Re: USB Hub versus PCI Card?
On May 18, 1:27 pm, Clark Martin cm...@sonic.net wrote: Mac G4 wrote: Hello, I have a G4 MDD that only came with 2 (4 if you count the keyboard) usb ports. I am not very concerned with the 1.0 versus 2.0, so considering that - my question is this: Should I get a usb pci card or just a usb hub? If I do get a pci card are they specific to the platform (i.e. mac/pc) or will any usb pci work on a mac? PCI cards can be problematic. I haven't found one yet that works through a sleep cycle. On the plus side I think any current PCI USB card will work. If 2.0 isn't an issue then a hub is your best bet. While I do agree that a hub is the best bet in this case, I've had good luck with this PCI USB 2.0 card in the MDD under Tiger: http://www.geeks.com/details.asp?invtid=AUA-2000. The chipset is NEC D720101GJ and any card with the same chipset should be virtually identical because the card makers usually build them to the chip manufacturer's reference design for that chipset. That's the chipset that my research of postings here and on XLR8yourmac.com seemed to indicate was the best bet. I've been using that card in an MDD for almost two years now with (almost) no sleep issues. The 'almost' is because I can't get our two card readers to work with sleep (actually don't work with wakeup), but that's a problem whether they're on the PCI card or on the built-in USB. My solution is just not leave card readers plugged in when I'm not using them. We also use this Young Micro four port powered hub plugged into the PCI card without problems: http://www.pcmicrostore.com/ PartDetail.aspx?q=p:10505289. The only inconvenience is that attached disks throw a This disk was not put away properly or some such at wakeup. This happens because the disk doesn't come back up fast enough and operating system throws the message before the disk finishes reconnecting. But the disk reattaches fine. The only inconvenience is clicking away the premature message. That Young Micro hub seems to work very well with sleep. At least, the little blue indicator LED goes off during sleep, and come back on at wakeup, so it seems to actually *do something* and recognize the difference between the conditions. I realize both of the links I provided are out of stock, but those items may be available elsewhere and the NEC chipset may be available in other cards. I like that particular hub because it is very compact, it is powered, and it is rectangular instead of some weird shape that won't fit well into a desk space. Oh, and it doesn't have a bunch of extraneous lights to irritate one. Just the single indicator LED. I bought a hub on Ebay once which puts on a non-stop light show. Try sleeping with that thing in the room. Jeff Walther --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: USB Hub versus PCI Card?
On May 19, 11:36 am, trag t...@io.com wrote: The chipset is NEC D720101GJ and any card with the same chipset should be virtually identical because the card makers usually build them to the chip manufacturer's reference design for that chipset. I just wanted to add a bit and a tiny backtracking. I found this card: http://www.geeks.com/details.asp?invtid=SD-NECU2-5E1Icat=CCD with the same chipset but it has six ports instead of two. Depending on how the chipset and the card implements the additional ports, it may be that cards with the same chipset but different numbers of ports could behave differently. For example, if there is an internal PCI- PCI bridge or built-in USB hub used in the chipset to implement the additional ports, it could have issues with sleep that you wouldn't see on the two-port version of the card. No solid knowledge there, just speculating on another factor that could make a difference. My solid knowledge is that in my experience the two-port PCI card based on that NEC chipset is solid with sleep and wake-up. Jeff Walther --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: USB Hub versus PCI Card?
On May 18, 2009, at 4:59 PM, Bill Connelly wrote: adaptec Duoconnect AUA-3020A USB 2.0 / FW400 PCI card alongside my M-Audio 2496 PCI audio card. Has an NEC chipset if I read the right chip on the card before inserting it: NEC Japan D720 101GT (error) Correction: NEC D720101GJ is the number on the NEC chip, as someone reported in a recent reply about their NEC card. Seems to be working under Leopard 10.5.7. I had a Nikon Coolscan 5000 (and/or Kodak 6-In-1), Olympus Voice Recorder, and Yamaha motif es8 USB/MIDI all connected and they communicated fine along with iTunes blaring away through the adjacent M-Audio 2496 PCI card. I do not use Sleep, as the M-Audio doesn't support it ... and also I always try to turn off all devices, and/or drag them to the Disconnect before I shut down. Bill Connelly artsite: http://mysite.verizon.net/moonstoneartstudio myspace: http://www.myspace.com/moonstoneartstudio --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
RE: USB Hub versus PCI Card?
