more sense to apply that same rule to periods and commas also. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"
Re: well, try here first...
On Wed, 14 Nov 2012 00:58:02 -0600 (CST) Robert Bonomi wrote: > In 'classic' English (as taught in the 60s and earlier), a comma was > _required_ before a trailing 'and' in a list of 3 or more items, and > forbidden if there were only two items. Not really: http://oxforddictionaries.com/words/what-is-the-oxford-comma Perhaps is should be taken to "chat", it has nothing to do with FreeBSD. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"
Re: well, try here first...
Hi, On Wed, 14 Nov 2012 03:58:14 +0100 Polytropon wrote: > On Wed, 14 Nov 2012 08:26:00 +0700, Erich Dollansky wrote: > > Hi, > > > > On Tue, 13 Nov 2012 17:07:38 -0800 > > Gary Kline wrote: > > > > > On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 04:47:48AM +0700, Erich Dollansky wrote: > > > > Hi, > > > > > > > > On Tue, 13 Nov 2012 11:00:07 -0800 > > > > Gary Kline wrote: > > > > > > > > > On Tue, Nov 13, 2012 at 09:12:55AM +0100, Polytropon wrote: > > > > > > On Tue, 13 Nov 2012 15:10:33 +0700, Erich Dollansky wrote: > > > > > > > Hi, > > > > > > > > ja vohl. futher dhclient is there. I'll go > > > > > > > > back to > > > > > > > > > > > > > > you wanted to say 'jawohl'? > > > > > > > > > > > > Jawohl mein Herr! :-) > > > > > > > > > > > What, no comma!? > > > > > > > > what the Playboy did to the German language ... > > > > > > > > Playboy's German tag line missed out on a comma too. It was > > > > obviously a mistake. I have heard that they brought it back > > > > after decades of no comma in the tag line. > > > > > > > > > do you mean that it was "Play boy"? or what? what was the > > > tag line? > > > > > Playboy alles was Maennern Spass macht > > Ouch. > > Unlike in English, the comma in German is an important symbol > in grammar. It brings structure to sentences. In English, there > is the "word order" that achieves this goal, and a comma is > mostly optional or "left to preferences". In German, there are > rules where to place a comma, and where not to. Those rules > are relatively easy to understand, and luckily they do not > leave much space for individual preferences. :-) > > In the above example, > > Playboy, alles was Maennern Spass macht > > or better using a hyphen > > Playboy - alles was Maennern Spass macht > > would have been correct, as it's shown on the current web page > in a correct manner. > I have had to open playboy.de again. Just for the comma. I think that it is a bit more complicated. Especially as Playboy is here the brand 'Alles, was Maennern Spass macht' is the tag line and needs a comma after alles. Playboy does it now properly in the header of their site but wrongly in the title. Your second line with the hyphen is there the best option if there would be the comma after alles. I never would have believed that Playboy becomes part of a serious discussion which started with an sshd problem. Ok, the world knows now the importance of Playboy for the IT world. Erich ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"
Re: well, try here first...
> Date: Wed, 14 Nov 2012 05:48:48 +0100
> From: Polytropon
> Subject: Re: well, try here first...
>
> On Tue, 13 Nov 2012 20:20:51 -0700, Chad Leigh Shire.Net LLC wrote:
> >
> > To be fair, a lot of the same rules exist for English. The comma
> > is not optional or left to preferences in English, either. There
> > are definite rules and it brings structure.
>
> That matches what I've learned in school, but it doesn't match
> realitiy anymore. :-)
>
> A famous thing is "comma in lists": Unlike German, where "and"
> substitutes a comma, in English it seems to be valid to put a
> comma infront of "and":
In 'classic' English (as taught in the 60s and earlier), a comma was
_required_ before a trailing 'and' in a list of 3 or more items, and forbidden
if there were only two items.
The famous "eats roots, shoots..." would parse as eating 3 objects, with the
comma before the 'and'.
for three actions, change the 'and' to 'then', comma before 'then'.
If eating two objects, "eats roots AND shoots *comma* and..." (emphasis added)
The accepted 'rules' changed about the time "new math" was foisted on the
world. The most visible ones involved comma placement, and punctuation
inside trailing quotes.
The password is "frodo."
It is 5 characters long.
The password is "frodo."
It is 6 characters long.
BAH, HUMBUG!!!
Make the first one:
The password is "frodo".
and all the ambiguity goes away.<*snarl*>
> He bought a glass, a towel, a toothpick, and a nose.
>
> In German, that would be
>
> Er kaufte ein Glas, ein Handtuch, einen Zahnstocker
> und eine Nase.
how do you write:
The sandwich choices are: tuna salad, chicken, roast beef and
ham, and cheese.
*without* making the last option a '{2 meats} and cheese' sandwich ??
(the next-to-last has two types of meat on it)
<*EVIL* grin>
> Note that the structure of a sentence, aided by
> punctuation, is an important part during the reading experience.
> Sentences that do not show any structure are hard to read and
> to understand, and a missing comma can decide about life or
> death easily:
>
> KILL HIM NOT WAIT UNTIL I ARRIVE
the traditional one of these in English is:
Go kill Joe Brown
_who_ is to die depends on whether or not there is a comma after
the second word. Ditto for who -does- the deed.
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Re: well, try here first...
