Re: [Freetel-codec2] FreeDV Tx power PAPR- SM1000

2020-06-22 Thread glen english
Hi Greg I did mention that  I was only considering computing the PAPR, and then if it exceeded some threshold, produce a new sequence... On the likelihood you wont get another bad one.  IE a gamble. I'm interested that you are considering what can be done at the receiver end to improve

Re: [Freetel-codec2] FreeDV Tx power PAPR- SM1000

2020-06-21 Thread Greg Maxwell
On Mon, Jun 22, 2020 at 4:55 AM glen english wrote: > One thing to consider- accurate PAPR measurement (by a receiver) is > hard at low SNR. That is one of the nice things about FEC based PAPR reduction, the receiver doesn't need to measure PAPR yet it exploits the PAPR reduction regardless.

Re: [Freetel-codec2] FreeDV Tx power PAPR- SM1000

2020-06-21 Thread glen english
Hi Greg RRR One thing to consider- accurate PAPR measurement (by a receiver)  is hard at low SNR. Tone reservation is probably the lowest cost means for this setup. And backward compatible. Remapping as I described this morning is probabaly reasonable, also- --given that LDPC encode is

Re: [Freetel-codec2] FreeDV Tx power PAPR- SM1000

2020-06-21 Thread Greg Maxwell
On Sun, Jun 21, 2020 at 9:51 PM glen english wrote: > I was giving some thought to how PAPR reduction might be implemented > within the current framework, taking into account the limited capability > of the SM1000 processor. One thing to perhaps consider is the ease at which a sufficiently

Re: [Freetel-codec2] FreeDV Tx power PAPR- SM1000

2020-06-21 Thread glen english
actually the majority of SSB generators ARE reasonably phase coherent over a relatively moderate passband with respect to their total passband. The group delay 'ears' are on the edges of the filter. staying between 600 and 2200 Hz should be OK for a 2400 Hz wide traditional lattice sideband

Re: [Freetel-codec2] FreeDV Tx power PAPR- SM1000

2020-06-21 Thread Al Beard
Hi Glen and all, There's something I don't understand here: In the SM1000 we have control of all the amplitudes AND phases of all the audio carriers. Thus we may be able to do something to reduce the peak levels that an IDEAL SSB generator will produce. This is where I have a problem, the

Re: [Freetel-codec2] FreeDV Tx power PAPR- SM1000

2020-06-21 Thread glen english
Alan it already goes through an SSB generator, and is already bandwidth constrained. The bandwidth expansion because of an excess  PAPR event occurs where the signal cannot be faithfully reproduced- that is stages beyond the sideband modulator- mostly the power amplifier, but in reality all

Re: [Freetel-codec2] FreeDV Tx power PAPR- SM1000

2020-06-21 Thread Al Beard
Hi David and Glen, Just how is this going to be effective when the audio signal is passed through an SSB generator? You will also have to, in the maths, factor this in. Am I wrong here? Alan VK2ZIW On Mon, 22 Jun 2020 07:49:45 +1000, glen english wrote > I was giving some thought to how PAPR

Re: [Freetel-codec2] FreeDV Tx power PAPR- SM1000

2020-06-21 Thread glen english
I was giving some thought to how PAPR reduction might be implemented within the current framework, taking into account the limited capability of the SM1000 processor. If we approach this on trying to constrain the  statistical likelihood of a PAPR event  (where the peak power exceeds some