Jeff, I just saw that same one. For under $10 it might be worth a shot. I am concerned about the sleep issue because I rarely turn my machine off, thus I need it to sleep whenever possible. http://www.geeks.com/details.asp?invtid=SD-NECU2-5E1Icat=CCD Date: Tue, 19 May 2009 09:43:24 -0700 Subject: Re: USB Hub versus PCI Card? From: t...@io.com To: g3-5-list@googlegroups.com On May 19, 11:36 am, trag t...@io.com wrote: The chipset is NEC D720101GJ and any card with the same chipset should be virtually identical because the card makers usually build them to the chip manufacturer's reference design for that chipset. I just wanted to add a bit and a tiny backtracking. I found this card: http://www.geeks.com/details.asp?invtid=SD-NECU2-5E1Icat=CCD with the same chipset but it has six ports instead of two. Depending on how the chipset and the card implements the additional ports, it may be that cards with the same chipset but different numbers of ports could behave differently. For example, if there is an internal PCI- PCI bridge or built-in USB hub used in the chipset to implement the additional ports, it could have issues with sleep that you wouldn't see on the two-port version of the card. No solid knowledge there, just speculating on another factor that could make a difference. My solid knowledge is that in my experience the two-port PCI card based on that NEC chipset is solid with sleep and wake-up. Jeff Walther _ Hotmail® goes with you. http://windowslive.com/Tutorial/Hotmail/Mobile?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_HM_Tutorial_Mobile1_052009 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
USB Hub versus PCI Card?
Hello, I have a G4 MDD that only came with 2 (4 if you count the keyboard) usb ports. I am not very concerned with the 1.0 versus 2.0, so considering that - my question is this: Should I get a usb pci card or just a usb hub? If I do get a pci card are they specific to the platform (i.e. mac/pc) or will any usb pci work on a mac? -Jeff _ Hotmail® goes with you. http://windowslive.com/Tutorial/Hotmail/Mobile?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_HM_Tutorial_Mobile1_052009 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: USB Hub versus PCI Card?
Howdy, A hub is cheap, and works for a lot of things. What do you want to plug in? Each USB hub on the computer can drive .5 amps. If you are plugging in multiple devices that need power, you may need a powered hub or the pci card. Not all PCI USB cards work in the Mac. Look in the archives for messages about that, or wait for further responses here. If I knew specifics on that, I'd give it to you. I remember having to be carefule when I bought my PCI USB 2.0 card. Available and supported chips have likely changed since then. Good luck, Ralph On Mon, 2009-05-18 at 08:03 -0400, Mac G4 wrote: Hello, I have a G4 MDD that only came with 2 (4 if you count the keyboard) usb ports. I am not very concerned with the 1.0 versus 2.0, so considering that - my question is this: Should I get a usb pci card or just a usb hub? If I do get a pci card are they specific to the platform (i.e. mac/pc) or will any usb pci work on a mac? --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: USB Hub versus PCI Card?