On Tue, 13 Nov 2012 22:27:37 -0700, Chad Leigh Shire.Net LLC wrote: > > On Nov 13, 2012, at 9:48 PM, Polytropon wrote: > > > That matches what I've learned in school, but it doesn't match > > realitiy anymore. :-) > > > > A famous thing is "comma in lists": Unlike German, where "and" > > substitutes a comma, in English it seems to be valid to put a > > comma infront of "and": > > > > He bought a glass, a towel, a toothpick, and a nose. > > > > In German, that would be > > > > Er kaufte ein Glas, ein Handtuch, einen Zahnstocker > > und eine Nase. > > > This is interesting, because the comma before the "and" in a list > is much more understandable, because it is open to less interpretation. This is different to "'and' substitutes a comma", but makes sense. For example, I prefer reading the english documentation of FreeBSD (manpages, handbook, FAQ and articles) over their often sloppily and quite "mechanically" done translations. Good quality in documentation helps to raise the quality of the complete product. > This is where the "eats shoots and leaves" comes in, kind of. > There are similar examples where ambiguity arises from the > lack of a comma before "and" in a list. The comma before > the "and" is traditional English. Interesting, thanks for this pointer. So "modern English" is what makes the difference here... > There are, however, lots of people who advocate for the lack > of a comma before the "and" in a list and that is taught in > some classes in some schools. This kind of arbitraryness is not good. Whatever "way" is preferred, it should be used consistently. > I don't claim to be a great German speaker or writer. I have > not visited there in 12 years nor lived there in almost 20 years. > But people at least can understand me and I can get my point > across. :) With enough mental variability, that shouldn't be a problem. :-) > Most of my post was meant to support what you were saying, btw. > As well as give examples and interesting tidbits. I agree that > proper grammar is important in language, even when I don't always > use it or do it; especially in informal speech like email lists, > forums, etc. Personally I do not "make" such differences. Proper spelling is easier (at least for me) than artificially avoiding it, like _not_ putting a comma where it belongs to, _not_ capitalizing a word that is to be capitalized, or _not_ using the proper spelling in favour of some "variant". However, I'm not considered "normal" so whatever I do does not imply anything. :-) > > But pleese pay atension too, the new englis orfograffy which > > make`s every thing easyer to under stand and, more freedems > > to mak punctation and les speeling errer's. > > > > Funkzionier't auch in, Deutsch! :-) > > > You must really be taking a conniption fit with the changes > (Verbilligen -- cheapening -- though the exact words I was > searching for have failed me tonight) that have happened in > German in the last 10 or so years ( striking of ß; to always > be written with "ss" now, etc)... The Eszett has been abolished in Switzerland, not in Germany. The "new" rule (historically: old, has been abolished after about 100 years in use because too much prone to errors) says something about "short vs. long vowels" which is nonsense (as vowel length depends on dialect, not on spelling), so some valid ß get turned into ss. Effect: Most valid ß get turned into ss, and even some innocent s get turned into ss, like Massband or Zeugniss. :-) I'm still looking for a valid translation of "bespaßen", an accusative-passive construct of "to entertain somebody". :-) > >> Und "Playboy alles was Maennern Spass macht" ist 100% verständlich > >> auf deutsch, da es einen richtigen Dativ Kasus gibt, im Gegensatz > >> zu englischer Sprache. > > > > It may be 100% understandable, but it's not correct, because it's > > not a sentence or a grammatically valid construct. The translation > > would have been (quite literally, I admit): > > > > Playboy everything what men fun makes > > Actually, no. A more correct translation would be: >Playboy everything that to men fun makes. Yes, that's much more valid, that's why I wrote "literally", which means sloppy and possibly wrong, because I didn't find a proper way to have the dative case "encoding" without adding additional words, so it's even wronger. :-) > [Or, if you wanted the same mistake (lack of comma or hyphen) but > proper English word order: Playboy everything that is fun for men.] Whom is it fun for? +Dativ. Whom is it fun to? +Dativ. Sadly, I can't bring the "Dativ joke" here: Ulli hat Dativ mitgebracht - für jedem einem. Ulli has brought Dativ - one for everyone. Yes, the translation isn't funny anymore. :-( > "Männern" is dative case, which, when used without a preposition, > is best translated as "to " where is written > with dative case endings. Case endings and clear preposition requirements are something m
Re: well, try here first...
On Nov 13, 2012, at 9:48 PM, Polytropon wrote: > That matches what I've learned in school, but it doesn't match > realitiy anymore. :-) > > A famous thing is "comma in lists": Unlike German, where "and" > substitutes a comma, in English it seems to be valid to put a > comma infront of "and": > > He bought a glass, a towel, a toothpick, and a nose. > > In German, that would be > > Er kaufte ein Glas, ein Handtuch, einen Zahnstocker > und eine Nase. This is interesting, because the comma before the "and" in a list is much more understandable, because it is open to less interpretation. This is where the "eats shoots and leaves" comes in, kind of. There are similar examples where ambiguity arises from the lack of a comma before "and" in a list. The comma before the "and" is traditional English. There are, however, lots of people who advocate for the lack of a comma before the "and" in a list and that is taught in some classes in some schools. I don't claim to be a great German speaker or writer. I have not visited there in 12 years nor lived there in almost 20 years. But people at least can understand me and I can get my point across. :) Most of my post was meant to support what you were saying, btw. As well as give examples and interesting tidbits. I agree that proper grammar is important in language, even when I don't always use it or do it; especially in informal speech like email lists, forums, etc. > But pleese pay atension too, the new englis orfograffy which > make`s every thing easyer to under stand and, more freedems > to mak punctation and les speeling errer's. > > Funkzionier't auch in, Deutsch! :-) You must really be taking a conniption fit with the changes (Verbilligen -- cheapening -- though the exact words I was searching for have failed me tonight) that have happened in German in the last 10 or so years ( striking of ß; to always be written with "ss" now, etc)... >> >> Und "Playboy alles was Maennern Spass macht" ist 100% verständlich >> auf deutsch, da es einen richtigen Dativ Kasus gibt, im Gegensatz >> zu englischer Sprache. > > It may be 100% understandable, but it's not correct, because it's > not a sentence or a grammatically valid construct. The translation > would have been (quite literally, I admit): > > Playboy everything what men fun makes Actually, no. A more correct translation would be:Playboy everything that to men fun makes. [Or, if you wanted the same mistake (lack of comma or hyphen) but proper English word order: Playboy everything that is fun for men.] "Männern" is dative case, which, when used without a preposition, is best translated as "to " where is written with dative case endings. > > Again, a hyphen after the 1st word would it much more readable. > > > >> (and "playboy -- everything that is fun for men" [in German] is >> 100% understandable in German, because there is a real dative case >> in German, unlike in english.) > > In _that_ translation, you've used the hyphen correctly (which was > missing in the german version discussed). > Yes, my bad. I was trying to write it the same but fixed it unconsciously. regards Chad
Re: well, try here first...
