Re: G4 MDD SCSI (pref non PCI)
Hey, thanks everyone for your contributions. Much appreciated. On 29/08/12 23:01, t...@prismnet.com wrote: The Atto cards are great...If you want a single ported card, consider the Adaptec PowerDomain I will look into the Atto cards more, as they seem to be well regarded (and cheap now, when available). I think single port SCSI would work best for me. My Scope cards are the heavy lifters of my DSP farm. They are also linked (like SLI for GFX). I think they are best kept in the mobo slots, with their own interrupt channels (did I understand that correctly?). I plan to house the OASYS + SCSI card in the expansion chassis. The SCSI card will not likely be used much at the same time as the OASYS, so a shared interrupt shouldn't affect things. I guess Adaptec is probably fine for this too. On 29/08/12 23:11, t...@prismnet.com wrote: So, unless you could live with all those limitations, I think the MDD has the most available PCI slots you can get. Cool, thanks for that info and analysis. I definitely will stick with the MDD for this. I think it's a fair fit for purpose. On 29/08/12 23:36, Bruce Ryan wrote: Just thinking about your ‘cable soup’ and the number of monitors you have running - hot, easy to trip over and large electricity bill. Might it be worth running some form of VNC on your macs. (VNC, rebadged as ‘screen-sharing’ has been part of Mac OS since 10·3, IIRC.) - For OS9 macs, there’s ‘OS9vnc Server PPC’. I’m using it to observe and control my Pismo from my mac Pro just now. - For logging into and attempting to help with my parents’ PCs, I’ve used TightVNC and ChickenOfTheVNC, IIRC. (Bit slow over the interweb but OK over LAN.) (Before using screen-sharing so much, I used to use a 4-port KVM switch to swap my monitor between Pismo, XServe, main mac and work-provided mac but cables took over my desk and shelves, then eventually the KVM unit became flaky.) I guess VNC might slow your pooters slightly but it might be better than tripping over a cable and dragging loads of kit onto the deck with you. Thanks for pointing that out. The cables are generally OK. Mostly behind the desk. I invest a fair bit of effort into cable management when I set up my work space. I also like to have a dedicated monitor for each machine. I mostly work 'live' (lots of low latency concurrent processing). I like to see what is happening on all my machines without having to switch around. I have also used Synergy before (nice idea), but I also use OS9 and DOS, so no play there. I used to use a KVM. Generally found them to be either cheap rubbish, or rather expensive. I even tried a DOS graphical remote desktop application for integrating one old machine, which was cool, but stupidly slow. Can VNC be used for keyboard/mouse only, without the video? I'm doing some reading on this now. There has been interest in this from others online, but I haven't filtered through all the info yet. PC2VNC will do this, but Windows only. Sill reading ... What I really want to do in this regard, is just share my USB keyboard and mouse between all my machines. I tried a couple of solutions to this already, but didn't really work out. I tried a cheap port KVM. Didn't work at all. Horrible device. I have another old 2 port PS/2 KVM, which is also quite bad. I have used pro KVMs in server racks before, and had no issues. These are not so cheap though. Not sure if they do true keyboard emulation in the disconnected state though. At least on Windows, keyboard interface is stateful (I think this is normal for most machines). To operate correctly, a switch should remember the state, and re-establish this when re connecting. I had trouble finding something with support for OS9, and modern machines, and trouble finding anything decent which is also affordable. I bought a mechanical USB switch, attached a small hub, and switched the keyboard and mouse between the machines. I hoped that USB hot plugging could take care of device recognition in a fast enough and reliable fashion. It didn't work out. On my faster PC, it was fine iirc. My cheap laptop with slightly dodgy USB ports would mostly work. Don't think I got around to trying with DOS. The MDD was a problem. It often didn't work, and sometimes would see keyboard or mouse, not both. One time the MDD was sleeping (I think). I switched to it, and it made and unrecoverable crash. Had to reinstall OS. Not sure what happened. I vaguely recall some issues with sleep on older Macs, but not clear on this at all. I am considering trying two separate mechanical USB switches, with separate keyboard and mouse, hoping that removing the hub might simplify matters enough to allow things to operate sufficiently. Bit of wishful thinking though. Still looking at older pro KVMs too, with a plan to just leave the video disconnected (not all will work correctly this way though). I'm using all VGA monitors ATM, so that should
Re: G4 MDD SCSI (pref non PCI)