On 18 May 2009, at 05:23:00 PDT, Ralph Green wrote: Howdy, A hub is cheap, and works for a lot of things. What do you want to plug in? Each USB hub on the computer can drive .5 amps. If you are plugging in multiple devices that need power, you may need a powered hub or the pci card. Not all PCI USB cards work in the Mac. Look in the archives for messages about that, or wait for further responses here. If I knew specifics on that, I'd give it to you. I remember having to be carefule when I bought my PCI USB 2.0 card. Available and supported chips have likely changed since then. Good luck, Ralph On Mon, 2009-05-18 at 08:03 -0400, Mac G4 wrote: Hello, I have a G4 MDD that only came with 2 (4 if you count the keyboard) usb ports. I am not very concerned with the 1.0 versus 2.0, so considering that - my question is this: Should I get a usb pci card or just a usb hub? If I do get a pci card are they specific to the platform (i.e. mac/ pc) or will any usb pci work on a mac? - Another consideration: You can only connect 4 devices (I Think it's 4, could be 5) to each port, no matter how many ports a hub might have. The keyboard and mouse are two, so that port can only have 2 (or 3?) more. I would go for a PCI card with 4 ports. It seems I am always looking for another port. I hate dragging the mac out where I can get at the ports. I have a couple of extension cables to help, but then there are cables running everywhere. My MDD is loaded up with things and I even have a Firewire card to add ports. With Palm device cradles, external drives, scanner, movie camera, still camera, printer, mouse, keyboard, my desk looks like a pasta factory. Ken http://mysite.verizon.net/res7gt1w/stackomacs --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
RE: USB Hub versus PCI Card?
Hello Thanks!, I found this post when searching the group - looks like if i get a card with the chipset NEC, ALI, TI or OPTI it should work. I should stay away from VIA chipset (which seems to be in most cards based on preliminary google searches). Subject: Re: USB Hub versus PCI Card? From: sfrea...@sbcglobal.net To: g3-5-list@googlegroups.com Date: Mon, 18 May 2009 07:23:00 -0500 Howdy, A hub is cheap, and works for a lot of things. What do you want to plug in? Each USB hub on the computer can drive .5 amps. If you are plugging in multiple devices that need power, you may need a powered hub or the pci card. Not all PCI USB cards work in the Mac. Look in the archives for messages about that, or wait for further responses here. If I knew specifics on that, I'd give it to you. I remember having to be carefule when I bought my PCI USB 2.0 card. Available and supported chips have likely changed since then. Good luck, Ralph On Mon, 2009-05-18 at 08:03 -0400, Mac G4 wrote: Hello, I have a G4 MDD that only came with 2 (4 if you count the keyboard) usb ports. I am not very concerned with the 1.0 versus 2.0, so considering that - my question is this: Should I get a usb pci card or just a usb hub? If I do get a pci card are they specific to the platform (i.e. mac/pc) or will any usb pci work on a mac? _ Windows Live™: Keep your life in sync. http://windowslive.com/explore?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_BR_life_in_synch_052009 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: USB Hub versus PCI Card?
At 6:11 AM -0700 5/18/2009, Ken Daggett wrote: You can only connect 4 devices (I Think it's 4, could be 5) to each port, no matter how many ports a hub might have. Each USB bus supports up to 64 devices. In general, the limitation most people come against is power and throughput. - Dan. -- - Psychoceramic Emeritus; South Jersey, USA, Earth --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: USB Hub versus PCI Card?
On 18 May 2009, at 08:26:16 PDT, Dan wrote: At 6:11 AM -0700 5/18/2009, Ken Daggett wrote: You can only connect 4 devices (I Think it's 4, could be 5) to each port, no matter how many ports a hub might have. Each USB bus supports up to 64 devices. In general, the limitation most people come against is power and throughput. - That was my understanding, but I recall reading something about power allocation that said that each connected device received an allocation of power whether or not the device used that power. The article seemed to say that the allocation was such that the sum of 5 devices consumed the allocation of power to one port. Thus, plugging in a hub took one allocation and each port of the hub got one. I have never seen a USB hub with more than 4 ports. Seemed to make sense. Ken --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: USB Hub versus PCI Card?