On Tue, 13 Nov 2012 20:20:51 -0700, Chad Leigh Shire.Net LLC wrote: > > On Nov 13, 2012, at 7:58 PM, Polytropon wrote: > > > > Ouch. > > > > Unlike in English, the comma in German is an important symbol > > in grammar. It brings structure to sentences. In English, there > > is the "word order" that achieves this goal, and a comma is > > mostly optional or "left to preferences". In German, there are > > rules where to place a comma, and where not to. Those rules > > are relatively easy to understand, and luckily they do not > > leave much space for individual preferences. :-) > > > > In the above example, > > > > Playboy, alles was Maennern Spass macht > > > > or better using a hyphen > > > > Playboy - alles was Maennern Spass macht > > > > would have been correct, as it's shown on the current web page > > in a correct manner. > > To be fair, a lot of the same rules exist for English. The comma > is not optional or left to preferences in English, either. There > are definite rules and it brings structure. That matches what I've learned in school, but it doesn't match realitiy anymore. :-) A famous thing is "comma in lists": Unlike German, where "and" substitutes a comma, in English it seems to be valid to put a comma infront of "and": He bought a glass, a towel, a toothpick, and a nose. In German, that would be Er kaufte ein Glas, ein Handtuch, einen Zahnstocker und eine Nase. There are in fact only two exceptions of "comma prior to 'and'" in German. But I don't want to start a school lesson here. The exceptions are closures and appended main clause. :-) > Unfortunately, lots of people forget (or don't pay attention to) > these rules, or, they are casual with them in the casual forms of > communication, like email. Well, I don't think that the e-mail (as a medium) implies abandoning rules for written language. Sure, it's "sloppy" very often, but it should not mangle the languge in a way that the reader has to guess or to ask for what the writer wanted to express. Proper spelling and punctuation help a lot, and it should not be "too much struggle" to get it right: children learn it in the early years in school, so why should adults forget it? > (And there are some people who believe that the "text" language > is English -- OMG, WTF, GR8, B4, LOL, etc -- > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Text_language ) There is also a transition of this written representation to spoken language - some (young) people actually speaking like SMS. I don't think that people actually confuse SMS text with the actual english language. They could have done so almost 100 years ago with Q groups and abbreviations used in amateur radio telegraphy (and even in phone mode), ok dr om, hw? :-) All those "specific language deviations" have their place and are fully valid. It depends on context. For example, if you got a business letter with every 3rd word spelled wrong and containing "SMS and L33T slang", would you take it as a serious information? Form and content have to match. Nobody would accept a tax form printed on toilet paper, even if it would be 100% correct in all content and number details. > Wie mit deutscher Sprache, man kann (mit englischer Sprache) vieles > mit der Wortstellung machen. Und dazu, ist, natürlich, die richtige > Anwendung (und Verständnis) der Grammatik wichtig. Sure it is, but it's not about an 1:1 translation. You need to "think in German" if you want to get it fully right. Baumkuchen... :-) Your sentence would have been: In der deutschen Sprache kann man (wie in der englischen Sprache) vieles mit der Wortstellung machen. Dazu ist natürlich die richtige Anwendung (und das Verstaendnis) der Grammatik wichtig. That is little difference, but it makes a big difference in readability. Note that the structure of a sentence, aided by punctuation, is an important part during the reading experience. Sentences that do not show any structure are hard to read and to understand, and a missing comma can decide about life or death easily: KILL HIM NOT WAIT UNTIL I ARRIVE It's either "kill him, not wait until I arrive" or "kill him not, wait until I arrive", and this translation is not very good as "nicht" ~= "do not" cannot be represented so nicely as in the german equivalent "sentence". Er begann seinen Hut auf dem Kopf zu essen. is another (famous) example of how a missing comma can confuse the reader: "He started eating the hat on his head" is the first interpretation, even if "He started eating, (having) the hat on his head", and the comma already makes this difference. > (Like with the German language, one can do a lot with word order > (in English). And for that, the proper use and understanding of > Grammar is important) > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eats,_Shoots_%26_Leaves Haha, nice! :-) But pleese pay atension too, the new englis orfograffy which make`s every thing easyer to under stand and, more freedems to mak punctat
Re: well, try here first...
On Tue, 13 Nov 2012 20:09:08 -0800, Gary Kline wrote:
> On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 02:35:43AM +0100, Polytropon wrote:
> > > box. it's got a web interface and runs some flavor of firewall that
> > > I never studied. yuk.
> >
> > I assume your "HW firewall" protects you to the outside. Of
> > course it should allow SSH connections from the outside to
> > the "tao" box _if_ you want it that way.
>
>
> my netgear and pfSense setup surprised me this afternoon. the
> initial setup listed my internal IP as
>
> 10.47.0.114,
>
> but something I did changed the DHCP leases section to
>
> 10.47.0.113 .
>
> after that, I could ssh out and then ssh back to tao.
If you have the option of configuring the DHCP subsystem to
hand out IPs according to MAC addresses, that should make you
safe from reboots and _possible_ new IPs. (At least that's
how I've configured my home system so every device will get
the same IP, no matter how or when it requests one from the
DHCP server. It also includes certain port redirections so
a SSH request from external source will _always_ be directed
to the _correct_ machine on the LAN.)
> > But I was thinking about the firewall run by the Fedora OS
> > that might block SSH connections to "tao", no matter from
> > where they come, just as if you would have set up FreeBSD's
> > ipfw with the default to deny connections: without explicitely
> > enabling SSH connections the server cannot be reached, no
> > matter if it's running.
> >
>
> I havent used ipfw for many years. the most recent firewall I
> ran was on FBSD 5.X and was {i think} "pfw". I got quite good
> at it. I should learn more about plain "pf" and pfSense.
> do you know if pf/pfsense defaults to DENY incoming connections?
> that would explain a Lot!
That depends on the pre-configuration of the firewall on the
Linux side. From reading the article I've mentioned, I got the
impression that the firewall would deny SSH connections per
default, and that _you_ would have to enable it if you wanted
to use that service. That is comparable to OpenBSD's "service
disabled by default" policy. I'm still not sure if this idea
will get much love or understanding in Linux land where an
"do everything out of the box" experience seems to be very
important among some distributions. :-)
On FreeBSD, ipfw can DEFAULT_TO_DENY or DEFAULT_TO_ACCEPT, and you
have to specify your rules usually according to the chosen paradigm.
Of course, there are rules to achieve the same effect, even if in
the opposite paradigm.
> > > > > > The way _how_ to enable it depends on the distribution you're
> > > > > > using and is very different among the Linusi.
> > > > >
> > > > > rt., and this is fedora, my least fav distro. But I've always
> > > > > had
> > > > > trouble with ssh, even with FBSD.
> > > >
> > > > There is a nice summary on how to get the OpenSSH server
> > > > set up on Fedora:
> > > >
> > > > http://www.techotopia.com/index.php/Configuring_Fedora_Linux_Remote_Access_using_SSH
> > > >
> > > > Basically, it's about installing and enabling it. The article
> > > > also discusses how to enable configure the firewall properly.
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > > thank you. I'll ck it out. also google other stuff if I have to.
> >
> > Check if the Techotopia article matches your version of Fedora.
> > It shows how to install and enable the SSH server and also
> > mentions the "built-in" firewall that has to be configured
> > to allow connections to that server.
>
>
> the URL you had was fedora-13; what I installed fedora-17.
> and just recently--maybe when I rebooted--i saw fedora-19[?]
> not sure... .
Then there's the possibility that things have changed. Even though
there should not be a massive or paradigm-wide shift in things, you
never know when using automated updating on Linux. Still the
instructions should be usable at least to identify the steps
involved and the tools to be used.
--
Polytropon
Magdeburg, Germany
Happy FreeBSD user since 4.0
Andra moi ennepe, Mousa, ...
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Re: well, try here first...
On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 04:01:20AM +0100, Bernt Hansson wrote:
> 2012-11-13 06:22, Gary Kline skrev:
> >
> > guys,
> >
> > hold your flame-throwers, because this is about how to get ssh working
> > from an outside computer into my brand new "tao" that is running a
> > flavor of linux. I just got my quad i5 box to replace the old, broken
> > tao. this was the box with the busted USB. [!] Anyway, linux is
> > installed; the box is on my internal IP net. I can ssh *out*. to my
> > server, vut from my server or wherever, I cant ssh back in.
