Re: Mavericks install

[Kris Tilford]

On Jul 6, 2016, at 1:59 AM, 'Irrational John' via G-Group 
 wrote:
> 
> Do you currently run El Capitan on a Core 2 Duo system? If so, how well does 
> it perform? How responsive is it?

I have a 13” Mid-2009 MacBook Pro 2.26GHz running El Capitan with 8GB RAM & 
normal HD. I mean to replace the HD with an SSD soon. The limitation in my 
opinion is the graphics card, the nVidia GeForce 9400M has 256MB DDR3 and the 
display is limited to 1280x800. This is fine for most video in El Capitan, but 
occasionally it bogs down a tiny bit. An SSD may help this, but otherwise I 
notice no extreme performance issues.

The big issue recently has been some sort of SMC bug (theoretical, but lots of 
anecdotal evidence of similar symptoms) that causes the fan to run slow and the 
laptop to overheat. This model overheats easily under load, and overheating 
results in either a random panic (meaning the panic logs show random backtraces 
that are non-repeatable) or a black screen reboot without a panic log being 
generated. The only solution seems to be to install a 3rd-party fan manager and 
crank up the fan manually so the temperature remains low, then everything is ok.

Apple seems to be aware of this issue, which appear to have not existed in El 
Capitan 10.11.0 thru 10.11.3, and was introduced in 10.11.4 & 10.11.5. People 
are hoping that 10.11.6 will have a fix for this SMC bug. The reason it’s 
thought to be an SMC bug is that when the problem manifests, it persists over 
reboots, but resetting the SMC seems to eliminate the problem for a short 
period. This issue affects several older models of MacBook & Macbook Pro.

I also have a 2009 Mini with 8GB with El Capitan 10.11.5, no SMC problem, it’s 
a slight faster 2.53GHz CPU, and has the same minor graphics limitation, so 
occasionally it bogs on 1920x1080 video.

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Re: Mavericks install

[Jörg Duurkoop]

> Seems unlikely an old woman would need a terabyte HD. For a similar price 
I’d think a 128GB SSD would make that old MacBook a lot faster in speed. El 
Capitan would work better with an SSD because of built-in TRIM support that 
would require a 3rd-party enabler in Mavericks. <

You are right about SSD. I saw a YouTube movie about that MacBook upgraded 
with a 120 GB SSD HD. Apps were loading three times faster. Too late ...

But that lady has time enough. On 1 TB I can put a big chunk of my digital 
movie collection for her.

And Cameron, thanks again for 10.4.Fox. It keeps my MDD alive and kickin ...

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Re: Mavericks install

['Irrational John' via G-Group]

On Tuesday, July 5, 2016 at 11:49:55 PM UTC-4, Kris Tilford wrote:
>
>
> This is all true, and a very good reason for an ‘old lady’ to be using El 
> Capitan.
>

Do you currently run El Capitan on a Core 2 Duo system? If so, how well 
does it perform? How responsive is it? 

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Re: Mavericks install

[Kris Tilford]

On Jul 5, 2016, at 7:28 PM, Cameron Kaiser  wrote:
> 
> No, Mavericks doesn't have *SIP*.

Yes, this is what I was referring to, “System Integrity Protection” which is 
not available for Mavericks. System Integrity Protection (SIP), also referred 
to as 'rootless' is a feature of El Capitan that protects system processes, 
files and folders from being modified or tampered with by other processes even 
when executed by the root user or by a user with root privileges (sudo). Root 
user access can be a significant risk factor to the system's security.

This is all true, and a very good reason for an ‘old lady’ to be using El 
Capitan.

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Re: Mavericks install

[Cameron Kaiser]

> This seems like a reason to install the newer OS X version. Mavericks
> doesn't utilize code signing, so the entire system software is open to
> malware attacks, whereas El Capitan has locked down system software

No, Mavericks doesn't have *SIP*. Mavericks most definitely has Gatekeeper.

-- 
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-- Birth, n.: The first and direst of all disasters. -- Ambrose Bierce 

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Re: Mavericks install

[Kris Tilford]

> On Jul 5, 2016, at 10:26 AM, Jörg Duurkoop  wrote:
> 
> The owner of the MacBook is an older lady to whom I had to explain very basic 
> computer stuff so I don't want to challenge her with a new OSX version.

This seems like a reason to install the newer OS X version. Mavericks doesn’t 
utilize code signing, so the entire system software is open to malware attacks, 
whereas El Capitan has locked down system software, so for an older woman who 
doesn’t know anything, having a “hardened system” is probably a better idea.

>  now she gets 4GB of RAM instead of 2 and a 1 TB HD instead of 160GB.

Seems unlikely an old woman would need a terabyte HD. For a similar price I’d 
think a 128GB SSD would make that old MacBook a lot faster in speed. El Capitan 
would work better with an SSD because of built-in TRIM support that would 
require a 3rd-party enabler in Mavericks.

Note that these old 2009 MacBooks are “end of life” for Apple now, with El 
Capitan being the final OS version supported, but there is a Sierra enabler 
already available to allow Sierra onto these. Sierra will come with the new 
Apple file system optimized for SSDs.

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Re: Mavericks install

[peterhaas]

> BTW I saw loads of defective newer MacBooks Air for sale. The RAM of these
> babies is soldered to the motherboard! How stupid is that?

It is a sign of the times.