On May 18, 2009, at 6:11 AM, Ken Daggett wrote: Another consideration: You can only connect 4 devices (I Think it's 4, could be 5) to each port, no matter how many ports a hub might have. That is manifestly untrue. USB supports 127 devices per host controller, each USB port on the Mac has it's own host controller. -- Bruce Johnson University of Arizona College of Pharmacy Information Technology Group Institutions do not have opinions, merely customs --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: USB Hub versus PCI Card?
On May 18, 2009, at 9:04 AM, Ken Daggett wrote: Thus, plugging in a hub took one allocation and each port of the hub got one. I have never seen a USB hub with more than 4 ports. Seemed to make sense. Well it was wrong. I have one 5-port and one 7 port USB hub at home. You can still buy 7-port USB hubs : http://www.everythingusb.com/belkin_7-port_plus_usb_2.0_hub_12907.html -- Bruce Johnson University of Arizona College of Pharmacy Information Technology Group Institutions do not have opinions, merely customs --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: USB Hub versus PCI Card?
At 09:04 -0700 5/18/09, Ken Daggett wrote: On 18 May 2009, at 08:26:16 PDT, Dan wrote: Each USB bus supports up to 64 devices. That was my understanding, but I recall reading something about power allocation that said that each connected device received an allocation of power whether or not the device used that power. The article seemed to say that the allocation was such that the sum of 5 devices consumed the allocation of power to one port. Thus, plugging in a hub took one allocation and each port of the hub got one. I have never seen a USB hub with more than 4 ports. Seemed to make sense. There are such things as powered hubs. They get extra power from somewhere - usually from a wall-wart - and use that to provide for required power on as many ports as they care to support. Well, the entire bus is still limited to the addressing limit above. -- Applescript syntax is like English spelling: Roughly, though not thoroughly, thought through. --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: USB Hub versus PCI Card?
At 9:04 AM -0700 5/18/2009, Ken Daggett wrote: On 18 May 2009, at 08:26:16 PDT, Dan wrote: At 6:11 AM -0700 5/18/2009, Ken Daggett wrote: You can only connect 4 devices (I Think it's 4, could be 5) to each port, no matter how many ports a hub might have. Each USB bus supports up to 64 devices. In general, the limitation most people come against is power and throughput. That was my understanding, but I recall reading something about power allocation that said that each connected device received an allocation of power whether or not the device used that power. Power is offered but doesn't have to be taken. By spec, a usb port offers 5 unit loads. A unit load is 5v at 100mA. Powered hubs can each do the same. I have never seen a USB hub with more than 4 ports. I've got a 13-port hub on my Smurf right now. At times, it's had several levels of hubs connected... - Dan. -- - Psychoceramic Emeritus; South Jersey, USA, Earth --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: USB Hub versus PCI Card?
On May 18, 2009, at 12:17 PM, Bruce Johnson wrote: On May 18, 2009, at 9:04 AM, Ken Daggett wrote: Thus, plugging in a hub took one allocation and each port of the hub got one. I have never seen a USB hub with more than 4 ports. Seemed to make sense. Well it was wrong. I have one 5-port and one 7 port USB hub at home. You can still buy 7-port USB hubs : http://www.everythingusb.com/belkin_7- port_plus_usb_2.0_hub_12907.html If I remember my USB voodoo correctly, the USB standard allocates 100ma to each device that it recognizes on a USB chain, whether or not it needs it. The USB standard calls for a total of 500ma available at each port. So once you have 4 devices plugged into a hub, that is the total of 5. Any more than 4 devices on one UN-POWERED hub, and things MIGHT start to get flaky. That is why most hubs with 5 or 7 (or more) ports come with a wall wart to supply the additional power. As long as you are using powered usb hubs, you can get out to 127 devices. I seem to remember one of the Mac magazines gathered all the usb devices that they could when they got the first iMac, and they hooked up over 20 devices cause that was all they could gather. Len --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
RE: USB Hub versus PCI Card?