> >
> > doing an % ssh 10.47.0.114 OR ssh tao gives me an instant
> > "Connection refused". if I try an ssh -X tao I get a string like
> > "Connnection closed". can any of you network wizards or setup
> > wizards clue me in. {FWIW:: the ssh stuff is from OpenBSD.}
> >
> > anybody know what im NOT doing?
>
> You have to start the ssh daemon (sshd)
this may have been what did the trick; also, you need the full
path.
--
Gary Kline kl...@thought.org http://www.thought.org Public Service Unix
Twenty-six years of service to the Unix community.
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Re: well, try here first...
On Nov 13, 2012, at 7:58 PM, Polytropon wrote: > > Ouch. > > Unlike in English, the comma in German is an important symbol > in grammar. It brings structure to sentences. In English, there > is the "word order" that achieves this goal, and a comma is > mostly optional or "left to preferences". In German, there are > rules where to place a comma, and where not to. Those rules > are relatively easy to understand, and luckily they do not > leave much space for individual preferences. :-) > > In the above example, > > Playboy, alles was Maennern Spass macht > > or better using a hyphen > > Playboy - alles was Maennern Spass macht > > would have been correct, as it's shown on the current web page > in a correct manner. To be fair, a lot of the same rules exist for English. The comma is not optional or left to preferences in English, either. There are definite rules and it brings structure. Unfortunately, lots of people forget (or don't pay attention to) these rules, or, they are casual with them in the casual forms of communication, like email. (And there are some people who believe that the "text" language is English -- OMG, WTF, GR8, B4, LOL, etc -- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Text_language ) Wie mit deutscher Sprache, man kann (mit englischer Sprache) vieles mit der Wortstellung machen. Und dazu, ist, natürlich, die richtige Anwendung (und Verständnis) der Grammatik wichtig. (Like with the German language, one can do a lot with word order (in English). And for that, the proper use and understanding of Grammar is important) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eats,_Shoots_%26_Leaves Und "Playboy alles was Maennern Spass macht" ist 100% verständlich auf deutsch, da es einen richtigen Dativ Kasus gibt, im Gegensatz zu englischer Sprache. (and "playboy -- everything that is fun for men" [in German] is 100% understandable in German, because there is a real dative case in German, unlike in english.) Gruss aus Utah Chad
Re: well, try here first...
On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 02:35:43AM +0100, Polytropon wrote:
> > box. it's got a web interface and runs some flavor of firewall that
> > I never studied. yuk.
>
> I assume your "HW firewall" protects you to the outside. Of
> course it should allow SSH connections from the outside to
> the "tao" box _if_ you want it that way.
my netgear and pfSense setup surprised me this afternoon. the
initial setup listed my internal IP as
10.47.0.114,
but something I did changed the DHCP leases section to
10.47.0.113 .
after that, I could ssh out and then ssh back to tao.
> But I was thinking about the firewall run by the Fedora OS
> that might block SSH connections to "tao", no matter from
> where they come, just as if you would have set up FreeBSD's
> ipfw with the default to deny connections: without explicitely
> enabling SSH connections the server cannot be reached, no
> matter if it's running.
>
I havent used ipfw for many years. the most recent firewall I
ran was on FBSD 5.X and was {i think} "pfw". I got quite good
at it. I should learn more about plain "pf" and pfSense.
do you know if pf/pfsense defaults to DENY incoming connections?
that would explain a Lot!
>
> > > > > The way _how_ to enable it depends on the distribution you're
> > > > > using and is very different among the Linusi.
> > > >
> > > > rt., and this is fedora, my least fav distro. But I've always
> > > > had
> > > > trouble with ssh, even with FBSD.
> > >
> > > There is a nice summary on how to get the OpenSSH server
> > > set up on Fedora:
> > >
> > > http://www.techotopia.com/index.php/Configuring_Fedora_Linux_Remote_Access_using_SSH
> > >
> > > Basically, it's about installing and enabling it. The article
> > > also discusses how to enable configure the firewall properly.
> > >
> >
> >
> > thank you. I'll ck it out. also google other stuff if I have to.
>
> Check if the Techotopia article matches your version of Fedora.
> It shows how to install and enable the SSH server and also
> mentions the "built-in" firewall that has to be configured
> to allow connections to that server.
the URL you had was fedora-13; what I installed fedora-17.
and just recently--maybe when I rebooted--i saw fedora-19[?]
not sure... .
>
> >From my limited experience with Fedora (haven't used it for some
> time), this looks like what you need to do.
>
well, the deal is that my volunteer system admin worked for
red hat for about 5 years. I'm more used to ubuntu, but my
friend says that im on my own
anyway, things are starting to eork. [!]
>
> --
> Polytropon
> Magdeburg, Germany
> Happy FreeBSD user since 4.0
> Andra moi ennepe, Mousa, ...
--
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Twenty-six years of service to the Unix community.
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Re: well, try here first...
On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 03:58:14AM +0100, Polytropon wrote:
> On Wed, 14 Nov 2012 08:26:00 +0700, Erich Dollansky wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> > On Tue, 13 Nov 2012 17:07:38 -0800
> > Gary Kline wrote:
> >
> > > On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 04:47:48AM +0700, Erich Dollansky wrote:
> > >
> > Playboy alles was Maennern Spass macht
>
> Ouch.
>
> Unlike in English, the comma in German is an important symbol
> in grammar. It brings structure to sentences. In English, there
> is the "word order" that achieves this goal, and a comma is
> mostly optional or "left to preferences". In German, there are
> rules where to place a comma, and where not to. Those rules
> are relatively easy to understand, and luckily they do not
> leave much space for individual preferences. :-)
>
> In the above example,
>
> Playboy, alles was Maennern Spass macht
>
> or better using a hyphen
>
> Playboy - alles was Maennern Spass macht
>
> would have been correct, as it's shown on the current web page
> in a correct manner.
>
So! this explains a lot that I've noticed over the years.
remember that im beyong =getting= old; I really Am old.
before I started high school, the rules for commas were
almost set in concrete. my english teacher took points off
if there was an incorrect comma. it looks like in germany
language has remained very strict. {but then, that's why
punctuation exists.}
I've noticed an easing of punctuation--esp'ly in the use of
commas--in how I was taught. but let's face it: it's easier
to text by slacking off. :)
>
>
>
> --
> Polytropon
> Magdeburg, Germany
> Happy FreeBSD user since 4.0
> Andra moi ennepe, Mousa, ...
--
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Re: well, try here first...