Chromebooks generally have soldered RAM (either 2 banks of 1 GB = 2 GB
total or 2 banks of 2 GB = 4 GB total), but some VERY OLD pre-Haswell
models have one or two DDR3 SO-DIMM slots, and these models are YEARS out
of production.

Chromeboxes, OTOH, have SO-DIMM slots, DDR3L, with everyone but HP
"stuffing" both banks, whereas HP "stuffs" only bank 0 on its Celeron
models, although bank 1 is indeed "printed". This showing of false economy
on HP's part gives its Celeron owners a choice of up to 8 GB in one stick
(one bank), and Core i owners a choice of up to 16 GB in two sticks (two
banks). Most Chromeboxes are Haswell, or Haswell-refresh.

Also, Chromebooks are now tending to move away from M.2 42mm SSDs (16 GB
or 32 GB is the most common), in favor of eMMC SSDs which are soldered.

Already, the Intel 802.11a/b/g/n/ac + BT card is being soldered.

Manufacturers would rather you did your upgrades by purchasing a new
machine, rather than incrementally adding-in low-cost devices.

Again, a sign of the times, and Apple Inc is not immune.




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Re: Mavericks install

[Bruce Johnson]

On Jul 5, 2016, at 8:26 AM, Jörg Duurkoop 
> wrote:

BTW I saw loads of defective newer MacBooks Air for sale. The RAM of these 
babies is soldered to the motherboard! How stupid is that?

Not uncommon at all for the ultrabook category. It’s part of how you make it so 
thin and Apple’s not the only one doing that. This seems unusual though, in my 
experience the MBA’s have been quite reliable; the ONLY failures I’ve seen here 
have been user-instigated, mostly dumping liquids on the kb. They seem to 
attract coffee spills.

--
Bruce Johnson
University of Arizona
College of Pharmacy
Information Technology Group

Institutions do not have opinions, merely customs

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Re: Mavericks install

[Jörg Duurkoop]

Hi

Thanks seeker & Kris. I found the latest Mavericks and installed it via the 
USB stick procedure. The owner of the MacBook is an older lady to whom I 
had to explain very basic computer stuff so I don't want to challenge her 
with a new OSX version.

After all, I found out that her corrupt HD was the result of faulty RAM so 
now she gets 4GB of RAM instead of 2 and a 1 TB HD instead of 160GB. She is 
very thankful. Glad I can help her.

BTW I saw loads of defective newer MacBooks Air for sale. The RAM of these 
babies is soldered to the motherboard! How stupid is that?

Greetings from the Netherlands.

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Re: Mavericks install

[Kris Tilford]

On Jul 4, 2016, at 3:26 PM, Jörg Duurkoop  wrote:
> 
>  MacBook from 2009

MacBooks from 2009 should be able to run the latest Mac software, so download 
the latest El Capitan installer application, and install it onto the new HD. 
You don’t even need to wait to install the new HD, you can boot the MacBook in 
Firewire Target Disk mode and install onto it from one of your Macs (if you 
have a Mac that will run El Capitan). If you don’t have a Mac that will run El 
Capitan, you’d need to do it in reverse, boot the MacBook by setting your Mac 
into Target Disk mode, and use the Option key boot to select your Mac’s HD as 
the boot HD, then run the El Capitan installer application while booted via the 
Macbook and install El Capitan onto the MacBook.

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Re: Mavericks install

[J Stjohnny]

You have to "own" an upgrade for Mavericks, which in turn you would have had to 
purchase mountain lion ( OS X 10.8 ). Seeing as I have had this same problem, 
use your own Apple ID as the hardware is legally transferable, unless you 
haven't owned any hardware that has had ML on it.  I purchased a MBP in 2014 
which had a broken hard drive, so I had to had to purchase another Mac with ML 
or higher on it to purchase the OS X upgrade(redundant, no?) when I went to 
reinstall..The best thing to do is make yourself a bootable usb stick 
and install from there.  However you do that, is your business .

Sent from my iPhone

> On Jul 4, 2016, at 3:26 PM, Jörg Duurkoop  wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> This is about an Intel MacBook but I know there is a lot of knowledge here so 
> I try my list.
> 
> I'm helping a lady whose white MacBook from 2009 has a damaged harddisk. I've 
> bought a new harddisk, put it in my Firewire dock, started the MacBook with 
> Alt, partitioned the new disk as GUID and then tried to re-install OSX 
> Mavericks from the recovery partition but then was asked for a Mac-ID and 
> password which I don't know. The laptop was connected to the net.
> 
> The MacBook is from a second-hand store and came without original Installer 
> or manual. What can I do to get the MacBook going again?
> 
> Thank you.
> 
> Best regards, Jörg.
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Mavericks install

[Jörg Duurkoop]

Hi,

This is about an Intel MacBook but I know there is a lot of knowledge here 
so I try my list.

I'm helping a lady whose white MacBook from 2009 has a damaged harddisk. 
I've bought a new harddisk, put it in my Firewire dock, started the MacBook 
with Alt, partitioned the new disk as GUID and then tried to re-install OSX 
Mavericks from the recovery partition but then was asked for a Mac-ID and 
password which I don't know. The laptop was connected to the net.

The MacBook is from a second-hand store and came without original Installer 
or manual. What can I do to get the MacBook going again?

Thank you.

Best regards, Jörg.

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