On Tuesday, August 28, 2012 11:43:23 AM UTC-5, oli wrote: I think at this point, I will replace one of my Scope cards with an Atto SCSI adapter. I don't really know much about which adapter to go for, though Atto seems to be well regarded. Any advice on that? From memory, the SCSI maintains some level of backwards compatibility, as long as the appropriate cabling is used (eg SCSI 1 devices on SCSI 2 host). Bah. When I wrote Initio in my original message, I meant Atto. Leaky brain. The Atto cards are great, from what I've read, but ones like the UL3D and UL4D are dual ported cards. I had a UL2D and it had to be installed in a non-Bridge slot in the Umax S900 in order to work. They will work fine in one of your MDD's slots, but *might* have problems if you get an expansion chassis. As I wrote, I don't know if Apple fixed that bug after the x500/x600 PCI PowerMacs. I think that the UL4D does not have support for OS9. You'll want to check that. So the UL3D may be your best choice amongst the Atto cards. If you want a single ported card, consider the Adaptec PowerDomain 29160, but check if OS support goes late enough for you. I have this vague feeling that Adaptec stopped providing updates at some point. Jeff Walther -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: G4 MDD SCSI (pref non PCI)
On Aug 28, 11:43 am, Oliver Fairhall o.fairh...@gmail.com wrote: From memory, the SCSI maintains some level of backwards compatibility, as long as the appropriate cabling is used (eg SCSI 1 devices on SCSI 2 host). Thanks everyone for you help so far. Are there any suggestions for a suitable G4 with more PCI slots? Forgot a couple of questions. Yes, as far as I know all the SCSI controllers will drop back to earlier protocols if an older device is present on the bus. Some of the newer U320 SCSI drives won't, but that's probably not an issue for you in this case. The MDD has the most PCI slots you can get in a G4 PowerMac. It has four PCI slots, plus the AGP slot for the graphics card. It was a very nice machine in that way. The only way to get more PCI slots in one box would be to get a PowerMac 9500 (or 9600, or Daystar Genesis, or PowerComputing PowerTower Pro) and install a G4 upgrade. The 9500/9600 has six PCI slots. However, the 9500/9600 would have a much slower memory bus. The fastest G4 upgrade available is 800 MHz (was there a 1 GHz?). There's no AGP slot so your effective PCI slots drop to 5, because you spend one on a graphics card. There's no USB nor Firewire, so if you need those, that's another slot and you're back down to the four that the MDD has. It does have SCSI built-in, so potentially, that saves you a slot, but the faster of the two SCSI busses is only Fast SCSI (10 MB/s theoretical). The slow built-in SCSI also means that your hard drive access is slow unless you add a fast SCSI card and drives, or an ATA or SATA card, which would cost another PCI slot. Finally the built- in ethernet is 10 Mbps. So, unless you could live with all those limitations, I think the MDD has the most available PCI slots you can get. Jeff Walther -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: G4 MDD SCSI (pref non PCI)
The audio output of the samplers is feeding an interface on my main studio PC. The MDD is not being used as the audio workstation host, or the main sequencer. It's mainly a DSP farm (again feeding my main interface on a PC). MDD will also be used to control the samplers more detailed functions (easier than the small hardware interfaces), off line sample editing, import/export/conversion of other audio into/out of the samplers, and some file storage. I did consider an older G3 just for sampler SCSI interfacing, but my home studio is getting too complicated/crowded already. A single legacy Mac would be preferable to me. A PCI expansion chassis is a reasonable solution for me. I'm already running 4 computers (including the MDD); my main PC as DAW, a laptop to edit my Nord modulars + daily computing, a legacy PC (rarely used for music, mostly just AXS http://www.resolutionaudio.nl/), but is there more for legacy RS-232 EPROM programming, and for some older music gear that requires true DOS environment for the occasional floppy based operation. One sampler also has it's own LCD monitor, so five monitors all up. Plus rack hardware, desktop controllers, and keyboard synths. Of course, this all comes with an ample serving of cable soup. Cheers, Oli On 29/08/12 00:54, Bruce Johnson wrote: I know nothing of this, but perhaps use another computer to control the samplers, feeding the output of that into your MDD somehow? Might be a lot easier to manage. -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: G4 MDD SCSI (pref non PCI)
One sampler also has it's own LCD monitor, so five monitors all up. Plus rack hardware, desktop controllers, and keyboard synths. Of course, this all comes with an ample serving of cable soup. Just thinking about your ‘cable soup’ and the number of monitors you have running - hot, easy to trip over and large electricity bill. Might it be worth running some form of VNC on your macs. (VNC, rebadged as ‘screen-sharing’ has been part of Mac OS since 10·3, IIRC.) - For OS9 macs, there’s ‘OS9vnc Server PPC’. I’m using it to observe and control my Pismo from my mac Pro just now. - For logging into and attempting to help with my parents’ PCs, I’ve used TightVNC and ChickenOfTheVNC, IIRC. (Bit slow over the interweb but OK over LAN.) (Before using screen-sharing so much, I used to use a 4-port KVM switch to swap my monitor between Pismo, XServe, main mac and work-provided mac but cables took over my desk and shelves, then eventually the KVM unit became flaky.) I guess VNC might slow your pooters slightly but it might be better than tripping over a cable and dragging loads of kit onto the deck with you. cheers Bruce -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: G4 MDD SCSI (pref non PCI)