On Wed, 14 Nov 2012 08:26:00 +0700, Erich Dollansky wrote: > Hi, > > On Tue, 13 Nov 2012 17:07:38 -0800 > Gary Kline wrote: > > > On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 04:47:48AM +0700, Erich Dollansky wrote: > > > Hi, > > > > > > On Tue, 13 Nov 2012 11:00:07 -0800 > > > Gary Kline wrote: > > > > > > > On Tue, Nov 13, 2012 at 09:12:55AM +0100, Polytropon wrote: > > > > > On Tue, 13 Nov 2012 15:10:33 +0700, Erich Dollansky wrote: > > > > > > Hi, > > > > > > > ja vohl. futher dhclient is there. I'll go back to > > > > > > > > > > > > you wanted to say 'jawohl'? > > > > > > > > > > Jawohl mein Herr! :-) > > > > > > > > > What, no comma!? > > > > > > what the Playboy did to the German language ... > > > > > > Playboy's German tag line missed out on a comma too. It was > > > obviously a mistake. I have heard that they brought it back after > > > decades of no comma in the tag line. > > > > > > do you mean that it was "Play boy"? or what? what was the tag > > line? > > > Playboy alles was Maennern Spass macht Ouch. Unlike in English, the comma in German is an important symbol in grammar. It brings structure to sentences. In English, there is the "word order" that achieves this goal, and a comma is mostly optional or "left to preferences". In German, there are rules where to place a comma, and where not to. Those rules are relatively easy to understand, and luckily they do not leave much space for individual preferences. :-) In the above example, Playboy, alles was Maennern Spass macht or better using a hyphen Playboy - alles was Maennern Spass macht would have been correct, as it's shown on the current web page in a correct manner. -- Polytropon Magdeburg, Germany Happy FreeBSD user since 4.0 Andra moi ennepe, Mousa, ... ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"
Re: well, try here first...
2012-11-13 06:22, Gary Kline skrev:
guys,
hold your flame-throwers, because this is about how to get ssh working
from an outside computer into my brand new "tao" that is running a
flavor of linux. I just got my quad i5 box to replace the old, broken
tao. this was the box with the busted USB. [!] Anyway, linux is
installed; the box is on my internal IP net. I can ssh *out*. to my
server, vut from my server or wherever, I cant ssh back in.
doing an % ssh 10.47.0.114 OR ssh tao gives me an instant
"Connection refused". if I try an ssh -X tao I get a string like
"Connnection closed". can any of you network wizards or setup
wizards clue me in. {FWIW:: the ssh stuff is from OpenBSD.}
anybody know what im NOT doing?
You have to start the ssh daemon (sshd)
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Re: well, try here first...
On Tue, 13 Nov 2012 10:50:40 -0800, Gary Kline wrote:
> On Tue, Nov 13, 2012 at 09:08:12AM +0100, Polytropon wrote:
> > On Mon, 12 Nov 2012 23:57:21 -0800, Gary Kline wrote:
> > > On Tue, Nov 13, 2012 at 06:39:52AM +0100, Polytropon wrote:
> > > > On Mon, 12 Nov 2012 21:22:00 -0800, Gary Kline wrote:
> > > > > Anyway, linux is
> > > > > installed; the box is on my internal IP net. I can ssh *out*.
> > > > > to my
> > > > > server, vut from my server or wherever, I cant ssh back in.
> > > > >
> > > > > doing an % ssh 10.47.0.114 OR ssh tao gives me an instant
> > > > > "Connection refused". if I try an ssh -X tao I get a string
> > > > > like
> > > > > "Connnection closed". can any of you network wizards or setup
> > > > > wizards clue me in. {FWIW:: the ssh stuff is from OpenBSD.}
> > > >
> > > > Have you checked that tao is actually running a SSH server?
> > >
> > > ja vohl. futher dhclient is there. I'll go back to comparing
> > > tao to ethic.
> >
> > The dhclient is a client (just as the ssh program), while
> > the system has to run some kind of SSH _server_ (sshd on
> > FreeBSD for example). Additionally, network configuration
> > and especially firewall has to _permit_ the access to that
> > specific service (that has to be enabled).
>
>
> hmmm. that might be it. my firewall is in a nice small, 4w netgear
> box. it's got a web interface and runs some flavor of firewall that
> I never studied. yuk.
I assume your "HW firewall" protects you to the outside. Of
course it should allow SSH connections from the outside to
the "tao" box _if_ you want it that way.
But I was thinking about the firewall run by the Fedora OS
that might block SSH connections to "tao", no matter from
where they come, just as if you would have set up FreeBSD's
ipfw with the default to deny connections: without explicitely
enabling SSH connections the server cannot be reached, no
matter if it's running.
> > > > The way _how_ to enable it depends on the distribution you're
> > > > using and is very different among the Linusi.
> > >
> > > rt., and this is fedora, my least fav distro. But I've always had
> > > trouble with ssh, even with FBSD.
> >
> > There is a nice summary on how to get the OpenSSH server
> > set up on Fedora:
> >
> > http://www.techotopia.com/index.php/Configuring_Fedora_Linux_Remote_Access_using_SSH
> >
> > Basically, it's about installing and enabling it. The article
> > also discusses how to enable configure the firewall properly.
> >
>
>
> thank you. I'll ck it out. also google other stuff if I have to.
Check if the Techotopia article matches your version of Fedora.
It shows how to install and enable the SSH server and also
mentions the "built-in" firewall that has to be configured
to allow connections to that server.
>From my limited experience with Fedora (haven't used it for some
time), this looks like what you need to do.
--
Polytropon
Magdeburg, Germany
Happy FreeBSD user since 4.0
Andra moi ennepe, Mousa, ...
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Re: well, try here first...
Hi,
On Tue, 13 Nov 2012 17:07:38 -0800
Gary Kline wrote:
> On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 04:47:48AM +0700, Erich Dollansky wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> > On Tue, 13 Nov 2012 11:00:07 -0800
> > Gary Kline wrote:
> >
> > > On Tue, Nov 13, 2012 at 09:12:55AM +0100, Polytropon wrote:
> > > > On Tue, 13 Nov 2012 15:10:33 +0700, Erich Dollansky wrote:
> > > > > Hi,
> > > > > > ja vohl. futher dhclient is there. I'll go back to
> > > > >
> > > > > you wanted to say 'jawohl'?
> > > >
> > > > Jawohl mein Herr! :-)
> > > >
> > > What, no comma!?
> >
> > what the Playboy did to the German language ...
> >
> > Playboy's German tag line missed out on a comma too. It was
> > obviously a mistake. I have heard that they brought it back after
> > decades of no comma in the tag line.
>
>
> do you mean that it was "Play boy"? or what? what was the tag
> line?
>
Playboy alles was Maennern Spass macht
Playboy corrected this meanwhile as you can see on www.playboy.de.
Just on the side. Does playboy.com still mirror FreeBSD as they did
many years ago?
Erich
> >
> > You know, while in other countries man could say that they read
> > Playboy only because of the articles, in Germany they read Playboy
> > only to check on the comma.
>
>
> :-) funny. I, of course, =always= read playboy for the
> articles, just like every other guy. {that line goes back to the
> early 1970s. at least.}
>
A brother-in-law does this for another professional reason. He does or
did those days plastic surgery and has had to see the results of other
people's work. Of course, he was also interested in the articles.