So this has wildly gone in a direction that I don't have a need (or probably a care) for. Does anyone have some recommendations for a PCI USB card that will work in a G4 MDD running 10.4.11? Thanks From: lgers...@gmail.com Subject: Re: USB Hub versus PCI Card? Date: Mon, 18 May 2009 12:39:50 -0400 To: g3-5-list@googlegroups.com On May 18, 2009, at 12:17 PM, Bruce Johnson wrote: On May 18, 2009, at 9:04 AM, Ken Daggett wrote: Thus, plugging in a hub took one allocation and each port of the hub got one. I have never seen a USB hub with more than 4 ports. Seemed to make sense. Well it was wrong. I have one 5-port and one 7 port USB hub at home. You can still buy 7-port USB hubs : http://www.everythingusb.com/belkin_7- port_plus_usb_2.0_hub_12907.html If I remember my USB voodoo correctly, the USB standard allocates 100ma to each device that it recognizes on a USB chain, whether or not it needs it. The USB standard calls for a total of 500ma available at each port. So once you have 4 devices plugged into a hub, that is the total of 5. Any more than 4 devices on one UN-POWERED hub, and things MIGHT start to get flaky. That is why most hubs with 5 or 7 (or more) ports come with a wall wart to supply the additional power. As long as you are using powered usb hubs, you can get out to 127 devices. I seem to remember one of the Mac magazines gathered all the usb devices that they could when they got the first iMac, and they hooked up over 20 devices cause that was all they could gather. Len _ Insert movie times and more without leaving Hotmail®. http://windowslive.com/Tutorial/Hotmail/QuickAdd?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_HM_Tutorial_QuickAdd1_052009 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
RE: USB Hub versus PCI Card?
At 12:50 PM -0400 5/18/09, Mac G4 wrote: So this has wildly gone in a direction that I don't have a need (or probably a care) for. Does anyone have some recommendations for a PCI USB card that will work in a G4 MDD running 10.4.11? Hi, I am running this one http://eshop.macsales.com/item/IOGear/GIC251U/ I have a FW800 but I am running Leopard (upgraded from Tiger when I got the card, as I upgraded my drives too). HTH, Diane --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: USB Hub versus PCI Card?
On May 18, 2009, at 9:50 AM, Mac G4 wrote: So this has wildly gone in a direction that I don't have a need (or probably a care) for. Does anyone have some recommendations for a PCI USB card that will work in a G4 MDD running 10.4.11? I had an IOGear one in mine, however, since mine didn't sleep, I don't know if it has an issue with sleep. Many USB2 pci cards work, but cause problems with sleeping the Mac. -- Bruce Johnson University of Arizona College of Pharmacy Information Technology Group Institutions do not have opinions, merely customs --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: USB Hub versus PCI Card?
Mac G4 wrote: Hello, I have a G4 MDD that only came with 2 (4 if you count the keyboard) usb ports. I am not very concerned with the 1.0 versus 2.0, so considering that - my question is this: Should I get a usb pci card or just a usb hub? If I do get a pci card are they specific to the platform (i.e. mac/pc) or will any usb pci work on a mac? PCI cards can be problematic. I haven't found one yet that works through a sleep cycle. On the plus side I think any current PCI USB card will work. If 2.0 isn't an issue then a hub is your best bet. -- Clark Martin Redwood City, CA, USA Macintosh / Internet Consulting I'm a designated driver on the Information Super Highway --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: USB Hub versus PCI Card?