What about saving over the Ethernet/LAN? -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: G4 MDD SCSI (pref non PCI)
On Monday, August 27, 2012 11:10:57 PM UTC-5, oli wrote: Hi, I was hoping for a SCSI adapter running from the Firewire 400 bus. Haven't found one though. These folks used to sell them: http://www.macgurus.com/store/ecom-prodshow/SCSIFR1SX.html but they're out of stock and at $140 they weren't very affordable. Still, you might be able to extract a part number and/or product name and use that as a basis for your search. PCI chassis work because the PCI specification includes a device called a PCI-PCI bridge, which is a device which sits in one PCI slot and creates up to sixteen more slots downstream of itself.Using a PCI expansion chassis should not affect the PCI performance of your other slots, however, all the cards installed in the chassis will share whatever interrupt was available in the original slot. This can sometimes be a problem. Also, on the earlier PCI Macs there is a bug in Apple's implementation which does not properly handle PCI-PCI bridges. The result is that if you have a daisy chain of bridges, (one bridge in one of the slots of another bridge) and there is more than one PCI card in the lowest bridge's slots, the Mac will freeze up when firmware for the second card tries to load. This mainly comes up if you use an expansion chassis (or Umax J700 or S900) and install a USB/Firewire combo card, or one of the video cards that looks like two PCI devices to Open Firmware, or one of the SCSI cards (most of the dual ported cards) which looks like two PCI cards to firmware. Oh, and some of the ATA cards have the same issue. Essentially, many PCI cards have what amounts to a PCI-PCI Bridge on the card (USB/Firewire combo cards literally have a PCI-PCI Bridge chip on board).So when you install one of these cards in a slot downstream of another PCI-PCI bridge, e.g. in an expansion chassis, you're creating a chain of two bridges and Apple's bug rears it's ugly frozen head. The PCI specification allows for creating several levels of PCI-PCI Bridge, so the multi-level bridge things should work, but it doesn't (or didn't) in Apple machines. I don't know if Apple fixed this firmware bug in later machines, but it was awfully persistent in earlier machines.It didn't get noticed much because not that many folks use PCI expansion chassis (the lower 4 (2) PCI slots in the Umax S900 (J700) are an expansion chassis off of the third PCI slot) and in more recent machines, the video cards are no longer PCI, and USB and Firewire are built in, so that eliminated many of the PCI cards that have two PCI devices on board. There were two later revisions of the ROM in the x500 and x600 PCI Macs and neither one did diddly to address this bug. So, you may need to avoid most of the later Initio SCSI cards, as they're all dual ported cards, which look like two PCI devices. And the Adaptec 2940U2B has the same issue, IIRC, both the Adaptec and the Apple versions. Jeff Walther -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: G4 MDD SCSI (pref non PCI)
Hi Jeff, Thank you very much for your detailed and well informed response. I very much doubt I would have found that information regarding the PCI bridge issue. I think I may have to be careful placing a SCSI card in a PCI extension chassis too, as some seem to offer multiple channels (don't know if this is a bridge implementation though, just wondering out loud). I did have a look at the Ratoc FR1SX Firewire to SCSI adapter already. I thought $140 may be OK, but eBay prices are more like $300 to $600. Also, it seems to only support one SCSI device at a time, and doesn't support all SCSI compliant devices. I assume it is really a limited implementation of a SCSI controller, probably running in code in a generic microcontroller host (just a guess). I would prefer to have a true SCSI adapter. I found a few other FW/USB to SCSI adapters. They all have various issues. Seems a bad idea. I think at this point, I will replace one of my Scope cards with an Atto SCSI adapter. I don't really know much about which adapter to go for, though Atto seems to be well regarded. Any advice on that? From memory, the SCSI maintains some level of backwards compatibility, as long as the appropriate cabling is used (eg SCSI 1 devices on SCSI 2 host). I'll keep a look out for a modest, well priced, used PCI expansion chassis over the coming months. Thanks everyone for you help so far. Are there any suggestions for a suitable G4 with more PCI slots? Cheers, Oli On 28/08/12 23:23, t...@prismnet.com wrote: ... Jeff Walther -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: G4 MDD SCSI (pref non PCI)