Listening to his comments was more fun than reading the humour page of
Playboy.
Erich
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Re: well, try here first...
On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 04:47:48AM +0700, Erich Dollansky wrote:
> Hi,
>
> On Tue, 13 Nov 2012 11:00:07 -0800
> Gary Kline wrote:
>
> > On Tue, Nov 13, 2012 at 09:12:55AM +0100, Polytropon wrote:
> > > On Tue, 13 Nov 2012 15:10:33 +0700, Erich Dollansky wrote:
> > > > Hi,
> > > > > ja vohl. futher dhclient is there. I'll go back to
> > > >
> > > > you wanted to say 'jawohl'?
> > >
> > > Jawohl mein Herr! :-)
> > >
> > What, no comma!?
>
> what the Playboy did to the German language ...
>
> Playboy's German tag line missed out on a comma too. It was obviously a
> mistake. I have heard that they brought it back after decades of no
> comma in the tag line.
do you mean that it was "Play boy"? or what? what was the tag line?
>
> You know, while in other countries man could say that they read Playboy
> only because of the articles, in Germany they read Playboy only to check
> on the comma.
:-) funny. I, of course, =always= read playboy for the articles,
just like every other guy. {that line goes back to the early
1970s. at least.}
gary
>
> Erich
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Re: well, try here first...
On Tue, Nov 13, 2012 at 09:08:12AM +0100, Polytropon wrote:
> On Mon, 12 Nov 2012 23:57:21 -0800, Gary Kline wrote:
> > On Tue, Nov 13, 2012 at 06:39:52AM +0100, Polytropon wrote:
> > > On Mon, 12 Nov 2012 21:22:00 -0800, Gary Kline wrote:
> > > > Anyway, linux is
> > > > installed; the box is on my internal IP net. I can ssh *out*.
> > > > to my
> > > > server, vut from my server or wherever, I cant ssh back in.
> > > >
> > > > doing an % ssh 10.47.0.114 OR ssh tao gives me an instant
> > > > "Connection refused". if I try an ssh -X tao I get a string
> > > > like
> > > > "Connnection closed". can any of you network wizards or setup
> > > > wizards clue me in. {FWIW:: the ssh stuff is from OpenBSD.}
> > >
> > > Have you checked that tao is actually running a SSH server?
> >
> > ja vohl. futher dhclient is there. I'll go back to comparing
> > tao to ethic.
>
> The dhclient is a client (just as the ssh program), while
> the system has to run some kind of SSH _server_ (sshd on
> FreeBSD for example). Additionally, network configuration
> and especially firewall has to _permit_ the access to that
> specific service (that has to be enabled).
>
and I believe you need to give the full path name; that's one of the
things ii just did.
>
> > > The way _how_ to enable it depends on the distribution you're
> > > using and is very different among the Linusi.
> >
> > rt., and this is fedora, my least fav distro. But I've always had
> > trouble with ssh, even with FBSD.
>
> There is a nice summary on how to get the OpenSSH server
> set up on Fedora:
>
> http://www.techotopia.com/index.php/Configuring_Fedora_Linux_Remote_Access_using_SSH
>
> Basically, it's about installing and enabling it. The article
> also discusses how to enable configure the firewall properly.
>
well, it works. im not sure what I did, but no comp;laints!
I'm running pfSense in a netgear box. before I rebooted, my
local IP ended in .114; after and now it moved to .113. when
I did an ssh 10.47.0.113, voila! the new tao requested my password.
and I was in. and go ssh back and forth. Whew!
thanks for the help, guys.
gary
ps: I'v got to figure out how to remove gnome and install kde,
&c, but at least that should be easy.
>
>
>
>
> --
> Polytropon
> Magdeburg, Germany
> Happy FreeBSD user since 4.0
> Andra moi ennepe, Mousa, ...
--
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Twenty-six years of service to the Unix community.
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Re: well, try here first...
Hi,
On Tue, 13 Nov 2012 11:00:07 -0800
Gary Kline wrote:
> On Tue, Nov 13, 2012 at 09:12:55AM +0100, Polytropon wrote:
> > On Tue, 13 Nov 2012 15:10:33 +0700, Erich Dollansky wrote:
> > > Hi,
> > >
> > > On Mon, 12 Nov 2012 23:57:21 -0800
> > > Gary Kline wrote:
> > >
> > > > On Tue, Nov 13, 2012 at 06:39:52AM +0100, Polytropon wrote:
> > > > > On Mon, 12 Nov 2012 21:22:00 -0800, Gary Kline wrote:
> > > > > > Anyway, linux is
> > > > > > installed; the box is on my internal IP net. I can
> > > > > > ssh *out*. to my server, vut from my server or wherever, I
> > > > > > cant ssh back in.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > doing an % ssh 10.47.0.114 OR ssh tao gives me an
> > > > > > instant "Connection refused". if I try an ssh -X tao I get
> > > > > > a string like "Connnection closed". can any of you network
> > > > > > wizards or setup wizards clue me in. {FWIW:: the ssh stuff
> > > > > > is from OpenBSD.}
> > > > >
> > > > > Have you checked that tao is actually running a SSH server?
> > > >
> > > > ja vohl. futher dhclient is there. I'll go back to
> > >
> > > you wanted to say 'jawohl'?
> >
> > Jawohl mein Herr! :-)
> >
> What, no comma!?
what the Playboy did to the German language ...
Playboy's German tag line missed out on a comma too. It was obviously a
mistake. I have heard that they brought it back after decades of no
comma in the tag line.
You know, while in other countries man could say that they read Playboy
only because of the articles, in Germany they read Playboy only to check
on the comma.
Erich
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Re: well, try here first...
On Tue, Nov 13, 2012 at 09:12:55AM +0100, Polytropon wrote:
> On Tue, 13 Nov 2012 15:10:33 +0700, Erich Dollansky wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> > On Mon, 12 Nov 2012 23:57:21 -0800
> > Gary Kline wrote:
> >
> > > On Tue, Nov 13, 2012 at 06:39:52AM +0100, Polytropon wrote:
> > > > On Mon, 12 Nov 2012 21:22:00 -0800, Gary Kline wrote:
> > > > > Anyway, linux is
> > > > > installed; the box is on my internal IP net. I can ssh
> > > > > *out*. to my server, vut from my server or wherever, I cant ssh
> > > > > back in.
> > > > >
> > > > > doing an % ssh 10.47.0.114 OR ssh tao gives me an instant
> > > > > "Connection refused". if I try an ssh -X tao I get a
> > > > > string like "Connnection closed". can any of you network wizards
> > > > > or setup wizards clue me in. {FWIW:: the ssh stuff is from
> > > > > OpenBSD.}
> > > >
> > > > Have you checked that tao is actually running a SSH server?