Ken Daggett wrote: On 18 May 2009, at 05:23:00 PDT, Ralph Green wrote: Howdy, A hub is cheap, and works for a lot of things. What do you want to plug in? Each USB hub on the computer can drive .5 amps. If you are plugging in multiple devices that need power, you may need a powered hub or the pci card. Not all PCI USB cards work in the Mac. Look in the archives for messages about that, or wait for further responses here. If I knew specifics on that, I'd give it to you. I remember having to be carefule when I bought my PCI USB 2.0 card. Available and supported chips have likely changed since then. Good luck, Ralph On Mon, 2009-05-18 at 08:03 -0400, Mac G4 wrote: Hello, I have a G4 MDD that only came with 2 (4 if you count the keyboard) usb ports. I am not very concerned with the 1.0 versus 2.0, so considering that - my question is this: Should I get a usb pci card or just a usb hub? If I do get a pci card are they specific to the platform (i.e. mac/ pc) or will any usb pci work on a mac? - Another consideration: You can only connect 4 devices (I Think it's 4, could be 5) to each port, no matter how many ports a hub might have. Where do you get this from? Are you saying a 7 port hub isn't really a 7 port hub? You can use up to 127 devices on a given USB port using however many hubs it takes to provide that. Not that I'd recommend going anywhere close to that many. -- Clark Martin Redwood City, CA, USA Macintosh / Internet Consulting I'm a designated driver on the Information Super Highway --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: USB Hub versus PCI Card?
Ken Daggett wrote: On 18 May 2009, at 08:26:16 PDT, Dan wrote: At 6:11 AM -0700 5/18/2009, Ken Daggett wrote: You can only connect 4 devices (I Think it's 4, could be 5) to each port, no matter how many ports a hub might have. Each USB bus supports up to 64 devices. It's 127 devices. FireWire supports 63 or 64 devices per branch. In general, the limitation most people come against is power and throughput. - That was my understanding, but I recall reading something about power allocation that said that each connected device received an allocation of power whether or not the device used that power. The article seemed to say that the allocation was such that the sum of 5 devices consumed the allocation of power to one port. Thus, plugging in a hub took one allocation and each port of the hub got one. I have never seen a USB hub with more than 4 ports. Seemed to make sense. Ken That's only if the hub isn't powered. Any USB port is rated at a maximum of 500mA (it could be less) and a minimum of 100mA. Any device plugged in automatically is allocated 100mA. To get more it has to tell the computer how much it needs. If the computer allows it the device can then draw more. If you have an un-powered hub the hub itself takes 100mA so it (and the computer) can dole out 400mA to 1-4 ports on the hub. But if the hub is powered every port can use up to 500mA. If you branch out from the computer port using powered hubs you can go up to 127 devices. I believe each hub counts as one device in that total. There are 7 port USB hubs, they are always powered. By powered hub I'm referring to an external power supply connected to the hub. -- Clark Martin Redwood City, CA, USA Macintosh / Internet Consulting I'm a designated driver on the Information Super Highway --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: USB Hub versus PCI Card?
At 11:39 AM -0700 5/18/2009, Clark Martin wrote: Ken Daggett wrote: On 18 May 2009, at 08:26:16 PDT, Dan wrote: Each USB bus supports up to 64 devices. It's 127 devices. FireWire supports 63 or 64 devices per branch. Yea. Realized that typo after I'd sent it. :( Actually, it's 128 devices *per controller*, split between its ports. The controller counts as one, hence the 127. - Dan. -- - Psychoceramic Emeritus; South Jersey, USA, Earth --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: USB Hub versus PCI Card?
On May 18, 2009, at 8:35 AM, Mac G4 wrote: I should stay away from VIA chipset VIA works if you install their software: http://www.viaarena.com/default.aspx?PageID=420OSID=23CatID=2470SubCatID=122 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: USB Hub versus PCI Card?
