Re: [FRIAM] Behaviorism [was Beat poet]

2010-05-03 Thread Russ Abbott
Nick, I don't think you addressed my two objections. But you did raise another issue. How do behaviorists distinguish between what you call the organism and what you call it's environment? I don't say that lightly. As you know, I think the issue of how to identify entities is fundamental. For

Re: [FRIAM] Behaviorism [was Beat poet]

2010-05-03 Thread Nicholas Thompson
Robert C., i wouldnt mind calling collective mental processes a mind because, to me, a mental process is a pattern of interaction between an organism and an environment; but i thought you were calling brain processes a mind. is your thinker-in-a-vat anesthetized and paralyzed? To me (Russ),

[FRIAM] Schroedinger redux

2010-05-03 Thread Nicholas Thompson
Dear Friammers, If anyone is curious about where I ended up on Schroedinger's glass of water, it's pasted in below. I don't necessarily recommend it. Thanks for your collective patience. Nick Nicholas S. Thompson Emeritus Professor of Psychology and Ethology, Clark University

Re: [FRIAM] Schroedinger redux

2010-05-03 Thread sarbajit roy
Dear Nicholas The foundation of your construct is that North Blandia consists of 10 counties with 10,000 people in each. The problem is what happens to the people in the other 9 counties - where do they go looking for work if there is no work in Blather county - how do you maintain your

Re: [FRIAM] Behaviorism [was Beat poet]

2010-05-03 Thread ERIC P. CHARLES
Russ, Good questions. These are indeed obvious vulnerabilities that behaviorists are familiar with. Of course, if I just said what I thought, then the answers would seem more solid, but I will try to give a flavor of the broader reality of the field, not just my opinion. Your Q1: How big (or

Re: [FRIAM] Beat poet defends the scientific method

2010-05-03 Thread Russ Abbott
Nice way to put it Robert. Nick, is it really your position that nothing goes on inside the head? How can you take that position? Lots of neuron firings take place inside the head. I imagine you aren't denying that -- only that neuron firings do not constitute thinking -- whatever that means.

Re: [FRIAM] Behaviorism [was Beat poet]

2010-05-03 Thread Russ Abbott
Thanks for your answers Eric. I like your answer to Q1 that the unit of observation is at the functional level -- where functional refers to an act that changes the relationship between an entity and its environment. Since almost every change can be divided into smaller changes, that doesn't

[FRIAM] the unreasonable effectiveness of copying

2010-05-03 Thread Roger Critchlow
Last month Science reported the results ( http://www.sciencemag.org/cgi/content/abstract/sci;328/5975/208) of a social learning tournament (http://www.intercult.su.se/cultaptation/tournament.php). In non-social algorithmic learning, an agent has the choice between exploiting what it already

Re: [FRIAM] the unreasonable effectiveness of copying

2010-05-03 Thread Victoria Hughes
very interesting. thanks.ToryOn May 3, 2010, at 12:29 PM, Roger Critchlow wrote:Last month Science reported the results (http://www.sciencemag.org/cgi/content/abstract/sci;328/5975/208) of a social learning tournament (http://www.intercult.su.se/cultaptation/tournament.php). In non-social