> > >
> > > ja vohl. futher dhclient is there. I'll go back to
> >
> > you wanted to say 'jawohl'?
>
> Jawohl mein Herr! :-)
>
What, no comma!?
:)
>
> --
> Polytropon
> Magdeburg, Germany
> Happy FreeBSD user since 4.0
> Andra moi ennepe, Mousa, ...
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Re: well, try here first...
On Tue, Nov 13, 2012 at 03:10:33PM +0700, Erich Dollansky wrote:
> Hi,
>
> On Mon, 12 Nov 2012 23:57:21 -0800
> Gary Kline wrote:
>
> > On Tue, Nov 13, 2012 at 06:39:52AM +0100, Polytropon wrote:
> > > On Mon, 12 Nov 2012 21:22:00 -0800, Gary Kline wrote:
> > > > Anyway, linux is
> > > > installed; the box is on my internal IP net. I can ssh
> > > > *out*. to my server, vut from my server or wherever, I cant ssh
> > > > back in.
> > > >
> > > > doing an % ssh 10.47.0.114 OR ssh tao gives me an instant
> > > > "Connection refused". if I try an ssh -X tao I get a
> > > > string like "Connnection closed". can any of you network wizards
> > > > or setup wizards clue me in. {FWIW:: the ssh stuff is from
> > > > OpenBSD.}
> > >
> > > Have you checked that tao is actually running a SSH server?
> >
> > ja vohl. futher dhclient is there. I'll go back to
>
> you wanted to say 'jawohl'?
>
> Erich
Ha! yes! I did not know it was one word, but should have remembered
the "v" should be a "w" ...
--
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Re: well, try here first...
On Tue, Nov 13, 2012 at 09:08:12AM +0100, Polytropon wrote:
> On Mon, 12 Nov 2012 23:57:21 -0800, Gary Kline wrote:
> > On Tue, Nov 13, 2012 at 06:39:52AM +0100, Polytropon wrote:
> > > On Mon, 12 Nov 2012 21:22:00 -0800, Gary Kline wrote:
> > > > Anyway, linux is
> > > > installed; the box is on my internal IP net. I can ssh *out*.
> > > > to my
> > > > server, vut from my server or wherever, I cant ssh back in.
> > > >
> > > > doing an % ssh 10.47.0.114 OR ssh tao gives me an instant
> > > > "Connection refused". if I try an ssh -X tao I get a string
> > > > like
> > > > "Connnection closed". can any of you network wizards or setup
> > > > wizards clue me in. {FWIW:: the ssh stuff is from OpenBSD.}
> > >
> > > Have you checked that tao is actually running a SSH server?
> >
> > ja vohl. futher dhclient is there. I'll go back to comparing
> > tao to ethic.
>
> The dhclient is a client (just as the ssh program), while
> the system has to run some kind of SSH _server_ (sshd on
> FreeBSD for example). Additionally, network configuration
> and especially firewall has to _permit_ the access to that
> specific service (that has to be enabled).
hmmm. that might be it. my firewall is in a nice small, 4w netgear
box. it's got a web interface and runs some flavor of firewall that
I never studied. yuk.
>
>
>
> > > The way _how_ to enable it depends on the distribution you're
> > > using and is very different among the Linusi.
> >
> > rt., and this is fedora, my least fav distro. But I've always had
> > trouble with ssh, even with FBSD.
>
> There is a nice summary on how to get the OpenSSH server
> set up on Fedora:
>
> http://www.techotopia.com/index.php/Configuring_Fedora_Linux_Remote_Access_using_SSH
>
> Basically, it's about installing and enabling it. The article
> also discusses how to enable configure the firewall properly.
>
thank you. I'll ck it out. also google other stuff if I have to.
>
>
>
>
> --
> Polytropon
> Magdeburg, Germany
> Happy FreeBSD user since 4.0
> Andra moi ennepe, Mousa, ...
--
Gary Kline kl...@thought.org http://www.thought.org Public Service Unix
Twenty-six years of service to the Unix community.
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Re: well, try here first...
On Tue, 13 Nov 2012 15:10:33 +0700, Erich Dollansky wrote:
> Hi,
>
> On Mon, 12 Nov 2012 23:57:21 -0800
> Gary Kline wrote:
>
> > On Tue, Nov 13, 2012 at 06:39:52AM +0100, Polytropon wrote:
> > > On Mon, 12 Nov 2012 21:22:00 -0800, Gary Kline wrote:
> > > > Anyway, linux is
> > > > installed; the box is on my internal IP net. I can ssh
> > > > *out*. to my server, vut from my server or wherever, I cant ssh
> > > > back in.
> > > >
> > > > doing an % ssh 10.47.0.114 OR ssh tao gives me an instant
> > > > "Connection refused". if I try an ssh -X tao I get a
> > > > string like "Connnection closed". can any of you network wizards
> > > > or setup wizards clue me in. {FWIW:: the ssh stuff is from
> > > > OpenBSD.}
> > >
> > > Have you checked that tao is actually running a SSH server?
> >
> > ja vohl. futher dhclient is there. I'll go back to
>
> you wanted to say 'jawohl'?
Jawohl mein Herr! :-)
--
Polytropon
Magdeburg, Germany
Happy FreeBSD user since 4.0
Andra moi ennepe, Mousa, ...
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Re: well, try here first...
Hi,
On Mon, 12 Nov 2012 23:57:21 -0800
Gary Kline wrote:
> On Tue, Nov 13, 2012 at 06:39:52AM +0100, Polytropon wrote:
> > On Mon, 12 Nov 2012 21:22:00 -0800, Gary Kline wrote:
> > > Anyway, linux is
> > > installed; the box is on my internal IP net. I can ssh
> > > *out*. to my server, vut from my server or wherever, I cant ssh
> > > back in.
> > >
> > > doing an % ssh 10.47.0.114 OR ssh tao gives me an instant
> > > "Connection refused". if I try an ssh -X tao I get a
> > > string like "Connnection closed". can any of you network wizards
> > > or setup wizards clue me in. {FWIW:: the ssh stuff is from
> > > OpenBSD.}
> >
> > Have you checked that tao is actually running a SSH server?
>
> ja vohl. futher dhclient is there. I'll go back to
you wanted to say 'jawohl'?
Erich
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Re: well, try here first...
On Mon, 12 Nov 2012 23:57:21 -0800, Gary Kline wrote:
> On Tue, Nov 13, 2012 at 06:39:52AM +0100, Polytropon wrote:
> > On Mon, 12 Nov 2012 21:22:00 -0800, Gary Kline wrote:
> > > Anyway, linux is
> > > installed; the box is on my internal IP net. I can ssh *out*. to my
> > > server, vut from my server or wherever, I cant ssh back in.