I had problems before where a USB Hub might have been a better choice, but ... Out of curiosity, since I'd replaced my QS 2002 Dual mobo, I'm again trying my adaptec Duoconnect AUA-3020A USB 2.0 / FW400 PCI card alongside my M-Audio 2496 PCI audio card. Seems to be functioning - playing back iTunes music through the audio card and scanning on my Nikon Coolscan 5000, saving to disk via the USB 2.0 adaptec port. No hiccups at this early date. Has an NEC chipset if I read the right chip on the card before inserting it: NEC Japan D720 101GT, etc. More info on the card and connected device: USB High-Speed Bus: Host Controller Location:Expansion Slot Host Controller Driver: AppleUSBEHCI PCI Device ID: 0x00e0 PCI Revision ID: 0x0004 PCI Vendor ID: 0x1033 Bus Number: 0x54 LS-5000 ED: Product ID: 0x4002 Vendor ID: 0x04b0 (Nikon Corporation) Version: 1.02 Speed: Up to 480 Mb/sec Manufacturer:Nikon Location ID: 0x5450 Current Available (mA): 500 Current Required (mA): Unknown (Device has not been configured) AFAIK, Adaptec no longer officially supports the card much past OS 9 ... so insert one at your own risk ... --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: [G3-5]RE: USB Hub versus PCI Card?
On 5/18/09 1:50 PM, Mac G4 at g4mac...@hotmail.com wrote: So this has wildly gone in a direction that I don't have a need (or probably a care) for. Does anyone have some recommendations for a PCI USB card that will work in a G4 MDD running 10.4.11? I'm using here a 3-bus, 5 (plus 1 internal)-port USB 2.0 PCI card with a central NEC processor chip. It workd pretty fine in Mac OS 9 (it works like a USB 1.1 card) and in Mac OS X (where it works with is full USB 2.0 capacity). -- MaGioZal @ São Paulo, Brazil. http://magiozal.blogspot.com/ --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: [G3-5]Re: USB Hub versus PCI Card?
On 5/18/09 5:22 PM, Kris Tilford at ktilfo...@cox.net wrote: http://www.viaarena.com/default.aspx?PageID=420OSID=23CatID=2470SubCatID=1 22 Well, when I bought a USB 2.0 PCI card with a VIA chipset about one year and half ago, I tried to install the drivers, but I ain' got any success. I was running at the time Mac OS 9 + Mac OS 10.2 on a Beige G3, and both systems did not recognized it. -- MaGioZal. http://fotolog.com/_magiozal/ --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: [G3-5]Re: USB Hub versus PCI Card?
On May 18, 2009, at 4:09 PM, MaGioZal wrote: Well, when I bought a USB 2.0 PCI card with a VIA chipset about one year and half ago, I tried to install the drivers, but I ain' got any success. I was running at the time Mac OS 9 + Mac OS 10.2 on a Beige G3, and both systems did not recognized it. The driver doesn't work under OS 9 at all, it's strictly OS X. If you notice, there are multiple versions of the OS X driver, one for each version of OS X. I suspect you installed the driver for 10.3 10.4 on a 10.2 system? Perhaps try again by deleting the driver you installed and using the correct version. You'd need to click the tiny Old Drivers link of the page I posted and use the v.1.10 for Jaguar or 1.50 driver for Panther. The 1.60 driver was for Tiger. OS 10.2 isn't very good for USB, both Panther and Tiger are large improvements for USB. The Beige G3 isn't very good for PCI cards (the Beige has a PCI 1.0 bus, whereas almost all PCI cards are PCI 1.1 or newer, so some VIA USB cards won't work, but it's not the fault of the driver or the card, it's the fault of the PCI bus on the Mac). --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: [G3-5]Re: USB Hub versus PCI Card?
On 5/18/09 7:13 PM, Kris Tilford at ktilfo...@cox.net wrote: OS 10.2 isn't very good for USB, both Panther and Tiger are large improvements for USB. The Beige G3 isn't very good for PCI cards (the Beige has a PCI 1.0 bus, whereas almost all PCI cards are PCI 1.1 or newer, so some VIA USB cards won't work, but it's not the fault of the driver or the card, it's the fault of the PCI bus on the Mac). Well, I've now another card here in the Biege G3 (the one with the NEC chip), and it's working fine here, on both Classic (9.2.2) and 10 (10.4.11). -- MaGioZal. http://fotolog.com/_magiozal/ --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