On Aug 28, 2012, at 9:42 AM, Oliver Fairhall wrote: I did have a look at the Ratoc FR1SX Firewire to SCSI adapter already. I thought $140 may be OK, but eBay prices are more like $300 to $600. Also, it seems to only support one SCSI device at a time, and doesn't support all SCSI compliant devices. I assume it is really a limited implementation of a SCSI controller, probably running in code in a generic microcontroller host (just a guess). I would prefer to have a true SCSI adapter. It was primarily designed to connect expensive, high-end (at the time) SCSI scanners to SCSI-less Macs. I know nothing of this, but perhaps use another computer to control the samplers, feeding the output of that into your MDD somehow? Might be a lot easier to manage. -- Bruce Johnson University of Arizona College of Pharmacy Information Technology Group Institutions do not have opinions, merely customs -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
G4 MDD SCSI (pref non PCI)
Hi folks, I have a G4 MDD (FW 400, not 800 model), which I would like to add SCSI to. All my PCI slots are taken up. I am mainly using this with OS 9.2.2. I would like to know what is the best featured/most reliable option for adding SCSI for this machine, that doesn't use a PCI slot? I use the machine as a legacy DSP farm for my home music studio. I use a Korg OASYS PCI card, which will not run under OSX. My idea for the SCSI was to interface with my old hardware samplers (EMU/Ensoniq/Akai). I have read about some Firewire and USB SCSI adapters, but information is a little sparse as to how these really perform in practice. Some also don't allow a complete SCSI chain, just one device. If really necessary, I could possibly try to free one PCI slot, but I would really rather not. It seems that some PCI SCSI solutions were more highly regarded. I certainly would not want too much hassle with an unreliable solution, if that's all I would get with USB/Firewire SCSI adapters. BTW, I have heard of PCI expansion racks to add more PCI slots; are these any good? Is there a performance degradation with these? Thanks for any pointers/advice. Cheers, Oli -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: G4 MDD SCSI (pref non PCI)
On Aug 27, 2012, at 10:45 AM, Oliver Fairhall wrote: I have a G4 MDD (FW 400, not 800 model), which I would like to add SCSI to. All my PCI slots are taken up. I am mainly using this with OS 9.2.2. I would like to know what is the best featured/most reliable option for adding SCSI for this machine, that doesn't use a PCI slot? I use the machine as a legacy DSP farm for my home music studio. I use a Korg OASYS PCI card, which will not run under OSX. My idea for the SCSI was to interface with my old hardware samplers (EMU/Ensoniq/Akai). I have read about some Firewire and USB SCSI adapters, but information is a little sparse as to how these really perform in practice. Some also don't allow a complete SCSI chain, just one device. If really necessary, I could possibly try to free one PCI slot, but I would really rather not. It seems that some PCI SCSI solutions were more highly regarded. I certainly would not want too much hassle with an unreliable solution, if that's all I would get with USB/Firewire SCSI adapters. BTW, I have heard of PCI expansion racks to add more PCI slots; are these any good? Is there a performance degradation with these? Well, forget USB, OS 9 only supports USB 1.1 so you'd be limited to 12MBps. Most of what I know about the Firewire - SCSI adapters is that they are rare. What other PCI cards do you have, maybe there are some options there. -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: G4 MDD SCSI (pref non PCI)
On Aug 27, 2012, at 12:45 PM, Oliver Fairhall wrote: All my PCI slots are taken up. All three? Isn't there one card you could move or sacrifice? I would like to know what is the best featured/most reliable option for adding SCSI for this machine, that doesn't use a PCI slot? You covered the options, which are few, rare, and probably not optimal. I have heard of PCI expansion racks to add more PCI slots; are these any good? Even if you had an expansion rack, where would it go so you could mount the cards? This would seem to be kludgy unless you plan some serious mod work to adapt such a rack into your G4. There are old Macs with 6 PCI slots which would be cheaper for the entire Mac than adding such an expansion rack. -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: G4 MDD SCSI (pref non PCI)