> > >
> > > doing an % ssh 10.47.0.114 OR ssh tao gives me an instant
> > > "Connection refused". if I try an ssh -X tao I get a string like
> > > "Connnection closed". can any of you network wizards or setup
> > > wizards clue me in. {FWIW:: the ssh stuff is from OpenBSD.}
> >
> > Have you checked that tao is actually running a SSH server?
>
> ja vohl. futher dhclient is there. I'll go back to comparing
> tao to ethic.
The dhclient is a client (just as the ssh program), while
the system has to run some kind of SSH _server_ (sshd on
FreeBSD for example). Additionally, network configuration
and especially firewall has to _permit_ the access to that
specific service (that has to be enabled).
> > The way _how_ to enable it depends on the distribution you're
> > using and is very different among the Linusi.
>
> rt., and this is fedora, my least fav distro. But I've always had
> trouble with ssh, even with FBSD.
There is a nice summary on how to get the OpenSSH server
set up on Fedora:
http://www.techotopia.com/index.php/Configuring_Fedora_Linux_Remote_Access_using_SSH
Basically, it's about installing and enabling it. The article
also discusses how to enable configure the firewall properly.
--
Polytropon
Magdeburg, Germany
Happy FreeBSD user since 4.0
Andra moi ennepe, Mousa, ...
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Re: well, try here first...
On Tue, Nov 13, 2012 at 06:39:52AM +0100, Polytropon wrote:
> On Mon, 12 Nov 2012 21:22:00 -0800, Gary Kline wrote:
> > Anyway, linux is
> > installed; the box is on my internal IP net. I can ssh *out*. to my
> > server, vut from my server or wherever, I cant ssh back in.
> >
> > doing an % ssh 10.47.0.114 OR ssh tao gives me an instant
> > "Connection refused". if I try an ssh -X tao I get a string like
> > "Connnection closed". can any of you network wizards or setup
> > wizards clue me in. {FWIW:: the ssh stuff is from OpenBSD.}
>
> Have you checked that tao is actually running a SSH server?
ja vohl. futher dhclient is there. I'll go back to comparing
tao to ethic.
>
> The way _how_ to enable it depends on the distribution you're
> using and is very different among the Linusi.
rt., and this is fedora, my least fav distro. But I've always had
trouble with ssh, even with FBSD.
>
> The FreeBSD equivalent would be something like
>
> # /etc/rc.d/sshd start
>
> or putting sshd_enable="YES" into /etc/rc.conf to have this
> task at boot.
>
> Depending on what Linux you are using, this may be as easy as
> on FreeBSD... or overcomplicated, because "nobody needs this
> anyway". :-)
no mo' energy. I hear my bed singing sirens' songs:)
5 mins later: I ssh'd from tao to ethic then used the ssh-vvv
for debug. Somewhere this string shoewd up. as noted, this
is from OBSD:
SSH2_MSG_IGNORE
so if anybody running openbsd or fedora, or anybody who has stubbed
his toe this way, give a hollar.
S'All,
gary
>
>
>
>
> --
> Polytropon
> Magdeburg, Germany
> Happy FreeBSD user since 4.0
> Andra moi ennepe, Mousa, ...
--
Gary Kline kl...@thought.org http://www.thought.org Public Service Unix
Twenty-six years of service to the Unix community.
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Re: well, try here first...
On Tue, Nov 13, 2012 at 12:36:59PM +0700, Erich Dollansky wrote:
> Hi,
>
> On Mon, 12 Nov 2012 21:22:00 -0800
> Gary Kline wrote:
>
> > hold your flame-throwers, because this is about how to get
>
> you do not allow us some fun?
>
> > ssh working from an outside computer into my brand new "tao" that is
> > running a flavor of linux. I just got my quad i5 box to replace the
> > old, broken tao. this was the box with the busted USB. [!] Anyway,
> > linux is installed; the box is on my internal IP net. I can ssh
> > *out*. to my server, vut from my server or wherever, I cant ssh back
> > in.
> >
> > doing an % ssh 10.47.0.114 OR ssh tao gives me an instant
> > "Connection refused". if I try an ssh -X tao I get a string
> > like "Connnection closed". can any of you network wizards or setup
> > wizards clue me in. {FWIW:: the ssh stuff is from OpenBSD.}
> >
> > anybody know what im NOT doing?
>
> Proper setup?
> Firewall?
> inetd?
>
> It sounds like something very, very obvious. But I know how it feels if
> one cannot see the tiny thing.
>
> Erich
hmmm. about the Only thing I havent tried is a "theraputic reboot."
tomorrow. im tempted to hit the power button! I'l wait.
gary
--
Gary Kline kl...@thought.org http://www.thought.org Public Service Unix
Twenty-six years of service to the Unix community.
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Re: well, try here first...
On 2012.11.13 06:22, Gary Kline wrote: > anybody know what im NOT doing? running sshd ? :) Have you installed it ? sshd is the server program, it is fairly independent from ssh, the client program. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"
Re: well, try here first...
On Mon, 12 Nov 2012 21:22:00 -0800, Gary Kline wrote:
> Anyway, linux is
> installed; the box is on my internal IP net. I can ssh *out*. to my
> server, vut from my server or wherever, I cant ssh back in.
>
> doing an % ssh 10.47.0.114 OR ssh tao gives me an instant
> "Connection refused". if I try an ssh -X tao I get a string like
> "Connnection closed". can any of you network wizards or setup
> wizards clue me in. {FWIW:: the ssh stuff is from OpenBSD.}
Have you checked that tao is actually running a SSH server?
The way _how_ to enable it depends on the distribution you're
using and is very different among the Linusi.
The FreeBSD equivalent would be something like
# /etc/rc.d/sshd start
or putting sshd_enable="YES" into /etc/rc.conf to have this
task at boot.
Depending on what Linux you are using, this may be as easy as
on FreeBSD... or overcomplicated, because "nobody needs this
anyway". :-)
--
Polytropon
Magdeburg, Germany
Happy FreeBSD user since 4.0
Andra moi ennepe, Mousa, ...
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Re: well, try here first...
Hi,
On Mon, 12 Nov 2012 21:22:00 -0800
Gary Kline wrote:
> hold your flame-throwers, because this is about how to get
you do not allow us some fun?
> ssh working from an outside computer into my brand new "tao" that is
> running a flavor of linux. I just got my quad i5 box to replace the
> old, broken tao. this was the box with the busted USB. [!] Anyway,
> linux is installed; the box is on my internal IP net. I can ssh
> *out*. to my server, vut from my server or wherever, I cant ssh back
> in.
>
> doing an % ssh 10.47.0.114 OR ssh tao gives me an instant
> "Connection refused". if I try an ssh -X tao I get a string
> like "Connnection closed". can any of you network wizards or setup
> wizards clue me in. {FWIW:: the ssh stuff is from OpenBSD.}
>
> anybody know what im NOT doing?
Proper setup?
Firewall?
inetd?
It sounds like something very, very obvious. But I know how it feels if
one cannot see the tiny thing.
Erich
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