Hi Clark, Thanks for your reply. My other PCI cards are Creamware/Sonic Core Scope DSP cards (3x) and one AGP video card. The Scope cards can run under OSX, but I'm mainly working with 9 due to the OASYS PCI. I'm also more familiar with OS 9 than X. As for slow transfer rates with USB 1, I could possibly live with that. In most cases, it would be fairly small transfers. My main concern is reliability and functionality. This area is pretty new to me. I used to use Amiga for music back in the day, but often heard about other users with pro samplers connected via SCSI to their Macs (I think G3 mainly). There is host control software to run under Mac OS 9 for this. I have the samplers now (they are cheap at this point) and really like the sounds I can coax from them, but would like to integrate them into my computing environment. I don't really know what I'm doing though. I have read a little about Magma PCI expansion chassis which are supported under OS 9. Never used one though. Would an Atto SCSI card + PCI chassis be a reasonable solution? Does adding an expansion chassis cause any issues with the PCI bus performance? As I'm running a lot of live DSP audio processing, which uses main memory to some extent, as well as some CPU load (I think not a lot though) I would not want to cause issues in the bus performance. Thanks again for your help, Oli On 28/08/12 10:53, Clark Martin wrote: On Aug 27, 2012, at 10:45 AM, Oliver Fairhall wrote: I have a G4 MDD (FW 400, not 800 model), which I would like to add SCSI to. All my PCI slots are taken up. I am mainly using this with OS 9.2.2. I would like to know what is the best featured/most reliable option for adding SCSI for this machine, that doesn't use a PCI slot? I use the machine as a legacy DSP farm for my home music studio. I use a Korg OASYS PCI card, which will not run under OSX. My idea for the SCSI was to interface with my old hardware samplers (EMU/Ensoniq/Akai). I have read about some Firewire and USB SCSI adapters, but information is a little sparse as to how these really perform in practice. Some also don't allow a complete SCSI chain, just one device. If really necessary, I could possibly try to free one PCI slot, but I would really rather not. It seems that some PCI SCSI solutions were more highly regarded. I certainly would not want too much hassle with an unreliable solution, if that's all I would get with USB/Firewire SCSI adapters. BTW, I have heard of PCI expansion racks to add more PCI slots; are these any good? Is there a performance degradation with these? Well, forget USB, OS 9 only supports USB 1.1 so you'd be limited to 12MBps. Most of what I know about the Firewire - SCSI adapters is that they are rare. What other PCI cards do you have, maybe there are some options there. -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: G4 MDD SCSI (pref non PCI)
Hi, I was hoping for a SCSI adapter running from the Firewire 400 bus. Haven't found one though. I'm not sure I really trust USB adapters for this purpose. Not so much from the transfer rates, but more because there have been so many poor quality USB interfaces (speaking generally), and due to the transfers being managed more directly by the CPU. My understanding is that Firewire not only has the superior bandwidth, but that it also features dedicated host control hardware to manage the transfers. Any advice on this matter would be appreciated. The alternative I was considering was to have the SCOPE PCI cards hosted in the MDD PCI slots, a Magma PCI expansion host card in the last on board slot, and a PCI SCSI card + Korg OASYS PCI mounted within the expansion chassis. I don't know how well this would perform though. I guess it would be fine. I believe professional studios were doing something similar for running Pro Tools rigs back in the day. I have a 19 equipment rack standing next to my MDD. I would likely house an expansion chassis there. I originally chose the MDD as I had access to a cheap dual 1.42 GHz model with TI4600, 2 GB RAM (1.5GB usable, I know) locally. The faster memory bandwidth appealed to me for live audio processing/generation. I don't really know how much of an issue this is in practice though. Also, I used to use my father's old PPC 6600/60, and I have nightmares about slow performance in general. Would you be able to recommend a different model with more PCI slots? I would rather not go too far back in terms of performance. If the memory bus is OK, and I can fit a decent single CPU accelerator, that would be fine. I also considered picking up an old G3 laptop with on board SCSI just for interfacing with the samplers. However, my space is getting somewhat crowded/complicated for computers/instruments. I can add SCSI to my main studio PC, but some software will only run well under Mac OS 9. Cheers, Oli On 28/08/12 11:25, Kris Tilford wrote: On Aug 27, 2012, at 12:45 PM, Oliver Fairhall wrote: All my PCI slots are taken up. All three? Isn't there one card you could move or sacrifice? I would like to know what is the best featured/most reliable option for adding SCSI for this machine, that doesn't use a PCI slot? You covered the options, which are few, rare, and probably not optimal. I have heard of PCI expansion racks to add more PCI slots; are these any good? Even if you had an expansion rack, where would it go so you could mount the cards? This would seem to be kludgy unless you plan some serious mod work to adapt such a rack into your G4. There are old Macs with 6 PCI slots which would be cheaper for the entire Mac than adding such an expansion rack. -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
